--- Log opened Sat Apr 17 00:00:31 2010
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20100417 00:12:35< CIA-32> ai0867 * r42147 /branches/fendrin_pathfind_and_editor/ (93 files in 44 dirs): Merge trunk up to r42146
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20100417 00:42:42< Jacob_> Decisions, decisions ... http://i42.tinypic.com/2e3d8on.jpg
20100417 00:42:54< Jacob_> What would you do?
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20100417 00:44:53< deekay> Kill him.
20100417 00:45:32< Crab_> Jacob_: I'd say "don't risk the wounded archer." :)
20100417 00:45:42< Jacob_> I was actually meaning, what would you do if you where the orc leader
20100417 00:45:52< Crab_> ah :)
20100417 00:45:59< Crab_> droid side 1 :)
20100417 00:46:26< Jacob_> Yup
20100417 00:46:32< Jacob_> He had 1 hp left
20100417 00:46:34< Crab_> or, depending on HP of leader, there might be a slim chance of killing the leader ;)
20100417 00:47:04< deekay> Jacob_: If I were an Orc leader, I'd  do  ":debug" ;)
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20100417 00:47:34< Jacob_> He would have a very slim chance of killing my leader
20100417 00:47:48< Crab_> deekay: in 1.8, esp. in mp, there's another option.
20100417 00:47:51< Jacob_> And if he did I would load the last turn >:) MWAHAHAHHAA
20100417 00:48:06< deekay> Crab_: Yes?
20100417 00:48:34< Crab_> deekay: wait till the player starts to type a chat message, and attack during that time. it'll make wesnoth throw 'wml child not found' exception. :)
20100417 00:48:46< deekay> haha
20100417 00:48:49< deekay> Nice one
20100417 00:48:58< Crab_> if we time the attack carefully to happen during the 'send chat message' part.
20100417 00:49:11< Crab_> or, a more cunning and evil solution. 
20100417 00:49:30< Crab_> 'do nothing, play chess, send annoying chat messages to player' :)
20100417 00:50:00< deekay> Ther's also another option
20100417 00:50:05< deekay> :kick ;)
20100417 00:51:13< Crab_> ':kick :droid :debug :heeeelpp!!!' would be cool chat message to send :)
20100417 00:52:05< deekay> ;)
20100417 00:54:04< Jacob_> moar dialogue?
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20100417 00:59:24< loonycyborg> Jacob_: Position of elven leader looks slightly suicidal to me :P
20100417 01:00:06 * loonycyborg have done a lot of such moves himself
20100417 01:00:15< Jacob_> But there were no villages
20100417 01:00:18< Jacob_> T.T
20100417 01:00:41< Jacob_> So I thought "New strategies are good"
20100417 01:05:07< Jacob_> hehehee
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20100417 01:45:15< Sapient> new strategy: let the wookie win
20100417 01:50:58-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: GSoC: Thanks to all GSoC candidates for submitting proposals to Google. Accepted student applications announced on April 26. | 86 bugs, 265 feature requests, 19 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20100417 02:41:51< Crab_> wesbot: topic
20100417 02:41:53< wesbot> Crab_: Don't be impatient, wait until something changes...  *tsk*
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20100417 04:08:40< Upthorn> hooray, I am now to the point of testing revisions
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20100417 04:46:25< Jacob_> Heya :D
20100417 04:46:37< Espreon> Hello.
20100417 04:46:45< Jacob_> I have a few questions to ask
20100417 04:47:04< Espreon> Oh?
20100417 04:47:25< Jacob_> How do we increment versions?
20100417 04:47:59< Espreon> What exactly do you mean?
20100417 04:48:14< Jacob_> Hmm
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20100417 04:48:53< Jacob_> What differences are ther in version 1.x t1.x+1
20100417 04:48:56< Jacob_> *there
20100417 04:49:17< Jacob_> Like new bug updates or new features?
20100417 04:49:54< Espreon> 1.x versions are major versions; 1.x.y are minor versions.
20100417 04:50:34< Espreon> Whether or not there are new features depends on what type of version it is; new features do not go into stable versions.
20100417 04:51:13< Jacob_> How do we decide when there are enough updates to move to 1.x+1
20100417 04:51:22< Espreon> IDK, ask Ivanovic.
20100417 04:51:30< Espreon> ... he manages the releases.
20100417 04:51:44< Jacob_> He appears AFk
20100417 04:51:48 * ABCD guesses that most people don't use the 1.9 MP server yet... :)
20100417 04:52:00< Jacob_> MP?
20100417 04:52:06< ABCD> multiplayer
20100417 04:52:09< Jacob_> Mana Points?
20100417 04:52:10< Jacob_> Ohh
20100417 04:52:15< Jacob_> hehee
20100417 04:52:39< ABCD> the 1.9 server is the "trunk" server - early dev builds :)
20100417 04:52:40< Espreon> Jacob_: Wait until it is day in Germany.
20100417 04:52:56< Jacob_> Ahh Ivanovic is german
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20100417 04:53:28< Jacob_> Where are the 1.9 builds at?
20100417 04:53:31< Jacob_> SVN?
20100417 04:54:25< King_Elendil> I think they're just getting the bugs out of 1.8, before they move on to 1.9
20100417 04:54:36< King_Elendil> I could be wrong though
20100417 04:55:17< Jacob_> Well, we have been getting the bugs slowly by slowly
20100417 04:55:32< Jacob_> Only new ones come every day
20100417 04:56:20< Espreon> Jacob_: Uh, what OS are you using?
20100417 04:56:28< Jacob_> Ubuntu
20100417 04:56:31< Jacob_> Linux
20100417 04:56:43< Jacob_> Also a few others
20100417 04:56:58< Jacob_> Why?
20100417 04:57:00< Espreon> OK, we only provide source code, thus you have compile your own binaries.
20100417 04:57:00< King_Elendil> there are only a few total
20100417 04:57:22< Jacob_> Compiling is fine
20100417 04:57:35< Jacob_> Unless build=debug 
20100417 04:57:59< Espreon> Heh...
20100417 04:58:02< Jacob_> Elendil: I thought we had 80+ bugs ATM?
20100417 04:59:16< King_Elendil> I meant a few total OS's
20100417 05:00:48< Jacob_> Well, most Linux users are used to make'ing everything themselves
20100417 05:01:20< Jacob_> I have never used a Mac
20100417 05:01:29< King_Elendil> you should
20100417 05:01:30< Jacob_> And installation in Windows is a breeze
20100417 05:02:25< Espreon> King_Elendil: Hwy should he use a Mac?
20100417 05:02:37< Jacob_> Oh I should? And pay large sums of money for for the same experience for less in Windows environment
20100417 05:02:54< Jacob_> Actually cut what I just said
20100417 05:02:58< King_Elendil> because they are the best, period.
20100417 05:03:05< Espreon> LOL, hwæt?
20100417 05:03:15< Jacob_> Macs = expensive in comparison with windows machines
20100417 05:03:28< King_Elendil> and worth it
20100417 05:03:28< Jacob_> Best???
20100417 05:03:35< Espreon> King_Elendil: It beeth a lie.
20100417 05:03:38< Jacob_> Worth ><
20100417 05:03:59< King_Elendil> the computer I'm using is 6 years old, and still runs like new
20100417 05:04:13< Espreon> Cool story, bro.
20100417 05:04:16< Sirp> Jacob_: Macs aren't really expensive compared to comparable Windows machines.
20100417 05:04:20< King_Elendil> it's true
20100417 05:04:30< Sirp> the thing is that "cheapo" Macs aren't available.
20100417 05:04:38 * Jacob_ looks up price
20100417 05:04:45< Sirp> if you compare a Mac to, say, a Sony Vaio you will see the pricing is similar.
20100417 05:04:57< King_Elendil> my brother is using a ten year old one now too
20100417 05:05:32< King_Elendil> and my dad's Vaio crashed at 5 years old
20100417 05:07:07< Jacob_> Back
20100417 05:07:27< Jacob_> I am not comparing to the sony VAIO
20100417 05:07:50< Jacob_> I am comparing to custom built machines
20100417 05:08:02< Jacob_> Also all my computers run a flavor of Linux
20100417 05:08:43< Jacob_> The current computer I am on right now is a few years old, and I have gottem perfect performance out of it
20100417 05:08:50< Jacob_> *gotten
20100417 05:11:49< King_Elendil> 21.5" Mac starting at $1199, 22.9" Sony Vaio starting at $1999.99
20100417 05:12:22< King_Elendil> still think macs are more expensive?
20100417 05:12:32< Jacob_> Yes
20100417 05:12:37< Jacob_> You gave no specs
20100417 05:12:46< King_Elendil> do you know how to count?
20100417 05:13:01< Jacob_> You gave screen size >.>
20100417 05:13:12< King_Elendil> Vaio:Dimensions (Approx.) : 22.9"(W) x 16.9"(H) x 7.4"(D)javascript:showFootnotes(); (CPU and Display only)
20100417 05:13:12< King_Elendil> Weight (Approx.) : 27.6 lbs. (CPU and Display only)
20100417 05:13:12< King_Elendil> Capacity : 1TBjavascript:showFootnotes();
20100417 05:13:12< King_Elendil> Speed : 7200rpm
20100417 05:13:13< King_Elendil> Type : Serial ATA
20100417 05:13:13< King_Elendil> Action Buttons : Action Buttons on Keyboard - Standby, VAIO, Volume - / +, Muting, Zoom In, Zoom Out Action Buttons on PC - PC On / Off, Display off
20100417 05:13:13< Jacob_> You do relise there is a difference?
20100417 05:13:13< King_Elendil> Camera : Built-in MOTION EYE® camera and microphone with face-tracking technology (640x480) VGA
20100417 05:13:14< King_Elendil> Keyboard : QWERTY, 19.05 mm pitch, 2.7 mm stroke
20100417 05:13:14< King_Elendil> Computer Type : Desktop
20100417 05:13:14< King_Elendil> Type of Use : All-in-One
20100417 05:13:14< King_Elendil> Input Voltage : 100-240V
20100417 05:13:15< King_Elendil> Bluetooth Technology : Integrated Stereo A2DP (2.1 + EDR)javascript:showFootnotes();
20100417 05:13:19< Jacob_> O.O
20100417 05:13:25< Jacob_> Use pastebin dude
20100417 05:13:36< Espreon> Indeed.
20100417 05:15:25< King_Elendil> sorry
20100417 05:15:32< King_Elendil> how?
20100417 05:15:40< Jacob_> http://wesnoth.pastebin.com  
20100417 05:20:17< King_Elendil> so, do I just link to pastebin?
20100417 05:20:33< Jacob_> Yah, you add a link to your post
20100417 05:21:17< Sirp> compared to a Vaio, Apple's prices are comparable. Compared to a budget custom machine, sure Apple is much more expensive.
20100417 05:21:17< King_Elendil> http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/6Ukg6TUz
20100417 05:21:28< Sirp> I don't think there's a need to go around posting stats.
20100417 05:21:37< King_Elendil> sorry :(
20100417 05:22:00< King_Elendil> got caught up in it all...
20100417 05:22:21< Jacob_> Meh we weren't really interfering with anyone IMHO
20100417 05:22:27< Sirp> hey you can knock yourself out. I just think that you're talking past each other because you're talking about very different kinds of products.
20100417 05:23:31< Jacob_> True
20100417 05:23:43< King_Elendil> I know, Mac is a whole 'nother level, Just kidding :p
20100417 05:23:48< Sirp> the problem with Apple isn't that they are more expensive. The problem is that they don't sell their software on a range of hardware, such as low-end custom hardware. That is the real problem people have with them. Of course, some people consider that an advantage.
20100417 05:24:39< Sirp> if you like running Linux, like I do, then there's no real comparison; get some nice commodity hardware and put Linux on it.
20100417 05:26:03< King_Elendil> heck, Wesnoth works on all Mac, Linux, and Windows, right? then there's nothing to worry about :)
20100417 05:26:35< Jacob_> Indeed
20100417 05:26:53< Jacob_> An admirable post from Sirp as well ;)
20100417 05:27:25< King_Elendil> do you know who Sirp is?
20100417 05:27:25< Sirp> personally I have a $2000 Macbook Pro just sitting on my couch 99% of the time, used only when I want to do iPhone development.
20100417 05:28:20< King_Elendil> really? can you send it in the mail to my so I can work on the iPhone stuff for you? :p
20100417 05:28:42< Jacob_> No, I don't know who Sirp is
20100417 05:28:50< King_Elendil> :O
20100417 05:29:00< Jacob_> Should I?
20100417 05:29:09< Sirp> yeah....I would have bought a refurbished one or something, but my wife decided I needed the best so she went out and said she wanted the best one in the store.
20100417 05:29:12< Sirp> :-/
20100417 05:29:15< King_Elendil> Sirp is David, the man who started Wesnoth
20100417 05:29:25< Jacob_> Ahh
20100417 05:29:34< Jacob_> O.O
20100417 05:29:51< Jacob_> Sorry
20100417 05:30:04< King_Elendil> don't worry, he seems quite nice :p
20100417 05:30:08< Jacob_> The whole nickname thing threw me off
20100417 05:30:18< King_Elendil> me too at first
20100417 05:32:24< Jacob_> We should have a reference to nick names 
20100417 05:34:06< King_Elendil> then I read: http://www.frogatto.com/
20100417 05:35:17< King_Elendil> frogatto looks quite fun actually 
20100417 05:37:36< Jacob_> It certaintly looks interesting if nothing else
20100417 05:37:42< King_Elendil> anything else the standard noob (me) should know before I leave?
20100417 05:38:34< Jacob_> I dunno?
20100417 05:39:03< Jacob_> :p
20100417 05:39:08< Jacob_> 'night all :D
20100417 05:39:12< King_Elendil> 'night then. See ya later Sirp :)
20100417 05:39:20< Jacob_> Goodbye Mighty Founder :D
20100417 05:39:28< King_Elendil> lol
20100417 05:39:41< King_Elendil> now you have a fan base :p
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20100417 05:52:50< Upthorn> crab_ I have uploaded a revised patch
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20100417 07:17:55< Zarel> Hey, guys.
20100417 07:18:03< Zarel> Someone breaking rules about using colors in their sig:
20100417 07:18:04< Zarel> http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?f=9&t=29603
20100417 07:18:31< Zarel> Someone might also want to talk to him about how most of our userbase aren't a fan of randomly strewn caps.
--- Log opened Sat Apr 17 07:47:17 2010
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20100417 07:47:25-!- Topic for #wesnoth-dev: GSoC: Thanks to all GSoC candidates for submitting proposals to Google. Accepted student applications announced on April 26. | 86 bugs, 265 feature requests, 19 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20100417 07:47:25-!- Topic set by wesbot [~wesbot@wesnoth/bot/wesbot] [Sat Apr 17 01:50:58 2010]
20100417 07:47:25[Users #wesnoth-dev]
20100417 07:47:25[ ABCD        ] [ ctrlfrea1] [ grzybacz ] [ ne0futur    ] [ Smar    ] 
20100417 07:47:25[ AI0867      ] [ Deiz     ] [ happygrue] [ noy         ] [ teaser  ] 
20100417 07:47:25[ AnMaster    ] [ erl      ] [ Ingmar   ] [ orfest      ] [ Tigge   ] 
20100417 07:47:25[ apoi_       ] [ Espreon  ] [ isaac    ] [ pokhbocee   ] [ Upth    ] 
20100417 07:47:25[ Appleman1234] [ esr      ] [ Ivanovic ] [ Polarina    ] [ Upthorn ] 
20100417 07:47:25[ aranair     ] [ ettin    ] [ knotwork ] [ Rhonda      ] [ Vetinari] 
20100417 07:47:25[ Blueblaze   ] [ fendrin  ] [ lobby    ] [ shadowmaster] [ wesbot  ] 
20100417 07:47:25[ Bocom_      ] [ freim    ] [ lukjad86 ] [ shikadibot  ] [ yann    ] 
20100417 07:47:25[ CIA-32      ] [ Greywhind] [ nagbot   ] [ Sirp        ] [ Zarel   ] 
20100417 07:47:25-!- Irssi: #wesnoth-dev: Total of 45 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 45 normal]
20100417 07:47:32-!- Channel #wesnoth-dev created Tue Jan 27 06:28:41 2009
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20100417 07:51:19< Upthorn> the thing that most surprises me about that user is that its posts actually seem to be bordering on useful.
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20100417 11:30:01< Crab_> Upthorn: good :)
20100417 11:35:31< Upthorn> Did you look at it yet, or are you just responding to the fact that I uploaded it?
20100417 11:36:06< Crab_> 'just responding to the fact that you uploaded it', but I'm looking at it now.
20100417 11:38:03-!- Darkas [~quassel@ppp-93-104-150-8.dynamic.mnet-online.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100417 11:41:27< Crab_> hi, Darkas
20100417 11:41:40< Darkas> Crab_: hi
20100417 11:45:09< Upthorn> I'm not totally sure that I abstracted the loading/saving properly
20100417 11:46:41< boucman> hello everybody
20100417 11:46:54< Crab_> hi, boucman
20100417 11:47:49< CIA-32> crab * r42148 /branches/upthorn_persistence/: Branch for Upthorn's Wesnoth persistence project
20100417 11:48:23< Upthorn> That seems like it might be a positive sign... :)
20100417 11:48:34< Crab_> Upthorn: I will commit your patch to that ^ branch, at it seldom touches existing files, so it'll be pretty easy to work with it.
20100417 11:49:24< Crab_> there is still stuff to fix in it, but it'll be easier to track things that way instead of patches.
20100417 11:50:49< Crab_> for example, don't use the "engine" log domain, there's too many things in it. better use a subdomain like "engine/persistence" or a new domain.
20100417 11:51:04< Crab_> that way it'll be easier to filter for 'your' log messages
20100417 11:54:00< Crab_> wesbot: seen Aethaeryn
20100417 11:54:00< wesbot> Crab_: The person with the nick Aethaeryn last spoke 1d 7h ago.  14h 7m ago was here and on the channels #wesnoth and #wesnoth-umc-dev with the message: Quit: ...
20100417 12:02:01< Crab_> Upthorn: meanwhile, can you add a list of mandatory/optional things-to-do to do to your wiki page ? (something like http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/8v9Hb5Es )
20100417 12:02:12< Crab_> (we've talked about it earlier this week)
20100417 12:02:26< Upthorn> yeah, I was meaning to do that tonight
20100417 12:02:32< Crab_> great, thanks.
20100417 12:03:26< boucman> wesbot: seen fakedrake
20100417 12:03:26< wesbot> boucman: The person with the nick fakedrake last spoke 2d 9h ago.  1d 23h ago they left with the message: Remote host closed the connection
20100417 12:04:26< Upthorn> I got distracted into trying to get MSVC to generate a console window so I can see cerr output during debugging -- so that I can actually see the log messages
20100417 12:04:57< Crab_> Upthorn: what about 'tail -f' on stderr.txt ?
20100417 12:06:49< Upthorn> it would be nice to be able to see updates in real-time
20100417 12:06:58< Crab_> yes, that's why "-f" switch
20100417 12:07:24< Crab_>  -f, --follow   output appended data as the file grows; 
20100417 12:07:56< Upthorn> yeah but I don't have a text-editor that will load the changes as they happen
20100417 12:08:21< Upthorn> and I just found the option in the project configuration properties
20100417 12:08:25< Crab_> good :)
20100417 12:08:49< Upthorn> ... the console window is scrolling really fast
20100417 12:09:03< Crab_> yes, "engine" log domain is chatty
20100417 12:09:11< Upthorn> I suppose that is my fault for --log-debug=all
20100417 12:09:34< Crab_> that's why I talked about something like --log-domain="engine/persistence"
20100417 12:09:41< Upthorn> yes
20100417 12:09:48< Crab_> oops s/log-domain/log-debug
20100417 12:10:21< Upthorn> now that I can actually see the log messages, I intend to do that
20100417 12:10:56< Crab_> (note: "tail" is a command which can display the 'tail' of file in a console, following changes if -f is given, it can be downloaded either through cygwin or via gnu utils for windows)
20100417 12:11:24< Upthorn> ah, I see
20100417 12:11:31< Crab_> but, of course, making MSVC do it automatically is better.
20100417 12:12:00< Upthorn> I somehow thought you were saying tail -f stderr.txt was a command line option to redirect cerr to stderr.txt
20100417 12:12:49< Crab_> ah. note that if you use tail, you can get tricky and pipe the output of tail command to something like 'grep', to filter for lines you need :)
20100417 12:13:10< Crab_> but, engine/persistence shouldn't be that chatty, at least yet :)
20100417 12:16:49< Crab_> Upthorn: also note that it is usually a good idea to check patches for 'stray whitespace'. for example, WML is usually space-indented, not tab indented (you have 3 such lines). and c++ shouldn't have blank lines containing only spaces (you have 1 such line)
20100417 12:17:15< Crab_> Upthorn: it's common for text editors to insert some, so it's better to check before committing.
20100417 12:22:14< Crab_> Upthorn: ok, tried it out. cool, it works :)
20100417 12:24:00< Upthorn> oh hey, crimson editor has a "use spaces instead of tabs" option
20100417 12:24:58< Upthorn> now tabs should never appear in wml that passes through me
20100417 12:25:30< Crab_> ok. note that there's a tool, wmlindent, which can reindent a file if it's totally broken wrt whitespace
20100417 12:25:34< boucman> we should have a script to reindent all sources+wml
20100417 12:25:42< boucman> ok, all source ;)
20100417 12:26:15< Crab_> boucman: we talked about that. but we need a small freeze before 1st run
20100417 12:26:25< boucman> true...
20100417 12:26:41< boucman> remind Ivanovic before the first 1.9 release :)
20100417 12:27:00< Crab_> :) ok
20100417 12:27:01< CIA-32> crab * r42149 /branches/upthorn_persistence/ (11 files in 4 dirs): Patch #1619: Upthorn's prototype for Wesnoth persistence
20100417 12:27:18< Crab_> Upthorn: so, it's in there ^
20100417 12:27:38< boucman> Crab_: you have quite a few open patches, any chance some of them can be dealt with ?
20100417 12:28:08< Crab_> Upthorn: do you intend to work on improving it further, in the nearest week(s) ?
20100417 12:28:25< Upthorn> yes.
20100417 12:29:59< Crab_> Upthorn: then I think it would be a good idea to ask Ivanovic to grant you commit access (to work on this branch more easily)
20100417 12:33:06< Upthorn> I'm going to add the deliverables list to my wiki page shortly
20100417 12:33:14< Crab_> that's good
20100417 12:33:31< Upthorn> but I'm unsure about transaction blocks
20100417 12:33:51< Crab_> in MP, things can go boom at any time
20100417 12:33:52< Upthorn> Oh, I guess the purpose is to MP
20100417 12:33:54< Upthorn> yeah
20100417 12:33:56< Crab_> client disconnections, etc
20100417 12:34:04< Upthorn> err, for MP, not to MP
20100417 12:34:06< Upthorn> yeah okay
20100417 12:34:18< Crab_> transaction blocks for '1 machine in MP' are very easy
20100417 12:34:19< Upthorn> yeah I answered my own question
20100417 12:34:37< Upthorn> I was thinking that it would be for WML authors
20100417 12:34:55< Upthorn> and I was going to say that they can just use container variables to do the same thing
20100417 12:35:05< Crab_> but if we want to allow them to work 'for all players specified in side or for none', that becomes funnier - transaction would be distributed and one of players or MP server will act as coordinator
20100417 12:35:10< Upthorn> but I can see how it might be necessary for MP communication
20100417 12:35:33< Crab_> see http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Two-phase_commit_protocol
20100417 12:36:20< Crab_> and we need at least 'local transactions' to work (which is easy)
20100417 12:36:41< Upthorn> yeah, I actually know how atomic transactions work, because ScummVM used transactions for graphics mode changes
20100417 12:36:50< Crab_> that's good :)
20100417 12:37:51< Crab_> if you feel that the list is too short, add more optional items. but, even as of now, there's plenty of good things in there :)
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20100417 12:38:35< Crab_> be sure to consider the effects of 'client disconnections' and side relocations in MP
20100417 12:39:30< Crab_> e.g., control of the given side might be transferred, and, even during the transfer, funny things like disconnections might happen
20100417 12:40:05< Crab_> or, imagine that we've just asked side=3 for his global variable, and internet connection of side=3 went down
20100417 12:40:33< Crab_> in general, we should aim for 'less features, less bugs' thing
20100417 12:42:51< Crab_> at least we have a centralized MP architecture, so there'll be no 'split horizon' issues.
20100417 12:46:34< Upthorn> yeah.
20100417 12:48:20< Crab_> so we might need to think out a good architecture to avoid issues with that. e.g. "if we ask side 3 for his global variable, then we expect that side=3 will add a block with that variable to the replay, and it doesn't matter how side 3 changes hosts"
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20100417 12:49:51< Crab_> Upthorn: (this might lead to 'we were waiting for the networked side to get us this variable, but then suddenly control of side 3 transferred TO us and WE must do that, then, before we were able to fully complete the task, control was transferred FROM us' things)
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20100417 12:50:18< Crab_> and other funny things..
20100417 12:50:25< YogiHH> shadowmaster: I have prepared all i wanted, is there anything more to be done before the experimental subforum can be opened?
20100417 12:50:48< Upthorn> Mm.
20100417 12:50:48< Crab_> Upthorn: ok, I've got to go, thanks. I will comment more on your patch later.
20100417 12:50:52< Upthorn> okay
20100417 12:51:24< Crab_> Upthorn: try playing MP locally with yourself and doing a few disconnects to get a feel for it
20100417 12:51:51< Upthorn> Okay.
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20100417 13:28:06< Ivanovic> Upthorn: please apply for group membership at gna to get commit access
20100417 13:28:08< Ivanovic> moin, btw
20100417 13:29:51< Upthorn> Ivanovic: can you help me with that? I've never used gna except to submit wesnoth patches and look at a couple of bugs
20100417 13:30:10< Ivanovic> Upthorn: somewhere in your userpreferences you got some "ask for group membership" field
20100417 13:30:15< Ivanovic> there enter 'wesnoth' as project
20100417 13:30:57< Upthorn> okay, I found it
20100417 13:31:05< Upthorn> I was at that page before but didn't scroll down far enough
20100417 13:31:21< Ivanovic> yes, the userinterface there is not too nice
20100417 13:32:07< Upthorn> request sent
20100417 13:40:13< CIA-32> ivanovic * r42150 /trunk/data/core/about.cfg: reordered Japanese translation credits
20100417 13:40:17< CIA-32> ivanovic * r42151 /branches/1.8/data/core/about.cfg: reordered Japanese translation credits
20100417 13:40:30< Ivanovic> Upthorn: okay, added you to the group
20100417 13:40:47< Ivanovic> Upthorn: you can now switch your checkout (or create a new checkout of this branch)
20100417 13:41:01< Ivanovic> make sure to checkout with your username via svn+ssh
20100417 13:41:32< Ivanovic> for trunk it would be this: svn co svn+ssh://upthorn@svn.gna.org/svn/wesnoth/trunk wesnoth-trunk
20100417 13:41:55< Ivanovic> instead of trunk in the url you probably want branches/upthorn_persistence/
20100417 13:49:32< Upthorn> hrm. tortoisesvn doesn't seem to be cooperating with svn+ssh properly
20100417 13:50:58-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: GSoC: Thanks to all GSoC candidates for submitting proposals to Google. Accepted student applications announced on April 26. | 86 bugs, 265 feature requests, 17 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20100417 13:51:46< ilor_> Upthorn: it will, make sure you have the privat key set up properly (putty etc)
20100417 13:53:56< Upthorn> tortoise plink asks me my username. I say upthorn. and then it asks for upthorn@cis.scc.losrios.edu's password. cis.scc.losrios.edu is the remote login location for my school's linux server
20100417 13:54:19< Upthorn> but I don't know where it is getting that location from. I've deleted all references in putty.
20100417 14:01:15< Upthorn> I can't seem to make it try to connect to ssh://svn.gna.org
20100417 14:03:29< boucman> Upthorn: svn+ssh://
20100417 14:03:54< Upthorn> that is what I told tortoisesvn
20100417 14:04:08< boucman> k
20100417 14:04:19< boucman> can you use command line svn ?
20100417 14:04:21< Upthorn> I tell tortoisesvn svn+ssh://upthorn@svn.gna.org/svn/wesnoth/branches/upthorn_persistence/
20100417 14:04:34< Upthorn> plink tries to connect to cis.scc.losrios.edu
20100417 14:04:39< boucman> how long ago did you register your gna key (it takes a couple hours usually)
20100417 14:04:52< Upthorn> it is not even trying to connect to gna
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20100417 14:09:38< Upthorn> okay I think I found the issue. Registry had data saved that putty wasn't showing me.
20100417 14:10:11< timotei> trying to use ssh to connect to the svn?
20100417 14:11:41< Upthorn> now it says "no supported authentication methods available"
20100417 14:12:10< timotei> Upthorn, using linux?
20100417 14:12:14< Upthorn> windows
20100417 14:13:28< timotei> here is a quick tutorial: http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SVN_on_Windows
20100417 14:13:59< Upthorn> Okay, I think I know the problem. Now that I have putty actually connecting to the right server, I still haven't registered an SSH key
20100417 14:14:57-!- ilor_ [~ilor@wesnoth/developer/ilor] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20100417 14:15:21< timotei> yes, that will take a time
20100417 14:15:49< Ivanovic> this takes some four hours to really be done
20100417 14:16:01< Ivanovic> (even though the docs make you believe that it would not take this long)
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20100417 14:26:49< Upthorn> okay so... I am not sure how much of the textbox is the key
20100417 14:27:04< Upthorn> do I include the ssh-rsa at the start?
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20100417 14:28:38< Upthorn> when I copy from the textbox I get "ssh-rsa [a bunch of letters and numbers and other characters] rsa-key-20100417"
20100417 14:29:07< timotei> yes, I got the same question my self
20100417 14:29:17< timotei> I copied once EVERYTHING in the textbox
20100417 14:29:21< timotei> and then, only the key
20100417 14:29:22< CIA-32> silene * r42152 /trunk/src/halo.cpp: Fixed halo unrender happening at the wrong location.
20100417 14:29:52< timotei> after: ssh-rsa
20100417 14:30:01< timotei> and before  rsa-keyxxxxx
20100417 14:30:49< Upthorn> the tutorial says to remove the spaces, but I can think of more than seven permutations of what to do with the spaces
20100417 14:30:55< Upthorn> based on that
20100417 14:31:28< timotei> :))
20100417 14:31:39< timotei> well, if there is any spaces in the copyed key
20100417 14:31:41< deekay> My registered at GNA! keys start with "ssh-rsa" then space and then key itself, following by hostname
20100417 14:33:57< Upthorn> http://asdfhgup.pastebin.com/rfYEyfyt
20100417 14:34:52< deekay> I'd do ctrl+a, ctrl+c, then ctrl+v in GNA! textbox.
20100417 14:35:47< Upthorn> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SVN_on_Windows#Step_2:_setting_up_an_ssh_connection says I have to remove part of it or the key won't match
20100417 14:36:11< Upthorn> which presumably rules out the format on line 2...
20100417 14:36:42< timotei> Upthorn, the spaces in that bunch of letters and numbers
20100417 14:36:59< timotei> in my putty version, there was:
20100417 14:37:09< timotei> ssh-rsa [keys] rsa-key-12313123213
20100417 14:37:17< Upthorn> oh. there aren't any.
20100417 14:37:21< timotei> and in the keys sequence, there were some blank spaces:(
20100417 14:37:28< timotei> ok, then it's good
20100417 14:37:36< timotei> I'll edit the wiki so everyhting will be clear
20100417 14:37:39< Upthorn> if there had been blank spaces in there, I would have been less confused.
20100417 14:37:58 * Upthorn goes from 5 registered ssh keys to 1
20100417 14:38:21< timotei> :D
20100417 14:38:35< Upthorn> ... 2 just to be safe
20100417 14:38:55< Upthorn> ssh-rsa [keys] rsa-key-20100417
20100417 14:39:02< Upthorn> and just [keys]
20100417 14:39:18< timotei> ye, me done that too
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20100417 15:05:54< CIA-32> ivanovic * r42153 /trunk/po/ (wesnoth-anl/sk.po wesnoth-l/sk.po wesnoth-sotbe/sk.po): updated Slovak translation
20100417 15:06:00< CIA-32> ivanovic * r42154 /branches/1.8/po/ (wesnoth-anl/sk.po wesnoth-l/sk.po wesnoth-sotbe/sk.po): updated Slovak translation
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20100417 15:09:44< CIA-32> silene * r42155 /trunk/src/sdl_utils.cpp: Fixed visual glitches in palette mode (--bpp 8).
20100417 15:21:12< CIA-32> silene * r42156 /trunk/src/font.cpp: Fixed visual glitches for partial modes (e.g. --bpp 10).
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20100417 15:36:21< CIA-32> silene * r42157 /branches/1.8/src/sdl_utils.cpp: 
20100417 15:36:21< CIA-32> Fixed visual glitches in palette mode (--bpp 8).
20100417 15:36:21< CIA-32> Backported from trunk r42155.
20100417 15:36:30< CIA-32> silene * r42158 /branches/1.8/src/font.cpp: 
20100417 15:36:30< CIA-32> Fixed visual glitches for partial modes (e.g. --bpp 10).
20100417 15:36:30< CIA-32> Backported from trunk r42156.
20100417 15:37:38< timotei> hey silene
20100417 15:43:04< silene> timotei: are you looking for me?
20100417 15:49:01< timotei> yes
20100417 15:49:16< timotei> I wanted to ask you about some WML things
20100417 15:49:31< timotei> let's say, we have a file _main.cfg and a subfolder myscen/
20100417 15:49:41< timotei> in _main.cfg you call the folder: {myscen}
20100417 15:49:58< timotei> in that folder the is some files (no _main/first/last.cfg)
20100417 15:49:59< timotei> f1,f2,f3
20100417 15:50:10< timotei> if I declare a macro in f1, does it propagates in f2 too?
20100417 15:50:19< timotei> or in f2, I have to include f1
20100417 15:50:21< timotei> f1.cfg
20100417 15:54:20< silene> it propagates; but it obviously depends on which one is included first; if f2 is processed first, then macros from f1 won"t be there
20100417 15:55:01< timotei> and isn't there any rules based on what you process first?
20100417 15:55:14< timotei> provided what I said earlier
20100417 15:55:23< timotei> so: no main/last/first.cfg
20100417 15:56:58< silene> no particular order, just the one from your operating system
20100417 15:57:13< timotei> so, alphabetically, right?
20100417 15:57:42< silene> why?
20100417 16:00:26< silene> i don't think there is a single operating system out there that mandates the order of the file in a directory; in fact, file ordering is a property of filesystems and there are some of them that definitely don't do it
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20100417 16:05:05< timotei> ok
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20100417 17:03:03< Ivanovic> off for the evening
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20100417 17:42:50< timotei21> fendrin, around?
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20100417 18:02:03-!- jacob_ [~chatzilla@adsl-75-49-234-30.dsl.stlsmo.sbcglobal.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100417 18:02:20< jacob_> Hello :D
20100417 18:05:03-!- pokhbocee [~pokhbocee@ws37.cs.drexel.edu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20100417 18:06:17< jacob_> CIA-32: Are you an actual user?
20100417 18:06:57-!- Aethaeryn [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100417 18:09:02< silene> jacob_: no, it's a cia.vc bot
20100417 18:09:20< jacob_> Ok
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20100417 18:14:10< jacob_> Question: If I am playing on Linux, can I play with someone who is using Windows?
20100417 18:14:29< Johannes13> jacob_: yes
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20100417 18:15:21< Aethaeryn> jacob_: you can even play with people on Mac OS X :o
20100417 18:16:13< jacob_> Is there any reason why I wouldn't see someone's server?
20100417 18:17:25< jacob_> Well, someone's game
20100417 18:17:39< Aethaeryn> If it's password protected or if it's full and no-observers
20100417 18:17:52< jacob_> It is password protected
20100417 18:18:03< jacob_> How do I enable me seeing that?
20100417 18:18:12< Aethaeryn> You can observe it, anyway, as long as observers are allowed.
20100417 18:18:18< Aethaeryn> But you can't join it unless you're given the password.
20100417 18:18:35< Aethaeryn> If observers aren't allowed and it's password protected, well...
20100417 18:18:38< jacob_> No, I mean I can't see someone's game that they have in the luist itself
20100417 18:18:42< jacob_> *list
20100417 18:18:48< Aethaeryn> oh
20100417 18:18:55< jacob_> Do we have a few servers?
20100417 18:19:04< Aethaeryn> there are a few servers, yes, but almost everyone is on the main one.
20100417 18:19:10< Aethaeryn> Versions would probably be the reason
20100417 18:19:17< Aethaeryn> i.e. if they have 1.8 and you still are on 1.6
20100417 18:19:23< jacob_> Do minor versions count?
20100417 18:19:29< Aethaeryn> only in development
20100417 18:19:43< Aethaeryn> for odd numbers, only minor versions can play with each other (1.7.8 incompatible with 1.7.7)
20100417 18:19:53< Aethaeryn> for even numbers, 1.6.2 can play with 1.6.1
20100417 18:20:07< jacob_> Oh, it appears I am running 1.6
20100417 18:20:07< Aethaeryn> it alternates between "stable" (even) and "development" (odd) ever since 1.0 and 1.1
20100417 18:20:11< Aethaeryn> right.
20100417 18:20:18< jacob_> Thank you :D
20100417 18:20:22< Aethaeryn> If your distro doesn't yet have a binary, you should just compile it.
20100417 18:20:32< Aethaeryn> And distros are hopelessly lagging on providing binaries.
20100417 18:20:38< Aethaeryn> I have long since given up relying on them, I just compile.
20100417 18:20:54< jacob_> Yah, I am using cmake right now, thought it is taking a while
20100417 18:20:59< jacob_> *though
20100417 18:21:02< Aethaeryn> I prefer scons.
20100417 18:21:08< jacob_> I have both :D
20100417 18:21:41< jacob_> Because I have had a few people help me, I thought it would be best to have both
20100417 18:22:43< jacob_> Whew it ca,e pre-compiled :D
20100417 18:22:46< Aethaeryn> Don't worry, I have 1.6 too, but for different reasons :P
20100417 18:22:52< jacob_> *came
20100417 18:22:56< Aethaeryn> I spent the past hour or so downloading and compiling a switch to branch on svn, only to find out I put "1.6" isntead of "1.8"
20100417 18:22:58< jacob_> Stability?
20100417 18:23:06< jacob_> Ah
20100417 18:23:08< Aethaeryn> So I just built the wrong branch :S
20100417 18:23:44< jacob_> Wait the version I downloaded appears to be 1.6 ><
20100417 18:23:50< jacob_> I am booting into windows
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20100417 18:24:25< Aethaeryn> I wonder if there's any noticeable differences between Wesnoth in Windows and vanilla, compiled Wesnoth.
20100417 18:24:35< Aethaeryn> I wonder if Wesnoth can run on my XP virtual machine.
20100417 18:25:16< Aethaeryn> I wonder what jacob_ was doing here when he was obviously killed by Ben last season as part of the smoke monster's manipulation to get off the Island.
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20100417 18:36:00< Jacob_> But now I'm backk
20100417 18:36:03< Jacob_> From outer space
20100417 18:36:58< Jacob_> And iwndows had 1,8 on it :D
20100417 18:37:16< Jacob_> *windows
20100417 18:41:35< Jacob_> Dwarfs have low defense right?
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20100417 18:43:33< Gambit> Jacob_: No.
20100417 18:43:56< Jacob_> What is their weakness?
20100417 18:43:58< Aethaeryn> Jacob_: low dodge
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20100417 18:44:11< Gambit> Well they have good defense on the proper terrain.
20100417 18:44:11< Aethaeryn> they basically have to stay on hills/mountains/castles/villages/cave or else they're screwed
20100417 18:44:32< Jacob_> Ah
20100417 18:44:32< Aethaeryn> they don't even have boosted dodge on forest like most races so they get about 1/2 the defensive terrain most races get
20100417 18:44:41< Jacob_> Hmm
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20100417 18:44:52< Aethaeryn> So on a standard map it's roughly equal between forest and hills (in theory), and all those forests are off limits for dwarves since they're 30% on them like grass
20100417 18:44:53< Gambit> So yeah you were right. Sorry.
20100417 18:44:57< Aethaeryn> you don't want to end where you have bad defense.
20100417 18:45:08< Aethaeryn> they're tanks, but only on the right terrain.
20100417 18:45:17< Aethaeryn> so I'd say dodge/movement are their two weaknesses
20100417 18:45:50< Jacob_> Thankyou :D
20100417 18:46:03< Aethaeryn> Thus why you need outlaws, btw
20100417 18:46:04< Aethaeryn> in MP
20100417 18:46:18< Aethaeryn> theives/footpads/poachers cover for the forests
20100417 18:46:27< Aethaeryn> You need them to plug your line since dwarves can't sit on forests
20100417 18:46:56< Aethaeryn> they also compensate for movement without being as expensive as a gryphon rider. Honestly, a quick footpad makes a decent enough scout.
20100417 18:48:21< Jacob_> But gryphons are so awesome
20100417 18:48:38< Aethaeryn> They also are too expensive for front line combat.
20100417 18:48:58< Aethaeryn> They'll own any scout (especially the drake one) one-on-one, but against multiple fighters, they're screwed
20100417 18:49:41-!- meric [~Eric@124-171-38-134.dyn.iinet.net.au] has quit [Client Quit]
20100417 18:49:44< Jacob_> You're quite knowledable
20100417 18:50:01< Aethaeryn> Experience.
20100417 18:50:07< loonycyborg> Dwarves also tend to have good damage resistance at higher levels.
20100417 18:50:16< Aethaeryn> Gryphons are the most expensive lvl 1 in MP
20100417 18:50:21< Aethaeryn> buy more than one, and you're outnumbered
20100417 18:50:24< Aethaeryn> I would know :P
20100417 18:50:29< Jacob_> Ah
20100417 18:50:53< Aethaeryn> Also, don't get any outlaws and your 60%-on-mountain dwarves are going to simply be walked around when your enemy goes through the grass/forest to your leader :P
20100417 18:51:10< Aethaeryn> you need the cheaper/expendable/forest-able outlaws to plug the line
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20100417 18:53:23< Aethaeryn> yay, lobby crashed already
20100417 18:53:35< Aethaeryn> in 1.8, just trying to expand the names to see all online :P
20100417 18:54:26-!- thespaceinvader [~chatzilla@wesnoth/artist/thespaceinvader] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100417 18:54:36< Aethaeryn> crashed it again by filtering by friends and then unfiltering by friends :P
20100417 18:54:40< Jacob_> >< another bug
20100417 18:54:40< Aethaeryn> wow, two crashes in 2 minutes
20100417 18:54:54 * Jacob_ falls over
20100417 18:55:39< Jacob_> Why are people so good at fining bugsss?
20100417 18:55:43< Jacob_> *finding
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20100417 18:56:31< Aethaeryn> because I tried to see what I could do with it?
20100417 18:56:32< Aethaeryn> :P
20100417 18:57:10< Jacob_> Yes :(
20100417 18:57:25< Jacob_> jking
20100417 18:57:39< Jacob_> But I don't fix bugs yet :D
20100417 18:57:53< Jacob_> I am still getting used to code :D
20100417 18:58:14< Jacob_> And lack of documentation :D
20100417 19:00:47< Aethaeryn> Another crash for just sitting in the lobby with a second client while in game XD
20100417 19:00:52< Aethaeryn> I didn't even need to do anything this time :P
20100417 19:02:23< Aethaeryn> and crash #4 (after a few minute freeze) for leaving the game
20100417 19:02:28< Jacob_> ><
20100417 19:02:49< Jacob_> bugs = 90\
20100417 19:03:33< Aethaeryn> and crash #5 for trying to expand "other games"
20100417 19:03:52< Aethaeryn> 5 crashes in 10 minutes is quite an achievement.
20100417 19:04:12< Aethaeryn> I'm just going to have to play on the 1.8 branch in SVN fully updated and hope they fixed a few
20100417 19:04:38< Aethaeryn> Though it looks mostly like translations updates :S
20100417 19:04:40< Jacob_> Yah ...
20100417 19:04:45< Jacob_> Hopefully
20100417 19:05:04< Jacob_> Ah what language do you speak?
20100417 19:05:07< Jacob_> Natively?
20100417 19:05:20< Aethaeryn> English.
20100417 19:05:27-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20100417 19:05:46< Aethaeryn> SVN tells you what lines were updated and when 12 were C++ lines and then there were 80 lines that ended in .po, I can say that most were translation updates without checking them all :P
20100417 19:05:57< Aethaeryn> I am a translator though
20100417 19:05:58< Aethaeryn> Latin.
20100417 19:06:55< Jacob_> Ah
20100417 19:07:18< Jacob_> People still speak latin?
20100417 19:07:45< Aethaeryn> I took five years of Latin from 8th-12th grade.
20100417 19:07:57< Aethaeryn> I'm not bad at languages, but I can't pronounce them for the life of me.
20100417 19:08:18< Aethaeryn> So I'd either get an A in a dead language where it's all written or a C in a living language by failing oral portions of the exams.
20100417 19:08:30< Aethaeryn> It was an obvious choice.
20100417 19:08:51-!- Gambit [~Gambit@pa-67-234-73-7.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100417 19:10:31< Jacob_> :D
20100417 19:12:36< loonycyborg> Latin is a good language to learn since many modern european languages are descended from it.
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20100417 19:14:32< Jacob_> On that I agree
20100417 19:15:39< Aethaeryn> oh my God... you can't even look at the list.
20100417 19:15:41< Aethaeryn> of players.
20100417 19:15:55< Aethaeryn> Since every time someone joins/parts (which is every second on the main server), it pushes you back to the top
20100417 19:16:00< Aethaeryn> so try to scroll down at all and you're screwed
20100417 19:16:10< CIA-32> silene * r42159 /trunk/src/gui/widgets/ (helper.cpp helper.hpp): 
20100417 19:16:10< CIA-32> Removed unused functions gui2::save_background and restore_background.
20100417 19:16:10< CIA-32> (They were broken anyway, as they would have caused a segfault for any nonneutral depth.)
20100417 19:16:14< CIA-32> silene * r42160 /trunk/src/ (sdl_utils.cpp sdl_utils.hpp): Enforced usage of neutral surfaces when doing low-level pixel manipulations. Any other usage is most certainly a bug (e.g. locking a copy of the main display).
20100417 19:16:16< CIA-32> silene * r42161 /trunk/src/sdl_utils.cpp: Removed redundant assertions.
20100417 19:16:35< boucman> Aethaeryn: please compile trunk and tell us if it's fixed
20100417 19:16:38< Aethaeryn> and the mousewheel scroll down locks you on the player list instead of the (probably more viewed) game list
20100417 19:16:43< Jacob_> But that's only a FR ;)
20100417 19:16:48< Aethaeryn> unless you click on it.
20100417 19:16:53< boucman> and it's already in :)
20100417 19:16:54-!- King_Elendil [~King_Elen@75.143.233.138] has quit [Client Quit]
20100417 19:17:01< Aethaeryn> normally, mouse over is sufficient for scrolling.
20100417 19:17:06< boucman> focus follow mouse for scrollwheel
20100417 19:17:18< Aethaeryn> ah, okay
20100417 19:17:57< Aethaeryn> idk, I have a feeling 1.8 is a release I'll be skipping for development version MP :S
20100417 19:18:12< Jacob_> :D
20100417 19:18:13< Aethaeryn> provided there's actually enough people on the devel version FOR MP... in 1.3 there was, in 1.7 there wasn't
20100417 19:18:29< Jacob_> Then, we'll see
20100417 19:18:36< boucman> Aethaeryn: you could test the 1.9, once it's out
20100417 19:18:50< boucman> we've tested 1.8 a lot... all three of us
20100417 19:19:00< boucman> and we did all we could with that testing.
20100417 19:19:35< Aethaeryn> The crashing 5-times-in-10-minutes appears to have been fixed, though
20100417 19:20:00< Aethaeryn> in 1.8.0+svn, not sure if it was in 1.8.0, I don't like leaving the domain of SVN since that would waste bandwith
20100417 19:20:40< Aethaeryn> still, I hate the go-to-top-when-refresh/ that every box appears to have: games and player, and probably even chat
20100417 19:21:01< boucman> Aethaeryn: yes, we know, and it's abug.
20100417 19:21:25< boucman> it's just not easy to fix, and we do it in our free time, so bare with us, it's not exactly funny ofr us either
20100417 19:21:58< Aethaeryn> I guess the reason I'm frustrated is for me, it would almost seem like a game-stopper, something that would have to be fixed before 1.8 final.
20100417 19:22:14< Aethaeryn> I guess I just don't use the lobby the same way the devels do?
20100417 19:22:38< boucman> we kind of had pressure to release 1.8 from our players too
20100417 19:24:44< Jacob_> Also, do you know how we manage releases?
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20100417 19:25:08< Aethaeryn> oh look, I left 1.8 up in the lobby... and it crashed by itself :S
20100417 19:25:29< Jacob_> What OS are you running?
20100417 19:25:50< Jacob_> boucman: do you know how we manage releases?
20100417 19:26:11< Aethaeryn> and it took me five minutes to select a game on the second "page" of the game list because it kept sending me to the front... New mini-game?
20100417 19:26:21< loonycyborg> Jacob_: Could you be a tiny bit more specific? :P
20100417 19:26:28< boucman> Jacob_: i've been a dev since ~2005 iirc
20100417 19:26:29< Jacob_> Umm
20100417 19:26:54< Jacob_> How do we decide 1.7 should be upgraded to 1.8?
20100417 19:26:58< Jacob_> Bug fixes?
20100417 19:27:05< Jacob_> New features?
20100417 19:27:05< Aethaeryn> Pretty much
20100417 19:27:10< Jacob_> Ah ok 
20100417 19:27:14< Jacob_> How many bugs?
20100417 19:27:14< Aethaeryn> At some point in 1.7 they string/feature freeze it
20100417 19:27:19< Aethaeryn> After they think enough has been added
20100417 19:27:20< boucman> it's "when we decide" but bug count is an important factor
20100417 19:27:26< Aethaeryn> Then they spend the rest of the time lowering bug count
20100417 19:27:56< Aethaeryn> So low bug count brings 1.7 into 1.8, but that's only after stuff has been added and then "frozen" (no new features while stuff is being fixed)
20100417 19:28:28< boucman> and since nobody tested 1.7 apart from devs, most of the "showstoppers" were spoted after 1.8
20100417 19:30:09< Jacob_> Ok :D
20100417 19:30:32< Jacob_> Also, do we plan on documenting the code soon?
20100417 19:31:16< boucman> Jacob_: feel free to do so
20100417 19:31:35< Jacob_> But I am new :(
20100417 19:31:58< Jacob_> Actually, new to coding for an entire project 
20100417 19:32:05< boucman> Jacob_: the first thing I did for wesnoth was reread the whole doc and write the whole WML reference in the wiki
20100417 19:32:10< Jacob_> I have only made stuff for myself
20100417 19:32:10< boucman> so that's not an excuse :P
20100417 19:32:11< silene> Jacob_: the comment ratio is 20%; so the code is actually commented
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20100417 19:35:40< Jacob_> But I am new to being with a project :(
20100417 19:36:10< Jacob_> And, the project uses a few libraries I'm not used to
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20100417 19:37:43< mordante> servus
20100417 19:40:04< timotei21> hello mordante 
20100417 19:40:10< mordante> hi timotei21 
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20100417 19:40:18-!- timotei_away is now known as timotei
20100417 19:41:11< Jacob_> Servus?
20100417 19:41:47< mordante> Jacob_, a greeting
20100417 19:41:53< Jacob_> Oh
20100417 19:42:09< Jacob_> What is it's origin?
20100417 19:42:26< Jacob_> Latin?
20100417 19:42:40< mordante> yep http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Servus
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20100417 19:50:58-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: GSoC: Thanks to all GSoC candidates for submitting proposals to Google. Accepted student applications announced on April 26. | 89 bugs, 265 feature requests, 17 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20100417 20:02:30< mordante> wesbot, seen billynux
20100417 20:02:30< wesbot> mordante: The person with the nick billynux last spoke 1d 20h ago.  18h 20m ago they left with the message: Quit: Leaving
20100417 20:03:37< Greywhind> hello - anyone know details of what this request is asking for: https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?13171
20100417 20:04:09< mordante> boucman, around^
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20100417 20:07:24< mordante> Greywhind, I think you really need to ask boucman the information provided is not much
20100417 20:09:08< Greywhind> yeah, i see that it says to contact him
20100417 20:09:09< Greywhind> thanks
20100417 20:09:42< Greywhind> mordante: you're working on some GUI2 stuff, yes?
20100417 20:10:25< mordante> Greywhind, yes that's the project I work on
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20100417 20:11:29< Greywhind> mordante: i'm looking around for a patch to work on to improve my knowledge of the codebase, and i see that there are a few GUI2 related things in EasyCoding - would you be able to point me in the right direction for one of them?
20100417 20:12:53< mordante> Greywhind, yes which one do you want to work on?
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20100417 20:13:36< Greywhind> i would be fine with either one of the ones listed, or another task if there's something else you think is more important
20100417 20:13:45< Greywhind> mordante: they're both related to the slider widget?
20100417 20:14:18< mordante> yes, some other student is working on the first one, but never applied a patch
20100417 20:14:29< mordante> and I personally like the first one done the best
20100417 20:14:47< mordante> (in fact I might even remove the second one)
20100417 20:15:04< Greywhind> well, i don't want to steal someone else's thunder, but if you think he or she has stopped working on it, i'll give it a shot
20100417 20:15:04< mordante> if you want to work on it I can give some hints
20100417 20:15:38< mordante> I've no idea but never heard back from that student, also can't remember the name, too many new `faces'
20100417 20:16:21< Greywhind> alright, well, i guess more patches for the same problem is better than none :P
20100417 20:16:28< mordante> yup
20100417 20:16:50< CIA-32> silene * r42162 /trunk/src/unit_map.cpp: Properly updated game contexts when swapping unit maps.
20100417 20:16:52< CIA-32> silene * r42163 /trunk/src/serialization/preprocessor.cpp: Extended #ifdef preprocessor directive so that it can test for any symbol that can be inserted. (Patch #1590 by fakedrake.)
20100417 20:16:56< CIA-32> silene * r42164 /trunk/src/serialization/preprocessor.cpp: Changed EOF preprocessor errors so that they point at the start of the token instead of the EOF itself.
20100417 20:17:08< Greywhind> mordante: so the code i'll need to work with is all in slider.cpp/hpp? or are there other files i'll need to look at as well?
20100417 20:18:43< mordante> Greywhind, yes the slider files in the gui/widgets directory and have a look at the text.cpp and text_box.cpp to find hints how to do it
20100417 20:19:12< Greywhind> mordante: ok, thanks. i'll let you know if i have more questions once i've looked at the code in more detail
20100417 20:20:03< mordante> ok good luck
20100417 20:20:16< Greywhind> thanks
20100417 20:23:58< Greywhind> mordante: what's the easiest way to test the functionality?
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20100417 20:25:51< mordante> Greywhind, wesnoth --new-widgets -s wesnoth.org and then create party
20100417 20:26:09< Greywhind> ok
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20100417 22:26:03< mordante> I'm off night
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20100417 22:30:54< Jacob_> Hello
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20100417 22:36:56< Greywhind> darn, looks like i took too long and missed mordante
20100417 22:37:46< Espreon> You could just leave him messages; I believe that he reads the logs.
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20100417 22:50:21< Greywhind> Espreon: i was just hoping i could get him to look at my patch before i submitted it
20100417 22:50:31< Greywhind> Espreon: but it's fine, i'll submit it and he can look at it whenever he wants :P
20100417 22:51:34< Greywhind> mordante: if you read this, the patch is: https://gna.org/patch/index.php?1639
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20100417 23:26:39< pokhbocee> Crab_: im almost done, testing the attacking
20100417 23:29:25< Crab_> pokhbocee: cool :)
20100417 23:29:56< Crab_> pokhbocee: post a patch when it'll be ready, I will test it tomorrow
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20100417 23:35:30< pokhbocee> Crab_: its a separate program though :D
20100417 23:35:56< Crab_> ah. then, how it can be compiled ?
20100417 23:36:02< pokhbocee> Crab_: but it has most of the necessary featurs so it will be able to give you set of actions for a specific turn of a scenario
20100417 23:36:03< Crab_> what buildsystem you'd used ?
20100417 23:36:14< pokhbocee> g++
20100417 23:36:23< Crab_> so, a g++ command-line ?
20100417 23:36:28< pokhbocee> yes
20100417 23:36:29< pokhbocee> or eclipse
20100417 23:36:30< Crab_> ok
20100417 23:36:38< pokhbocee> ill post it when im done.
20100417 23:36:44< Crab_> ok
20100417 23:37:02< Crab_> (i'll look at it tomorrow)
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20100417 23:59:42< Darkas> Crab_: hi
20100417 23:59:46< Crab_> hi, Darkas
--- Log closed Sun Apr 18 00:00:11 2010