Improved Castles/Forts

[Privan]

What about possible making castle sieges more involved? I mean instead of just treating it like a regular tile, throw in some twists and turns.

For example, when crossing the walls the first unit (or all units) across take a bit of damage to simulate actually having to storm the walls. Or maybe identifying entrance/exit points that you have to use rather than scaling the wall itself? Or making all castle tiles heal units, like a town, aligned with the general that sits in the keep as long as he's there? Or at least make it so you have to a full move turn just to cross the walls of a castle. You'd have to move next to a wall, then move over it the next turn.

I know there is an advantage to staying in the castle right now, but it's relatively minor. For a fortification it's really rather useless besides recruiting/recalling. If I had to make a stand I'd head to the nearest town so I'd be healing in between attacks. I'm just tossing out ideas to make the forts more beneficial in a multiplayer game and more difficult to get through in a singlerplayer game.

[Dacyn]

What about possible making castle sieges more involved? I mean instead of just treating it like a regular tile, throw in some twists and turns.

Before you post a new idea you should read the first topic of this forum, which is the FPI. The FPI is the list of all ideas that have been previously rejected. Now this is the first thing on the FPI [1], so I don't see how you could have missed it if you read the FPI.
[1] AFAIK the FPI is not in any particular order.

[Dave]

I am kinda partial to the idea of castles emitting a zone of control if the leader controls the keep.

I.e. to storm an enemy castle you'd have to move up to the walls on your first turn, and could only enter the castle on the second turn.

But otoh, this is going to attract many complaints in the campaign.

Basically players find it frustrating if they use excellent strategy to win a scenario, only to lose some valuable units at the end when attacking the castle. This already happens quite alot, and would happen even more if castles were more difficult to storm.

David

[Sangel]

It's happened. Our first "now that the castles look so cool, people will want them to defend coolly" thread.

The Zone of Control idea is nice - I'd go for that. But I agree, making Castles too hard to lay siege to would not be a good thing for the game - Wesnoth is meant to be simple and fast-paced.

[Dave]

Actually the ZoC idea has a problem: it'll make it that the best units to attack a castle with are horse-based, at least in HttT.

Why? The land outside of a castle is usually flat. Horse units have pretty good resistance against blade and impact, which most leaders use as their weapons. The disadvantage of horse-based units is they defend poorly in most terrain. However in flat terrain, horsemen are typically the same as infantry at defending.

So, if you have to move your units up to the enemy castle, and the enemy leader gets his choice of which unit to come and attack from the castle, horsemen are the best units to send. They have as good defense as other units, better resistance, and can hit back.

If you send someone like a mage or archer, they will get slaughtered. Regular infantry will do somewhat better, but not as good as horsemen.

David

[AT]

I would deifinatly say leave them as they are. I didnt like how easy it was when I first started playing, but now... it seems right game-play wise. If anything, up defence for all units 5%, but no more.

[Bander]

It would be cool if castles had better means of defense, so that you could like lay seige to them. Take all the towns and starve them out. Of course turn limits would make this tough anyway. wrong topic

[turin]

I would deifinatly say leave them as they are. I didnt like how easy it was when I first started playing, but now... it seems right game-play wise. If anything, up defence for all units 5%, but no more.

all defenses are in increments of 10%. this is completely illogical, because % is not arithmatic progression, but nonetheless it is true.

and most units have good defense in castle anyway. i think 40% is normal.

[Dave]

It would be cool if castles had better means of defense, so that you could like lay seige to them. Take all the towns and starve them out. Of course turn limits would make this tough anyway. wrong topic

Sieges typically took months or even years. Battles in Battle for Wesnoth take a few days, or perhaps a week. The time scale is completely wrong for sieges.

David

[Privan]

I do admit I didn't read the stick post, which is my fault. I normally do but this idea just suddenly popped up and I wanted to get it out. I'll be more careful in the future.

But something really needs to be done about the end game. I haven't played hard yet, but on easy and normal once you've gotten past the first half of the map, it's all smooth sailing from there. I don't think I've played a map yet where I've even been in danger of losing someone after the 10th turn (especially once I got units that heal). I thought adding some sort of difficulty getting to the generals would make a difference.

[Dave]

once you've gotten past the first half of the map, it's all smooth sailing from there

Isn't it like this in pretty much all strategy games though?

[Privan]

once you've gotten past the first half of the map, it's all smooth sailing from there

Isn't it like this in pretty much all strategy games though?

Unfortunately you've got a point. Although, Point of Attack 2 & Rise of Nations we're two games (well, PoA2 is still in the "are" category) that fit into the exceptions list.

[ebo]

With the new AI grouping, and a larger income in the scenario config file, do you think that you would end up hitting a second wave of units near the end of the scenario?

[turin]

With the new AI grouping, and a larger income in the scenario config file, do you think that you would end up hitting a second wave of units near the end of the scenario?

it happens with me somewhat often. they recruit in the castle, and, if they have good defense there, i have a decent chance of loosing a unit, and it might take a long time to defeat them, if i don't have enough units.

and thats with the current castles. not the suggested improvements.

[Insinuator]

(well, PoA2 is still in the "are" category)

As is RON!