--- Log opened Mon Jun 08 00:00:50 2009
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20090608 00:50:26< esr> Jetrel: Still there?
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20090608 01:16:38< AI0867> wesbot: topic
20090608 01:16:40-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 62 bugs, 243 feature requests, 13 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20090608 01:49:50< Jetrel> esr: I'm back now
20090608 01:50:00 * Jetrel is grabbing coffee really quick, though
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20090608 01:59:07< esr> Jetrel: See http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/Barbarians
20090608 01:59:11< corn__> hey guys, can I get the dev cloak again? 'corn' was taken when I registered
20090608 02:02:35< Jetrel> esr:  yeah; I'm interested in doing two of those lines; the infantry and the cavalry
20090608 02:03:25< esr> Jetrel: You were talking about axes, but I think in this game axes get to be a dwarf trademark.
20090608 02:03:31< Jetrel> I'd actually advise against doing the archer, because it's really redundant with the poacher line - one of the reasons we'd moved the poacher line to not being an outlaw, and being a generic woodsman instead, was to make it useable for precisely this.
20090608 02:04:32< Jetrel> esr:  Okay, I suppose that could work.
20090608 02:05:52< esr> The poachers are night-fighters.  I was probably the least attached to the archers of any of these unit lines, but it would be nice to have day-fighter barbarian archers.
20090608 02:06:28< Jetrel> esr:  well, here's a thought;  is there anything strongly against making the poachers 'neutral' ?
20090608 02:06:29< esr> But anyway, I agree that the infantry and cav are the high priority.
20090608 02:06:47< Jetrel> esr:  because I really think we need to take care to fight unit bloat.
20090608 02:07:04< esr> Neutral pochers...hmmm...possible I suppose...
20090608 02:07:10< Jetrel> Expressly, when I'd first thought of doing these, it was intended that they'd be paired with other human units.
20090608 02:07:14< esr> "Unit bloat"?
20090608 02:07:43< Jetrel> Yeah.  We have a lot of units, and the more units we get, the less I'm able to animate them.
20090608 02:08:14< esr> Ah, I see.
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20090608 02:08:40< Jetrel> I mean, I'd love to make these, and a dozen other ideas I have rolling around in my head into whole factions, but I place a high value on stuff being decently animated.
20090608 02:08:58< esr> Are you happy wiuth the stats, weapon mixes, and so forth on these?
20090608 02:09:37< Jetrel> A major idea I had would be to 'extend' the current factions by making a few auxilliary units, so that the race can show up in a campaign with rather different flavor by swapping out a few units.
20090608 02:10:53< Jetrel> I think the infantry would do better with just bladed weapons to distinguish them from the spearmen.  If we find for balance reasons that they really need spears, I suppose we could do it, though.
20090608 02:12:50< Jetrel> OtOH, spears might be more plausible, but when the unit is practically identical to the spearman, there's not a lot of point in having a different unit.
20090608 02:14:10< Jetrel> I suppose on assumption I was holding could be entirely 'up for grabs'.  Maybe these aren't necessarily impoverished peasants from out in the boonies; maybe they're a decently equipped, but different culture (like vikings).
20090608 02:18:31< Jetrel> Actually, one open idea might be to strip the ranged weapons from the infantry, and have them be more like orc grunts; good in melee, but only getting ranged at L2 or so.
20090608 02:18:57< Jetrel> Anyways, I have to run to dinner.  Be back in about 30-40 min.
20090608 02:25:24< esr> Jetrel: "decently equipped, but different culture (like vikings)." is closer to what I intended.  Remenber, an immediaste use for these will be as Noerthern Alliance human troops.
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20090608 02:51:23< [Relic]> Hello :)
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20090608 03:27:55 * Jetrel is back
20090608 03:32:09< Jetrel> is away
20090608 03:32:20< Jetrel> esr:  okay;  I'm gonna try and make a base sprite for the L1 melee fighter.  Since these aren't impoverished peasants, the L1 will have some sort of short sword; presumably the L0 would have whatever implement they could grab.
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20090608 04:47:25< CIA-77> ai0867 * r36081 /trunk/data/ (lua/wml-tags.lua scenario-test.cfg): Move [unit_worth] tag to data/lua/wml-tags.lua, make its formula more configurable, store the calculated values.
20090608 04:47:31< CIA-77> ai0867 * r36082 /trunk/data/scenario-test.cfg: Add lua-evaluation code to test scenario.
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20090608 05:49:39< Jetrel> esr:  http://www.wesnoth.org/jetrel/Wesnoth/Sprites/L1-compare.png
20090608 05:50:06< Jetrel> esr: there's the melee L1 fellow in the middle.
20090608 05:52:15< noy> Jetrel: any comments about the art scholarship proposal?
20090608 05:58:55< Jetrel> noy:  I need a little time to formulate them.  I'm planning to knuckle down tomorrow and do the deep thinking on it.
20090608 05:59:12< noy> have you read the proposal?
20090608 05:59:55< Jetrel> Not in depth, and that's what it needs.  I want to take a really deep look at GSOC's analogous document.
20090608 06:00:27< Jetrel> I have to read something like this in depth, otherwise it's insulting to the person who wrote it. :)
20090608 06:01:14< noy> sure, but the timetable is designed to start in a couple of weeks time... 
20090608 06:01:30< noy> The system I've proposed is based off of the GSOC system
20090608 06:02:02< noy> With some alterations based on other developers comments and the like
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20090608 08:47:27< YogiHH> good morning
20090608 08:49:56< CIA-77> cornmander * r36083 /website/stats.wesnoth.org/wesstats/controllers/root.py: more work on database-driven views
20090608 08:50:42< corn__> hey, how acceptable is it to use flash in my stats project? right now I am using the google graphing API but they have a more extended version called the google visualization api
20090608 08:51:00< corn__> some of the graphs are SVG but others are flash based
20090608 08:51:52< corn__> right now I am recoding all the page generating stuff anyway, so switching to a different graphing scheme will be easiest right now
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20090608 09:02:44< euschn> hi
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20090608 09:04:01< esr> Jetrel: I cannot visually pasrse that imafe,, It looks like he has a horn growubng out of his shoulder.
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20090608 09:43:08< Jetrel> esr:  uhm, I don't know what you would be seeing that looks like that
20090608 09:43:39< Jetrel> esr:  there are a few pixels that are part of his metal coif, that might be it; let me remove them.
20090608 09:46:23< Jetrel> esr:  done:  http://www.wesnoth.org/jetrel/Wesnoth/Sprites/L1-compare.png
20090608 09:49:45< Jetrel> He has a short-sword in his right (visually our left) hand, and he has metal pauldrons and a metal coif/mantle sitting on his shoulders, over a leather jerkin/cuirass.
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20090608 10:17:37< CIA-77> euschn * r36084 /trunk/src/ (play_controller.cpp play_controller.hpp): savegame reorganization: added turn members and (stub) functions to play_controller
20090608 10:18:39< YogiHH> euschn: doesn't play_controller have turn members already?
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20090608 10:49:46< esr> Jetrel: Ah, I see what happened. I have a 120dpi display; viewed at natural resio;tion, his swordblade merged with the pauldron.  The imasge looks fine zoomed in a little.
20090608 10:50:06< Jetrel> Ah, okay, good - you had me a bit worried.
20090608 10:50:24< Jetrel> it might be good of me to put a few darker tones on the edge between sword+pauldron.
20090608 10:50:54< Jetrel> esr:  otherwise, though, I hope the costuming is fairly agreeable; he's exactly the same height as the loyalist bowman.
20090608 10:51:26< euschn> YogiHH: play_controller does have members for start_turn and previous_turn, but not the current one or the max number
20090608 10:51:46< euschn> previous_turn is not used a lot though, we might be able to get rid of that one
20090608 10:51:51< YogiHH> ah, ok
20090608 10:52:41< esr> Yes, costuming looks good. Dunno about the weapons, though; that might be a better match for the L2, the L1's supposed to be dagger and spear.
20090608 10:54:24< Jetrel> Yeah, it's a fairly short sword (and we can probably label it as such, much like the loyalist bowman has).  At higher levels, he'll graduate into longswords, and at the highest level, maybe a bit two-hander.
20090608 10:54:32< Jetrel> s/bit/big
20090608 10:55:44< esr> Right, that was more or less the plan.
20090608 10:55:52< Jetrel> Mkay.
20090608 10:56:59< Jetrel> I do think we should consider dropping the spear, because it makes these functionally rather different than the spearmen, which again would make campaigns more interesting.  If they have spears, they're very effective against cavalry, and it might be an interesting flavor point to make this nationality 'weak' against cavalry.
20090608 10:57:43< esr> Hmmm...have you ever played "Commands and Colors: Ancients"?  In case you haven't, it's an ancient-period tactical wargame with a scale and feel a lot like Wesnoth.
20090608 10:57:54< Jetrel> Nope.
20090608 10:58:02< esr> You might like it.
20090608 10:58:13< esr> As to spears....
20090608 10:58:24< esr> .looking at the wiki page...
20090608 10:58:31< Ivanovic> off to uni, cu
20090608 10:58:42< Jetrel> Spears would be very historically plausible, because they're easy to make, but they might be bad for gameplay, is what I'm suggesting.
20090608 10:59:49< esr> Yeah, I'm being really influenced by historicity here. Perils of being an old-school hex-and-counters grognard...
20090608 11:01:56< Jetrel> It's much like the "squishy mage" game issue.  Realistically, most mages would probably be a decent hand with a sword, but in a strategy game, that'd make them similar to infantry.
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20090608 11:02:59< esr> As for functionally different from spearmen, I think we accomplish that if we remove firststrike, weaken their spear attack, and give them a light bladed attack.  
20090608 11:03:30< Jetrel> And by making them similar, it's not inherently bad - there's nothing wrong with combining a "tank" with really heavy firepower, but it removes an interesting element that had been present before, in having a fragile but valuable/dangerous unit.
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20090608 11:03:41< esr> So they'd be slightly better all-around troops but tend to lose to groups pf loyalist spearmen.
20090608 11:04:36< Jetrel> esr:  the other thing is I secretly like avoiding dual-weapon units as much as possible, although I suppose we've gone so far down the road of "hammerspace" that it's fairly moot.
20090608 11:04:53< Jetrel> :P  So I can probably just strap one on his back and have done with.
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20090608 11:06:25< esr> hammerspace?
20090608 11:06:57< Jetrel> esr: that alternate dimension that cartoon characters magick their weapons out of.  Often used by bugs bunny.
20090608 11:08:03< zookeeper> can't you give them a stick/staff instead of a spear then? makes them suck against cavalry for sure.
20090608 11:08:18< zookeeper> (impact, not pierce)
20090608 11:09:12< esr> Staves have never been battlefield eeapons.  Too easy to put a spear-tip on them...and these guys can make armor.
20090608 11:09:24< Jetrel> esr:  they reach behind their back, and grab a tool that's too big to have fit behind their back - almost like it's being pulled out of an invisible "bag of holding".  Most wesnoth units do this when switching weapons, but I'd like to avoid it if possible.
20090608 11:09:27< zookeeper> well, then you have to go with spears i guess
20090608 11:10:59< esr> Jetrek: How;s this for a concept...L1 Barb holds a spear in a diagonal position, cross-body, but you can see a dagger at his hip.  No jammerspace.  The "L1" you have now becomes the L2 with sword as primary weapon.
20090608 11:12:06< esr> ...and a spear strapped across his back.
20090608 11:13:11< Jetrel> Possibly.
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20090608 11:13:58< Jetrel> It's easier to show a spear on the back, so I might end up doing that for both levels.
20090608 11:14:10< Jetrel> I don't know - I'll experiment.
20090608 11:21:12< esr> k
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20090608 11:36:33< Soliton> corn__: i don't think there is anything against flash per se. as i see it the question is whether it works well on most browsers/plattforms and is maintainable in the future.
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20090608 11:53:05< euschn> YogiHH: can you explain the use of utils::interpolate_variables_into_string in gamestatus.cpp: 226? turn_at (the current turn) is already read from a config, how does the interpolation update turn_at?
20090608 11:53:29< euschn> I am asking because I wonder whether to include this line in the tod_manager constructor 
20090608 11:53:51< euschn> or just have it read the current turn from a config (the game_state"s snapshot)
20090608 11:54:27< YogiHH> euschn: wait a minute...
20090608 11:55:39< euschn> ok
20090608 12:00:33< YogiHH> euschn: I am not sure, from what i understand this is the evaluation of WML variables/formulas. It would only make sense if the current turn is being determined by such a formula but i can
20090608 12:00:36< YogiHH> oops
20090608 12:00:55< YogiHH> ...but i can't imagine any case where that would make sense.
20090608 12:01:28< YogiHH> zookeeper: ^?
20090608 12:01:54< euschn> YogiHH: ok, I couldnt come up with such a case either
20090608 12:09:13-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 62 bugs, 242 feature requests, 13 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20090608 12:20:49< CIA-77> euschn * r36085 /trunk/src/ (play_controller.cpp play_controller.hpp): added tod_manager member to play_controller
20090608 12:28:44< Soliton> YogiHH: you were able to reproduce the savegame issue with seemingly wiped out gamestate, right? (the save would only be named "Auto-Save") you think https://gna.org/bugs/?13577 might be related?
20090608 12:32:44< zookeeper> YogiHH, if you're talking about [scenario] turn_at=, then variable substitution is sometimes very handy there
20090608 12:33:13< zookeeper> like if you have two scenarios linked together so that the second one begins at the same turn on which the first one finishes, or something like that
20090608 12:33:31< zookeeper> it'd be evaluated when starting that scenario
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20090608 12:42:04< mordante> servus
20090608 12:43:58< euschn> hi mordante 
20090608 12:46:29< mordante> hi euschn 
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20090608 12:48:29< euschn> zookeeper: it is about [snapshot] turn_at in savegames, storing the current turn number
20090608 12:49:49< euschn> how can a scenario start on a turn which another one finishes at, doesnt a scenario always start at turn 1?
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20090608 12:53:53< zookeeper> well, in mainline yes, but with turn_at you can change that
20090608 12:54:26< euschn> i see
20090608 12:55:42< zookeeper> i'd imagine that key has no real purpose in a mid-scenario savefile, since the scenario has already started
20090608 12:56:30< zookeeper> hmh, are you sure [snapshot] turn_at stores the current turn number? that's a bit poorly named IMO in that case..
20090608 12:56:52< euschn> pretty sure yes
20090608 12:57:24< zookeeper> maybe worth renaming it to just turn or current_turn or something, as you can see it's easy to confuse with the scenario-level turn_at ;)
20090608 12:57:35 * Soliton uses turn_at to figure the turn a loaded savegame is at in wesnothd.
20090608 12:59:52< mordante> corn__, I'm not happy with using flash, afaik there aren't players for all platforms
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20090608 13:00:35< zookeeper> maybe it uses the same key because the game starts a scenario and loads a save the same way, so that key does the same job in both cases...i wouldn't know
20090608 13:01:06< mordante> corn__, it also adds a "dependency" so best discuss it on the dev-ml, but it would be nice if you can make it work without additional dependencies
20090608 13:01:40< euschn> zookeeper: yes I think thats the case
20090608 13:03:23< zookeeper> euschn, ok. so, basically the variable/formula substitution needs to be available at the scenario level, but i guess it'd be pointless to specifically disable it for when loading a snapshot
20090608 13:04:37< euschn> zookeeper: I see, thanks for the clarification
20090608 13:07:38< YogiHH> Soliton: Yes, i was able to reproduce. Looking at it in debug mode showed a completely corrupted gamestate. Actually, that could cause all kinds of problems, 13577 might be related but could as well be caused by something else. No idea about that.
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20090608 13:22:24< CIA-77> euschn * r36086 /trunk/src/ (4 files): implemented turn function stubs in play_controller and added variable/formula substitution to tod_manager constructor
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20090608 13:54:12< euschn> YogiHH: I just noticed replay_controller actually has a current_turn_ member (playsingle and playmp dont). I think it will become redundant now that I have added turn_ to play_controller
20090608 13:56:39< YogiHH> euschn: yes, very likely
20090608 14:02:30< euschn> YogiHH: is there a policy on adding assertions to the code? I would like to add some as an intermediate step to verify that play_controller.turn_ and gamestatus.turn_ are equal. of course Id remove them again once I have finished the migration and removed all turn functionality from gamestatus
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20090608 14:03:13< thespaceinvader> afternoon all
20090608 14:05:55< Soliton> euschn: to verify internal consistency asserts are the right choice. just not for possibly user supplied data.
20090608 14:07:30< euschn> Soliton: ok, thanks
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20090608 14:20:11< CIA-77> thespaceinvader * r36087 /trunk/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Update portraits for tHoT's Ratheln & Angarthing. Update changelogs.
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20090608 14:22:37< CIA-77> thespaceinvader * r36088 /branches/1.6/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Update portraits for tHoT's Ratheln & Angarthing. Update changelogs.
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20090608 15:36:30< CIA-77> euschn * r36089 /trunk/src/ (4 files): savegame reorganization: synchronized turn_ and numTurns_ members of play_controller and gamestatus
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20090608 17:01:54< Ivanovic> hi
20090608 17:02:28< Sapient> hi
20090608 17:03:17< Crab_> hi
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20090608 17:44:20< shadowmaster> nice, phpbb 3.0.5 has been released last month! now that's what I was waiting for. :P
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20090608 17:58:51< stikonas> Ivanovic: is http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/wesnoth?rev=36080&view=rev eligible for backporting to 1.6? It adds 2 strings instead of 1 bad.
20090608 17:59:10< Ivanovic> hmm, it should be
20090608 17:59:51< zookeeper> sorry, there's no potion.ogg in 1.6
20090608 18:00:01< zookeeper> i didn't realize that before, i thought i had added it before 1.6..
20090608 18:00:18< stikonas> this part of the patch can be skipped
20090608 18:00:29< zookeeper> so when porting to 1.6, just change the potion.ogg to lightning.ogg and remove the 2000 delay
20090608 18:00:43< Ivanovic> zookeeper: can you do the backporting?
20090608 18:00:52< stikonas> zookeeper: I have no write access. So I can only provide patch, but you will have to commit.
20090608 18:00:58< zookeeper> ah, ok, will do
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20090608 18:05:41< stikonas> zookeeper: ok, I have the patch and it applies cleanly to 1.6, where should I post it?
20090608 18:07:22< CIA-77> zookeeper * r36090 /branches/1.6/data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/ (16_The_Chief_must_die.cfg 16_The_Chief_must_die_utils.cfg): Ported r36080 to 1.6 (with minor compatibility adjustments).
20090608 18:07:24< zookeeper> you mean that? :P
20090608 18:07:39< stikonas> :P
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20090608 18:41:38< stikonas> wesnoth mp server seems to be down
20090608 18:42:31< shadowmaster> something else than 1.6?
20090608 18:43:01< stikonas> no, 1.6
20090608 18:43:15< stikonas> are you updating?
20090608 18:43:24< shadowmaster> no. I am not doing anything.
20090608 18:43:47< shadowmaster> I don't have permissions for controlling wesnothd either. :)
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20090608 19:21:27< Turuk> Some users make me want to shoot myself
20090608 19:21:51< shadowmaster> who?
20090608 19:22:23< Turuk> Just a general statement, but Midnight and dawn come to mind
20090608 19:23:59< Turuk> The people, not the time of day
20090608 19:24:23< shadowmaster> of course
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20090608 20:15:21< CIA-77> mcshark * r36091 /trunk/projectfiles/ (CodeBlocks/wesnoth.cbp CodeBlocks-SCons/wesnoth.cbp): Update according to recent file changes
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20090608 20:55:09< Dragonking> Hello everyone.
20090608 20:55:31< Sapient> hi DK
20090608 20:56:10 * Dragonking is in a middle of his exams
20090608 20:56:26< Ivanovic> ugh, lucky you
20090608 20:57:02< Dragonking> Today I got results of fist exam (and the hardest one) and I passed it.. I was a bit afraid about it because in case of fail it would destroy my SoC shedule completely
20090608 20:57:51< Dragonking> Still 3 exams to go.. tomorrow (and partly the day after - talkin part), then friday and then next week around tuesday.
20090608 20:59:31< Dragonking> Till then I have completely no time unfortunately... but after last exam there will be only one project left so should I have plent of time to spend mostly for wesnoth before miditime evaluation.
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20090608 21:28:34< Crab_> hi Dragonking
20090608 21:30:03< Dragonking> hi Crab_ 
20090608 21:31:32< Crab_> how is your AI work going ? any files you're working with at the moment that I should be aware of ?
20090608 21:33:31< Dragonking> Crab_: Like I wrote 30 min ago, I have 3 exams within 1 week now, I am not working on anything yet
20090608 21:33:49< Dragonking> Crab_: In about a week I'll talk to you for sure :)
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20090608 21:35:35< Dragonking> I think 3 weeks working 10+h/day should be enough to catch up and meet midterm requirements...
20090608 21:36:41< Crab_> ok.  btw, what's your opinion about moving files (a message I've sent to ml a few days ago - http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/m2d976a95 ) 
20090608 21:37:06< Crab_> ( I won't move the formula files if you nack their move/rename)
20090608 21:37:55< Sapient> have people been documenting the (lua only) WML tags added in the WML Reference?
20090608 21:38:30< Sapient> e.g. [unit_worth]
20090608 21:39:42< Dragonking> Crab_: Looks fine, I don't mind moving formula_ai files into separate dir.
20090608 21:39:47< Crab_> Dragonking: the reason I asked about 'how is your AI work going?' is because I want to avoid any merging difficulties that can be avoided )
20090608 21:40:06< Dragonking> Crab_: Yes, I understood that. :)
20090608 21:40:43< Dragonking> Crab_: Worry not, once I plan to mess with something, you will most likely know about it.
20090608 21:40:53< zookeeper> Sapient, hey, someone found out that presumably you can (with [allow_undo]) undo a move triggering a moveto event which modifies units...as long as it doesn't modify the unit that moved. kinda interesting.
20090608 21:40:57< Crab_> Dragonking: I worry because I plan to mess with something :)))
20090608 21:41:05< zookeeper> (not that i've tested it, but he said he had)
20090608 21:41:08< Crab_> ok, so we'll talk in a week
20090608 21:42:20< Dragonking> Crab_: Yes, I saw you did quite a lot so far, I'll need to talk to you to catch up with everything around AI probably. :)
20090608 21:42:47< Dragonking> Crab_: What do you want to mess with now?
20090608 21:43:38< Dragonking> Crab_: And a lot of my job till midterm eval will be just to mess with recruitment formulas itself, to do some test and re-organize code, I tihnk it should not create confilcts. :)
20090608 21:44:19< Crab_> right now I'm tinkering with ai_default. I've made a composite ai, which consists of a various pieces. I've made a rca loop that can accept candidate actions written in c++, and I've made it possible for these candidate actions to stay 'in context' of the ai ( = have access to many helper functions )
20090608 21:44:54< Dragonking> Ok, I remember you talking about it. Nice. :)
20090608 21:44:59< Crab_> so, right now I'm working on making a copy of a default ai as an rca-based ai.
20090608 21:45:54< Crab_> that composite ai is designed to allow both c++ and formula ai (and lua, if someone wants it) pieces, by using a helper I call 'engine'.
20090608 21:46:21< Crab_> right now I only have a c++ engine, but I'll refactor formula ai a bit to allow a 'formula ai' engine
20090608 21:46:29< Crab_> I'll document it all, too
20090608 21:46:51< Dragonking> ok :)
20090608 21:46:56< Dragonking> Sounds great.
20090608 21:47:38< Crab_> this will allow us to integrate formula candidate actions into default ai. so, we will not be forced to 'implement an entire ai in formula ai'.
20090608 21:48:22< Sapient> zookeeper: it's well known that [allow_undo] can allow dangerous undos... if improperly used
20090608 21:48:58< Sapient> it's the WML author's responsibility to safeguard against that
20090608 21:50:42< Dragonking> Crab_: Everything sounds really good. :)
20090608 21:51:09< ardesh_> hey Dragonking ure the guy for ai coding from the summer of code, right?
20090608 21:51:23< Dragonking> Yes, one of.
20090608 21:51:53< ardesh_> theone with the evolutionary ai?
20090608 21:51:53< zookeeper> Sapient, well, i've never before managed to allow undo when the event modifies units, but i guess i've just always been modifying the moving unit.
20090608 21:52:50< Dragonking> ardesh_: No, the one with recruitment library
20090608 21:53:15< ardesh_> ah okay :D
20090608 21:53:30< ardesh_> did u already get the grant?
20090608 21:54:15< ardesh_> or is the selection still in progress?
20090608 21:55:01< Crab_> Dragonking: see http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/m5b223368 for 'example of how-it-can-look-like'
20090608 21:55:04< Dragonking> ardesh_: Selection finished like.. around 2 months ago
20090608 21:55:11< ardesh_> uh
20090608 21:55:16< ardesh_> okay.. im not up to date XD
20090608 21:55:28< Dragonking> ardesh_: Adound 26th of my coding time started
20090608 21:55:48< ardesh_> nice :)
20090608 21:57:07< Dragonking> Crab_: "testing_ai_default::recruitment_phase"  <- how this candidate action would be executed?
20090608 21:59:48< Crab_> Dragonking: candidate action evaluation loop passes each [candidate_action] chunk to the corresponding engine. each engine gets that config, creates a candidate action, and adds a smart pointer to it to the list of candidate actions.
20090608 22:00:40< Crab_> Dragonking: c++ engine uses a factory registry pattern (see src/ai/registry.cpp ) to create c++-based candidate actions so it does a lookup by name, gets a factory, creates a instance, and adds the smart pointer to it to the list of candidate actions.
20090608 22:01:31< Crab_> Dragonking: that's 'creation' part. then, on each turn, composite ai executes all stages in order. this candidate action evaluation loop stage ( src/ai/testing/stage_rca.hpp) does a rca loop.
20090608 22:03:40< CIA-77> soliton * r36092 /trunk/ (data/multiplayer/eras.cfg src/scripting/lua.cpp): 
20090608 22:03:40< CIA-77> allowed lua access to the team config
20090608 22:03:40< CIA-77> formatted the turn-over evaluation a bit nicer
20090608 22:03:40< CIA-77> excluded leader cost from the unit score
20090608 22:03:42< CIA-77> soliton * r36093 /trunk/utils/mp-server/run_server: check for running jobs only
20090608 22:03:54< Dragonking> Crab_: ok
20090608 22:10:21< Crab_> Dragonking: that (composite ai) is one of three main new things. Second new thing is ai contexts - they allow composite ai parts to have access to helper functions in a nice way. for example, just 'get_info()' instead of 'ai_.get_info()'. Third new thing (unfinished, but will be working this week) is a new ai::actions stuff - functions for moving and attacking which will reuse src/actions implementation of moving and attacking, and allow for bett
20090608 22:10:43< Crab_> (... for better error checking)
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20090608 22:19:33 * loonycyborg curses Windows for requiring a reinstall after every mobo upgrade
20090608 22:25:22< Ivanovic> ah, what a lovely operating system
20090608 22:25:25< Ivanovic> ;)
20090608 22:27:09 * Crab_ thinks that most people reinstall windows more often than they do upgrade motherboards... 
20090608 22:28:11< Ivanovic> Crab_: in fact in the last 3 years i updated my motherboard more often than i installed windows...
20090608 22:28:12< Ivanovic> ;)
20090608 22:28:58< Crab_> Ivanovic: :)
20090608 22:29:02< Crab_> Ivanovic: 'do not having windows at all or running it inside vmware' helps, too :)
20090608 22:30:35< Ivanovic> Crab_: uhm, what do you exactly mean, this sounds slightly awkward...
20090608 22:30:42< Soliton> loonycyborg: can you reproduce https://gna.org/bugs/?13577 ?
20090608 22:30:56< Ivanovic> (and yeah, i change my motherboard twice in the last three years and have not installed windows)
20090608 22:31:15< Ivanovic> ah wait, i installed windows once since i wanted to play "overlord"
20090608 22:31:18< Crab_> Ivanovic: 1) if you do not use windows at all, you do not have to (re)install it:)
20090608 22:31:38< Crab_> Ivanovic: 2) if you install windows inside virtual machine, you do not have to reinstall it if hardware changes.
20090608 22:31:54< Ivanovic> Crab_: depends on the host of the VM
20090608 22:32:14< Crab_> Ivanovic: *nix :)
20090608 22:32:15< Ivanovic> if that is the windows box where you have another vm running in, you got to reinstall windows anyway...
20090608 22:32:17< Ivanovic> ;)
20090608 22:43:15< loonycyborg> After the upgrade Ubuntu Just Worked and Gentoo required a mere kernel recompile because my kernel lacked support for new SATA controller. But with windows I'll probably need to also reinstall all apps..
20090608 22:44:50< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: of course you have to reinstall basically everything
20090608 22:44:55< Ivanovic> this is the windows way to do things
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20090608 22:47:00< loonycyborg> Soliton: Nope. I can't repro it neither with linux native nor cross-compiled in wine trunk.
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20090608 22:56:27< loonycyborg> Soliton: Actually I can repro the "TURN <turn number>" as per forum post.
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20090608 22:57:58< Ivanovic> off to bed, n8
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20090608 23:02:23< loonycyborg> So yes. I can confirm that after opening "Load Game" dialog default savegame name becomes screwed.
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20090608 23:16:44< loonycyborg> Soliton: I can confirm the bug as reported in the forum post on linux.
20090608 23:17:19< loonycyborg> I'm getting both segfaults on recruit and segfaults on next turn after opening "Load Game".
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20090608 23:33:03< turin> hallo all
20090608 23:33:16< turin> a question about the add-on server - does it use different ports for uploading and downloading?
20090608 23:33:33< turin> it's currently letting me download add-ons but not upload new ones or new versions of my already-uploaded ones
20090608 23:38:05< Soliton> what does it say?
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20090608 23:45:10< turin> "remote host disconnected"
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20090608 23:45:59< turin> but only *after* it has he click yes on the accepting-GPL message
20090608 23:47:28< Soliton> does it take a while or is it instant?
20090608 23:47:44< turin> instant
20090608 23:48:15< Soliton> weird.
20090608 23:48:48< turin> this is with 1.6, not 1.7, BW
20090608 23:48:55< AI0867> the game no longer ends when turns are over
20090608 23:48:57< AI0867> bisecting now
20090608 23:49:53< Soliton> i've committed some tweaks to the turn-over evaluation and only tested it a while ago.
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20090608 23:50:42< Soliton> though are you using an uoptodate binary with the current data?
20090608 23:50:53< AI0867> I am
20090608 23:51:05< AI0867> I was testing your changes when I noticed the game didn't end
20090608 23:51:53< AI0867> now at turn 4/2
20090608 23:52:02< Soliton> oh, heh.
20090608 23:53:41< AI0867> r36089 broke it
20090608 23:54:03< AI0867> who is euschn?
20090608 23:54:19< Soliton> soc student for the savegame refactoring.
20090608 23:54:46< Soliton> YogiHH: ^
20090608 23:55:08< YogiHH> hmm?
20090608 23:55:15< Crab_> AI0867: see change in playsingle_controller.cpp
20090608 23:55:20< YogiHH> just a minute...
20090608 23:55:45< Crab_> "bool b = next_turn();   if(!status_.next_turn() && b) {" - looks not symmetric
--- Log closed Tue Jun 09 00:00:59 2009