--- Log opened Tue Aug 25 00:00:34 2009
20090825 00:00:37< Crab_> fabi: ok, it is not ready yet, but I want you to take a look at the code structure - http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/m542ad627   - is it easy to understand ? is it a good way to go ?
20090825 00:01:56< Crab_> (do not point at errors, just comment on the 'style' of controlling ai from WML )
20090825 00:02:11< esr> fabi: Checking...
20090825 00:02:59< esr> Yes, I did.  Should I not have?
20090825 00:03:15< Aethaeryn> Is is possible to have more than 9 human players?
20090825 00:03:24< Aethaeryn> I think it is possible to have more than 9 players, but I think the others are AI
20090825 00:03:37< fabi> esr: The wml of that scenario hasn't changed much lately and the bug seems to be in the engine. (I hope so). You need to find a c++ guru for that one.
20090825 00:03:44< Aethaeryn> Personally, I'm a minimalist so I never hit the limit, but I'd be interested to know
20090825 00:06:28< fabi> Crab_: good coding style. I like it.
20090825 00:07:09< Crab_> fabi: ok. I'll finish it in a few hours. then, I'll use the same style for LoW 3, as well.
20090825 00:09:30< fabi> Crab_: remove the should please. dwarves_kill_elves instead of dwarves_should_kill_elves
20090825 00:09:34< CIA-62> jhinrichs * r38068 /trunk/src/game.cpp: Fixes a bug, where ingame loading of a savegame causes loading that savegame automatically again when returning to the title screen.
20090825 00:09:46< Crab_> fabi: ok
20090825 00:11:02< fabi> Crab_: I try to recode scenario seven's ai.
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20090825 00:12:02< Crab_> ok
20090825 00:12:36< CIA-62> jhinrichs * r38069 /trunk/src/ (play_controller.cpp savegame.cpp): Avoids making a copy of the gamestate when loading a savegame ingame and removes an include that is not needed.
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20090825 00:30:07< fabi> esr: The bug is caused by theme=FullScreen
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20090825 00:30:38< esr> The theme itself is buggy?
20090825 00:30:58< fabi> esr: every other scenario with that attribute shows the same behaviour: No map displayed. Crash after some dialogue.
20090825 00:31:21< fabi> esr: I believe mordante told me that the new gui code can't switch themes at the moment. 
20090825 00:31:51< fabi> esr: But there are only 2 scenarios in mainline that do make use of this attribute. HttT 21 and LoW 13.
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20090825 00:32:27< Soliton> Crab_: cc1plus: warnings being treated as errors
20090825 00:32:27< Soliton> src/ai/composite/engine.cpp:143: error: ‘ai::component* ai::find_component(ai::component*, const std::string&)’ defined but not used
20090825 00:33:10< Crab_> Soliton: fixed in my local copy, just not committed yet
20090825 00:34:03< Rhonda> Ivanovic: Don't chicken out of an apache restart. :)
20090825 00:34:09< Crab_> Soliton: you can just delete that function
20090825 00:34:37< fabi> Can someone with the might add GUI to the item group in the gna.org bug interface?
20090825 00:34:53< fabi> please
20090825 00:35:04< Soliton> there is user interface already.
20090825 00:35:10< Crab_> fabi: "user interface" is not GUI ?
20090825 00:35:28< fabi> Thanks, got it.
20090825 00:37:53< Ivanovic> Rhonda: ahh, but it is soooo lovely easy to chicken out of apache restarts
20090825 00:37:55< Ivanovic> ;)
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20090825 00:39:54< Crab_> Ivanovic: when do you want to release 1.7.4 ?
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20090825 00:41:18< fabi> Crab_: I dared to assign bug https://gna.org/bugs/?13119 to you.
20090825 00:41:36< Ivanovic> Crab_: probably on sunday
20090825 00:41:53-!- Ivanovic changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 1.7.4 planned for Sunday | 79 bugs, 242 feature requests, 10 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20090825 00:41:54< Crab_> Ivanovic: ( I'm asking because there are some AI/event problems which are already fixed in trunk, and they seriously affect some scenarios. )
20090825 00:42:05< Ivanovic> Crab_: yeah, i know
20090825 00:42:14< Ivanovic> you mentioned those some time after i tagged 1.7.3
20090825 00:42:42< Crab_> Ivanovic: yes, and +1 (unrelated) bug which was found later.
20090825 00:42:49< Ivanovic> :)
20090825 00:42:51< fabi> esr: Updated the bug report with the information I have. Note that this can be solved at least temporarely by just disabling that attribute in the only two scenarios where it is used.
20090825 00:43:10< Crab_> fabi: ok
20090825 00:43:48< esr> What does that do to the appearance of the scenarios?  Anytthing serious?
20090825 00:44:03< Crab_> fabi: however, this is better assigned to DK
20090825 00:44:27< fabi> esr: It mainly disables all gui elements. It's meant for story only scenarios that do shuffle the protagonists around the map.
20090825 00:44:45< Crab_> fabi: since he worked/works on formula_ai recruitment for the several previous months
20090825 00:44:46< esr> Hm.
20090825 00:45:16< Crab_> fabi: and his recruitment has the potential to be better in some aspects. 
20090825 00:45:33< esr> What I'd suggest doing is retitling the bug "FullScreen theme fails", or something like that, then assigning it to None.  
20090825 00:45:52< esr> Unless you think it nbelongs in Mordante's lap :-)
20090825 00:46:16< fabi> esr: I have done in a similar way already. And changed it to the type "user interface".
20090825 00:46:18 * Rhonda thinks of sending 1.7.4 through Debian NEW queue. Will try to package it as wesnoth-1.7 and include the 1.7 in every package name ...
20090825 00:46:47< fabi> Rhonda: what does that mean?
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20090825 00:47:15< Rhonda> fabi: That it will be possible to install wesnoth 1.6 and wesnoth 1.7 side-by-side.
20090825 00:47:23< Ivanovic> fabi: it means that the world is about to end!
20090825 00:47:29< Soliton> neat.
20090825 00:47:36< fabi> Rhonda: very cool. I love you.
20090825 00:48:03< Rhonda> And that the game data will end in /usr/share/games/wesnoth/1.7, a hierarchy lower.
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20090825 00:48:38< Rhonda> Next 1.6 release will switch that for the stable packages too.
20090825 00:49:28< fabi> Rhonda: so you can install 1.6.4 beside 1.6.5?
20090825 00:49:47< Rhonda> Hmm ...
20090825 00:50:02< Rhonda> You're right, I probably won't be able to make that switch within 1.6.
20090825 00:50:33< Rhonda> And no, what's the usefulness to install 1.6.4 beside 1.6.5?
20090825 00:50:53< Soliton> being able to install 1.6.4 and .5 at the same time doesn't sound very useful.
20090825 00:51:03< fabi> esr: I do a bet that it belongs to mordante. Reassigned it to him.
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20090825 00:52:20< Crab_> fabi: btw, how can the player find out the difference between AND and OR in objectives ?
20090825 00:53:32< Crab_> fabi: e.g., in LoW 2, I see a list "Kalenz must reach the signpost" "Defeat Grugl" for victory conditions. how can I find out if they are 'or' or 'and' ?
20090825 00:54:17< fabi> Crab_: I believe the convention says that they are all AND. 
20090825 00:54:32< Crab_> fabi: but, in LoW2, it's really 'OR'
20090825 00:55:06< fabi> Crab_: Right. Let's see. HttT scenario 5a should give an example.
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20090825 00:55:39< Soliton> if it's OR it should say something about a bonus objective.
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20090825 00:55:57< Crab_> Soliton: bonus is for optional things...
20090825 00:56:00< Soliton> unless it's really XOR. :-P
20090825 00:56:40< Crab_> fabi: yes, HttT 5a is nice
20090825 00:57:13< fabi> Crab_: But we shouldn't disable the early finish bonus on the signpost thing, should we?
20090825 00:57:23< Crab_> fabi: it has the second objective clearly defined as "Alternate objective"
20090825 00:57:42< Crab_> fabi: well, why you have disabled it ?
20090825 00:58:14< Crab_> fabi: (at least in the objectives of LoW 2 it says 'no early finish bonus')
20090825 00:58:52< fabi> Crab_: No idea. I consider it a bug. No early finish bonus in that scenary doesn't make sense for the troll killing.
20090825 00:59:24< fabi> Crab_: I think for the signpost either.
20090825 00:59:29< Crab_> fabi: so, it should be 'run' (with no early finish bonus) or 'kill the troll' with early finish bonus ?
20090825 00:59:40< Crab_> fabi: or it should have early finish bonus in all cases ?
20090825 01:00:34< fabi> Crab_: what is your opinion?
20090825 01:00:47< Crab_> fabi: from the PoV that early finish bonus is there to avoid the player clicking [end turn] until the last turn to collect gold, it should be " 'run' (with NO early finish bonus) or 'kill the troll' with early finish bonus "
20090825 01:01:12< Crab_> oh, no..
20090825 01:01:48< Crab_> it's somewhat complicated by the fact that dwarf is not to be killed...
20090825 01:02:29< fabi> Crab_: Running is quite hard.
20090825 01:02:30< Crab_> will (from the story point of view) dwarf make peace with Kalenz after Kalenz kills the troll ?
20090825 01:02:59< Crab_> (if kalenz steps on dwarf land before that)
20090825 01:04:27< fabi> Crab_: The dwarves are in a very bad situation in scenario 6. They can't deny help there. And Kalenz is willing to offer them help and even gold in all cases.
20090825 01:05:44< Crab_> so, then I prefer :  1) 'run' (with NO early finish bonus)  2) 'kill the troll without provoking the dwarves' WITH early finish bonus 3)  'kill the troll with provoking the dwarves' with NO early finish bonus' "
20090825 01:06:20< Crab_> i.e, if Kalenz runs, he has no ability to safely collect_gold by [end_turn]ing - trolls are still there
20090825 01:07:03< Crab_> if Kalenz provokes dwarves and kills the troll, he has no ability to safely collect gold - he has to settle with dwarves who are hostile
20090825 01:07:44< Crab_> if Kalenz doesn't provoke dwarves and kills the troll, than all is ok - there is no enemy on map and it's perfectly safe to hit end_turn.
20090825 01:09:15< Crab_> in 1 and 3, the player might have the chance to hit end_turn a few times for extra gold, but it's not 'risk-free' to do so.
20090825 01:10:25< Crab_> and running is not that hard if you know how to run...
20090825 01:10:38< Crab_> even with 5-move Kalenz
20090825 01:12:06< shadowmaster> fabi: have you read the last posts in DM's thread?
20090825 01:12:28< shadowmaster> the second-to-last post is the one I'd want you to read, actually
20090825 01:12:30< fabi> Crab_: The running decision has many disadvantages. The dwarves will be harmed most likely very much. You can not expect to level up much units. If you don't even get a bonus for early finishing this choice is simple nonsense. 
20090825 01:13:09< Crab_> fabi: well, we need some prose to stress the importance of dwarves
20090825 01:13:39< Crab_> fabi: to explain that strange 'olurf must not die' objective, as well
20090825 01:14:23< Ivanovic> boucman, dfranke, mordante, Sapient, Sirp, YogiHH: sent you a mail regarding the mentor summit, if you have not done so yet, please check your mails (and consider clicking "reply to all" and writing some reply) ;)
20090825 01:18:02< Ivanovic> basically off to bed now, n8
20090825 01:19:00< Crab_> fabi: since the player (without prior knowledge) might consider the dwarves as potential enemies, and think that it's better to weaken them in a sneaky way
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20090825 01:21:11< Crab_> fabi: one way to reward the runner is to modify LoW 3 if he manages to run under a specified number of turns
20090825 01:21:28< Crab_> s/run/win
20090825 01:23:57< Crab_> fabi: this can be done as a 'bonus objective' of sorts, and provide better replayability
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20090825 01:37:04< fabi> shadowmaster: fixing them.
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20090825 01:40:40< Crab_> fabi: ok, all except 'TODO retreat to own territory' seems to work. will commit soon.
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20090825 01:53:05< corn> Soliton: sorry to ask, can I get another apache restart?
20090825 01:53:28< Crab_> corn: can you ask for sudo access to restart apache ?
20090825 01:53:31< corn> I forgot to reinit the http server on port 9090 after I moved the wesstats dir, so I encountered the proxy problem I described earlier
20090825 01:53:39< corn> Soliton: ^ see crab's comment
20090825 01:53:51< corn> Crab_: it shouldn't be necessary once things are running properly
20090825 01:53:59 * shadowmaster raises eyebrow
20090825 01:54:07< Soliton> corn: sudo /usr/sbin/invoke-rc.d apache restart
20090825 01:54:29< Crab_> corn: yes. but allowing you to run a single command on your own, will speed things up
20090825 01:54:52< corn> Soliton: I never set my current password, can you set it to something temporary and then msg me with it so I can change it?
20090825 01:54:58< Soliton> hmm, actually tht should be apache2...
20090825 01:55:16< Soliton> corn: you don't need a password.
20090825 01:55:18< corn> rhonda set me up with a public key auth 
20090825 01:55:29< corn> Soliton: ah, yeah
20090825 01:55:30< corn> it worked
20090825 01:55:37< corn> Soliton: thanks, works now
20090825 01:55:43< Soliton> no problem.
20090825 01:57:39< corn> Crab_: I know I have said this several times already but maybe tonight I will finally finish the changes to wesstats + wesnoth client to complete AI logging
20090825 01:57:49< Crab_> ok, good
20090825 01:59:49< corn> Crab_: can you provide a method within ai::manager to retrieve the ai config?
20090825 01:59:57< corn> I can do it myself if you need
20090825 02:00:20< Crab_> retrieve the full config of ai ?
20090825 02:00:26< Crab_> or you mean 'config file location' ?
20090825 02:00:31< corn> the latter
20090825 02:01:06< Crab_> corn: well, as I've said, it' is not always available. better just forget about it for now :)
20090825 02:01:20< Crab_> corn: if you really want to, it's possible to get this info when it's available
20090825 02:01:31< Crab_> corn: but note that there are two in-game ways for this info to change
20090825 02:01:55< Crab_> ai identifier is a better thing
20090825 02:02:13< corn> ok. I am already retrieving that
20090825 02:02:20< corn> I will just leave the config section blank then
20090825 02:02:27< Crab_> ok
20090825 02:02:30< corn> (server-side)
20090825 02:02:52< Crab_> corn: the reason that it was easy for me to store it, is because I called wesnoth with those config file locations as arguments
20090825 02:03:14< corn> I see
20090825 02:03:24< corn> so the path is location dependent as well...
20090825 02:03:33< corn> I mean
20090825 02:03:39< corn> the config filename
20090825 02:03:50< corn> it is not worth storing if every user would have a different full path
20090825 02:03:58< Crab_> corn: no, it's relative
20090825 02:04:12< corn> gauranteed?
20090825 02:04:18< Crab_> corn: yes
20090825 02:04:27< corn> ok
20090825 02:04:46< corn> I will mark it for todo later then
20090825 02:05:00< corn> getting this working now is important because I need to start stat collection on the server anyway :)
20090825 02:07:24< corn> Crab_: I am commiting some small changes now that will move the upload log server from my server to wesnoth.org
20090825 02:07:29< Crab_> ok
20090825 02:07:37< corn> you can recompile and start a test
20090825 02:07:43< corn> how long will it run?
20090825 02:08:23< corn> I will get the server-side stuff done later tonight, so if it can last through tomorrow you will have some data
20090825 02:08:58< Crab_> corn: a hour or so for a recompile, then 20-30 seconds per game
20090825 02:09:15< corn> painful recompile :)
20090825 02:09:21< CIA-62> cornmander * r38070 /trunk/src/ (ai/testing.cpp upload_log.cpp): Changed experimental upload log server target from cornmander.com to wesnoth.org
20090825 02:09:26< corn> I mean, how many games will it run through
20090825 02:09:42< Crab_> I set it to 10000
20090825 02:10:04< Crab_> it's 3.4 days
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20090825 02:10:08< corn> ok
20090825 02:10:17< corn> remember to use --new-uploader and the new --label param
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20090825 02:11:57< Crab_> ok
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20090825 02:19:29< CIA-62> crab * r38071 /trunk/src/ai/composite/engine.cpp: remove an orphaned function
20090825 02:19:50< CIA-62> crab * r38072 /trunk/src/ai/ (composite/component.cpp manager.cpp): better logging - ai/mod logdomain to log effect of [modify_ai] tags
20090825 02:19:55< CIA-62> crab * r38073 /trunk/src/ai/composite/stage.hpp: fix a segfault
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20090825 02:20:03< CIA-62> crab * r38074 /trunk/data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/02_Hostile_mountains.cfg: LoW 2: dwarven ai changes
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20090825 02:25:58< Crab_> fabi: known issues include 'retreat not yet implemented' and 'dwarven ai too slow when avoid is in effect' (investigating this one)
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20090825 02:45:10< Crab_> fabi:  'dwarven ai too slow when avoid is in effect' seems to be an engine 'feature'. will try to fix/work around it.
20090825 02:50:48< shadowmaster> I'm off for tonight (and maybe tomorrow), bye
20090825 02:51:29< corn> night
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20090825 02:58:43< shadowmaster> fabi: the Fullscreen theme doesn't exist btw, that's why it was causing problems
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20090825 03:11:45< shadowmaster> esr: ditto (in case fabi misses the message)
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20090825 03:12:32< esr> Er, I guerss we can close that one then...
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20090825 03:14:55< shadowmaster> though I don't see any reason why the game shouldn't fallback to the default theme is the requested one doesn't exist
20090825 03:15:08< shadowmaster> *if
20090825 03:15:33< CIA-62> crab * r38075 /trunk/src/ai/default/ai.cpp: optimization of retreat phase
20090825 03:15:38< CIA-62> crab * r38076 /trunk/data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/02_Hostile_mountains.cfg: speedup of dwarven ai by making it skip retreat phase. necessary because of the combination of factors (mostly - big 'avoid' aspect in combination the way retreat phase works) makes dwarven AI very slow
20090825 03:16:23< shadowmaster> perhaps it used to do and that's why those buggy theme= specifications  didn't cause problems *shrugs*
20090825 03:17:05< Soliton> it should at least complain. a silent fallback is not nice.
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20090825 03:25:26< CIA-62> esr * r38077 /trunk/data/campaigns/ (2 files in 2 dirs): 
20090825 03:25:26< CIA-62> Comment out references to nonexistent FullScreen theme, tit was
20090825 03:25:26< CIA-62> crashing the engine. Works around bug #14165 in mainline, but
20090825 03:25:26< CIA-62> (a) The WML engine should complain on a noexistent theme and then
20090825 03:25:26< CIA-62> fall back to the default, rather than puking its guts out.
20090825 03:25:30< CIA-62> (a) FullScreen probably should come back as a feature.
20090825 03:25:52< esr> Not clear how I should mark this...
20090825 03:26:58< shadowmaster> I'd never use fallbacks without complaining :P
20090825 03:27:48< shadowmaster> I think I have a FullScreen theme in IftU, sort of
20090825 03:30:28< shadowmaster> it only displays the game map and the menu though
20090825 03:33:15< shadowmaster> and makes wesnoth unkillable on exit somehow. That is a new one. :/
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20090825 03:47:28< crimson_penguin> shadowmaster: thought you hated the game and uninstalled it? :D
20090825 03:48:13< shadowmaster> that was a hilarious side-comment to my action of uninstalling wesnoth. I don't need to have it installed when I can run it from its source tree
20090825 03:48:40< shadowmaster> installing it every time I built it would also be counter-productive
20090825 03:49:02< crimson_penguin> true
20090825 03:49:29< crimson_penguin> I only run make install on po/ because it makes a new directory structure
20090825 03:49:35< crimson_penguin> s/new/nice/
20090825 03:49:49< crimson_penguin> (that is, it makes the directory structure Wesnoth expects to use)
20090825 03:50:13< shadowmaster> um. I have never needed to do that.
20090825 03:52:50< crimson_penguin> well it changes the structure - once I've done that, I copy into my .app
20090825 03:57:49< shadowmaster> ah, MacOS X stuff. right
20090825 04:02:28< AI0867> mordante: http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=378986#p378986
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20090825 04:16:56< Crab_> AI0867: bug #14165
20090825 04:17:08< AI0867> wesbot: bug 14165
20090825 04:17:08< wesbot> Bug #14165  Assigned to: Mark de Wever <mordante>  Status: Confirmed  Priority: 5 - Normal
20090825 04:17:11< wesbot> Summary: Unknown theme value crashes the WML engine unrecoverably
20090825 04:17:14< wesbot> Original submission: After you click through the dialog
20090825 04:17:17< wesbot>  council..
20090825 04:17:19< AI0867> ah, k
20090825 04:17:20< wesbot> URL: https://gna.org/bugs/?14165
20090825 04:17:22< wesbot> Attached file (1st): https://gna.org/bugs/download.php?file_id=6494
20090825 04:22:48< shadowmaster> cat ~hyperion2/hyperion-ircd/var/lib/dancer-ircd/dline.conf
20090825 04:22:56< shadowmaster> argh
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20090825 04:38:58< CIA-62> fendrin * r38078 /trunk/data/campaigns/Delfadors_Memoirs/scenarios/11_wasteland.cfg: 
20090825 04:38:58< CIA-62> DM 11: Fixed wrong story speech if Delfador sights elves and is already known to Chantal.
20090825 04:38:58< CIA-62> For that reason I lift also the shroud for Delfador when he meets Chantal since share_maps isn't supported in a modify_site.
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20090825 04:54:24< AI0867> http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=378466#p378466 <-- L:05 uses idle_ai for side 2, but side 2 is completely active
20090825 04:54:35< AI0867> though moving in a rather odd pattern
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20090825 05:06:58< AI0867> in fact, the scenario is thoroughly broken
20090825 05:24:38< Soliton> how big is a core file going to be? virtual memory size?
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20090825 07:10:41< Rhonda> corn: Just make sure apache is running after you fiddled with it ... :)
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20090825 08:59:12< Crab_> hi
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20090825 09:36:32< YogiHH> hello
20090825 09:37:00< Crab_> hi YogiHH
20090825 09:38:22< Crab_> YogiHH: a small theoretical question: is it possible to load a savegame with corrupt replay but correct snapshot ?
20090825 09:39:28< YogiHH> Crab_: yes, it is
20090825 09:39:33< Crab_> thanks
20090825 09:40:19< Aethaeryn> otherwise no one using debug could save
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20090825 10:50:49< Ivanovic> moin
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20090825 11:06:23< Ivanovic> cjhopman, corn, Crab_, deekay, euschn, ilor: don't forget that google wants to see the code you created over gsoc
20090825 11:06:51< Ivanovic> that is: probably the easiest thing is to have svn (or git-svn) create patches for you with all the revisions you commited
20090825 11:06:57< Crab_> Ivanovic: afair, it wants it only after 3rd September
20090825 11:07:25< Ivanovic> Crab_: but the code they want to see is up till yesterday (or the final eval deadline)
20090825 11:07:40< ilor> yeah I don't think the infrastructure for uploading that is up yet
20090825 11:07:47< Ivanovic> so yeah, you can't submit it before 3rd september
20090825 11:08:06< ilor> and iirc the code should be up to the 'firm pencils down' date ie ~a week ago
20090825 11:08:08< Ivanovic> but (in theory) the code they do want to see is the stuff that was created till now
20090825 11:08:31< Crab_> Ivanovic: 'until'  option should work fine
20090825 11:08:33< Ivanovic> ilor: since we were allowed to consider the stuff till the final eval deadline, that can probably be included in the code sample, too
20090825 11:08:47< ilor> ah
20090825 11:12:08< Crab_> Ivanovic: hehe , patch.txt almost 4Mb long :)
20090825 11:12:23< Ivanovic> Crab_: ah, just use bz2 on it and it is fine
20090825 11:12:29< euschn> someone posted this script on the mailing list for collecting all your svn diffs: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/m27feb1c1 worked fine for me with some modifications
20090825 11:12:44< Crab_> euschn: git log --author=crab -p > patch.txt
20090825 11:15:32< euschn> hm that looks simpler for sure
20090825 11:16:04< Ivanovic> but it is not possible with plain svn IIRC
20090825 11:16:35< Ivanovic> (and also includes no "timeconstraints" so that revisions before official starting are in, which does not work for ilor and deekay)
20090825 11:17:31< ilor> Ivanovic: there most likely are more options to git log that will do that ;)
20090825 11:17:32< Crab_> Ivanovic: it's easy - use the 'git log' command to find out the commit IDs, and specify them as a range
20090825 11:18:15< Ivanovic> ilor: of course there are
20090825 11:18:34< Ivanovic> Crab_: is it not possible to also filter via date in git?
20090825 11:18:48< Crab_> Ivanovic: yes, possible, too
20090825 11:19:21< Crab_> --since-date and --until-date options
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20090825 11:19:54< Crab_> but still an 1-liner
20090825 11:20:31< Ivanovic> Crab_: the svn command is possible as oneliner, too
20090825 11:20:48< Ivanovic> though the one posted as script creates one diff per revision
20090825 11:21:19< Crab_> and then they're tarballed into one file at which no one will look anyway :)
20090825 11:21:29< Ivanovic> uhm, yeah
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20090825 13:33:35< CIA-62> fendrin * r38079 /trunk/data/campaigns/Delfadors_Memoirs/scenarios/08_ur_thorodor.cfg: DM 08: Limit the amount of gryphons Ur'Thorodor can recruit.
20090825 13:34:36< CIA-62> fendrin * r38080 /trunk/data/campaigns/Delfadors_Memoirs/maps/wasteland.map: DM 11: Updated the map with new terrain types.
20090825 13:36:24< CIA-62> fendrin * r38081 /trunk/data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/02_Hostile_mountains.cfg: LoW 2: Removed a silly story message.
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20090825 15:14:43< Crab_> Ivanovic: GSoC summary sent via forum PM
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20090825 16:02:19< CIA-62> soliton * r38082 /branches/1.6/src/server/server.cpp: added last seen time to the ip log (backport of r38039)
20090825 16:02:25< CIA-62> soliton * r38083 /branches/1.6/src/server/server.cpp: match online players in the searchlog result by ip and nick
20090825 16:02:29< CIA-62> soliton * r38084 /branches/1.6/src/server/server.cpp: improved connected time display a bit
20090825 16:02:32< CIA-62> soliton * r38085 /branches/1.6/src/server/server.cpp: removed code duplication
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20090825 16:35:59< CIA-62> ivanovic * r38086 /trunk/ (4 files in 3 dirs): updated Chinese (Traditional) translation
20090825 16:36:01< CIA-62> ivanovic * r38087 /branches/1.6/ (4 files in 3 dirs): updated Chinese (Traditional) translation
20090825 16:38:33< CIA-62> soliton * r38088 /trunk/src/server/server.cpp: match online players in the searchlog result by ip and nick
20090825 16:38:41< CIA-62> soliton * r38089 /trunk/src/server/server.cpp: improved connected time display a bit
20090825 16:38:51< CIA-62> soliton * r38090 /trunk/src/server/server.cpp: removed code duplication
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20090825 17:02:27< CIA-62> soliton * r38091 /branches/1.6/src/server/ (ban.cpp server.cpp): synchronized timestamp functions and the format used
20090825 17:02:59< CIA-62> soliton * r38092 /trunk/src/server/ (ban.cpp server.cpp): synchronized timestamp functions and the format used
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20090825 18:37:32< ilor> Ivanovic: added an overview of my project to the top of http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/MP_Server_Ilor
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20090825 19:00:23< Soliton> wesnothd still manages to throw a std::bad_alloc exception in compress_buffer()  http://nopaste.com/p/adOnkMT7db
20090825 19:01:06< Soliton> i don't really see how that's possible but i guess i'll wrap the whole function in a try-catch block..
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20090825 19:39:15< mordante> servus
20090825 19:40:48< ilor> Soliton: did we get any info from those try..catches yu put there?
20090825 19:41:26< Soliton> ilor: no, what i meant was that the exception is still uncaught.
20090825 19:41:37< ilor> figured as much
20090825 19:42:43< Soliton> i guess it's the vector allocation then?
20090825 19:43:14< Soliton> though i would have thought there'd be some mention about vector in the bt then.
20090825 19:52:07< ilor> Soliton: can't think of anything smarter than put a big try-catch around the call and log all the arguments in the catch block
20090825 20:21:27-!- YogiHH [n=chatzill@d027101.adsl.hansenet.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090825 20:25:25< YogiHH> Sirp, you there?
20090825 20:37:32< CIA-62> jhinrichs * r38093 /trunk/src/ai/composite/engine.cpp: Silence a VC++ warning
20090825 20:40:48< CIA-62> jhinrichs * r38094 /trunk/src/ (gamestatus.cpp gamestatus.hpp savegame.cpp):
20090825 20:41:23< YogiHH> oops, forgot the comment: "Some refactoring on the savegame code."
20090825 20:41:57< YogiHH> mordante: ping
20090825 20:42:33< mordante> YogiHH, pong
20090825 20:42:46< YogiHH> mordante: got a few minutes to discuss something?
20090825 20:42:59< ilor> mordante: OT, if all goes well, I'll get all the parts for my new computer tomorrow ;)
20090825 20:43:04< mordante> YogiHH, yes, guess we wanted to do that last weekend
20090825 20:43:11< mordante> ilor, cool :-)
20090825 20:43:23< YogiHH> yes, that, too, but i got something else on my mind, right now :)
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20090825 20:44:10< YogiHH> mordante: With euschn, i designed an interface to deal with creating config information for savegames
20090825 20:44:28< ilor> I wonder how building wesnoth will scale with a cpu oveclock ;) also mordante I recall you being quite adamant about the hdd in your build, care to say what it is?
20090825 20:44:49< YogiHH> mordante: however, there are parts of the code that can't implement this interface directly, as they don't work with classes but rather are function oriented and have global variables
20090825 20:45:31< YogiHH> mordante: Am i right, that considered this architecture, the closest equivalent to an interface is a separate header that has that functionality?
20090825 20:45:57-!- Blueblaze [n=irchon@32.171.163.5] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
20090825 20:46:17< mordante> ilor, what do you exactly mean? I just want a raid 1 since hdd tend to die often
20090825 20:47:24< mordante> YogiHH, not entirely sure what you mean, can you give an example?
20090825 20:47:44< YogiHH> moment, phone
20090825 20:51:16< YogiHH> mordante: for the savegame relevant code, i need to create config information to store in the savegame, for example for teams.
20090825 20:52:00< YogiHH> mordante: To minimize dependencies, i don't want to expose the whole team functionality to the savegame code, basically just one method that creates the config.
20090825 20:52:18-!- Aethaeryn [n=Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #Wesnoth-dev
20090825 20:52:44< YogiHH> mordante: Therefore, we created a class with one abstract method and make team inherit from it. To the savegame code, we only need to expose this one method
20090825 20:52:59< YogiHH> mordante: That is what i called an interface
20090825 20:53:34< YogiHH> mordane: However with other parts of the code, this doesn't work, as there are no suitable objects to implement the method.
20090825 20:54:01< YogiHH> mordante: I wonder how to deal with that.
20090825 20:54:07-!- Crab_ [n=Crab_@wesnoth/developer/crab] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090825 20:54:27< YogiHH> mordante: I could either convert those parts into object oriented code, and then implement the method.
20090825 20:54:56< YogiHH> mordante: Or i could try to find some equivalent to an interface that works with the current architecture of global variables and functions
20090825 20:54:58< mordante> you can just write a free standing function
20090825 20:55:20< YogiHH> mordante: I was thinking if an additional header could work as a substitute for such an interface
20090825 20:55:50< mordante> Yes it's possible to do that, I did that at some work related projects
20090825 20:56:17< mordante> one factory function that returns a class, whose details are not know by the rest of the program
20090825 20:56:52< YogiHH> ok, then i think i will do that, as rewriting the code to be object oriented is quite a bit of work
20090825 20:57:00< mordante> but freestanding function are nice for this kind of thing, I often put them in namespaces to avoid cluttering the global namespace
20090825 20:57:08< mordante> but we don't do that much in Wesnoth
20090825 20:57:13< YogiHH> i see
20090825 20:57:43< YogiHH> i was thinking of a freestanding function rather than a factory
20090825 20:58:00< mordante> to be honest, rewriting it just that it can be object orientated was the reason I hated object orientated code
20090825 20:58:11-!- Espreon [n=espreon@wesnoth/developer/espreon] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090825 20:58:13< YogiHH> it only returns a config, there is no need to hide something for that
20090825 20:58:31< mordante> there should be a balance between functional and object orientated code, both are tools, pick the best one
20090825 20:58:51< YogiHH> mordante: yes, object oriented code should have more benefits than just being object oriented :)
20090825 20:58:58< mordante> exactly
20090825 21:00:13< Crab_> YogiHH: well, if you want to get rid of dependencies, you can do it the 'reverse way' - a static function in the savegame code which is used by other parts of the ai to register 'callbacks' which should be called to save a specific part of the game in specific location of the save config
20090825 21:00:19< Crab_> s/ai/game
20090825 21:00:21< ilor> mordante: I meant as in hdd model, I remeber you saying they got you the wrong ones or something
20090825 21:00:53< mordante> ah yes I ordered caviar black and got the slow caviar green ones
20090825 21:01:16< mordante> and I expect to get what I pay for
20090825 21:01:29< YogiHH> Crab_: yes, i once wrote generic_event.cpp for exactly this purpose, but i use it with care, as it can make the code very hard to follow if used extensively
20090825 21:02:34< Crab_> YogiHH: yes, it needs a built-in tracer to allow following 'what is going on'
20090825 21:03:35< Crab_> however, a "stateless facade in a separate header" is also a good way of reducing dependencies
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20090825 21:07:36< YogiHH> mordante: could you start wesnoth with --new-widgets and have a look at the load-game dialog, please?
20090825 21:09:21< mordante>  YogiHH I'll do it in a few minutes after I finished reviewing a patch
20090825 21:09:29< YogiHH> ok
20090825 21:11:31< Crab_> YogiHH: btw, can you say something about r38093 ?
20090825 21:11:52-!- fendrin [n=fabi@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has quit [Remote closed the connection]
20090825 21:13:07< YogiHH> Crab_: oh, that's just vc++ not getting that for "variable */* comment */" the first star is a pointer and not the ending of a comment :)
20090825 21:13:19< Crab_> YogiHH: yes, but the function is unused :)
20090825 21:13:39< Crab_> YogiHH: so, it looks like a 'bad automerge' issue 
20090825 21:13:49< YogiHH> Crab_: Seems that the vc++ parser is not too impressed of that ;-)
20090825 21:14:37< YogiHH> I didn't check if that code is used actually, i just silenced the warning. Could well be, that this is an automerge artefact
20090825 21:14:43< Crab_> ok
20090825 21:15:00< Crab_> YogiHH: I deleted it recently 
20090825 21:15:08< YogiHH> ah, ok
20090825 21:15:49< Crab_> I'll keep in mind MSVC and */*
20090825 21:15:50< mordante> YogiHH, I have the dialog
20090825 21:16:38< YogiHH> mordante: first question: how do i get some space between the caption "Choose a game to load" and the textbox below?
20090825 21:17:22< CIA-62> crab * r38095 /trunk/src/ai/composite/engine.cpp: remove an accidentialy resurrected function
20090825 21:19:42< mordante> YogiHH, you should add a border for the widget, you have to set that per widget
20090825 21:20:55< YogiHH> so the border is like a margin?
20090825 21:21:39< mordante> YogiHH, yes, IIRC ilor wanted to rename it
20090825 21:22:03< ilor> mordante: see, border is not a clear name ;)
20090825 21:22:25< mordante> ilor, then do something about it :-P
20090825 21:22:27< ilor> seems tyo work more like padding though like you said then
20090825 21:22:44< ilor> html margins have all these collapsing rules etc
20090825 21:23:01< YogiHH> yes, padding is something that i know how to deal with ;-)
20090825 21:23:11< mordante> yes I think padding is the best term for it
20090825 21:23:36< YogiHH> mordante: then i suppose that the "delete" and "cancel" buttons are not exactly on the same horizontal position has its cause in borders as well?
20090825 21:24:30< ilor> mordante: if I get my parts tomorrow and manage to stup a wesnoth build quickly, I'll have a go at the rename ;)
20090825 21:25:21< mordante> YogiHH, I can't see a difference and both have a border
20090825 21:25:59< YogiHH> mordante: for me, the delete button is positioned slightly more to the right
20090825 21:26:00< mordante> ilor, then I hope you have time to do the rename tomorrow
20090825 21:26:26< mordante> YogiHH, sorry misread
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20090825 21:27:44< mordante> YogiHH, indeed looks like the border again (in combination with the right alignment)
20090825 21:28:37< fendrin> Crab_: Hello. Are you finished with 2 and 3?
20090825 21:29:12< YogiHH> mordante: ok, i will play a little with that, then, to get the layout better done. Apart from that, i think the dialog is ready to go. Unless i am mistaken, it has all the functionality the old one had. Or do you know of any gui2 glitches regarding the listbox and scrolling?
20090825 21:30:06< Crab_> fendrin: with 2 - mostly (there are some C++ engine optimizations that I'll do to make the dwarf side go a bit faster where the avoid is in effect; plus, I need to write a 'retreat to home territory' candidate action
20090825 21:30:25< Crab_> fendrin: with 3 - will commit a new version later today
20090825 21:30:48< Crab_> fendrin: have you tested LoW 2 with yesterday's commits ?
20090825 21:31:35< fendrin> Crab_: Yes I have. Just waiting leeds to troll step on dwarf land every time.
20090825 21:32:09< mordante> YogiHH, I'm only not sure about the speed of listboxes with a lot of items, or very long listboxes in general
20090825 21:32:28< mordante> maybe shadowmaster can test a bit, IIRC he has a very long list of savegames
20090825 21:32:39< YogiHH> mordante: ok, i will do a performance test for that, then
20090825 21:32:45< Crab_> fendrin: yes, of course. especially with the keep moved south, trolls do that almost each time
20090825 21:33:16< shadowmaster> mordante: I dropped it when I installed debian lenny on the old laptop
20090825 21:33:25< shadowmaster> e.g. no backups where to restore from
20090825 21:33:29< Crab_> fendrin: this can be fixed by:
20090825 21:33:35< mordante> shadowmaster, ok thanks
20090825 21:33:35< fendrin> Crab_: I must look at the global ai defining and delete the part that goes for the leader?
20090825 21:33:40< shadowmaster> mordante: nonetheless I have 304 saves right now
20090825 21:33:46< YogiHH> well, getting a lot of savegames into a directory is probably the easiest part :)
20090825 21:33:54< Crab_> way 1) positioning a line of dwarven guards along the edge of the leader to ZoC away the nearest path to the player
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20090825 21:34:20< mordante> YogiHH, and it might be this bug https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?14145 also is there in listboxes
20090825 21:34:37< Crab_> fendrin: 'going for the leader' and 'going for the villages' is inherent part of default AI targeting. there is leader_value and village_value parameters that should be tuned
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20090825 21:35:06< YogiHH> mordante: mmm, how large is "large"
20090825 21:35:08< Crab_> way 2) adding an 'avoid' to trolls until they 'have tasted blood' in some way
20090825 21:35:18< YogiHH> ?
20090825 21:35:43< mordante> not sure, but I guess 32K pixels might be the magical value
20090825 21:35:52< Crab_> way 3: somehow force the trolls 'north' before they go north-east
20090825 21:36:04< fendrin> Crab_: I have had that sort of code. A wml event that lifted the avoid after the first troll was killed.
20090825 21:36:17< Crab_> fendrin: was is bad ?
20090825 21:36:46< Crab_> fendrin: personally, I prefer 'a line of dwarven guards' on the southern border
20090825 21:36:48< fendrin> Crab_: It was in a string frezze. So I couldn't tell about it to the player. Nobody got it.
20090825 21:37:13< Crab_> fendrin: but now it's not stringfreeze...
20090825 21:37:35< YogiHH> mordante: uh, any idea how many letters that are approximately?
20090825 21:38:02< fendrin> Crab_: Can we tell the trolls ai to not to get for villages or leaders but for all elves that come in a certain range?
20090825 21:38:11< Crab_> fendrin: yes
20090825 21:38:25< mordante> YogiHH, about 1500 savegames
20090825 21:38:26< Crab_> fendrin: but does it make sence ? will trolls simply accept the loss of some villages ?
20090825 21:39:07< YogiHH> mordante: i see. Well i think about using folders way before i hit that limit ;-)
20090825 21:39:27< mordante> ok
20090825 21:39:48-!- Blueblaze [n=Blueblaz@32.171.163.5] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090825 21:39:56< mordante> we can test and enable the new dialog for 1.7.4 and if no new bugs are filed we can remove the old code later
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20090825 21:40:20< shadowmaster> mordante: what do you need me to test?
20090825 21:40:26< YogiHH> mordante: ok
20090825 21:40:46< fendrin> Crab_: You are right. Reviving the avoid until a troll dies could be worth a try.
20090825 21:40:51< mordante> shadowmaster, I wanted to make sure the load game dialog with --new-widgets can handle a lot of savegames
20090825 21:41:13< mordante> both speed and stability wise
20090825 21:41:16< shadowmaster> okay, compiling  (http://xkcd.com/303/)
20090825 21:41:42< Soliton> the new dialog still does not support directory traversal?
20090825 21:41:44< mordante> I think today's one is really great
20090825 21:42:04< mordante> Soliton, no unless somebody added code for taht
20090825 21:42:06< mordante> that*
20090825 21:44:03< Soliton> well, the save map dialog supports it since a while now.
20090825 21:44:39< mordante> which uses the old gui code (obviously it needs to be added the new gui as well)
20090825 21:46:06< shadowmaster> and which has seen several strange bugs as well
20090825 21:49:25< shadowmaster> I wish wesnoth trapped SIGTERM while on the loadscreen...
20090825 21:51:45< shadowmaster> mordante: ~300 saved games don't cause any problem at all here, but I don't like that eah time I select one, the dialog's width changes
20090825 21:53:05< Crab_> fendrin: the problem with the AI is that we need to to make 'smart' decisions as much as possible. so, for example, the best course of actions for the trolls is to go 'the fastest route through the dwarves'
20090825 21:54:02< Crab_> fendrin: so, although we can 'script' the ai into submission, the better way is to tune the variables it uses in the decision-making to make the course of action we want from it to appear 'smart'
20090825 22:05:39< Sirp> YogiHH: I'm here now if you still are. :)
20090825 22:05:58< YogiHH> Sirp: I am, but the issue settled already :)
20090825 22:07:43-!- Zarel [i=Zarel@warzone2100/developer/Zarel] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20090825 22:08:13< mordante> shadowmaster, the resizing can be fixed, but YogiHH doesn't know how ;-) I want to look at it later, first want to test it as is
20090825 22:11:20< Zarel> So, hmm.
20090825 22:11:30< Zarel> ilor: You there?
20090825 22:11:40< ilor> Zarel: sup?
20090825 22:12:04< Zarel> I noticed you committed my icons without asking me about licensing. :P
20090825 22:12:35< Zarel> I don't mind, but I thought it was kind of funny, since I'm used to people being really careful about copyright.
20090825 22:12:36< ilor> Zarel: ...
20090825 22:14:00< ilor> Zarel: http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=2014
20090825 22:14:08< mordante> Zarel, we are
20090825 22:14:29< mordante> ah ilor found the post I was looking for
20090825 22:15:06< Zarel> Ah, hmm? I think shrinkwrap licenses along the lines of "by posting here, you automatically license your post under <whatever license>" is rather poor legal precedence.
20090825 22:15:22< shadowmaster> Zarel: that's why the sticky is a sticky
20090825 22:15:34< shadowmaster> or announcement actually.
20090825 22:15:39< ilor> by posting in a therad that requests art for the game, in a forum about art for the game...
20090825 22:16:22 * Zarel shrugs
20090825 22:16:28< shadowmaster> similarly we won't be reciting the full Forum Rules to every new poster.
20090825 22:18:40< Zarel> Hmm, you license art under GPLv2? iirc, the reason the CC licenses were made was because the GPL didn't really fit for art, because of the "source code" requirement and all that.
20090825 22:18:53< ilor> Zarel: also you should probably have a look at facebookish sites which usually have a rather unfriendly "we own what you post" rules
20090825 22:19:06< Soliton> there are plenty of discussions about that on the forum.
20090825 22:19:26-!- noy [n=Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit ["GO, GET TO THE CHOPPAH!!!"]
20090825 22:19:46< Zarel> Soliton: Not recently, afaik.
20090825 22:20:02< Soliton> sure, is there anything new about it?
20090825 22:20:08< Zarel> "Sorry but you cannot use search at this time." <- and that's just from trying to click on page two of a search. :(
20090825 22:20:20< shadowmaster> Zarel: http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=22098
20090825 22:20:30< ilor> I wouldn't mind changing over to a cc-by-sa, but it's not super-simple. Wesnoth ain't large enough to get a special cc-compatible gpl version like wikpedia got
20090825 22:21:27< zookeeper> the main reason why the art license hasn't been changed ages ago already is that there's no way to get re-licensing permission from all the art contributors.
20090825 22:22:19< Zarel> Well, GFDL != GPL
20090825 22:22:47< Zarel> GFDL would be lots better than GPL when applied to things other than source code. ;)
20090825 22:22:47< ilor> Zarel: doesn't matter as long as the FSF is willing to hack around their own licenses ;)
20090825 22:23:15< shadowmaster> it'd have to be a dual license since there's already artwork being distributed under the GPL (all the artwork)
20090825 22:23:20< shadowmaster> you can't just revoke the GPL.
20090825 22:23:25< zookeeper> everyone knows the GPL sucks for art but it's practically impossible to ask for permission from every contributor.
20090825 22:23:32< shadowmaster> which makes the license change kind of impossible imo
20090825 22:23:58< ilor> shadowmaster: nah, we'd just distribute the new versions of art as cc. old ones are still gpl
20090825 22:24:13< shadowmaster> ilor: do you mean new artwork? as in completely new sprites?
20090825 22:24:16< Zarel> Exactly. Perhaps dual-license CC and GPL.
20090825 22:24:33< shadowmaster> new versions of existing artwork could fall into the derived content category (thus, requiring to be licensed under the GPL still)
20090825 22:24:51< ilor> shadowmaster: no, new releases of wesnoth (assuming a miracle happens and we get a relicensing from every single wesnoth contributuor on the planet)
20090825 22:26:07< ilor> not sure if there'd be any poiunt in dual licensing, isn't cc-by-sa compatible with gpl?
20090825 22:27:14< Zarel> CC-BY-SA-3.0 qualifies under DFSG, but I'm not sure if that means it's GPL-compatible...
20090825 22:28:21< zookeeper> the point of changing the license would be to prevent wesnoth from breaking its own license for not providing the sources. at least i don't much other reason to do something like that.
20090825 22:28:31< zookeeper> +see
20090825 22:29:52-!- lizard_r [n=Miranda@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/lizard] has quit ["Saurian Augur - I'll heal you by 4 hp if you leave next to me"]
20090825 22:31:04< Zarel> http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=26541&p=379291#p379291
20090825 22:32:01< zookeeper> actually the vast majority of the art could easily pass as GPL, it's actually only the music which is in obvious violation due to the lack of proper source
20090825 22:33:32< Zarel> The last discussion on GPL for artwork I read, I remember someone said the wording was "preferred format for editing", so for some pixel art that doesn't use layers/etc, PNGs could work well enough.
20090825 22:33:52< mordante> I'm off night
20090825 22:33:54< zookeeper> yes, for sprites and other "small" images
20090825 22:33:57< ilor> night mordante
20090825 22:34:20-!- mordante [n=mordante@wesnoth/developer/mordante] has quit ["Leaving"]
20090825 22:34:41< Zarel> That's why I just uploaded my PNGs for the one that I used something other than Pencil tool with.
20090825 22:36:13< Zarel> PSDs*
20090825 22:40:08< Soliton> you're not required to post your source to the public. you can just hand it out on request.
20090825 22:44:41< loonycyborg> And what if it was lost long ago?
20090825 22:47:48< Soliton> it doesn't matter when it was lost.
20090825 22:49:39< loonycyborg> What are the consequences of not providing source on request? I wonder whether someone can sue the author in that case..
20090825 22:53:16< Soliton> i doubt there'd be much of a case if it's not derivative work.
20090825 22:54:42< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: 1) the author can always say that the png is the source
20090825 22:54:44-!- Blueblaze [n=Blueblaz@32.171.163.5] has quit [Read error: 104 (Connection reset by peer)]
20090825 22:54:56< Ivanovic> yes, in pixel art it *is* possible to directly work with the png file
20090825 22:55:16< Ivanovic> 2) if the file is lost anyway, the png *automatically* becomes all sources that are available
20090825 22:55:20< CIA-62> soliton * r38096 /branches/1.6/src/server/ (game.cpp server.cpp simple_wml.cpp): improved simple_wml error exception handling and error logging
20090825 22:56:23-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 1.7.4 planned for Sunday | 81 bugs, 242 feature requests, 10 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20090825 22:57:13< Zarel> Whoa, fast release schedule.
20090825 22:57:25< Zarel> I remember last week 1.7.3 hadn't even been released yet.
20090825 22:57:45< Zarel> That, or I haven't been paying much attention to 1.7 releases.
20090825 22:59:16< fendrin> Crab_: Wulf Rider's formula ai in LoW 16 stoped moving.
20090825 23:00:44< CIA-62> soliton * r38097 /branches/1.6/src/server/server.cpp: added missing newline
20090825 23:00:52< Crab_> fendrin: yes, the syntax changed. AI turn is composed of stages. unit_formulas stage ( http://www.wesnoth.org/wiki/Ai_Module#unit_formulas ) must be added as first stage of the ai to make it work again.
20090825 23:00:57< Crab_> fendrin: should I do it now ?
20090825 23:01:07< fendrin> Crab_: Yes, please.
20090825 23:01:25< AI0867> zookeeper: do you know if the enemy= style team declaration (rather than team_name) is still in use anywhere other than the test scenario?
20090825 23:02:44< AI0867> because it doesn't really seem to work
20090825 23:04:35< YogiHH> good night
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20090825 23:05:02< Soliton> no, it's not.
20090825 23:05:21< zookeeper> yeah, probably not in mainline
20090825 23:05:28< zookeeper> maybe in some stray UMC?
20090825 23:05:43< Soliton> since it doesn't work i doubt that.
20090825 23:06:25< AI0867> well, it sort of works
20090825 23:06:29< AI0867> when there's just side 1 and 2
20090825 23:07:02< AI0867> but when adding a third side, I found it impossible to get that side to be friendly with anyone
20090825 23:08:03< Soliton> can you have a side without a team_name?
20090825 23:08:48< AI0867> you can, it just doesn't seem to be able to be on a team with anyone
20090825 23:09:33< AI0867> Crab_: maybe you want to take a look at this? -> http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=378466#p378466
20090825 23:09:35< zookeeper> in any case, enemy= doesn't need to be fixed..
20090825 23:10:00< AI0867> deprecate it or just tear it out right now?
20090825 23:10:04< Crab_> AI0867: who's the maintainer of Liberty ?
20090825 23:10:10< AI0867> no idea
20090825 23:10:16< AI0867> but the side has idle_ai
20090825 23:10:18< AI0867> and it moves
20090825 23:10:31< Crab_> AI0867: ok, I'll be able to check that
20090825 23:12:03< Soliton> if(team_name.empty()) { team_name = cfg["side"];
20090825 23:12:03< Soliton> }
20090825 23:12:22< stikonas> Crab_: ESR and zookeeper have most commits in Liberty
20090825 23:12:22< zookeeper> Crab_, me
20090825 23:12:44< Soliton> so no, you can't really have a side without a team_name.
20090825 23:13:19< Crab_> zookeeper: ok. I was told about http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=378466#p378466 , and I wanted to ask the question: what the AI is *supposed* to do in that scenario ?
20090825 23:13:22< Soliton> and i'm afraid there is a lot of code that relies on that.
20090825 23:13:41< Soliton> i wouldn't mind if enemy= gets fixed though.
20090825 23:14:10< zookeeper> AI0867, if you want to, support for team_name accepting a comma-separated list would be useful as a replacement for the lost capabilities of enemy= ;)
20090825 23:15:01< stikonas> Ivanovic: somebody should go over http://wesnoth.org/wiki/SpellingMistakes
20090825 23:15:14< stikonas> there are quite a lot of them
20090825 23:15:43< AI0867> Crab_: it's supposed to just sit there until you move into range, then it switches the nearby units to side 3 (which has a default_ai)
20090825 23:15:49 * Ivanovic points esr to the page stikonas just linked
20090825 23:16:00< Crab_> AI0867: ok
20090825 23:16:30< zookeeper> yeah, that's correct
20090825 23:16:35< stikonas> Ivanovic: and credits were not updated for 3 months
20090825 23:16:46< Ivanovic> stikonas: you mean the website?
20090825 23:16:53< zookeeper> also, when they can't see any player units anymore, they get turned back to side 2 and thus should go back to being idle
20090825 23:16:53< Ivanovic> will probably update it on sunday
20090825 23:17:09< boucman> hey all
20090825 23:17:10< stikonas> yes, website
20090825 23:17:10< AI0867> I believe the NEUTRAL_SIDE macro somewhat fills that void
20090825 23:17:17< Crab_> hi boucman
20090825 23:17:26< AI0867> but that sounds reasonable
20090825 23:17:30< Zarel> :O :O :O :O :O
20090825 23:17:39< Zarel> I just realized that esr is Eric S. Raymond.
20090825 23:17:40< Zarel> :O :O
20090825 23:17:49< Soliton> that's a pretty hacky macro iirc.
20090825 23:18:27< zookeeper> yes, very hacky and doesn't work perfectly
20090825 23:20:59< stikonas> zookeeper: do you know if 50 out of 34 HP in 2p-Dark Forecast (Survival map) is normal behavior?
20090825 23:21:06< stikonas> or this is a bug?
20090825 23:21:15< Soliton> a bug.
20090825 23:21:17< zookeeper> yep
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20090825 23:25:11< AI0867> wesnoth: src/ai/default/move.cpp:301: virtual std::pair<map_location, map_location> ai::ai_default::choose_move(std::vector<ai::target, std::allocator<ai::target> >&, const ai::move_map&, const ai::move_map&, const ai::move_map&): Assertion `map_.on_board(ittg->loc)' failed.
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20090825 23:29:33< Sapient> looks like an AI bug
20090825 23:31:42< AI0867> yeah
20090825 23:31:46< Crab_> Sapient: yes, it is
20090825 23:31:51< AI0867> it came completely out of nowhere and is not reproducible
20090825 23:32:04< Crab_> AI0867: i have a way to reproduce, working on solving it atm
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20090825 23:50:52< CIA-62> ai0867 * r38098 /trunk/ (5 files in 3 dirs): 
20090825 23:50:52< CIA-62> Added ability to change the share_maps team attribute using [modify_side]
20090825 23:50:52< CIA-62> tag. Be sure to use shroud=yes for that side
20090825 23:50:56< CIA-62> ai0867 * r38099 /trunk/data/campaigns/Delfadors_Memoirs/scenarios/11_wasteland.cfg: Uncomment some WML that is now supported.
20090825 23:51:51< Zarel> So I just read through the entirety of http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=2&t=22098
20090825 23:52:03< Zarel> It seems like it died in Sept of last year, and was never resolved?
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20090825 23:55:01< Soliton> everything on the addon server is still under the GPL.
20090825 23:55:38< CIA-62> fendrin * r38100 /trunk/data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/maps/14_Human_Alliance.map: LoW 14: Thrown in more forested hills to enhance the value of dwarves on this map.
20090825 23:56:17< AI0867> the only thing we can really do is *add* licenses, removing the GPL from stuff would create a huge mess (most UMC authors don't understand it as it is)
20090825 23:57:23< Zarel> Well, yes.
20090825 23:57:30< Zarel> Basically, what I would suggest is:
20090825 23:57:41< Zarel> 1. All future work gets licensed CC-BY-SA (or simply CC-BY)
20090825 23:58:24< Ivanovic> Zarel: you know that this would introduce a *real* mess with releasing=
20090825 23:58:49< Zarel> 2. Any artists who can be contacted should be asked if they want to relicense their work under CC-BY-SA (or simply CC-BY), and if so, that is done. Make sure to mention that it doesn't grant any more rights that the GPL grants; it just resolves some inconsistencies with the GPL.
20090825 23:58:59< Ivanovic> it would basically not be possible to release our current tarball the way it is done now since many distribuitions force a split when a mix of licenses comes in
20090825 23:59:03< Zarel> 3. For any previous work that can't be relicensed, leave as GPL.
20090825 23:59:20< Zarel> Ivanovic: Not really, since CC-BY/CC-BY-SA is supposedly GPL-compatible.
20090825 23:59:31< Zarel> It's what we do for Warzone.
20090825 23:59:40< Ivanovic> not really
20090825 23:59:51< Zarel> And we still release a single tarball, etc.
20090825 23:59:52< Ivanovic> it does not enforce things the way like the gpl does
20090825 23:59:57< AI0867> CC-BY-SA is not GPL compatible
--- Log closed Wed Aug 26 00:00:14 2009