--- Log opened Fri Mar 20 00:00:50 2009
20090320 00:01:29< Sirp> Crab_: your ideas sound good, but I really think I'd like to hear your ideas again after you've tried writing a simple prototype of them.
20090320 00:01:31< Crab_> Dragonking: so, basically, i think that the first part of the work is to make current system more easy to manage and debug, and to separate responsibilities between C++ AI code, C++ information code, and FormulaAI code
20090320 00:01:45< silene> Crab_: "better" is not the correct word; it is mandatory to not let designers use C++, since we want campaigns to be published
20090320 00:04:12< Crab_> Sipr: yes, I'm going to try to do so, using only C++ (not formula AI, which I consider a tool not 'most suitable' for this job - in my opinion, formula AI should be used for overriding AI behavior for specific scenario purpose)
20090320 00:04:35< Sirp> Crab_: okay; sounds good.
20090320 00:04:53< Dragonking> Crab_: Getting back to your "group of units" idea... how big could be this group?
20090320 00:04:54< Crab_> s/Sipr/Sirp, sorry 
20090320 00:05:30< fabi> Crab_: what about the [ai] parameters?
20090320 00:05:57< Crab_> Dragonking: not bigger than 6 units at the start, then I'll see how it fares
20090320 00:05:57< Sirp> Crab_: no problem. I think it'd be best to try to make your prototype implement and prove most of the concepts, but can ignore many of the more complex aspects of an AI (invisible enemy units, ambushes, events happening in the middle of a move, etc) -- and can probably ignore most special abilities too, and can forgo the flexibility the final product wil need as well.
20090320 00:06:45< Crab_> Dragonking: 6 because there are 6 hexes around a single hex. but that is now purely  arbitrary
20090320 00:06:52-!- thespaceinvader [n=chatzill@wesnoth/artist/thespaceinvader] has quit ["night all"]
20090320 00:07:06< boucman> Crab_: I'd be very interested in any patch that would ease FAI debugging... ask me or Dragonking if you're not sure what sort of help is needed
20090320 00:07:18< boucman> (and it's a good way to get into the C++ side of FAI)
20090320 00:07:34< boucman> see the EasyCoding page for details
20090320 00:08:18< Crab_> boucman: i've debugged them (a bit) yesterday myself [using gdb], while trying to hunt down my 1st bug ) 
20090320 00:08:25-!- iyonius [n=iyo@a02-0829c.kn.vutbr.cz] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
20090320 00:08:26< boucman> :P
20090320 00:09:02< nital> loonycyborg, Ivanovic, YogiHH, any other devs involved in providing Wesnoth binaries: Can I get your opinion about my idea on http://wesnoth.org/wiki/User:Nital ?
20090320 00:09:05-!- ikarius [n=ross@smtp.gridironsystems.com] has quit []
20090320 00:10:53 * Ivanovic has nothing to do with binaries
20090320 00:10:55< Ivanovic> ;)
20090320 00:11:27< Soliton> nital: sounds simple enough.
20090320 00:11:40< nital> I didn't really know, but you were the first person which I bugged with my idea ;)
20090320 00:12:12< Crab_> fabi: IMO, AI parameters are there to avoid hardcoding 'magic numbers' into c++ codefiles, where it is possible to attach some sort of description to those magic numbers. I'm yet so see what [ai] parameters there will be.
20090320 00:13:41< Soliton> nital: you'll have trouble keeping people from updating graphics though.
20090320 00:14:18< nital> Soliton: I guess it's not me who will have the trouble, but it will be a problem, yes ;)
20090320 00:14:25< boucman> nital: you should download 1.4.0 to 1.4.5 or something like that, to check your assumptions about file changes
20090320 00:14:36< silene> nital: you are not taking into account removed files, do you? please keep in mind, that wml allows to load all the wml files of a directory (i plead guilty) so you could get conflicts by not properly removing an obsolete file
20090320 00:14:43< boucman> I'm pretty sure we don't change the filestructure much, however, we do add quite a lot of art
20090320 00:15:20< nital> boucman: I will do it as soon as I have a working script ;)
20090320 00:15:26< boucman> and removing files might be a problem (nothing a small script couldn't solve, though)
20090320 00:16:05< boucman> nital: you should do it before that using any "diff" program, it's more about testing your assumptions and studying the problem than having something to test with
20090320 00:16:36< YogiHH> nital: I agree with Soliton, the graphics can be expected to change. I also suggest to separate sound as there can be changes, too and they really hit the download size.
20090320 00:16:54< boucman> ok, bed time here, good night all
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20090320 00:17:14< nital> silene: didn't know about that WML feature, I'll keep it in mind
20090320 00:17:19< YogiHH> nital: i think you can safely assume that there won't be any tree structure changes during a stable release
20090320 00:18:00-!- fabi is now known as fendrin
20090320 00:18:18< YogiHH> nital: all in all sounds like a good idea, though
20090320 00:19:32< Crab_> good night to all ) 
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20090320 00:20:05< nital> YogiHH: but won't separating the sound create some problems with WML?
20090320 00:20:17< nital> I thought that every soundfile is linked in WML
20090320 00:20:39< nital> so won't it produce missing file problems etc?
20090320 00:21:21< YogiHH> nital: not as long as the existing sound files are only updated. For new sound files you are indeed right, they need to be shipped or you risk certain scenarios not to be playable.
20090320 00:22:17-!- Sirp [n=me@wesnoth/developer/dave] has quit ["leaving"]
20090320 00:22:37< fendrin> YogiHH, nital: I believe the sceanrios will be playable but there is output on stdout about a missing file.
20090320 00:22:42< Soliton> which is why we won't do that in a stable branch.
20090320 00:22:44-!- Rrenys [n=rrenys@81-20-159-197.levira.ee] has quit [Success]
20090320 00:23:03< Soliton> it's supposed to be forward and backwards compatible.
20090320 00:23:52< nital> afaik there is 1.6 without mermen animations packaged right now... aren't they going to be added in 1.6.x?
20090320 00:24:07< nital> anrios will be playable but there is output on stdout about a missing file.
20090320 00:24:07< nital> 00:22:42 < Soliton> which is why we won't do that in a stable branch.
20090320 00:24:26< nital> sorry, that's strange putty copying text behaviour :/
20090320 00:25:58< nital> all right... thanks for the feedback, everyone
20090320 00:26:44< nital> seems like my tiny project being created for friends will be useful
20090320 00:27:26< nital> good night
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20090320 00:28:52< loonycyborg> nital: If I were you, I'd researched solutions commercial games use. Perhaps one of them is OSS..
20090320 00:28:59-!- jacek [n=chatzill@dhcp4-193.eastwest.com.pl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 00:29:59< nital> loonycyborg: I've searched quite a bit to assure that I'm not reinventing wheel and didn't find one.
20090320 00:30:55< sk-> any way to just download wesnoth.exe and not have to compile to get 1.6a?
20090320 00:31:11< nital> loonycyborg: I'll probably release mine therefore, before adding Wesnoth filetree hacks to it, so it can be of public use.
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20090320 00:41:39< Ivanovic> okay, i will separate 1.6 and trunk now
20090320 00:46:09< fendrin> Ivanovic: cool
20090320 00:46:25< Ivanovic> first a pot-update, then copying over trunk to branches/1.6
20090320 00:46:36< Ivanovic> right after this any kind of freeze on trunk is *over*
20090320 00:46:57< loonycyborg> Ivanovic: 1.6a installer is uploaded.
20090320 00:46:57< fendrin> thats good
20090320 00:46:59< Ivanovic> for branches/1.6 the feature freeze of course still applies and strings should only be changed, when it is really required
20090320 00:47:03< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: great
20090320 00:48:42< CIA-70> torangan * r33862 /trunk/ (changelog po/wesnoth/he.po po/wesnoth-tutorial/he.po): hewbrew translation update
20090320 00:49:08< CIA-70> ivanovic * r33863 /trunk/CMakeLists.txt: fontconfig and pangocairo are *only* required for building the game, not for the server and the rest...
20090320 00:51:15-!- silene [n=plouf@wesnoth/developer/silene] has quit ["Leaving."]
20090320 00:52:27< CIA-70> ivanovic * r33864 /trunk/ (310 files in 28 dirs): 
20090320 00:52:27< CIA-70> pot-update right before 1.6 is branched off (yes, string changes, this is done to have both in sync for at least some mins... the next pot update for trunk is basically one month away...)
20090320 00:52:27< CIA-70> regenerated doc files (due to many additions to the wesnothd manpage, those are now not complete enough anymore for inclusion and have to be translated further first)
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20090320 00:58:39< CIA-70> ivanovic * r33865 /branches/1.6/: move 1.6 stuff into branches/1.6, using "svn head"
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20090320 01:00:56< Velory> is config/config.sub missing in trunk?
20090320 01:01:13< Velory> and config/config.guess
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20090320 01:02:01< loonycyborg> Velory: They exist for me.
20090320 01:03:10< Velory> i downloaded wesnoth my other computer 10 min ago with svn but im taking this 2
20090320 01:03:10< Velory> configure.ac:48: required file `config/config.guess' not found
20090320 01:03:10< Velory> configure.ac:48: required file `config/config.sub' not found
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20090320 01:04:24< loonycyborg> Velory: Probably they're just not included in the tarball for some reason.
20090320 01:04:58< Velory> hmm ok anyway im going to bed good nite everyone
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20090320 01:05:25< loonycyborg> Ivanovic: Or are they?
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20090320 01:05:42 * loonycyborg doesn't know. He doesn't download tarballs :)
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20090320 01:07:28< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: no idea, i created the tarball "Just as usual"
20090320 01:07:59< loonycyborg> Well.. You could try tar xjvf and see..
20090320 01:08:44< Ivanovic> hey, i used the tarball here to build and it worked normally...
20090320 01:09:07< Ivanovic> but velory is talking about svn and autoconf stuff
20090320 01:09:14< Ivanovic> probably some wrong version thingie
20090320 01:09:30< loonycyborg> Yes. He downloaded with svn.
20090320 01:09:40 * loonycyborg was confused.
20090320 01:09:57< Sparks_> Hi, I would like to just quickly introduce myself..  I am planning to apply for the Google summer of code project.
20090320 01:10:17< Sparks_> and on the wiki it suggested I come here?
20090320 01:10:43< Soliton> hi
20090320 01:11:08< Sparks_> hello.
20090320 01:11:22< Sparks_> are you guys all developers on this channel?
20090320 01:11:46< Soliton> most of us, yes.
20090320 01:12:12< Sparks_> Seems the AI improvement project is quite popular :)
20090320 01:12:20< noy> it usually is
20090320 01:12:23< Smar> some are just lazy translators, too.
20090320 01:13:10 * loonycyborg wonders why everyone are so interested with AI :/
20090320 01:13:17< CIA-70> ivanovic * r33866 /branches/1.6/ (changelog configure.ac players_changelog src/wesconfig.h): 
20090320 01:13:17< CIA-70> correct changelog entries for 1.6 to list all the 1.6a stuff
20090320 01:13:17< CIA-70> bump version to 1.6+svn
20090320 01:13:40< Blueblaze_> loonycyborg, it is the backbone of single player gaming
20090320 01:13:46< CIA-70> ivanovic * r33867 /trunk/ (changelog configure.ac players_changelog src/wesconfig.h): 
20090320 01:13:46< CIA-70> correct changelog entries to list all the 1.6a stuff correctly
20090320 01:13:46< CIA-70> bump version to 1.7.0-svn
20090320 01:14:14< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: that is easy: there are not many projects out there that *offer* working on AI stuff and it is in general an interesting area
20090320 01:15:08< Sparks_> Well..  I'm on a compu science + AI course and I'm certainly enjoying it very much..
20090320 01:15:16< Ivanovic> :)
20090320 01:15:42< Ivanovic> Sparks_: have you already read a little in our wiki about the ai stuff and why it is difficult?
20090320 01:15:53< Sparks_> unfortunately, I find myself reloading somewhat too often in single player :(
20090320 01:16:03< Ivanovic> you should first get an idea of what you will be getting into
20090320 01:16:05< Ivanovic> ;)
20090320 01:16:13< Sparks_> Ivanovic:  Yes I did read a little today
20090320 01:16:29< Ivanovic> this is a good start
20090320 01:16:52< Sparks_> I'm not too familar with c++ currently but quite comfortable with OO programming in general
20090320 01:16:55< Ivanovic> another question: you got an account in the forums? if yes, what is it's name (so that i can add you to the SoC group)?
20090320 01:17:33< Sparks_> Sparksteel :)
20090320 01:17:35< Sparks_> thx
20090320 01:18:16< Dragonking> Sparks_: Actually quite good understanding of C++ is requied for AI work
20090320 01:18:54< Sparks_> Unfortunately, our course went for the Java-heavy approach..
20090320 01:19:18< Sparks_> But I'd like to get fluent with c++ too..
20090320 01:19:45< Dragonking> Sparks_: You should look here then: http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/EasyCoding
20090320 01:20:35< loonycyborg> Sparks_: I'm sure you'll find a lot of people on this channel who'll explain C++ stuff to you :)
20090320 01:21:01< Sparks_> And from what I have read on the wiki so far, I'm getting the impression that part of the problem is more about finding appropriate datastructures and algorithms for the AI, not neccessarily language-specific issues?? Or is that a wrong impression?
20090320 01:21:37< Sparks_> Dragonking/loonycyborg:  Thx, I'll give those a go 
20090320 01:21:49< Dragonking> You get right impression.
20090320 01:22:02< Sparks_> :)
20090320 01:22:28< Dragonking> Besides C++, good understanding of the strategy gaming and wesnoth gamplay is needed
20090320 01:22:41< Dragonking> Plus some ideas of course :)
20090320 01:23:13< Sparks_> I have been learning Haskell(functional) and Prolog(logical/declaritive) as part of my vourse so far, so have had quite a broad experience of different ways of think about the same programming proble :)
20090320 01:23:20< Dragonking> Just look around, try some coding, think about your proposal and don't be afraid to ask.
20090320 01:23:26< Sparks_> cool :)
20090320 01:23:28< Sparks_> thx
20090320 01:23:38< Dragonking> You're welcome.
20090320 01:24:41< Sparks_> It is about midnight now here.. and we have a heavy team project going currently at uni..  but hopefully I'll pop in again tomorrow.. Nice meeting you guys.. Bye!
20090320 01:24:48< YogiHH> fendrin, are you still there?
20090320 01:25:11< Ivanovic> Sparks_: uhm, i don't find your forum username
20090320 01:25:54< Sparks_> umm.. It's 'Sparksteel'  I have also started a wiki page (not yet filled) in the SoC page?
20090320 01:26:31< Sparks_> I really need to sleep now :) 12.30pm lol..  see you guys later!
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20090320 01:26:46< Smar> 02.27 ....
20090320 01:26:59< fendrin> YogiHH: yes
20090320 01:27:02< Ivanovic> okay, it is probably his wiki name, not his forum name...
20090320 01:27:21< YogiHH> fendrin: i know what's wrong with scenario 3 of LoW
20090320 01:27:38< fendrin> YogiHH: it's the shroud?
20090320 01:27:50< YogiHH> fendrin: no, i will try to explain
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20090320 01:28:13< YogiHH> the AI is looking for targets and villages are natural targets
20090320 01:28:43< YogiHH> every village first gets a rating that is dependent on its distance to the AI leader
20090320 01:29:07< YogiHH> for this, it is not accounting for its own unit distribution or terrain costs
20090320 01:29:31< Turuk> If he cannot find you, you do not exist....
20090320 01:29:43< YogiHH> after having done this, every village gets a weighted rating correction
20090320 01:29:48< Dragonking> Good night everyone, see you areoun sunday evening
20090320 01:29:54< Dragonking> Good luck with students ;p
20090320 01:30:23< YogiHH> the correction is done by measuring the distance to every other village on the map and considering the weight of that village as well
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20090320 01:31:13< YogiHH> this leads to the effect, that village clusters get extraordinary high ratings, because their distances are small
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20090320 01:31:48< YogiHH> that's why the AI tries to get to Kalenz's keep, because the villages around there have the highest rating
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20090320 01:32:32< YogiHH> once you deactivate this weighted correction, the AI is doing exactly what you expected it to do
20090320 01:32:58< Ivanovic> ahh, this cleanup feels *good*...
20090320 01:33:42< YogiHH> fendrin: just comment ai_move.cpp, line 224 (this one): targets[n].value = new_values[n];
20090320 01:34:05< YogiHH> fendrin: then you will find that the AI is going for the nearest villages and sends all the wolves down south
20090320 01:34:32< YogiHH> fendrin: so in a way, it's not a bug but by design (although i am not sure if the design is good ;-)
20090320 01:35:45< YogiHH> fendrin: still there? ;-)
20090320 01:36:04 * Ivanovic thinks that fendrin fell from his chair...
20090320 01:36:09< fendrin> YogiHH: I see. That cluster feature sounds not that bad.
20090320 01:36:41< YogiHH> fendrin: well, i don't know, it keeps the AI from concentrating on the most straightforward targets here
20090320 01:36:43< fendrin> YogiHH: It just doesn't get that the cluster isn't scoutable because of enemy presence.
20090320 01:37:12< YogiHH> fendrin: that's right, only distance counts for the rating of villages
20090320 01:37:21< alink> Ivanovic: maybe add a link to GSoC wiki info in the channel topic ?
20090320 01:37:28< fendrin> [ai] scout_go_for_clusters=boolean
20090320 01:37:45 * YogiHH had the same idea
20090320 01:38:24< YogiHH> fendrin: you are on windows, right?
20090320 01:38:57< Ivanovic> alink: sounds like a good idea
20090320 01:40:08< alink> btw, wesbot is smart enough to change only the bug counts? how does it works? he catches the '|' or something
20090320 01:40:22< alink> wesbot: topic
20090320 01:40:42< alink> good smart wesbot :)
20090320 01:40:44< Ivanovic> yes, it is able to do so, it just changes the bug/feature/patch counter
20090320 01:41:16 * Smar smells smartyness..
20090320 01:41:29< Ivanovic> okay, i got to head off to bed now, n8
20090320 01:41:40< alink> gn Ivanovic
20090320 01:41:42< YogiHH> same here, good night
20090320 01:41:52< alink> btw I just added a link to irc logs in that page, so the loop is done
20090320 01:42:04< alink> bye YogiHH
20090320 01:42:27-!- YogiHH [i=YogiHH@wesnoth/developer/yogihh] has quit ["Bye folks"]
20090320 01:42:43 * alink feels sleepy too now, goodnight all
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20090320 02:08:22< [Relic]> Hello :)
20090320 02:14:05-!- Sirp [n=me@wesnoth/developer/dave] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 02:14:59< Sirp> hi
20090320 02:15:48< crimson_penguin> hi Sirp 
20090320 02:16:00< [Relic]> :)
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20090320 02:25:12 * Sirp wonders why slashdot seems to hate us. They linked to three games in the GSoC story, but not us.
20090320 02:25:28< Shadow_Master> 19:49 <Ivanovic> and, even more important: will the versioning stuff handle a 1.6a release well?
20090320 02:25:31< Shadow_Master> yes
20090320 02:27:05< voris> Good lord. Bzflag?
20090320 02:27:13< dfranke> is there a reason not to just call it 1.6.1?
20090320 02:27:20< voris> That is odd, Sirp.
20090320 02:27:52< Shadow_Master> ... why kvirc is more stupid than irssi at handling network disconnections??
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20090320 02:30:37< crimson_penguin> dfranke: because 1.6 isn't even announced, I guess
20090320 02:31:29< Shadow_Master> 1.6.0.1
20090320 02:31:29< Shadow_Master> ;)
20090320 02:32:01< Shadow_Master> (hey, why not start using that convention instead of those silly suffixes from now on...)
20090320 02:32:02< crimson_penguin> heh
20090320 02:32:54< Shadow_Master> and nobody wants to reply to my message in the ML...
20090320 02:34:33< crimson_penguin> gah, I don't wanna package and upload again - I don't think it'd work here very well
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20090320 02:46:15< voris> Isn't it 1.6.0.3? rc3 and all...
20090320 02:46:26< voris> Oh he's gone.
20090320 02:46:28< voris> Nevermind.
20090320 02:46:32< shadowmaster> me?
20090320 02:46:36< voris> Oh hi!
20090320 02:46:37< voris> hehe
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20090320 03:04:35< shadowmaster> doing that is pretty simple with the power of regexps
20090320 03:04:41< shadowmaster> (and Perl)
20090320 03:05:02< shadowmaster> wrong time.
20090320 03:05:28< shadowmaster> voris: no, it isn't.
20090320 03:05:34< shadowmaster> RCs are numbered as 1.5.x versions.
20090320 03:05:45< voris> True.
20090320 03:09:32-!- ilor [n=user@wesnoth/developer/ilor] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)]
20090320 03:12:23< cjhopman> 1.6 is off in its own branch now, right?
20090320 03:13:27< Sirp> cjhopman: hey, are you hoping to participate with us in GSoC this year?
20090320 03:13:43< cjhopman> yeah
20090320 03:14:08< CIA-70> cjhopman * r33868 /trunk/src/ (unit_map.cpp unit_map.hpp): 
20090320 03:14:08< CIA-70> - greatly improve unit_map interface documentation
20090320 03:14:08< CIA-70> - templatize unit_map iterators
20090320 03:14:20< Sirp> cjhopman: cool, do you have any ideas what you're interested in working on?
20090320 03:14:51< Sirp> cjhopman: any chance I could interest you in developing a web app for me, or are you more interested in the main engine? :)
20090320 03:15:08< cjhopman> ah, more interested in the main engine.
20090320 03:15:34< shadowmaster> anyone knows if it's possible to have two working directories for a single git repository?
20090320 03:15:38< Sirp> fair enough.
20090320 03:15:44< Sirp> cjhopman: anything in particular you're interested in?
20090320 03:15:51< cjhopman> right now, i'm most interested in the optimization of config memory usage...
20090320 03:16:16< cjhopman> though i think dragonking was interested in that, too...
20090320 03:16:26< Sirp> cjhopman: oh really? Cool.
20090320 03:16:55< Sirp> cjhopman: yeah. A good thing we're talking actually. I think if you were really interested in that we could probably convince Dragonking to do something else, since he was interested in a number of areas.
20090320 03:18:13< Sirp> cjhopman: and to be honest, you're one of the only potential applicants that I would really trust with that project.
20090320 03:18:41< cjhopman> Sirp: yeah, that's the only project that I've put some thought into how I would do it.
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20090320 03:34:46< Sirp> cjhopman: I assume you've read my blog posting on the matter at http://dave.wesnoth.org ?
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20090320 03:37:43< cjhopman> Sirp: I have
20090320 03:39:49< cjhopman> Sirp: do you have any experience with google performance tools?
20090320 03:42:17< Sirp> cjhopman: only a little.
20090320 03:42:28< Sirp> they generally work pretty well though.
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20090320 03:50:22< crimson_p> so is there any easy way to get my svn to (a)?
20090320 04:07:43< Soliton> svn switch tags/1.6a
20090320 04:09:10< Soliton> shadowmaster: git-new-workdir
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20090320 04:32:31< crimson_penguin> Soliton: thanks; didn't realize there was actually a tag
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20090320 04:57:07< PK> heyo everyone.
20090320 04:57:36< PK> when 1.6 comes out will it be compatable with the 1.5.14 (if .14 becomes 1.6 that is)? Or will there be a must-have re-download?
20090320 05:01:55< Soliton> it's compatible.
20090320 05:02:41< PK> ah good. I'll get it then.
20090320 05:03:05< PK> so its pretty much just 1.6 beta, and when 1.6 comes out it'll just be slightly obsolete?
20090320 05:04:09< Soliton> 1.6 is out.
20090320 05:09:54< PK> oh really?
20090320 05:09:57< PK> hmm
20090320 05:10:23< PK> www.wesnoth.org still has 1.5.14 which is only a "release candidate"
20090320 05:13:06< Blueblaze_> PK, the official announcement hasn't been made
20090320 05:13:13< Blueblaze_> As the topic says, it will be announced Sunday
20090320 05:17:35< PK> oooh
20090320 05:17:39< PK> I see.
20090320 05:18:08< PK> Except I'm more confused than when I came here now.
20090320 05:21:28< PK> hmm
20090320 05:21:42< PK> it looks like I'll have to redownload because the userdata is stored in 1.5 folder, no?
20090320 05:24:59< Soliton> no.
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20090320 05:38:23< PK> okay. I'll just click and pray.
20090320 05:38:47< PK> the way the pioneers of the interwebs did it, running headfirst into nests upon nests of spiders.
20090320 05:45:26-!- CeeGee [n=contact@adsl-70-240-77-109.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 05:45:58< CeeGee> hello
20090320 05:46:04< cjhopman> hi
20090320 05:47:10< PK> hola.
20090320 05:47:29< CeeGee> i am new to this group
20090320 05:47:38< CeeGee> what do you guys discuss here?
20090320 05:50:26< CeeGee> I want to be one of Wesnoth's Google Summer of Code students
20090320 05:51:22< PK> don't ask me, I come in here to ask questions that are completely off topic. Generally via PM.
20090320 05:51:32< CeeGee> ok
20090320 05:51:37< CeeGee> Turuk, Sirp, Ivanovic?
20090320 05:51:42< PK> most time they're uploading stuff to some bots er something.
20090320 05:52:01< PK> never can tell what they're doing, but its obviously important.
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20090320 05:55:26< cjhopman> lol
20090320 05:57:03< Sirp> CeeGee: what can we do to help you?
20090320 05:58:01< CeeGee> I became interested in the project of implementing campaign statistics reports 
20090320 05:58:16< Sirp> okay, well, good; we want someone who is interested in that.
20090320 05:58:29< Sirp> did you have a particular set of web technologies that you're most familiar with and want to use?
20090320 05:59:11< CeeGee> Who will be mentoring that project?
20090320 05:59:24< Sirp> I don't think we're sure yet; possibly me.
20090320 06:00:00< Sirp> CeeGee: so what web technologies are you familiar with?
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20090320 06:01:34-!- CG [n=contact@adsl-70-240-77-109.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 06:01:48< CG> I am sorry I got disconnected
20090320 06:01:54< CG> Who will be mentoring that project?
20090320 06:02:09< CG> I wanted more details about this idea
20090320 06:02:32< Sirp> I don't think we're sure yet; possibly me.
20090320 06:02:34< Sirp> CeeGee: so what web technologies are you familiar with?
20090320 06:03:20< CG> HTML,CSS,Javascript,ASP,JSP,PHP
20090320 06:03:26< CG> VBScript
20090320 06:04:01< CG> and I have worked on web development for quite some time
20090320 06:04:14< CG> though small local projects
20090320 06:05:16< Sirp> okay.
20090320 06:05:27< Sirp> are you familiar with Linux or any other Unix variant?
20090320 06:05:42< CG> yes I am familiar with unix
20090320 06:05:52< Sirp> okay.
20090320 06:05:54< CG> but not too much
20090320 06:06:03< Sirp> and have you used MySQL or any other RDBMS?
20090320 06:06:11< CG> have learnt unix and basic shell scripting
20090320 06:06:25< CG> yes Ive used MySQL, Oracle, SQLServer
20090320 06:06:40< CG> I am an Oracle Certified Associate
20090320 06:06:59< CG> am good with PL/SQL
20090320 06:07:21< Sirp> okay, cool.
20090320 06:07:49< Sirp> so basically we have a MySQL database which has a bunch of stats from games played, and we want a web interface which will show nice reports based on this data.
20090320 06:08:03< CG> that sound good
20090320 06:08:09< Sirp> so we need a web site that will run on our Linux server that will generate these reports and display them.
20090320 06:08:36< CG> ok...can I use Java Applets for the same?
20090320 06:08:42< CG> I am good at Java
20090320 06:08:54< PK> 'sept it tastes nasty.
20090320 06:09:05< PK> 's like mud in a cup.
20090320 06:10:12< CG> ?
20090320 06:10:50< PK> if you wanna have coffeebreaks I suggest mocha. Way better.
20090320 06:11:22< CG> Sirp you thr?
20090320 06:11:25< PK> got that chocolate tinge too it, less dirt.
20090320 06:11:30< cjhopman> PK: lol
20090320 06:14:55< PK> ay music/sounds for a specific player? Like say if a faction had its own music only people with that faction would hear it?
20090320 06:15:27< PK> hmm, the first part of that sentence got cut off "any devs here know if-- --can work for--"
20090320 06:15:32< Sirp> CG: developers here tend to get busy. Please be patient.
20090320 06:15:50< CG> oh I am sorry, I thought you left
20090320 06:16:00< Sirp> CG: you are welcome to make the case for any technology. I trust you know all the trade offs of Java Applets.
20090320 06:16:01< CG> This is my first time on this group :)
20090320 06:16:29< CG> yes I know
20090320 06:16:31< Sirp> the biggest problem being that your Java Applet still needs a way to get the data from the server.
20090320 06:16:56< Sirp> and we're not going to want to send all the data, since that'd be prohibitive, so you're still going to need lots of processing to occur on the server.
20090320 06:16:58< CG> well, that can be done (if I am not wrong)
20090320 06:17:36< CG> hmm
20090320 06:18:35< CG> I can try Java, if not successful, I can try other technologies too
20090320 06:19:38< Sirp> CG: to seriously consider a student we would want to see a prototype of their work that they can evolve into the final thing.
20090320 06:21:01< CG> so what do you want me to do?
20090320 06:22:39< Sirp> CG: these are the MySQL commands to create the database that we have: http://pastebin.com/m21294501
20090320 06:23:04< Sirp> CG: go and make a program that will read data from such a database and display it in a web interface.
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20090320 06:24:30< CG> ok
20090320 06:24:50< CG> how much time can I take for the same?
20090320 06:26:25< Sirp> CG: well, you'd want to have something nice to show by the application deadline.
20090320 06:27:03< CG> hmm
20090320 06:27:47< CG> I shall try to work on it as fast as I can, since I am in a Masters program, it will be quite difficult to give much time in the mid of my semester
20090320 06:28:24< CG> I have taken 5 courses so its hard to get time
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20090320 06:30:52< CeeGee> got logged out again
20090320 06:31:59< CeeGee> Sirp, these are just the table structures, do you want me to create a dummy code that accesses these tables?
20090320 06:32:12< CeeGee> that *shows* to access these tables?
20090320 06:34:26-!- crimson_penguin [n=ben@wesnoth/developer/crimsonpenguin] has quit ["Leaving"]
20090320 06:34:33< Sirp> CeeGee: well it should be real code, to access tables like this. I'm sure you can create the tables in your own database. Then once we're convinced you're a good candidate, we'll give you access to our real database.
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20090320 06:34:51< Sirp> I'm sure that you're able to set up a database with this schema, populate it with some dummy data, and then make a prototype which accesses it, yes?
20090320 06:36:19< CeeGee> ya I always meant a real code. what i wanted to say was that since I dont have any real database to connect to, the code will not actually show any sound output
20090320 06:36:35< CeeGee> However, as I said, I shall work on this and let you know
20090320 06:36:52< Sirp> CeeGee: well I'm sure that you can set up your own database, no?
20090320 06:37:00< CeeGee> yes I will
20090320 06:37:12< CeeGee> but please dont expect me to work on prototypes a lot since I cannot give much time to it...
20090320 06:37:40< CeeGee> right now
20090320 06:38:00< Sirp> CeeGee: well it depends on how compelling you want your application to be.
20090320 06:38:05< CeeGee> since I am in the middle of my spring semester
20090320 06:39:21< Sirp> well I've been to college too. Now I'm a senior engineer at Google, and raise a family, and still manage to find plenty of times to put toward open source development.....I guess it depends what one is really passionate about.
20090320 06:39:31< CeeGee> Well, you can get an idea of my skills from the sample that I give you...I cant devote much time right now to make it compelling
20090320 06:39:41< CeeGee> I agree
20090320 06:39:56< CeeGee> I am passionate about it
20090320 06:40:29< Sirp> excellent. I look forward to seeing a very compelling prototype then.
20090320 06:40:31< Sirp> :)
20090320 06:40:51< CeeGee> ok I will do my best in whatever time I can give to it
20090320 06:41:43< CeeGee> how many students are you planning to take in this program?
20090320 06:42:25< Sirp> I think we'll likely have four or five.
20090320 06:43:27< CeeGee> ok...and how many students have approached you for this particular idea?
20090320 06:43:52< Sirp> for this idea? I do believe you are the first one.
20090320 06:44:07< CeeGee> ok
20090320 06:44:24< CeeGee> Do you want any other information from me?
20090320 06:45:25< Sirp> I don't think so. I look forward to seeing your prototype with your application. Ask any questions you need to in developing it.
20090320 06:46:37< CeeGee> is the application you are referring to, the GSoC application?
20090320 06:46:50< Sirp> yes.
20090320 06:46:58< CeeGee> or is there any other application I need to submit to Wesnoth?
20090320 06:47:29< Sirp> CeeGee: no, that's it. I'm sure that you can appreciate that we really want to make sure we only select the strongest possible developers, and those who we think have the skill and dedication to continue as a developer once SoC is over.
20090320 06:49:51-!- CG [n=contact@adsl-68-91-103-89.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 06:50:00< CG> sorry I got dc again
20090320 06:50:04< CG> I was saying that
20090320 06:50:08< CG> I am completed dedicated to what I do
20090320 06:50:21< CG> Hence this opportunity is a good chance for me
20090320 06:50:24< Sirp> well good, I am glad to hear it.
20090320 06:51:07-!- CeeGe [n=contact@adsl-70-240-77-109.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 06:51:20< CeeGe> I am completed dedicated to what I do
20090320 06:51:24< CeeGe> Hence this opportunity is a good chance for me
20090320 06:51:40< CeeGe> what are the other ways to get in touch with you?
20090320 06:51:54< CeeGe> because I may not have access to IRC in college labs?
20090320 06:53:15< Sirp> CeeGee: well can you get web access? at http://www.mibbit.com there is a nice web interface to IRC.
20090320 06:54:26< CeeGe> ok I shall try that
20090320 06:54:39< CeeGe> any gmail ID?
20090320 06:54:51-!- crimson_pingvin [n=ben@S0106001cf0705af9.cc.shawcable.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 06:57:31< Sirp> CeeGee: we really prefer to use this as our main method of communicating. Project members are all very busy and we'd prefer not to disrupt their lives with messaging using other systems.
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20090320 07:02:11< CeeGe> sure
20090320 07:02:15< CeeGe> no problem
20090320 07:02:25< CeeGe> do you always stay online here?
20090320 07:05:15< Sirp> I don't; some people do.
20090320 07:05:57< Sirp> hi noy
20090320 07:06:04< CeeGe> ok I shall get back to you soon
20090320 07:06:08< CeeGe> bye till then
20090320 07:06:09< CeeGe> cya
20090320 07:06:10< noy> allo
20090320 07:06:26< Sirp> bye.
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20090320 07:39:12< crimson_penguin> Ivanovic: I can't really upload a new build until hopefully Saturday - I'm staying at a hostel, and the internet is rather flakey
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20090320 07:51:39< dfranke> something wrong with the MP server?
20090320 07:51:42< dfranke> I'm seeing an empty lobby.
20090320 07:52:00< dfranke> for 1.4
20090320 07:52:38< wildpenguin> wesnoth.org seems down.
20090320 07:54:02< dfranke> hanging on waiting for an HTTP reply?
20090320 07:54:39< wildpenguin> yes.  I'm seeing the same here.
20090320 07:55:47< dfranke> what a peculiar wedge state.
20090320 07:56:25< dfranke> TCP connections succeed, but then no data makes it out?
20090320 07:56:57< dfranke> pings work
20090320 07:57:09-!- PK [n=pk@r74-192-44-206.vctrcmta01.vctatx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net] has quit ["Java user signed off"]
20090320 07:57:39< cjhopman> looks full to me
20090320 07:57:57< cjhopman> wesnoth.org works
20090320 07:58:15< dfranke> cjhopman: do you see me in the lobby?
20090320 07:58:44< cjhopman> yes
20090320 07:58:51< cjhopman> dfranke and dfranke_
20090320 07:58:57< dfranke> yup
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20090320 07:59:26< wildpenguin> This has been occurring as of 30mins ago for me.
20090320 07:59:28< dfranke> I quit and reconnected, and it told me my username was taken.  So I put in dfranke_, and get an empty lobby again
20090320 07:59:33-!- ABCD [n=ABCD@wikipedia/ABCD] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
20090320 08:00:32< dfranke> I can get to wesnoth.org from my linode in NJ but not my one in CA.
20090320 08:01:41< dfranke> border gateway somewhere setting the evil bit?
20090320 08:04:34-!- Turuk_ [n=Turuk@FUSE-WS1-208-102-202-188.fuse.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 08:04:57< dfranke> I suspect ORM-LLC-1123020.cust.snet.net is the broken router.
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20090320 08:06:47< CIA-70> silene * r33870 /trunk/src/ (about.cpp about.hpp): Removed config::get_children from about.cpp.
20090320 08:06:48< CIA-70> silene * r33871 /trunk/src/config.hpp: Added conversion from child_iterator to const_child_iterator.
20090320 08:06:51< CIA-70> silene * r33869 /trunk/src/ (23 files in 3 dirs): Modified config::child_range so that it returns opaque iterators.
20090320 08:06:53< CIA-70> silene * r33872 /trunk/src/ (6 files): Removed config::child_list from gamestatus.cpp.
20090320 08:06:56< CIA-70> silene * r33873 /trunk/src/replay.cpp: Partly removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:07:00< CIA-70> silene * r33874 /trunk/src/unit_types.cpp: Partly removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:07:03< CIA-70> silene * r33875 /trunk/src/mapgen.cpp: Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:07:07< CIA-70> silene * r33876 /trunk/src/playturn.cpp: Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:07:09< CIA-70> silene * r33877 /trunk/src/time_of_day.cpp: Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:07:11< CIA-70> silene * r33878 /trunk/src/intro.cpp: Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:07:15< CIA-70> silene * r33879 /trunk/src/ (cavegen.cpp cavegen.hpp): Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:07:19< CIA-70> silene * r33880 /trunk/src/map_label.cpp: Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:07:25< CIA-70> silene * r33881 /trunk/src/ (game_events.cpp team.cpp team.hpp): Removed config::child_list from team.cpp.
20090320 08:07:26< CIA-70> silene * r33882 /trunk/src/filesystem.cpp: Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:07:29< CIA-70> silene * r33883 /trunk/src/statistics.cpp: Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:07:37-!- ABCD [n=ABCD@wikipedia/ABCD] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 08:07:38< CIA-70> silene * r33884 /trunk/src/ (map.cpp terrain.cpp terrain.hpp): Removed config::child_list from map.cpp.
20090320 08:07:40< CIA-70> silene * r33885 /trunk/src/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:07:41< CIA-70> silene * r33886 /trunk/src/ (race.cpp race.hpp unit_types.cpp): Removed config::child_list from race.hpp.
20090320 08:07:48< CIA-70> silene * r33887 /trunk/src/ (dialogs.cpp unit.cpp unit.hpp): Removed config::child_list from unit.hpp.
20090320 08:07:50< CIA-70> silene * r33888 /trunk/src/ (dialogs.cpp unit.cpp unit_types.cpp unit_types.hpp): Removed config::child_list and vector<config*> from unit_types.hpp.
20090320 08:07:54 * Blueblaze_ ignores CIA-70
20090320 08:07:54< CIA-70> silene * r33889 /trunk/src/titlescreen.cpp: Removed config::child_range_bak.
20090320 08:07:56< CIA-70> silene * r33890 /trunk/src/theme.cpp: Partly removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:07:59< CIA-70> silene * r33891 /trunk/src/unit_animation.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:08:02< CIA-70> silene * r33892 /trunk/src/font.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:08:02< dfranke> weeee
20090320 08:08:05< CIA-70> silene * r33893 /trunk/src/builder.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:08:09< CIA-70> silene * r33894 /trunk/src/ai.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:08:12< CIA-70> silene * r33895 /trunk/src/hotkeys.cpp: Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:08:15< CIA-70> silene * r33896 /trunk/src/editor2/editor_controller.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:08:20 * Blueblaze_ kicks CIA-70
20090320 08:08:20< CIA-70> ow
20090320 08:08:22< dfranke> ok, back up from home now, suspecting CIA-70's behavior is not coincidental.
20090320 08:08:40< CIA-70> silene * r33897 /trunk/src/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Removed config::get_children from addon_checks.cpp.
20090320 08:08:41< CIA-70> silene * r33898 /trunk/src/ (6 files): Removed config::get_children from unit_abilities.cpp.
20090320 08:08:41< CIA-70> silene * r33899 /trunk/src/ (game_events.cpp game_events.hpp play_controller.cpp unit.cpp): Removed config::child_list from game_events.hpp.
20090320 08:08:42< CIA-70> silene * r33901 /trunk/src/multiplayer_create.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:08:43< CIA-70> silene * r33900 /trunk/src/ (12 files): Removed config::values.
20090320 08:08:45< CIA-70> silene * r33902 /trunk/src/titlescreen.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:08:50< CIA-70> silene * r33903 /trunk/src/ (config.hpp unit.cpp): Removed hardly used function.
20090320 08:08:56< CIA-70> silene * r33904 /trunk/src/ (15 files in 3 dirs): Replaced field config::values by function config::attribute_range which returns opaque iterators.
20090320 08:08:59< CIA-70> silene * r33905 /trunk/src/multiplayer_lobby.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:09:03< CIA-70> silene * r33906 /trunk/src/unit.cpp: Partly removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:09:07< CIA-70> silene * r33907 /trunk/src/game_events.cpp: Removed config::child_list.
20090320 08:09:12< CIA-70> silene * r33908 /trunk/src/ (3 files): Removed config::get_children from playcampaign.cpp.
20090320 08:09:14< CIA-70> silene * r33909 /trunk/src/playsingle_controller.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:09:19< CIA-70> silene * r33910 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/window_builder.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:09:20< CIA-70> silene * r33911 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/ (settings.cpp settings.hpp): Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:09:25< CIA-70> silene * r33912 /trunk/src/game_preferences_display.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:09:30< CIA-70> silene * r33913 /trunk/src/multiplayer_ui.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:09:31< CIA-70> silene * r33914 /trunk/src/game_preferences.cpp: Removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:09:36< CIA-70> silene * r33915 /trunk/src/campaign_server/campaign_server.cpp: Partly removed config::get_children.
20090320 08:09:40< CIA-70> silene * r33916 /trunk/src/ (6 files): Removed config::get_children from multiplayer_wait.cpp.
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20090320 08:24:30< stikonas> Ivanovic: will you update 1.6 Announcement with new paths for 1.6a?
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20090320 08:31:06< Munk> umm hello?
20090320 08:31:28-!- Espreon [n=espreon@wesnoth/developer/espreon] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
20090320 08:31:46< Blueblaze_> hi Munk
20090320 08:33:19< Munk> hi, I'm trying to get in the google summer of code project and the website referred me to here
20090320 08:33:36< Munk> the wesnoth website , that is
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20090320 08:33:53< Blueblaze_> Munk, have you read this, http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/SummerOfCodeIdeas
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20090320 08:36:58< Munk> yes
20090320 08:37:17< Munk> actually that's where it told me to come here
20090320 08:38:01< Blueblaze_> So have you actually downloaded and played Wesnoth?
20090320 08:38:26< Munk> Yeah, I played it for several months
20090320 08:38:38< Blueblaze_> Ah good, so do you have any ideas for a particular project?
20090320 08:39:35< Munk> Not yet
20090320 08:40:00< Munk> Actually, I haven't played it since November
20090320 08:40:05-!- crimson_penguin [n=ben@S0106001cf0705af9.cc.shawcable.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 08:40:36< Munk> I'll spend the next few days playing and reading the source code
20090320 08:40:50< Blueblaze_> Alright, well it wouldn't do harm to dl the latest version just to get a feel for changes, I've got to get to sleep now, but here is a list of people that can help you out depending on what area you have questions on: http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/SoC_People_to_bug_on_IRC
20090320 08:41:25< Munk> I realize it's a poor time to join the channel
20090320 08:41:27< Blueblaze_> If you have some specific questions, then ask them here and eventually you should get a response :P
20090320 08:41:42< Munk> It's 3:41 in the morning I have to sleep too
20090320 08:41:53< Munk> Ok, thanks a lot
20090320 08:41:53< Blueblaze_> Yeah, the Americas are just in bed and the Europeans are just getting out of bed
20090320 08:42:23< Munk> I'll come join the channel tomorrow at a more appropriate time
20090320 08:42:23< Blueblaze_> There is a large amount of European members of the project, so we're actually very active in the early to late afternoons
20090320 08:42:49< Blueblaze_> Not as many developers are on at night in Eastern Time Zone, since that's late night in Europe
20090320 08:43:00< Munk> I see
20090320 08:43:16< Blueblaze_> Munk, just spend some more time getting refreshed with updates, check out  other areas of Wesnoth development, and yeah, come back when a few more people are alive :)
20090320 08:43:20< Blueblaze_> See you later
20090320 08:43:31< Munk> See you and thank you
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20090320 08:57:52< crimson_penguin> Ivanovic: I'm not sure if what I said before actually went through... Basically I'm on flakey internet until Saturday evening
20090320 08:58:07< crimson_penguin> maybe I can go to the library...
20090320 08:58:11< crimson_penguin> bed now
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20090320 10:10:39< grzybacz> morning
20090320 10:18:38-!- stikonas [n=stikonas@ctv-79-132-187-171.vinita.lt] has joined #wesnoth-dev
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20090320 10:52:21< zookeeper> the AI doesn't seem to obey [ai] [avoid]s anymore
20090320 10:52:44< Ivanovic> moin
20090320 10:52:48< zookeeper> (not sure when was the last time it has, or whether it's somehow specific to this case i have here..)
20090320 10:53:29-!- turin [n=turin@168.215.249.247] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
20090320 10:53:45< Ivanovic> crimson_penguin: (in the hope you read the logs) yes, i got your message that you won't be able to upload "soon"
20090320 10:54:14< Ivanovic> crimson_penguin: the easiest way to get the changes is just switch your svn to tags/1.6a just as Soliton described
20090320 10:54:47< Ivanovic> beside this all the changes are also available as plain and dirty patch: http://rafb.net/p/DG3gLZ97.html
20090320 10:56:55< CIA-70> zookeeper * r33917 /trunk/data/campaigns/Eastern_Invasion/ (maps/The_Arena.map scenarios/18a.The_Duel.cfg): A completely new map and WML cleanup for "The Duel".
20090320 11:06:44-!- stikonas [n=stikonas@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
20090320 11:38:47< Ivanovic> stikonas: (in the hope you read the logs...) i plan to change the links using a plain sed command on all po files right before announcing
20090320 11:40:25< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: i am about to remove the "plain" 1.6 windows installer from sf.net
20090320 11:40:40< Ivanovic> since the 1.6a version is already available
20090320 11:43:11< loonycyborg> Ivanovic: I suppose that it's a sane idea..
20090320 11:43:31< Ivanovic> thought so, too
20090320 11:43:49< Ivanovic> will now do some sed magic on the names of the binaries
20090320 11:46:26< Ivanovic> ha, the links to the binaries were broken anyway...
20090320 11:49:48-!- Turuk_ [n=Turuk@FUSE-WS1-208-102-202-188.fuse.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 11:53:08< CIA-70> zookeeper * r33918 /trunk/data/campaigns/Liberty/scenarios/02_Civil_Disobedience.cfg: Fixed Tarwen's killer not receiving XP.
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20090320 12:02:57< CIA-70> ivanovic * r33919 /website/start/1.6/ (57 files in 2 dirs): 
20090320 12:02:57< CIA-70> change download urls to corrected values:
20090320 12:02:57< CIA-70> wesnoth-1.6.tar.bz2 -> wesnoth-1.6a.tar.bz2
20090320 12:02:57< CIA-70> wesnoth-1.6-windows.exe -> wesnoth-1.6a-win32.exe
20090320 12:02:57< CIA-70> Wesnoth_MacOSX_1.6.dmg -> Wesnoth_1.6a.dmg
20090320 12:02:58< CIA-70> All po files were updated in the original and translated strings (thanks to sed...)
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20090320 12:58:26-!- Shadow_Master [n=ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 12:59:17< Shadow_Master> hi
20090320 12:59:22< loonycyborg> hello
20090320 13:00:11< Shadow_Master> AI0867: :/
20090320 13:00:38< loonycyborg> Ivanovic: So, trunk is now 1.7, feature freeze is lifted and commits are allowed?
20090320 13:01:20< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: like i wrote in my mail: YES
20090320 13:01:30< Ivanovic> you can mess with trunk as you please
20090320 13:02:43< Shadow_Master> holy commit spam.
20090320 13:03:07< loonycyborg> Ah. I was distracted from your mail by laughing at the guy who posted "quit emailing me" :P
20090320 13:04:36< Shadow_Master> Soliton thanks
20090320 13:04:58< CIA-70> loonycyborg * r33920 /trunk/SConstruct: Removed some cruft.
20090320 13:05:01< CIA-70> loonycyborg * r33921 /trunk/SConstruct: Set scons version requirement to 0.98.3
20090320 13:05:06< CIA-70> loonycyborg * r33922 /trunk/SConstruct: Fix scons warnings about deprecated Options class.
20090320 13:05:11< CIA-70> loonycyborg * r33923 /trunk/SConstruct: Use env.Requires instead of env.Depends to make wesnoth binary depend on translations.
20090320 13:05:19< CIA-70> loonycyborg * r33924 /trunk/ (doc/manual/SConscript src/SConscript): Remove now redundant EnsureSConsVersion() calls in SConscript files.
20090320 13:06:14< Shadow_Master> more ?
20090320 13:06:53< loonycyborg> More later :P
20090320 13:07:09< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: looking at your ebuild: have you ever actually tried to build without gettext available in the system?
20090320 13:07:24< Ivanovic> even with nls turned off in the build systems, it still requires gettext libs
20090320 13:08:20< Ivanovic> so yeah, libintl is a hard requirement and the only difference the nls flag makes is "are those translations built or not and can they really be selected ingame or not"
20090320 13:09:15< loonycyborg> I know about that. Probably it got inherited from gentoo's 1.4 ebuild.
20090320 13:09:43< loonycyborg> Besides, gettext support is builtin into glibc on most installations of Gentoo..
20090320 13:09:54< Ivanovic> i already warned the "official gentoo packager" about this, you might want to change this in packaging/Gentoo/*.ebuild, too
20090320 13:10:05< Ivanovic> yes, it is
20090320 13:10:12< Ivanovic> just it looks misleading
20090320 13:14:34< Shadow_Master> who is that guy? Want me to set a forum title for them?
20090320 13:28:15< Shadow_Master> can *anyone* reply to my message in the ML about renaming <userdata>/data/campaigns ?  >:)
20090320 13:29:24< Shadow_Master> https://mail.gna.org/public/wesnoth-dev/2009-03/msg00068.html
20090320 13:29:55< Rhonda> Please do it, for MK's sake!
20090320 13:30:15< Shadow_Master> MK?
20090320 13:31:00< Rhonda> Shadow_Master: http://bugs.debian.org/439950
20090320 13:31:03< Soliton> how will @campaigns work then?
20090320 13:31:22< Shadow_Master> it won't work because campaigns won't exist. That's where wmllint comes into play I guess.
20090320 13:31:41< Shadow_Master> (and some transitional backwards compatibility code)
20090320 13:32:12< Shadow_Master> Rhonda: ah, nice
20090320 13:34:54< Ivanovic> Shadow_Master: i don't think that the official gentoo package maintainer has an account in our forums
20090320 13:35:03< Ivanovic> in irc it is mr_bones_
20090320 13:37:28-!- windrunner [n=toth@14.103-64-87.adsl-dyn.isp.belgacom.be] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 13:39:57< loonycyborg> According to /whois mr_bones_ is on #gentoo-commits. Masochist :P
20090320 13:41:52-!- velory [n=gprocess@212.175.117.167] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 13:42:00< velory> hi
20090320 13:42:19< windrunner> Hello. Need some help, don't knox why this doesn't work : [if] [capture_village] side=2 x=2 y=3 [/capture_village] [then] sth_here [/then]..anyone knows why it doesn't work ?
20090320 13:44:46< velory> is this code for formula ai ?
20090320 13:45:14< windrunner> what's formula ai ?
20090320 13:45:18< velory> so im not familiar with that syntax but i see you are not describe condition in that
20090320 13:45:42< velory> http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/FormulaAI
20090320 13:46:25< windrunner> ah nope that's not it
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20090320 13:46:59< velory> u may need to define condition after [if] but dunno quiet
20090320 13:47:13< windrunner> what kind of condition? 
20090320 13:47:18< velory> hmm 
20090320 13:47:19< windrunner> if isn't enough? 
20090320 13:47:25< velory> if what?
20090320 13:47:34< windrunner> well it was if [capture_village]
20090320 13:47:51< velory> is that condition ?
20090320 13:48:00< windrunner> I'm not sure :)
20090320 13:48:01< velory> so whats return value of capture_village
20090320 13:48:05< velory> :D
20090320 13:48:18< velory> maybe it can be if [village_captured] but i dont know
20090320 13:48:24< velory> whats this code for _
20090320 13:48:35< velory> and where are u trying to compile that?
20090320 13:49:08< windrunner> just a simple campaign..if a unit takes a village, then it should do something
20090320 13:49:28< windrunner> that's why i thought it would be like that, but not that easy huh :P
20090320 13:49:30< loonycyborg> Ivanovic: libintl.h is provided by glibc while msgfmt and other tools are provided by sys-devel/gettext
20090320 13:49:47-!- Shadow_Master [n=ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
20090320 13:50:08< loonycyborg> So there should be unconditional dep on virtual/libintl and conditional on sys-devel/gettext
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20090320 13:52:10< Soliton> windrunner: then you need a village capture event.
20090320 13:52:37< windrunner> ah, i thought it was already in the macros? like it could understand village_capture?
20090320 13:53:46< windrunner> besides, I don't know what to put in event...and OWN_VILLAGE doesn't seem to work for me
20090320 13:54:33< Soliton> first step: you look at EventWML in the wiki and check whether there is a vilalge capturing event.
20090320 13:54:56< CIA-70> loonycyborg * r33925 /trunk/packaging/Gentoo/wesnoth-1.5.12.ebuild: 
20090320 13:54:56< CIA-70> Made Gentoo ebuild depend on virtual/libintl unconditionally.
20090320 13:54:56< CIA-70> Since sources include libintl.h and currently there's no way to disable
20090320 13:54:56< CIA-70> that.
20090320 13:55:45< windrunner> yes, there is, called capture
20090320 13:56:10< windrunner> so I can do event name=capture x=3 y=2?
20090320 13:56:37< Soliton> look at the wiki how you can filter the event.
20090320 13:56:52< Soliton> probably something like [filter_location]
20090320 13:57:14< windrunner> indeed, thanks!
20090320 13:57:39< windrunner> so, event name=capture filter_location] x=3 y = 2 [/filter_location]?
20090320 13:58:45< Soliton> sounds good.
20090320 13:59:11< windrunner> I can put then the command I wanted to do in the event?
20090320 13:59:28< Sapient> windrunner, you are not right
20090320 13:59:46< Sapient> unit [filter] goes in the [event]
20090320 13:59:59< Sapient> [filter_location] goes inside that unit [filter]
20090320 14:00:10< windrunner> I see
20090320 14:00:26< Sapient> and then all the commands go inside the [event]
20090320 14:00:33< windrunner> so [filter] [filter_location] ... [/filter_loc] [filter] If i understood?
20090320 14:01:28< Sapient> yeah
20090320 14:01:43< windrunner> thanks
20090320 14:01:53< windrunner> this stuff isn't as hard as it looks :-
20090320 14:01:55< windrunner> :)
20090320 14:02:51< windrunner> where do I put the side by the way? is there a filter_side?
20090320 14:03:14-!- Shadow_Master [n=ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 14:06:01< zookeeper> windrunner, use the reference
20090320 14:06:52< zookeeper> [event] takes a [filter] which takes a standard unit filter. when an event of that type occurs, the [event] will be triggered if the given filter matches the unit which did the action.
20090320 14:07:26< zookeeper> all that leads you to FilterWML and then to StandardUnitFilter
20090320 14:07:36< windrunner> I see
20090320 14:07:48< windrunner> so I must put side inside the filter
20090320 14:07:52< zookeeper> yes
20090320 14:07:57< windrunner> thanks
20090320 14:08:27< CIA-70> loonycyborg * r33926 /branches/1.6/packaging/Gentoo/wesnoth-1.5.12.ebuild: 
20090320 14:08:27< CIA-70> Made Gentoo ebuild depend on virtual/libintl unconditionally.
20090320 14:08:27< CIA-70> Since sources include libintl.h and currently there's no way to disable
20090320 14:08:27< CIA-70> that.
20090320 14:08:27< CIA-70> (cherry picked from commit 05e6346657f15930037ded51018136900ec0187f)
20090320 14:08:55 * Shadow_Master loves it when people use the git commit hash instead of the git-svn find-rev output
20090320 14:09:35< Shadow_Master> hah, cp -prf .git .git_backup_20090320  is proving that the major bottleneck here is at the HDD :-/
20090320 14:09:37< loonycyborg> That commit message was fully autogenerated. Is there a way to configure git to use find-rev output?
20090320 14:10:17< zookeeper> would it be at all useful to have a "this is how you learn WML" sticky, with the usual steps of 1. don't guess 2. use the reference 3. search for existing examples ?
20090320 14:10:21< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: RE "So there should be unconditional dep on virtual/libintl and conditional on sys-devel/gettext": correct
20090320 14:10:43< Soliton> zookeeper: at least for you to point people to? :-)
20090320 14:10:54< Shadow_Master> loonycyborg: no idea, but sure you can use the -n switch to edit your commit message manually :)
20090320 14:12:17< Shadow_Master> er,  -e
20090320 14:12:43< zookeeper> Soliton, true enough
20090320 14:14:18< loonycyborg> Shadow_Master: I'll do that in the future, but it's still annoying that git is not smart enough to figure out to use find-rev :(
20090320 14:14:28< Shadow_Master> why should it?
20090320 14:14:31< windrunner> So...What i want the event to do is to create a variable which gets icnremented....[variable] name=a a++, or how do you increment? geez, sorry about these questions
20090320 14:14:55< Shadow_Master> I mean, git svn isn't even part of git-core
20090320 14:15:44< loonycyborg> But it must have some hooks git-svn could use to make autogenerated messages more useful..
20090320 14:16:12< zookeeper> windrunner, you can do one operation in each [set_variable]
20090320 14:16:36< zookeeper> so use value=3 to set it to 3 or whatever, and if you want to increment use add=1
20090320 14:16:46< windrunner> I see, thanks
20090320 14:17:43< Sapient> windrunner, variables don't need to be declared in advance; you just set values to them
20090320 14:17:53< zookeeper> there's this new formula system which allows you to do fancier calculations, but frankly i haven't bothered to learn it yet...
20090320 14:18:07< zookeeper> i probably should do that and then simplify some complicated WML using that
20090320 14:18:13< Sapient> zookeeper, it's really easy
20090320 14:18:33< zookeeper> i know
20090320 14:19:00< windrunner> problem is, this event gets triggered many times...and if i set it to 0 at the event it gets restarted ,and I want ti to be saved..I guess I must do #define
20090320 14:19:13< Sapient> a="$( $b + $c )"
20090320 14:19:36< zookeeper> err, no, #defines won't help you
20090320 14:20:02< Sapient> windrunner: then why don't you initialize the variable in a "start" event?
20090320 14:20:31< Sapient> or don't initialize it at all; uninitialized variables are numerically equivalent to zero
20090320 14:20:33< windrunner> good idea, thanks again :-)
20090320 14:21:05< windrunner> so i can just do name=a_var add=1, and every time it goes to the event it gets saved
20090320 14:21:44< Shadow_Master> "Note: moving to "1.6" which isn't a local branch" um..
20090320 14:22:46< windrunner> later on, I must do something like this? IF_VAR a_var equals 5 [then] ....
20090320 14:23:52< Shadow_Master> Soliton: could that give me problems in the future?
20090320 14:24:31< Sapient> windrunner, variables don't need to be "saved"
20090320 14:24:41< Sapient> if you set them, they have been set
20090320 14:24:47< zookeeper> windrunner, later on you'll need to do something like an [if] [variable] name=a_var equals=5 [/variable] [then] ...
20090320 14:25:44< zookeeper> (IF_VAR is a shortcut for that)
20090320 14:25:51< windrunner> ah, I see
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20090320 14:27:51< boucman> hey all
20090320 14:27:57< Sapient> yo
20090320 14:28:26< Crab_> boucman: hello
20090320 14:28:39< boucman> so, what's up ?
20090320 14:30:11< Shadow_Master> scons -j 3 build=release prefsdir=.wesnoth-1.7
20090320 14:30:31< velory> boucman:hello
20090320 14:30:45< boucman> :)
20090320 14:30:54 * boucman goes updated his build env...
20090320 14:31:13< windrunner> thanks for yar help guys
20090320 14:31:16< windrunner> be seeing you
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20090320 14:33:08< zookeeper> btw, there's a simple test case for the issue of AI ignoring [avoid]s in EI now
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20090320 14:33:42< zookeeper> just :cl to the duel scenario, and watch mal-ravanal always run pointlessly into that one gap in the wall even though i've [avoid]ed it
20090320 14:33:55< zookeeper> (btw, why the heck does he want to do that anyway?)
20090320 14:34:20< zookeeper> my guess is that he's trying to get to a keep or something
20090320 14:34:33< zookeeper> and for some reason decides that the hole in the wall is the next best thing ;)
20090320 14:35:04< Shadow_Master> that campaign is full of coward characters.
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20090320 14:35:34< zookeeper> (i guess that might explain the [avoid] issue too, since the docs say that [avoid]s are ignored only by leaders trying to get to a keep)
20090320 14:35:53< zookeeper> Shadow_Master, yeah
20090320 14:36:32< Shadow_Master> (not saying that the enemy leaders in IftU don't do extremely awkward things at times)
20090320 14:36:39< zookeeper> turin liked to create wimpy protagonists :P
20090320 14:37:03< zookeeper> although i think gweddry is still wimpier than rugnur
20090320 14:38:28< Ivanovic> zookeeper: you could in a prestart event "seal" the ways out
20090320 14:38:44< Ivanovic> as in "the gates will only open once a winner is found"
20090320 14:38:47< Shadow_Master> a.k.a. impassable terrain overlay?
20090320 14:38:51< Ivanovic> Shadow_Master: correct
20090320 14:38:52< zookeeper> Ivanovic, err..
20090320 14:39:07< zookeeper> yeah, then he'd just run into some other corner
20090320 14:39:09< Ivanovic> something like i have done in two brothers scenario 3 with the gate thingie
20090320 14:39:22< zookeeper> i don't think you know what the scenario is like even
20090320 14:40:01-!- IronJan [n=jan@R38a8.r.pppool.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 14:41:40< Ivanovic> have you already changed number_of_possible_recruits_to_force_recruit to 0.0 ?
20090320 14:41:49< Ivanovic> since the keep gets removed in the first turn, correct?
20090320 14:41:52< sk-> In 1.6 I clicked the X to turn off sound effects and it crashed.
20090320 14:42:14< Ivanovic> sk-: i always do so in my tests and it never crashes
20090320 14:42:35< sk-> I turn it on and off all the time, was the first time it did it.
20090320 14:42:36< Ivanovic> would be nice to get some more info like the output of stderr.txt, just paste it eg at http://wesnoth.pastebin.com
20090320 14:42:44< sk-> ok
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20090320 14:45:27< Shadow_Master> why 'wesnoth --config-dir' succeeds ? :-|
20090320 14:45:47< Shadow_Master> it should say "hey, you didn't tell me what config dir you want" and return 1.
20090320 14:46:20< loonycyborg> Because wesnoth's option parsing really needs an overhaul :P
20090320 14:51:03-!- Shadow_Master [n=ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit ["class"]
20090320 14:55:48< boucman> yay, snow castle :) http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=346133#p346133
20090320 14:58:48< Ivanovic> neat
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20090320 15:31:19< Soliton> Shadow_Master: well, you have to create a local tracking branch for 1.6 if you want to commit to it.
20090320 15:34:27< loonycyborg> Soliton: I just did git svn fetch and git checkout 1.6
20090320 15:36:29< Soliton> ok.
20090320 15:36:50< Soliton> loonycyborg: do you have any modifications in git on the server?
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20090320 15:38:08< loonycyborg> Soliton: Nope.
20090320 15:38:14< Ivanovic> Soliton: do we already have a checkout of 1.6 on wesnoth.org?
20090320 15:38:30< Soliton> Ivanovic: yep.
20090320 15:38:34< Ivanovic> great
20090320 15:38:48< Ivanovic> then i can alter g.w.o soon to have 1.6 listed instead of 1.4 and 1.6 shown as default
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20090320 15:46:40< Guest11202> Yo?
20090320 15:46:56< Guest11202> Bye.
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20090320 15:47:20< Ivanovic> wow, expects and answer in 15 seconds
20090320 15:47:25< Ivanovic> close to a new record...
20090320 15:52:34< boucman> indeed
20090320 15:52:51< ilor> hmm, http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=23841&st=0&sk=t&sd=a&start=15 displays  Page 2 of 1 [ 15 posts ] at the bottom
20090320 15:53:12< Ivanovic> though i think the "real" record between "join -> 'hi' -> leave" is something like 5s...
20090320 15:53:25< ilor> I guess I should bug Shadow_Master about this?
20090320 15:54:55< Ivanovic> just ignore it...
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20090320 16:06:46< Turuk_> where did the rest of that topic go?
20090320 16:07:14< Turuk_> Never mind
20090320 16:15:00< Ivanovic> was cleanup time
20090320 16:15:08< Turuk_> Cleanup time?
20090320 16:15:11 * Turuk_ shudders
20090320 16:15:20< Ivanovic> jupp, there is no more freeze on trunk
20090320 16:15:32< Ivanovic> 1.6 is basically done, only the announcement missing, stuff like that
20090320 16:15:40< Ivanovic> stikonas: you read the log?
20090320 16:15:44< Ivanovic> left you a message there
20090320 16:16:15< stikonas> Ivanovic: yes, I read the logs at least when I asked something before
20090320 16:18:33< Ivanovic> stikonas: that is: the urls are updated as well as the po files
20090320 16:18:45< Ivanovic> i will also "check" before announcing on sunday that those are really correct
20090320 16:19:05< Ivanovic> and yeah, i will send a mail about the current status with 1.6 and trunk to the i18n ml this evening
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20090320 17:23:02< CIA-70> ivanovic * r33927 /branches/resources/gettext.wesnoth.org/public_html/wesnoth-gettext/westats/ (config.php index.php): bump version to 1.6 and switch to 1.6 as default shown
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20090320 17:31:41-!- Shadow_Master [n=ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 17:32:49< Shadow_Master> hi
20090320 17:33:36< Smar> btw, is that self_made page(westats)?
20090320 17:36:47< Shadow_Master> cd ../wesnoth
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20090320 17:39:20< Turuk_> Soliton, Ivanovic, I believe you have the deleting power for the server, if you could take care of this when you have a moment? http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=24548
20090320 17:39:29< Shadow_Master> I can.
20090320 17:39:42< CIA-70> shadowmaster * r33928 /branches/1.6/players_changelog: Test commit.
20090320 17:39:42< Shadow_Master> no. I cannot.
20090320 17:40:12< Shadow_Master> I read that URL as a forum attachment one, uh.
20090320 17:41:43< Shadow_Master> Soliton: while you are at it, perhaps you could do me a favor and change the version= of the "Invasion_from_the_Unknown" add-on (in the 1.4 server) from 1.9.4 to 1.9.99
20090320 17:42:07-!- Velory [n=GProcess@81.213.222.96] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 17:42:20< Velory> hi everyone
20090320 17:42:36< boucman> hey
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20090320 17:49:06< CIA-70> loonycyborg * r33929 /branches/1.6/packaging/Gentoo/ (wesnoth-1.5.12.ebuild wesnoth-1.6a.ebuild): Bumped the Gentoo ebuild, moved userdata dir from ~/wesnoth-1.5 to ~/wesnoth-1.6
20090320 17:50:55< Ivanovic> afk for a while, will remove the addons when back
20090320 17:51:03< Soliton> Ivanovic: i've switched the mp servers to 1.6 now. gone for the weekend...
20090320 17:51:11< Ivanovic> Soliton: okay
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20090320 17:53:14< Shadow_Master> :(
20090320 17:53:30< loonycyborg> Shadow_Master: ?
20090320 17:53:46< Shadow_Master> that Soliton is gone and I'll have to reupload IftU 1.9.99 with the correct version= number
20090320 17:55:37< zookeeper> cool, i managed to write some entirely new forest terrain graphics WML which is now like...less than 70 lines in its entirety, as opposed to the multi-hundred-line monster scattered across three unintuitively named files.
20090320 17:55:57< Shadow_Master> unless I manage to convince Ivanovic to do it for me? ;)
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20090320 17:57:48< esr> zookeeper: Are they installed yet?  And do you plan to backport to 1.6?
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20090320 17:59:04< boucman> esr: not sure it's a good idea, refactoring is something better left for trunk
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20090320 18:11:22 * boucman has free time to help students with any tasks from http://wesnoth.org/wiki/EasyCoding#Improvements_to_FormulaAI
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20090320 18:11:53< zookeeper> esr, no no, it's not complete yet, just ported a couple of forest types to use it so far. i'll probably not backport to 1.6 unless there's some particular reason to do it.
20090320 18:12:11< esr> Noted.
20090320 18:12:14< boucman> Crab_, Velory ^^^^ any taker ?
20090320 18:12:19< Crab_> boucman, yes
20090320 18:12:23< boucman> :)
20090320 18:12:42< Crab_> boucman, i'm studying the source of formula ai parser at the moment
20090320 18:13:15< boucman> Crab_: hmm, the parser is probably not the best place to start, because it probably don't need much changes except debugging
20090320 18:13:18< Crab_> boucman, i am thinking about improving debugging
20090320 18:13:41< Crab_> boucman, in particular, i want to add filenumber/linenumber to parsed function definitions
20090320 18:13:48< boucman> hmm
20090320 18:14:02< boucman> did you see proposal 4.5
20090320 18:14:20< Crab_> yes
20090320 18:14:24< boucman> I would start there if you want to do debugging, it's pretty easy and will get you quickly a result, 
20090320 18:14:43< Crab_> 'have all AI move print their name in the log ' -isn't it already done ?
20090320 18:14:53< boucman> not that I know of
20090320 18:15:06< boucman> however, floating type is not implemented :)
20090320 18:15:32< boucman> and it should be pretty trivial to add
20090320 18:15:54< Crab_> 'floating text next to a hex' ?
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20090320 18:16:13< boucman> Crab_: you see the way numbers float over a unit when it's hit ?
20090320 18:16:25< YogiHH> cooool :-D
20090320 18:16:45< boucman> I would like a formula function similar to debug_print, except it makes the label float over a given hex
20090320 18:16:48 * YogiHH just read the log and found Sirp talking about an IRC web interface
20090320 18:17:06< Crab_> yes,  i've seen debug print
20090320 18:17:07< Shadow_Master> uh... oh?
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20090320 18:17:27< boucman> Crab_: I'm pushing you to do that one, because it's a good entry point into the code (making you add a new formula function) 
20090320 18:17:34< Shadow_Master> YogiHH: when?
20090320 18:17:35-!- Noyga [n=lame-z@wesnoth/developer/noyga] has left #wesnoth-dev ["Quitte"]
20090320 18:17:39< boucman> and it will be really usefull for future debugging
20090320 18:17:47< Crab_> boucman: where is the code for ' numbers float over a unit when it's hit' ? in what .cpp file ? 
20090320 18:18:02< YogiHH> Shadow_Master: wait a minute...
20090320 18:18:14< Shadow_Master> i've got three
20090320 18:19:03< boucman> game_display.hpp line 123
20090320 18:19:09< boucman> (function float_label)
20090320 18:19:09< Crab_> thanks
20090320 18:19:13-!- YogiHH [i=c3f5f398@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-36dd9b91b841c170] has quit [Client Quit]
20090320 18:19:50< Crab_> boucman: and, by the way, numbering of hexes in game starts from 1,1. and numbering in code starts from 0,0. 
20090320 18:20:10-!- YogiHH [i=c3f5f398@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-38068cad0ea0f29b] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 18:20:15< boucman> Crab_: yeah, the usual "programers start from 0" thingy
20090320 18:20:25< Crab_> Crab: but why start from 1 in the game then ?
20090320 18:20:33< Crab_> s/Crab/boucman
20090320 18:20:42< YogiHH> Shaodw_Master: 6:53 today, http://www.mibbit.com
20090320 18:20:57< boucman> because most non-programmers can't understand numbering from 0
20090320 18:21:01< YogiHH> Shadow_Master: oops, see above
20090320 18:21:54< Shadow_Master> oh.
20090320 18:22:06-!- sk- [n=sk@pool-72-81-10-78.phlapa.east.verizon.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 18:22:15< Shadow_Master> I use it from the computer rooms at uni when my laptop is out of battery
20090320 18:22:16< boucman> Crab_: you don't need much hand-holding, apparently, but feel free to ask any question, that's why I'm around
20090320 18:22:39-!- Shadow_Master [n=ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit ["3"]
20090320 18:22:53< Velory> boucman and im taking too :D
20090320 18:22:55< Crab_> boucman: but when you debug, you see messages such as ai_interface::move_unit 21,21 -> 25,21   , and it's unconvenient if you want to look it up in game (where that is move from 22,22 -> 26,22)
20090320 18:23:22< zookeeper> err, why on earth are they numbered from 0 in the code then? surely programmers can understand both ways..
20090320 18:23:29< boucman> Crab_: fix it in the logging facility, then ;)
20090320 18:23:44< boucman> Velory: you might as well work on something else, to avoid conflicts...
20090320 18:24:22< boucman> how about 4.1 it's purely formula, but having experience with formulas will be usefull
20090320 18:24:36< Velory> 4.1 ?
20090320 18:24:37< Crab_> bocuman: i'll then add a define which will be added to log calls. eg  LOG_AI << "move(): " << src+LOG_HEX_OFFSET << ", " << dst+LOG_HEX_OFFSET << ")\n";
20090320 18:24:46< boucman> http://wesnoth.org/wiki/EasyCoding#Poisoning_Improvement
20090320 18:24:58< Crab_> bocuman: and #define LOG_HEX_OFFSET 1
20090320 18:25:04< boucman> hmm
20090320 18:25:14< boucman> just hard-code the +1
20090320 18:25:40< boucman> I know some people tend to #define every constant, but it only make sense if these constant might actually change
20090320 18:25:58< boucman> having pages and pages of #define at the start of code don't make it more readable
20090320 18:26:18< Crab_> bocuman: there is another reason - to make developer understand what is the purpose of that +1. its easier to forget +1 than to forget +LOG_HEX_OFFSET
20090320 18:26:18< Velory> boucman:so which cpp must i look for that ?
20090320 18:26:22< YogiHH> hehe, yes, there are const constants and changing constants :-)
20090320 18:26:27< boucman> Velory: non
20090320 18:26:28< boucman> none
20090320 18:26:47< boucman> Crab_: just give me the file/linenumber, I'll correct right away
20090320 18:26:53< boucman> no need to do a patch for that
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20090320 18:27:29< sk-> Is Velory the intern?
20090320 18:27:44< sk-> from google?
20090320 18:27:48< Velory> no
20090320 18:27:52< sk-> oh
20090320 18:28:00< boucman> Velory: start by (re)reading http://wesnoth.org/wiki/FormulaAI and specifically the part about candidate moves
20090320 18:28:02< Velory> im not intern from google
20090320 18:28:22< boucman> sk-: he is a candidate to become an intern, but so is Crab_, and no intern have been chosen yet
20090320 18:28:30< Velory> i read this page alredy
20090320 18:28:45< sk-> You guys can work on my latest feature request: https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?13227
20090320 18:29:02< boucman> sk-: checking...
20090320 18:29:38< boucman> sk-: nope, this is not GSoC material, sorry
20090320 18:29:44< sk-> darn
20090320 18:29:45< Crab_> boucman: there are many places, it is hard to do that '+1' change without a patch. see grep -n LOG formula_ai.cpp ai.cpp
20090320 18:29:55< boucman> too complicated, and need a political choice => for a real dev
20090320 18:30:02< sk-> Could you have them work on my tax return?
20090320 18:30:09< sk-> ;)
20090320 18:32:39< boucman> Crab_: well, if you feel like doing the patch that's fine, but I can do that while directing you too, if you'd rather focus on "real code"
20090320 18:33:49< Crab_> boucman: i'm working to add that float_label support to formulaAI at the moment ) that thing about the hex numbering is just one small thing I've noticed earlier
20090320 18:34:06< boucman> Crab_: i'll do that numbering stuff
20090320 18:34:09< Crab_> ok
20090320 18:34:36< boucman> you might want to have a look at formula_ai::handle_exception at some point, there seem to already have some facilities wrt line numbering
20090320 18:35:22< Crab_> boucman: yes, I've seen them. but they work at token level. and when the token is parsed successfully, they are not propagated further
20090320 18:36:47< boucman> oh, ok
20090320 18:36:52< Crab_> boucman: I've wanted to propagate them to the formula layer, because I think it would be really nicer to see the offending file:linenumber when, for example, some function in function_ai makes an infinite loop following some weird request of the ai.
20090320 18:36:52< boucman> Velory: tell me when you're done
20090320 18:36:57 * zookeeper notes that the MP menu descriptions/tooltips have a delay for some obscure reason
20090320 18:38:12-!- elias__ [n=elias@80-121-77-118.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 18:39:03< Velory> ok i'll
20090320 18:39:10-!- elias [n=elias@allegro/developer/allefant] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
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20090320 18:39:59< zookeeper> mordante ^ those tooltips should of course have no delay since the ones in the main menu don't have either.
20090320 18:40:16-!- Baufo [n=thomas@wesnoth/developer/baufo] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 18:42:04< zookeeper> err, the set password thing in MP isn't working AFAICT.
20090320 18:42:37< Velory> im copying Copy formulaai.vim to .vim/syntax now
20090320 18:43:45< zookeeper> sk-, your era problem is a non-issue. eras can have that require_era=yes which prevents people without it from joining in the first place.
20090320 18:44:22< sk-> ah, cool, didn't know that was an option...
20090320 18:44:26< zookeeper> if the authors don't use that, their fault. i'm thinking of adding an extra sanity rule to the add-on server rules saying that you must use that key when appropriate.
20090320 18:44:41< zookeeper> yeah, apparently it's defaulting the wrong way
20090320 18:44:43< sk-> that was "solution B"
20090320 18:44:48< boucman> sk-: I'm marking your FR as "won't do" including zookeeper's comment if that's fine with you
20090320 18:44:55< sk-> sure
20090320 18:45:39< sk-> extra sanity rule is a good idea
20090320 18:45:58< sk-> so, if you do not need the era then the game will not be greyed out?
20090320 18:46:13< sk-> by that I mean, it will be apparent that it is possible to join.
20090320 18:46:21< Velory> boucman:ok i finished
20090320 18:46:44< zookeeper> sk-, if you use require_era=yes then it'll be grayed out if you don't have the era.
20090320 18:47:14< sk-> and if require_era=no then it won't be greyed... got it.
20090320 18:47:28< zookeeper> well, actually i'm not sure if i tested it right. maybe it's not defaulting to no after all.
20090320 18:47:51< zookeeper> i'm off now
20090320 18:48:23< Turuk> zookeeper's add-on rule bit reminds me that i have people I need to PM
20090320 18:48:25< Turuk> Bugger
20090320 18:49:25< boucman> Velory: ok here is a description of what we want to do
20090320 18:50:15< boucman> if a unit has a poison attack and there is an unpoisoned ennemy unit that it can reach, then it should attack it with the poisonous attack
20090320 18:50:24-!- Sirp [n=me@wesnoth/developer/dave] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 18:51:03< boucman> so, in candidate move turn, you should add a new candidate move that evaluates to a positive value when it find such a unit
20090320 18:51:23< boucman> you will find the other candidate moves (to use as examples in data/ai/formula
20090320 18:51:43< Velory> oh im looking for that thank you
20090320 18:52:06< boucman> I'll let you look into it for a while and try to figure it out. once you're done (or if you have trouble understanding something) drop a line, I'll be around
20090320 18:53:24-!- busfahrer is now known as buzZzZzfahrer
20090320 18:56:26< Velory> ok
20090320 18:57:39< CIA-70> boucman * r33930 /trunk/src/formula_ai.cpp: fix off-by-one mistake in formula_ai logs for some (but not all) logging, sugestion by Crab_
20090320 19:03:17< Crab_> boucman: a question - since the ai prevents game interface redrawing when AI 'thinks', it is needed to yield control to the UI after we told it to add a floating box. In ai.cpp I see raise_user_interact() - is it used for this purpose ?
20090320 19:03:47< boucman> Crab_: hmm
20090320 19:03:59-!- crimson_penguin [n=ben@S0106001cf0705af9.cc.shawcable.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 19:04:01< boucman> never heard of raise_user_interact, I'll have a look
20090320 19:04:29< boucman> normally, there is no need to call anything, the text will start floating as soon as the display starts updating again
20090320 19:06:18< Crab_> boucman: yes. but, i think that it will not be good for debugging. for example, if you want the ai to 'float something and then do something', wont 'float something' be delayed to that 'as soon as the display starts updating again' future time ?
20090320 19:07:01< boucman> indeed, but that will be whenever the unit action is performed (since when the AI moves a unit, the display is updated)
20090320 19:07:18< Crab_> but if that debugging is not connected to movement?
20090320 19:07:24< boucman> Crab_: just don't bother about it for now, see if it's a problem, and we'll look into it if it is
20090320 19:07:29< Crab_> boucman: ok
20090320 19:08:29-!- esr [n=chatzill@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
20090320 19:08:34< boucman> well, AI thinking being "fast" compared to unit animation, I don't think trying to fit the floating labels "between AI actions" is a good idea, unless you volunteerly block the ai from thinking while the label floats
20090320 19:08:36< Sirp> Crab_: yes that is what raise_user_interact() is for.
20090320 19:08:50< boucman> (which is doable, not sure if it's a good idea)
20090320 19:08:50< Crab_> Sirp, thanks
20090320 19:08:55< boucman> Sirp: oh, ok
20090320 19:09:01< Sirp> it processes any incoming GUI events. It should be called reasonably frequently but not too frequently
20090320 19:09:03< boucman> that's cool, I didn't know we had that
20090320 19:09:15< Sirp> (like 20 or 50 times a second, not 10,000 times a second)
20090320 19:09:32< Sapient> boucman: if an enemy is moving across a path that is totally under shroud, does its animation play?
20090320 19:09:35< Sirp> boucman: yeah it's how we keep the display responsive when the AI is thinking.
20090320 19:09:44< Sirp> at one time the game used to freeze up while the AI was thinking.
20090320 19:09:49< boucman> Sapient: nope, the anim code returns immediately
20090320 19:15:19-!- newt is now known as newt|SF4
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20090320 19:20:36< mordante> hi
20090320 19:22:11< Velory> hi
20090320 19:22:28< mordante> hi Velory 
20090320 19:24:32< mordante> Crab_, please no #defines rather a const in an anonymous namespace
20090320 19:24:51< Crab_> mordante, ok.
20090320 19:26:00< Velory> boucman:where can i find .fai syntax and functions is it python language?
20090320 19:26:56< Velory> this is not python but similar to python
20090320 19:27:01< boucman> no, this is the FormulaAI language that is described in the http://wesnoth.org/wiki/FormulaAI  I pointed you to earlier
20090320 19:27:15< Velory> ye im looking there
20090320 19:27:29< mordante> zookeeper, I added the tooltip to my todo list
20090320 19:27:31< boucman> it's a bit tricky to understand, which is why I want you to work on that feature, to learn the language
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20090320 19:29:07< Velory> boucman:but there is no description there like "fai 'level_up_attack_move.fat'" so i need to write 2 codes like that u said isnt it ?
20090320 19:29:56< Velory> i need to write maybe poisoningmove.fai first isnt it ?
20090320 19:29:56< Velory> then i register_candidate_move in scenario test
20090320 19:31:29< boucman> yes
20090320 19:32:33< Velory> so there is nothing like that for example
20090320 19:32:33< Velory> if(size(villages) != 0, 
20090320 19:32:33< Velory> 	move(me.loc, nearest_loc(nearest_loc(me.loc,villages),unit_moves(me.loc))),
20090320 19:32:33< Velory> 	move(me.loc, nearest_loc(nearest_loc(me.loc,shroud),unit_moves(me.loc))))
20090320 19:32:33< Velory>  or did i missed something ? :S
20090320 19:33:54-!- buzZzZzfahrer is now known as busfahrer
20090320 19:34:05< boucman> again, I'm not sure what you mean
20090320 19:34:24< CIA-70> mordante * r33931 /trunk/src/multiplayer_lobby.cpp: Fix a compiler warning.
20090320 19:35:06< CIA-70> mordante * r33932 /trunk/src/unit_map.hpp: Fix a compiler warning.
20090320 19:35:48< Velory> ok i need to write a code in /data/ai/formula which is for evaluation and attack right?
20090320 19:35:57< boucman> right
20090320 19:35:59< Velory> so
20090320 19:36:59< Velory> for example scouting_eval.fai in ~/formula 
20090320 19:37:13< Velory> starting with this lines
20090320 19:37:14< Velory> fai 'scouting_eval.fai'
20090320 19:37:14< Velory> if(me.loc = my_leader.loc,
20090320 19:37:14< Velory> 	-5,
20090320 19:37:14< Velory> if( size(shroud) = 0, 
20090320 19:37:14< Velory> 	-5,
20090320 19:38:36< boucman> yes, that means "if(<the current unit is the leader>, return -5, else if <nothing to explore>, return -5
20090320 19:38:40< boucman> you got the idea ?
20090320 19:39:36< Velory> yes
20090320 19:40:39< Velory> but i dunno how can i write  if a unit has a poison attack in there cos i dunno the syntax
20090320 19:41:05< boucman> well, learn it
20090320 19:41:10< boucman> :)
20090320 19:41:21< Velory> and i couldnt find the link u pointed me before
20090320 19:41:38< boucman> http://wesnoth.org/wiki/FormulaAI  this one ?
20090320 19:41:43< Velory> yea
20090320 19:41:48< boucman> :)
20090320 19:41:49< Velory> did i miss something
20090320 19:41:51< Velory> _
20090320 19:42:01< boucman> well, the functions are detailed there,
20090320 19:42:06< boucman> but not the variables, 
20090320 19:42:31< Velory> this page only including the blocks which is like in scenario-test.cfg
20090320 19:42:33< boucman> to see available variables, start wesnoth with "-d -t" parameters
20090320 19:43:04< Velory> ./wesnoth -d -t or ./wesnoth -d formula -t ?_
20090320 19:43:18< boucman>  -d -t should be enough
20090320 19:43:21< Velory> ok
20090320 19:43:31< boucman> the whole section 5 of the page should give you the basics
20090320 19:43:45< boucman> functions are detailed at http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/FormulaAI_Functions
20090320 19:44:00< Velory> AI Formula Language ?
20090320 19:44:04< boucman> yes
20090320 19:44:08< Velory> ok 
20090320 19:44:38< Velory> btw i have a problem with my desktop computer
20090320 19:44:41< Velory> so
20090320 19:44:46< boucman> ok, once you started wesnoth, press the "f" key to open the FormulaAI command line
20090320 19:44:50-!- Turuk_ [n=Turuk@FUSE-WS1-208-102-202-188.fuse.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 19:45:05< boucman> type "debug_print(my_leader)" 
20090320 19:45:06< Velory> yesterday in 19.00 pm i downloaded trunk files to my laptop with svn
20090320 19:45:20< Velory> and i compiled it
20090320 19:45:23< Velory> now working well
20090320 19:45:30< boucman> this should detail the content of the "my_leader" variable which give you an idea how a unit is described
20090320 19:45:50< Velory> but at 22.pm i downloaded from svn to my desktop but i cant compile im taking this error
20090320 19:46:11< Velory> configure.ac:48: required file `config/config.guess' not found
20090320 19:46:12< Velory> configure.ac:48: required file `config/config.sub' not found
20090320 19:46:33< loonycyborg> Velory: Do they actually exist?
20090320 19:46:36< Velory> ok i will do what u say
20090320 19:46:39< Velory> no they are not
20090320 19:46:41< loonycyborg> They're definitely in trunk.
20090320 19:46:47< Velory> but i cant download from trunk
20090320 19:46:49< Velory> dunno why
20090320 19:46:59< boucman> Velory: try using scons or cmake instead of automake/autoconf if possible
20090320 19:47:08< Velory> ok
20090320 19:47:20< boucman> zookeeper: around ?
20090320 19:48:03< loonycyborg> Velory: You can't download trunk? Then what are you trying to compile?
20090320 19:48:10-!- silene [n=plouf@wesnoth/developer/silene] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 19:48:21< silene> hi
20090320 19:49:13< boucman> hey silene
20090320 19:50:05< Velory> i downloaded from trunk
20090320 19:50:19< Velory> cmake seems working well
20090320 19:50:52< Baufo> umm, it seems Soliton (who is gone for the weekend) has forgotten to add a file to the 1.6 server config
20090320 19:50:58< Baufo> now for example the server mods can't do their job because the server is running without a password
20090320 19:51:09< mordante> hi silene 
20090320 19:51:18< Baufo> anyone here who can fix that?
20090320 19:52:17-!- Turuk [n=Turuk@wesnoth/forumsith/turuk] has quit [Connection timed out]
20090320 19:53:25< loonycyborg> Velory: I still have no idea why these files are missing for you. :/ Perhaps there are more files missing..
20090320 19:54:20< Velory> hmm no i installed with cmake
20090320 19:54:25< Velory> dunno how can i but it worked
20090320 19:54:45< loonycyborg> Did you also try with scons?
20090320 19:54:52< Velory> no
20090320 19:54:58< Velory> i tried with autoconf/automake
20090320 19:55:10< Velory> but i took error with that tools
20090320 19:55:19< Velory> cmake worked
20090320 19:55:33< silene> Velory: did you run autogen?
20090320 19:55:57< Velory> yes autogen gave me same errors before
20090320 19:56:09< Velory> `config/config.sub' not found
20090320 19:57:41< loonycyborg> config/config.sub files are versioned in svn so they should exist when svn is checked out.
20090320 19:58:40< silene> loonycyborg: are they? i thought Ivanovic has removed them three years ago
20090320 19:59:30< loonycyborg> Oh. I was just confused by git log :/
20090320 20:00:10-!- thespaceinvader [n=chatzill@wesnoth/artist/thespaceinvader] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 20:00:43< thespaceinvader> wotcher chaps
20090320 20:00:50< loonycyborg> It's apparently somewhat better at time travel than svn log :P
20090320 20:01:13-!- stikonas [n=stikonas@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 20:03:23< silene> loonycyborg: git log --stat is your friend ;-)
20090320 20:04:38< Velory> ok i started with -d -t now im looking variables etc.
20090320 20:06:42< boucman> zookeeper: tell me when you're back
20090320 20:07:34< zookeeper> boucman, oops, didn't notice your previous...but i'm going afk for a moment now ;)
20090320 20:07:41< zookeeper> i'll ping you then
20090320 20:07:50< boucman> k
20090320 20:09:29< CIA-70> mordante * r33933 /trunk/INSTALL: Add scons minimum version.
20090320 20:10:44< boucman> did we clean up the wiki yet ?
20090320 20:10:55-!- grzywacz [n=grzywacz@wesnoth/developer/grzywacz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 20:14:52 * zookeeper has an early return
20090320 20:14:55 * zookeeper pings boucman
20090320 20:15:20< boucman> zookeeper: https://gna.org/patch/?1134
20090320 20:16:41< CIA-70> boucman * r33934 /trunk/src/ (5 files): apply patch 1134, code half. WML half will come later, and once both are ready and heavily tested, we can backport to 1.6
20090320 20:16:49-!- Shadow_Master [n=ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 20:17:42< Shadow_Master> re
20090320 20:17:42< zookeeper> boucman, well, yeah, the game got very laggy when i had some ghosts around
20090320 20:17:59< crimson_pingvin> Ivanovic: looks like this might upload OK afterall
20090320 20:18:07< crimson_pingvin> 78% now
20090320 20:18:30< elias> mordante: was the wiki upload script useful?
20090320 20:18:58< Ivanovic> re
20090320 20:19:00< Ivanovic> crimson_pingvin: great
20090320 20:19:39< CIA-70> boucman * r33935 /trunk/src/unit_animation.cpp: slightly fix the in_hex logic with default animations
20090320 20:19:54< mordante> elias, yes thanks again 
20090320 20:20:23< boucman> zookeeper: could you look at the WML half of the patch ?
20090320 20:20:30< mordante> I only got bitten by the cookie, tested with a valid passwd and then used the wrong one to test my script ...
20090320 20:20:38< mordante> and I made a small mess of the wiki ;-)
20090320 20:21:27< zookeeper> boucman, i have no idea what kind of file that is.
20090320 20:21:45< boucman> zookeeper: ok, let me explain
20090320 20:22:36< Ivanovic> crimson_pingvin: have you named the file Wesnoth_1.6a.dmg ?
20090320 20:22:40< zookeeper> oh right, there's a in_hex_data.patch too
20090320 20:22:48< boucman> we have a new boolean parameter in_hex that can be used in [frame] in [animation] and in [unit]
20090320 20:23:19< boucman> this will tell the anim engine that the image fits in the hex (not just the 72x72 square, the actual hex)
20090320 20:23:24< zookeeper> sure
20090320 20:23:30< boucman> which means we can heavily optimize redraw
20090320 20:23:32< zookeeper> and you want me to apply that where appropriate?
20090320 20:23:36< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: please have a look at #wesnoth
20090320 20:23:41< Ivanovic> someone has a scons problem there
20090320 20:23:45< boucman> it would be cool to review all standing animations and upgrade it
20090320 20:24:12< boucman> (putting it directly in the [unit] has similar effect for the animations built with image= in the [unit]
20090320 20:24:32< zookeeper> sure, i can do that. i won't touch the standing anims which aren't actually animated, though.
20090320 20:24:39< zookeeper> (like the flying drakes etc)
20090320 20:25:03< boucman> yes, you should still do these (actually these are the most important) 
20090320 20:25:11< zookeeper> oh?
20090320 20:25:19< zookeeper> that sounds backwards :P
20090320 20:25:50< boucman> suppose that we have 3 units touching each other a b and c
20090320 20:25:51-!- shikadibot [n=1001@wesnoth/bot/shikadibot] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 20:26:00< boucman> they are on the same line
20090320 20:26:44< boucman> if a moves, since the 72x72 square overlaps b's hex, b will need a redraw too, but b's 72x72 square overrides c's hex
20090320 20:26:53-!- Elvish_Pillager [n=eli@66-189-40-122.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
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20090320 20:27:03< boucman> thus a useless cascading effect if a,b and c actually fit in the hex
20090320 20:27:13< boucman> but the engine can't guess if a unit fits in a hex
20090320 20:27:39< zookeeper> ok, but how does them having static 1-frame standing anims make things worse than if they have proper standing anims like the ghost?
20090320 20:28:12< boucman> most standing anims don't fit in a hex anyway (they override slightly) so you won't give them the param
20090320 20:28:24< boucman> this patch is especially usefull if all units use it
20090320 20:29:46< zookeeper> i don't see how that answers the question
20090320 20:30:21< Crab_> boucman, i've got a question regarding those floating popups
20090320 20:30:22-!- Turuk_ [n=Turuk@FUSE-WS1-208-102-202-188.fuse.net] has quit [Connection reset by peer]
20090320 20:30:28< boucman> zookeeper: ok, maybe my first reply wasn't very clear
20090320 20:30:36-!- Turuk [n=Turuk@wesnoth/forumsith/turuk] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 20:30:43< boucman> Crab_: sure, I can manage two conversations at the same tim :P
20090320 20:31:03 * happygrue hands boucman a stick of gum...
20090320 20:31:16< boucman> zookeeper: non-animated are as important as animated (since the cascading effect is the same)
20090320 20:31:58< boucman> however, since there are much more non-animated, and the effectiveness is proportional to the number of use, you should not skip non-animated standing units
20090320 20:32:00< zookeeper> ok, that makes sense. but non-animated won't cause (notable) cascading effects, right?
20090320 20:32:24< zookeeper> i mean, not as often
20090320 20:33:01< boucman> well, they won't cause any cascading (since they don't cause redraw by themselves) however if they are in a dense pack of unit and any unit in the pack moves (attack, idle anim, unit selection) the whole pack will redraw
20090320 20:33:11< zookeeper> the blood and dread bats need some pixels shifted around to make them fit
20090320 20:33:12< boucman> and the cascading effect will still be very bad
20090320 20:33:20< zookeeper> sure
20090320 20:33:38< boucman> zookeeper: just marking as much as possible in a first pass should help a lot
20090320 20:33:52< Crab_> boucman. it seems to me that the floating popups (as of now), are part of unit animation. (see unit_display.cpp :296 - there the information about damage and other combat effects is added, and see  unit_frame.cpp:373 - here is the actual float_label call). so, the question is: if we want to make debug popup in any hex, including those hexes which are not occupied by any unit, how it can be done ?
20090320 20:33:56-!- noy [n=Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit []
20090320 20:34:47< Crab_> boucman: one of the solutions that comes to mind is to add a hidden (invinsible) unit if the hex is empty, add animation, and delete that unit afterwards
20090320 20:35:18< Crab_> s/invinsible/invisible
20090320 20:35:31< boucman> Crab_: unit animations is indeed a heavy user of float label, but floating labels are not linked to units, and can be fired without a label
20090320 20:36:01< boucman> calling ame_display::get_singleton()->float_label(<any hex> will work
20090320 20:36:07< boucman> even if there are no unit
20090320 20:36:26< boucman> even if there is already a floating label (it will look ugly, but it will work)
20090320 20:36:43< boucman> and it's a fire and forget implementation, just call the function and it will float
20090320 20:36:55< Crab_> won't it be removed on the next redraw ?
20090320 20:37:00< boucman> nope, 
20090320 20:37:10< Shadow_Master> Sapient: around=
20090320 20:37:18< Sapient> yo
20090320 20:37:26< Sapient> slightly afk
20090320 20:37:40< boucman> the "halo" drawing engine keeps track of all those floating around thingies, and take care of everything
20090320 20:37:50< boucman> that's what I meant by fire-and-forget
20090320 20:38:06< boucman> it will even destroy the floating label after a few second, just like damage labels
20090320 20:38:21< boucman> (that's why I thought it would be pretty handy for debug
20090320 20:38:32< Shadow_Master> Sapient: could I make [switch] to allow numerical_(not_)?equals= and (not_)?equals= instead of value= in 1.5.x?
20090320 20:38:41< Crab_> ok. for i've tried  game_display::get_singleton()->float_label() already, and maybe i've missed something ). i'll try again, a bit differently.
20090320 20:38:59< Shadow_Master> Sapient: that is, would you object to such a syntax change?
20090320 20:39:11-!- Munk [n=munkhsoy@CPE0015e91a861d-CM0019474d8044.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 20:39:28< Shadow_Master> everyone: from now on, when I talk about 1.5.x here, I mean 1.7.x. :P
20090320 20:39:31< boucman> http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=346232#p346232 this confirms my theory : good art atracts good artists :P
20090320 20:39:45< boucman> Crab_: it didn't work ?
20090320 20:40:07< zookeeper> boucman, gah, for the drakes i need to duplicate the existing macro -.-
20090320 20:40:18< zookeeper> hmm, or do i
20090320 20:40:19< Shadow_Master> boucman: uh.
20090320 20:40:19< Crab_> no. but i'll try it again with some additional debugging.
20090320 20:40:20< Sapient> Shadow_Master: eh... let's not make switch into a monster
20090320 20:40:33< zookeeper> the base frames are in the hex already, so...ah, i'm so clever
20090320 20:40:41< Shadow_Master> boucman: perhaps I should restrict forum user names to at least one lower case letter.
20090320 20:40:41< Sapient> Shadow_Master: what's really needed is [else_if], right?
20090320 20:40:43< boucman> Crab_: you can always pastebin for me
20090320 20:40:52< Crab_> boucman,o k
20090320 20:40:58< boucman> Shadow_Master: is all upper really a problem ?
20090320 20:41:06-!- Kira0Alexis [i=4bb1a55f@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-be6d6409aaf26d55] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 20:41:15< Shadow_Master> boucman: it hurts my eyes ;(
20090320 20:41:28< Sapient> so you could chain together a bunch of else_if's in side a single [if]
20090320 20:41:34-!- elias [n=elias@allegro/developer/allefant] has quit ["Leaving"]
20090320 20:41:46< Shadow_Master> s/else_if/elsif/
20090320 20:42:13 * Shadow_Master adds [unless] to his internal list of things that 1.8 would have in an ideal world ;)
20090320 20:42:33< Shadow_Master> also [break][/break]
20090320 20:42:42-!- fabi [n=fabi@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 20:42:55< Shadow_Master> or [continue][/continue]
20090320 20:43:40< Shadow_Master> Sapient: I was asking about this [switch] thing because it seems it won't work if I test the case $a == 0 if $a == "0.0"
20090320 20:43:54-!- Kira0Alexis [i=4bb1a55f@gateway/web/ajax/mibbit.com/x-be6d6409aaf26d55] has quit [Client Quit]
20090320 20:44:00< Shadow_Master> unless [set_variable] name=a value=0.0 [/set_variable] automatically converts it into a "0"
20090320 20:45:25< Sapient> I don't switch to evolve
20090320 20:46:18< Sapient> numerical_value, boolean_value, etc
20090320 20:46:37< Sapient> but go ahead if you want to
20090320 20:46:45< Shadow_Master> for some reason, I can't make a meaning out of the first sentence
20090320 20:48:40< CIA-70> silene * r33936 /trunk/src/ (config.cpp config.hpp): Improved config::all_children_iterator by getting rid of std::auto_ptr.
20090320 20:49:49< CIA-70> zookeeper * r33937 /trunk/data/core/units/ (7 files in 3 dirs): Added in_hex=yes to standing anims which remain in the hex.
20090320 20:50:05< Velory> boucman: how can i page down hen i type my_units for example
20090320 20:50:20< Velory> s/hen/when
20090320 20:50:24< boucman> what do you mean ?
20090320 20:50:34< zookeeper> boucman, there you go
20090320 20:51:05< zookeeper> i'll be afk for 45 mins or so now ->
20090320 20:51:06< Shadow_Master> boucman: what's going on?
20090320 20:51:06< Velory> how can i page down when i type my_units to command console in game 
20090320 20:51:12< boucman> zookeeper: only 7 units fit in a hex ?
20090320 20:51:15< zookeeper> yeah
20090320 20:51:28< boucman> what do you mean by "paging down" ?
20090320 20:51:41< Velory> i cant see whole message
20090320 20:51:42< boucman> zookeeper: i'm suprised, all units with no animations should fit...
20090320 20:51:53< Shadow_Master> boucman: that is, I haven't followed the logs, I'm busy, etc.
20090320 20:51:56< boucman> (well most, I think one of the loyalist mounted unit doesn't
20090320 20:52:03< Velory> some overflow
20090320 20:52:10< boucman> Shadow_Master: with regard to ?
20090320 20:52:28-!- newt|SF4 is now known as newt
20090320 20:52:40< Shadow_Master> boucman: what's this in_hex stufF?
20090320 20:52:53< Ivanovic> ARGH, GRML
20090320 20:53:12< Velory> boucman:did u understand what i mean ?
20090320 20:53:17 * Ivanovic swears a little about the wesnoth_addon_manager not wanting to delete addons from the 1.4.x server
20090320 20:53:20< Velory> s/id did
20090320 20:53:27< Shadow_Master> oh no Ivanovic is angry! run like hell, all! ;)
20090320 20:53:47-!- alink [n=alink@wesnoth/developer/alink] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 20:53:49< boucman> Velory: yes, I don't think there is an easy way, I usually manage to have less content using the different formula functions
20090320 20:53:54< alink> hi
20090320 20:54:11< Velory> for example filter?
20090320 20:54:14< boucman> Shadow_Master: see patch 1134
20090320 20:54:17< mordante> hi alink 
20090320 20:54:21< Velory> hi alink
20090320 20:54:25< boucman> hey alink, we were discussing your patch
20090320 20:54:44< boucman> Velory: yes, and head() whe you have big lists
20090320 20:54:50< Shadow_Master> boucman: couldn't there be a less intrusive way of doing it?
20090320 20:55:02< alink> boucman: yes, i saw that, glad that you agreed with the patch
20090320 20:55:11< boucman> Shadow_Master: it's not very intrusive codewise, and I can't think of any way
20090320 20:55:18< Shadow_Master> e.g. before displaying the game map, determine which units have standing animations that reach out of hex somehow
20090320 20:55:34< Shadow_Master> perhaps by examining the PNG files when they are being inserted into the image cache
20090320 20:55:43< Velory> but i dunno Cuttle Fish's id for example is there any way to learn?
20090320 20:55:48< alink> Shadow_Master: yes that's exactly my plan for 1.7 :)
20090320 20:56:10< Shadow_Master> alink but the patch applied by boucman is for trunk too
20090320 20:56:11< boucman> Shadow_Master: you mean looking pixel by pixel to see if there are only 100% transparent pixels in the out of hex area ?
20090320 20:56:17< Shadow_Master> boucman: yes
20090320 20:56:19< boucman> I'm not sure it would be more efficiant
20090320 20:56:37< boucman> Shadow_Master: trunk is 1.7 now
20090320 20:56:43< boucman> I only applied to trunk
20090320 20:56:47< Shadow_Master> boucman: I know.
20090320 20:56:51< alink> yes to be efficient it need to be done carefully, with some caching etc 
20090320 20:56:58< Shadow_Master> too == boucman applied it in the same place where you plan to implement it
20090320 20:57:17< Munk> Hello all. I'm new here, but perhaps I should wait until the conversation ends to introduce myself?
20090320 20:57:24< boucman> Shadow_Master: ok, I don't understand what you mean
20090320 20:57:26< alink> Shadow_Master: well it can stay in trunk for the moment, and remove it later when a better way will be avaible
20090320 20:57:34< boucman> Munk: that's ok, we can multitask :)
20090320 20:57:44< Munk> Oh, I'm glad.
20090320 20:57:47-!- fendrin [n=fabi@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
20090320 20:57:52< Munk> You're programmers, after all.
20090320 20:57:54< Munk> :)
20090320 20:57:58< mordante> hi Munk 
20090320 20:57:59< alink> Shadow_Master: the work must be done for 1.6 anyway, and that keep them in sync for the moment
20090320 20:57:59< boucman> alink: i'm not convinced there is really a better way, I had given it some thoughts before...
20090320 20:58:22< Shadow_Master> boucman, alink . No, I'm the one that's extremely confused now.
20090320 20:58:33< Munk> I'm here because of the Google Summer of Code project.
20090320 20:58:33< Shadow_Master> Let's put this conversation aside and let me ask boucman : what do I have to know about this patch, as a WML author?
20090320 20:58:42< boucman> I think we all are :P inherent risk of IRC
20090320 20:58:50< boucman> Munk: welcome
20090320 20:58:50< mordante> Munk, we're programmers and pretend to be able to multitask, so feel free to introduce yourself
20090320 20:58:59< alink> Shadow_Master: nothing to do for UMC
20090320 20:59:11< Shadow_Master> alink: no, not yours.
20090320 20:59:13< Munk> Ok...
20090320 20:59:15< boucman> Shadow_Master: nothing if you don't have units defined, and if you do, it will work by default
20090320 20:59:30< boucman> I will document it in the wiki once the wiki has been cleaned up post 1.6
20090320 20:59:37< Shadow_Master> boucman: what do you mean? It assumes all units have standing animations that don't reach out of the hex, by default?
20090320 20:59:53< boucman> it assumes they do reach out of hex by default
20090320 20:59:58< boucman> which is the old behaviour
20090320 21:00:04< CIA-70> mordante * r33938 /trunk/ (CMakeLists.txt INSTALL): Bump the minimum cmake version to 2.6.0.
20090320 21:00:05< boucman> (old as in 1.6)
20090320 21:00:06< Munk> I'm a software engineering student in Toronto, Canada
20090320 21:00:23< Shadow_Master> boucman: ahhh, okay.
20090320 21:00:25< alink> Shadow_Master: that's an optional optimization
20090320 21:00:38< alink> (assuming that we are talking about my patch)
20090320 21:00:51< boucman> Munk: while introducing yourself, you might want to have a look at http://wesnoth.org/wiki/SummerOfCodeIdeas that's the "new student howto"
20090320 21:00:58< Shadow_Master> alink: ohhh. I didn't notice it was yours! :D
20090320 21:01:01< Munk> I'm in the first year of my program but I've been programming on and off for 10 years
20090320 21:01:09< alink> Shadow_Master: ah ok
20090320 21:01:14< Munk> Yes, I've been there.
20090320 21:01:47< boucman> Shadow_Master: basicaly if an image used for animation fits in a hex (not just a 72x72 square) you can tell the engine, which will then avoid redrawing the neighbouring hexes
20090320 21:01:47< alink> btw, this is why it's possible to introduce in 1.6, it doesn't break compatibility and doesn't change anything if you don't update your WML
20090320 21:01:58< boucman> but if you don't specify, it will only cause useless hex invalidation
20090320 21:02:00< mordante> Munk,  what languages have you been programming in?
20090320 21:02:28< Shadow_Master> boucman: roger
20090320 21:03:07< alink> Shadow_Master: and updating mainline WML will already optimize most add-ons
20090320 21:03:14< CIA-70> ivanovic * r33939 /website/start/1.6/ (index.lt.html po/lt.po): updated Lithuanian announcement translation
20090320 21:03:21< Munk> My primary language is C++ but I've been writing Flash ActionScript (for fun, not for class) for the last 3 months and I study C# for class.
20090320 21:03:36< Shadow_Master> alink: most.
20090320 21:03:44< Shadow_Master> mine includes at least three dozens of new units
20090320 21:04:03< Shadow_Master> ^^
20090320 21:04:12< Munk> I played Wesnoth for months but I haven't played it since like November.
20090320 21:04:26< boucman> zookeeper: did you see my last reply about all other mainline units ?
20090320 21:04:34< alink> Shadow_Master: yeah but this is just a line in a wiki, and it's just a speed optimization
20090320 21:04:56< mordante> Munk, and how long did you play wesnoth before and what single player or multiplayer or both
20090320 21:05:05< alink> boucman, zookeeper, actually I suggest to start only with a faction, and test/think with that 
20090320 21:05:13< mordante> loonycyborg, http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=24508 it this the normal look on Windows?
20090320 21:05:18 * Shadow_Master writes down "it's just a line in a wiki" in his personal list of new Internet terminology
20090320 21:05:20< boucman> alink: my problem is that it's not 1.4 and we can't mark it as dev_feature or it'll get mixed up with 1.6 
20090320 21:05:21< Munk> I played it non-stop for 3-4 months.
20090320 21:05:26< boucman> so i'm waiting to update the wiki
20090320 21:05:28< Munk> Single player
20090320 21:05:48< alink> s/is just a line in a wiki/  is just a line in your WML
20090320 21:05:49< Munk> I played through 4 long campaigns.
20090320 21:06:04< alink> but will need to be documented in the wiki
20090320 21:06:24< CIA-70> ivanovic * r33940 /trunk/ (11 files in 8 dirs): updated Finnish and Turkish translation
20090320 21:06:29< Shadow_Master> alink: I think I'll stay to the typoed version ;)
20090320 21:06:57< Shadow_Master> *with.  It'll a nice way to denote things than nobody cares/should care about, and _my_ internet meme
20090320 21:07:02< boucman> Munk: and do you have any idea of what you'd like to work on for GSoC ?
20090320 21:07:29< alink> boucman: i still need to check your modif, I think you removed one line needed, but your second modif seems to fix it
20090320 21:07:38< Munk> Not yet, but I will have one soon.
20090320 21:07:57-!- PK [n=pk@r74-192-44-206.vctrcmta01.vctatx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 21:07:59< alink> and yes override_in_hex was not nice, just used it to avoid touching default param etc..
20090320 21:08:01< CIA-70> ivanovic * r33941 /branches/1.6/ (11 files in 8 dirs): updated Finnish and Turkish translation
20090320 21:08:24< boucman> alink: that's not why I removed it
20090320 21:08:45< Ivanovic> Munk: your username in the forums is 'Munk' ?
20090320 21:09:02< boucman> whe you reach line 333 (where you used it) you could have a mixture of user specified default animations and the ones we built at line 315 and below
20090320 21:09:15< Munk> I never worked in open source before so I find it a little intimidating, but I guess that's why GSoC was started.
20090320 21:09:26< Munk> Ivanovic: yes
20090320 21:09:31< boucman> and we don't want to override the in_hex for other anims which might not fit in hex 
20090320 21:09:41< boucman> that's why I added it at the other place
20090320 21:09:53< Ivanovic> Munk: no need to be intimidated
20090320 21:10:03< mordante> Munk, to avoid students from flipping burgers in the summer and to introduce them to open source
20090320 21:10:12< Ivanovic> that is: open source is basically about a huge bunch of people doing stuff they enjoy
20090320 21:10:21< PK> but flipping burgers is fun and lucrative
20090320 21:10:27< Ivanovic> s/enjoy/mostly enjoy, some are even paid for this stuff...
20090320 21:10:45< Ivanovic> PK: summer of code is rather lucrative with 4500$ over the summer, too
20090320 21:10:45< PK> its like little meaty acrobatics.
20090320 21:10:54< mordante> PK, summer of code is also lucrative and IMO much more fun as flipping burgers
20090320 21:11:00-!- Azkar [n=leazkar@rh-116-202.johnstown.resnet.pitt.edu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 21:11:00< alink> boucman: yes make sense from the code. Not what my test showed up, but i trust you for the special cases
20090320 21:11:13< Munk> It's hard not to get intimidated when I downloaded 200megs of source code last night.
20090320 21:11:24< Ivanovic> Munk: that is most the time you just do the stuff you have fun doing
20090320 21:11:24< Shadow_Master> Munk: most of that is music and images
20090320 21:11:27-!- West_ [n=West@hd5e2754c.gavlegardarna.gavle.to] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 21:11:31< Shadow_Master> and sound.
20090320 21:11:36< boucman> I must admit that's not the easiet area to understand... it's basically an "animation compiler" with all sorts of default parameters
20090320 21:11:37< Ivanovic> Shadow_Master: don't forget the several megabytes of translations
20090320 21:11:39< PK> Its hard to get intimidated when you have no idea what anyone is talking about >>
20090320 21:11:45< Ivanovic> i think compressed we are at >15MB by now...
20090320 21:11:46< mordante> Munk, IIRC about 5 MB of source and a lot of data
20090320 21:11:48< PK> bliss is wonderous.
20090320 21:12:12< mordante> true PK 
20090320 21:12:17< Shadow_Master> mordante: shadowm@bluecore:~/src/wesnoth$ du -sh src/
20090320 21:12:17< Shadow_Master> 7.9M    src/
20090320 21:12:35< Munk> So all the source codes are in "src" folder? That's where I should start?
20090320 21:12:42< mordante> ah we added 2.9 MB :-)
20090320 21:12:55< Ivanovic> Munk: the best way to get started is to look for a target to accomplish
20090320 21:13:10< mordante> Munk, http://www.wesnoth.org/devdocs/ might be easier to navigate
20090320 21:13:10< Ivanovic> there is no way anyone sane would start by "just reading everything for the sake of doing so"
20090320 21:13:11< Munk> Ah ok.
20090320 21:13:14< PK> that doesn't sound like much >> what is the source exactly?
20090320 21:13:28< PK> is it like wesnoths hardcoded stuff?
20090320 21:13:29< mordante> Munk, and feel free to ask
20090320 21:13:46< Shadow_Master> PK: I recommend you to search in the internet about basic programming theory ;)
20090320 21:13:48< boucman> Ivanovic: my target when entering wesnoth code was "read all code and document all WML"
20090320 21:13:52< Ivanovic> once you have such a task (like the ones we listed at the easy coding page) or a bug that annoys you or a tiny feature you think is missing, you should have a look at implementing it
20090320 21:13:56< boucman> yeah, I was young and naive at that time
20090320 21:14:00< mordante> PK, the source is what gets "translated" into the binary which you run
20090320 21:14:06< Shadow_Master> PK: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Source_code
20090320 21:14:25< mordante> PK, the rest of the stuff in WML config files and music and images 
20090320 21:14:32< Ivanovic> for implementing this you will slowly step down into the several levels of hell
20090320 21:14:47-!- PK [n=pk@r74-192-44-206.vctrcmta01.vctatx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net] has quit ["Java user signed off"]
20090320 21:14:58 * mordante wonders which level he's at. but it's quite hot here ;-)
20090320 21:14:58< Ivanovic> if any questions come up, you should just ask and we will try to find a satisfying answer
20090320 21:15:01< Munk> I've wrote hundreds of small programs before but none are bigger than 700 lines of code
20090320 21:15:03-!- PK [n=pk@r74-192-44-206.vctrcmta01.vctatx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 21:15:08< Ivanovic> mordante: you are too far by now
20090320 21:15:15< boucman> Crab_, Velory: everything nominal ?
20090320 21:15:16< Ivanovic> mordante: for you it is getting cold *again*
20090320 21:15:23< Shadow_Master> reminds me I want to check how many source code lines we have ^^
20090320 21:15:23< mordante> :-D
20090320 21:15:31< Crab_> boucman, yes. It takes a lot of time to compile )
20090320 21:15:40< boucman> Crab_: indeed :(
20090320 21:15:58< Munk> Can I ask who you people are and where you're from?
20090320 21:15:59< Ivanovic> PK: the "source code" is basically what several gaming studios sell as "engine"
20090320 21:16:14< Ivanovic> from everywhere and nowhere, Munk
20090320 21:16:17< mordante> Shadow_Master, http://www.ohloh.net/p/wesnoth/analyses/latest
20090320 21:16:24< PK> you might as well give up explaining it =P I can barely understand what WML I work with.
20090320 21:16:28< Shadow_Master> mordante: pah. I was having fun with wc.
20090320 21:16:30< alink> boucman: Ah isee, you use in_hex for the default anim. I initialy rejected that because I thought that it was more intrusive. But i suppose that if the default anim always use the base frame, then that in_hex will always be consistent.
20090320 21:16:36< Ivanovic> all over the world, lots of people from europe, some from north amerika, one from south amerika, ...
20090320 21:16:48< Shadow_Master> mordante: remind me to never, never go to the movies with you.
20090320 21:16:53< PK> Amerika? Is that like Afrika?
20090320 21:17:17< Munk> I'm from Kanada ;)
20090320 21:17:17 * PK huzzahs for techno song references.
20090320 21:17:21< Velory> boucman: i created unit which have poison attack but i cant reach him from command 
20090320 21:17:21< Shadow_Master> PK: german lapsus
20090320 21:17:28< Velory> s/from/with
20090320 21:17:34< boucman> alink: the cfg you have at this point is the [unit_type] so we can use the in_hex= only to tell us that default_image fits in hex, we should not use it in any other case
20090320 21:17:36< PK> I always wondered why one of my songs was spelled with a K.
20090320 21:17:48< mordante> Shadow_Master, nothing stops you from verifying ohloh is right ;-)
20090320 21:17:49< PK> thought it was just some upbeat thing, or avoiding a copyright (on a continent, wierd.)
20090320 21:18:33< alink> boucman: ah in case of special modif for a specific unit. I see
20090320 21:18:37< boucman> Velory: use filter() on the global my_units variable to filter units with poison
20090320 21:19:37< CIA-70> mordante * r33942 /trunk/cmake/ (FindBoost.cmake Readme): 
20090320 21:19:37< CIA-70> Remove the custom boost script.
20090320 21:19:37< CIA-70> It's now shipped with cmake so use that version.
20090320 21:19:49< mordante> Shadow_Master, and bonus points if you use git to make a graph as well ;-)
20090320 21:19:50< Ivanovic> got to say that this is *really* funny to read: http://www.ohloh.net/p/wesnoth/contributors/13638668662120
20090320 21:19:53< Velory> i dont know which variable should i use filter(my_units, xxx )
20090320 21:20:09< Ivanovic> i didn't know that i commited this much html and objective c stuff to wesnoth...
20090320 21:20:11< Ivanovic> ^^
20090320 21:20:17< alink> zookeeper: wait before updating more units with in_hex, I will do some (maybe a faction) as example and test. Also easier for me, because I can check if all work fine
20090320 21:20:26< boucman> my_units is a list of all units
20090320 21:20:31< Velory> i know that
20090320 21:20:41< boucman> so filter using loc(x,y) should work,
20090320 21:20:45< mordante> Ivanovic, and even ruby and dos batch files
20090320 21:20:49< Ivanovic> yeah
20090320 21:20:53< Velory> hmm ok
20090320 21:20:55< Velory> thx
20090320 21:21:41< Ivanovic> the only common element is that my code is not well documented
20090320 21:21:43< Ivanovic> ;)
20090320 21:21:57< mordante> mine is :-)
20090320 21:22:21< mordante> and I still manage to do more than 1 month work in a month http://www.ohloh.net/p/wesnoth/contributors/13638668662150 ;-)
20090320 21:23:13< CIA-70> esr * r33943 /trunk/po/ (5 files in 5 dirs): Updated en_GB translation.
20090320 21:23:37-!- crimson_p [n=irchon@S0106001cf0705af9.cc.shawcable.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 21:25:47< Ivanovic> hey, cool, fendrin is our leesing emaxs lisp coder
20090320 21:27:06< crimson_p> upload's probably done, just have to go back to my computer
20090320 21:27:36< Ivanovic> crimson_p: ah, good
20090320 21:27:43< Ivanovic> i guessed the new filename correctly?
20090320 21:27:51< alink> I see that i am near my 1000th commit (966), I must try to not fail that one
20090320 21:27:55< Ivanovic> Wesnoth_1.6a.dmg
20090320 21:28:12< Ivanovic> he, my commit 1k is long ago by now...
20090320 21:28:15< Crab_> boucman, aha it works now. svn commit sneaked by which changed the default ai used, so code i've changed wasn't firing off ). how I should name that new function ? is 'debug_popup' reasonable ?
20090320 21:28:24< crimson_p> no, I called it the same
20090320 21:28:25 * Shadow_Master out
20090320 21:28:44< mordante> alink, it might be the cia already thinks you passed that mark ;-)
20090320 21:28:49< boucman> I was thinking of debug_float, but you coded it, you decide :P
20090320 21:28:55< Ivanovic> ahhhh, i see
20090320 21:28:58< Ivanovic> they only count trunk
20090320 21:28:59< boucman> and don't forget to update changelog and about.cfg
20090320 21:29:06-!- Shadow_Master [n=ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit ["SIGPIPE"]
20090320 21:29:06< Ivanovic> not 1.4, not 1.6 and not the rest either
20090320 21:29:07< crimson_p> so the old one has to be deleted first
20090320 21:29:07< crimson_p> I hope that works
20090320 21:29:12< Crab_> boucman, ok, so let it be debug_float then.
20090320 21:29:14< Ivanovic> pah, then i would easily come to *more*
20090320 21:29:30< Ivanovic> crimson_p: have you uploaded it with the same name as before?
20090320 21:29:34-!- Shadow_Master [n=ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 21:30:02< Shadow_Master> don't forget https://mail.gna.org/public/wesnoth-dev/2009-03/msg00068.html  ^^
20090320 21:30:09< crimson_p> yeah
20090320 21:30:15-!- Shadow_Master [n=ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit [Client Quit]
20090320 21:30:21< Ivanovic> crimson_p: ugh, bad idea...
20090320 21:30:37< Crab_> boucman: should I center the screen on the popup hex  (via ->scroll_to_tile ) ?
20090320 21:30:53< crimson_p> I don't know that it's done, but it probably is if I didn't get disconnected
20090320 21:30:58< Ivanovic> especially since i see no way to rename it in the web management thingie
20090320 21:30:59< boucman> Velory: debug_print(filter(my_units,loc.x=8 and loc.y=4))
20090320 21:31:03< crimson_p> oh :-/
20090320 21:31:26< Ivanovic> crimson_p: if you used rsync via ssh there is no problem if the download is aborted in the middle
20090320 21:31:30< Ivanovic> you can just continue
20090320 21:31:36< boucman> Crab_: probably not, there could be lots of popups at the same time, and the screen will most likely scroll to the interesting place because of animations anyway
20090320 21:31:44< crimson_p> yeah
20090320 21:31:45< Ivanovic> just use the same command and it will go on where it stopped
20090320 21:31:55< crimson_p> I did
20090320 21:32:06< Velory> boucman: can i find unit with his attacks for example filter(my_units,'attacks' = 'ink') its not working but any similar code like that ?
20090320 21:32:16< crimson_p> but it still wouldn't be done now
20090320 21:34:05< boucman> Velory: that would be filter(my_units,size(filter(attacks,id=ink))>0)
20090320 21:34:23< boucman> (or something similar, I havn't tested it)
20090320 21:35:32< Ivanovic> crimson_p: once you are done and added the version i might just download it using wesnoth.org and reupload it with the Wesnoth_1.6a.dmg filename
20090320 21:35:38-!- fabi [n=fabi@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
20090320 21:36:29< alink> mordante: yes you were right, my commit mails seems to indicate 996
20090320 21:36:29-!- crimson_p [n=irchon@S0106001cf0705af9.cc.shawcable.net] has quit []
20090320 21:37:08< alink> but I am not ready for my 1000th commit, i need to find something very nice to commit  :-/
20090320 21:37:24< mordante> my number at ohloh is also wrong 
20090320 21:37:24-!- busfahrer [n=busfahre@unixboard/user/busfahrer] has quit ["leaving"]
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20090320 21:37:42 * mordante didn't look what his 1000th commit was
20090320 21:38:33< Ivanovic> mordante: like i just noted, they only monitor trunk, not the other branches
20090320 21:38:33-!- Espreon [n=espreon@wesnoth/developer/espreon] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 21:38:45< Ivanovic> which will add "a little" in many accounts...
20090320 21:38:52< mordante> ah that explains a lot
20090320 21:39:17 * alink remember one when, exceptionaly, he commited text in help and still made English mistake
20090320 21:39:25< alink> wesbot log 20000
20090320 21:39:30< wesbot> alink * r20000 : Fix error in the description of backstab in special-note.
20090320 21:39:35< wesbot> URL: http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/wesnoth?view=rev&rev=20000
20090320 21:39:41< mordante> :-)
20090320 21:39:59< Ivanovic> mordante: regarding the cmake recipe: those policy lines can be removed now, too, right?
20090320 21:40:03< alink> wesbot log 30000
20090320 21:40:03< wesbot> dragonking * r30000 : Made move() formula reset remaining movmement of unit to 0
20090320 21:40:04< boucman> Velory: fixed formula debug_print(filter(my_units,filter(attacks,id='sword')))
20090320 21:40:06< wesbot> URL: http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/wesnoth?view=rev&rev=30000
20090320 21:40:09< mordante> oh Ivanovic do you get really unhappy when I break pot-updates for cmake for now?
20090320 21:40:14< Ivanovic> IIRC they were only needed for backwards compatibility
20090320 21:40:19< Ivanovic> not at all
20090320 21:40:23< Ivanovic> so far i am not using them
20090320 21:40:40< mordante> I haven't checked what those lines do yet
20090320 21:40:40< Ivanovic> atm i am still working via autotools for po(t) file updates
20090320 21:41:15< Ivanovic> if esr was around in here i would have told him to also commit the en_GB update to branches/1.6
20090320 21:41:24< Ivanovic> since he is not, i hope he reads the logs...
20090320 21:41:33< mordante> my pot update still has some glitches but at least I generate POTFILES.in :-)
20090320 21:42:05< alink> boucman: that's not a surprise, but I confirm that your second modif of my patch fixed what was broken by the first modif
20090320 21:42:13< mordante> will look at it later tonight going to watch some TV now 
20090320 21:42:32< boucman> :P
20090320 21:43:23< Ivanovic> have fun
20090320 21:43:26-!- PK [n=pk@r74-192-44-206.vctrcmta01.vctatx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net] has quit ["Java user signed off"]
20090320 21:43:34< Munk> Do I have to login to create a wiki page? If so, is the login information different from the forums?
20090320 21:44:26< alink> wesbot: log 33937
20090320 21:44:27< wesbot> zookeeper * r33937 : Added in_hex=yes to standing anims which remain in the hex.
20090320 21:44:30< wesbot> URL: http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/wesnoth?view=rev&rev=33937
20090320 21:44:47< Ivanovic> Munk: yes, it is a different account
20090320 21:44:51< Ivanovic> and yes, you have to log in
20090320 21:44:55< alink> boucman: these [+standing_anim] in_hex=yes [/standing_anim] must not be there, I am correct ?
20090320 21:45:25< boucman> alink: you're talking of zookeeper's commit ?
20090320 21:45:34< boucman> why shouldn't they be there ?
20090320 21:46:06< alink> yes, but wait i check more, maybe i am just confused by something
20090320 21:46:36< Munk> Ok, thanks
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20090320 21:48:42< Velory> yes i can reach units that have poision attack 
20090320 21:49:07-!- esr [n=chatzill@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
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20090320 21:49:41< CIA-70> loonycyborg * r33944 /trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): Use env.AddMethod to add custom methods.
20090320 21:54:11< alink> boucman: ok sorry there was a [standing_anim] hidden in a macro, i didn't expected that
20090320 21:54:25< boucman> :P
20090320 21:55:42 * alink realizes better now why it's best to let WML guru do this update :-/
20090320 21:55:51< boucman> :)
20090320 21:55:53-!- fendrin [n=fabi@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has joined #wesnoth-dev
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20090320 21:57:29< alink> boucman: but still, even with the [+standing_anim] in_hex=yes [/standing_anim], we also need a in_hex=yes at the root level of the unit_type, to tell that the base frame is in_hex too.
20090320 21:57:44 * alink looking the drake burner in that last commit
20090320 21:58:49< boucman> alink: agreed, I'm trying to catch zookeeper on that, but he seems to be afk
20090320 21:59:19< shadowmaster> okay, I'll try to get back home this time for real. grrr...
20090320 21:59:35-!- shadowmaster [i=929b360d@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit ["http://www.mibbit.com ajax IRC Client"]
20090320 22:00:01< alink> ok, if we agreed on that, i test more with special cases, and i write a first howto in the bugreport, then maybe review it if i missed something
20090320 22:00:47< zookeeper> boucman, i have no idea what you're talking about "all other mainline units"
20090320 22:01:33< alink> zookeeper: i will write an how-to with some example
20090320 22:02:14< alink> it will also allow to test if this howto is clear enough for WML authors ;)
20090320 22:03:54< Velory> boucman:in eval state only i must return positive value if i have a unit with poison ability and there is a unpoisoned enemy that my unit can reach right?
20090320 22:03:58< boucman> zookeeper: well, we need to know if the image fits in hex for all images, which include the "default image", the one specified as image= in the unit itself (i.e out of all animations)
20090320 22:04:10< boucman> to do that, put an in_hex=yes directly in the unit
20090320 22:05:21< boucman> Velory: your should return a positive value if the unit specified in the "me" variable  should attack the unit in "target"
20090320 22:05:25< alink> - If the base frame fit in a hex (regardless if the unit has standing animations defined), add in_hex=yes at the root level of unit_type file. If it doesn't fit in a hex, nothing is needed, but you may want to add a in_hex=no to warn others that this image was reviewd and not fit in hex
20090320 22:05:33< Ivanovic> afk for a while
20090320 22:05:54< boucman> remember these two variables are filled by the engine (see 2.4 in FormulaAI page)
20090320 22:06:03 * alink ^started to write his howto
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20090320 22:09:15< zookeeper> err, so you want to put in_hex=yes to every unit type and animation except the ones which actually are bigger-than-hex?
20090320 22:09:21< alink> - After that, check if the unit has standing animations. If you find a [standing_anim] and all its frames fit in a hex, add an in_hex=yes into that tag (same remark as above about using in_hex=no to hint the other cases).
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20090320 22:09:52< alink> zookeeper: yes annoying, but that's the only way to guarantee compatibility with 1.6.0
20090320 22:10:32< alink> I considered using the default in_hex=yes, but that's more problem and a potential for glitches for UMC
20090320 22:10:59< crimson_pingvin> Ivanovic: uhhh, the upload finished, but it's not showing up...
20090320 22:11:36< Ivanovic> have you deleted the old file in the group?
20090320 22:11:36< boucman> alink: you could add in_hex on a per-frame basis too, but that wouldn't gain much performance
20090320 22:12:08< crimson_pingvin> no
20090320 22:12:10< crimson_pingvin> I guess I"ll do that now
20090320 22:12:14< Ivanovic> crimson_pingvin: do so first
20090320 22:12:23< alink> boucman: yes I wanted to ask about that, because I think that would gain some performance
20090320 22:12:29< crimson_pingvin> ah, there we go
20090320 22:12:59< Ivanovic> :)
20090320 22:13:07< alink> boucman: for example the standing anim of the bat has only one frame out of the hex
20090320 22:13:08< crimson_pingvin> deleted and added
20090320 22:13:23< West> guys, a question: would anyone except me be interested in seeing a slight redesign of the wesnoth interface?
20090320 22:13:27< alink> boucman: but agreed in general cases it's less important
20090320 22:13:36< West> the skin I mean, not the layout
20090320 22:13:46< boucman> alink: it would work, (the way you implemented it works both at frame and animation level) but would gain little gain because if you add at [frame] level, it probably means that some images fit and other don't
20090320 22:13:53< Ivanovic> West: atm this is rather difficult to do
20090320 22:14:01-!- ABCD [n=ABCD@wikipedia/ABCD] has quit [Read error: 113 (No route to host)]
20090320 22:14:05< Ivanovic> West: that is: until mordante is done with his new gui this is a real PITA
20090320 22:14:05< boucman> which in turn means that very often you invalidate your neighbours anyway
20090320 22:14:08< West> Ivanovic: oh?
20090320 22:14:18< West> ah, I see
20090320 22:14:39< Ivanovic> (i have done some modding to the theme to better support smaller res right before 1.4 eg introducing support for 800x480 instead of 800x600 as min res)
20090320 22:14:44< Ivanovic> no fun, really no fun
20090320 22:14:49< West> you see, I was playing around with altering the interface graphics a while back
20090320 22:14:56-!- Baufo [n=thomas@wesnoth/developer/baufo] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
20090320 22:15:05< West> but unoftunately I reinstalled the game and forgot to backup the images
20090320 22:15:13< West> unfortunately*
20090320 22:15:16< Ivanovic> but one of the things mordante aims for is making it easier themable
20090320 22:15:22< Ivanovic> as in "saner config"
20090320 22:15:23< West> that's good to hear
20090320 22:15:49< West> will there even be support for easily switchable 3rd party skins?
20090320 22:15:57< alink> boucman: it may help specifif cases: for the bat, that means that she invalidates only one hex most of the time, and once 5 hexes. that's still an averages of ~4.5 times less hexes 
20090320 22:16:06-!- Baufo [n=thomas@wesnoth/developer/baufo] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 22:16:28< Ivanovic> personally there are some changes that would *really* be good to have (like better support for really high and really low res)
20090320 22:16:34< alink> (4.5 is just a guess)
20090320 22:16:37< Ivanovic> West: i *think* this is somehow planned, too
20090320 22:16:46< boucman> alink: yes, it can be done and would be beneficial 
20090320 22:16:56< Ivanovic> not sure 100% sure though, you will have to ask him yourself (once he is back from watching tv)
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20090320 22:17:05< boucman> but I think that once we have reviewed all other standing anims, the gain would be minimal
20090320 22:17:32< Munk> I went over the ideas page and I think I can do one of these two: Savegame reorganization  and  Implement campaign statistics reports on stats.wesnoth.org 
20090320 22:18:16< alink> ok I will test it on the bat, just to check. But, as you said, i also think that we must start with a general simple method and see what's details later
20090320 22:18:22< Ivanovic> Munk: the savegame reorganization is a whole lot more difficult than it sounds like
20090320 22:18:25< Munk> for campaign stats, I've used PHP and MySQL in the past to make a personal blog and discussion board
20090320 22:18:34< Ivanovic> beside the AI task this is probably one of the most difficult ones
20090320 22:19:02< alink> boucman: btw, one detail for later is try it for idle anim too
20090320 22:19:05< Ivanovic> where the stats stuff on the other end is "rather easy", it "only" requires lots of different things
20090320 22:19:22< Munk> Well, it seems less about coding and more about design.
20090320 22:19:28< West> Ivanovic: ok, thanks, I'll ask him
20090320 22:19:28< Ivanovic> the main task there is find a good way to reorganize the data to have it meaningfull
20090320 22:19:44< Velory> boucman:is there any attribute which is denoting if unit can be poisioned?
20090320 22:20:06< boucman> no
20090320 22:20:18< alink> check if undead ?
20090320 22:20:21< boucman> just look for "not poisoned" as a first attempt
20090320 22:20:26< Ivanovic> and mechanical
20090320 22:20:33< Munk> Well, I haven't seen the savegame codes, but I think I can do it. (fingers crossed)
20090320 22:20:39< Velory> so only undeads cant be poisioneD?
20090320 22:20:41< boucman> once that's done, we can add "not regenerating" "not undead" "not mechanical" etc...
20090320 22:20:46< boucman> but let's start easy
20090320 22:20:51< Velory> hmm
20090320 22:20:52< Velory> ok
20090320 22:20:57< Ivanovic> Munk: yogihh is our expert on the savegame stuff
20090320 22:21:13< Ivanovic> it is really problematic since there are *several* problemtic areas connected
20090320 22:21:30< Ivanovic> at the moment it is a really fragile mess...
20090320 22:22:18< Crab_> boucman, all ok, for example -   debug_float(loc(10,10),'hello, free world!')   works :)
20090320 22:22:33< boucman> Crab_: conderfull
20090320 22:22:35< boucman> wonderfull
20090320 22:22:43< Sirp> Munk: the problem is the save game stuff is all through the code, and it's complex.
20090320 22:22:44< boucman> patch cleaned and ready to submit ?
20090320 22:24:37< Crab_> boucman: 1) cleaned according to http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/CodingStandards ? 
20090320 22:25:30< alink> (my previous example about the bat, was in fact only about the dreadbat)
20090320 22:25:38< Munk> So one is too easy and the other is too hard?
20090320 22:26:02< boucman> Munk: programming 101 : never say anything is "too easy" :P
20090320 22:26:45< Munk> I didn't say it was easy. I thought you guys were saying it was easy.
20090320 22:26:58< alink> (and the blood bat, grrr)
20090320 22:27:24< Ivanovic> Munk: uhm, it is *rather* easy
20090320 22:27:31< boucman> Munk: maybe easier than the other tasks 
20090320 22:27:33< Ivanovic> compared to tasks that will likely drive you mad
20090320 22:27:52< boucman> *cough* AI *cough*
20090320 22:27:56< Sirp> who is saying what is easy?
20090320 22:28:07 * crimson_pingvin hopes his package doesn't have any problems
20090320 22:28:16< crimson_pingvin> please test it, people with Mac OS!
20090320 22:28:20 * crimson_pingvin disappears
20090320 22:28:20< Sirp> Munk: sorry I missed the beginning of the discussion. Hi. :) What areas are you interested in working on?
20090320 22:28:22< Ivanovic> crimson_pingvin: can you give me an md5sum of it?
20090320 22:28:25-!- crimson_pingvin is now known as crimson_penguin
20090320 22:28:46< crimson_penguin> fc210744b7eb488ec37187b80679abc2
20090320 22:29:10< Munk> Sirp: The save game reorginization and stats.wesnoth.org rework
20090320 22:29:28< Sirp> Munk: okay. Personally I would love to have someone on the stats.wesnoth.org rework and I think it's actually an exciting, challenging task.
20090320 22:29:47< Munk> Then I'd love to work on it.
20090320 22:29:54< Crab_> boucman, see http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/m9d46b59
20090320 22:30:11< Sirp> Munk: and if you did that, I would be your mentor. I have spent the last two years or so as an engineer on Google's Google Analytics project, so I know quite a lot about this kind of thing and am hoping to mentor a good student to make a great analysis tool for Wesnoth.
20090320 22:30:58< Sirp> Munk: is there a particular set of web technologies that you work best with? (This is not some kind of trick question where you'll get dinged if you don't name my favorite technology. ;)
20090320 22:32:37< Munk> I wrote a primitive blogging app and a primitive forum app using PHP and MySQL. It was a year ago though, and I need to refresh my memory. But I didn't find PHP hard at all, coming from a C++ background.
20090320 22:32:58< Sirp> Munk: ahh you have a C++ background? Cool, we are cut from the same piece of wool. :)
20090320 22:33:09< Ivanovic> crimson_penguin: okay, reuploading as Wesnoth_1.6a.dmg after the download worked nicely (md5 is identical)
20090320 22:33:12< boucman> Crab_: looks good, but could you put your new function in formula_function, rather than formual_ai ?
20090320 22:33:20< boucman> (let's not worsen the mess)
20090320 22:33:23< Crab_> boucman: ok
20090320 22:34:08< boucman> also, do a FormualAI section in the changelog, we'll have enough change in FAI to have it have its own section
20090320 22:34:11< Munk> I took down my PHP/MySQL apps from the internet but I can put 'em up again later if you want to see them.
20090320 22:34:17< Crab_> boucman: ok
20090320 22:34:26< boucman> and last, post the patch to pathes.wesnoth.org, so you have a link to add to your wiki page
20090320 22:34:41< Crab_> boucman: ok, again )
20090320 22:35:13< Crab_> should I update the wiki page ( http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/FormulaAI_Functions ) too ?
20090320 22:35:31-!- Baufo [n=thomas@wesnoth/developer/baufo] has quit ["Leaving"]
20090320 22:35:36< Munk> Also, I've been working heavily with Flash and ActionScript for the last 3-4 months, although I doubt it'll be used.
20090320 22:35:55< boucman> Crab_: no, your change will be in 1.7 and currently we can't add stuff for 1.7 to wiki yet
20090320 22:35:56< Crab_> boucman: and also this - http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/EasyCoding  ?
20090320 22:36:10< voris> Does the first paragraph of this section make more sense to any of you than it does to me? http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/InternalActionsWML#.5Bevent.5D
20090320 22:36:17< boucman> yes, you can update that one, stating that you've done it
20090320 22:36:27< voris> I'm lost as to what is trying to be said there.
20090320 22:36:36< thespaceinvader> boucman: you need to update your artist intro post a bit
20090320 22:36:58< Ivanovic> crimson_penguin: okay, uploaded the renamed osx binary
20090320 22:37:06< boucman> thespaceinvader: I guess so
20090320 22:37:34< Crab_> boucman, regarding the 1.7: shouldn't be the title of the section named "Version 1.7" unstead of "Version 1.6+svn" ?
20090320 22:37:43< Crab_> (in the changelog)
20090320 22:38:00< Ivanovic> Crab_: in *which* changelog?
20090320 22:38:07< Ivanovic> the one of trunk is 1.7.0-svn
20090320 22:38:17< thespaceinvader> specifically, art contributors are artists who have contributed to mainline, art developers are artists who have commit privs, and have a good deal more sya than most contribs about what goes on in the art side of things
20090320 22:38:27< boucman> Crab_: indeed, we havn't upgraded everything yet, I'll fix that
20090320 22:38:44< Ivanovic> grml, only in the players_changelog it is correct...
20090320 22:38:44< Turuk> Personally, I think boucman's post works well as many of the art contributors have given poor advice on occasion...
20090320 22:38:54< Crab_> Ivanovic, changelog file in the root of trunk svn )
20090320 22:38:56-!- YogiHH [i=YogiHH@c129133.adsl.hansenet.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 22:38:57< thespaceinvader> currently, there're only two are developers, myself and kestenvarn, who doesn't do much on the art side these days
20090320 22:39:02< Munk> Is there any other technology being used besides PHP (I assume it's PHP) and MySQL for stats?
20090320 22:39:11< YogiHH> hello everyone
20090320 22:39:11< Sirp> Munk: I personally would prefer Perl or Python or perhaps even Ruby be used. But ultimately I like the person developing to make the choice.
20090320 22:39:12< boucman> Turuk, thespaceinvader, you might want to take it, and sticky it in the moderator forum
20090320 22:39:38< boucman> I think that posting that to all new (worthy) artist individually is important, but having it stickified for easy updating would be nice
20090320 22:39:42< thespaceinvader> Turuk: it works, but it's inaccurate - changing it so that it's accurate could still avoid the implication that all art contributors are to be trusted implicitly
20090320 22:39:49< Ivanovic> crimson_penguin: and removed the 1.6 named mac binary
20090320 22:39:59< Turuk> Boucman, sounds like a plan and thespaceinvader, good point.
20090320 22:40:14< YogiHH> Sirp: You enlarged my world today (www.mibbit.com) ;-)
20090320 22:40:17< Turuk> Thespaceinvader, what if you PM me with updates/changes you think work and I can sticky it into the moderator's forum?
20090320 22:40:22< thespaceinvader> we definitely ought, by the way, to sticky a portrait requirements list in the Art Contribs section, preferably in Announcements
20090320 22:40:29< Sirp> Munk: for one thing, I think we will need a "data processing job" run on a regular basis to process the data in the MySQL database. This could actually be done in C++, but would probably also be fine in Python or Perl but not in PHP.
20090320 22:40:33< thespaceinvader> saves use constantly re-typing it all the time
20090320 22:40:36< Sirp> YogiHH: it is cool. :)
20090320 22:40:43< YogiHH> yup
20090320 22:40:49 * Turuk has the portraits list bookmarked
20090320 22:41:06< Turuk> thespaceinvader, do you just want to sticky the current portrait list?
20090320 22:41:09< Munk> I'm open to learning new languages. Python sounds good.
20090320 22:41:26 * Turuk moves to PMs.
20090320 22:41:57< boucman> wesnoth could always do with more python experts
20090320 22:42:00< YogiHH> Sirp: Have you got some time to talk about the AI?
20090320 22:42:01< thespaceinvader> Turuk: not what i mean
20090320 22:42:06-!- Sparks_ [n=Sparkste@78-105-212-150.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 22:42:15< thespaceinvader> i meant the technical requirements - size, backgrounds etc
20090320 22:42:32< Sparks_> hello.. :)
20090320 22:42:37< Turuk> Ah, but what about both?
20090320 22:42:37< boucman> hello
20090320 22:42:38< YogiHH> hi Sparks
20090320 22:43:02< Ivanovic> hi Sparks_
20090320 22:43:04< Sparks_> is there any devs here who wouldn't mind talking a little about AI design?
20090320 22:43:08< Crab_> boucman, is there some hidden ordering in the list of functions in formula_functions.cpp ?  Or is it arbitrary ?
20090320 22:43:10< Sparks_> :)
20090320 22:43:15< Sirp> Munk: okay, great. How deep would you say your programming language is in general? What things have you worked on in the past?
20090320 22:43:16< Ivanovic> Sparks_: your forum nick (yesterday) was clearly not what you said
20090320 22:43:20< Sirp> YogiHH: I have a little time
20090320 22:43:33< boucman> Crab_: not that I know of
20090320 22:43:37< Crab_> ))
20090320 22:43:43< Sparks_> Ivanovic:  I'll log in now  and see ... ?
20090320 22:43:45< Ivanovic> Sparks_: probably you only created an account for the wiki, none for the forums
20090320 22:43:54< Sparks_> o lol
20090320 22:43:56< Ivanovic> yes, those are two different places
20090320 22:43:57< Ivanovic> :(
20090320 22:43:58< Sparks_> I think ur right :0
20090320 22:44:11< Ivanovic> and please type in "normal" english
20090320 22:44:23< Sparks_> not text ? :)
20090320 22:44:25< boucman> voris: ok, I think I have the genera idea
20090320 22:44:29< Ivanovic> we got many not native english speakers in here
20090320 22:44:34-!- West [n=West@hd5e2754c.gavlegardarna.gavle.to] has quit ["b'bye"]
20090320 22:44:43< Sparks_> o ok .. sure np
20090320 22:44:44< Ivanovic> so stuff like "I think ur right" might not always be understood
20090320 22:44:44< Sirp> Munk: so have you seen/understood our database structure at http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/SoC_Ideas_Stats_Server ?
20090320 22:44:51< Sparks_> no problem i mean :)
20090320 22:44:59< Ivanovic> :)
20090320 22:44:59< Sparks_> sry
20090320 22:45:12< Sparks_> arghhh..  sorry I'm not doing it on purpose
20090320 22:45:17< Munk> I would say my programming is intermediate in general.
20090320 22:45:29< Sparks_> just bear with me for a little while.. please :)
20090320 22:45:34< boucman> or not...
20090320 22:45:40< Ivanovic> you will get used to it
20090320 22:46:05< Sirp> Munk: well gee, intermediate between who? :) What is some stuff you have programmed that you are proud of?
20090320 22:46:06< boucman> Sparks_: :)
20090320 22:46:29< Sparks_> So is there any developers here who wouldn't mind discussing wesnoth AI a little?  
20090320 22:47:00< Sparks_> by the way, why are some people in red on my chat?
20090320 22:47:14< Ivanovic> probably they are "away"
20090320 22:47:20< Turuk> Ae they users who have said your name?
20090320 22:47:22< Turuk> *Are
20090320 22:47:31< Sparks_> like boucman, and you all in one page?
20090320 22:47:51< Sparks_> red names I mean?
20090320 22:48:41-!- Blueblaze_ [n=Blueblaz@c-98-199-143-139.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 22:49:03< Munk> I know C++ and ActionScript aren't comparable but I made these the last couple of months: http://studentweb.cencol.ca/merdeneb/Navigation/Navigation.html
20090320 22:49:42< Sirp> Munk: I'm really not trying to intimidate you or scare you off, just want to know where you're at. :)
20090320 22:49:52< Sirp> and, that does look pretty cool
20090320 22:50:12< Sirp> Munk: are you familiar with the STL (vector, map, etc)?
20090320 22:50:23< Munk> I wrote a lot of small C++ programs but none of them I would describe as a "project" and would include in a portfolio.
20090320 22:50:46< Sirp> Munk: okay, that's cool.
20090320 22:51:02< Munk> Most of them, I can use them ok, but I'm not an expert.
20090320 22:51:23< Sirp> Munk: but you want to be an expert, right? :)
20090320 22:51:30< Munk> Sure! :)
20090320 22:51:54< Sirp> Munk: okay how about Linux? Do you use it at home? do you have access to a server on the Internet which has a web server, CGI facilities, etc?
20090320 22:52:00< Sirp> and how well do you know it?
20090320 22:52:01< loonycyborg> Munk: Have you used Boost?
20090320 22:52:46< Munk> I downloaded and installed Boost a while ago but never got around to using it.
20090320 22:53:22< stikonas> mordante: it is safe now to remove two cmake 2.4.6 workarounds in CMakeLists.txt. Removing custom ImageMagick script also seems to work.
20090320 22:53:30< Ivanovic> Sparks_: to get some answers about AI stuff you should ask some questions
20090320 22:54:00-!- Sapient [n=sapien-x@wesnoth/developer/sapient] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 22:54:12< Sapient> yo
20090320 22:54:40< Munk> I don't use Linux. My dad uses it constantly and always bugs me to get into it.
20090320 22:55:33< ilor> silene: around?
20090320 22:55:45< Sirp> Munk: and why haven't you? I mean, if you're into programming shouldn't Linux be the kind of thing you're hugely into? :)
20090320 22:55:55< silene> ilor: yes
20090320 22:56:21< loonycyborg> Munk: Linux is kinda programmer's pardise :)
20090320 22:56:27< Munk> "access to a server on the internet"? You mean do I have a webpage that's not student page?
20090320 22:56:32< loonycyborg> Especially Gentoo..
20090320 22:56:56< Velory> boucman:why this isnt working filter(my_units,size(filter(states,'poisoned' = 'on'))>0)
20090320 22:57:02< ilor> silene: how far are you planning to go with the config class changes? I'm asking from a GSoC-hopeful perspective
20090320 22:57:32< boucman> Velory: not sure, I tried it too, though
20090320 22:57:59< boucman> removing the size() part fixed it (since filter will match if the formula part returns anything)
20090320 22:58:12< boucman> Sirp or Dragonking might have a better idea
20090320 22:58:48< ilor> silene: last year I almost had an application going for working on WML performance, but ended up doing the editor mostly because there was a mentor shortage (i.e. Sirp was busy ;) )
20090320 22:59:12< Velory> not fixed in me
20090320 22:59:20< boucman> hmm
20090320 22:59:21< Velory> i cant reach posioned units
20090320 22:59:29< Velory> hmm maybe its because
20090320 22:59:30< Sparks_> hi boucman...  I have an initial rough idea for my proposal for GSoC..  and I thought I'd just bounce some ideas around off you.. is that ok?
20090320 22:59:48< Ivanovic> Munk: for me working (especially coding) is a whole lot easier on linux than on windows, the system is specifically done to have compiling "just work"
20090320 23:00:05< Ivanovic> no need for an IDE with strange setups and stuff, just the normal system tools and you have it working
20090320 23:00:07< Velory> in list its appering like that:states -> ['poisoned' -> 'on' ]
20090320 23:00:12< Sirp> Munk: well a Linux server on the Internet that you can write a prototype for us on so we can see how you do.
20090320 23:00:14< Velory> its in tuple
20090320 23:00:28< Ivanovic> plus "lovely neat features" like pasting via middle mouse button and package managing
20090320 23:00:42< Sirp> Munk: I mean I'm not going to lie, you're going to use Python....MySQL....and develop on a Linux server. You're going to need some pretty decent Linux skills to do this project.
20090320 23:00:52 * loonycyborg loves middle button pasting :)
20090320 23:01:02< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: so do i
20090320 23:01:18< Ivanovic> it is among the best stuff out there that is easy to mention and differs a lot from windows
20090320 23:01:26< Sirp> if you're a Windows-only GUI, IDE-loving person, then this might not be the best project for you.
20090320 23:01:30< Ivanovic> stuff that they have not copied so far
20090320 23:02:02< silene> ilor: hmm... i don't mind you taking over; the 300K patch already went in, i just have one last patch to commit, and then i'm done with what was waiting for 1.7
20090320 23:03:24< Munk> Well, learning Linux was something I was planning to do sooner or later so I can use this opportunity to start now
20090320 23:03:35< Sapient> Munk, your collision program is pretty fun
20090320 23:03:48< Munk> I hope I'm not being too sheepish
20090320 23:03:50< Sapient> although I do hate flash
20090320 23:03:50< ilor> silene: have you considered mentoring for Wesnoth?
20090320 23:03:51< Munk> thanks
20090320 23:04:22< Munk> it gets a little buggy when there are too many balls with too high speeds in too little space
20090320 23:04:39< Sapient> yeah, I managed to glitch it out a little
20090320 23:04:47< Sapient> that's part of the challenge ;)
20090320 23:04:55< Sparks_> Hi Sirp:  I'm a prospective GSoC applicant..  Would you guys be interested in a project that includes a significant redesign of the AI? Or is the AI project more incremental changes?
20090320 23:05:08< boucman> Sparks_: you should start writing a wiki page, the chan is quitte busy right now
20090320 23:05:18< loonycyborg> Munk: Is your nick after a race from Wizardy games? :)
20090320 23:05:27< Sparks_> o ok...
20090320 23:05:41< boucman> Sparks_: we are a bit afraid of "big redesign of the AI" writing an AI for wesnoth is VERY hard (we have a whole page on why it is hard)
20090320 23:05:41< Sirp> Sparks_: well gee, maybe. I mean it really depends on the strength of the student. We're not closed minded by any means.
20090320 23:05:49< Munk> No, it's short for Munkhsoyol. My first name. :)
20090320 23:06:02< Sapient> wow
20090320 23:06:02< loonycyborg> :P
20090320 23:06:04< silene> ilor: no, i'm already mentoring during the day, i didn't consider mentoring during the night in addition ;-)
20090320 23:06:11< boucman> so we will be reluctant to all proposals that try to completely rewrite the AI, set yourselves reasonable goals
20090320 23:06:26< boucman> Velory, Crab_ what I said above might interest you too
20090320 23:06:29< silene> ilor: but i should look at what it means
20090320 23:06:53< Velory> im listening :)
20090320 23:07:01< Sparks_> boucman:  I was more thinking of big redesign (modular) with implementation of a fairly limited subset (in the 3 months)?
20090320 23:07:08< boucman> Sparks_: http://wesnoth.org/wiki/SummerOfCodeIdeas if you havn't been there yet
20090320 23:07:24< Sparks_> boucman:  I have been there already :)
20090320 23:07:26< boucman> Sparks_: write a proposal, it will give us a basis to discuss
20090320 23:07:31< Sapient> silene: I appreciate the work you are doing on the config object
20090320 23:07:32< Sparks_> cool..
20090320 23:07:36-!- Blueblaze_ [n=Blueblaz@c-98-199-143-139.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Success]
20090320 23:07:38< Sparks_> will do ...
20090320 23:07:56< Velory> btw boucman did u look at my wiki page i edited my ideas today :)
20090320 23:07:58< Munk> I know I'm promising to learn a lot of things but I'm a quick learner and can do it if I spend like 30 hours a week on it, which I certainly have
20090320 23:08:05< boucman> Velory: not yet
20090320 23:08:19< Velory> Ok:)
20090320 23:08:22< boucman> I've spent all my wesnoth time helping all of you on the chan today :P
20090320 23:08:23< Crab_> boucman, I've written my ideas on my wiki page. basically, most of the time is devoted to the refactoring of the existing codebase
20090320 23:08:28< Velory> hehe
20090320 23:08:36< boucman> Crab_: ok, 
20090320 23:08:40< Sirp> Munk: So I posted our database schema above. Would it be unreasonable for me to ask you to go and get a server, make a database on that server using the schema, and then set up a start of a web site which runs on Python and pulls stats from dummy data you have put in the database (i.e. the start of your project)?
20090320 23:08:42< Sapient> silene: but... using simple ranges means std::distance and std::advance everwhere... can't we get some object-oriented approach?
20090320 23:08:49< Sparks_> o hi guys :)  fellow applicants :)
20090320 23:08:52< CIA-70> jorda * r33945 /website/start/1.6/ (11 files in 2 dirs): Update Catalan translation
20090320 23:09:28< Munk> hey sparks
20090320 23:09:41 * boucman just crashed wesnoth
20090320 23:09:43< Velory> hey
20090320 23:09:43< boucman> :(
20090320 23:09:48< Velory> hehe :)
20090320 23:09:53< Velory> why u crashed ?
20090320 23:10:08< YogiHH> boucman: so you finally did it, welcome to the club ;-D
20090320 23:10:13< loonycyborg> boucman: Aren't programmers supposed to make things crash? :)
20090320 23:10:14< boucman> Velory: a particularly convoluted formula
20090320 23:10:35< Velory> :)
20090320 23:11:07< silene> Sapient: "everywhere" is a bit too exagerated; my changes introduced only 1 std::advance and only 3 std::distance
20090320 23:11:27< Sapient> ok, I'm just starting to review your changes
20090320 23:11:33< Munk> Sirp: No it's no unreasonable. It's just going to take some time. About 1 day is my guesstimate.
20090320 23:11:43< Sapient> I may have some more interesting proposals later
20090320 23:11:45< Velory> so can anyone have any idea why i cant reach poisoned member with this line
20090320 23:11:45< Velory> filter(my_units,size(filter(states,'poisoned' = 'on'))>0)
20090320 23:12:00< Munk> And I'll have my wiki page created by tonight or tomorrow.
20090320 23:12:21< Sirp> Munk: 1 day? Gee if you can do it in that time I'll be VERY impressed.
20090320 23:13:25< Sirp> Munk: I mean you understand, right? I want a MySQL database set up, with the schema I linked to, running on a server, this MySQL database populate with some dummy data, and then a Python script running a web site which allows some simple queries of the data.
20090320 23:13:35< Munk> Err, ok maybe 2 days.
20090320 23:13:45< Sirp> okay. :)
20090320 23:14:07< Munk> Oh..
20090320 23:14:40< Munk> I'm sorry, that'll take a few more days I think. :(
20090320 23:14:40< Sirp> i.e. what I'm basically looking for is a start on the project.
20090320 23:14:50< Sirp> Munk: no problem. That is what I was expecting.
20090320 23:15:19< Sirp> I'm looking for a student who has the initiative, creativity, talent, etc to go off and do things without being hand-held all the way. Of course, if you have some questions, don't be afraid to ask them.
20090320 23:15:55< silene> boucman: i have an infinite loop/black screen; could it be related to your latest changes or have i broken something?
20090320 23:16:48< boucman> Velory: looking into it
20090320 23:17:11< boucman> silene: probably not my latest change
20090320 23:17:39< Munk> so the schema is this right: http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/SoC_Ideas_Stats_Server
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20090320 23:19:59< silene> boucman: in display.cpp, someone is asking sdl_delay to wait for 463874608ms, no wonder the screen is black
20090320 23:20:28< voris> In reference to Turuk
20090320 23:20:29< Sapient> silene: ok, maybe we could have a utility method like get_children which returns an object that is essentially a wrapper for the config::const_child_itors, and understands methods such as size()
20090320 23:20:32< voris> ack
20090320 23:20:34< Crab_> boucman, see https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?13230
20090320 23:20:37< Turuk> ?
20090320 23:20:51< boucman> silene: wow
20090320 23:20:54< silene> Sapient: that's called config::child_count
20090320 23:20:55< voris> In reference to Turuk's note about making the wiki conform to 1.6... does that mean "development only" tags should go away?
20090320 23:20:59< boucman> where (what line
20090320 23:21:08< zookeeper> voris, yes
20090320 23:21:12< voris> Ok.
20090320 23:21:15< silene> boucman: line 1212
20090320 23:21:31< Sirp> okay I have to go....bye all
20090320 23:21:31-!- Sirp [n=me@wesnoth/developer/dave] has quit ["leaving"]
20090320 23:22:19< Sapient> ok, so I guess you don't see the utility of a wrapper object for child_ranges. I'll ponder it some more
20090320 23:22:21< boucman> silene: no, I still don't think it's related to my change
20090320 23:22:44< mordante> thanks for the info stikonas, did you also test tiny-gui?
20090320 23:25:18-!- Andylee [n=kvirc@188-23-13-205.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 23:25:28< Andylee> hi
20090320 23:25:34< Andylee> one short question:
20090320 23:25:47< YogiHH> hi Andylee 
20090320 23:25:53< boucman> Velory: got it working
20090320 23:26:02< boucman> Velory: debug_print(filter(my_units,index_of('poisoned',keys(states)) != -1))
20090320 23:26:29< Andylee> are there already aims defined for the next version (1.7, i am talking about main versions) and where can i find them?
20090320 23:26:37< boucman> Velory: try to do your formulas by progressively building around with debug_print
20090320 23:26:46< boucman> Andylee: not really
20090320 23:26:59< Andylee> except the somer of code ideas, that are really promising
20090320 23:27:03< Andylee> ah
20090320 23:27:05< Andylee> ok
20090320 23:27:29-!- stikonas [n=stikonas@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Read error: 60 (Operation timed out)]
20090320 23:27:38< YogiHH> Andylee, have you got something specific in mind?
20090320 23:28:40< Andylee> no, not really ;)
20090320 23:28:55< Andylee> so, it's about to become midnight down here
20090320 23:29:14< Andylee> have to go to bed, must get up at 4 o'clock
20090320 23:29:28< Velory> boucman: ok thanks :)
20090320 23:29:34< cjhopman> ilor: you know, i think you me and dragonking all are interested in the same project... :)
20090320 23:29:57< Andylee> thanks for your answers!
20090320 23:30:27< boucman> cjhopman: oh noes :(
20090320 23:31:01< ilor> cjhopman: everyone's pushing for hard WML hacking?
20090320 23:31:10-!- Andylee [n=kvirc@188-23-13-205.adsl.highway.telekom.at] has quit ["KVIrc 3.4.2 Shiny http://www.kvirc.net/"]
20090320 23:31:17< boucman> Crab_: ok, I will review your patch now (should be pretty fast)
20090320 23:31:25< Crab_> boucman: ok
20090320 23:31:38< mordante> what is the AI not sexy any more ;-) :-P
20090320 23:31:45< boucman> Crab_: note that there is patches.wesnoth.org for patches (not really important, but I can easily miss patches that are submited as bugs
20090320 23:32:05< cjhopman> ilor, yep
20090320 23:32:09< Crab_> boucman: ok.
20090320 23:32:17< mordante> best file a patch and refer to the bug it fixes
20090320 23:32:45< boucman> mordante: no bug in this case (it's an EasyCoding request)
20090320 23:32:47< Crab_> mordante: it's was 'patch before bug' situation :)
20090320 23:32:54-!- Blueblaze_ [n=Blueblaz@c-98-199-143-139.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 23:33:00< cjhopman> ilor: dragonking might be interested in some other stuff, too though
20090320 23:33:25< mordante> ah ok, well then for your patch of yesterday ;-)
20090320 23:34:04< ilor> cjhopman: then I only need to persuade you to find something else fun to do in Wesnoth ;)
20090320 23:35:10-!- stynx_ [n=stynx@dls.homelinux.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 23:36:14< cjhopman> ilor: and i, you
20090320 23:37:25< Sapient> heh, unless si13n3 or s4pi3n+ beats you to it ;)
20090320 23:37:44-!- BenUrban [n=benurban@c-68-49-10-243.hsd1.md.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 23:38:25< Sapient> looks like a large step forward has already begun for config optimization
20090320 23:38:31< ilor> yeah
20090320 23:38:56< happygrue> Ivanovic: any idea when the first 1.7 release will be?
20090320 23:38:57< mordante> indeed thanks silene for looking into the config class :-)
20090320 23:39:13< Sapient> if you finish your project I guess we could always give more work :)
20090320 23:39:21< Munk> Ok I'm gonna go. Thanks for the help!
20090320 23:39:35< mordante> bye Munk 
20090320 23:39:47-!- Munk [n=munkhsoy@CPE0015e91a861d-CM0019474d8044.cpe.net.cable.rogers.com] has quit []
20090320 23:39:48< mordante> Sapient, me? 
20090320 23:40:04< Sapient> no, I was talking about our slaves of code
20090320 23:40:16< mordante> ah those
20090320 23:40:24 * mordante hands Sapient the whip
20090320 23:40:29< mordante> ;-)
20090320 23:42:22< CIA-70> jhinrichs * r33946 /trunk/src/ai_village.cpp: Revert one of suokko's AI changes that was overlooked before.
20090320 23:42:30< Velory> mordante i updated my wiki page today btw
20090320 23:42:39< Velory> if u want to look again (just my idea)
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20090320 23:43:57< boucman> Velory: we'll review all pages at the end of the student meeting period, don't worry
20090320 23:44:05< mordante> YogiHH, and another one bites the dust ;-)
20090320 23:44:07< boucman> and we read some of these randomly before that
20090320 23:44:20< mordante> Velory, and also before to give more hints on improving the idea
20090320 23:44:26< ilor> mordante: I cringe whenever I see "suokko" in a commit message
20090320 23:44:29< YogiHH> mordante: yeah, hopefully the last one :-)
20090320 23:44:43< boucman> but we can't reread every changes you do, 
20090320 23:44:45< mordante> YogiHH, you reverted all of them? :-P
20090320 23:44:55< boucman> just let it mature a bit, refine your ideas....
20090320 23:45:04< mordante> ilor, I know the feeling
20090320 23:45:18< YogiHH> mordante: no, esr did that already ;-)
20090320 23:45:23-!- Sparks__ [n=Sparkste@78-105-212-150.zone3.bethere.co.uk] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 23:45:30< mordante> btw ilor you want to apply for Wesnoth this year or another project?
20090320 23:45:48< mordante> YogiHH, well you just proved he missed some ;-)
20090320 23:46:03< ilor> mordante: I'm looking at Wesnoth right now and trying to think of a project
20090320 23:46:29< CIA-70> jhinrichs * r33947 /branches/1.6/src/ai_village.cpp: Backport to 1.6: Revert one of suokko's AI changes that was overlooked before.
20090320 23:46:29< mordante> Velory, but first we'd like you to work a bit more on Wesnoth so you get more knowledge and improve your idea
20090320 23:46:32< ilor> mordante: apparently, config optimization is becoming popular so I'm looking at other stuff
20090320 23:46:55< Velory> Ok im trying
20090320 23:47:04< mordante> yes nothing happened since last year and now everybody starts to look into it ;-)
20090320 23:47:53< boucman> thespaceinvader: do we still need two size of portraits now that 1.6 is (almost) out ?
20090320 23:48:03< thespaceinvader> i;m not sure
20090320 23:48:05< thespaceinvader> i think so...
20090320 23:48:17< boucman> mordante: do we still need two size of portraits ?
20090320 23:48:19< thespaceinvader> mordante: do we still need the smaller help portrait?
20090320 23:48:39< thespaceinvader> certainly we still have them for units already committed
20090320 23:48:57< alink> <silene>  in display.cpp, someone is asking sdl_delay to wait for 463874608ms, no wonder the screen is black     
20090320 23:49:01< thespaceinvader> and for some portraits, it's better to have two, since there are some with different cropping to make them square for the help
20090320 23:49:06< mordante> boucman, thespaceinvader yes :-(
20090320 23:49:13< thespaceinvader> thoguht so
20090320 23:49:16< thespaceinvader> thanks for confirming
20090320 23:49:17< alink> silene ^ mmh I may know what is the problem
20090320 23:49:23< boucman> ok
20090320 23:49:32< mordante> alink, uninitialized variable?
20090320 23:49:33< Crab_> boucman, see http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/m7273d9a7
20090320 23:49:33< Crab_> i think it fixes a crash you were having in that 
20090320 23:49:36< boucman> alink: what is it ?
20090320 23:49:41< alink> mordante: almost 
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20090320 23:50:00< silene> alink: i'm interested; because i can't reproduce with trunk, but my local changes seem completely unrelated
20090320 23:50:06< alink> nextDraw_(0) is a bad initianlisation
20090320 23:50:34< alink> *initialisation
20090320 23:50:37-!- Turuk [n=Turuk@wesnoth/forumsith/turuk] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090320 23:50:52< boucman> Crab_: it's pretty late here, I won't have time to look into it, please attach the patch to bug 13229
20090320 23:51:02< boucman> thx a lot for the quick fix, though :)
20090320 23:51:27< Crab_> ok
20090320 23:51:32< alink> I think the problem comes from :  const int current_time = SDL_GetTicks(); 	const int wait_time = nextDraw_ - current_time;
20090320 23:52:40< Crab_> boucman, it just tried to dereference invalid memory location, in the pathologic case that a collection  contained 0 elements.
20090320 23:52:44 * YogiHH prepares for breaking trunk again. As he will carefully plan for it, this time it will be a controlled process ;-)
20090320 23:53:19 * mordante wonders why people need to prepare to break trunk, it's so easy to do :-P
20090320 23:53:39< Crab_> boucman, should I attach as a single patch (which includes all my other changes) ? or should I make a separate patch ?
20090320 23:54:09< alink> mmh or not. that olny gives big negative number and there is "if wait_time > 0" later
20090320 23:54:36< alink> *only
20090320 23:54:43< boucman> Crab_: please do a patch that only correct that bug, it easer to trace/revert if there is a problem
20090320 23:54:50< Crab_> ok
20090320 23:55:28< alink> silene: can tou reproduce it reliably ? and does it happen when a unit start to move ?
20090320 23:55:34< mordante> boucman, with the in hex change do you also look at the offset of the unit in the hex (eg castles)
20090320 23:55:41< alink> s/tou/you
20090320 23:55:45< boucman> mordante: yes
20090320 23:55:53< boucman> Crab_: debug_print(map(my_units,debug_float(loc,name))) :)
20090320 23:55:53< mordante> good
20090320 23:56:37< silene> alink: yes, it is reliable, i can't even start a single game
20090320 23:56:47< Crab_> boucman, he-he ) looks good )
20090320 23:56:50< boucman> mordante: 		bool in_hex = current_data.in_hex && r.x==xsrc && r.y==ysrc && r.w==disp->hex_size() && r.h==disp->hex_size();
20090320 23:57:11< alink> silene: so it happens even before a unit moves ? 
20090320 23:57:52< silene> alink: yes, it just can't display the game map; but i must have broken something somewhere; that's too strange
20090320 23:58:24-!- esr [n=chatzill@static-71-162-243-5.phlapa.fios.verizon.net] has quit ["ChatZilla 0.9.84 [Firefox 3.0.7/2009030423]"]
20090320 23:59:10< alink> ah cleaning that we must proably do anyways is to replace the nextDraw_(0) in display ctor by nextDraw_=SDL_GetTicks();
20090320 23:59:32< CIA-70> boucman * r33948 /trunk/ (changelog data/core/about.cfg src/formula_function.cpp): new formula function debug_float, will create a floating label with a text at a given location, usage is similar to debug_print. patch by Crab
20090320 23:59:43< boucman> Crab_: don't forget to mention that patch in your wiki page
20090320 23:59:55< Crab_> boucman: ok
--- Log closed Sat Mar 21 00:00:58 2009