--- Log opened Tue Feb 02 00:00:13 2010
--- Day changed Tue Feb 02 2010
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20100202 00:20:23< AI0867> Ivanovic: I have two padlocks, one which is all sandy inside and is hard to open/close, the other can be picked in 30 seconds
20100202 00:20:45< Ivanovic> AI0867: basically every padlock can be picked in 30s
20100202 00:20:55< Ivanovic> that is: those picked in 30s are the secure ones
20100202 00:21:12< Ivanovic> i picked some within less than 2s
20100202 00:21:13< Ivanovic> ;)
20100202 00:22:01< Ivanovic> the really bad ones are the ones that you have to bump against to open them
20100202 00:22:02< AI0867> Ivanovic: that 'picking' was mostly randomly moving around an unsuitable lockpick
20100202 00:22:20< AI0867> basically, the last pin is somewhat secure, but once you bump that one, it's open
20100202 00:22:31< AI0867> if you know that, it takes 2s indeed
20100202 00:23:02< AI0867> which raises the question: should I bring lockpicks? ;)
20100202 00:23:44< AI0867> the sandy one is reasonably secure, but that's just because it's hard to open regardless of the tool you're using (key or otherwise)
20100202 00:24:23< Ivanovic> many padlocks can be opened simply with some metal piece you put in and push a little
20100202 00:24:36< Ivanovic> (that is a 90° angle for pushing and open it is)
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20100202 00:25:40< Ivanovic> though it is better to have some lock attached then just nothing, right?
20100202 00:25:41< Ivanovic> ;)
20100202 00:26:13< AI0867> yeah
20100202 00:26:36< AI0867> I'm off
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20100202 01:04:06< shadowmaster> Ivanovic: around?
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20100202 01:37:45< shadowmaster> okay, never mind.
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20100202 04:42:33-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: string/feature freeze active! | 70 bugs, 243 feature requests, 8 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20100202 10:41:11< Ivanovic> moin
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20100202 12:13:35< Ivanovic> hmm, who is best suited to have a look at this report? https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?15256
20100202 12:13:48< Ivanovic> yeah, i do know that there is not too much information available in the report...
20100202 12:16:12< Ivanovic> ah, nun auch ein forum post: http://forum.gp2x.de/viewtopic.php?p=111407#p111407
20100202 12:19:07< Ivanovic> Rhonda: uhm, why have you marked the bugreport as "invalid"?
20100202 12:19:08< Ivanovic> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/wesnoth/+bug/386538
20100202 12:19:23< Ivanovic> Rhonda: IMO it is a clear case of "valid but not wesnoth upstream"
20100202 12:20:03< Ivanovic> Rhonda: basically a case where the dependency for ubuntu will have to differ from debian since in ubuntu you will have to change the dep to libsdl1.2debian-pulseaudio
20100202 12:21:20< Ivanovic> sure, the report could/should also be "the ubuntu default libsdl package sucks! (since it is broken in some cases)"
20100202 12:21:49< Rhonda> Ivanovic: Because that is a bug in libsdl and not one in wesnoth and it has to get fixed there.
20100202 12:22:07< Rhonda> There is no direct dependency on any specific audio sdl package in wesnoth at all.
20100202 12:22:26< Ivanovic> most likely it is not a bug in libsdl itself but the freaking packaging stuff ubuntu does
20100202 12:22:28< Ivanovic> ;)
20100202 12:22:34< Ivanovic> Rhonda: is there a report for this?
20100202 12:22:39< Rhonda> It definitely is.
20100202 12:22:50< Rhonda> I even thought I linked it in most of the reports, let me dig it up for you.
20100202 12:23:20< Ivanovic> i don't see it linked in that post and it would make sense to do so
20100202 12:23:28< Rhonda> https://bugs.launchpad.net/ubuntu/+source/libsdl1.2/+bug/203158 - look at its age.  *sigh*
20100202 12:23:39< Ivanovic> since that i what i used as reference for some people in the wesnoth forums
20100202 12:24:31< Rhonda> "They don't want to put libsdl1.2debian-pulseaudio as the first dependency of libsdl1.2debian, because Kubuntu and Xubuntu don't use pulseaudio by default, and that would break them. So Ubuntu remains broken instead."
20100202 12:24:39< Rhonda> See the irony in their approach. :)
20100202 12:24:48< Ivanovic> hehehe
20100202 12:26:34< Ivanovic> Rhonda: can i cite you with this in the forum post?
20100202 12:27:10< Rhonda> With what? That is from the bugreport, 203158
20100202 12:27:33< Ivanovic> ah, right
20100202 12:27:40< Rhonda> Thus the quotes. ;)
20100202 12:27:54< Rhonda> comment #22 in there
20100202 12:30:24< Ivanovic> http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?p=407176#p407176
20100202 12:33:52< Rhonda> AI0867: And I'm far from being "Ubuntu", mind you. :P
20100202 12:34:07< Rhonda> sheesh, insultings wherever I turn :)
20100202 12:34:25< CIA-62> ivanovic * r40984 /trunk/src/pathfind/: set svn:ignore for the new folder
20100202 12:35:04< CIA-62> ivanovic * r40985 /trunk/ (changelog players_changelog po/wesnoth-manual/pl.po): updated Polish translation
20100202 12:36:39< Rhonda> Ivanovic: You could have asked me right from the start too, you know :)
20100202 12:37:28< Ivanovic> Rhonda: why?
20100202 12:37:45< Ivanovic> my comment was a plain "instal the pulseaudio libsdl version since ubuntu sucks"
20100202 12:37:58< Ivanovic> the user was not able to use his package manager to search
20100202 12:38:01< Rhonda> Because I could have come up right ahead with the proper bug number. ;)
20100202 12:38:25 * Ivanovic stakes fendrin
20100202 12:38:35< Rhonda> But it's nice to see that now after about two years they are going to fix it. :)
20100202 12:39:22< fendrin> Ivanovic: What?
20100202 12:39:23< Ivanovic> data/gui/default/window/icon_message.cfg:143
20100202 12:39:33< Ivanovic> Rhonda: really, they are?
20100202 12:39:37< Ivanovic> fendrin: have a look at this line
20100202 12:40:02< Rhonda> Ivanovic: Yes, read the last few comments in 203158 :)
20100202 12:40:09< Rhonda> I was astonished by that, too.
20100202 12:40:21< Ivanovic> fendrin: do you see there what i see?
20100202 12:40:26< Ivanovic> yes, this string *is* new!
20100202 12:40:56< Rhonda> \o/ - new strings!
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20100202 12:45:08< mordante> pong fendrin 
20100202 12:45:21< fendrin> hi mordante
20100202 12:45:48< mordante> hi fendrin you were looking for me
20100202 12:46:17< fendrin> mordante: Ivanovic told me to talk to you about the recruit/recall gui for some reason.
20100202 12:47:02< mordante> Ivanovic, I expect to be at the university around 15:30 with AI0867 
20100202 12:47:55< Ivanovic> mordante: okay
20100202 12:48:06< fendrin> Ivanovic: Does the removal of the "#textdomain" disable translation for the file? 
20100202 12:48:08< mordante> fendrin, I left you a message in the log, that I want to review that code before getting it in
20100202 12:48:23< Ivanovic> fendrin: don't just remove the textdomain marker
20100202 12:48:31< Ivanovic> we got scripts that check for missing textdomains!
20100202 12:48:46< mordante> and nicely add them to the default domain
20100202 12:48:54< Ivanovic> exactly
20100202 12:49:09< Ivanovic> basically: DO NOT ADD NEW STRINGS, WE ARE IN FEATURE FREEZE ANYWAY!!!
20100202 12:49:14< Ivanovic> ;)
20100202 12:49:30< mordante> and in general I think the EXPERIMENTAL switch is a hack to branch trunk
20100202 12:49:52< Ivanovic> jupp
20100202 12:49:58< CIA-62> ivanovic * r40986 /trunk/po/wesnoth-manual/en_GB.po: fix some markup in the en_GB translation
20100202 12:51:02< mordante> fendrin, also having extra code in gui at the moment might accidentally cause some bugs or me breaking your code
20100202 12:52:14< Ivanovic> in general is the string you added already available in the textdomain wesnoth, but not in wesnoth-lib
20100202 12:52:27< Ivanovic> so in the domain wesnoth it would not have been a new string, in wesnoth-lib it is new
20100202 12:53:38< Ivanovic> hi ilor, nice to see you around again
20100202 12:53:47< Ivanovic> ilor: there are several bugs (crashes) assigned to you
20100202 12:54:00< Ivanovic> any idea when you will/might find time to look at those?
20100202 12:54:08< AI0867> mordante: EXPERIMENTAL is a branch that doesn't depend on svn's rather horrible merging systems
20100202 12:54:46< AI0867> svn's merging systems might not be that bad by themselves, but along with the speed at which trunk is changing
20100202 12:55:04< AI0867> by the time 1.8 is forked, hardly anything of the branch will cleanly merge
20100202 12:55:08< Ivanovic> AI0867: the problem with the branch itself is, that it changes too much in the stuff in "mainline" that is currently being fixed
20100202 12:55:23< AI0867> it changes stuff?
20100202 12:55:30< Ivanovic> if it was in an area that was not realted to "currently has many probs" it would merge cleanly
20100202 12:55:56< Ivanovic> since the branch itself is in the GUI2 area, that is currently under heavy bugfixing
20100202 12:55:58< mordante> AI0867, the problem is that we're working on new features instead of trying to fix all bugs
20100202 12:56:11< mordante> AI0867, I know a lot hangs on the MP-Lobby but still
20100202 12:56:13< Ivanovic> better try to get the existing stuff 100% stable first
20100202 12:56:33< Ivanovic> there is a reason for the feature freeze: concentrate all available resources on stabilizing instead of new features!
20100202 12:56:43< mordante> exactly
20100202 12:57:07< Ivanovic> yes, working on new features is more fun than fixing bugs
20100202 12:58:01< AI0867> "work on a new feature", "finish too late for 1.8 feature freeze", "constantly maintain your patchset"
20100202 12:58:55< CIA-62> fendrin * r40987 /trunk/data/gui/default/window/icon_message.cfg: Disabled the translation marks by making them part of the string.
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20100202 12:59:17< ilor> Ivanovic:yeah I know, I plan to have a run through the bugs today
20100202 12:59:21< mordante> AI0867, ?
20100202 12:59:48< Ivanovic> AI0867: in fact the work on the new feature was started after the feature freeze was started
20100202 12:59:50< ilor> got some breathing space, one exam left next monday and that's it
20100202 13:00:04< Ivanovic> and the freezed was announced more than a month before it was started
20100202 13:00:17< AI0867> I think the gui stuff wasn't
20100202 13:00:24< AI0867> the teleport stuff, sure
20100202 13:00:39< Ivanovic> AI0867: the work on this part of the GUI (new recruit dialog) was *not* started before the freeze
20100202 13:00:53< AI0867> how long have we been in freeze now?
20100202 13:00:54< Ivanovic> at least there was not a single commit regarding it before the start of the freeze
20100202 13:00:58< Ivanovic> a long time
20100202 13:01:04< mordante> too long :-(
20100202 13:01:12< AI0867> I've seen features go in since =P
20100202 13:02:03< Ivanovic> the freeze was started at the end of september
20100202 13:02:51< Ivanovic> AI0867: yes, but this is no reason to add new features in the currently most fragile area that is holding us back from releasing the new stable series
20100202 13:03:11< Ivanovic> since yeah, what is holding us back *IS* the new gui atm
20100202 13:03:35< mordante> not the new gui, the slow lobby ;-)
20100202 13:03:52< mordante> the gui itself is not fragile, just the lobby part
20100202 13:04:17< mordante> and the lobby is one of the more annoying windows since it has a lot of changing content
20100202 13:04:58< mordante> the other windows made before mainly have static content
20100202 13:05:06< rosso> if there is stuff to be fixed that doesnt require to be into the big picture of the whole project very much, give me a hint. 
20100202 13:05:46< fendrin> I do see the need to disable all new strings the EXPERIMENTAL code switch introduced. But I don't get what it has to do with the gui2 system under bugfixing and some stuff related to the mp lobby. No idea what you are talking about.
20100202 13:06:20< Ivanovic> fendrin: better invest your time in helping mordante and ilor fix the existing problems
20100202 13:06:28< Ivanovic> that is the main issue
20100202 13:07:15< mordante> fendrin, first that we wanted to review the code before adding it, second there might slip some content of the .cfg files in the rest of the gui which causes new glitches
20100202 13:07:31< mordante> and I don't have time to review it now?
20100202 13:08:41< fendrin> mordante: You can review it any time. Independly from if it is part of trunk or not. There is a switch for EXPERIMENTAL cfg stuff as well. If it is used there is no extra wml code in a normal build.
20100202 13:08:51< mordante> Ivanovic, when are the new year holidays in Germany? (regarding the Pandora mail of Evil Dragon)
20100202 13:09:01< Ivanovic> mordante: not germany
20100202 13:09:05< Ivanovic> new year in *china*
20100202 13:09:16< mordante> ah ok and when's that?
20100202 13:09:20< Ivanovic> since the cases are produces there
20100202 13:09:24< Ivanovic> end of next week
20100202 13:10:03< Ivanovic> starting at febuary 14th and celebrations las "a while"
20100202 13:10:22< mordante> so probably you have it at the FOSDEM next year
20100202 13:10:28< Ivanovic> i hope so
20100202 13:10:29< Ivanovic> ;)
20100202 13:10:47< ilor> I hope to be there ;)
20100202 13:10:56< mordante> me too 
20100202 13:10:58< Ivanovic> in fact i hope that i can hold my pandora in my hands before easter *this year*
20100202 13:11:18< ilor> next year I shouldn't have too many exams in the winter. hopefully none.
20100202 13:11:53< AI0867> rosso: I can't think of any. You can look on the bugtracker, but those are the ones that are fixed the fastest
20100202 13:12:14< Ivanovic> mordante: i think this post says most stuff: http://forum.gp2x.de/viewtopic.php?f=24&t=8846&p=111407#p111407
20100202 13:12:37< Ivanovic> and yeah, i should be among the first 1000 customers
20100202 13:13:31< Ivanovic> so if only 1000 cases are produced and shipped to texas (where the pandora will be assembled) before the chinese new year i should get mine sometime in march
20100202 13:13:32< rosso> AI0867: i took a look already, you know it actually needs some experience with the project to get down to the point where you find the cause for a bug by a brief description of a user
20100202 13:14:02< mordante> Ivanovic, I just read that one, you posted the link in the log ;-)
20100202 13:14:16< Ivanovic> really?
20100202 13:14:19< Ivanovic> in which logs?
20100202 13:15:02< Ivanovic> right, i was in the wrong chan when posting this...
20100202 13:15:17< Ivanovic> a clear case of "too many chans open at the same time..."
20100202 13:15:32< mordante> I expected that since you wrote it in German ;-)
20100202 13:15:43< Ivanovic> was meant for the german gp2x chan on efnet
20100202 13:16:30< mordante> but I saw gp2x in the link so thought it still might be interesting to look at it ;-)
20100202 13:16:41< Ivanovic> IMO it is
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20100202 13:19:37< CIA-62> ivanovic * r40988 /trunk/ (278 files in 24 dirs): 
20100202 13:19:37< CIA-62> pot-update (no new/changed strings, reference update only)
20100202 13:19:37< CIA-62> regenerated doc files
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20100202 13:29:40< CIA-62> fendrin * r40989 /trunk/data/gui/default/window/icon_message.cfg: Excluded the whole file from consideration by a normal Wesnoth build.
20100202 13:30:05< fendrin> mordante: ^
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20100202 13:47:32< mordante> fendrin, ok
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20100202 13:48:30< fendrin> mordante: Do you know which train station is best in brüssel? Central or midi?
20100202 13:57:03< mordante> fendrin, no not really
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20100202 14:02:17< ilor> fendrin: iirc central is closest to the hostel, if you guys are staying at the same place
20100202 14:02:28< ilor> ... as last year (2go)
20100202 14:02:47< fendrin> ilor: Thank you.
20100202 14:04:14< ilor> iirc2 the hostel is more or less between north and central stations, but you'll likely be spending time in the cetre anyway. the walk from the north station is longer :P
20100202 14:14:23< Ivanovic> central is the way to go
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20100202 15:22:39< AI0867> esr: when starting trackplacer with a relative path, saving fails to remember the original file (gtk dialog complains about a non-absolute name too), when selecting the original file, I then get a confirmation dialog that doesn't fit on my screen
20100202 15:23:19< AI0867> "You have requested saving to a file other than relative/path/here, and tha..." (right side of screen)
20100202 15:23:26< esr> Your screen must be rather small...
20100202 15:23:34< AI0867> "Really overwrite /absolute/path?"
20100202 15:23:43< AI0867> esr: 1024 wide
20100202 15:23:50< esr> Hm.
20100202 15:23:54< esr> Looking....
20100202 15:27:54< esr> Ghod.  I don't remember how any of this works anymore :-(
20100202 15:30:45< esr> This relative path: did you specify it with a command-line argument or through the "Open Tack File" dialog?
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20100202 15:48:41< AI0867> commandline argument
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20100202 16:28:32< zookeeper> what's the port number for the dev (not trunk) MP server?
20100202 16:31:14< fendrin> 14997
20100202 16:31:38< zookeeper> thanks
20100202 16:31:50< zookeeper> i tried 99 and 98 but didn't go further down :p
20100202 16:34:33< Jozrael> Am I confusing Dark_Beer_Adept (my current opponent) with someone else?
20100202 16:35:13< zookeeper> btw, i haven't been able to reproduce the dark forecast crash: http://gna.org/bugs/?15206
20100202 16:35:40< zookeeper> granted i only really tried it after applying a fix which i think wouldn't affect that.
20100202 16:42:29< AI0867> I've tested (the start of) dark forecast quite a bit to eliminate wml warnings, I found no crashes
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20100202 17:25:08< fendrin> esr: https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?15204 is now a blocker for my work. 
20100202 17:26:18< esr> fendrin: I've done some diagnostics, but I don't know how to fix it.  
20100202 17:26:44< AI0867> it's preprocessor related, maybe silene knows how that cache works?
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20100202 17:49:11< ilor> mordante: someone's made a game on the 1.7 server name with a malformed <span> tag, the engine outputs an error to the effect of
20100202 17:49:19< ilor>  error gui/layout: ttext::set_text has broken markup ...
20100202 17:49:38< ilor> problem is, it does that >20 times, and it's only this one string
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20100202 18:15:33< AI0867> wesbot: topic
20100202 18:15:35-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: string/feature freeze active! | 69 bugs, 243 feature requests, 8 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org/ | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20100202 20:12:46< mordante> servus
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20100202 20:17:56< mordante> hi ilor 
20100202 20:18:03< ilor> hi mordante
20100202 20:18:22< mordante> ilor, the error message can be annoying in the lobby but is handy to fix WML
20100202 20:18:46< ilor> mordante: okay, I was just worried that it appeared 20+ times for one string during one gamelist refresh
20100202 20:19:34< mordante> oh ok not sure why it does that and whether or not it's a bug
20100202 20:20:00< ilor> would be bad if it means the string is parsed 20 times ;)
20100202 20:20:39< mordante> it indeed would, but I think invalidate layout might cause it to be called more often as needed ;-)
20100202 20:21:02< ilor> mordante: though as I said it was 20+ during one gamelist refresh
20100202 20:21:16< ilor> it kept going with that frequency every refresh
20100202 20:21:57< mordante> hmm ok, then there might indeed be a bug
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20100202 20:41:23< Ivanovic> waste of resources!
20100202 20:41:25< Ivanovic> re, btw
20100202 20:42:25< mordante> not a waste Wesnoth just needs it ;-)
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20100202 20:47:07< YogiHH> hello
20100202 20:47:44< Jozrael> Why hello thar
20100202 20:48:17< mordante> hi YogiHH 
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20100202 20:57:27< Ivanovic> YogiHH: everything planned for friday?
20100202 20:57:45< Ivanovic> that is: do you already have an idea when you will arrive in brussels?
20100202 21:00:35< YogiHH> Ivanovic: My Ticket says 11:45 at Brussels Airport on friday :)
20100202 21:00:48< Ivanovic> cool
20100202 21:00:51< YogiHH> i hope it will be right :P
20100202 21:01:10< Ivanovic> so you will basically be one of the first to arrive
20100202 21:01:15< YogiHH> i was glad to get home at all from Bremen today :/
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20100202 21:01:26< Ivanovic> this bad in the north?
20100202 21:01:32< Ivanovic> over here there is just rain, lots of it
20100202 21:01:50< YogiHH> yes, lots of more snow, and the streets are full of ice/snow mix
20100202 21:02:10< Ivanovic> here the streets were already free from basically everything in the morning
20100202 21:02:31< Ivanovic> since temperatures were above zero the snow coming down directly became water when hitting the streets
20100202 21:02:36< Ivanovic> by now it is rain instead of snow
20100202 21:03:07< YogiHH> buses either don't drive or have to skip stops that are in the middle of a hill
20100202 21:03:25< Ivanovic> in general i assume that there won't be a problem with your flight
20100202 21:03:36< Ivanovic> temps are meant to rise a little and in brussels they are well above zero, too
20100202 21:03:49< YogiHH> yeah, i hope so
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20100202 21:08:45< mordante> I hope the temperature in Brussels is not above zero like here this morning... ice on the road together with rain makes it really slippery
20100202 21:10:00< Ivanovic> mordante: temps between 5 and 10° should be fine
20100202 21:10:01< Ivanovic> ;)
20100202 21:10:28< mordante> should yes...
20100202 21:11:04< mordante> but the weather forecasts here seem to change their minds a lot about what to expect with the weather
20100202 21:11:45< Jozrael> Welcome to earth
20100202 21:11:47< Jozrael> <3
20100202 21:11:53 * Ivanovic is looking forward to the weekend of greek food
20100202 21:11:55< Ivanovic> ;)
20100202 21:12:00 * mordante too
20100202 21:12:34< CIA-62> mcshark * r40990 /trunk/projectfiles/ (CodeBlocks/wesnoth.cbp CodeBlocks-SCons/wesnoth.cbp): Update according to recent file changes: added src/gui/dialogs/icon_message.cpp+hpp
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20100202 22:50:49< mordante> since GSoC 2010 will take place and I assume we want to (try to) participate again, maybe we can try to find some easy coding tasks at the FOSDEM
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20100202 22:58:01< mordante> I'm off night
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--- Log closed Wed Feb 03 00:00:47 2010