--- Log opened Tue Jul 07 00:00:04 2009
20090707 00:00:36< Crab_> boucman: one of my original points was the point that rca is not good for finding out good multiaction sequences
20090707 00:00:52< boucman> yes, I agree on that
20090707 00:00:56< Sapient> cya later, have fun.
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20090707 00:01:20< Crab_> boucman: so, even depth=2 "hypotetical move of the leader to action+rca" will be an improvement over "rca"
20090707 00:01:51< boucman> indeed
20090707 00:02:05< boucman> Crab_: let's do it that way
20090707 00:02:37< boucman> implement it with a depth of 2 and no pruning (as a first aproximation) and we will refine it later when our AI framework is in a more mature state
20090707 00:02:53< Crab_> ok
20090707 00:03:39< Crab_> note that this system has no need for poisoning candidate action in its current form
20090707 00:03:49< boucman> this allows you to avoid the complicated (but fortunately easily pluggable) problem of pruning and focus on the basic structure
20090707 00:04:01< Crab_> yes
20090707 00:04:12< boucman> Crab_: ???
20090707 00:04:23< boucman> of course it does
20090707 00:04:30< boucman> or did I miss something
20090707 00:04:44< boucman> depth=2 means two actions, not two turns, I hope :)
20090707 00:04:53< Crab_> two actions :)
20090707 00:04:54< Crab_>  1) first step is to gather good action plans. this includes all simple attacks, simple moves, and more elaborate multistep actions proposed by candidate actions.
20090707 00:05:06< boucman> aaaah ok
20090707 00:05:16< Crab_> so, there's no need for candidate actions which *propose* simple attacks
20090707 00:05:29< boucman> yes, the current form of poisoning would be useless, but a poisoning function as a move evaluator would be usefull
20090707 00:05:34< Crab_> there is need for *scoring* them, yes
20090707 00:05:37< boucman> :)
20090707 00:05:42< boucman> ok, got it
20090707 00:08:03< Crab_> note that this solves the problem ' is terrain properly taken into account ?'
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20090707 00:08:10< boucman> :)
20090707 00:08:28< Crab_> since generic attack evaluator will take terrain into account
20090707 00:08:37< CIA-53> jhinrichs * r36666 /trunk/ (10 files in 4 dirs): 
20090707 00:08:37< CIA-53> Replacing one savegame dialog with the new message dialog class. This also shows
20090707 00:08:37< CIA-53> work in progress on the load-game dialog. It's not really functional yet but
20090707 00:08:37< CIA-53> there is something to see already so i am comitting this already. If you are
20090707 00:08:37< CIA-53> curious for the dialog, remove the comments in savegame.cpp (line 336/337).
20090707 00:09:00< Crab_> YogiHH: congrats on commit number :)
20090707 00:09:07< boucman> hehe
20090707 00:09:12< YogiHH> hehe
20090707 00:09:14-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 58 bugs, 238 feature requests, 13 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20090707 00:09:16< Crab_> boucman: and poisoning action evaluator will score the 'poisoning part'
20090707 00:11:01< Crab_> boucman: note that we'll need either 'score categories' or strict limiting on the number of action evaluators
20090707 00:11:35< boucman> why ?
20090707 00:11:49< Crab_> boucman: note the scoring bias of '1 defence evaluator + 3 combat evaluators' vs '3 defence evaluator + 1 combat evaluators' 
20090707 00:13:27< boucman> Crab_: yes, but that's our job as AI designers to balance that bias, not something we can hardcode in the engine
20090707 00:14:10< Crab_> boucman: that's why I said about two options.
20090707 00:14:45< Crab_> boucman: "strict limiting on the number of action evaluators" = that's our job as AI designers to balance that bias, and implement only balanced set of evaluators
20090707 00:15:27< Crab_> boucman:  'score categories' - use not simple mean, but mean over means over categories to allow people to add new evaluators without biasing the ai towards combat-or-noncombat actions.
20090707 00:16:09< boucman> Crab_: ok, understood
20090707 00:16:22< boucman> I guess that the first one is simpler as a first approch
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20090707 00:17:41< Crab_> boucman: second is more manageable, imo
20090707 00:18:30< shadowmaster> Turuk: congratulations, you have sent two test messages with shiny subjects to forum@wesnoth.org
20090707 00:18:31< boucman> if you think so, go for it :)
20090707 00:18:44< Turuk> Shadowmaster
20090707 00:18:45< Turuk> Yup
20090707 00:18:51< shadowmaster> Turuk: have you checked http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=33&t=25664  btw?
20090707 00:19:00< Crab_> boucman: since it allows to add a nevaluator without changing the entire ai behavior
20090707 00:19:24< shadowmaster> (I mean, after you posted there months ago, of course)
20090707 00:19:35< Crab_> boucman: but, then, we need to pick a small list of categories (at least two, to illustrate the concept)
20090707 00:19:39< Turuk> shadowmaster: I have not checked it recently, but I like the look of the second one
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20090707 00:21:20< shadowmaster> I could swear I saw button templates for subsilver2 somewhere. I just can't find it anymore... I'd prefer to use little subsilvery images instead of the UTF-8 arrow character
20090707 00:21:23< Crab_> for example, categories such as 'economy' and 'combat'
20090707 00:21:34< shadowmaster> *s
20090707 00:22:57< Turuk> An image would be better, but there's no problem with the arrow for now
20090707 00:23:02< Turuk> It gets the point across
20090707 00:24:09< Crab_> boucman: for example, if we have two evaluators, 'economy evaluator', and 'attack evaluator', and we add a 'poisoning evaluator', then (assuming that the poisoning evaluator is balanced), the impact of adding a poisoning evaluator on a balance between economy and attack categories will be less
20090707 00:24:27< boucman> Crab_: ok, if you think you can do this without too much impact on schedule, go for it...
20090707 00:25:14< boucman> but i'm afraid it's getting borderline too complicated (from an AI writer point of view) 
20090707 00:25:31< boucman> there are lots of different concepts in the AI, it's starting to get a bit overwhelming
20090707 00:25:49< boucman> ok, i need to sleep now, see you tomorow...
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20090707 00:39:18< YogiHH> night everyone
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20090707 01:11:32< CIA-53> silene * r36667 /trunk/src/config.cpp: Removed code duplication.
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20090707 02:23:49< CIA-53> turuk * r36668 /trunk/data/core/units/humans/Outlaw_Highwayman.cfg: Updated description.
20090707 02:38:51< CIA-53> silene * r36669 /trunk/changelog: Updated changes.
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20090707 03:58:40< CIA-53> esr * r36670 /trunk/data/campaigns/The_Hammer_of_Thursagan/scenarios/10_The_Siege_of_Kal_Kartha.cfg: 
20090707 03:58:40< CIA-53> Recent changes in the AI seem to have made it much more effective at
20090707 03:58:40< CIA-53> scragging Dulcatolos vefore you can get there. Reinforce him on turn 5.
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20090707 06:09:14-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 59 bugs, 239 feature requests, 13 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20090707 06:33:25< MJ999> Anyone else having trunk failing at startup?
20090707 06:38:47< ancestral> MJ999: Where and how?
20090707 06:38:52< ancestral> What OS?
20090707 06:39:36< MJ999> Throws a WML exception, linux.
20090707 06:39:44< ancestral> Hmmm
20090707 06:39:53< MJ999> Something about not finding a window type.
20090707 06:40:19< MJ999> src/gui/widgets/settings.cpp:306
20090707 06:40:44< ancestral> I'm rebuilding from trunk, though I'm running OS X
20090707 06:41:03< MJ999> It doesn't look OS-specific
20090707 06:50:27< ancestral> Still compiling
20090707 06:50:32< MJ999> :P
20090707 06:51:38< MJ999> I did some investigating, and its not finding the "game_load" window under default is why
20090707 06:53:38< MJ999> Which is perfectly understandable because data/gui/default/window doesn't contain any game_load window definitions.
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20090707 06:57:29< ancestral> oops new files to add to the project
20090707 07:04:07< ancestral> Hmm, two errors on build
20090707 07:16:00< ancestral> Build error: ld: duplicate symbol gui2::tcanvas::tshape::put_pixel
20090707 07:16:16< MJ999> o.O I don't get that one.
20090707 07:54:47< CIA-53> turuk * r36671 /trunk/data/campaigns/An_Orcish_Incursion/scenarios/3_Wasteland.cfg: Fixed typo.
20090707 07:54:58< CIA-53> turuk * r36672 /trunk/data/campaigns/The_Hammer_of_Thursagan/scenarios/03_Strange_Allies.cfg: Fixed typo.
20090707 08:01:12< MJ999> http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/d5a785127
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20090707 08:36:05< euschn> hi
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20090707 08:49:19< euschn> I have a question about class unit: is it save to assume that underlying_id_ is unique for every unit?
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20090707 08:50:48< Dragonking> euschn: I think it is supposed to be unique
20090707 08:51:01< euschn> ok, thanks
20090707 08:55:57< Dragonking> euschn: If you look at unit.cpp:3006 there's manager that handles assigning underlying ids..tho I'm not sure how it handles case of loading id from the cfg 
20090707 08:56:43< euschn> Dragonking: I see, that suggests its unique
20090707 09:16:30< grzywacz> Dragonking, -pl
20090707 09:18:40< euschn> hm, starting wesnoth yields the following error on trunk:
20090707 09:18:55< euschn> WML exception:
20090707 09:18:57< euschn> User message: Window not defined.
20090707 09:18:58< euschn> Dev message: Condition 'window_types.find(*itor) != window_types.end()' failed at src/gui/widgets/settings.cpp:306 in function 'read'.
20090707 09:20:48< euschn> hm, after commenting that line wesnoth starts again, but I have no idea what that line does
20090707 09:25:03< CIA-53> euschn * r36673 /trunk/src/game_events.cpp: fixed setting of wml roles for units of team.recall_list_
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20090707 09:34:23< Soliton> MJ999: what happens when there is no free passable hex to teleport to?
20090707 09:45:28< CIA-53> euschn * r36674 /trunk/data/gui/default/window/game_load.cfg: added game_load.cfg to fix error in src/gui/widgets/settings.cpp
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20090707 10:34:15< Ivanovic> moin
20090707 10:35:07< Ivanovic> Turuk: for pure typo fixes please ask esr how to do it
20090707 10:35:19< Ivanovic> since they should be added in pofix, too (and run onto the translation files)
20090707 10:36:15< Ivanovic> that is: if a typo or a clear and small grammar problem is fixed it can be added in that file
20090707 10:36:46< Ivanovic> if it is a change in some "real" name or the like (which changes the meaning) it should *not* be added to pofix
20090707 10:38:33< MJ999> Soliton, nothing, if it doesn't find a valid hex the functions simply returns.
20090707 10:39:05< Soliton> MJ999: that means no teleporting happens?
20090707 10:39:32< MJ999> Also, could anyone with svn patch: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/d5a785127
20090707 10:39:42< MJ999> Soliton, correct.
20090707 10:39:58< Soliton> ok, excellent.
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20090707 10:42:41< CIA-53> soliton * r36675 /branches/1.6/CMakeLists.txt: fixed a typo
20090707 10:42:56< CIA-53> soliton * r36676 /trunk/CMakeLists.txt: fixed a typo
20090707 10:43:37< MJ999> Soliton, it should be noted that it checks within a 50 hex range. Perhaps that's an option for another wml paramter...
20090707 10:45:00< Soliton> eh, that sounds fine for any sane scenario.
20090707 10:45:28< zookeeper> just checking: does it check only for passable hexes that are actually connected to the original destination by other passable hexes?
20090707 10:45:52< zookeeper> or any passable hex within a 50 hex radius, preferring the closest ones first?
20090707 10:46:03< MJ999> zookeeper, second
20090707 10:46:08< zookeeper> oh.
20090707 10:46:51< zookeeper> that could be a bit problematic sometimes, i'd imagine. not that i think the scenario designer shouldn't try to take that into consideration anyway.
20090707 10:47:19< MJ999> Wait...I lied. First.
20090707 10:47:28< zookeeper> phew. great :)
20090707 10:48:36< MJ999> Uhh...this code is extremely redundant. 
20090707 10:49:24< MJ999> In most cases it will work fine (ie: unit teleports from loc A to loc B)
20090707 10:50:09< MJ999> However, when target loc and adjacent start to get filled the selection is horrible.
20090707 10:52:43< zookeeper> my point was that the situations where the passable checks matter are usually ones where you teleport units in some kind of a cave with rather little space. in those cases it's important that the units are teleported to spaces that are actually connected to the original destination instead of just taking them to the nearest passable hex, since those could be behind a wall in a whole different section of the map.
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20090707 11:01:09< CIA-53> esr * r36677 /trunk/data/ (4 files in 3 dirs): wmlscope/wmllint cleanup.
20090707 11:01:24< Soliton> loonycyborg: does the 1.6 installer install in a new dir for 1.6.x by default?
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20090707 11:02:05< loonycyborg> Soliton: It has full version number in directory's name.
20090707 11:02:13< esr> Ivanovic, zookeeper: wmllint found something suspicious.  In UtBS there are a couple of places where a [set_variable] has a value= attribute that's a *translated* string.  Is that legal? 
20090707 11:02:49< Ivanovic> no idea
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20090707 11:03:16< Soliton> loonycyborg: any reason just 1.6 won't do?
20090707 11:03:31< zookeeper> esr, yes, why wouldn't it be?
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20090707 11:06:02< esr> zookeeper: Any context where there is only two instances of translatables in the entire corpus and all other instances are non-translatable makes me suspect that one auther didn't undertstand what he was doing. But since you tell me that's OK, I'll beat wmllint into accepting it.
20090707 11:06:04< zookeeper> (i'm guessing you're talking of some translated grog/rogrimir names used in dialogue)
20090707 11:06:13< loonycyborg> Soliton: Because new version will be installed over the old version by default then.
20090707 11:06:32< zookeeper> esr, well, i can check those right now if you want to, just name the lines..
20090707 11:06:38< Soliton> loonycyborg: exactly the point!
20090707 11:07:36< loonycyborg> In order to do this the right way you'll need to first running the uninstaller.
20090707 11:08:01< esr> "../../data/campaigns/Under_the_Burning_Suns/scenarios/05_A_Subterranean_Struggle.cfg", line 1881: value should not have a translation mark
20090707 11:08:03< esr> "../../data/campaigns/Under_the_Burning_Suns/scenarios/05_A_Subterranean_Struggle.cfg", line 1906: value should not have a translation mark
20090707 11:08:45< loonycyborg> Since otherwise start menu shortcuts from provious version will stay.
20090707 11:09:48< loonycyborg> Of course I can overwrite them too but that can cause problems if some files are removed in new versions..
20090707 11:11:04< Soliton> no files get removed in stable versions.
20090707 11:11:55< Soliton> though if you think it's too fragile maybe just give a hint to the user that he can/should copy his userdata dir over?
20090707 11:12:06< zookeeper> esr, yeah, those are valid. a bit of a clumsy way of doing the whole thing, but still...
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20090707 11:13:13< zookeeper> i think i'll do a minor cleanup while i'm at it...
20090707 11:14:38< loonycyborg> Soliton: What does this have to do with userdata dir? It only has '1.6' in its name. Only the installation dir has 1.6.x in its name..
20090707 11:15:31< Soliton> loonycyborg: you can have it under the install dir on windows, no?
20090707 11:15:59< loonycyborg> Yes. Though not by default.
20090707 11:16:53< esr> zookeeper: Waiting on your cleanup...
20090707 11:18:16< loonycyborg> I'm going to eventually make all stable releases to install into same 1.6 dir. Though I still have doubts. That'll prevent one from installing multiple versions at the same time.
20090707 11:18:46< loonycyborg> Is installing multiple versions side-by-side absolutely not useful for stable releases?
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20090707 11:22:21< Soliton> might help with regression testing but for the casual user? i don't think so.
20090707 11:23:48< loonycyborg> k
20090707 11:25:11< Soliton> you could still install side by side by manually choosing the install dir though, no?
20090707 11:25:59< loonycyborg> You can change the install dir, but there are also registry keys and start menu shortcuts..
20090707 11:26:59< Soliton> but those will then use the actual install dir, right? i don't mean moving the dir after install.
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20090707 11:27:48< loonycyborg> Yes. But they're overwrite old version's registry keys.
20090707 11:28:07< Soliton> ahh
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20090707 11:28:44< loonycyborg> So you won't be able to uninstall it with uninstaller since it reads install dir from registry.
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20090707 11:30:19< CIA-53> loonycyborg * r36678 /branches/1.6/packaging/windows/Wesnoth.nsi.in: 
20090707 11:30:19< CIA-53> Made windows installer write uninstall information so Wesnoth will appear in Add/Remove Programs.
20090707 11:30:19< CIA-53> Cherry-picked from r36466(trunk)
20090707 11:36:51< CIA-53> zookeeper * r36679 /trunk/data/campaigns/Under_the_Burning_Suns/scenarios/05_A_Subterranean_Struggle.cfg: Cleaned up some clumsy WML and changed duplicate id's to roles instead.
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20090707 11:44:43< MJ999> Errr...bugsy, if you have a replay that is corrupt in the middle, you cannot quit.
20090707 11:47:44< ilor_> hah, figured out why the minimap was getting empty map data. there's bit of code in the server that won't serve the mapdata to the lobby if a game uses shroud, and the code for loading map data from a local map by it's id is non-functional
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20090707 12:06:05< CIA-53> esr * r36680 /trunk/po/ (6 files in 6 dirs): British translation update.
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20090707 12:47:53< mordante> MJ999, euschn I guess YogiHH forgot to add a file in commit 36666, which causes the error
20090707 12:48:17< mordante> YogiHH you can also use the --new-widgets switch for testing if you want
20090707 12:48:24< mordante> I'm off again
20090707 12:48:34< MJ999> Devil commits. >.>
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20090707 12:49:56< mordante> yup
20090707 12:50:08< mordante> esr, »"../../data/campaigns/Under_the_Burning_Suns/scenarios/05_A_Subterranean_Struggle.cfg", line 1881: value should not have a translation mark«
20090707 12:50:28< euschn> mordante: yogihh already sent me the missing file which i commited
20090707 12:50:58< ilor_> mordante: can I control the minimap's size?
20090707 12:51:22< mordante> esr, they should have a marker since they're used translated see bug https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?13751
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20090707 12:51:30< silene> hi
20090707 12:51:34< mordante> hi silene 
20090707 12:51:37< euschn> hi silene
20090707 12:51:39< mordante> euschn, ok good
20090707 12:52:54< mordante> ilor, at the moment they have a fixed size, but I think I can change that, now that we have a stacked widget :-)
20090707 12:53:29< mordante> ilor, can't explain the details at the moment, but will try something this evening in my old mp create dialog
20090707 12:53:39< mordante> afk
20090707 12:54:25< ilor_> mordante: okay, also, would it take long for you to remove the need for having a dummy widget in a listbox header for every widget in it's body, with matching ids?
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20090707 14:15:58< CIA-53> euschn * r36681 /trunk/src/ (game_events.cpp menu_events.cpp replay.cpp): added population of team.recall_list_ in do_replay_handle()
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20090707 14:54:10< mordante> ilor_, I've been doing some thinking to avoid the dummy widgets and think I know a better way to handle linked widgets, but it might take some time before I can implement it
20090707 14:54:23< mordante> but want to discuss that later with you
20090707 14:54:43< ilor_> mordante: okay for now I can keep adding th empty labels
20090707 15:05:55< CIA-53> euschn * r36682 /trunk/src/ (game_preferences.cpp game_preferences.hpp): added encounter_recallable_units() with a vector<team> parameter
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20090707 15:36:22< CIA-53> soliton * r36683 /branches/1.6/src/multiplayer_lobby.cpp: mark unobservable games with missing eras red rather than grey
20090707 15:37:24-!- mordante [n=mordante@87.215.201.26] has quit ["Leaving"]
20090707 15:37:52< CIA-53> soliton * r36684 /trunk/src/multiplayer_lobby.cpp: mark unobservable games with missing eras red rather than grey
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20090707 16:12:04< fendrin> esr: ping
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20090707 17:15:20< CIA-53> euschn * r36685 /trunk/src/ (team.hpp upload_log.cpp): upload_lod::start() now uses the team recall list instead of player_info
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20090707 18:54:37< YogiHH> hello
20090707 18:56:23< Sirp> hi YogiHH 
20090707 19:00:57< ilor_> hi YogiHH, I can't recall whether you've gotten a response from mordante regarding small fonts in gui2 labels and I could use something like that, can you help? :)
20090707 19:01:37< YogiHH> ilor_: i can, you can try to use definition="default_small" ;-)
20090707 19:01:45< ilor_> ok :)
20090707 19:02:30< YogiHH> ilor_: and if that is not what you had in mind, have a look at the definition config file (right at the end). Not difficult to define a new one.
20090707 19:02:45-!- mordante [n=mordante@wesnoth/developer/mordante] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090707 19:02:56< mordante> servus
20090707 19:03:01< ilor_> hi mordante :)
20090707 19:03:10< mordante> hi ilor_ 
20090707 19:03:11< YogiHH> hi mordante, speaking of the devil... :-)
20090707 19:03:21< ilor_> YogiHH: won't need more than a simple smaller font for now
20090707 19:03:25< mordante> hi YogiHH 
20090707 19:04:32< ilor_> mordante: regarding hiding widgets, the doc for INVISIBLE says "find_widget never 'sees' the widget.", what does that mean?
20090707 19:06:02< grzywacz> hi
20090707 19:06:14< mordante> hi grzywacz 
20090707 19:06:43< mordante> ilor_, that an INVISIBLE widget is never finds the widget (but I'll update the documentation, since it only is true for the coordinate version)
20090707 19:07:21< ilor_> ah, makes sense for the coordinate version, but yeah better clarify that
20090707 19:08:11< mordante> I still think the overloaded name is a bad idea as well
20090707 19:08:23< mordante> do you have a suggestion for better names?
20090707 19:08:30< YogiHH> mordante: i learned today that displaying an image with timage is done via set_label(...) which looked a little counter-intuitive to me. Good that there is enough code to copy and paste from :-)
20090707 19:10:01< ilor_> mordante: not sure, maybe widget_at(point) ?
20090707 19:10:34< mordante> YogiHH, is it really that confusing?
20090707 19:10:50< mordante> ilor_, and what about only at, since it's a member function>
20090707 19:10:53< mordante> ?*
20090707 19:11:10< ilor_> mordante: I don't care much about the overload because all versions give the same result so it's not *that* confusing
20090707 19:11:11< YogiHH> well, i was looking for set_image first. set_label has a connotation of having something to do with text for me.
20090707 19:11:35< ilor_> mordante: you have find_widget() not find(), so I suggested widget_at() not at() :)
20090707 19:11:53< mordante> ilor_, except that one version honours the VISIBLE state and the other not
20090707 19:11:58< ilor_> and I'll have to agree with yogi on the label-means-image-source thing
20090707 19:12:08< mordante> that widget is in find widget is about to change ;-)
20090707 19:12:23< ilor_> mordante: yes but the pixel version has to handle overlapping widgets already so it's pretty intuitive
20090707 19:13:00< mordante> YogiHH, ilor_ you prefer extra documentation or a forwarding function?
20090707 19:13:30< YogiHH> mordante: i'd go for a forwarding function
20090707 19:14:00< ilor_> quite honestly since the image only has an image and no text I'd prefer if it didn't have a set_label function, but I'm guessin that's contrary to some basic design choice you've made
20090707 19:16:43< mordante> the set_label is to make code more generic
20090707 19:17:34< ilor_> mordante: yeah figured that out, it's just that "label" rally sounds like text data to be displayed
20090707 19:17:44< ilor_> *really
20090707 19:18:49< mordante> yeah, I know and thought about it as well, but wanted to keep consistency
20090707 19:19:08< mordante> there are some more places where names suffer due to consistency
20090707 19:20:16< Soliton> what does set_label mean elsewhere?
20090707 19:28:23< YogiHH> afk
20090707 19:28:58< ilor_> Soliton: apart from being the image source in timage I don't know
20090707 19:32:23< ilor_> mordante: what are valid values for a [column]'s border parameter, apart from "all"?
20090707 19:33:22< Soliton> ilor_: btw, are you keeping a setting for replay saving/publishing in mind?
20090707 19:34:21< ilor_> Soliton: not at the moment since that's more of a game creation thing that I'm not going to be touching much anytime soon
20090707 19:34:45< ilor_> Soliton: it's observable=published now?
20090707 19:35:00< Soliton> ilor_: yep.
20090707 19:35:30< Soliton> right, it's more of a game creation thing but should also be shown in the lobby like observable.
20090707 19:36:16< Soliton> as a quick solution i could actually implement a /query savereplay command...
20090707 19:36:40< ilor_> Soliton: what do you mean by replay saving here?
20090707 19:36:41< Soliton> might be nice to be able to toggle it in a running game anyway.
20090707 19:36:42< mordante> Soliton, set_label sets the text/label for a widget
20090707 19:36:59< mordante> ilor_,  left, right, top, bottom
20090707 19:37:17< Soliton> ilor_: well, really s/saving/publishing/.
20090707 19:37:24< ilor_> mordante: and if I want to set two borders?
20090707 19:38:09< Soliton> mordante: and it depends on the widget whether it is text or an image?
20090707 19:39:06< Soliton> i mean it can never be both?
20090707 19:39:42< mordante> ilor_, left, right should do the trick
20090707 19:39:52< ilor_> ah, so the comma is parsed, okay
20090707 19:40:09< mordante> Soliton, yes it's a generic name used for text boxes, label, images etc
20090707 19:41:58< Soliton> ok, doesn't seem so bad then.
20090707 19:42:47< ilor_> YogiHH: you sure the default_small thing works?
20090707 19:43:34< ilor_> so, mordante: smaller text in a [label], how to? :)
20090707 19:44:57< mordante> ilor_, the way YogiHH told you ;-)
20090707 19:45:41< mordante> [label]definition="default_small"
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20090707 19:46:40< ilor_> mordante: doesn't seemto work, same size as a nearby label with definition="default"
20090707 19:47:46< mordante> nearly the same or exactly the same?
20090707 19:48:35< ilor_> mordante: wait, maybe it is 1px shorter 
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20090707 19:49:35< mordante> the size should be 12 instead of 14
20090707 19:50:05< mordante> if it needs smaller you can add a new label definition and add a new size to data/gui/default/macros/_initial.cfg
20090707 19:50:45< mordante> the current engine also defines TINY with a size of 10
20090707 19:50:59< boucman> hey all
20090707 19:51:01< ilor_> mordante: okay, so definition="default_tiny" ?
20090707 19:52:13< ilor_> mordante: also have you considered adding a layout debug mode that'd, say, outline all grid cells with a 1px red border or something? :P
20090707 19:53:00< mordante> hi boucman 
20090707 19:53:40< mordante> ilor_, considered yes, implemented no (time, todo list, the usual stuff)
20090707 19:54:06< mordante> ilor_, yes, but you also need to add the definition, or should I?
20090707 19:54:16< ilor_> mordante: I'll do it
20090707 19:54:20< mordante> ok
20090707 19:58:15< ilor_> mordante: where is the default_small label definition?
20090707 19:59:03< mordante> ilor_,  data/gui/default/widget/label_default.cfg
20090707 19:59:30< ilor_> mordante: hm, I only see the default and title defs
20090707 19:59:54< mordante> YogiHH added it yesterday evening
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20090707 20:02:04< Ivanovic> cjhopman, crab_, corn, dragonking, euschn, ilor_: don't forget that it is time for the mid term evals, you got till monday to fill them out
20090707 20:06:21< grzywacz> Ivanovic, perhaps you feel like bisecting SDL changes to find out when the crackling started? Or maybe emu10k1? ;-)
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20090707 20:23:06< grzywacz> Ivanovic, I've moved back to December 2007 with SDL and it's still crackling.
20090707 20:23:16< grzywacz> Ivanovic, at this point I'm going to try with kernel....
20090707 20:24:29< YogiHH> Ivanovic: euschn did his already
20090707 20:25:52< Ivanovic> YogiHH: okay
20090707 20:27:40< ilor_> mordante: are there any "special" button ids apart from quit, cancel, ok and help?
20090707 20:29:09< mordante> ilor_, yes have a look at twindow::get_retval_by_id
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20090707 20:42:16< CIA-53> jhinrichs * r36686 /trunk/ (7 files in 3 dirs): Load-game dialog: Cleaning up and adding leader image support.
20090707 20:44:28< stikonas> grzywacz: BTW, vultures suffer from the same crackling sound if small buffer is used
20090707 20:49:49< CIA-53> ilor * r36687 /trunk/ (10 files in 4 dirs): another bit of the new lobby. Shows the minimap, more useful info in the gamelist and also fixed preferences dialog display glitch
20090707 20:51:12< CIA-53> ilor * r36688 /trunk/data/gui/default/ (3 files in 3 dirs): add a TINY font size in gui2 and a default_tiny label definition, used it in new lobby
20090707 20:51:35< CIA-53> ilor * r36689 /trunk/ (7 files in 3 dirs): remove background from some icons so they look better in newlobby, added as separate images
20090707 20:57:40< mordante> ilor_, you have some time to have a look at the FR's you have for me?
20090707 20:58:06< ilor_> mordante: yes, what do you have in mind?
20090707 20:58:26< mordante> just want to get an overview and the priority of the things
20090707 20:58:56< ilor_> mordante: well I don't have them written down sadly, so let me remember ;)
20090707 20:59:11< mordante> my todo list is growing fast again, which I don't like and want to forget things
20090707 20:59:48< mordante> is the listbox rows removal working now?
20090707 20:59:54< ilor_> mordante: yes seems fine
20090707 20:59:57< mordante> good
20090707 21:00:18< mordante> shall I type my list here?
20090707 21:00:22< ilor_> there's the enter-closes-dialog thing which's related to having enter in the chat input do a send-message
20090707 21:00:33< ilor_> mordante: oh, that would be better
20090707 21:01:01< mordante> clicking on a button etc in a listbox doesn't work
20090707 21:01:32< mordante> when a listbox without items, gets an item you need to do an invalidate manually
20090707 21:01:55< mordante> want to get rid of the fixed size of the minimap
20090707 21:02:23< mordante> want to get rid of the dummy header items
20090707 21:02:25< ilor_> having to call the invalidate_layout is not a big deal
20090707 21:03:19< mordante> might be, but it's silly and tricky if you don't know it
20090707 21:03:47< mordante> that's my list of items, did I miss any (except the enter which you mentioned) ?
20090707 21:04:23< ilor_> there's some I haven't mentioned yet ;)
20090707 21:04:41< ilor_> is it possible to scroll a listbox from c++ to a specific point?
20090707 21:04:45< Soliton> YogiHH, euschn: http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=366291#p366291
20090707 21:06:37< mordante> ilor_, no but it can be added, by exposing set_item_position of the scrollbar
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20090707 21:07:08< ilor_> mordante: ok it's not critical now but might be necessary later
20090707 21:07:09< boucman> hey Crab_
20090707 21:07:14< Crab_> hi, boucman
20090707 21:07:18< YogiHH> Soliton: ok, will answer to that
20090707 21:08:52< ilor_> mordante: enter issue is probably the most annoying as it's a very basic thing that doesn't work yet
20090707 21:09:25< ilor_> minimap size, buttons in listbox and dummy header items are all for the improved gamelist
20090707 21:11:20< CIA-53> mcshark * r36690 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/game_load.cpp: Fix compiler warning about "no newline at end of file"
20090707 21:11:52< ilor_> mordante: also, I've an idea on how to implement the selected-item-has-different-layout thing without too much work on your part
20090707 21:12:35< mordante> ok, I've upped the priority of that item
20090707 21:12:46< mordante> what do you mean with  selected-item-has-different-layout?
20090707 21:13:02< CIA-53> mcshark * r36691 /trunk/projectfiles/ (CodeBlocks/wesnoth.cbp CodeBlocks-SCons/wesnoth.cbp): Update according to recent file changes
20090707 21:13:35< ilor_> in the listbox teh original plan was to display all games in a very compact form, mostly icons, and the selected game with more info, join buttons, etc
20090707 21:14:17< ilor_> I think it should be possible already bu having a listbox row be two rows in a subgrid and having one of those rows hidden, updating when the selected row changes
20090707 21:15:29< mordante> ilor_, oh that part, yeah I think it should already work as well, not even sure whether you need two rows or one row with some hidden widgets
20090707 21:15:37< mordante> s/hidden/invisible/
20090707 21:15:54< ilor_> mordante: the expanded version might need a different amount of rows inside
20090707 21:17:06< mordante> are we talking about grid rows in _1_ listbox row or several listbox rows?
20090707 21:17:27< Crab_> boucman: I'm thinking about using a structure like http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/m348b62a5 to represent 'possible action plans'
20090707 21:18:19< Crab_> Ivanovic: thanks for reminding, done already.
20090707 21:18:23< boucman> checking...
20090707 21:18:35< Crab_> note the idea on the last line
20090707 21:19:27< ilor_> mordante: one lisbox row 
20090707 21:19:27-!- kitty_ [n=kitty@e180203198.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090707 21:19:28< Crab_> basically, it's "allow candidate actions to return something like "hey, move here AND THEN a local rca loop can be a good idea"
20090707 21:20:08< kitty_> hi
20090707 21:20:14< boucman> hey kitty_
20090707 21:20:15< ilor_> mordante: but for instance the short version might have two lines in the main description area, and the long version - three
20090707 21:20:33< boucman> Crab_: not sure I understand completely your structure
20090707 21:20:40< Crab_> a tree of actions
20090707 21:20:45< mordante> hi kitty_ 
20090707 21:20:58< boucman> i.e you have a "plan" in the item, but you also have items_
20090707 21:21:18< mordante> ilor_, ok, I thought you meant several listbox rows
20090707 21:21:33< Crab_> boucman:   action_plan_item &parent_;  --link to parent action   action_plan &plan_;  -- link to 'top'
20090707 21:21:36< mordante> so yeah several grid rows would be the solution I was also thinking of
20090707 21:22:05< boucman> oh, ok, makes sense now
20090707 21:22:39< boucman> it might be better to use a vector of pair(child, score) instead of two vectors, but that's an implementation detail
20090707 21:22:55< boucman> i'nvm my last line, it's stupid
20090707 21:23:23< Crab_> boucman: maybe you're meant 'priority queue by score' :)
20090707 21:23:48< boucman> nope, I thought something even more stupid, I thought it was a list of score for the matching childs :)
20090707 21:24:09< Crab_> boucman: so, the candidate action will return such an 'action plan', and in it, it will state a bunch of actions it thinks are 'good'
20090707 21:24:38< Crab_> and, it will explicitly state places where it thinks that 'a local rca evaluation will be good'
20090707 21:24:49< ilor_> mordante: also, wiki page updated, and I think that since I'm getting good progress now I should reach the 2nd milestone on time, if slightly underpolished
20090707 21:25:16< boucman> so an "action plan" is a list of alternative candidate actions, not a serie of actions to do one after the other...
20090707 21:25:16< mordante> :-)
20090707 21:25:38< mordante> more items you want me to do, which I don't know about yet?
20090707 21:25:38< Crab_> boucman:  action plan is serie of actions to do one after the other.
20090707 21:25:46< boucman> ok
20090707 21:25:56< boucman> then what are the childs ?
20090707 21:27:17< ilor_> mordante: thinking
20090707 21:27:35< ilor_> mordante: gui2 context menus are some time off aren't they?
20090707 21:27:44< Crab_> boucman: I'll show by example: imagine a candidate action which says 'move a unit with leadership   forward,  close to enemies, and then see if any good actions appear'
20090707 21:28:16< boucman> ok
20090707 21:28:36< mordante> ilor_, yes menus are off for now
20090707 21:28:43< Crab_> this CA will return a plan with root element of 'move of unit with leadership' with only child 'mini-rca-loop(near leaders_move)'
20090707 21:28:59-!- ABCD [n=ABCD@wikipedia/ABCD] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090707 21:29:30< ilor_> mordante: so the only other thing seems to be general help in positioning stuff so it all expands predictably, we're set for friday evening for that
20090707 21:29:31< Crab_> then, we'll run that mini-rca-loop (in a hypotetical situation after that leader's move), and we'll get a bunch of good candidate actions
20090707 21:29:40< boucman> ok
20090707 21:30:04< mordante> ok ilor_, can you give your priority to the items?
20090707 21:30:06< Crab_> boucman: but, this 'good candidate actions in a hypotetical situation' share a common parent
20090707 21:30:59< Crab_> boucman: so, I thought about making a tree-like structure to avoid copying/reevaluation of the parent move
20090707 21:31:26< ilor_> mordante: enter button first, minimap second, dummy header items third, buttons on listbox fourth
20090707 21:32:07< boucman> so the final structure would be
20090707 21:32:36< boucman> move leader -> sub-rca-> move1
20090707 21:32:36< boucman>                                        -> move2
20090707 21:32:42< ilor_> mordante: I can live with the buttons not working there and having them global for a while, it's not stopping me from doing anything, unlike the other 3 issues
20090707 21:33:21< Crab_> move leader -> move1
20090707 21:33:22< Crab_>                      -> move2
20090707 21:33:39< Crab_> ('sub-rca' can be removed after expansion)
20090707 21:33:44< boucman> ok
20090707 21:33:48< Crab_> note that it can be:
20090707 21:34:09< boucman> how do you plan on handling actions with multiple outputs like fight ?
20090707 21:34:11< Crab_> move leader -> move1  -> sub-rca 
20090707 21:34:11< Crab_>                      -> move2
20090707 21:34:59< Crab_> this will allow to do a 'deep search' of a small number of positions, suggested by candidate actions which use that sub-rca
20090707 21:35:52< Crab_> boucman: at first, I'll try most naive thing - full branching, and i'll see how it turns out
20090707 21:36:20< Crab_> boucman: note that 'leadership' is handled by 'sub-rca after movement'
20090707 21:36:22< mordante> ilor_, oke, I put up the first three items on top of my list after that I want to look at the stacked widget for grzywacz and then your fourth item
20090707 21:36:28< boucman> Crab_: ok, but for each possible output, you need to have it's probability somewhere...
20090707 21:36:42< Crab_> boucman: yes
20090707 21:36:58< boucman> and in your tree structure, there is no place to store the gamestate+associated probability, do you intend to have this purely in sub-classes
20090707 21:37:02< Crab_> boucman: I'll reuse attack_analysis
20090707 21:37:16< boucman> ok
20090707 21:37:17< mordante> and then I finally hope to have time to fix the wml_dialogs...
20090707 21:39:42< Crab_> boucman: regarding ' gamestate+associated probability' - it will be calculated on-demand, only if mini-rca is present
20090707 21:40:02< Crab_> boucman: and yes, I'll need to store that probabilities in there, after that
20090707 21:40:45< boucman> ok
20090707 21:40:59< boucman> still coding the AI save tag right now ?
20090707 21:41:11< Crab_> boucman: yes
20090707 21:42:36< ilor_> mordante: ok great, I'm afk now and will be offline for most of tomorrow, maybe will check in in the evening
20090707 21:42:47< boucman> ok, is it more complicated that you anticipated ?
20090707 21:43:55< mordante> ilor_, ok, I won't be around tomorrow or only short
20090707 21:45:34< Crab_> boucman: well, I'm moving slowly because I want to ensure it works ok, because I don't want for saves to be broken. Also, I've lost some work time on weekend.
20090707 21:45:41< CIA-53> mordante * r36692 /trunk/src/gui/ (19 files in 2 dirs): 
20090707 21:45:41< CIA-53> Remove the NEW_ prefix for the layout functions.
20090707 21:45:41< CIA-53> The functions seem to work and the old functions are gone long enough so
20090707 21:45:41< CIA-53> drop the prefix.
20090707 21:45:45< CIA-53> mordante * r36693 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/ (image.cpp image.hpp): 
20090707 21:45:45< CIA-53> Add some set|get_image helpers.
20090707 21:45:46< CIA-53> The usage of label is deemed confusing so add some wrappers.
20090707 21:45:50< CIA-53> mordante * r36694 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/game_load.cpp: Fix a compiler warning.
20090707 21:45:54< CIA-53> mordante * r36695 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/ (6 files): Make find_widget<T> a freestanding function.
20090707 21:45:58< CIA-53> mordante * r36696 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/lobby_main.cpp: Fix a compiler warning.
20090707 21:46:19< boucman> Crab_: no problem, I'm just interested on what you're actually doing, not only design and future plans :)
20090707 21:46:53< Crab_> ok. this will take a few more days.
20090707 21:48:29< boucman> ok
20090707 21:48:52-!- grzywacz [n=grzywacz@wesnoth/developer/grzywacz] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
20090707 21:49:14< Crab_> so, expect that committed around thursday
20090707 21:52:33< boucman> ok, sounds good
20090707 21:59:44< mordante> kitty_, the modification of the wml_dialogs have to wait a little bit longer :-( ilor wants me to some things so he can continue with his GSoC project
20090707 22:00:13< mordante> but I want to work on it soon afterwards
20090707 22:00:31< kitty_> mordante: no hurry, as long as it is done sometime ;)
20090707 22:00:34-!- maxy [n=maxy@80-219-1-128.dclient.hispeed.ch] has quit []
20090707 22:01:02< mordante> kitty_, yeah, but I wanted to have it done by now :-/ but new things keep popping up
20090707 22:01:18< kitty_> that's normal...
20090707 22:01:38< mordante> true, but still annoying
20090707 22:10:15-!- Blueblaze [n=nick@c-98-199-143-139.hsd1.tx.comcast.net] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
20090707 22:11:33< boucman> kitty_: about http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=366315#p366315
20090707 22:11:46< kitty_> yes?
20090707 22:12:02< boucman> next time, tell the artist you want him to guess, this way we can all try to guess and see if we are wrong, instead of uselessly helping :)
20090707 22:13:00< kitty_> yes, that would have been wiser... i tend to forget how much fun all the forum guys have giving "helpfull" insights
20090707 22:13:24 * boucman pleads guilty :P
20090707 22:13:37< kitty_> hih? when?
20090707 22:14:30< boucman> well, i've been lurking the help forum since ~2003, so I know I did it a couple of time, but can't spot a specific place...
20090707 22:15:16< kitty_> anyways, I was thinking of other people :P generally comments by non-artists are good, fresh eyes can spot a lot of things!
20090707 22:15:33< kitty_> but rather for spotting problems not for solving them
20090707 22:16:25< boucman> yes, now our community tend to understand that, but trust me, it hasn't always been the case
20090707 22:17:15< kitty_> it was even worse in the past ?!
20090707 22:19:41< boucman> oh yes, trust me...
20090707 22:20:05< boucman> there were people actively attacking artists for not following their "advice"
20090707 22:20:33< boucman> and advices could be totally wrong, like "this is cool, but you should do it manga style with huge swords and ridiculous hairs"
20090707 22:20:55< boucman> these type of advice might still come from newcomers, but the community usually reacts faster than the artist :P
20090707 22:21:01< kitty_> yay, for our  tough moderators!
20090707 22:21:06< Rrenys> & sgt. groovy scared away the guy who made HTTT story images :P
20090707 22:21:28< boucman> it's not just the moderators (though they do a great job) it's the community as a whole that has learnt to behave.
20090707 22:21:43< kitty_> I would have loved to work with johann. A single comment from him would heve meant a lot :(
20090707 22:21:57< boucman> Rrenys: I don't remember if it was Sgt Groovy, but it was not a criticism issue, it was licensing
20090707 22:22:34< kitty_> it's still sad, for whatever reason
20090707 22:22:54< Rrenys> Oh, I just remember sgt groovy had some big issues with him (& shadow_master somehow managed to mod the thread in a way that only deteriorated it), i assumed it was that
20090707 22:24:50< Turuk> Boucman: The community has learned, through blunt application of reminding them constantly of the Critique Guidelines :P  So many PMs sent.....
20090707 22:25:57 * kitty_ hands Turuk a cookie
20090707 22:26:11< boucman> Turuk: indeed, but it did work :)
20090707 22:26:22 * Turuk takes the cookie gratefully.
20090707 22:27:03< Turuk> Indeed, I agree that I can now rely on users to correct other users when they step out of line, but it just took some legwork to remind certain people that such behavior would not fly.
20090707 22:27:06-!- fendrin [n=fabi@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
20090707 22:27:14< Turuk> Also, apologies kitty for pointing out the thumb bit that you wanted him to learn.
20090707 22:28:06< kitty_> no need to apologise, sometimes figuring out things on your own is the best way to learn and remember stuff
20090707 22:30:32< mordante> I'm off night
20090707 22:31:18-!- mordante [n=mordante@wesnoth/developer/mordante] has quit ["Leaving"]
20090707 22:32:07< Turuk> Yeah, but I'm no artist, I don't need to learn :P
20090707 22:32:19< CIA-53> ivanovic * r36697 /trunk/ (9 files in 8 dirs): updated Slovak translation
20090707 22:32:28< CIA-53> ivanovic * r36698 /branches/1.6/ (9 files in 8 dirs): updated Slovak translation
20090707 22:35:39< kitty_> Turuk: but tsi is supposed to learn in the course of wsas... 9.9 
20090707 22:36:30< Turuk> Exactly, so if I answer your statements, I'm not helping him figure it out on his own. ;)
20090707 22:37:46< kitty_> but perhaps there is a sleeping artist inside of you just waiting to get out :P
20090707 22:38:36< zookeeper> kitty_, is there a reason why monster unit portraits aren't usually suggested for new portrait artists when giving them ideas on what to work on?
20090707 22:39:10< zookeeper> i've just noticed that usually it's the more usual core unit lines which are suggested and i'm not sure if anyone minds if i always point out the monsters as a possibility too.
20090707 22:39:33< boucman> zookeeper: my guess : it's harder because you usually can't work with ref
20090707 22:40:07< kitty_> no  important reason, I just assumed they'll get less dialogue time generally. I suggest mmonsters if i see someone with a style that looks like it could lend itself to meonsters. e. g. if captain swing had stayed...
20090707 22:40:33< kitty_> but we will get to them, too! promised!
20090707 22:41:18< kitty_> and boucman no, they aren't really more difficult. just different. less available ref also means less retrictions, more creative freedom etc. can be fun too
20090707 22:41:21< zookeeper> all right. i've just thought that they'd be a good first step for new artists since they're all single units instead of whole unit lines and there's a _bit_ more leeway regarding the style in general.
20090707 22:41:41< kitty_> uhm, no. 
20090707 22:42:00< kitty_> why should there be more stylistic freedom there?
20090707 22:42:24< zookeeper> because stylistic inconsistency isn't as apparent when there's no other similar units to compare to
20090707 22:42:44< kitty_> look at that awfull scorpion...
20090707 22:43:24< zookeeper> if the revenant portrait is stylistically a bit different than the skeleton and draug, it's gonna be much more obvious than if the fire dragon portrait is stylistically a bit different from the other units
20090707 22:43:38< zookeeper> and really, i just meant a bit, not a lot ;)
20090707 22:43:46< kitty_> but generally you're right. I'll add them to the list of easy starting points :)
20090707 22:43:50< boucman> thespaceinvader: btw, we've discussed your portrait so much that I forgot...
20090707 22:43:55< boucman> your animations are great :)
20090707 22:44:17< thespaceinvader> thanks boucman 
20090707 22:44:17< kitty_> indeed! (as far as i can tell) :D
20090707 22:45:08-!- elias [n=allefant@allegro/developer/allefant] has quit [Read error: 110 (Connection timed out)]
20090707 22:45:53-!- busfahrer` [n=busfahre@ulmg-5f70cf40.pool.einsundeins.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090707 22:45:53-!- elias [n=allefant@allegro/developer/allefant] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090707 22:48:01< kitty_> thespaceinvader: if you post a revision for the portrait at the end of the week I'll be able to crit it monday the earliest. We'll have our big semester end exhibition starting friday plus I'll be away over the weekend. sorry.
20090707 22:48:19< thespaceinvader> yeah, i should be able to do that, kitty
20090707 22:48:25< thespaceinvader> maybe tomorrow, if you're lucky
20090707 22:49:06< kitty_> I don't know when I'll be able to squeeze in the outlaw to make the first deadline arg.
20090707 22:49:21< MJ999> Any dev on who could submit a patch?
20090707 22:49:49< boucman> MJ999: that would most likely be me, at least for triaging
20090707 22:49:50< Sirp> MJ999: submit a patch or approve a patch?
20090707 22:49:59< boucman> but please submit to patches.wesnoth.org
20090707 22:50:20-!- AnMaster [n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster] has quit [Nick collision from services.]
20090707 22:50:36< shadowmaster> Rrenys: yeah, I suppose you'd have done it better.
20090707 22:51:11< MJ999> I've usually just been posting them to the pastebin and someone commits them from there.
20090707 22:52:07< Soliton> well, if it's just a one line change, go ahead.
20090707 22:52:18< boucman> if it's a one liner, that's fine, but bigger patches should go through the site
20090707 22:52:25< MJ999> Err...4 liner. :P
20090707 22:52:38< boucman> ok, still good ;)
20090707 22:52:41< MJ999> http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/d1bcd59d0
20090707 22:53:46< Sirp> !? why was that in a for loop in the first place?
20090707 22:54:16< MJ999> I am simply the discoverer. Not the cause.
20090707 22:54:44< boucman> Sirp: that's not an area I know well, care to commit ?
20090707 22:54:50< boucman> (or at least validate, I can commit)
20090707 22:54:59< Sirp> boucman: I will validate....at workand allthat so not committing.
20090707 22:55:07< Sirp> boucman: lgtm
20090707 22:55:14< boucman> lgtm ,
20090707 22:55:15< boucman> ?
20090707 22:55:38 * Soliton guesses "looks good to me"
20090707 22:56:07< boucman> ok
20090707 22:57:02< Sirp> yes.
20090707 22:57:44< boucman> ok, comitting
20090707 22:57:46< MJ999> The code isn't used frequently, and the benefit is minimal, but it might be needed later on. :P
20090707 22:58:08< Rrenys> shadowmaster, i totally wouldve!
20090707 22:58:15< boucman> Sirp: note that these two are not strictly equivalent, (afaict without looking at what find_vacant do)
20090707 22:58:16< Sirp> well cleaning up poorly written code is always worthwhile
20090707 22:58:44< boucman> since the "i" param is given as a variable instead of a fixed 50
20090707 22:58:51< MJ999> Simply fixes a check for a vacant tile down from looking (1,1,2,1,2,3,1,2,3,4...) down to (1,2,3,4).
20090707 22:58:56< Rrenys> I would have banned sgt groovy, and elevated johann quickly to Art Developer++ so that he would feel bad about leaving
20090707 22:59:18< Sirp> boucman: I think it's still good, as MJ999 says
20090707 22:59:29< boucman> ok, just making sure
20090707 22:59:29< Sirp> MJ999: I assume you've tested it?
20090707 22:59:51< MJ999> Yup, worked fine.
20090707 22:59:51-!- fendrin [n=fabi@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090707 22:59:55< boucman> Rrenys: wouldn't have worked, as I said it was mostly a GPL problem
20090707 22:59:57< Sirp> johann is the fellow who drew those HTTT storyline images, right?
20090707 23:00:01< boucman> yes
20090707 23:00:28< Sirp> yeah though I'm not sure I can always condone sgt groovy's approach, I think johann has sufficient personality/gpl issues that he is fundamentally incompatible with Wesnoth.
20090707 23:00:59< Sirp> which is unfortunate, since he is obviously a highly talented artist.
20090707 23:01:12< boucman> btw it's been a long time since we last heard of Neo...
20090707 23:01:23< Sirp> boucman: of Neorice?
20090707 23:01:28< boucman> yup
20090707 23:01:34< Ivanovic> ages to be more precise
20090707 23:01:42< kitty_> perhaps tsi's work will spark his interest?
20090707 23:02:03< boucman> I hope so
20090707 23:02:03< Soliton> MJ999: does that really produce the same pattern? looks to me like it'd be a depth first search now.
20090707 23:03:00< Sirp> boucman: he's working with Jetryl and I on Frogatto, though at the moment he's taking a break altogether due to his parents wanting him to concentrate on school.
20090707 23:03:00-!- AnMaster [n=AnMaster@unaffiliated/anmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090707 23:03:03< Sirp> he's also doing a webcomic.
20090707 23:03:16< kitty_> link?
20090707 23:03:20< MJ999> Soliton, yes I tested it on THoT. Units move to destination accordingly.
20090707 23:03:21-!- Aethaeryn [n=Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #Wesnoth-dev
20090707 23:04:10 * Soliton wonders how that works.
20090707 23:04:27< Aethaeryn> http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=12&t=21094 <- did anything ever come of this idea?
20090707 23:04:48< Sirp> kitty_: http://www.neorice.com -- Neorice's web comic http://www.frogatto.com -- the game me, Neorice, and Jetryl are working on
20090707 23:05:09< MJ999> Soliton, recursively through line 65.
20090707 23:05:14< boucman> Sirp: you should add a couple screenshots to your website :)
20090707 23:05:23< Sirp> boucman: actually crimson_penguin manages it. :)
20090707 23:05:30< Sirp> and I agree. :)
20090707 23:05:30< kitty_> frogatto is fun -  and pretty! I just didn't know about the comic 
20090707 23:05:31< Aethaeryn> Sirp: A and S?
20090707 23:05:47< Soliton> MJ999: well, that is exactly the point, doesn't the recursion go into adj[0] direction first until depth is reached?
20090707 23:05:49< Aethaeryn> Sirp: For controls, I've found A and Z are more convenient for platformers
20090707 23:05:53< Aethaeryn> and other side-scrollers
20090707 23:06:01< Sirp> Aethaeryn: we like A and S
20090707 23:06:07< Aethaeryn> Would it be possible to have the movement customizable?
20090707 23:06:08< Sirp> Aethaeryn: it'll be configurable though.
20090707 23:06:10< Aethaeryn> I'm just so used to A/Z
20090707 23:06:19< Aethaeryn> And I'm sure A/Z is a common secondary
20090707 23:06:19< Sirp> sure, eventually
20090707 23:06:36< Aethaeryn> It's just more "natural" to rest my pointer finger on z rather than s, at least for me.
20090707 23:07:12< Aethaeryn> Maybe it's just my tighter laptop keyboard
20090707 23:10:22< Sirp> I prefer A and S but I can see A and Z...
20090707 23:10:37< Aethaeryn> Yeah, both make sense, I guess it's just the games I've been playing made me used to it.
20090707 23:10:54< boucman> you sure you are both using the same keyboard ? :)
20090707 23:11:03< Aethaeryn> I'm using the US yes
20090707 23:11:18< fendrin> Sirp: may I bug you with the http://www.wesnoth.org/cgi-bin/stats/stats.pl? It's not working anymore.
20090707 23:11:20< MJ999> Soliton, checked and yes you're right. Units choose NW locations first.
20090707 23:11:25< Aethaeryn> The point is that both my fingers "rest" on A and Z, while they have to be curved more on A/S.
20090707 23:11:56< MJ999> Soliton, though with a little adjusting it should be made so that the set does not clear every iteration.
20090707 23:11:57< Rrenys> At least not on my keyboard?
20090707 23:12:49< Aethaeryn> For me, A/Z are the keys next to capslock and shift respectively.
20090707 23:12:59< boucman> MJ999: should I delay comitting ?
20090707 23:13:06< Aethaeryn> But it's really a really minor thing...
20090707 23:13:07< MJ999> boucman, yes.
20090707 23:13:11< Soliton> MJ999: sure, it'd be good to have find_vacant work breadth first by itself.
20090707 23:13:21< Ivanovic> fendrin: this is intentional
20090707 23:13:40< Ivanovic> fendrin: currently the database is too large to allow an access without stalling the server
20090707 23:13:49< boucman> k
20090707 23:13:53< Sirp> fendrin: bug corn and dfranke .... it's a GSoC project to make a new/better stats system.
20090707 23:14:13< Sirp> and importantly, a scalable one.
20090707 23:14:51< fendrin> I see.
20090707 23:15:51< Aethaeryn> Sirp: Jetryl mentioned that WML is a lot more advanced in later games you've worked on...
20090707 23:16:06< Aethaeryn> Any chance in some of those features getting backported to Wesnoth?
20090707 23:16:39< boucman> Aethaeryn: FAI arrived that way
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20090707 23:19:22< Sirp> what boucman said; also cjhopman is working on some optimization ideas I've had for SoC
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20090707 23:34:57< grzywacz> Ivanovic, also: http://www.nabble.com/-BUG---audio-cracking-with-SBLive,-ALSA,-and-SDL-td23380082.html
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20090707 23:41:38< boucman> MJ999: going to bed, so feel free to ask someone to commit once you're done
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--- Log closed Wed Jul 08 00:00:12 2009