Provincial Map of Wesnoth

[Ashmyr]

I had the idea of creating a Provincial Map of Wesnoth. The lighter areas are more autonomous.

EDIT: ORANGE KERLASH IS PARTHYN

[Ashmyr]

Ideas for each province: (partially inspired from my Parliamentary Election post! Warning: ~fictional politics~! Spooky!) -- this is kind of a messy brainstorm, but i hope it makes sense

Rough setting and inspiration: I imagine Wesnoth is in a lateish medieval setting, with some limited industry, and a robust system of legalities and ceremonies -- much closer to a modern state than to a late medieval state in political nature. It has a vast network of merchants and mages which dominate much of the improvements in construction, infrastructure, and communication.

Weldyn is very urbanized and heads the government. Most large legal entities and guilds are headquartered in Weldyn. It is known as a capital for art and academia, with its main rival being Elensefar. Despite Elensefar often having more prestegious academia and liberal politicians, Weldyn often holds more ceremonies, and holds the Royal Family and the Royal Army. Weldynians enjoy a high degree of privilege and a high standard of living.

If one were to look at the Kingdom from the outside, Dan'Tonk would seem as if it was a rival of Weldyn at first. In reality, though, both provinces are linked closely through political, cultural and historical ties. Dan'Tonk and Weldyn often exchange politicans, and the two cities often trade closely, and often host debates and ceremonies in each others' cities. The biggest difference between the two, however, is while the royal houses are typically centered in Weldyn, many merchant families are centered in Dan'Tonk, and thus, Dan'Tonk serves as more of a center of commerce. The Dan'Tonki are richer on average than any other provincial population.

The Clan Territories are very rural and spread out, and are very distinct from the nation as a whole. They have a unique structure and language of their lands -- a direct descendant of many of the Wesfolk languages. This language is known as "Clanese". The Clans have a structure less based on hereditary feudalism and more based around families ruling their lands collectively, with much more of a focus on the community and the people as a whole. They also have a stronger honor code than anywhere else in the nation. This often results in their politics being very odd. However, some areas outside of the lands that were first settled by the Clans are more integrated with the rest of Wesnoth and less distinct overall.

Kerlash is not autonomous, like the Clan Territories. Despite this, it is similar in many ways. It takes influence from both mainstream Wesnothian culture, but also the Clanese culture. The population is ultimately split around 50/50, although the area is far too populated and underdeveloped.

Northern Wesnoth is among the least developed in all of Wesnoth. It has barely any population, and is often beset by wild beasts and monsters. It does not have much of a distinct identity.

Central Wesnoth is vast and expansive. Despite this, it is not very diverse. It has the lowest population density of any province. It does have a large population, most of which is feudal, and typically very scattered among small villages. It has many farms, and a large diversity of food, despite its lack of distinct identity. Some areas are developed, by being connected to the vast trade network, while others are very isolated.

EDIT: Green is supposed to be Parthyn, not Kerlash! Parthyn is unexpectedly quite populated, although it is more xenophobic than most regions. Most residents are suspicious of outsiders, and merchants often find a hard time setting up trade networks or selling their goods at a prefered price. This has resulted in Kerlash being quite underdeveloped, in contrast to its population. It often requests extra assistance, both militarily and politically, from the government in Weldyn, even when it is not entirely necessary.

Blackwater is the second-most liberal out of all the provinces. It is quite diverse, having large populations of Elves in the south and Mermen in the north. It is home to a large population of Magi, and thus is a huge source of academia, science, and the arts. However, to outsiders, the high-class society of the Magi often makes the Magi seem classist, and thus the area is unattractive to those distrustful of the higher classes. The area is quite autonomous, due to its high population of researchers and scientists, which greatly benefit the furthering of magic arts.

Elensefar is the most liberal of all provinces. It has been a historic hub of diversity, with the capital, Elensefar, having populations of Elves, Dwarves, and even Orcs. It is highly autonomous due to various historical differences from the main culture of Wesnoth. It has a strong standing navy, and is one of the few provinces that could function well entirely independently. It also has an extremely distinct dialect, which is a mixture of many native Irdyan tongues. It enjoys close ties to the Merfolk, and a strong regionalist sentiment.


Annuvin is highly dependent on Kerlash, and was set up as a crown frontier colony. Thus, it is naturally not very distinct, and most of its population is peasants held in feudalism.

[Ashmyr]

OOPS -- the orange one and its description is supposed to be for Parthyn.

[Kal_Ultor]

If I might give some feedback and input (don't take it to seriously and I sincerely apologise if it sounds rufe somwhere):

Actually, I would disagree with you about the setting Wesnoth is in for several reasons.

Firstly, since the modern state was made by nationalism which is more or less directly linked to the Industrialisation. So if Wesnoth just has some limited industry (I probably do not agree with that either), it is quite unlikely that this nationalism would have occured to form a modern state. Additionally to that, we know that Wesnoth's territory hosts a variety of people/folks (elves, dwarves, humans, woses, merfolk, etc.). In my point of view this makes (successful) nationalism and state building even more unlikely (see the revolution in Germany 1848). One could veto here and say that Germany did form a modern national state shortly after. But it needed 3 wars and the exclusion of the multi-ethnic state of Austria to achieve that as well as a very racist nationalism what I am quite confident would not occur in Wesnoth. To sum up: Since there is no industrialisation, there is no nationalism, so there is no modern state.

Secondly, the codification of law was a process that is also linked to that period of time; propbably a little bit earlier. But in any case it is closely linked to modern technology "making the world smaller" so there was an actual need for same laws in all places of the territory and to protect and stimulate trade (also a sign of post-industrialisation). One could veto here that the UK has an older Constitution but it's original drafts where way closer to medial times then to modern times. Additionally, the codification and drafting of constitutions were influenced by the enlightment. However, I doubt that there was a period in Wesnoth that was similar to the enlightment since they all are quite mystic.

Thirdly, the structure of the Kingdom of Wesnoth is feudal. We have a king who is not bound by law (see Rise of Wesnoth or Heir of the Throne). Furthermore, the power is taken by force or inherited, not taken by a political coup which would be a sign for a modern state. Moreover, the empire is administered in a feudalistic manner, as we know from the southgard provinces are given to commanders who take care of the administration. This seems similar to the feudal system.

Now to the politics:
Welten – If the academy of the mages is in Weldyn I would totally agree with you but I believe it is not. So the Part about academia probably does not hold true. Beides that it makes Sense to me. However, I believe the capital is Mappe in Heir to the throne and supposed to be somewhere else.

Dan'Tonk – I think Blackwater Port would make a for more suitable trade centre.

Clan Territories & Kerlash seem reasonable to me since the east part is often described as wild and unciviliced. I am not sure about it being so close to the capital though.

Northern Wesnoth – If the Great River is the border it seems ok to me.

Central Wesnoth – I think it would be populated quite densly since it is between Blackwater Port (in my point of view the tranig centre) and the capital as well as being lochtet right in the middle and among the origin Territories of the kingdom.

Kerlash (i assume the Green one) – I dont know about it being densly populated it did not seem like that in the southguard but I totally agree with the rest.

Blackwater – agree if the Academy of the mages is here + I think it is the trading centre

Elensefar – I agree on the first Part. However, I think it could not Function autonomously and is quite poor since it is so for in the east and most likely constantly raided by orcs.

I like your provinces though. For some reason they seem very logical to me.

[Ashmyr]

If I might give some feedback and input (don't take it to seriously and I sincerely apologise if it sounds rufe somwhere):

Actually, I would disagree with you about the setting Wesnoth is in for several reasons.

Firstly, since the modern state was made by nationalism which is more or less directly linked to the Industrialisation. So if Wesnoth just has some limited industry (I probably do not agree with that either), it is quite unlikely that this nationalism would have occured to form a modern state. Additionally to that, we know that Wesnoth's territory hosts a variety of people/folks (elves, dwarves, humans, woses, merfolk, etc.). In my point of view this makes (successful) nationalism and state building even more unlikely (see the revolution in Germany 1848). One could veto here and say that Germany did form a modern national state shortly after. But it needed 3 wars and the exclusion of the multi-ethnic state of Austria to achieve that as well as a very racist nationalism what I am quite confident would not occur in Wesnoth. To sum up: Since there is no industrialisation, there is no nationalism, so there is no modern state.

I disagree.

For one, Wesnoth's setting was formed by many different Islefolk groups being forced to unify against the threat of Orcs. Many Nationalist movements were created out of a wish for independence or statehood against other powers. For example, Czechoslovakia was created against Austria-Hungary, Yugoslavia was created in response to Austrian and Ottoman oppression, Albania was formed due to threats of Slavic, Greek and Ottoman oppression, and the like. Also, a modern state does not also have to be monocultural or monoethnic. Russia, Austria and the Ottoman Empire were quite diverse. Granted, they did suppress their minority populations, but I imagine if a minority is large, it is harder to oppress.

Secondly, the codification of law was a process that is also linked to that period of time; propbably a little bit earlier. But in any case it is closely linked to modern technology "making the world smaller" so there was an actual need for same laws in all places of the territory and to protect and stimulate trade (also a sign of post-industrialisation). One could veto here that the UK has an older Constitution but it's original drafts where way closer to medial times then to modern times. Additionally, the codification and drafting of constitutions were influenced by the enlightment. However, I doubt that there was a period in Wesnoth that was similar to the enlightment since they all are quite mystic.

I also think that the White Mages would help with advancements in technology and health. A population that is less concerned about health because they can be magically healed has the time and resources to care about other things instead. With such an advancement in living conditions (more likely in urbanized areas but still) could easily lead to people directing their concerns towards more academic matters, thus leading to an enlightenment. Plus, the existence of Silver Magi makes mass communication possible. While I doubt there are many Silver Magi, news could travel quickly from province to province.

Thirdly, the structure of the Kingdom of Wesnoth is feudal. We have a king who is not bound by law (see Rise of Wesnoth or Heir of the Throne). Furthermore, the power is taken by force or inherited, not taken by a political coup which would be a sign for a modern state. Moreover, the empire is administered in a feudalistic manner, as we know from the southgard provinces are given to commanders who take care of the administration. This seems similar to the feudal system.

I have made a Parliament of Wesnoth post in my past, and I believe that it is much more interesting to imagine Wesnoth with a Parliament with limited enfranchisement, similar to pre-World War I Republics or Democracies. Of course, the Franchise would be limited. However, there are many examples of medieval states holding legislatures of some form, or parliaments which had little power at first but gained more over time. Plus, I think that the entire system would be overhauled after The Rise of Wesnoth, as many disputes would come from a mass death event of much of the population, and a Parliament could be seen as a way to arbitrate some of these disputes of noble titles peacefully.

Now to the politics:
Welten – If the academy of the mages is in Weldyn I would totally agree with you but I believe it is not. So the Part about academia probably does not hold true. Beides that it makes Sense to me. However, I believe the capital is Mappe in Heir to the throne and supposed to be somewhere else.

The capital is Weldyn, and so it makes sense to me that many academic and political institutions would be headquartered there.

Dan'Tonk – I think Blackwater Port would make a for more suitable trade centre.

The in-game encyclopedia says that Dan'Tonk is the largest city. It is in the center of the country, and has not been attacked in any mainline campaign. However, I'm not exactly sure who Blackwater Port would be trading with. The Isle of Alduin, sure, but who else? The Mermen? Drakes?

Clan Territories & Kerlash seem reasonable to me since the east part is often described as wild and unciviliced. I am not sure about it being so close to the capital though.

I made a mistake -- Kerlash (in orange) -- is Parthyn. The in-game encyclopedia talks about the Clans being close to Weldyn, and we encounter them in Test of the Clans.

Northern Wesnoth – If the Great River is the border it seems ok to me.

Neat

Central Wesnoth – I think it would be populated quite densly since it is between Blackwater Port (in my point of view the tranig centre) and the capital as well as being lochtet right in the middle and among the origin Territories of the kingdom.

I suppose -- it could be a breadbasket of sorts of the population, being underdeveloped and rural, much of it lacking connection to prominent trade routes?

Kerlash (i assume the Green one) – I dont know about it being densly populated it did not seem like that in the southguard but I totally agree with the rest.

Yep, this one is real Kerlash. My bad! I think the urban areas would be quite dense and crowded, and you can see how I elaborated on what I think the culture of Kerlash is in my Parliament post

Blackwater – agree if the Academy of the mages is here + I think it is the trading centre

The Academy of Mages is on the Isle of Alduin, which is in Blackwater. Although I'm not quite sure who Blackwater would be trading with.

Elensefar – I agree on the first Part. However, I think it could not Function autonomously and is quite poor since it is so for in the east and most likely constantly raided by orcs.

It could be that Elensefar is quite rich and builds up its military to be high-tech (for the Middle Ages, with good armor and crossbows), thus being able to rebuff the Orcs a lot. Plus, Annuvin is just to the north, and it could be built up as a buffer state!

I like your provinces though. For some reason they seem very logical to me.

Thank you

[Ashmyr]

Fixed map! My bad! D:

[Ashmyr]

If anyone has suggestions, thoughts or ideas, feel free to let me know

[Kal_Ultor]

I disagree.

For one, Wesnoth's setting was formed by many different Islefolk groups being forced to unify against the threat of Orcs. Many Nationalist movements were created out of a wish for independence or statehood against other powers. For example, Czechoslovakia was created against Austria-Hungary, Yugoslavia was created in response to Austrian and Ottoman oppression, Albania was formed due to threats of Slavic, Greek and Ottoman oppression, and the like. Also, a modern state does not also have to be monocultural or monoethnic. Russia, Austria and the Ottoman Empire were quite diverse. Granted, they did suppress their minority populations, but I imagine if a minority is large, it is harder to oppress.

I would disagree with this argumentation. The upcoming nationalism in your example was brought about more by the spirit of the times than by the external enemy. There are many examples in history where a civilisation was threatened (Roman empire by Carthago and later the Germans; Greek polis by Persia, Europe in General by the huns etc.) or occupied by an external Force (Poland multiple times by Germany, Russia, and Austria; France by England; colonies by UK, France, Spain, and Netherlands; etc.) without forming a modern state but average states for their time or did not change their Government model. There were multiethical empires but that were empires with a more medieval model of government and their multiethnicity were at least one of the main reasons for them failing. If we look at Austria-Hungary it could not form an equal, non-racist state but a state with an Austrian elite reigning the other people. The Ottoman and Russian Empire had also racist elements. If we look at other "early" modern states we see also racist Elements:
- France and UK towards the colonies and and they had Germany as an enemy image
- Germany has courted the Sonderweg thesis and one of the reasons the revolution in 1848 failed was that they were unsure if Austria counts twoards the German Territories and should be included in the German empire as such or not and their Territories with other people would have been excluded from the German empire per se
- US were excluding towards the UK and black and Indian people
Sally, racism or at least excluding trends seem to be universial while forming a modern state.

I also think that the White Mages would help with advancements in technology and health. A population that is less concerned about health because they can be magically healed has the time and resources to care about other things instead. With such an advancement in living conditions (more likely in urbanized areas but still) could easily lead to people directing their concerns towards more academic matters, thus leading to an enlightenment. Plus, the existence of Silver Magi makes mass communication possible. While I doubt there are many Silver Magi, news could travel quickly from province to province.

But if white mages would be that helpful (they always seemed quite entitled to me) there would be no need for technological progress. Additionally, I think that without a better infrastructure there could not be a lot (and I mean a lot) of trading, so producing goods at an industrial scale would be pointless (one of the biggest drivers for the industrial revolution) and with that I don't think something as the enlightment would have happened and this is in my point of view crucial for forming a modern state. I also doubt that the assistance of the white mages would lead to people directing their concerns towards academia that would lead to forming a modern state since we did not see that in Greece and Rome. Quite the contrary happened it helped forming a small elite.

I have made a Parliament of Wesnoth post in my past, and I believe that it is much more interesting to imagine Wesnoth with a Parliament with limited enfranchisement, similar to pre-World War I Republics or Democracies. Of course, the Franchise would be limited. However, there are many examples of medieval states holding legislatures of some form, or parliaments which had little power at first but gained more over time. Plus, I think that the entire system would be overhauled after The Rise of Wesnoth, as many disputes would come from a mass death event of much of the population, and a Parliament could be seen as a way to arbitrate some of these disputes of noble titles peacefully. I doubt that silver mages are out in use as messengers because everybody always sends riders in the campaigns. In the southgard, it does not occur to anybody to send a silver magi do investigate what is happening in the south but the send a knight. The silver mages also seem to be quite entitled according to their description in the wiki.

I agree with you that it would be far more interesting but I think Wesnoth is not quite there yet. I think it would be more like the Imperial Diet in Germany, the Estates General in France or something similar in England but not a pre-WW 1 parliament. Firstly, the logistics of holding elections would be unbearable for Wesnoth. Secondly, I think the parliament could not handle the diversity of the empire as well as the feudalism (because news would take a considerable time to get from one place to another). Thirdly, we simply never heard of something like that (in fact the Farmers seem to be reigned by their lord directly).

I think that Balckwater has a lot of trading to do. They can trade with the merfolk, what is often mentioned in the campaigns, with nagas, trading is the main professions of the sicarius, it can trade with the south so wesnoth can get it hands on their ressources and with dwarves, I think shipping their ressources is more convenient and saver then transporting them on land. It is also located in the Pearl bay so it would make Sense to me they sell them everywhere and it is basically the place where the humans arrived so there might also be a historical component. It is also the biggest harbour of the kingdom and seems to be of interest for the orcs.

[Ashmyr]

I would disagree with this argumentation. The upcoming nationalism in your example was brought about more by the spirit of the times than by the external enemy. There are many examples in history where a civilisation was threatened (Roman empire by Carthago and later the Germans; Greek polis by Persia, Europe in General by the huns etc.) or occupied by an external Force (Poland multiple times by Germany, Russia, and Austria; France by England; colonies by UK, France, Spain, and Netherlands; etc.) without forming a modern state but average states for their time or did not change their Government model. There were multiethical empires but that were empires with a more medieval model of government and their multiethnicity were at least one of the main reasons for them failing. If we look at Austria-Hungary it could not form an equal, non-racist state but a state with an Austrian elite reigning the other people. The Ottoman and Russian Empire had also racist elements. If we look at other "early" modern states we see also racist Elements:
- France and UK towards the colonies and and they had Germany as an enemy image
- Germany has courted the Sonderweg thesis and one of the reasons the revolution in 1848 failed was that they were unsure if Austria counts twoards the German Territories and should be included in the German empire as such or not and their Territories with other people would have been excluded from the German empire per se
- US were excluding towards the UK and black and Indian people
Sally, racism or at least excluding trends seem to be universial while forming a modern state.

I understand that, but I think that a mass death and mass exodus on the scale seen in *The Rise of Wesnoth* would cause a change in government. And yes, we see quite racist elements in states both modern and old -- and I think this would, sadly, exist in Wesnoth -- primarily against Elves; I imagine there would not be much integration with Elves outside of Blackwater and Elensefar. Perhaps the main Wesnothian culture -- most prominent in Weldyn, Dan'Tonk, Central Wesnoth and Northern Wesnoth -- could be quite demeaning politically towards Clanese and Elense politics or culture?

But if white mages would be that helpful (they always seemed quite entitled to me) there would be no need for technological progress. Additionally, I think that without a better infrastructure there could not be a lot (and I mean a lot) of trading, so producing goods at an industrial scale would be pointless (one of the biggest drivers for the industrial revolution) and with that I don't think something as the enlightment would have happened and this is in my point of view crucial for forming a modern state. I also doubt that the assistance of the white mages would lead to people directing their concerns towards academia that would lead to forming a modern state since we did not see that in Greece and Rome. Quite the contrary happened it helped forming a small elite.

Well, White Mages are ineffective at fighting humans and their power is healing, so I think they'd focus on healing. Even if they're entitled, if the magic you learned was literally *only* good for healing, isn't that what you'd do? I could see modern-ish style hospitals popping up in a few big cities. Also, with greater trade comes greater supply and demand, and the Industrial Revolution allowed the mass transport of goods, and produce in excess. Maybe industry wouldn't come along, but mass trade would, and that would result towards a shift to a capitalistic system, with Silver Mages being able to bring exotic goods from halfway across the Kingdom in a second, and merchants traversing and connecting the vast Kingdom.

I agree with you that it would be far more interesting but I think Wesnoth is not quite there yet. I think it would be more like the Imperial Diet in Germany, the Estates General in France or something similar in England but not a pre-WW 1 parliament. Firstly, the logistics of holding elections would be unbearable for Wesnoth. Secondly, I think the parliament could not handle the diversity of the empire as well as the feudalism (because news would take a considerable time to get from one place to another). Thirdly, we simply never heard of something like that (in fact the Farmers seem to be reigned by their lord directly).

Well, at first -- yes, I agree. My idea of Wesnothian politics is that there were a lot of disputes and disorganization at first, caused by the mass displacement, disorganization and disputes of the refugee crisis. The classes would likely interact with each other much more on the galleon, like how many people mingled together during the aftermath of the French Revolution, although there was of course, still, classes and classism. Thus, to resolve disputes and provide stability, I imagine Haldric would allow the organization of a Senate with very loose powers at first, and possibly elections where less than 1% of a district's population would vote -- perhaps only wealthy landowners. Heir to the Throne is 700 years after The Rise of Wesnoth, and I don't see how that long of a timespan wouldn't result in a system changing at a large scale. Thus, I don't think it's unreasonable to assume the Senate, Parliament or whatever, gradually took more and more power, and, with the exception of Ashievere, provided a balance of powers over time, with gradually more enfrancisement and liberalization of the most liberal areas. Perhaps in the wake of Ashievere's tyranny, the Kingdom could be much more integrated and interconnected than at first, and public outcry in the aftermath of the civil war leads to a Parliament with considerably more power? Of course, Wesnoth at first could be barely any different from 1200s or 1400s France or England, but I imagine with time, the Kingdom would become more federalized, developed and liberal.

I think that Balckwater has a lot of trading to do. They can trade with the merfolk, what is often mentioned in the campaigns, with nagas, trading is the main professions of the sicarius, it can trade with the south so wesnoth can get it hands on their ressources and with dwarves, I think shipping their ressources is more convenient and saver then transporting them on land. It is also located in the Pearl bay so it would make Sense to me they sell them everywhere and it is basically the place where the humans arrived so there might also be a historical component. It is also the biggest harbour of the kingdom and seems to be of interest for the orcs.

I suppose, but there's not any known civilizations out to the sea that aren't aquatic or semi-aquatic. Perhaps Dan'Tonk would be the internal trade capital, while Blackwater would be the external trade capital?



And I have a few questions for you.



Are there any differences you would suggest to be on top of my differences between the provinces?



Would you suggest any other provinces or province renames or lore?



What would the biggest political differences be between the provinces?

[Ashmyr]

Maybe Parthyn could be separated in half, with Soradoc on one side?

[Kal_Ultor]

I understand that, but I think that a mass death and mass exodus on the scale seen in *The Rise of Wesnoth* would cause a change in government. And yes, we see quite racist elements in states both modern and old -- and I think this would, sadly, exist in Wesnoth -- primarily against Elves; I imagine there would not be much integration with Elves outside of Blackwater and Elensefar. Perhaps the main Wesnothian culture -- most prominent in Weldyn, Dan'Tonk, Central Wesnoth and Northern Wesnoth -- could be quite demeaning politically towards Clanese and Elense politics or culture?

Perhabs you are right. Especially in the beginning, the elves were quite fickle allies.

Well, White Mages are ineffective at fighting humans and their power is healing, so I think they'd focus on healing. Even if they're entitled, if the magic you learned was literally *only* good for healing, isn't that what you'd do? I could see modern-ish style hospitals popping up in a few big cities. Also, with greater trade comes greater supply and demand, and the Industrial Revolution allowed the mass transport of goods, and produce in excess. Maybe industry wouldn't come along, but mass trade would, and that would result towards a shift to a capitalistic system, with Silver Mages being able to bring exotic goods from halfway across the Kingdom in a second, and merchants traversing and connecting the vast Kingdom.

You have a point with the White Mages, simply because I could not imagine anything else for them to do. I would disagree with the Silver Mages though, according to the wiki they keep to themselves and guard their secret of teleportation, so I doubt they would make their services available to the traders. I also don't think money would be an incentive for them, as no one who wants to get rich becomes a mage.

Well, at first -- yes, I agree. My idea of Wesnothian politics is that there were a lot of disputes and disorganization at first, caused by the mass displacement, disorganization and disputes of the refugee crisis. The classes would likely interact with each other much more on the galleon, like how many people mingled together during the aftermath of the French Revolution, although there was of course, still, classes and classism. Thus, to resolve disputes and provide stability, I imagine Haldric would allow the organization of a Senate with very loose powers at first, and possibly elections where less than 1% of a district's population would vote -- perhaps only wealthy landowners. Heir to the Throne is 700 years after The Rise of Wesnoth, and I don't see how that long of a timespan wouldn't result in a system changing at a large scale. Thus, I don't think it's unreasonable to assume the Senate, Parliament or whatever, gradually took more and more power, and, with the exception of Ashievere, provided a balance of powers over time, with gradually more enfrancisement and liberalization of the most liberal areas. Perhaps in the wake of Ashievere's tyranny, the Kingdom could be much more integrated and interconnected than at first, and public outcry in the aftermath of the civil war leads to a Parliament with considerably more power? Of course, Wesnoth at first could be barely any different from 1200s or 1400s France or England, but I imagine with time, the Kingdom would become more federalized, developed and liberal.

I always forget about the time span. There must be some sort of development, I mean what civilication stays exactly the same for 700 years. I think the biggest shift in politics would be after Asheviere, probably even towards a proper Parlament with some rights. However, I think most of the time it would be an assembly of estates. Perhabs there is a small adventure in to parlamentarism equal to the Britain Parlament in the 18./19. hundrets in the golden age of wesnoth which ended with the crisis of wesnoth. I could even imagine something like the Senat while Augustus' reign. So in total most of the time a pretty powerless representation of the people but at least some form of representation. I actually could imagine a tax fight in Wesnoth prettywell and how would that work without representation.

I suppose, but there's not any known civilizations out to the sea that aren't aquatic or semi-aquatic. Perhaps Dan'Tonk would be the internal trade capital, while Blackwater would be the external trade capital?

You are right, Blackwater is to far east to do the internal trade in total so there must be another centre. I think that south of Wesnoth further down the Great Kontinent are other kingdoms one could trade with. The north might be not that good for trade, I doubt orcs would understand or care for the Basic principles of it, like paying.

Are there any differences you would suggest to be on top of my differences between the provinces?

I would extend Dan'Tonk further south so it is actually north and west of Weldyn, like the wiki says. But I would not change anything else, I think it fies the landscape pretty well. And I don't think Party should be seperated because it is wild and chaotic so why would they bother splitting it. I think it is quite a neglected part of Wesnoth. And I think they also picture the history and development of Wesnoth very well.

Would you suggest any other provinces or province renames or lore?

No, I think it is good.

What would the biggest political differences be between the provinces?

I think that Blackwater, Dan'tonk and Weldyn are quite open minded, welcoming. Dan'Tonk and Blackwater are mercants so they have a lot of different people, especially Blackwater would know different cultures, while Weldyn is the capital and probably the melting pot of Wesnoth. Weldyn is probably politically centre-left, almost never under attack and not so much industry/ trade but a lot of politics. Dan'Tonk and Blackwater would be more conservative, mainly because of economical reasons and taxes. I imagine they protest quite often against spendings proposed Weldyn/ the king.

Clan Territories and Parthyn are probably chaotic and messed up but without a distinct political opinion. The clan leaders are most likely very critical of being part of a kingdom but the first one to go to war or fulfill military duty. Parthyn on the other hand does not care at all about Wesnoth and does whatever it wants and no one cares about it either.

Kerlash is relaxed and womewhat of a swing state. The political opinions are pretty mixed.

Central Wesnoth - Grain Chamber of the kingdom and because it is rural conservative/ Central-right as rural areas are often (but not extreme).

Elsenfar and Northern Wesnoth are under Constant attack of the orcs, so I think they are militaristic and xenophobic. And Annuvin is even extremer.

In General: Provinces that share a border with the Great River are more conservative and militaristic/ marked by raids, while the developed south is more modern and open. And Tiere is obviously a disput between the rich and the poor provinces.

[Ashmyr]

You have a point with the White Mages, simply because I could not imagine anything else for them to do. I would disagree with the Silver Mages though, according to the wiki they keep to themselves and guard their secret of teleportation, so I doubt they would make their services available to the traders. I also don't think money would be an incentive for them, as no one who wants to get rich becomes a mage.

I suppose I can understand that.

I always forget about the time span. There must be some sort of development, I mean what civilication stays exactly the same for 700 years. I think the biggest shift in politics would be after Asheviere, probably even towards a proper Parlament with some rights. However, I think most of the time it would be an assembly of estates. Perhabs there is a small adventure in to parlamentarism equal to the Britain Parlament in the 18./19. hundrets in the golden age of wesnoth which ended with the crisis of wesnoth. I could even imagine something like the Senat while Augustus' reign. So in total most of the time a pretty powerless representation of the people but at least some form of representation. I actually could imagine a tax fight in Wesnoth prettywell and how would that work without representation.

The Assembly of Estates idea is good, I might have to edit my own headcanon for the pre-Civil War Wesnothian government structure. And yeah, taxes would be pretty complicated and could lead to more demands.

You are right, Blackwater is to far east to do the internal trade in total so there must be another centre. I think that south of Wesnoth further down the Great Kontinent are other kingdoms one could trade with. The north might be not that good for trade, I doubt orcs would understand or care for the Basic principles of it, like paying.

Eh, I don't think that's that accurate for the Orcs. I imagine many Orcs do care to trade and want to trade -- many of them do join the Northern Alliance, after all.

I would extend Dan'Tonk further south so it is actually north and west of Weldyn, like the wiki says. But I would not change anything else, I think it fies the landscape pretty well. And I don't think Party should be seperated because it is wild and chaotic so why would they bother splitting it. I think it is quite a neglected part of Wesnoth. And I think they also picture the history and development of Wesnoth very well.

Hmm, alright. I could do that and do some minor border rearrangements.

I think that Blackwater, Dan'tonk and Weldyn are quite open minded, welcoming. Dan'Tonk and Blackwater are mercants so they have a lot of different people, especially Blackwater would know different cultures, while Weldyn is the capital and probably the melting pot of Wesnoth. Weldyn is probably politically centre-left, almost never under attack and not so much industry/ trade but a lot of politics. Dan'Tonk and Blackwater would be more conservative, mainly because of economical reasons and taxes. I imagine they protest quite often against spendings proposed Weldyn/ the king.

Well, I imagine that Weldyn would be a cultural hub, but also, I think it could be conservative. It is far from the Elves, and thus, xenophobic attitudes towards their betrayal of Haldric could still linger. It's also not close to the Dwarves' territory. The rest makes sense to me though.

Clan Territories and Parthyn are probably chaotic and messed up but without a distinct political opinion. The clan leaders are most likely very critical of being part of a kingdom but the first one to go to war or fulfill military duty. Parthyn on the other hand does not care at all about Wesnoth and does whatever it wants and no one cares about it either.

Makes sense to me. I imagine that the Clans see independence from the Kingdom as infeasible, though. They'd be surrounded on all sides by the Kingdom, and they'd be outnumbered, so maybe they begrudgingly accept it, even their most extreme leaders?

Kerlash is relaxed and womewhat of a swing state. The political opinions are pretty mixed.

Perhaps the harsh law and order and extra aid could result in more authoritarian cultural attitudes, and it could have some elvish xenophobia (See: TSG) but it is developing, and is more developed than Central or Northern Wesnoth, so perhaps it has an urban hub or two?

Central Wesnoth - Grain Chamber of the kingdom and because it is rural conservative/ Central-right as rural areas are often (but not extreme).

The urban/rural divide is somewhat recent, but also somewhat quite old. That does make sense to me though. Most politicians from there would not be that extreme.

Elsenfar and Northern Wesnoth are under Constant attack of the orcs, so I think they are militaristic and xenophobic. And Annuvin is even extremer.

Well, I imagine Elense culture is more of a mixing pot than anywhere else in the Kingdom, maybe not, but it could result in it being liberal because of its unique culture, and diverse values with Elves, but hostile towards Orcs (moreso than Weldyn), and it has a fully-functional independent military, although it often takes heavy losses every year.

In General: Provinces that share a border with the Great River are more conservative and militaristic/ marked by raids, while the developed south is more modern and open. And Tiere is obviously a disput between the rich and the poor provinces.

Hmm, makes sense generally, I suppose.

[Ashmyr]

Cultural map of Wesnoth.
Red = Wesnothians
Blue = Elense
Yellow = Clanese

Lighter = Plurality, Darker = Majority

[Gothyoba]

Nice work. You know, I think this could work well as part of the Wesnoth canon. However, I do have a small suggestion. Having played the start of Eastearn Invasion, I can say that there is a larger region of partial control east of the region showed her which might be worth including. Maybe this could be added as Eastern Wesnoth? I’m not very sure of this though, as Eatsern Invasion does extensively point put that Wesnothian control in the east is highly limited, so there is a good argument to say that Eastern Wensoth should not be on the map. By the way, the souhern province is referred to as Kerlath, not Kerlash, in Wesnoth. (At least in TSG)