--- Log opened Sun Jul 26 00:00:26 2009
--- Day changed Sun Jul 26 2009
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20090726 01:30:36< ancestral> Goblin Poker: poker with no face cards?
20090726 01:31:43< keb> goblins dont have royalty?
20090726 01:32:28< ancestral> Oh they do, it's just whoever survives the longest, and has the largest stick
20090726 01:32:44< ancestral> Also, Goblins can rarely count higher than 10
20090726 01:34:38< keb> i wouldnt know, i never met one i didnt kill :/
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20090726 01:53:21< ancestral> Okay, so in Wesnoth, are they Wargs or Worgs?
20090726 01:54:01< ancestral> EoM uses Wargs so we'll go with that
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20090726 03:08:52< ancestral> Alright, who's good with names?
20090726 03:11:10< Vornicus> Like remembering them, or coming up with them?
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20090726 03:18:44< ancestral> Coming up with a name for aunit
20090726 03:19:32< ancestral> So I need a unit name for a level 4 or 5 Naga Myrmidon
20090726 03:20:09< ancestral> Wait, I may have found one
20090726 03:21:01< Turuk_> Juggernaut
20090726 03:21:18< ancestral> I think that's your answer to everything :P
20090726 03:21:29 * Vornicus examines Myrmidons.
20090726 03:21:43< ancestral> Well it has a Greek root
20090726 03:21:46< ancestral> Hmm
20090726 03:22:03< ancestral> Eh that's fine
20090726 03:22:08< ancestral> I might go with Centuriom
20090726 03:22:17< ancestral> *Centurion, though of course it's Roman
20090726 03:22:23< ancestral> But this is Wesnoth, no one cares
20090726 03:22:51< Vornicus> It's a... naga myrmidon.  Okay, let's see.
20090726 03:23:40< ancestral> Historically, a member of the elite soldiers who fought against Troy or with Achilles or something like that
20090726 03:24:04 * ancestral didn't study ancient Greece much
20090726 03:26:06< Vornicus> RIght, I see this.
20090726 03:26:43 * Vornicus ponders.
20090726 03:27:24< Vornicus> Naga Commando!
20090726 03:27:25< Vornicus> :P
20090726 03:27:28-!- Aethaeryn [n=Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #Wesnoth
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20090726 03:30:09< Aethaeryn> Anyone up for a game?
20090726 03:31:10< ancestral> Perhaps…
20090726 03:31:41< Turuk_> Perhaps...
20090726 03:32:34< Aethaeryn> lol
20090726 03:32:43< ancestral> I'm logging into the server
20090726 03:32:46< Aethaeryn> I was thinking one of my maps because I don't get to playtest them too much.
20090726 03:33:51< ancestral> One of the nice things about developing an era is your cache often goes bad and leaves the game unstable
20090726 03:34:31< Turuk_> the man who wants the game is not in the lobby....
20090726 03:34:32< Turuk_> hmm
20090726 03:34:52< Aethaeryn> Closing other windows.
20090726 03:35:03< Aethaeryn> In now.
20090726 03:35:33< Aethaeryn> I have a 3v1 I used to play all the time.
20090726 03:35:48< Aethaeryn> I still love that map.
20090726 03:36:07< Aethaeryn> Not a 2v2 though. If you'd prefer a 2v2 I could play a "standard" game.
20090726 03:36:18< Aethaeryn> I'm not opposed to that, as long as I'm in a game with good people.
20090726 03:38:01-!- name [n=name@sburn/devel/name] has quit ["Lost terminal"]
20090726 03:38:15< Turuk_> aww a celebrity moment
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20090726 03:58:14< Turuk_> Aethaeryn: are you moving?
20090726 03:58:57< Aethaeryn> Turuk_: problems?
20090726 03:59:05< Turuk_> it times out for me sometimes
20090726 03:59:08< Aethaeryn> oh
20090726 03:59:12< Aethaeryn> Need it back now?
20090726 03:59:22< Aethaeryn> or is the Turuk observing a ghost?
20090726 03:59:41< Turuk_> let me back in please
20090726 03:59:41< Turuk_> it happens from time to time
20090726 04:03:18< Vornicus> Naga Sardaukar!  ...no.
20090726 04:03:25< Vornicus> ...Naga marines?
20090726 04:03:29< Vornicus> ...no.
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20090726 04:17:49< Vornicus> Actually I kind of like Naga Marines.
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20090726 04:29:23< Zarel> :/
20090726 04:29:34< Zarel> Apparently my name was mentioned sometime in the last five days.
20090726 04:29:37< Zarel> I should really check IRC more.
20090726 04:31:16< shadowmaster> we have logs
20090726 04:32:11< Zarel> Oh, great, thanks!
20090726 04:33:28-!- conor [n=conor@c-67-180-158-41.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth
20090726 04:33:37< conor> hoi
20090726 04:33:40< conor> i need some halp
20090726 04:34:20< shadowmaster> Sure, I'm dying to know what exactly you need help with.
20090726 04:34:47< conor> haha. i need some help with a macro to recruit on villages instead of a castle
20090726 04:35:01< conor> i frankensteined the one from empires
20090726 04:35:11< conor> its not very good though lol
20090726 04:35:43< conor> mind if i paste here?
20090726 04:36:00< conor> (its pretty empty)
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20090726 04:36:24< conor> aite im going for it
20090726 04:36:33< conor> #define OPTION UNIT PRICE MSG
20090726 04:36:33< conor> [option]
20090726 04:36:33< conor> 	message=_ {MSG}
20090726 04:36:33< conor> 	[command]
20090726 04:36:33< conor> 		[if]
20090726 04:36:34< conor> 			[variable]
20090726 04:36:36< conor> 				name=gold
20090726 04:36:38< conor> 				greater_than_equal_to={PRICE}
20090726 04:36:40< conor> 			[/variable]
20090726 04:36:42< conor> 		[then]
20090726 04:36:46< conor> 			[gold]
20090726 04:36:48< conor> 					amount=-{PRICE}
20090726 04:36:50< conor> 					side=$side_number
20090726 04:36:52< conor> 			[/gold]
20090726 04:36:54< conor> 			[unit]
20090726 04:36:56< conor> 				type={UNIT}
20090726 04:36:58< conor> 				side=$side_number
20090726 04:37:00< conor> 				x=$x1
20090726 04:37:02< conor> 				y=$y1
20090726 04:37:04< conor> 				generate_name=yes
20090726 04:37:06< conor> 				random_traits=yes
20090726 04:37:06< Vornicus> ack
20090726 04:37:08< conor> 				random_gender=yesrunemaster is
20090726 04:37:10< conor> 			[/unit]
20090726 04:37:12< conor> 			[store_unit]
20090726 04:37:16< conor> 				[filter]
20090726 04:37:18< conor> 					x=$x1
20090726 04:37:20< Vornicus> Use pastebins.
20090726 04:37:20< conor> 					y=$y1
20090726 04:37:22< conor> 				[/filter]
20090726 04:37:24< conor> 				kill=yes
20090726 04:37:26< conor> 				variable=tempstore
20090726 04:37:28< conor> 			[/store_unit]
20090726 04:37:30< conor> 			{VARIABLE tempstore.attacks_left 0}
20090726 04:37:32< conor> 			{VARIABLE tempstore.moves no}
20090726 04:37:34< conor> 			[unstore_unit]
20090726 04:37:36< conor> 				variable=tempstore
20090726 04:37:37-!- mode/#wesnoth [+o shadowmaster] by ChanServ
20090726 04:37:38< Bilbo_Ba1gins> Pastebin
20090726 04:37:38< conor> 			[/unstore_unit]
20090726 04:37:39-!- conor [n=conor@c-67-180-158-41.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] has left #wesnoth [requested by shadowmaster]
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20090726 04:37:52< conor> 				side_for=$side_number
20090726 04:37:54< conor> 				message=_ "Insufficient Funds"
20090726 04:37:56< conor> 				speaker=narrator
20090726 04:37:58< conor> 			[/message]
20090726 04:37:58< Vornicus> >_<
20090726 04:38:00< conor> 		[/else]
20090726 04:38:02< conor> 		[/if]
20090726 04:38:04< conor> 	[/command]
20090726 04:38:06< conor> [/option]
20090726 04:38:08< conor> #enddef
20090726 04:38:10< conor> [set_menu_item]
20090726 04:38:12< conor> 	id=recruitunitforest
20090726 04:38:16< conor> 	description="Recruit Unit"
20090726 04:38:18< conor> 	[filter_location]
20090726 04:38:20< Vornicus> for god's sake man
20090726 04:38:20< conor> 		terrain=Gg^Ve
20090726 04:38:22< conor> 		owner_side=$side_number
20090726 04:38:24< conor> 		[not]
20090726 04:38:26< conor> 		[filter]
20090726 04:38:28< conor> 			canrecruit=no
20090726 04:38:30< conor> 			x=$x1
20090726 04:38:32< conor> 			y=$y1
20090726 04:38:34< conor> 		[/filter]
20090726 04:38:36< conor> 		[/not]
20090726 04:38:38< conor> 	[/filter_location]
20090726 04:38:40< conor> 	[command]
20090726 04:38:41< Zarel> lol
20090726 04:38:42< conor> 		[store_gold]
20090726 04:38:46< conor> 			side=$side_number
20090726 04:38:48< conor> 			variable=gold
20090726 04:38:50< conor> 		[/store_gold]
20090726 04:38:51-!- Bilbo_Ba2gins [n=Tom@adsl-99-49-134-63.dsl.rcfril.sbcglobal.net] has joined #wesnoth
20090726 04:38:52< conor> 		[message]
20090726 04:38:54< conor> 			speaker=narrator
20090726 04:38:56< conor> 			message=_ "You have $gold gold.
20090726 04:38:58< conor>  
20090726 04:39:00< conor> Select a unit to recruit:"
20090726 04:39:02< conor> 			[option]
20090726 04:39:04< conor> 				message=_ "Cancel"
20090726 04:39:09-!- mode/#wesnoth [+b %*!*@c-67-180-158-41.hsd1.ca.comcast.net] by ChanServ
20090726 04:39:13< Zarel> Whoa, took ChanServ a while.
20090726 04:39:15< shadowmaster> conor: really, use a pastebin.
20090726 04:39:19< Zarel> Yeah, seriously.
20090726 04:39:29< Zarel> I've been yelled at for pasting 5 lines. Five!
20090726 04:39:34< shadowmaster> Zarel: my SSH session got disconnected actually
20090726 04:39:39< shadowmaster> thus I couldn't react on time
20090726 04:39:46< Zarel> And that was on a channel I was an op on!
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20090726 04:40:48< conor> jeez
20090726 04:40:52< conor> can i get some help now?
20090726 04:40:57< Zarel> Yeah, pastebin.
20090726 04:40:59< shadowmaster> conor: yes, but use wesnoth.pastebin.com
20090726 04:41:09< conor> wow
20090726 04:41:15< conor> i feel like im in kindergarten
20090726 04:41:21< shadowmaster> not only you flooded the channel, but it also becomes unreadable because the tab characters die in the IRC protocol
20090726 04:41:28< shadowmaster> (or at least, for my client)
20090726 04:41:35< conor> not for me
20090726 04:41:39< Zarel> For my client, they turned into spaces.
20090726 04:41:48< Zarel> But most importantly, you flooded the channel. <_<
20090726 04:41:52< shadowmaster> they appear as "ugly Is" here
20090726 04:42:35< conor> http://www.wesnoth.pastebin.com/d3303ab2
20090726 04:42:43< conor> nooone is talking on the channel
20090726 04:42:54< conor> besides the people yelling at me
20090726 04:43:07< conor> in fact, you should be happy i flooded it, otherwise noone would be talking
20090726 04:43:12< conor> :)
20090726 04:43:19< Zarel> ...that's not how it works at all.
20090726 04:43:54< shadowmaster> what was the problem with the macro?
20090726 04:44:19< conor> well, im wondering if thats the best way to create a system where you recruit on the villages instead of castles
20090726 04:45:40< shadowmaster> well, you could also define special terrains that worked like castles but gave income
20090726 04:46:05< shadowmaster> for that though, you'd have to fiddle with uglier stuff (including terrain graphics), so yeah, a menu is probably the best option
20090726 04:46:21< conor> well, what i am wanting to do is make it so that heroes and leaders can recruit
20090726 04:46:35< conor> so like the leader can recruit basic level 0's on his castle
20090726 04:46:53< conor> and the heroes can go around to different villages to recruit people
20090726 04:47:00< conor> with a max of 2 people per village
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20090726 04:50:26< conor> the suspense is killing me
20090726 04:51:10< Zarel> ancestral: You there?
20090726 04:52:20< ancestral> Zarel: Yeah
20090726 04:52:33< shadowmaster> conor: well, you tested it?
20090726 04:52:47-!- noy [n=Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth
20090726 04:52:57< conor> shadowmaster: not yet
20090726 04:53:38< Zarel> ancestral: Minor nitpick.
20090726 04:53:48< ancestral> Please I'm receptive
20090726 04:53:49< Zarel> iirc, an arbalest is a type of crossbow, not a type of bow.
20090726 04:54:07< Zarel> It also requires less skill to operate than a bow.
20090726 04:54:35< Zarel> And also has a significantly higher fire rate.
20090726 04:54:42< Zarel> But was significantly heavier (lower mobility).
20090726 04:55:10< Zarel> Would indeed be interesting to have a slow ranged unit with a powerful attack (a ranged equivalent of the HI), but I don't think it makes sense as a name for an upgrade to Master Bowman.
20090726 04:55:46< ancestral> Hmmm
20090726 04:55:56< ancestral> Then I need a good alternative
20090726 04:56:28< conor> whats the terrain code for city villages?
20090726 04:56:33< Zarel> Composite bowman?
20090726 04:56:39< Zarel> -> Composite Longbowman?
20090726 04:57:44< shadowmaster> conor: Rp^Vhc
20090726 04:58:14< Zarel> Expert Bowman?
20090726 04:58:49< Zarel> Some sort of reference to a "rain of arrows" or "blotting out the sun"?
20090726 04:58:58< conor> lets see what explodes then
20090726 04:59:59< ancestral> Zarel: Hmm okay
20090726 05:00:02-!- noy [n=Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit []
20090726 05:00:12< conor> yaaa didnt work
20090726 05:00:13< ancestral> Maybe I'll use Arbalestier for the Orcish line of crossbowmen
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20090726 05:00:45< Zarel> I dunno, arbalests are heavier; I can't imagine an arbalestier getting more than 4 MP.
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20090726 05:01:09< Zarel> There were other names for advanced crossbows.
20090726 05:01:14< Zarel> Repeating Crossbowman?
20090726 05:01:42< conor> no still not working
20090726 05:02:02< conor> where is the error report located in wesnoth on linux?
20090726 05:02:18< shadowmaster> conor: start wesnoth from a terminal emulator
20090726 05:02:20< Zarel> ancestral: Lancer upgrades shouldn't get more attacks. Charge is powerful because of its potential to kill a fairly high-HP unit before it can fight back.
20090726 05:02:25< conor> shadowmaster: ok
20090726 05:02:32< shadowmaster> the error reports should go to stderr (which appears on the terminal emulator as it updates)
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20090726 05:03:37< ancestral> Zarel: Yet the Lancer still gets more attacks from 1-2-3
20090726 05:03:38< conor> is it ok if i paste one line lol
20090726 05:03:48< shadowmaster> yeah, one line is always okay
20090726 05:03:57< conor> 20090725 20:03:17 error filesystem: Trying to open file with empty name.
20090726 05:04:08< conor> i dont think that has to do with my campaign thouh
20090726 05:04:24< conor> the other errors had to do with other campaign
20090726 05:04:34< Zarel> ancestral: Also, I still think it should go: Silver Mage -> Diamond Mage -> Void Mage
20090726 05:04:41< ancestral> HAha
20090726 05:04:47< ancestral> I'll think about it
20090726 05:04:55< ancestral> But Void doesn't resemble a color
20090726 05:05:08< Zarel> ancestral: It goes from 2 -> 3, but that's more to differentiate it from Knight.
20090726 05:05:16< Zarel> ancestral: I see no reason why it should.
20090726 05:05:23< ancestral> Hmmm
20090726 05:05:33< ancestral> You may have a point
20090726 05:05:37< Zarel> I mean, the other color mages lose their color names by the next upgrade.
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20090726 05:05:55< Zarel> And silver mage description references that they understand secrets of the void, which is why I think the L5 should be Void Mage.
20090726 05:06:31< keb> what about Ether Mage
20090726 05:06:40< conor> alright here is what i got when i tried to start it 
20090726 05:06:41< conor> http://www.wesnoth.pastebin.com/d6b4cd7ee
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20090726 05:08:15< Zarel> Not a bad idea. Silver Mage -> Ether Mage -> Void Mage
20090726 05:10:45< shadowmaster> conor: the error on the pastebin's line 54 is from your addon?
20090726 05:11:11< conor> shadowmaster: yes i think i found the error, let me check
20090726 05:11:46< conor> shadowmaster: yes i found that error, there is another though 
20090726 05:12:20< conor> http://www.wesnoth.pastebin.com/d74b3b23f
20090726 05:12:59< conor> that file worked perfectly before i added the new menu for villages
20090726 05:13:36< shadowmaster> conor: btw, you don't plan to upload this in our add-ons server, do you?
20090726 05:13:52< conor> shadowmaster: no
20090726 05:14:50< shadowmaster> ah, okay, just checking
20090726 05:16:14< shadowmaster> any other error above that one? what was the full log again?
20090726 05:16:35< conor> that was the only error the second time around after i fixed the first
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20090726 05:18:09< shadowmaster> there may be a {VARIABLE inclusion with bad syntax somewhere
20090726 05:19:02< conor> shall i paste you the faulty code?
20090726 05:19:12< conor> there are a few VARIABLE inclusions
20090726 05:19:22< shadowmaster> sure
20090726 05:19:55< conor> http://www.wesnoth.pastebin.com/d39d94bde
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20090726 05:21:21< conor> hmmm i may have found the issue...
20090726 05:22:39< conor> nope
20090726 05:23:11< conor> is it neccesarry for me to define the arguments at the beginning along with the file description?
20090726 05:23:19< conor> definition*
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20090726 05:25:11< Aethaeryn> Turuk: Up for one more game or done?
20090726 05:25:14< shadowmaster> you don't hive arguments to files...
20090726 05:25:33< shadowmaster> (sorry, I'm getting disconnected every 60 seconds for some reason)
20090726 05:26:04< conor> alright
20090726 05:26:17< keb> now that might be a cool mage trick for multiplayer : disconnect opponent intermittently
20090726 05:26:26< Turuk> I think I'm done for now Aethaeryn 
20090726 05:26:33< Turuk> Game takes too long per turn
20090726 05:26:52< Aethaeryn> ok
20090726 05:27:12< Aethaeryn> Who wanted to see the forest map?
20090726 05:27:14< Aethaeryn> jb?
20090726 05:27:25< Turuk> I think so
20090726 05:27:44< Aethaeryn> Damn, disconnected before I could PM
20090726 05:28:42< Aethaeryn> I think I'm done for the night too, then
20090726 05:28:50< Aethaeryn> My maps do not play well with complete n00bs
20090726 05:29:45-!- Bilbo_Ba3gins [n=Tom@adsl-99-49-134-63.dsl.rcfril.sbcglobal.net] has quit ["Lost terminal"]
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20090726 05:29:54< Aethaeryn> And I don't trust random joiners unless I have some others first
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20090726 05:31:24< conor> which shadowmaster do i talk too?
20090726 05:31:26< conor> to*
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20090726 05:32:21< shadowmaster> any.
20090726 05:32:25< shadowmaster> no, better, me :P
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20090726 05:34:21< conor> lol, shadowmaster alright, any idea what is going on?
20090726 05:35:50< conor> hmmm, maybe this will work... or i will create an infinite loop
20090726 05:36:03< conor> or none of the above
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20090726 06:34:18-!- mode/#wesnoth [-bo *!*@99-28-86-165.lightspeed.irvnca.sbcglobal.net shadowmaster] by shadowmaster
20090726 06:36:24< Aethaeryn> ?
20090726 06:37:18< shadowmaster> Aethaeryn: what?
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20090726 07:05:24< Blueblaze> hi
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20090726 07:16:12< ancestral> Zarel: So I thought about it
20090726 07:16:39< ancestral> I'll make the changes you suggested, with the archer/arbalestier and the lancer
20090726 07:16:47< Zarel> Okay.
20090726 07:17:05< Zarel> Wait, did we ever come up with new names for arbalestier?
20090726 07:17:12< Zarel> The ones I suggested were pretty sucky.
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20090726 07:17:38< ancestral> Yes
20090726 07:17:46< ancestral> I found one
20090726 07:17:48< ancestral> The Yeoman
20090726 07:18:11< Zarel> Makes me think of a melee fighter.
20090726 07:18:20< ancestral> The level 5 might be Elite Yeoman, or Crown's Yeoman, or something like that
20090726 07:18:22< Zarel> Makes me think of a Knight or something.
20090726 07:18:33< ancestral> http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Yeoman
20090726 07:18:37< ancestral> It fits fairly well
20090726 07:18:45< ancestral> They were used later in the Middle Ages, which is good
20090726 07:18:54< Zarel> ...
20090726 07:19:01< Zarel> A yeoman is a cavalry member...
20090726 07:19:04< ancestral> Well in a broad range
20090726 07:19:07< ancestral> Not necessarily
20090726 07:19:16< Zarel> A cavalry member raised from commoners, according to WP
20090726 07:20:32< ancestral> The yeoman archer was typically mounted and fought either on foot or on horseback, in contrast with infantry archers, and came to be applied to societal standing as a farmer in particular during the 14th century to 18th century.
20090726 07:20:51< ancestral> Guess what? It's time to fight, he fights on foot
20090726 07:22:03< ancestral> I really can't find anything better to name these
20090726 07:22:38< Turuk> yeoman instantly makes me think of a peasant-like individual
20090726 07:22:40< ancestral> It sounds like they rode into battle mounted, but didn't fight mounted
20090726 07:22:46< Turuk> which is noted in the second part of your description
20090726 07:23:02< ancestral> Ironically, they were one step down from lordship, or were lordship
20090726 07:23:21< Zarel> Yeah, well, what it could be, and what an average person thinks when they see "yeoman", are two entirely different things.
20090726 07:23:46< Turuk> lordship?
20090726 07:23:48< Zarel> Dragoons were also mounted but fought on foot, yet they're mounted units in Wesnoth for good reason.
20090726 07:24:00< Zarel> (Popular conception)
20090726 07:24:00< Turuk> in some contexts, sure
20090726 07:24:15< Zarel> When I see "yeoman", I think peasant horse-rider with some sort of polearm.
20090726 07:24:18< ancestral> (we're reading the WP article up there)
20090726 07:24:18< Turuk> but it also referred to various lower levels of society
20090726 07:24:36< ancestral> "In the 16th century, a yeoman was also a farmer of middling social status who owned his own land and often farmed himself"
20090726 07:24:41< Turuk> it had no actual set level of society that it referenced
20090726 07:24:43< Turuk> I know
20090726 07:24:47< Turuk> I majored in this stuff
20090726 07:24:51< ancestral> "A yeoman was identified as a rank or position in a noble or royal household, with titles such as Yeoman of the Chamber, Yeoman of the Crown, Yeoman Usher, King's Yeoman, and various others."
20090726 07:25:07< Zarel> Regardless, "archer" is nowhere near the first thing that comes to mind.
20090726 07:25:21< ancestral> Yet they were archers
20090726 07:25:36< Zarel> yeoman archers were archers.
20090726 07:25:39< Turuk> They were a number of things.....
20090726 07:25:42< Zarel> Yeomen, not necessarily.
20090726 07:25:53< Zarel> It's like saying "We should call this unit Chinese, since Chinese archers were archers."
20090726 07:25:57< Turuk> You're just pigeon-holing it to fit your usage and declaiming that everyone else will therefore understand it as such
20090726 07:26:19< Zarel> Master Bowman -> Royal Bowman -> Elite Bowman?
20090726 07:26:24< ancestral> They're archers
20090726 07:26:43< ancestral> And they're not historically low in social class
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20090726 07:26:55< Turuk> yesssssssssss
20090726 07:26:58< Turuk> they are
20090726 07:27:05< Zarel> They are definitely.
20090726 07:27:18< Turuk> They can be lords, but if not, they were farmers or apprentices or just freeman
20090726 07:27:26< Turuk> freeman could stand anywhere on the social ladder
20090726 07:27:29< ancestral> Which is better than servant
20090726 07:27:32< Turuk> were they indentured? no
20090726 07:27:49< Turuk> But there's a whole broad spectrum beyond that one
20090726 07:27:57< ancestral> The plan was to preface it with Crown's Yeoman, etc.
20090726 07:28:38< Turuk> You're condensing the entire societal strata of a few centuries into lord, yeoman, and servant/serf
20090726 07:29:38< ancestral> Well, when it comes down to it
20090726 07:29:48< Zarel> More importantly, you're condensing an extremely small subset of yeomen who used bows and expecting everyone to understand you.
20090726 07:30:18< Zarel> Like I said. You say "bowman". First three things that come to mind: 1. Mounted, 2. Peasant, 3. Some sort of melee weapon.
20090726 07:30:23< Zarel> I mean, yeoman*
20090726 07:30:27< Zarel> Freudian slip.
20090726 07:32:18< Zarel> I mean, maybe if you call it "Crown's Yeoman Archer", it could work.
20090726 07:32:26< Zarel> But then why not just "Crown Archer" or something?
20090726 07:34:10< ancestral> YEah
20090726 07:34:22< ancestral> I'll have to play with the names
20090726 07:34:29< ancestral> Thanks guys, I appreciate your input
20090726 07:34:50< ancestral> I'm debating about using Arbalestier for the Orc crossbowman line
20090726 07:35:13< shadowmaster> blah 
20090726 07:35:33< Zarel> shadowmaster: ?
20090726 07:35:49< shadowmaster> oops, my mistake
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20090726 07:43:20< ancestral> I don't know if I want to add "royal" into the bowman class.
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20090726 08:09:49< shadowmaster> crap
20090726 08:10:05< shadowmaster> poor Turuk was eaten by the netsplit
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20090726 08:32:54< ancestral> He has arisen
20090726 08:33:02< ancestral> A phoenix!
20090726 08:33:11< Blueblaze> Lucy in the sky!
20090726 08:33:14< Blueblaze> With diamonds!
20090726 08:34:40< ancestral> She must be rich
20090726 08:35:19< ancestral> Dammit, stupid Master Bowman unit
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20090726 08:35:26< ancestral> Gotta make things difficult for me
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20090726 10:50:59< Ivanovic> moin
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20090726 11:22:51< Elvenisko> hello boys and girls... yet another problem... again there is something wrong :)
20090726 11:23:48< Elvenisko> well, i am creating a campaign. all works great. but than a de-serialize error has been found. i tried to remove as much as possible, and there is still this problem :(
20090726 11:25:10< Elvenisko> when changed scenario to scenario from another campaign, it works. so problem is in my scenario cfg file. but i do not know where exactly :(
20090726 11:27:07< zookeeper> then first find out what piece of code causes it and then ask what's wrong with it
20090726 11:28:04< Elvenisko> well, i am trying to find it... but without success. i am going to add it to pastebin
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20090726 11:28:36< Elvenisko> http://pastebin.com/m69bf223
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20090726 11:30:13< zookeeper> don't try to use that {JALENAS} stuff for doing your side 1 definition
20090726 11:30:41< zookeeper> (i doubt you even have a proper macro definition for that)
20090726 11:30:47< Elvenisko>     id=Jalenas
20090726 11:30:47< Elvenisko>     side=1
20090726 11:30:47< Elvenisko>     save_id=Player
20090726 11:30:47< Elvenisko>     persistent=yes
20090726 11:30:47< Elvenisko>     name= _"Jalenas"
20090726 11:30:48< Elvenisko>     unrenamable=yes
20090726 11:30:50< Elvenisko>     canrecruit=yes
20090726 11:30:52< Elvenisko>     profile="portraits/jalenas.png"
20090726 11:30:54< Elvenisko>     type=Elvish Lord
20090726 11:30:56< Elvenisko>     controller=human
20090726 11:30:58< Elvenisko>     team_name=Jalenas
20090726 11:31:00< Elvenisko>     [modifications]
20090726 11:31:02< Elvenisko>         {TRAIT_STRONG}
20090726 11:31:04< Elvenisko>         {TRAIT_RESILIENT}
20090726 11:31:06< Elvenisko>     [/modifications]
20090726 11:31:24< Elvenisko> this is macro in utils. but i also deleted that macro and added it into the main cfg
20090726 11:31:39< zookeeper> right
20090726 11:31:54< Elvenisko> without success again :(
20090726 11:32:07< zookeeper> well then don't
20090726 11:32:29< zookeeper> just put all that in the [side] and remove that macro call
20090726 11:32:52< Elvenisko> i mean moving them into side
20090726 11:33:14< Elvenisko> i always write and mean something a little different :)
20090726 11:34:33< Elvenisko> now also removed sides, and still the same problem
20090726 11:34:57< Elvenisko> maybe i can take another scenario and start adding my code
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20090726 11:54:54< Elvenisko> reinstalled wesnoth and it is working :)
20090726 11:56:56< zookeeper> reinstalling wesnoth doesn't help unless you've been messing with the main data files.
20090726 11:57:41< Elvenisko> i know i know... it is strange that it works... but works :D
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20090726 12:17:43< Elvenisko> i think that i found a problem
20090726 12:17:46< Elvenisko> #ifdef HARD
20090726 12:17:46< Elvenisko>     hitpoints=20
20090726 12:17:46< Elvenisko> #ifdef NORMAL
20090726 12:17:46< Elvenisko>     hitpoints=30
20090726 12:17:46< Elvenisko> #else
20090726 12:17:47< Elvenisko> #endif
20090726 12:18:03< Elvenisko> is this not OK?
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20090726 12:31:23< Elvenisko> is here someone with wesnoth 1.7.2? :)
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20090726 12:41:44< Ivanovic> Elvenisko: of course it is not correct
20090726 12:41:48< Ivanovic> remove the #else
20090726 12:41:58< Ivanovic> and end each #ifdef with an #endif
20090726 12:46:57< Elvenisko> #ifdef HARD
20090726 12:46:58< Elvenisko> hitpoints=20
20090726 12:46:58< Elvenisko> #endif
20090726 12:46:58< Elvenisko> #ifdef NORMAL
20090726 12:46:58< Elvenisko> hitpoints=30
20090726 12:46:58< Elvenisko> #endif
20090726 12:47:02< Elvenisko> like this?
20090726 12:47:09< Ivanovic> and make sure that all cases are covered
20090726 12:47:25< Ivanovic> so if you got three difficulty levels (eg EASY, too) you need a block for this one, too
20090726 12:47:52< Elvenisko> and if in easy i like to have default value?
20090726 12:48:18< Elvenisko> just ifdef, nothing, endif?
20090726 12:48:37< Ivanovic> ugh, so you want to modify a unit at prestart?
20090726 12:48:46< Elvenisko> not exactly
20090726 12:48:52< Ivanovic> no idea if this has really a chance to work...
20090726 12:49:25< Elvenisko> during scenario a wounded unit will show up. on bigger difficullity, this ally unit is weaker
20090726 12:50:46< Ivanovic> might work this way, just try it
20090726 12:52:19< Elvenisko> can you also help me with labels? they do not work :(
20090726 12:52:37< Elvenisko>         [label]
20090726 12:52:38< Elvenisko>     x,y=15,21
20090726 12:52:38< Elvenisko>     text=_ "New bridge"
20090726 12:52:38< Elvenisko>         [/label]
20090726 12:53:08< Elvenisko> player do not see this on the map
20090726 12:53:25< Ivanovic> no idea how labels work
20090726 12:53:47< Ivanovic> it is probably documented in the wml reference in the wiki though
20090726 12:54:14< Ivanovic> in general you should ask in the scenario development forum(s) since this is the place where most wml coders are
20090726 12:54:36< Ivanovic> or #wesnoth-umc-dev
20090726 12:55:52< Elvenisko> okay. i will take my campaign to the forum. but how many scenarios must be working? story is not yet completed even in my head :)
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20090726 13:10:05< DeathTheNoob> Hello.
20090726 13:11:31< DeathTheNoob> i'm IRC/MMORPG-known as Death The Noob, and i have a question
20090726 13:11:54< DeathTheNoob> when will Wesnoth update?
20090726 13:12:02< Ivanovic> Elvenisko: the forum is also for questions
20090726 13:12:25< Ivanovic> Elvenisko: pure "it does not work, how to do it?" questions
20090726 13:12:33< Ivanovic> DeathTheNoob: what do you mean with this?
20090726 13:13:38< DeathTheNoob> i mean 1.7
20090726 13:13:42< Elvenisko> Death: you mean new version of wesnoth when will come?
20090726 13:13:57< Elvenisko> 1.7 is development. 1.8 will be stable. long way to that
20090726 13:14:20< DeathTheNoob> jnk
20090726 13:14:34< DeathTheNoob> i almost forgot about Wesnoth, cuz of Endless Online
20090726 13:15:07< Elvenisko> current stable 1.6 is okay i think :)
20090726 13:15:10< Ivanovic> uhm, new releases are always announced in the news at www.wesnoth.org
20090726 13:15:21< Ivanovic> and the game itself does not update automatically itself
20090726 13:15:28< Ivanovic> you have to download the new versions yourself and install them
20090726 13:15:36< Ivanovic> (or on linux have your package manager do it for you)
20090726 13:16:29< grzywacz> Ivanovic, hm. We could probably add an in-game notification about new version being available tho
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20090726 13:16:47< Ivanovic> grzywacz: ah, boring
20090726 13:16:53< grzywacz> Ivanovic, would be easier for people to figure out why there are so few people on the MP server and similar cases ;)
20090726 13:17:03< Ivanovic> beside this: the latest version is listed in the MotD on the mp server anyway
20090726 13:17:16< grzywacz> Ivanovic, meh. Boring but not hard to do.
20090726 13:17:34< Elvenisko> no one wish to download new version again and again. and someone have also slow internet connection :)
20090726 13:17:39< grzywacz> Ivanovic, also it's better to let people know about updates if there's a security problem or something ;)
20090726 13:17:52< grzywacz> Elvenisko, I'm talking about notifications, not about automatic updates
20090726 13:18:00< grzywacz> "There's a new version, take a look"
20090726 13:18:02< grzywacz> That's all.
20090726 13:18:07< Elvenisko> ups. i am blinding. sorry
20090726 13:18:54< Soliton> should only display once though or have a "don't remind me again" button since some people might just not want to update or can't easily.
20090726 13:19:21< DeathTheNoob> there IS a notification
20090726 13:19:25< grzywacz> Yes, it should be possible to disable the notifications.
20090726 13:19:36< Ivanovic> and many might fill bug reports at ubuntu like "the game tells me there is a new version, but the package manager does not offer it!!!"
20090726 13:19:37< Ivanovic> ^^
20090726 13:19:51< grzywacz> Ivanovic, this could be disabled by distributions
20090726 13:20:07< DeathTheNoob> main server says "#.# is old, get #.$" - it's in chat, and it should not bother ppl too much
20090726 13:20:27< Ivanovic> DeathTheNoob: like i said, it is already in the motd on the server
20090726 13:20:29< grzywacz> DeathTheNoob, what if you mainly play single player? ;-)
20090726 13:20:31 * Elvenisko is going to test something. have a nice day...
20090726 13:20:50 * Elvenisko prefer single player :)
20090726 13:21:10 * DeathTheNoob comes to srv to watch, not to play
20090726 13:21:59< DeathTheNoob> why'd s1 disable the notificator in the green message?
20090726 13:22:34 * DeathTheNoob pukes with nukes
20090726 13:28:05< Soliton> who disabled what?
20090726 13:28:52< DeathTheNoob> the update notificator in the green message on mp srv
20090726 13:30:05< Elvenisko> does anyone have a good name for a really big troll? :)
20090726 13:30:25< Soliton> i don't know what you mean.
20090726 13:30:43< Soliton> 1.4 has no green motd and 1.6 has no update message obviously.
20090726 13:32:56< Elvenisko> nothing? :(
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20090726 13:35:31< grzywacz> Elvenisko, BOULDER
20090726 13:35:32< grzywacz> ;>
20090726 13:37:22< Elvenisko> or Shrek :)
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20090726 16:23:08< Kenpachi> so... I'm running Ubuntu 9.04 and I want to be able to use the latest stable release without manually uninstalling the old version then downloading and installing the new one. What are my options?
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20090726 16:32:39< Aethaeryn> Turuk_: lol @ "buying a Dodge" comment.
20090726 16:39:17< Aethaeryn> Also, damn. Now I will always see the merman hoplite as Obama.
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20090726 17:43:11< Ke> btw is it possible to not view the map when using random map and shroud
20090726 17:47:26< Aethaeryn> The mini-map?
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20090726 17:53:08< keb> Kenpachi you could download source and compile it with different target directories
20090726 17:53:37< Kenpachi> yeah, I found the repo lists as well
20090726 17:55:28< keb> also i think there is an option to install packages only in one user space, which would be separate from the system installed wesnoth
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20090726 21:52:52< Zarel> For anyone who's interested: Ubuntu gaming meeting in #ubuntu-meeting going on right now: http://blog.thesilentnumber.me/2009/06/first-ubuntu-gaming-team-meeting.html
20090726 21:53:14< Zarel> (It's a marketing/PR meeting, not a developer meeting, btw)
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--- Log opened Sun Jul 26 23:18:33 2009
20090726 23:18:42-!- lobby [n=wesnoth@wesnoth/bot/lobby] has joined #wesnoth
20090726 23:18:42-!- Topic for #wesnoth: Wesnoth User Channel | wesnoth.org | http://addons.wesnoth.org | latest stable version: 1.6.4 | latest development version: 1.7.2 | public IRC logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org
20090726 23:18:42-!- Topic set by Ivanovic [] [Mon Jul 20 22:51:58 2009]
20090726 23:18:42[Users #wesnoth]
20090726 23:18:42[ a0xff_         ] [ erl      ] [ Randorr        ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ ABCD           ] [ Espreon  ] [ retupmoca      ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ Aethaeryn      ] [ ettin    ] [ Rhonda         ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ Amu            ] [ G-Lo     ] [ shadowmaster   ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ ancestral      ] [ grzywacz ] [ shikadibot     ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ AnMaster       ] [ harryBer ] [ Smar           ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ anttil         ] [ idiota1  ] [ Soliton        ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ apoi           ] [ ilor     ] [ Stealth        ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ ardesh         ] [ isaac    ] [ thespaceinvader] 
20090726 23:18:42[ BenUrban       ] [ Ivanovic ] [ Turuk          ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ BiggieSmalls   ] [ Ke       ] [ vjoe           ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ Carneus        ] [ keb      ] [ Vornicus       ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ crimson_penguin] [ law__    ] [ VurtualRuler98 ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ dfranke        ] [ lobby    ] [ wesbot         ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ Doppp          ] [ MadMerlin] [ Xjs|moonshine  ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ Dragonking     ] [ martin___] [ Zarel          ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ Eduard_Munteanu] [ Mellar_  ] [ zookeeper      ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ elias          ] [ Noyga    ] 
20090726 23:18:42[ Elvish_Pillage2] [ Polarina ] 
20090726 23:18:42-!- Irssi: #wesnoth: Total of 55 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 55 normal]
20090726 23:18:42-!- Home page for #wesnoth: http://www.wesnoth.org
20090726 23:18:49-!- Channel #wesnoth created Sun Nov 26 07:42:43 2006
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20090726 23:20:01< Soliton> should be back now.
20090726 23:20:08< Eduard_Munteanu> I see, thanks.
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--- Log closed Mon Jul 27 00:00:24 2009