--- Log opened Wed Mar 31 00:00:25 2010
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20100331 00:02:48< PeterPorty> So....you are not very chatty are you?
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20100331 00:04:17< PeterPorty> OMG! Shadow Master is here!
20100331 00:04:33< Blarumyrran> zomg
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20100331 00:05:03< PeterPorty> AND Blarumyrran!
20100331 00:05:15< Blarumyrran> AND PeterPorty!
20100331 00:05:32< PeterPorty> yay!
20100331 00:05:42< PeterPorty> but no, i was mentioning known people
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20100331 00:06:43< PeterPorty> why's shadowmasters name in gray? is it cuz hes afk?
20100331 00:07:47< Soliton> he's in the shadow.
20100331 00:07:55< PeterPorty> Rawr...
20100331 00:08:08< Blarumyrran> Soliton, that makes sense only with white-text-on-black
20100331 00:09:11< PeterPorty> Hee-Haw!
20100331 00:09:31< noy> Blarumyrran: heh, thanks
20100331 00:09:40< Blarumyrran> you're welcome
20100331 00:09:41< noy> I appreciate it... but it can't fit as a background
20100331 00:09:42< Soliton> i'm glad you can find sense in it at all.
20100331 00:10:24< PeterPorty> OMG! Noy's here too...awesome
20100331 00:10:44< Blarumyrran> right, the size is a bit silly, just a few pixels larger than 1028...
20100331 00:12:44< PeterPorty> so...can someone teach me to register my sexy account
20100331 00:12:49< PeterPorty> ?
20100331 00:12:52< PeterPorty> plz?
20100331 00:13:31< PeterPorty> ok.... ill take that as a no...
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20100331 00:35:38< PeterPorty> Soo.....not very chatty in here right?
20100331 00:36:02< Tomsik> yep
20100331 00:36:10< PeterPorty> why r there 62 people here and nobody talking?
20100331 00:38:34< Tomsik> because they have better things to do
20100331 00:38:39< Tomsik> or maybe nothing to talk about
20100331 00:39:57< PeterPorty> ok... if they have better things to do... why r they here?
20100331 00:40:46< PeterPorty> and if you need something to talk about i will give you something
20100331 00:41:52< PeterPorty> is this off topic or wesnoth only? is this moderated?
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20100331 00:44:41< PeterPorty> ok, its off topic... whats ur favourite movie guys?
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20100331 00:45:16< PeterPorty> Mine is "Big Fish" by Tim Burton
20100331 00:46:19< PeterPorty> : (
20100331 00:46:25< PeterPorty> :´(
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20100331 01:04:46< PeterPorty> bbl guys, dinner time
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20100331 02:32:02< Gambit> <3
20100331 02:32:06< Gambit> Someone bumped the coding thread
20100331 02:32:16< Gambit> and they did it in such a way I got to continue the double entendre joke.
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20100331 02:35:49< corroded> anyone on?
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20100331 02:36:06< Jarkko> Somewhat...
20100331 02:36:46< corroded> can i ask a question? :P im not sure if i found a bug so i was hoping to ask here before i post it in the forums
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20100331 02:37:58< corroded> is there a level cap in the heir to the throne campaign?
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20100331 02:40:37< Jarkko> Shouldn't be. If I've understood correctly, after maximum level a character should still level up... but the problem is, that I've never gotten any unit to the max to see it myself :/
20100331 02:41:45< corroded> hmm thats weird, i have a level 3 sharpshooter with 147/150 exp, and a troll attacked it thereby making it 'level up', but when i checked, it was still level 3, and the exp was back to 1/180. is that a bug?
20100331 02:42:24< Appleman1234> corroded, that is called amla 
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20100331 02:42:38< Appleman1234> or after maximum level advancement 
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20100331 02:43:05< Appleman1234> corroded, the unit gains some hp and the exp requirement is increased
20100331 02:43:06< corroded> hmm so im stuck with having a level 3 sharpshooter?
20100331 02:43:12< corroded> ohhh
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20100331 02:43:37< corroded> but shouldnt it be just a level 4 sharpshooter then?
20100331 02:43:44< corroded> instead of forever being level 3 with high hp?
20100331 02:43:59< Gambit> Well if it isn't a bug we'll all laugh ;)
20100331 02:44:10< Gambit> whoa nvm scrolling issues...
20100331 02:44:14< ancestral> Well… you could download my mod you can go to 5th level for any unit :-P
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20100331 02:44:50< corroded> oh sorry i just started playing so i dont really know the max level per unit lol. so level 3 is common as a max?
20100331 02:45:03< Jarkko> It varies.
20100331 02:45:24< ancestral> http://units.wesnoth.org/
20100331 02:45:34< corroded> ah i was just looking for that link. thanks man
20100331 02:45:38< corroded> ill go check it out now
20100331 02:45:38< ancestral> :)
20100331 02:45:42< Gambit> You can also check the manual
20100331 02:46:00< Gambit> But it only shows you stats for units you have seen.
20100331 02:46:11< Gambit> they changed it to a pokedex some versions ago :\
20100331 02:47:00< Jarkko> All, that is required, is, that the game reads it to you... Then it's - umm - UnitDex?
20100331 02:47:23< corroded> yeah i was just checking that before i went here, but it didnt say anything if a sharpshooter levels up to something
20100331 02:48:00< Gambit> Yeah it only mentions upgrades if upgrades exist.
20100331 02:49:18< ancestral> corroded: Perhaps, being a new[er] user…
20100331 02:49:19< corroded> ah there you go..so most units go up to level 3 only. so thats why lol
20100331 02:49:25< ancestral> http://mproud.com/wesnoth/bestiary/elvish_marksman.html
20100331 02:49:40< ancestral> (A little pet project I'm working on, mostly unfinished)
20100331 02:49:56< Jarkko> Oh... This advertigo makes me feel dizzy. :P
20100331 02:50:52< Jarkko> ancestral: Okay, it was worth it :O
20100331 02:51:47< ancestral> :)
20100331 02:51:58< corroded> ancestral: thanks for the link! ill try to use the unit guide as a pokedex lol
20100331 02:52:22< corroded> i reallly just didnt realize that they just go up to level 3. i thought they had new unit names up to level 10 lulz 
20100331 02:52:29< corroded> silly noob
20100331 02:52:36< ancestral> In Ascension, all units go up to 5
20100331 02:52:56< Jarkko> Heh... in Morrowind to 100... <_<;
20100331 02:54:52< ancestral> So the Sharpshooter → Bowmaster → Sniper
20100331 02:55:36< VurtualRuler98> There aren't any units with an attack that specificly boosts their defense when using it?
20100331 02:55:40< VurtualRuler98> Like, one attack alone.
20100331 02:55:52< ancestral> Actually
20100331 02:56:40< corroded> anyways, time to play again thanks for all the help!
20100331 02:57:00< ancestral> Maybe that's in a few of the survival mods where you can buy that ability
20100331 02:57:13< Gambit> In the Spinal Tap addon
20100331 02:57:16< Gambit> all units go to 11
20100331 02:57:19< Jarkko> corroded: No problem :)
20100331 02:57:25< ancestral> Yay you caught the reference!
20100331 02:57:46< Gambit> VurtualRuler98: Yes.
20100331 02:57:57< VurtualRuler98> Which one?
20100331 02:58:04< Gambit> VurtualRuler98: or rather there can easily be one :\
20100331 02:58:16< Gambit> Weapon specials can be activated only on offense/defense
20100331 02:58:39< VurtualRuler98> I was imagining a spartan unit.
20100331 02:58:43 * Gambit grumbles about how he thought the spinal tap joke was hilarious :(
20100331 02:59:00< VurtualRuler98> Who had a spear, which added 10% defense(max 70%) when in use, or a more powerful sword attack.
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20100331 03:22:24< Gambit> Rofl some guy on kz2 was just like "Hi, I am the boss, and welcome to my house of pain." Just after incapacitating him, but just before pistoling him execution style I said "Hi, I'm Norm Abrams. Welcome to the New Yankee Workshop."
20100331 03:22:35< Gambit> He started to say something but then I shut him up.
20100331 03:23:24< Jarkko> Okay.
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20100331 04:39:28< King_Elendil> hello
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20100331 05:12:29< King_Elendil> hello
20100331 05:15:03< shadowmaster> you already said hello
20100331 05:15:16< shadowmaster> you don't want to be be flooded by 56 instant replies, do you?
20100331 05:20:53< King_Elendil> sry :(. I was saying it to Zarel, but I guess he didn;t notice
20100331 05:22:20< shadowmaster> or he doesn't care
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20100331 05:25:55< King_Elendil> which is probably the truth, lol. I guess most people don't pay much attention to a squirt like me
20100331 05:26:40< King_Elendil> ancestral, I posted another pic on your bestiary thread
20100331 05:29:38< ancestral> Yeah
20100331 05:29:49< ancestral> To be honest, I'm not a fan of the male/female designations
20100331 05:30:04< ancestral> I think that's fine but I want to just stay consistent with all the pages
20100331 05:32:23< King_Elendil> ok, it was just an idea
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20100331 05:38:01< ancestral> And that's great :)
20100331 05:38:16< ancestral> There'll be plenty of time for refinements and updates
20100331 05:38:21< King_Elendil> It still looks woderful!
20100331 05:38:26< ancestral> Thanks!
20100331 05:38:35< King_Elendil> you do good work
20100331 05:39:28< ancestral> I probably need someone else to help me
20100331 05:39:34< ancestral> The more I think about it
20100331 05:39:56< ancestral> At least in the way of storing and pulling data
20100331 05:40:02< King_Elendil> what would someone need to know in order to help you?
20100331 05:40:09< ancestral> Or perhaps I just need to bounce ideas
20100331 05:40:10< ancestral> Well
20100331 05:40:24< ancestral> Firstly I'm not sure how the unit tree fits in
20100331 05:40:36< ancestral> Clearly it's needed and I have no idea what it would look like
20100331 05:40:56< ancestral> Of course I'm talking about this: ( http://units.wesnoth.org/trunk/C/mainline.html )
20100331 05:41:45< King_Elendil> hmm.
20100331 05:42:43< ancestral> So actually, if you're interested, I'd be curious on how it should look
20100331 05:42:58< ancestral> Make a visual prototype
20100331 05:43:29< King_Elendil> I guess I might try to do this
20100331 05:43:41< ancestral> But then I figure I'll pull data into the page through JavaScript — that part's not hard
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20100331 05:44:08< ancestral> However, what kind of format would be best to store it in so as to parse through in say jQuery
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20100331 05:44:20< ancestral> Should I save it all in one file, multiple files, or a database?
20100331 05:44:27< ancestral> (the raw data)
20100331 05:45:19< King_Elendil> you lost me there, I have no experience coding out side of some limited WML :(
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20100331 05:46:08< ancestral> I should probably listen to Zarel if he has advice as he seems to have much more experience using jQuery and such
20100331 05:46:59< King_Elendil> right. I still might be able to do a visual thing, but not much beyond that, sorry
20100331 05:48:16< ancestral> That's fine, wasn't expecting you to :)
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20100331 06:09:35< King_Elendil> I'm working on the visual now ancestral :)
20100331 06:09:52< King_Elendil> Do you want any stats on there?
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20100331 06:11:34< ancestral> The unit tree might not even need to show all the stats that is currently does 
20100331 06:11:41< ancestral> Wow you read my miond
20100331 06:11:42< ancestral> *mind
20100331 06:11:56< ancestral> My theory is that the two sections could integrate much more easily
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20100331 06:12:07< ancestral> In fact it could essentially be the same page… sort of
20100331 06:12:20< ancestral> Page on top of a page or what have you
20100331 06:12:47< ancestral> I'm really not sure
20100331 06:13:33< King_Elendil> Hey, I just had an idea. (uh-oh :p ) maybe we could have separate pages for the different genders? would that be too hard?
20100331 06:14:20< ancestral> No, but what's the point?
20100331 06:14:42< King_Elendil> well, let me show you when I'm done...
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20100331 06:15:24< ancestral> Absolutely
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20100331 06:36:08< King_Elendil> Just sent you a PM ancestral
20100331 06:37:42< Zarel> What's also ridiculous
20100331 06:37:57< King_Elendil> is?
20100331 06:38:05< Zarel> is that apparently even the iPhone version of Wesnoth has more reviews than the desktop version.
20100331 06:38:10< Zarel> Just because it's a commercial game.
20100331 06:38:32< King_Elendil> why does it cost money? will it always?
20100331 06:42:49< Zarel> It costs money because it can.
20100331 06:42:52< Zarel> Pretty much.
20100331 06:43:03< King_Elendil> that stinks :(
20100331 06:43:36< Zarel> What bothers me more is that Kyle Poole is getting a disproportionate amount from it.
20100331 06:43:59< Zarel> I mean, that's what always happens - tons of people make money from OSS, but it's rarely the contributors.
20100331 06:44:00< King_Elendil> oh, well, it doesn't really bother me-since i don't have an iPhone/iPod
20100331 06:44:10< Zarel> I'm not sure why it bothers me more than the others.
20100331 06:45:25< King_Elendil> I just think that wesnoth should be free, on ALL systems. But that is my humble opinion 
20100331 06:47:18< Zarel> We _could_ release it for free on the iPhone.
20100331 06:47:22< ancestral> me nods
20100331 06:47:31< ancestral> I rose these concerns before…
20100331 06:47:53< King_Elendil> did you see it yet ancestral?
20100331 06:48:20< ancestral> kind of in the middle of a few things, hopefully in a bit
20100331 06:48:33 * King_Elendil begins to edit a new idea
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20100331 06:52:20< noy> well wesnoth makes money from it
20100331 06:52:33< noy> and we use that to assist development
20100331 06:53:44< Zarel> True, but it's disproportionate, and most contributors don't see any of it.
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20100331 06:54:03< noy> Most contributors aren't bothered by it
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20100331 06:54:20< noy> I didn't come to the game with the intention to make money
20100331 06:54:51< noy> No one else did
20100331 06:55:28< noy> Without Kyle
20100331 06:55:35< noy> it probably wouldn't have happen either
20100331 07:01:14< ancestral> noy: True
20100331 07:06:34-!- crimson_penguin [~ben@wesnoth/developer/crimsonpenguin] has joined #wesnoth
20100331 07:13:01< Zarel> Yeah. I don't _really_ mind it, but it still seems unfair to me.
20100331 07:13:21< Zarel> I mean, if I _really_ hated it, I'd just go and redistribute it for free.
20100331 07:13:40< Zarel> Does anyone think I should?
20100331 07:21:32< ancestral> On the App store?
20100331 07:22:22< noy> I personally don't
20100331 07:22:28< noy> what benefit will that have?
20100331 07:22:37< noy> are you going to teach him a lesson?
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20100331 07:22:42< ancestral> Would seem like kind of a dick move. You'd have to change the name, etc. At least talk to Kyle first.
20100331 07:23:15< ancestral> Don't start a war or anything :)
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20100331 07:28:36< ancestral> Actually, I wish Wesnoth got a little more exposure as an application on computer platforms
20100331 07:29:21< ancestral> I tried sending insidemacgames.com an email encouraging them to review it when 1.6 came out, but all their links were b0rked and stuff
20100331 07:29:36< ancestral> So screw them I guess
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20100331 07:43:23< Zarel> ancestral: Well, technically, Wesnoth isn't trademarked, so I don't have to change the name. :P
20100331 07:43:37< ancestral> This is true
20100331 07:43:57< ancestral> Though the app store would probably say there's already an app by this name
20100331 07:43:59< Zarel> And even if it was, I belive I could get away with it.
20100331 07:44:07< Zarel> Yeah, that'd probably be the bigger issue. :P
20100331 07:44:11< ancestral> You could maybe call it Freenoth
20100331 07:44:12< ancestral> Or 
20100331 07:44:17< ancestral> Wesnoth Free?
20100331 07:44:18< Zarel> Or just "Wesnoth"
20100331 07:44:28< ancestral> Instead of The Battle for Wesnoth
20100331 07:44:31< ancestral> Maybe actually
20100331 07:44:40< Zarel|> Yeah.
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20100331 07:44:45< ancestral> However you are probably best to distinguish it somehow
20100331 07:44:47< Zarel|> "Wesnoth" instead of "Battle for Wesnoth"
20100331 07:44:51< ancestral> Otherwise you're doing people a disservice
20100331 07:45:01< Zarel_> Yeah, "Wesnoth Free" would probably be enough.
20100331 07:45:04< ancestral> Going to Kyle for tech support when they download your game, or vice versa
20100331 07:45:17< Zarel_> Oh, people will do that anyway. :P
20100331 07:45:32< Zarel_> And vice versa. Fact of life, users are stupid about that kind of stuff.
20100331 07:45:46< ancestral> I have absolutely no issue you doing that, and Kyle understands someone could do that, but if you want to be a gentleman about it, you might send him a message about it
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20100331 07:46:12< ancestral> If anything, he's going to reap immediate benjamins off the iPad version anyway
20100331 07:46:14< ancestral> :-P
20100331 07:46:25< Zarel> I mean, Warzone Forums get so many support topics about Warzone Portable, which we know nothing about.
20100331 07:46:34< Zarel> Anyway, it's really a hypothetical.
20100331 07:47:19< Zarel> I've been considering it, but unless someone gives me a good reason, I don't think I'd do it.
20100331 07:47:37< Zarel> I mean, "dick move" is probably a good way to describe it.
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20100331 07:48:09< ancestral> Are you a reg'd developer?
20100331 07:48:16< ancestral> (Paid your $99 dues?)
20100331 07:48:42< Zarel> No, but I can be.
20100331 07:49:21-!- Jarkko [~JMP@gprs-prointernet-ffb0c200-91.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #wesnoth
20100331 07:50:30< ancestral> Do you have plans to develop non-Wesnoth games?
20100331 07:50:49< Zarel> I might.
20100331 07:50:54< Zarel> I'm considering porting Warzone over.
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20100331 07:52:23< ancestral> k
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20100331 08:24:34< ancestral> Hey Zarel, are you pretty familiar with jQuery and web data storage/retrieval?
20100331 08:31:37< Zarel> mhm
20100331 08:31:40< Zarel> Wait
20100331 08:31:50< Zarel> Are we talking HTML5 data stores, or cookies, or server-side?
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20100331 08:33:59< ancestral> Well
20100331 08:34:19< ancestral> I'm wondering if all I need are some flat files
20100331 08:34:41< ancestral> KISS
20100331 08:35:24< ancestral> The way I see this working is that the user will be in a unit description page and clicks on another unit
20100331 08:35:29< ancestral> to see its description
20100331 08:36:08< ancestral> The page looks up the info and changes all the appropriate fields on the page
20100331 08:37:18< ancestral> All of the info would be stored on the server side
20100331 08:38:51< ancestral> Data like: Elvish Fighter,level=1, hp=33, etc.
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20100331 08:57:42< Zarel> ?
20100331 08:57:52< Zarel> Well.
20100331 08:57:57< Zarel> Yes, all you need are flat files...
20100331 09:00:37< ancestral> Sure
20100331 09:01:40< ancestral> Parsing through a file, any conventions in jQuery with formatting in a certain way that is better or worse?
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20100331 09:09:34< pokhbocee> guys how can i compile and install a subdirectory of the project
20100331 09:09:36-!- KnThrak [~KnThrak@ip-109-90-46-121.unitymediagroup.de] has joined #wesnoth
20100331 09:10:11< pokhbocee> im trying to test some functions. but to do that i have to compile and install whole project
20100331 09:10:16< pokhbocee> which takes a lot of time
20100331 09:10:29< pokhbocee> can i just compile and install the files that i have modified?
20100331 09:10:59-!- Lancaster [~Miranda@123.119.83.49] has quit [Quit: Lancaster]
20100331 09:11:36< pokhbocee> ancestral: can you help me about this?
20100331 09:14:47-!- crimson_penguin [~ben@wesnoth/developer/crimsonpenguin] has quit [Quit: crimson_penguin]
20100331 09:15:04< pokhbocee> anybody??
20100331 09:15:34< ancestral> One sec
20100331 09:15:41< pokhbocee> ok ty
20100331 09:16:53< ancestral> What platform?
20100331 09:17:16< pokhbocee> unix
20100331 09:19:04< ancestral> Hmmm
20100331 09:19:14< pokhbocee> am i clear about my problem?
20100331 09:19:16< ancestral> I don't know much with the compilation through UNIX
20100331 09:19:31< pokhbocee> i just tried to compile but it doesnt apply changes
20100331 09:19:33< ancestral> But basically you have to recompile everything as I understand it
20100331 09:19:44< pokhbocee> and installed
20100331 09:20:02< pokhbocee> compilation is short but installation is really really long
20100331 09:20:10< pokhbocee> actually if you know other platforms
20100331 09:20:17< Zarel> ancestral: JSON
20100331 09:20:25< pokhbocee> i have them too 
20100331 09:20:35< pokhbocee> in which one can we solve this issue?
20100331 09:20:37< ancestral> Good place to look if I'm a newbie to JSON?
20100331 09:22:11< pokhbocee> Zarel: do you know how to compile-install only a subdirectory or a file of the project?
20100331 09:22:13< Zarel> ancestral: Basically, store them in JavaScript.
20100331 09:22:25< Zarel> pokhbocee: ...what are you trying to compile-install?
20100331 09:23:30< pokhbocee> i have changes 2-3 files in data/ai directory
20100331 09:23:45< pokhbocee> and i just want to compile-install those files or the directory
20100331 09:24:04< pokhbocee> do you want me to give the names for the files??
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20100331 09:32:04< ancestral> Zarel: Okay, I think there's basically no right answer
20100331 09:32:11-!- kcaze [~herman@219.237.205.155] has joined #wesnoth
20100331 09:32:18< ancestral> So… I'll have to experiment
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20100331 09:35:27< Zarel> pokhbocee: No, I don't know.
20100331 09:42:02< pokhbocee> thank you anyway guys
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20100331 09:50:56< Worksphair> anyone familiar with http://wiki.wesnoth.org/GSoC-SpriteSheets_Gabba ?
20100331 09:52:16-!- rocket16 [~rocket16@115.117.233.62] has joined #wesnoth
20100331 09:52:22< rocket16> Hello all,
20100331 09:52:34< rocket16> !wesnoth
20100331 09:52:49< rocket16> Oh! Hi Sevis!
20100331 09:52:57< rocket16> Sevis? Are you here?
20100331 09:53:38< rocket16> ANYBODY HERE?
20100331 09:54:04< rocket16> Ah, silent as usual~
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20100331 10:07:35< Unnheulu|Laptop> hai"
20100331 10:07:38< Unnheulu|Laptop> hai!
20100331 10:07:49< Unnheulu|Laptop> My younger brother pulled me out of bed :/
20100331 10:08:15< sevis> Hullo, Unnheulu
20100331 10:09:03< phlaem> well, it's 10 am? :)
20100331 10:10:35< Unnheulu|Laptop> haia
20100331 10:10:39< Unnheulu|Laptop> 9am :P
20100331 10:10:47-!- timotei21 [~timotei21@188.24.5.152] has joined #wesnoth
20100331 10:10:55< Unnheulu|Laptop> And he knows how tired I get^^
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20100331 10:32:39< Unnheulu|Laptop> aargh I never want to look at another gtk comboBox again -.-
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20100331 10:38:50< Unnheulu|Laptop> *after getting breakfast, Unnheulu decides its round two of wrestling with glaed&gtk
20100331 10:38:54< Unnheulu|Laptop> *glade
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20100331 10:55:03< Unnheulu|Laptop> uurgh, that didn't work^^
20100331 10:59:56< Unnheulu|Laptop> yay, I got it working, now for cheap hack time
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20100331 11:12:35< Ivanovic> moin
20100331 11:13:11< Unnheulu|Laptop> boreda
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20100331 12:25:15< Unnheulu> *return to laptop*
20100331 12:25:17< Unnheulu> bbiab
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20100331 12:33:54< zenhoobb-it> hai
20100331 12:35:05< Unnheulu|Laptop> hai#
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20100331 13:17:45< Unnheulu|Laptop> elias, you doing pyweek this time round?
20100331 13:18:00< elias> no time ;;
20100331 13:19:42< Unnheulu|Laptop> kay
20100331 13:19:51< Unnheulu|Laptop> when's ludumdare?
20100331 13:19:57 * Unnheulu|Laptop doesn't wanna miss it this time
20100331 13:22:29< Blarumyrran> The date is up on the site
20100331 13:26:09< Unnheulu|Laptop> is it?
20100331 13:26:14< Unnheulu|Laptop> kay
20100331 13:26:52< Unnheulu|Laptop> ah
20100331 13:26:57< Unnheulu|Laptop> its today...:/
20100331 13:27:02< Unnheulu|Laptop> oh
20100331 13:27:06< Blarumyrran> What.
20100331 13:27:17< Unnheulu|Laptop> I misread the site^^
20100331 13:27:23< Unnheulu|Laptop> never liked the frontpage
20100331 13:27:36< Blarumyrran> Yeah, the site is terribly designed; I never find anything there
20100331 13:30:02< Unnheulu|Laptop> Wait, you take part?
20100331 13:30:16< Blarumyrran> No, I just like looking :)
20100331 13:30:24< Unnheulu|Laptop> ah :P
20100331 13:30:35< Blarumyrran> I almost would've last time, if the timing had differed by a day
20100331 13:30:38< Unnheulu|Laptop> didn't recall you taking part, but I've only taken part 3 times
20100331 13:30:41< Blarumyrran> a week*
20100331 13:30:46< Unnheulu|Laptop> aww :(
20100331 13:35:16< Unnheulu|Laptop> anyways, can't talk, too busy wrestling with gtk
20100331 13:37:10< shadowmaster> openSUSE 11.2 feels incredily fast on a VM despite I allocated less than 400 MB.
20100331 13:37:14< shadowmaster> *incredibly
20100331 13:37:55< Blarumyrran> Strange; last I tried, windows 2000 was far faster than opensuse
20100331 13:38:03< shadowmaster> I guess it's proof that SSDs are the way to og
20100331 13:38:05< shadowmaster> *go
20100331 13:38:23 * Unnheulu|Laptop has only run haiku in VM which was pretty awkward
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20100331 13:44:06< Unnheulu|Laptop> shadowmaster, can wesnoth-tc only export the image to a file?
20100331 13:44:15< shadowmaster> yes
20100331 13:44:20< Unnheulu|Laptop> ok
20100331 13:45:04< shadowmaster> I could probably add an option in git master to spit the output to stdout.
20100331 13:45:10< Unnheulu|Laptop> ok
20100331 13:45:23< Unnheulu|Laptop> or I could  add a save option
20100331 13:45:25< shadowmaster> it all depends on what you people want, really.
20100331 13:45:40< Unnheulu|Laptop> maybe I could just have it save, and delete on program close
20100331 13:45:41< Blarumyrran> what, as a byte stream?
20100331 13:46:03< shadowmaster> even with the file output, you could tell wesnoth-tc to write them to temporary files that (in Unix at least) are immediately unlinked after your frontend opens them
20100331 13:46:47< shadowmaster> that way those files would automatically disappear even if your fronted receives SIGKILL
20100331 13:46:51< shadowmaster> *frontend
20100331 13:47:43< shadowmaster> I know that qemu uses this technique to work with disk images in -snapshot mode
20100331 13:49:02< Unnheulu|Laptop> the advantage of using gtk though, is it runs in OS's other than Linux (although it is possible to find out the users OS on load-up)
20100331 13:50:10< sevis> Hm, didn't KDE/Qt have a Windows port, too?
20100331 13:50:24 * Unnheulu|Laptop shrugs
20100331 13:50:39< Unnheulu|Laptop> I'm just using gtk cause thats what I know+I can use glade :P
20100331 13:51:02< shadowmaster> sevis: nowadays, I think there are experimental KDE SC 4.x ports for Windows
20100331 13:51:12< shadowmaster> since Qt 4's Windows version is currently free
20100331 13:51:22< Blarumyrran> Is wesnoth-tc that programs that can display sprite animations or something?
20100331 13:51:28< Blarumyrran> -s*
20100331 13:51:30< shadowmaster> Blarumyrran: no, that's Anima
20100331 13:51:42< sevis> Hm, I should try that if I get a Windows machine to play with.
20100331 13:51:52< Blarumyrran> What's wesnoth-tc then
20100331 13:51:56< shadowmaster> I am trying to learn to use Qt 4 to build a frontend for wesnoth-tc too, but my time's just so limited
20100331 13:52:06< shadowmaster> Blarumyrran: http://shadowm.rewound.net/projects/wesnoth-tc.php
20100331 13:52:54< Blarumyrran> Is there a reason to have animations and tc previews separately?
20100331 13:53:04< shadowmaster> yes.
20100331 13:53:15< shadowmaster> wesnoth-tc was there first, Anima came later and I have got nothing to do with it.
20100331 13:53:58< Unnheulu|Laptop> and as jetryl explains in this thread http://wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=22859
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20100331 13:54:23< Unnheulu|Laptop> aargh need to get my battery pack bb
20100331 13:54:45< shadowmaster> battery
20100331 13:55:24< Unnheulu|Laptop> humm, did I spell it wrong? :P
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20100331 14:04:24< Unnheulu|Laptop> shadowmaster, would you rather clutter or cairo, or do you have no real preference?
20100331 14:08:35< Unnheulu|Laptop> meh I'll use cairo
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20100331 14:15:54< shadowmaster> Unnheulu|Laptop: no, it's just that this laptop's battery ran out at that mment
20100331 14:15:56< shadowmaster> moment
20100331 14:16:03< Unnheulu|Laptop> ah :P
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20100331 14:16:09< shadowmaster> and I have no real preference since I've got no idea about either library
20100331 14:16:17< Unnheulu|Laptop> kay
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20100331 14:30:23< Unnheulu|Laptop> shadowmaster, (I know this is replying to over a month ago), but, in the technical support thread you mention it didn't work with all versions of SDL/platforms, is it not possible to check those before running the code?
20100331 14:31:42< shadowmaster> what thread? what is "it"?
20100331 14:32:25< Unnheulu|Laptop> umm, brb
20100331 14:32:38< Unnheulu|Laptop> http://wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=28962
20100331 14:32:59< shadowmaster> I have no idea.
20100331 14:33:13< shadowmaster> it wasn't me who reverted the commit; it was the original author (silene IIRC)
20100331 14:33:18< Unnheulu|Laptop> oh ok
20100331 14:33:39< shadowmaster> also, re what Gerion said: we have no business with the sound systems :P
20100331 14:33:52< Unnheulu|Laptop> ;)
20100331 14:34:12< Unnheulu|Laptop> but, surely just the sounds alone won't make that much of a difference?
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20100331 14:35:38< shadowmaster> consider that PulseAudio is not a kernel-based sound system. It is a big f***ing abstraction layer that requires the kernel's sound services on Linux
20100331 14:36:16< shadowmaster> that means that it's not surprising that a bug in it can keep the actual kernel services idle, PulseAudio busy, and the clients waiting
20100331 14:37:02< puer> yea i always had problems with pulse audio, it was never the alsa
20100331 14:37:40< puer> i also dont much care for them ditching pidgin for that telepathy client that has no features at the moment
20100331 14:47:03< Unnheulu|Laptop> shadowmaster, I've got a pic of the initial interface in the thread, and I'm now hooking up the signals and stuff (got the colour picker done cause thats kinda easy) ;P
20100331 14:48:32< shadowmaster> Unnheulu|Laptop: may I suggest that you don't post anything until you've got sources?
20100331 14:48:43< shadowmaster> sources that work, anyway (also, it's "original", not "origional")
20100331 14:48:44< Unnheulu|Laptop> sure
20100331 14:48:54< Unnheulu|Laptop> ok
20100331 14:49:17< Unnheulu|Laptop> deleted the post :P
20100331 14:49:57< shadowmaster> also, while crimson_penguin did make a Mac OS X applet, it used version 1.0a which doesn't work on PowerPC and other big-endian CPUs
20100331 14:50:14< shadowmaster> and I don't know if I'll get him to update it for 1.5.0
20100331 14:51:12< Unnheulu|Laptop> ok, but, I have no idea if GTK will work on a mac and have no way of testing
20100331 14:51:42< shadowmaster> it probably would.
20100331 14:52:02< Unnheulu|Laptop> ok, but, like I said, I can't test
20100331 14:52:14< Blarumyrran> If you're so driven by compatibility, why do you do things in c++ anyway
20100331 14:52:36< shadowmaster> aren't you using PyGTK?
20100331 14:52:40< Unnheulu|Laptop> yeh
20100331 14:52:46< shadowmaster> well, that's not C++ :p
20100331 14:52:59< Blarumyrran> oh.
20100331 14:53:00< Unnheulu|Laptop> Obviously ;)
20100331 14:53:06< Blarumyrran> Why obviously?
20100331 14:53:12< Unnheulu|Laptop> Py=python :P
20100331 14:53:38< Blarumyrran> Yeah, you didn't say that before though :P
20100331 14:53:43< shadowmaster> yes, Python people have this weird habit of putting "Py" or "Python" in their application names somehow
20100331 14:53:44< Unnheulu|Laptop> and is used before most python libraries (pyopengl, pyglet, pygame, pygtk etc.)
20100331 14:53:54< shadowmaster> Blarumyrran: you probably missed yesterday's conversation
20100331 14:54:01< Blarumyrran> maybe
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20100331 14:55:30< puer> nothing wrong with python. i think its a great intro language, especially cross platform and can be run from a browser or compiled into binary
20100331 14:55:37< Blarumyrran> doesn't python have its own platform-independent drawing stuff like java has swing?
20100331 14:55:55< shadowmaster> and that's relevant how?
20100331 14:56:12< Unnheulu|Laptop> I think most of pythons libraries are wrappers around C++ ones
20100331 14:56:14< shadowmaster> we want a natural GUI, not a plain graphics engine
20100331 14:56:26< Unnheulu|Laptop> puer, it can be run from a web browser?
20100331 14:56:27< Blarumyrran> shadowmaster, uh so you wouldn't have to worry about if it runs on mac
20100331 14:56:38< shadowmaster> Blarumyrran: and that's where PyGTK comes into play
20100331 14:56:40< Unnheulu|Laptop> I know it can be used like PHP, but not as an applet :P
20100331 14:56:49< puer> Unnheulu|Laptop: yes, with proper plugins.
20100331 14:57:22< Unnheulu|Laptop> I knew of one some people started work on, but, I thought it was abandoned soon after
20100331 14:57:24< shadowmaster> unlike Tcl, Python doesn't have a dedicated toolkit AFAIK
20100331 14:57:49< puer> i use the widget toolkit for python
20100331 14:57:56< shadowmaster> but Tcl's toolkit (Tk) looks like crap on X11 platforms :x
20100331 14:58:09< shadowmaster> s/crap/taken from X's stone age/
20100331 15:00:08< puer> http://www.wxwindows.org/ this is what i use for python gui
20100331 15:00:30< Unnheulu|Laptop> wx?
20100331 15:01:09< Unnheulu|Laptop> The nice thing about pygtk/gtk is you've got glade which simplifies the gui making
20100331 15:01:18< Unnheulu|Laptop> although connecting the signals isn't working :/
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20100331 15:02:08< puer> i think wx is simple. im not a programmer, so if its simple to me, im sure its easy.
20100331 15:02:41< Unnheulu|Laptop> meh
20100331 15:02:43< Unnheulu|Laptop> :P
20100331 15:02:47< puer> hehe
20100331 15:03:15< puer> its crossplatform toolkit though and supports alot of language
20100331 15:03:27< puer> also tries to use native api for whatever OS
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20100331 15:04:50< puer> im behind the curve though. i mostly use freepascal (aka delphi/kylix aka object pascal)
20100331 15:05:03< shadowmaster> ew, pascal
20100331 15:05:06< puer> :P
20100331 15:05:10< shadowmaster> talking about stone age stuff
20100331 15:05:14< puer> yup
20100331 15:05:27< puer> its a good language. i hate to see it fall in the cracks
20100331 15:05:49< Blarumyrran> aka?
20100331 15:05:54< puer> also known as
20100331 15:05:58< shadowmaster> because "object oriented programming" is more popular amongst marketing people
20100331 15:06:15< puer> well it does have object programming
20100331 15:06:26< puer> at least the versions i use
20100331 15:06:33< Blarumyrran> Yeah, but i mean, free pascal and delphi are different things
20100331 15:06:35< shadowmaster> yes, not the original
20100331 15:06:42< shadowmaster> I was talking about the original, naturally
20100331 15:07:04< puer> yea delphi isnt free pascal
20100331 15:07:10< Blarumyrran> Why the aka then
20100331 15:07:11< puer> its borlands version of pascal
20100331 15:07:22< puer> but its what most people recognize
20100331 15:07:58< Blarumyrran> They're both by borland, I think
20100331 15:08:07< Blarumyrran> at least free pascal ran in the Borland Pascal ide
20100331 15:08:36< puer> free pascal is very close to delphi though
20100331 15:08:43< puer> you can also cross compile
20100331 15:08:47< puer> with very few change
20100331 15:09:01< Blarumyrran> free pascal isn't object-oriented
20100331 15:09:23< puer> http://www.lazarus.freepascal.org/
20100331 15:09:26< puer> with that it is
20100331 15:11:28< puer> they are different yes, no doubt. i perfer delphi but its no really actively developed
20100331 15:12:19< puer> i use to use alot of borland stuff
20100331 15:12:23< puer> whatever happen to them
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20100331 15:25:05< Unnheulu|Laptop> shadowmaster: is it worth knowing C++ in your opinion?
20100331 15:27:27< puer>  are there any other type of special mp scenarios. i played the old wesbowl, a new land, and 18th century warfare(which by the way needs work. ships are only so useful and no real way to take guys over seas)
20100331 15:27:31< puer> they can hold those islands for hours
20100331 15:27:33< Unnheulu|Laptop> anyways, now I just need to get the program displaying the images and I'm done
20100331 15:27:38< puer>  im interested in alternative uses for wesnoth. i think its a great game. not to sure about some of the eras though. played this one that had all animals for 1 faction and all regenerate guys for another.
20100331 15:27:49< Unnheulu|Laptop> haha
20100331 15:27:55< Unnheulu|Laptop> that sounds fun :P
20100331 15:27:56< puer> regenerate demolished the other every times even when we switched control
20100331 15:28:16< Unnheulu|Laptop> which era was that?
20100331 15:28:22< puer> um
20100331 15:28:26< puer> let me check
20100331 15:28:27< Unnheulu|Laptop> it sounds like it might have been a campaign era
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20100331 15:30:27< puer> bmr is the abbreviation for it. its in the ageless era
20100331 15:30:48< Unnheulu|Laptop> ah
20100331 15:31:02< Unnheulu|Laptop> that explains everything if its ageless era =)
20100331 15:31:23< puer> we both choose bmr era though. we didnt mix ee with bmr
20100331 15:31:29< puer> so it should of been balanced
20100331 15:31:46< Unnheulu|Laptop> unless its a campaign era
20100331 15:32:10< puer> its labeled mp era on the addon list
20100331 15:32:44< Unnheulu|Laptop> whats the archaic era labelled as?
20100331 15:33:07< puer> mp era
20100331 15:35:07< Unnheulu|Laptop> but archaic (iirc) is for bad moon rising campaign :P
20100331 15:37:07< puer> perhaps they should fix the labels then, just for the sake of organization
20100331 15:37:19< Unnheulu|Laptop> Perhaps...
20100331 15:37:30< Unnheulu|Laptop> But, you'll have to ask the devs for that :P
20100331 15:38:21< puer> its pain the arse playing era not meant for mp. and my buddy is the type that wont let me choose a different one if he has a chance of winning. (which is rarely)
20100331 15:39:53< puer> anyways we're off topic to the question i preposed, if you can answer the question id be thankful.
20100331 15:43:16< Unnheulu|Laptop> *looks for the question*
20100331 15:43:57< puer> are there any other type of special mp scenarios. i played the old wesbowl, a new land, and 18th century warfare
20100331 15:44:42< Unnheulu|Laptop> there was iirc a mp campaign for 1.4 or 1.5
20100331 15:44:59< puer> 1.4 and 1.5?... im on 1.7/8
20100331 15:45:23< Unnheulu|Laptop> yep
20100331 15:45:30< Unnheulu|Laptop> I dunno if its been ported :P
20100331 15:45:52< puer> i dont think ill be able to play 1.4 or 1.5. couldnt even play 1.6 too well.
20100331 15:48:19< puer> even if people dont add new features they really should upgrade what they've made, before moving on to new projects. we have just as many addons now as back then. should have way more.
20100331 15:48:41< puer> like wesbowl. great mp scenario. havent seen it in a while
20100331 15:51:38< Unnheulu|Laptop> I think it was removed for some reason...
20100331 15:52:03< Unnheulu|Laptop> also, about your upgrade old projects, wmllint didn't work upping my 1.4 project to 1.7 :?
20100331 15:52:04< puer> it was removed cuz bob stopped working on it and it stopped working with the new versions
20100331 15:52:10< Unnheulu|Laptop> *:/
20100331 15:53:01< puer> what you mean unnheulu
20100331 15:53:39< Unnheulu|Laptop> nvm
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20100331 16:23:44< Unnheulu|Laptop> aargh I hate cairo -.-
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20100331 16:44:40< zenhoobb-it> people spamming the lobby...
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20100331 16:58:51< Unnheulu|Laptop> bah, I'm moving to clutter
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20100331 17:05:26< Unnheulu|Laptop> internet trouble allefant? :P
20100331 17:06:35< allefant> indeed
20100331 17:07:04< allefant> no money to get better service :/
20100331 17:07:26-!- Jarkko [~JMP@gprs-internet-ffe7f000-129.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #wesnoth
20100331 17:07:30< allefant> else i'd just get a server somewhere with a permanent irc connection i can hook into from anywhere
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20100331 17:57:33< shadowmaster> Unnheulu: yes
20100331 17:57:45 * Unnheulu forgot what he asked^^
20100331 17:57:53< shadowmaster> whether learning C++ was worth it
20100331 17:57:56< Unnheulu> ah ok
20100331 17:58:15< Unnheulu> I have a 600page book on it by me that I got for christmas two years ago, and I'm only 1/4 of t he way through :P
20100331 17:59:30< shadowmaster> incidentally, I didn't learn C++ by book
20100331 17:59:56< Unnheulu> really?
20100331 18:00:00< Unnheulu> examples?
20100331 18:00:22< Unnheulu> or just coding?^^
20100331 18:00:27< shadowmaster> coding.
20100331 18:00:33< Unnheulu> ah ok
20100331 18:00:41< shadowmaster> I learned stuff as I needed it. Same with Perl and PHP.
20100331 18:00:56< shadowmaster> I guess I can't learn Python because I don't needed it since I have Perl.
20100331 18:00:59< shadowmaster> *need
20100331 18:01:53< shadowmaster> I learned C and C++ for a dead project of mine, but I really progressed once I decided to hack on wesnoth.
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20100331 18:03:41< shadowmaster> although I know now that I'd not learned enough at the point I produced Wesnoth TC 0.80 - 1.0a (2008). Or I didn't care, or something. The code was crap :|
20100331 18:05:07< shadowmaster> but that's more of a language-independent issue. You can know C++ but that doesn't mean your programs will be readable and maintainable
20100331 18:08:34< shadowmaster> it's a common misconception that a particular programming language will magically allow you to produce cleaner output - like Photoshop is some kind of formula for artistic awesomeness. The fact is, even if you have the right programming language for a purpose, it's easy to stray and produce shit if you aren't experienced enough in programming in general. Or if you have been skipping sleep.
20100331 18:10:16< sevis> Heh, I'd say that applies to human languages, too.
20100331 18:10:55< Jarkko> It applies to everything, basically.
20100331 18:13:25< Unnheulu> including my school work...
20100331 18:14:06< Unnheulu> shadowmaster: I think there is some truth in that; Although I've been coding for like 7 years, and my code still looks $%^*
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20100331 18:24:21< Unnheulu|Laptop> wow
20100331 18:24:24< Unnheulu|Laptop> hailstones outside
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20100331 18:49:09< Gambit> Zarel: Did you see? He sacrificed his integrity as a critic afterall.
20100331 18:49:22< Gambit> I figured since he had it for two weeks he might at least make it through half of it.
20100331 18:50:01< Jarkko> Gambit: Hi there.
20100331 18:50:12< Gambit> Hai.
20100331 18:51:21< Jarkko> How're you?
20100331 18:52:10< Gambit> Terrible
20100331 18:52:27< Gambit> My favorite wednesday activity just killed itself :o
20100331 18:52:41< Jarkko> Which is...?
20100331 18:52:49< Gambit> Zero Punctuation
20100331 18:53:02< Gambit> He is... was a very funny highly respected game critic.
20100331 18:53:16< Gambit> I was looking forward to watch him put FF13 through the ringer.
20100331 18:53:25< Gambit> As he does with all games. It's funny even when you like the game.
20100331 18:53:28< Unnheulu|Laptop> lol
20100331 18:53:32< Gambit> But he only played it for 5 hours!
20100331 18:53:35< Gambit> Out of over 40.
20100331 18:53:50< Gambit> You cannot, as a good reviewer, put out an opinion based on such a tiny fraction.
20100331 18:54:34< Jarkko> Opinions have been based on even tinier fractions... <_<;
20100331 18:54:38< Gambit> 5 hours would be sufficient for a MW2 review, or a Wesnoth review.
20100331 18:54:54< Gambit> Actually 5 hours would only work for one campaign in Wesnoth...
20100331 18:55:27< Jarkko> In general a human has 15 to 30 seconds to make a first impression - After that the first impression sticks and it takes about two years to "repair any damages".
20100331 18:55:59< Unnheulu|Laptop> lol
20100331 18:57:54< Jarkko> So, I guess that five hours is an eternity :P
20100331 18:59:53< Gambit> Jarkko: Opinions have been formed
20100331 19:00:24< Gambit> But now put out from a respected source to be gobbled up by a multitude of the general public
20100331 19:00:34 * Gambit remembers MSNBC's opinion journalists
20100331 19:00:36< Gambit> oh wait nevermind :P
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20100331 21:21:11< Unnheulu> bah
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20100331 21:21:23< Unnheulu> well there goes my hope I was going to get it finished today
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20100331 21:24:49< Unnheulu> hi
20100331 21:24:53< Unnheulu> hows the RPG? :P
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20100331 21:53:58< Unnheulu|Laptop> then again
20100331 21:54:01< Unnheulu|Laptop> maybe I will finish it
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20100331 21:54:16< Unnheulu|Laptop> even if I do, I won't release till tomorrow
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20100331 22:31:52< shadowmaster> Unnheulu|Laptop: no need to hurry
20100331 22:33:17< Unnheulu|Laptop> meh
20100331 22:33:19< Unnheulu|Laptop> almost done
20100331 22:33:31< Unnheulu|Laptop> (all but the recoloured image is blitted)
20100331 22:33:59< shadowmaster> I'm off for a math test anyway
20100331 22:35:16< Unnheulu|Laptop> ok
20100331 22:35:54< Unnheulu|Laptop> good luck
20100331 22:36:02< shadowmaster> yeah, I'll need it
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20100331 22:50:20< Unnheulu|Laptop> finally
20100331 22:50:23< Unnheulu|Laptop> finished :D
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20100331 23:01:12< Unnheulu|Laptop> shadowmaster, finished it :P
20100331 23:02:00< Unnheulu|Laptop> Wow, that took a while^^
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--- Log closed Thu Apr 01 00:00:40 2010