[Complete] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

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serclino
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Joined: May 18th, 2018, 9:54 pm

Re: [In progress] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by serclino »

serclino wrote: April 11th, 2020, 6:52 pm
Vilebeggar wrote: April 11th, 2020, 6:40 pm serclino come and play i made the game
Give me 10 minutes pls

I am there
Vilebeggar
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Re: [In progress] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by Vilebeggar »

you know what you can have the game im too busy today.
Competitive Wesnoth. For the fans by the fans.
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sergey
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Re: [In progress] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by sergey »

Legendary20Miner wrote: April 11th, 2020, 6:17 pm The picker could have very well been bugged when unticking some maps, just like RBY was, its not out of the realm of possibility.
It excludes maps correctly.
Boy wrote: April 11th, 2020, 6:44 pm Just tested, seems working. But actually pointless - it's not saved at chat history, so you could watch this text only some amount of time and it disappeared. If you P1 with timer - you just ignoring this text. Moreover - this text distracting a bit and that's bad.
Have you tested it online? I noticed it's not saved in the history, but I checked only offline. I thought chat history doesn't work offline since the chat is unavailable. In any case if it is not saved in history when online I don't think it is possible to fix within the WML.

If you play as P1 and the timer is very tough, so you don't have time to look at the map list, the list is anyway shown in the replay discouraging people from using wrong map pool.
Author of SP scenario Dragon Fight and SP campaign Captured by a Nightmare.
Created The Rise of Wesnoth (alternative mechanics) version of the mainline campaign.
Boy
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Joined: January 27th, 2014, 1:57 pm

Re: [In progress] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by Boy »

sergey wrote: April 11th, 2020, 7:42 pm Have you tested it online?
Just played last game with it.
Legendary20Miner
Posts: 16
Joined: December 23rd, 2019, 4:56 pm

Re: [In progress] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by Legendary20Miner »

Boy wrote: April 11th, 2020, 6:39 pm ...
Keep crying. Besides, you are the one who started calling people "clowns" and "stupid" lol. You can't do any better? Just call people clowns and stupid, thats your strategy lol

I on the other hand just said you are a complainer.
Konrad2
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Re: [In progress] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by Konrad2 »

I wish to remind everyone that our Community Guidelines ask all of us to be nice and respectful (see point 1a). Name calling and insulting other members certainly isn't nice and respectful, so either anyone involved ceases this behavior now, or we will have to take action.
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ForPeace
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[Complete] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by ForPeace »

Boy wrote: April 11th, 2020, 7:04 pm I've created a table with all games played. This table could be saved as CSV format and after that there is possibility to make SQL-like queries to CSV-table.
I'll probably do this and will show some interesting analytics about tournament.
That would be great :) Looking forward to seeing it!

THE FINAL ROUND - RESULTS
Spoiler:
"Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament is now officially over!

We have together defeated boredom during the epidemic.

CONGRATULATIONS TO THE CHAMPIONS!
  • The ultimate champion: Danniel_BR
  • The vice-champion: Dauntless
  • The 3rd place winner: Caritas

FULL STANDINGS
Spoiler:
I want to say thank you to all the participants. It was a great pleasure to organize this tournament and play some games with you! :D
But not everything is over yet... ;)


The Best Games Contest

For the future, I would like to make three lists of the best games of the tournament. I invite all tournament participants to nominate 6 games: 2 for each of the 3 categories. The first game from rounds 1-6 and the second from rounds 7-11. Choose whichever games you want but not your own. ;)

Category 1: The most epic games 8)
Games fun for spectators, with crazy RNG, unbelievable comeback or whatever else you mean by epic.

Category 2: The highest quality games :D
Games where you believe someone has played outstandingly precisely.

Category 3: The most instructive games :eng:
Games that you teach you how to play better and show certain strategic ideas or mistakes that players new to 1v1 can learn from.

I am waiting for your votes until Sunday 19th April 2020, 11:59 UTC.

See you,
ForPeace
Polish BfW fansite | Polish BfW translation | My Ladder profile

"When I say I've been playing for 10 years people come saying they've played for 15 years and that I know nothing about this game because I didn't use to play when the TRUE pros were playing xD" ~Hejnewar
Boy
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Joined: January 27th, 2014, 1:57 pm

Re: [Complete] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by Boy »

For easy choosing best games:

1) There are all replays:
AllReplays_Corona_Tournament_2020.zip
(1.7 MiB) Downloaded 492 times
2) There is my table of all games (archive contains ODS and CSV files):
Table_all_games_Corona_Tournament_2020.zip
(23.79 KiB) Downloaded 530 times
clmates
Posts: 80
Joined: February 17th, 2005, 11:19 pm

Re: [Complete] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by clmates »

Thanks for the tournament

I've enjoyed it
Best regards

clmates
Boy
Posts: 86
Joined: January 27th, 2014, 1:57 pm

Re: [Complete] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by Boy »

Thanks god I am old and experienced, so I saved my message and now could easily restore it.
This is second version of my message, with removed spoilers for young ones :)
Thanks moderators - they are on duty :)


As foreword:
* It's all my personal opinion.
* They say: "Who has eyes - could see".

First of all, I want to repeat: Ruphus Isle is VERY bad map for tournament (actually, it's just bad).

My priority for factions, starting from the best:
Northerners
Loyalists
Drakes
Rebels
Knalgan
Undead


After I made this priority list, I went to check me here - well, no surprise - stats are telling the same.

I would analyse only games between these players (list according end standings, starting from best player):
Danniel_BR
Dauntless
Caritas
matto
Legendary20Miner
Boy
NanRoig
ForPeace
Baltese_Windragon


Now, table, just stats about which factions got good players when they played each other:
Table_good_players_factioning_each_other.png

It's expected, at least, for me: first and second places guys got both 4 times top factions when they played against other good players.

So, my mainline position: this tournament was far from fairness. Actually, all Wesnoth tournaments are not fair in general.
Nope, I am not saying that all results should not be accepted. It's just current reality.

As I think - really good serious Wesnoth's tournament should try to minimize unfairness.
To do this there are next methods:
* playing best of 3 each game between 2 players; 1st game shuffle sides, second - manually changing, third - probably random again;
* map only 1 and always the same for all games;
* factions are not random, chooses from near equal pair (north-loys, dwarfs-rebels);
* to not waste time, because there is bo3, only good players allowed to play.
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ForPeace
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Re: [Complete] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by ForPeace »

Boy wrote: April 12th, 2020, 4:12 pm First of all, I want to repeat: Ruphus Isle is VERY bad map for tournament (actually, it's just bad).
What precisely is wrong about it?
So, my mainline position: this tournament was far from fairness. Actually, all Wesnoth tournaments are not fair in general.
Nope, I am not saying that all results should not be accepted. It's just current reality.
Surely. Can't do much about it, RNG and balance issues can spoil the competition. Nonetheless I believe the best performing players were the ones who won.
To do this there are next methods:
* playing best of 3 each game between 2 players; 1st game shuffle sides, second - manually changing, third - probably random again;
BO3 would be clearly more fair for 1v1 matches.
* map only 1 and always the same for all games;
Only one map would make the tournament monotonous. I prefer a bigger map pool.
* factions are not random, chooses from near equal pair (north-loys, dwarfs-rebels);
The problem with "near-equal pairs" is they are different from each players' perspective and map-dependant. Like you said "north-loys, dwarfs-rebels" are near equal. In my opinion dwarfs have an advantage over rebels. Maybe a good idea would be after map is randomly chosen, one player picks a matchup (like "Let's play drakes vs rebels") and the other picks the faction ("I choose rebels").
* to not waste time, because there is bo3, only good players allowed to play.
Maybe not just good but experienced and reliable. Entrance criterion ">25 games on Ladder or WesnothLife"?
Polish BfW fansite | Polish BfW translation | My Ladder profile

"When I say I've been playing for 10 years people come saying they've played for 15 years and that I know nothing about this game because I didn't use to play when the TRUE pros were playing xD" ~Hejnewar
Legendary20Miner
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Joined: December 23rd, 2019, 4:56 pm

Re: [Complete] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by Legendary20Miner »

And here we go again. That table isn't even clear, I have no idea what North+Loy means. Besides, the final places are a result of tiebreaks, many places were tied, 2 players tied for second, 2 for third, 3 for fourth etc.
Boy
Posts: 86
Joined: January 27th, 2014, 1:57 pm

Re: [Complete] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by Boy »

ForPeace wrote: April 12th, 2020, 4:44 pm (1) What precisely is wrong about it?

(2) Only one map would make the tournament monotonous. I prefer a bigger map pool.

(3) The problem with "near-equal pairs" is they are different from each players' perspective and map-dependant.
... In my opinion dwarfs have an advantage over rebels.

(4) ...one player picks a matchup (like "Let's play drakes vs rebels") and the other picks the faction ("I choose rebels").

(5)Maybe not just good but experienced and reliable. Entrance criterion ">25 games on Ladder or WesnothLife"?
(1) Ruphus Isle is bad because:
* This map VERY depends from wise firstbuying! Players who did not know this map well or already forgot (exp players, as far as I know, didn't play this map) could easily lost.
* It's hard to play against first night orcs rush at left flank.
* Both right and left sides are widely open - if bats or tough glider would be there - it's hard to do smth against.

(2) There are different types of tournaments - ones for crowd and other for determine players true skill. Btw, soccer players play all lifetime at the same "map" :)

(3) This problem is just nothing at face randomly choosed drakes-undead. What would you prefer: rebels for you vs dwarfs - set up manually, or drakes vs undead from random generation? :) According map dependancy, as I said, there is should 1 map, which good for all manually setting up factions.

(4) Sounds interesting, but there is should be more thinking about this mechanism.

(5) All this numbers probably could be used, but real criteria should be smth like one-two known good players would said a word for including new player. There are not so many really good players, actually...
Legendary20Miner
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Re: [Complete] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by Legendary20Miner »

Boy wrote: April 12th, 2020, 9:01 pm (5) All this numbers probably could be used, but real criteria should be smth like one-two known good players would said a word for including new player. There are not so many really good players, actually...
Im not sure why you push for some kind of elite "invite only" tournament system, given that you almost certainly wouldn't be included there, based on the elo.
Vilebeggar
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Location: Albania

Re: [Complete] "Stay at home!" - the 2020 Wesnoth coronavirus tournament.

Post by Vilebeggar »

There are not so many really good players, actually...
Like you? :lol:
Competitive Wesnoth. For the fans by the fans.
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