--- Log opened Sun Apr 26 00:00:03 2009
20090426 00:03:01< silene> ilor: i don't think it is that unfair; we are aiming at being the best free game, so it makes sense to put things in perspective and to compare it with the best proprietary game; and i don't feel too bad seeing wesnoth at 1% of a game that has 12 millions regular customers
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20090426 00:09:12-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: accepted students for SoC: http://socghop.appspot.com/org/home/google/gsoc2009/wesnoth | 55 bugs, 235 feature requests, 11 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20090426 00:17:21< CIA-30> jhinrichs * r35220 /trunk/src/ (playcampaign.cpp savegame.cpp savegame.hpp): 
20090426 00:17:21< CIA-30> Savegame reorganization Step 1: Providing a simpler interface to saving and loading.
20090426 00:17:21< CIA-30> Refactor calling the start-of-scenario save and (hopefully) fix the broken compilation for TINY_GUI.
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20090426 00:40:04< CIA-30> ivanovic * r35222 /branches/1.6/po/wesnoth/sk.po: updated Slovak translation
20090426 00:40:04< CIA-30> ivanovic * r35221 /trunk/po/wesnoth/sk.po: updated Slovak translation
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20090426 00:46:55 * Shadow_Master tries to resume work on /src/storyscreen :[
20090426 00:47:16 * Polarina raises the jar of medicine.
20090426 00:47:34< Polarina> These will help you concentrate, Shadow_Master.
20090426 00:47:52-!- mode/#wesnoth-dev [+v Polarina] by ChanServ
20090426 00:47:57-!- mode/#wesnoth-dev [-v Polarina] by ChanServ
20090426 00:48:14< Shadow_Master> Polarina: it is making it worse actually
20090426 00:49:05 * Ivanovic helps you by going off to bed (so that i don't disturb you...)
20090426 00:49:07< Ivanovic> n8
20090426 00:51:10< Shadow_Master> wesbot: seen turuk
20090426 00:51:10< wesbot> Shadow_Master: The person with the nick Turuk last spoke 2d 4h ago.  1d 23h ago was here and on the channels #wesnoth and #wesnoth-umc-dev with the message:
20090426 00:51:13< Shadow_Master> :(
20090426 01:00:36< turin> zookeeper: update on Spacenoth forums, Zebulon has locked them, no more n00b-spamming there
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20090426 01:22:35< [Relic]> Hello :)
20090426 01:32:36< Shadow_Master> (: olleH
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20090426 01:39:59< zookeeper> turin, awesome, now i can stop checking them for new noob-posts once in a while ;)
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20090426 01:53:38< [Relic]> :)
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20090426 03:43:45< fendrin> hi
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20090426 04:36:09< CIA-30> ai0867 * r35223 /trunk/po/ (wesnoth-units/nl.po wesnoth-utbs/nl.po): Remove ^ comments from dutch translation.
20090426 04:38:41< CIA-30> ai0867 * r35224 /branches/1.6/po/ (wesnoth-units/nl.po wesnoth-utbs/nl.po): Remove ^ comments from dutch translation.
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20090426 05:02:13< CIA-30> ai0867 * r35225 /trunk/data/ (core/terrain-graphics.cfg core/terrain.cfg scenario-test.cfg): Wire in doofus's orcish villages for grassland.
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20090426 06:09:12-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: accepted students for SoC: http://socghop.appspot.com/org/home/google/gsoc2009/wesnoth | 56 bugs, 235 feature requests, 11 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20090426 07:35:41< ancestral> Player limit for a multiplayer game? 8?
20090426 07:46:11< ancestral> …
20090426 07:46:58-!- mordante [n=mordante@wesnoth/developer/mordante] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090426 07:47:13< mordante> hi
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20090426 07:54:05< mordante> ancestral, can you compile yourself?
20090426 07:54:17< ancestral> Hey
20090426 07:54:44< ancestral> I had some trouble last while building for Mac, but, I have a windows computer too. I'd give it another go
20090426 07:56:58< mordante> would be nice if you can try the latest trunk or 1.6 branch, I think silene fixed some or all of your font issues
20090426 07:57:04< ancestral> Sweetness
20090426 07:57:50< mordante> seems to be a default setting got changed with a new pango setting so he ran into the problem on Linux as well
20090426 07:59:04< ancestral> Let me try building then
20090426 07:59:47< mordante> thanks
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20090426 08:15:24< ancestral> checkout done, now the tricky part
20090426 08:17:33-!- Sirp [n=me@wesnoth/developer/dave] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090426 08:22:31< ancestral> If I'm not successful I might need to pm penguin (I feel like I ought to know how to build Wesnoth on my own, useful thing to be able to do)
20090426 08:30:59< ancestral> Should I avoid SDL 1.3?
20090426 08:38:49< ancestral> Any thoughts?
20090426 08:40:04-!- silene [n=silene@ASte-Genev-Bois-152-1-102-31.w86-203.abo.wanadoo.fr] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090426 08:42:00< silene> hi
20090426 08:45:09< mordante> hi silene 
20090426 08:45:27< mordante> ancestral, yes avoid SDL 1.3 it's not compatible with 1.2
20090426 08:45:47< ancestral> mordante: slick, thanks
20090426 08:46:23< silene> mordante: did you see the message i posted just after you left yesterday? i'm concerned we are sending to pango_font_description_set_family, which would explain why ancestral can't switch to gentium
20090426 08:46:49< silene> sending crap to*
20090426 08:46:55< mordante> silene, yes I saw it, not sure whether it's really a problem
20090426 08:47:20< mordante> unfortunately pango only has a reference manual and no nice tutorial :-(
20090426 08:47:31< silene> mordante: it's a problem in the sense that pango will always the default system font, it won't switch to a the wesnoth one
20090426 08:52:21< silene> i have tried to come with a way to get pango to display the font files used, but the interface is just too complicated
20090426 08:53:45< mordante> yes I also noticed that and a nice tutorial would be welcome
20090426 08:54:10< mordante> since the change did seem to work for me I thought it was oke, will do a short test later
20090426 08:59:06< silene> mordante: my intuition for saying that it doesn't work as exepected is that, if i change the family to "crap" (verbatim), it looks exactly the same ;-)
20090426 08:59:35< mordante> well I recall testing that it looked bad and after adding that line it looked good
20090426 08:59:48< mordante> but I'm recompiling now so will test afterwards
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20090426 09:21:07< silene> mordante: i confirm, at least here, pango is using a system font (namely DejaVuSans-Bold.ttf) instead of wesnoth one, even if i ask for the "crap" family or the "" one; if i ask for the NULL family, i get the Serif one, which is probably why adding the line improved the situation for you
20090426 09:22:08< mordante> ok 
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20090426 09:29:24< YogiHH> mordante: awake?
20090426 09:29:29< mordante> YogiHH, yes
20090426 09:29:46< YogiHH> mordante: can you check TINY_GUI compilation, please?
20090426 09:30:19< mordante> YogiHH, it compiled yesterday, can test later today doing some other rebuilds at the moment
20090426 09:30:35< YogiHH> mordante: yesterday at what time?
20090426 09:30:48< mordante> in the afternoon
20090426 09:31:13< YogiHH> hmm, weird, that was before my fix. I could bet it did not compile before that.
20090426 09:31:49< mordante> odd it compiled for me 
20090426 09:32:07< YogiHH> well, i didn't try :-)
20090426 09:32:15< mordante> :-)
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20090426 10:12:48< CIA-30> silene * r35226 /trunk/ (data/core/fonts.cfg src/font.cpp src/font.hpp src/text.cpp): Fixed improper families passed to Pango. (Bug #13399)
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20090426 10:15:50< Ivanovic> moin
20090426 10:16:03< mordante> hi Ivanovic 
20090426 10:16:21< Ivanovic> silene, mordante: we currently have two fonts.cfg files, which one is the "real" one or are currently both used?
20090426 10:16:38< Ivanovic> one is data/core/fonts.cfg, the other is data/hardwired/fonts.cfg
20090426 10:16:49< Ivanovic> would be nice if the "depricated" one would be removed
20090426 10:17:17< mordante> Ivanovic, I think I asked about that before :-/
20090426 10:18:12< silene> hmm... i guess i modified the wrong one, actually
20090426 10:18:29< Ivanovic> silene: might be
20090426 10:18:43< Ivanovic> at least in the sources the one in hardwired is referenced
20090426 10:19:10< silene> how come we got two in the first place?
20090426 10:19:16< Ivanovic> no idea
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20090426 10:21:18< silene> i will remove core/fonts.cfg
20090426 10:22:05< Ivanovic> first diff the two please to be sure they are identical (they should be)
20090426 10:22:36< Ivanovic> and change the reference in data/core/_main.cfg to include the font file in hardwired
20090426 10:23:10< silene> Ivanovic: no, i will simply remove the reference
20090426 10:23:26< Ivanovic> okay, even better if it is not required
20090426 10:30:26< CIA-30> silene * r35227 /trunk/data/ (core/_main.cfg core/fonts.cfg hardwired/fonts.cfg): Removed redundant unused file.
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20090426 10:38:50< CIA-30> silene * r35228 /branches/1.6/ (6 files in 3 dirs): 
20090426 10:38:50< CIA-30> Backport of revisions 35226 and 35227. (Bug #13399)
20090426 10:38:50< CIA-30> Fixed improper families passed to Pango.
20090426 10:38:50< CIA-30> Removed redundant unused file.
20090426 10:39:52< silene> Ivanovic: it adds a new translatable string to 1.6, but even if it stays untranslated, it will be an improvement
20090426 10:43:04< mordante> silene, regarding your change does it also still work for SDL_TTF ?
20090426 10:43:22< mordante> don't we need to old values for SDL_TTF and the new ones for pango?
20090426 10:43:35< silene> mordante: sdl_ttf is not changed, it still uses the "order" field
20090426 10:44:25< mordante> ok
20090426 10:44:41< Ivanovic> silene: add it
20090426 10:44:50< Ivanovic> i will run a pot-update this afternoon anyway
20090426 10:45:16< Ivanovic> (some other things led to string changes, too)
20090426 10:45:43< silene> Ivanovic: already done, or do you want me to do something else?
20090426 10:45:52< Ivanovic> no, it's fine
20090426 10:48:22< silene> mordante: that being said, i hope you quickly finish gui2, so that we can get rid of sdl_ttf :-)
20090426 10:48:44< mordante> me too, but I still have a lot to do
20090426 10:49:24< mordante> btw we still wanted to look allowing lua to use user defined dialogs
20090426 10:49:33< mordante> when do you want to look at it?
20090426 10:51:07< silene> whenever you want; now that my papers and book are finally sent to the editors, i have a lot more free time
20090426 10:51:34< mordante> what kind of book did you write?
20090426 10:52:15-!- YogiHH [n=chatzill@80.171.53.220] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090426 10:52:17< silene> a handbook on floating-point arithmetic
20090426 10:58:33< mordante> interesting subject
20090426 10:59:34< mordante> I think I want to look at the lua later I want to have the layout algorithm rewritten and so kind of tabs enabled before gsoc really starts
20090426 11:00:03< mordante> after that I have no more critical things left
20090426 11:01:04< zookeeper> jetryl's new orcish leader sprites made me think of just bumping the whole line one level up higher, so leader lvl2, ruler lvl3 and sovereign lvl4
20090426 11:01:24< zookeeper> i'm not sure how good an idea that would be.
20090426 11:03:02< silene> mordante: do you intend to do something about the fill_window_types function? this is kind of a showstopper
20090426 11:03:42< mordante> silene, what do you mean with fill_window_types function?
20090426 11:04:15< silene> mordante: i mean that all the windows are hardcoded; unless i missed something, it makes it hard for a script to define a new window
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20090426 11:05:28< mordante> silene, they're hardcoded for the theme engine, but the new lua windows shouldn't have to take that in account
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20090426 11:06:19< mordante> silene, they need to register them my an id, but I want to give them an automatic pre or suffix so they won't clash with engine defined ids
20090426 11:06:26< mordante> s/my/by/
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20090426 11:08:45< mordante> Ivanovic, foo.wesnoth.org seems no longer to work but www.wesnoth.org/foo does
20090426 11:09:30< silene> mordante: sure, but it's not id conflict i was worried about; it's more that the current scheme is inherently static, there is no interface to deal with dynamic windows with limited lifetime (windows can't stay alive past the end of a scenario for instance)
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20090426 11:10:13< mordante> windows or window definitions?
20090426 11:11:19< silene> mordante: both, you don't want to have a window definition still around after its user disappeared
20090426 11:12:02< silene> for instance, it doesn't make sense to have campaign-specific window definitions visible from other campaigns
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20090426 11:13:09< mordante> silene, true but that's why I wanted to use the onload event to load the definitions and of course we can auto clear them before loading or going to the main menu
20090426 11:14:09< Ivanovic> mordante: there are no auto redirects of foo.wesnoth.org to www.wesnoth.org/foo
20090426 11:14:34< Ivanovic> foo.wesnoth.org is *the same* as www.wesnoth.org or wesnoth.org unless we specify a redirect
20090426 11:14:36< mordante> Ivanovic, eg wiki.wesnoth.org fails but www.wesnoth.org/wiki works
20090426 11:15:05< Ivanovic> Rhonda: around?
20090426 11:15:21< Ivanovic> mordante: short guess, the redirects are borken somehow
20090426 11:15:43< mordante> I guess so too, but I thought you could fix that as well ;-)
20090426 11:17:59< Ivanovic> hmm, looks like only wiki related redirects are broken
20090426 11:20:25< Ivanovic> uhm, wiki.wesnoth.org works here
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20090426 11:21:10< mordante> forum and devdocs suddenly started to work again as well :-)
20090426 11:21:12< Ivanovic> mordante: do you have some examples that don't work?
20090426 11:21:21< mordante> not anymore ;-)
20090426 11:21:34< Ivanovic> okay, so someone probably "did something" to the server...
20090426 11:23:32< mordante> I just wanted to check the files page of devdocs to see whether it updated correctly and it did :-)
20090426 11:26:01< CIA-30> silene * r35229 /trunk/src/font.cpp: Removed redundant path spearator.
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20090426 11:34:20< Rhonda> Ivanovic: Only partly.
20090426 11:35:16< Ivanovic> Rhonda: you seem to not be needed, the problem somehow solved itself/was solved...
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20090426 11:41:10< Crab_> hi
20090426 11:41:38< CIA-30> ivanovic * r35230 /branches/1.6/ (283 files in 25 dirs): 
20090426 11:41:38< CIA-30> pot-update (several string changes in wesnoth, wesnoth-editor and wesnoth-sof)
20090426 11:41:38< CIA-30> regenerated doc files
20090426 11:46:32< CIA-30> ivanovic * r35231 /trunk/ (330 files in 23 dirs): 
20090426 11:46:32< CIA-30> pot-update
20090426 11:46:32< CIA-30> regenerated doc files
20090426 11:52:20< YogiHH> ho Gallifax :-)
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20090426 12:03:15< ilor> YogiHH: tell me, do you get a load of '[Loaded|Unlodaded] libpng12-0.dll' messages in the output window when running wesnoth under msvc?
20090426 12:06:48< YogiHH> ilor: yes, i do
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20090426 12:07:56< euschn> good morning
20090426 12:08:08< euschn> YogiHH: thanks for your comments, I will get to answer them straigth away
20090426 12:08:12< YogiHH> hi euschn
20090426 12:08:28< euschn> in short: I think my implementation is correct on 1 and 2, and I agree on 3. and 4.
20090426 12:08:29< YogiHH> ok
20090426 12:09:12-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: accepted students for SoC: http://socghop.appspot.com/org/home/google/gsoc2009/wesnoth | 55 bugs, 235 feature requests, 11 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20090426 12:13:17< ilor> YogiHH: I wonder if liadinga nd unloading the same 128k dll a thousand times can have a, uh, effect on the performance
20090426 12:13:24< ilor> *if loading
20090426 12:15:12< YogiHH> ilor: no idea, it might be cached by windows, i am not familiar with the mechanisms of that
20090426 12:15:46< ilor> well my msvc build always seem a bit sluggish-er than the mingw ones
20090426 12:16:33< CIA-30> mordante * r35232 /trunk/Doxyfile: Add two recently added subdirectories.
20090426 12:17:42< silene> ilor: not much, the dll format is trivial (dlls are not linked on the fly, each function call goes through an additional indirection and this indirection is hardcoded in the application), so this is just a matter of putting the dll in the address space of the application and removing it
20090426 12:18:59< ilor> silene, YogiHH: http://www.nabble.com/Submission:-IMG_Init-and-IMG_Quit-for-faster-loading-td22915075.html
20090426 12:19:17< silene> still, it's surprising it gets load/unload; you may want to add a dummy reference to the dll in the code, so that it stays forcefully loaded
20090426 12:19:50< ilor> it's apparently a SDL_Image issue
20090426 12:23:38< CIA-30> mordante * r35233 /trunk/src/gui/ (3 files in 2 dirs): 
20090426 12:23:38< CIA-30> Add some layout exceptions.
20090426 12:23:38< CIA-30> These exceptions have been described in the algorithm and the scrollbar
20090426 12:23:38< CIA-30> container throws the exception when needed. The codepath doing so hasn't been
20090426 12:23:38< CIA-30> implemented yet.
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20090426 12:32:52< YogiHH> afk
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20090426 12:35:45< ilor> bbl
20090426 12:38:51< euschn> YogiHH: https://gna.org/bugs/?13268#comment4
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20090426 14:29:29< Chusslove> Ivanovic: Given another week and those few modified changes, do ignore my last night's update for sr. I'll send new one in the meantime.
20090426 14:29:44< Ivanovic> uhm, okay
20090426 14:29:52< Ivanovic> just wanted to commit it...
20090426 14:30:09< Ivanovic> or shall i commit and you fetch the fresh files?
20090426 14:31:01< Ivanovic> (this is what i would recommend, since this way they are well merged
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20090426 14:48:48< Ivanovic> Chusslove: around?
20090426 14:48:58< Chusslove> Ivanovic: Yep.
20090426 14:49:00< Ivanovic> so you want me to commit your update, or should i compeltely omit it?
20090426 14:49:15< Chusslove> Ivanovic: Completely omit it.
20090426 14:49:19< Ivanovic> this way you at least have updated files taht you can directly use
20090426 14:49:21< Ivanovic> okay
20090426 15:00:50< YogiHH> euschn: https://gna.org/bugs/index.php#comment5
20090426 15:10:59-!- Pietro_S [n=sobotkap@tom.bn-ulm.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090426 15:11:28< Pietro_S> hello, is it normal that wesnoth binary has size 262MB ?
20090426 15:13:00< Pietro_S> I build it with scons, just to mention ;-)
20090426 15:14:44< CIA-30> jhinrichs * r35234 /trunk/src/savegame.cpp: 
20090426 15:14:44< CIA-30> Savegame reorganization Step 1: Providing a simpler interface to saving and loading.
20090426 15:14:44< CIA-30> Reduce dependencies for savegame.cpp.
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20090426 15:16:21< silene> Pietro_S: it is a bit big; is it statically linked?
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20090426 15:19:36< Pietro_S> silene: looks like it's wesnoth statically linked as ldd doesn't show any wesnoth library :-(
20090426 15:20:04< loonycyborg> That size is normal if you build with debugging symbols.
20090426 15:20:43< silene> loonycyborg: no, it isn't, even with debugging symbols, it shouldn't be more than 100MB
20090426 15:22:06< loonycyborg> It's 182 Mb for me.
20090426 15:22:25< loonycyborg> And Pietro_S is using Solaris AFAIK.
20090426 15:22:28< Polarina> Mine's 9 MiB.
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20090426 15:24:22< silene> loonycyborg: just to be sure, does ldd really says this is not a static build? (my binary has 53 dynamic dependencies, debugging symbols, and its size is 70MB)
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20090426 15:25:46< Polarina> silene: 55 dynamic dependencies here.
20090426 15:26:03< loonycyborg> silene: ldd definitely lists a lot of dependencies for me.
20090426 15:26:18< silene> loonycyborg: how many?
20090426 15:26:34< loonycyborg> 70
20090426 15:26:50< Polarina> loonycyborg: Trunk?
20090426 15:26:54< Pietro_S> I have debuging symbols and 44 libs to link with
20090426 15:27:10< loonycyborg> Polarina: Yes.
20090426 15:27:34< Polarina> Oh.. I checked with branches/1.6
20090426 15:27:53< loonycyborg> http://rafb.net/p/N2v7fr23.html
20090426 15:28:46< silene> loonycyborg: what kind of build is that? why are you linked to mysql and openssl?
20090426 15:28:48< Polarina> loonycyborg: Proprietary dependencies! :O
20090426 15:30:22< loonycyborg> forum_user_handler requires that.
20090426 15:32:12< silene> loonycyborg: i'm still confused, forum_user_handler is supposed to be in the server; why does it appears in your client?
20090426 15:35:09< loonycyborg> Because -lmysqlclient is passed to all programs.
20090426 15:35:41< loonycyborg> -Wl,--as-needed should prevent extra dependencies, but looks like it doesn't :/
20090426 15:43:12< silene> loonycyborg: -Wl,--as-needed doesn't prevent extra dependencies from being linked in, it only says to the dynamic linker that libraries that are not immediately needed can be loaded lazily
20090426 15:44:08< loonycyborg> Understood.
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20090426 16:09:39< Polarina> Ivanovic: I sent you updated translation.
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20090426 17:00:33< Polarina> Everyone dead?
20090426 17:03:29-!- Gauteamus [n=chatzill@c43C4BF51.dhcp.bluecom.no] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090426 17:04:38< Gauteamus> In 1.6a, when in a team-game one leader dies, the remaining units of that side can sit on allied villages without capturing the village
20090426 17:04:47< Gauteamus> is this bug or feature?
20090426 17:06:33< mordante> Polarina, yes and we soon return as zombies ;-)
20090426 17:07:46< mordante> Gauteamus, I'd say yes, IMO you should capture the village directly when the leader dies
20090426 17:07:57< silene> Gauteamus: they wouldn't capture the village since they are leaderless; did you mean "without removing the flag"?
20090426 17:08:22< Gauteamus> yes, I mean remove the flag and allied side loose income
20090426 17:08:58< Gauteamus> actually, this "bug report" is woefully shortcoming
20090426 17:09:05< mordante> I thought you meant when you are on a village of an allied team (but of course you still directly capture it :-/ )
20090426 17:09:23< Gauteamus> I do not know if allied side looses income or not, but at least the flag stay put
20090426 17:10:07< silene> Gauteamus: i would consider it a bug, but i can't tell for sure there was a time when it worked differently
20090426 17:11:08< Gauteamus> I will do another test and see where the gold really goes
20090426 17:14:40< silene> Gauteamus: don't bother, it most certainly does not
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20090426 17:19:39< Gauteamus> Ok, when the leaderless unit enter the allied village, the ally keeps the income, but the leaderless gets healed. On the other hand leaderless units can capture enemy villages to make them unowned.
20090426 17:23:01< Polarina> Gauteamus: Please upgarde to 1.6.1
20090426 17:26:29< Gauteamus> Polarina: ok, thanks *up as a lion, down as a wet hide*
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20090426 18:09:12-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: accepted students for SoC: http://socghop.appspot.com/org/home/google/gsoc2009/wesnoth | 56 bugs, 235 feature requests, 11 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20090426 18:15:18< CIA-30> silene * r35235 /trunk/Doxyfile: Added missing directory. Removed obsolete variable.
20090426 18:15:25< CIA-30> silene * r35236 /trunk/ (29 files in 4 dirs): Fixed source documentation.
20090426 18:25:17< mordante> silene, for which version of doxygen is that variable obsolete?
20090426 18:27:27< silene> it has been obsolete for a long time (it didn't do anything), but now doxygen starts to complain loudly; my version is 1.5.8
20090426 18:28:04< Polarina> ssh root@::1
20090426 18:28:15< mordante> ok since my version 1.5.6, which is also used on the server didn't complain about it
20090426 18:28:22< mordante> Polarina, wrong terminal ;-)
20090426 18:28:29< Polarina> mordante: O'rly?
20090426 18:28:45< mordante> Polarina, maybe
20090426 18:28:58< CIA-30> ivanovic * r35237 /trunk/po/ (17 files in 17 dirs): updated Icelandic translation
20090426 18:29:02< CIA-30> ivanovic * r35238 /branches/1.6/po/ (17 files in 17 dirs): updated Icelandic translation
20090426 18:29:04< Polarina> Yay! :D
20090426 18:29:18< silene> mordante: according to the changelog, it was removed in 1.5.7
20090426 18:29:52< mordante> which means it's not obsolete for the server yet
20090426 18:30:50< silene> mordante: yes, that's why you didn't get error message; but that doesn't make useful either; or does the server complain about it missing?
20090426 18:32:21< mordante> I'll run it after my compilation finished
20090426 18:33:25< Polarina> Icelandic is now in the 30th place. :D
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20090426 18:42:50< CIA-30> mordante * r35239 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/ (scrollbar_container.cpp window_builder.cpp): 
20090426 18:42:50< CIA-30> Changed some listbox defaults.
20090426 18:42:50< CIA-30> This will be tuned more later on for now try to be a bit more sane in
20090426 18:42:50< CIA-30> the defaults.
20090426 18:43:01< CIA-30> mordante * r35240 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/scrollbar_container.cpp: Fix some horizontal and vertical mixups.
20090426 18:43:06< CIA-30> mordante * r35241 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/scrollbar_container.cpp: 
20090426 18:43:06< CIA-30> Fixed several minor issues with the scrollbars.
20090426 18:43:06< CIA-30> The new algorithm now correctly seems to work with the vertical
20090426 18:43:06< CIA-30> scrollbar in the several modes. (The algorithm will be committed next.)
20090426 18:43:10< CIA-30> mordante * r35242 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/ (grid.cpp grid.hpp grid_private.hpp): 
20090426 18:43:10< CIA-30> Implement the grid height reduction algorithm.
20090426 18:43:11< CIA-30> Only implements the algorithm partly, the forcing of reduction hasn't
20090426 18:43:13< CIA-30> been done yet.
20090426 18:53:08< mordante> silene, I see no warning at 1.5.6
20090426 18:53:15< silene> great
20090426 18:53:17< benetnash> hi! where goes output from debug_print('xxx') from fai? before it fas in domain formula_ai, now it's not in ai/formula_ai
20090426 18:55:12< silene> benetnash: you may try the scripting/formula domain which Crab added yesterday
20090426 18:55:51< benetnash> works, thx
20090426 18:58:13< benetnash> oh f**k, in script script foo(x,x) where x = bar() x can take two different values...
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20090426 19:24:22< benetnash> hi! some time ago you argued with me, that AI should be as deterministic as possible
20090426 19:24:43< benetnash> well, comparing of pointers values for ordering callables is as much undeterministic as possible ;)
20090426 19:25:03< Polarina> O'rly?
20090426 19:26:05< Polarina> What happened to the "Great War" multiplayer era?
20090426 19:26:29< zookeeper> it was removed
20090426 19:26:47< Polarina> zookeeper: Which revision?
20090426 19:26:49< mordante> benetnash, yes it should be 
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20090426 19:29:09< benetnash> mordante: thats why my formula AI script is not working, I have move(m.src, m.dst) where m = choose_move() and when there are several good moves m.src could be from other move then m.dst
20090426 19:29:53< benetnash> i.e. method tomap can return list of elements in different order so even head(tomap(xxx)) is not deterministic in some cases
20090426 19:30:04< Polarina> zookeeper: Why was it removed?
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20090426 19:32:35< CIA-30> alink * r35243 /trunk/changelog: update changelog
20090426 19:34:53< mordante> benetnash, and the order of items in choose_move is not deterministic ?
20090426 19:37:05< benetnash> mordante: no, choose_move returns move moving first unit on village or first possible move if all villages are occupied
20090426 19:38:10< silene> benetnash: if someone is doing pointer comparisons in the ai, please fix it or fill a bug report, this is bad
20090426 19:38:15< benetnash> mordante: choose_move is choose(map(tomap(my_moves.moves, is_village(ai.map, m.dst)), 'm', m.value)
20090426 19:38:17< mordante> but if I call it two times under the same circumstances, can it return different results?
20090426 19:40:24< benetnash> if program, i.e. during map() method makes copies of objects it can put them in different places in memory. I don't know exactly how memoy management works, but assumption that it's deterministic is IMO wrong.
20090426 19:41:10< benetnash> in formula_callable.hpp in line 82 is method for comparing variants
20090426 19:41:28< CIA-30> silene * r35244 /trunk/src/ (7 files in 3 dirs): Converted documentation to doxygen or fixed it.
20090426 19:41:37< benetnash> it's compasrion of pointers
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20090426 19:42:08< mordante> ah ok, then it's indeed random and like silene sad a bad idea
20090426 19:42:35< mordante> said*
20090426 19:43:22< mordante> and having the engine not deterministic is also bad, good catch benetnash 
20090426 19:43:24< benetnash> try in game in fai console write: debug_print(tomap(my_moves.moves))
20090426 19:43:36< benetnash> the result is different every time
20090426 19:45:11< benetnash> I'll send bug report
20090426 19:47:47< mordante> I've to many moves here to reproduce it, but I trust you
20090426 19:49:05< benetnash> mordante: just see that every result is differently formatted of first entry is sometimes different ;)
20090426 19:49:46< mordante> I can only see one entry, but I'll try with two wesnoths
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20090426 19:52:48< mordante> benetnash, confirmed I can see it now as well
20090426 19:54:28< benetnash> mordante: I can write patch partially solving problem - implementing do_compare() methods for attacks and move will make tomap(my_moves.moves) and tomap(my_attacks.attacks) stable
20090426 19:55:37< mordante> we always love patches :-) best post them at patches.wesnoth.org and refer to the bug, that way the patch gets noticed
20090426 19:56:01< benetnash> ok, I need this to be fixed asap, so I'll post it in a while
20090426 19:56:19< mordante> you know who wrote the original function?
20090426 19:57:45< mordante> I guess it was Sirp 
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20090426 19:58:10< benetnash> mordante: sorry, no idea
20090426 19:58:36< mordante> Sirp, starting about half an hour ago benetnash found some issues with the tomap formula. Did you write it?
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20090426 20:00:19< mordante> silene, regarding fixing doxygen issues, could you try not to touch files in gui/widgets/*? I still have some uncommitted patches there
20090426 20:00:53< silene> mordante: okay
20090426 20:00:58< mordante> thanks
20090426 20:02:07< mordante> Reisiger, regarding https://gna.org/bugs/?13420 does it only happen in trunk or also in 1.6?
20090426 20:02:51< Reisiger> So far have tested only trunk. I got a 1.61 release installed. Will test the savegame there
20090426 20:06:21< mordante> ok, since for trunk I'm rewriting the code entirely, which won't be done for 1.6
20090426 20:10:05< zookeeper> Polarina, it was removed because it sucked and was very pointless? :p
20090426 20:10:07< Reisiger> mordante: Can't load the savegame. 1.6.1 release crashes when I try to
20090426 20:10:18< Polarina> zookeeper: Ok.
20090426 20:11:02< mordante> Reisiger, ok, then I just have a look and guess whether it's also 1.6
20090426 20:11:27 * Polarina wonders what key size people use for their SSH keys.
20090426 20:12:37< mordante> afk
20090426 20:14:00< benetnash> Polarina: default
20090426 20:14:30< Polarina> benetnash: 2048-bits?
20090426 20:16:26< benetnash> Polarina: I created it 10 years ago and then 1024 was default afair
20090426 20:22:06< Polarina> I see.
20090426 20:22:46< Polarina> benetnash: So your key is 1024-bit long?
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20090426 20:32:00< benetnash> Polarina: yes, I don't know how to check it but I generated new 2048 bits key and it's file is two times larger then my key
20090426 20:38:02< Polarina> I'd recommend a 8192-bit key.
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20090426 20:43:01< benetnash> Polarina: thx. Anyway I have to create dwo new keys - one for work and one for private use. Now I'm using the same key everywhere and it's very unsafe
20090426 20:44:12< Polarina> It's not unsafe to use the same key over and over.
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20090426 20:49:44< benetnash> Polarina: but if I use this key with agent on some unsafe machine (i.e. servers iat my uni, I don't trust them) someone may log into hi-security servers in my work. I know that I can disable ssh-agent but imo it's better to use separated keys
20090426 20:50:16< benetnash> mordante: I submitted patch, it includes two new methods
20090426 20:50:35< Polarina> benetnash: I'd just keep the private key to myself.
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20090426 21:01:31< silene> benetnash: please add a compare method to map_location and use it to simplify your code
20090426 21:02:16< benetnash> silene: ok
20090426 21:04:31< silene> benetnash: and use doxygen comments for your two new methods, something like /** Deterministically compares attacks. */
20090426 21:04:47< benetnash> silene: ack
20090426 21:06:38< Polarina> Why not add some randomness into the AI?
20090426 21:07:15< silene> Polarina: because it is not worth not being able to reproduce bugs
20090426 21:07:37< Polarina> silene: Then make the random seed accessable by a debug command.
20090426 21:07:49< benetnash> Polarina: because with nodeterminictic compare move(a.src, a.dst) where a = choose_move doesn't work
20090426 21:08:35< silene> benetnash: just in case you don't know this idiom, once you have your compare method, you can use it like that: if (int cmp = move_from_.compare(other_from)) return cmp; if (int cmp = ...
20090426 21:08:58< silene> Polarina: here what are talking about randomness which is not even related to the random generator
20090426 21:09:15< Polarina> silene: Ah, I see.
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20090426 21:10:29< benetnash> silene: I'm never sure if -1 is true or false in C++ so I avoid such constructions
20090426 21:10:44< Polarina> benetnash: It's true.
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20090426 21:10:48< silene> benetnash: 0 is false, everything else is true
20090426 21:12:52< benetnash> silene: ok, so I'll use your perl-like code ;)
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20090426 21:24:06< Shadow_Master> so, the dissappearing-unit-images bug has been fixed in 1.6.1+svn?
20090426 21:24:28< Shadow_Master> the bug report doesn't mention the SVN revision in which it was fixed (shame on you Ivanovic)
20090426 21:25:04 * Polarina opens eyes.
20090426 21:33:54< benetnash> silene: I posted new version of patch to gna.
20090426 21:37:57< silene> benetnash: seems good, i will wait till tomorrow evening in case someone that knows formula ai better has comments, otherwise i will commit it then
20090426 21:47:56< benetnash> silene: sure
20090426 21:49:26< mordante> thanks for the patches benetnash 
20090426 21:50:32< benetnash> np, it's my diploma work. I've got just two months left, so I don't have time to wait for someone to fix this bugs ;)
20090426 21:50:44< mordante> :-)
20090426 21:51:10< mordante> you use Wesnoth for a diploma project?
20090426 21:51:35< benetnash> yes, I evolve AI using coevolution
20090426 21:51:58< mordante> sounds interesting
20090426 21:52:53< benetnash> I hope my AI will be better then default, but wesnoth is rather tool, My job is to test different approaches to coevolution.
20090426 21:53:31< benetnash> unfortunately my english is to weak to write paper in it, so I won't show you final work, just same AI ;)
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20090426 21:58:11< mordante> you're going to write it with the formula AI?
20090426 22:02:00< benetnash> mordante: yes. I planned to do it in python but you removed it.
20090426 22:03:21< benetnash> I thonk Formula AI is very good designed, I already have everything prepared and I want to start with experiment in several days
20090426 22:03:28< benetnash> *think
20090426 22:04:30< mordante> yeah python had security issues and they're hard to fix since it's not intended to be embedded
20090426 22:05:01< mordante> but good to hear FAI also works for you
20090426 22:05:18< loonycyborg> Incorrect. Python is intended to be embedded but not sandboxed.
20090426 22:05:58< mordante> yeah I meant sandboxed 
20090426 22:06:32< benetnash> time to bed, cu
20090426 22:07:21< mordante> night benetnash 
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20090426 22:26:37< CIA-30> mordante * r35245 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/scrollbar_container.cpp: 
20090426 22:26:37< CIA-30> Fix a reinitialization bug.
20090426 22:26:37< CIA-30> When reinitialization the scrollbar mode is not correctly set due to the
20090426 22:26:37< CIA-30> old, soon to be obsoleted, variable. So set it to fix the bug.
20090426 22:26:51< CIA-30> mordante * r35246 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/window.cpp: Relayout a window when the width has been modified.
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20090426 22:41:11-!- gnutoo_ is now known as GNUtoo
20090426 22:41:27< mordante> YogiHH tiny still compiles for me :-)
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20090426 23:03:42< mordante> I'm off night
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20090426 23:18:35< Shadow_Master> esr: are you there?
20090426 23:19:10< Shadow_Master> >:(
20090426 23:19:34< CIA-30> shadowmaster * r35247 /trunk/data/tools/wmllint: 
20090426 23:19:34< CIA-30> wmllint is generating invalid WML for the ".stoned" and "[unstone]"
20090426 23:19:34< CIA-30> replacements (namely, it generates "petrified" and "[unpetrifyx]"
20090426 23:19:34< CIA-30> instead of ".petrified" and "[unpetrify]".
20090426 23:19:34< CIA-30> This commit fixes that.
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20090426 23:21:22-!- gnutoo_ is now known as GNUtoo
20090426 23:23:13< CIA-30> shadowmaster * r35248 /trunk/changelog: 
20090426 23:23:13< CIA-30> ESR didn't edit the changelogs consistently for r34747, leaving an entry
20090426 23:23:13< CIA-30> in players_changelog not in changelog, and thus not mentioning either
20090426 23:23:13< CIA-30> that the change affects WML authors (yes, we the few people who don't
20090426 23:23:13< CIA-30> use wmllint can be that dumb, mind you).
20090426 23:27:05< Shadow_Master> I hope nobody runs wmllint without the -d flag and/or checking the diffs
20090426 23:30:25< CIA-30> ivanovic * r35249 /trunk/po/ (14 files in 7 dirs): updated Serbian translation
20090426 23:30:29< CIA-30> ivanovic * r35250 /branches/1.6/ (16 files in 8 dirs): updated Serbian translation
20090426 23:36:15< Shadow_Master> interesting that after three weeks, I git svn rebase and immediately notice a killer bug... not even in the game engine
20090426 23:36:32< Shadow_Master> I guess I don't want to play Wesnoth for some years
20090426 23:42:56< Polarina> Shadow_Master: :(
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--- Log closed Mon Apr 27 00:00:11 2009