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20091206 10:20:11< Ivanovic> moin
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20091206 15:04:05< SekoIdiootti> hi, people...
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20091206 16:21:00< ^kenhoob-it> hello
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20091206 16:24:10< ^myokidzu> hello
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20091206 16:28:36< ^kenhoob-it> hello can I use the battleforwesnoth installer for ubuntu 9 with ubuntu 8.04? Can you help me?
20091206 16:31:23< ^kenhoob-it> hello G-lo hello soliton
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20091206 18:23:19< Rawel> hello all.:)
20091206 18:24:56< Rawel> I have a question for some of the wesnoth gurus out there. I have just started playing the second part of the tutorial scenario and for some reason the orcs seem to be getting to move turns to my one? Any one know how come?
20091206 18:26:29< fendrin> ?
20091206 18:28:48< zookeeper> "getting to move turns to my one" means...what? they move twice per turn?
20091206 18:29:06< Rawel> yes sorry to=two typo.
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20091206 18:30:20< Rawel> The wolf riders make it onto the middle island in the 2nd turn (i.e. first turn they are able to move).
20091206 18:30:39< zookeeper> sounds like a bug with the AI/gotos/etc...fendrin, haven't you worked some on that recently?
20091206 18:32:14< Rawel> Oh btw I'm playing the 1.7.9-1.8beta2 version if that helps at all.
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20091206 18:33:34< Rawel> Also the orc that starts on the island and moves to the end of the bridge on the first turn moves back to the island on the second turn then other units move then he moves back to end of bridge and attacks.
20091206 18:33:49< zookeeper> probably a bug in that version
20091206 18:34:21< zookeeper> shouldn't affect pretty much anything outside the tutorial though
20091206 18:34:55< fendrin> zookeeper: no, I did not work on the ai c++ code yet.
20091206 18:35:14< fendrin> zookeeper: but crap fixed something in there.
20091206 18:35:37< zookeeper> craB :P
20091206 18:35:51< zookeeper> http://www.thefreedictionary.com/crap
20091206 18:36:32< fendrin> :-)
20091206 18:38:32< zookeeper> Rawel, so, better to just skip that scenario then
20091206 18:38:57< zookeeper> (not that there are any more tutorial scenarios)
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20091206 21:37:30< SekoIdiootti> bye
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20091206 22:24:20< sandman> What I don't understand is why does the Wesnoth iPhone app cost money? 
20091206 22:24:28< sandman> Could probably be the most popular app in the app store if it wasn't.
20091206 22:24:44< sandman> You'd think, Wesnoth being free, it would in turn be free on the iPhone. But yet, it's not. Gotta pay money for it
20091206 22:24:51< shadowmaster> distributor's decision? :P
20091206 22:24:58< shadowmaster> you can still get the original for free.
20091206 22:25:29< Ivanovic> sandman: porting the game is *a lot* of work
20091206 22:25:35< shadowmaster> with 'original' I mean mainline Wesnoth, of course.
20091206 22:25:37< sandman> So if I were to port it myself, I could just give it away for free?
20091206 22:25:44< sandman> @ the App Store?
20091206 22:25:45< Ivanovic> and i am not sure if apple realy does allow "completely free" apps
20091206 22:26:01< Ivanovic> in the appstore that is
20091206 22:26:04< sandman> It does. I have loads of free apps.
20091206 22:26:13< sandman> Most applications are free.
20091206 22:26:16< Ivanovic> even something as large as wesnoth?
20091206 22:26:19< sandman> Yeah
20091206 22:26:21< Ivanovic> sorry, would suprise me
20091206 22:26:23< sandman> There are lots of games for free
20091206 22:26:29< sandman> Like MMOs and FPS
20091206 22:26:37< Ivanovic> 250MB downloads?
20091206 22:26:56< sandman> Yup
20091206 22:27:04< Ivanovic> interesting
20091206 22:27:05< shadowmaster> Ivanovic: the distribution size is probably out of the matter, since the iPhone port has scaled down versions of graphics
20091206 22:27:22< Ivanovic> beside this: the sources are available, so you are free to compile it yourself
20091206 22:27:36< shadowmaster> yes, you can also compile it for the iPhone :P
20091206 22:27:38< Ivanovic> it is just not allowed for someone else to publish the same product in the appstore
20091206 22:27:49< Ivanovic> (apple policy thing)
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20091206 22:28:44< sandman> So I couldn't port Wesnoth now?
20091206 22:28:50< sandman> And give it away for free?
20091206 22:28:58< Ivanovic> not via the apple appstore
20091206 22:29:03< sandman> I'll hafta call them about that.
20091206 22:29:23< sandman> Because that's likely exactly what I'll do. Basically, do the exact same thing this guy is doing, but give it away for free.
20091206 22:29:28< sandman> I'll put that in the app description, too =)
20091206 22:29:36< sandman> Same thing as this other app, exactly, except it's free.
20091206 22:30:09< Ivanovic> considering that the other guy *has* spent some significant efford i think it is 100% fair that he charges money for the port
20091206 22:30:20< Ivanovic> that is: apple gets a part of the money, he gets the rest
20091206 22:30:26< Ivanovic> from the rest he donates to wesnoth, too
20091206 22:30:36< sandman> Considering that it's a free app, I will happily put forth significant effort also, and not charge money for it.
20091206 22:30:51< sandman> If someone wants to donate, they should do it directly to wesnoth.
20091206 22:31:02< sandman> I don't see how it helps wesnoth for Apple to get money
20091206 22:32:14< sandman> I'm all about developers getting money
20091206 22:32:16< sandman> Don't get me wrong
20091206 22:32:29< sandman> For example, if the developer of the application had given it away for free
20091206 22:32:43< sandman> I would personally send him $100 or more. 
20091206 22:32:54< sandman> As a donation. But to require it... that hurts wesnoth. 
20091206 22:32:57< Ivanovic> the problem is not many people share this opinion and act after it
20091206 22:33:07< sandman> It could be a lot more popular if it were free, I think. Would get the word out and really popularize it.
20091206 22:33:24< sandman> I think wesnoth would be a smash hit on the iphone if it were free, actually.
20091206 22:33:33< Ivanovic> too popular is not good for us either, the mp server might not be able to handle too much
20091206 22:33:34< Ivanovic> ;)
20091206 22:33:43< sandman> Ivanovic: Right, well. I'm going to start it tonight. 
20091206 22:33:49< sandman> More users can mean more donations.
20091206 22:34:13< Ivanovic> in general we earned by far more with the percentage we get from the iphone port than we get by donations
20091206 22:34:32< sandman> The software is free, so I suppose you _can_ charge money for it. But it is certainly not the best option. Another person is equally free to do the same thing for free.
20091206 22:34:34< Ivanovic> that is: in the first week we earned more from the percentages of the iphone port than we got in >2 years in donations
20091206 22:34:39< Ivanovic> sad but that is the way things are
20091206 22:34:45< sandman> That's because of the audience involved. There are a _lot_ of iphone users.
20091206 22:34:48< Ivanovic> the software is not exactly free as in beer
20091206 22:35:02< Ivanovic> people *are* allowed to sell it and it is perfectly fine if people make money with it
20091206 22:35:08< sandman> Of course.
20091206 22:35:18< sandman> And someone else is allowed to give it away for free, and that's perfectly fine, too.
20091206 22:35:45< Ivanovic> (as long as they follow the license, and KylePoole has done so and he even donates part of the money back to wesnoth (a significant part that is!), which is not required by the license)
20091206 22:36:25< sandman> Are you trying to convince me to not port it?
20091206 22:36:35< sandman> And give it away for free?
20091206 22:36:54< Ivanovic> no, i am just stating how things currently are
20091206 22:37:25< Ivanovic> that i, as wesnoth dev, do not have a single problem with the version *not* being free of charge, since the porter has spent significant work on it and he does this for a living
20091206 22:38:25< sandman> Well, now I feel as if I'm going to be stepping on everyones' feet by making a free port.
20091206 22:40:34< Ivanovic> no need to feel this way
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