Lizardman Special Ability

Post by **Dave** » May 8th, 2004, 3:07 pm

The lizardman has recently been added to the Northerners with regeneration -- but they already have trolls who regenerate. On one hand this looks like too much regeneration, on the other it seems kinda good to make sides have certain specialties - Rebels have healing, Undead have drain, and Northerners have regeneration.

Another ability that would make sense for the lizardmen is 'skirmisher'. What do people think?

If you think that they should get a certain ability but they also need stats adjustments, post about that below.

David

Post by **Boucman** » May 8th, 2004, 3:29 pm

I voted both, but I think they should either at lvl1 and both at lvl2 or 3

Post by **turin** » May 8th, 2004, 3:39 pm

only skirmishing at level 1, maybe a choice between them at level 2, and both at level 3. for this, you would need to have the tree split at level 2. but if we have the graphics, i think thats fine.

on a related note, i really think the northerners should not get lizardmen. why would lizards allign with orcs? i don't see any sense in it.

telly · Post by **telly** » May 8th, 2004, 4:03 pm

I think Lizardmen are fine as they are. At first glance they don't look that strong but I like them a lot. Regen makes sense for lizards.
Their stats and cost are about right as well. Skirmish would be overkill especially as they have 7 move already.
2nd level ability, maybe a poison bite as an alternate melee attack?

Mortifer · Post by **Mortifer** » May 8th, 2004, 5:21 pm

Why should lizardmen have regeneration at all??? I know that this is a unique fantasy world, but it is still sounds weird to me...so NO regeneration for the lizards.

cobretti · Post by **cobretti** » May 8th, 2004, 6:29 pm

I voted neither. If lizardmen are teamed with orcs, they should keep orcs' main ability, and be cheap

. Having many units with regeneration and also strong, resilient units is overkill: It is already if you haven't got good units against trolls (the famous troll horde trick).

Skirmisher is much of the same thing. It makes the orcs too powerful

Mortifer · Post by **Mortifer** » May 8th, 2004, 6:37 pm

I totally agree with cobretti, I also voted 'neither'.

Post by **Dave** » May 8th, 2004, 9:15 pm

turin wrote: on a related note, i really think the northerners should not get lizardmen. why would lizards allign with orcs? i don't see any sense in it.

In the North lands live a collection of different tribes and creatures -- human barbarian tribes, orcs, lizardmen, trolls, etc.

They often fight each other, but they all share a common hatred of dwarves, elves, and lawful humans. Sometimes conflict breaks out between Wesnoth and the northern lands, in which case these creatures will band together to fight the southerners they hate.

Also, during Asheviere's rule, she makes friends with these northerners, and hires them as mercenaries to do her bidding.

Basically if we wanted to organize factions into the form they are in when non-allied, then trolls would have to be a seperate faction, as would lizardmen. I think so many mono-cultural factions would get boring, not to mention require alot more work on balancing.

Also the northerners need a unit like the lizardman to give them a much needed strong piercing attack, particularly so they can fight against horse-based units effectively.

David

Post by **turin** » May 8th, 2004, 9:24 pm

Dave wrote:
turin wrote: on a related note, i really think the northerners should not get lizardmen. why would lizards allign with orcs? i don't see any sense in it.
In the North lands live a collection of different tribes and creatures -- human barbarian tribes, orcs, lizardmen, trolls, etc.

They often fight each other, but they all share a common hatred of dwarves, elves, and lawful humans. Sometimes conflict breaks out between Wesnoth and the northern lands, in which case these creatures will band together to fight the southerners they hate.

Also, during Asheviere's rule, she makes friends with these northerners, and hires them as mercenaries to do her bidding.

Basically if we wanted to organize factions into the form they are in when non-allied, then trolls would have to be a seperate faction, as would lizardmen. I think so many mono-cultural factions would get boring, not to mention require alot more work on balancing.

Also the northerners need a unit like the lizardman to give them a much needed strong piercing attack, particularly so they can fight against horse-based units effectively.

David

I just don't think lizardmen would allign with orcs. Trolls would, but not lizardmen.

I never said they should be mono-cultural, i just think lizardmen are so different from orcs, they should be a different faction. IF draconians/drakonians/dragarians/whatever are accepted, the lizardmen might be alligned with them.

Yes, the northerners need a strong piercing attack, but i think a unit that is actually orcish or goblinoid would work better *cough*orcish spearman*cough*.

Post by **Sangel** » May 8th, 2004, 9:36 pm

Hmmmm. Currently the only goblin unit is the Wolf Rider. I can see weak little goblins with spears, weak but dirt cheap and plentiful. In fact, I could even see them being level 0, if we want our goblins to be really weak. After all, even the goblin knight never actually attacks with that fancy spear.

Then the goblins could compose all of the Orc's scouting and skirmishing body (and yes, I'd like to see them get skirmishing upon advancement).

Post by **quartex** » May 9th, 2004, 1:41 am

Why wouldn't lizardmen align with orcs, and trolls? Wesnoth is a new world, and Dave provided a perfectly logical reason why the various barbarian races would align together wilds of the north. Orcs can have very different culture depending on where they are used, compre the orcs of D&D to the orcs of Warcraft III, why can't our orcs have a strong alliance with goblins, trolls and lizardmen. I think lizardmen look like a very cool race, and there is no rule in fantasy that certain races can't be allies or work together. You just have to provide good justification.

Post by **Dave** » May 9th, 2004, 4:05 am

Yeah I don't see any real reason why the lizardmen would refuse to join the orcs and trolls. I also like the idea someone else proposed of making lizardmen the sworn enemies of the dragon-like-humanoids.

David

Post by **Sangel** » May 9th, 2004, 4:15 am

That was me. "Your Dragon-kings enslaved our fathers for far too long! Now you must all DIE!"

Post by **quartex** » May 9th, 2004, 5:18 am

"I also like the idea someone else proposed of making lizardmen the sworn enemies of the dragon-like-humanoids. "

I wonder if someone will create a northerners/lizardman vs. dragon-like-humanoid campaign. We don't need to work every race into "Heir to the Throne" but their racial hatred sounds like great background for a campign. I know the whole "extra-planar invasion thing" has been done to death, but I was thinking that a draconic invasion of Wesnoth might be really cool, with the northerners (and maybe other races) rallying against the invasion.

Circon · Post by **Circon** » May 9th, 2004, 6:37 am

[quote="turin]
I just don't think lizardmen would allign with orcs. Trolls would, but not lizardmen.[/quote]
Been playing too much Warcraft and reading too much Tolkien. You're just biased. Why would Trolls side with Orcs?

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Lizardman Special Ability

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Lizardman Special Ability