--- Log opened Fri Jun 04 00:00:42 2010
20100604 00:03:46< Espreon> shadowmaster: ... This silence sucks.
20100604 00:03:55< Gambit> I feel like...
20100604 00:03:58< Gambit> we don't talk anymore
20100604 00:04:06< Gambit> You know? How we used to.
20100604 00:04:25< Gambit> This fight is stupid. You can have the car.
20100604 00:04:27< Espreon> Hwa, hwa, and hwam now?
20100604 00:05:22< Gambit> This soap opera moment was brought to you by EsperOn. New and improved EsperOn! Just spray a little on and telepathic powers can be yours!
20100604 00:05:41< Gambit> [1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Esper
20100604 00:05:48< Espreon> shadowmaster: Who the fuck is this Esperon person?
20100604 00:05:58< Gambit> It's a not a person.
20100604 00:06:00< Gambit> It's a product.
20100604 00:06:12< Gambit> That just so happens to have the name of your evil twin.
20100604 00:06:21< Gambit> Pure coincidence.
20100604 00:06:28< Espreon> No, my evil twin is Umbspeon... get it right!
20100604 00:06:58< Gambit> Espreon: No. The eviler twin.
20100604 00:07:18< Espreon> O RLLY?
20100604 00:07:20< Gambit> The one that burnt down that place and did that thing to a puppy.
20100604 00:07:28< Espreon> Gambit: Bring this crap in #wesnoth
20100604 00:07:30< Espreon> *to
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20100604 00:07:38< Gambit> Umbspeon does some bad things, but I wouldn't call him evil.
20100604 00:07:47< Gambit> Espreon: Nah. I'm done with this crap now.
20100604 00:07:55< Espreon> No, we need to talk about things in #wesnoth
20100604 00:08:08< Gambit> OH I see. You want me to get a conversation started.
20100604 00:08:23< Espreon> Sure, hwy not?
20100604 00:08:32< Gambit> But in here I had a setup. A springboard. A place to start.
20100604 00:08:36< Gambit> Over there... nothing.
20100604 00:08:54 * Espreon teleports Gambit's crap to #wesnoth
20100604 00:08:56< Gambit> And even if you mentioned the silence over there I can't just repeat the same joke.
20100604 00:08:57< Espreon> Happy?
20100604 00:09:42< Gambit> Alright I'll make up something funny about our mutual boss.
20100604 00:15:08< Gambit> I tried. Mission fail.
20100604 00:15:42< Gambit> He was too fast.
20100604 00:15:46< Gambit> It came out of nowhere.
20100604 00:26:10< Gambit> Espreon: I just don't think it's possible.
20100604 00:26:14< Gambit> The man is holding us down!
20100604 00:29:06< Espreon> Who beeth the Man?
20100604 00:29:18< Gambit> shadowmaster
20100604 00:30:02-!- mode/#wesnoth-umc-dev [+q *!*@pa-67-234-73-7.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] by ChanServ
20100604 00:30:17< Espreon> Gambit: Don't you dare talk about the Dear Leader like that.
20100604 00:30:35< shadowmaster> heil me
20100604 00:30:45< Espreon> shadowmaster: No, no, you'd have to use Korean in this case.
20100604 00:30:55< shadowmaster> I can't speak Korean
20100604 00:31:04< Espreon> Nor can I.
20100604 00:31:10-!- mode/#wesnoth-umc-dev [-q *!*@pa-67-234-73-7.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] by ChanServ
20100604 00:31:13< Espreon> shadowmaster: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Dear_Leader ;)
20100604 00:31:44< Espreon> I just love how the official leader is dead.
20100604 00:32:08< shadowmaster> he looks quite pixelated
20100604 00:32:34< Espreon> It's a jpg... what do you expect?
20100604 00:33:17< Espreon> ... and here's North Korea's eternal president: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kim_Il-sung
20100604 00:33:25 * Espreon just loves that concept.
20100604 00:35:39-!- zookeeper [~l@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit []
20100604 00:38:35< AI0867> 23:41 < shadowmaster> you don't say June 21st, for instance; you say "21 de Junio" (21 of July) <-- dutch has it easier, we say "21 juli" (21 July)
20100604 00:44:58< shadowmaster> 18:15:56 <@nenolod> alsa is horrid
20100604 00:45:01< shadowmaster> behold
20100604 00:47:11< Espreon> So, then, what do we use?
20100604 00:47:15< Espreon> No, I am not trying OSS again.
20100604 00:47:21< Espreon> Too damn quiet.
20100604 00:47:43< shadowmaster> I'm using ALSA
20100604 00:47:56< shadowmaster> he's talking about ALSA at the programming level anyway, for Audacious
20100604 00:49:04< Espreon> Oh...
20100604 00:55:08< AI0867> I use alsa
20100604 00:56:22< Espreon> I use ALSA.
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20100604 02:27:01< Elvish_Pillager> Hey Gambit, I just completely broke GEB in three different ways on my first time playing it.
20100604 02:34:04< Elvish_Pillager> Gambit, you there?
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20100604 02:38:46< Gambit> Elvish_Pillager: Yes.
20100604 02:38:51< Gambit> Highlighting me through the lobby.
20100604 02:38:53-!- loonybot [~loonybot@wesnoth/bot/loonybot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20100604 02:38:54< Gambit> Naughty boy.
20100604 02:38:57< Elvish_Pillager> hmm?
20100604 02:39:11< Elvish_Pillager> you're not in the lobby
20100604 02:39:11< Gambit> So tell me these three ways?
20100604 02:39:14< Elvish_Pillager> okay
20100604 02:39:15< Gambit> Elvish_Pillager: I am.
20100604 02:39:20< Elvish_Pillager> 1) I stayed in the starting castle
20100604 02:39:21< Elvish_Pillager> oh
20100604 02:39:36< Gambit> I'm always in the lobby
20100604 02:39:39< Gambit> via some voodoo
20100604 02:39:44< Elvish_Pillager> you have a different name there?
20100604 02:39:47< Gambit> No.
20100604 02:39:56< Gambit> Elvish_Pillager: So you stayed in the start castle on the big map?
20100604 02:40:00< Elvish_Pillager> yeah
20100604 02:40:05< Elvish_Pillager> can't get my leader there!
20100604 02:40:07< Gambit> I can fix that by tearing down those walls
20100604 02:40:13< Gambit> Elvish_Pillager: Just use the teleporter...
20100604 02:40:19< Gambit> oh
20100604 02:40:23< Gambit> nevermind
20100604 02:40:27< Gambit> Okay #2?
20100604 02:40:35< Elvish_Pillager> 2) I gave negative gold to the other players
20100604 02:40:44< Gambit> haha
20100604 02:40:45< Elvish_Pillager> so they had negative gold and couldn't do anything
20100604 02:40:56< Gambit> Okay.
20100604 02:41:00< Elvish_Pillager> 3) I robbed the bank
20100604 02:41:12< Gambit> ?
20100604 02:41:12< Elvish_Pillager> Deposited enough negative gold in the bank to underflow it, then withdrew lots
20100604 02:41:22< Gambit> okay
20100604 02:41:32< Gambit> so I need to check that numbers are greater than 0 on money transfers
20100604 02:41:37< Elvish_Pillager> yeah
20100604 02:41:42< Gambit> and tear down the walls of the big map on turn 3
20100604 02:41:50< Elvish_Pillager> that would make sense
20100604 02:42:53< Elvish_Pillager> or you could just force-teleport the guys inside
20100604 02:43:22< Gambit> Only the sith know that technique.
20100604 02:43:27< Gambit> What if Jedi decide to play?
20100604 02:43:58< Elvish_Pillager> What.
20100604 02:44:18< Gambit> force-teleport?
20100604 02:44:28 * Gambit wonders if his college has a comedy class
20100604 02:44:49< Elvish_Pillager> I mean, teleport them without giving them a choice
20100604 02:44:57< Elvish_Pillager> your joke was rather bad
20100604 02:45:33< Gambit> And though the news was rather bad.
20100604 02:45:38< Gambit> Well I just had to laugh
20100604 02:45:41< Elvish_Pillager> I didn't have to laugh.
20100604 02:45:47< Elvish_Pillager> Still don't.
20100604 02:45:55 * Elvish_Pillager blows Gambit's mind out in a car
20100604 02:46:31 * Gambit didn't notice that the mood had changed
20100604 02:46:32< Elvish_Pillager> You know, the 5% interest at the bank could probably also get you absurd amounts of gold
20100604 02:46:42< Gambit> Elvish_Pillager: That's the point.
20100604 02:46:53< Gambit> Save 1k for 10 turns and you'll be sitting on a fortune.
20100604 02:46:55< Elvish_Pillager> And then you could use that to overflow other people's gold.
20100604 02:46:59< Gambit> But can you get 1k, and can you wait 10 turns?
20100604 02:47:07< Gambit> Ussually not.
20100604 02:47:13< Elvish_Pillager> hmm, why not?
20100604 02:47:26< Gambit> People don't normally play it on the big map.
20100604 02:47:31< Gambit> They have no patience.
20100604 02:47:33< Elvish_Pillager> Oh.
20100604 02:47:35< Gambit> They play on default maps.
20100604 02:47:38< Gambit> Small and few trees.
20100604 02:47:42< Gambit> And they rush.
20100604 02:47:44< Elvish_Pillager> Yeah, but gold basically isn't a limited resource after a little while on the big map.
20100604 02:47:45< Gambit> It gets crowded.
20100604 02:48:00< Gambit> Elvish_Pillager: The big map is for epic empires.
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20100604 02:48:15< Elvish_Pillager> What is the peasant limit, by the way?
20100604 02:48:27< Elvish_Pillager> Nobody in the game knew and the lack of documentation is really irksome.
20100604 02:49:03< Gambit> There is none
20100604 02:49:19< Elvish_Pillager> Then what is it other than food that stops you from getting more?
20100604 02:49:42< Elvish_Pillager> I had 16 food and it told me "Not enough food or too many peasants" or something like that.
20100604 02:56:28< Gambit> oh
20100604 02:56:32< Gambit> apparently there is a limit of 30
20100604 02:56:38< Gambit> gah
20100604 02:56:42< Gambit> I can't keep track of all this
20100604 02:57:16< Gambit> Elvish_Pillager: I must have coded in a limit some time and forgot.
20100604 02:57:19< Gambit> It's in misc.cfg
20100604 02:57:28< Elvish_Pillager> heh
20100604 02:57:37< Gambit> This addon is quite large you see... :P
20100604 02:57:49< Gambit> Also earlier (8:47:32 PM) Elvish_Pillager: Yeah, but gold basically isn't a limited resource after a little while on the big map.
20100604 02:57:49< Elvish_Pillager> I think that the most necessary improvement for it is good documentation
20100604 02:58:06< Gambit> On that map gold is never a limit and wood rarely is. On the big map it comes down to intellect and memory I swear.
20100604 02:58:15< Gambit> You can build and build and build for as long as you can keep track of
20100604 02:58:21< Gambit> at that point you get overwhelmed and scale back
20100604 02:59:06< Gambit> I was working on a website for documentation
20100604 02:59:10< Gambit> the host closed up shop
20100604 02:59:12< Gambit> and disappeared
20100604 02:59:20< Gambit> came back months later as a redirect to another hosting company
20100604 02:59:46< Gambit> Honestly I hate this addon. I do not want to work on it anymore.
20100604 02:59:51< Gambit> I'm sick of it.
20100604 03:00:05< Gambit> I don't want to sit down and write a manual for it.
20100604 03:00:23< Gambit> I hope whatever Aethaeryn is working on is so good that people forget GEB ever existed.
20100604 03:00:38< Elvish_Pillager> brb
20100604 03:02:11< Valkier> What game is this?
20100604 03:03:21< Elvish_Pillager> you could remove GEB from the add-on server
20100604 03:03:44< Elvish_Pillager> I could make my THS rewrite into an epic empire builder and hope people play that instead ^_^
20100604 03:04:17< Elvish_Pillager> ooh I'm having an idea RIGHT NOW
20100604 03:04:49< Elvish_Pillager> I will write a generator for absurdly large random maps for my THS mod with different islands that you can conquer, vaguely like in the really old Mac game Galactic Empire
20100604 03:05:22< Elvish_Pillager> or worse, like in the equally old Mac game Empire Master
20100604 03:05:35< Elvish_Pillager> (People are as creative as ever in naming things)
20100604 04:08:57 * Elvish_Pillager names it Archipelagic Empires
20100604 04:09:10< Elvish_Pillager> (because, you know, there's more than one player.)
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20100604 04:43:00< Elvish_Pillager> Hmm, I can't seem to get [place_shroud] to work.
20100604 04:43:35< Elvish_Pillager> ..oh crap, probably because I'm not "use map settings"ing
20100604 04:52:52< Elvish_Pillager> "Sirrah! We've struck undocumented behavior!"
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20100604 06:16:37< PK2> hey guys.
20100604 06:16:45< Espreon> Hello PK2.
20100604 06:17:08< PK2> does violate_maximum not work on hitpoints effects anymore? I'm not quite sure why mine isn't working.
20100604 06:17:27< PK2> increase can be a value or percent, right? I used a value (in the form of a variable I checked)
20100604 06:17:42< Espreon> That sounds right.
20100604 06:18:04< PK2> the unit ended up with the same 1/1 hp, instead of 6/1 hp in my third test.
20100604 06:18:15< PK2> the first and second it ended with 2/2 when it should've had quite abit more.
20100604 06:18:51< Espreon> Meh, IDK. I would probably have to see the actual code, and I have to actually do homework at home.
20100604 06:18:56< Espreon> ... so... yeahz.
20100604 06:19:20< PK2> I posted it in the WML workshop, but homework is pretty important; summerschool?
20100604 06:20:12< Espreon> Uh, well, it's not like I'll fail, but I don't need this shit from my literature teacher: "Are you going to say X to your college professor?" et cætera.
20100604 06:20:26< Espreon> "Of course not."
20100604 06:20:40< Espreon> What I would like to say: "No, but, are you a college professor?"
20100604 06:20:55< PK2> heh.
20100604 06:21:06< PK2> I have to go to college after summer ends. Freshman year is gonna be tough.
20100604 06:21:39< PK2> Elementary teachers always said how hard middle school would be, middleschool said highschool would be hard, and now highschool says college would be hard.
20100604 06:21:47< PK2> highschool are the only ones that likely aren't lying
20100604 06:22:17< Espreon> It matters not, if you want to be successful in Western society legitimately without having "talent" is to have a shiny piece of paper.
20100604 06:22:24< Espreon> (Id est, a degree in XYZ)
20100604 06:22:47< Espreon> *"talënt", you must have
20100604 06:23:50< Espreon> ... and LOL, I didn't pay attention to my output.
20100604 06:26:35< Espreon> What I also want to say to my literature teacher when she spurts that shit: "Well, what would one say? They're not going to ask me if I have my homework... I either hand it in or I don't, thus I don't expect that 'I don't have an excuse' would work..."
20100604 06:26:39< Espreon> Idiot...
20100604 06:27:07< Espreon> *... so... if I don't have it... I'd sit down and STFU..."
20100604 06:27:36< Espreon> Seriously? I really hope that she's spurting this shit for the lulz.
20100604 06:28:06< Espreon> If she truly thinks that I would do otherwise, then she is batshit daft.
20100604 06:28:13< Espreon> PK2: What do you think?
20100604 06:29:20< PK2> oh dang, I forgot this was open
20100604 06:29:59< PK2> and. In college you don't have homework
20100604 06:30:05< PK2> you have essays, projects, and tests.
20100604 06:30:26< PK2> entirely different, in that its something you work on for a month (or the night before)
20100604 06:30:33< Espreon> ... that they just expect you to do outside of class...
20100604 06:30:38< shadowmaster> still homework
20100604 06:30:49< PK2> Ah well, I always think of projects as something special
20100604 06:30:57< shadowmaster> I don't
20100604 06:31:01< PK2> homework always had this "everyday" sound to me.
20100604 06:31:12< shadowmaster> it's an everyday thing still
20100604 06:31:21< shadowmaster> you don't slack around for a month and try to get it done the last day
20100604 06:31:29< PK2> Oh, some people try though
20100604 06:31:39< PK2> I definately won't be one of those.
20100604 06:31:50< shadowmaster> good plan
20100604 06:31:51< Espreon> As long as things don't have to be creative, yeahz.
20100604 06:31:53< PK2> I was making a sarcastic side comment. sorry. =P
20100604 06:31:57 * Espreon hates creative writing
20100604 06:32:05< Espreon> Apparently, I am a great writer...
20100604 06:32:06< PK2> Industrial/Orginazational Psycholology
20100604 06:32:13< PK2> all I has to do, is make workers happy with jobs they hate.
20100604 06:32:13< Espreon> (This is said by many in my school)
20100604 06:32:25< PK2> whoo!
20100604 06:32:25< Espreon> Just because I am apparently great does not mean that it is easy.
20100604 06:32:43< PK2> to do the easy is not great. Because that would be wasting potential
20100604 06:33:05< PK2> ironically. I quit my hard project to do something less WML wordy
20100604 06:33:39< PK2> speaking of which: shadowmaster ; do you think you could check out my post in the WML workshop about Effects/violate_maximum?
20100604 06:34:04< PK2> if you have time.
20100604 06:35:04< shadowmaster> gods
20100604 06:35:10< shadowmaster> indent your code!
20100604 06:35:17< shadowmaster> I mean, correctly
20100604 06:35:32< shadowmaster> also, [effect] is to be used in an [object] tag
20100604 06:35:38< PK2> oh.
20100604 06:35:52< shadowmaster> if you put it alone you'll be seeing a message in stderr mentioning that [effect] is not a recognized action
20100604 06:35:53< PK2> dangit. I thought I was getting around using objects. heard they bogged things down
20100604 06:36:39< PK2> and the indentions were getting jumbly cause I've had abunch of different people put their stuff in
20100604 06:36:40< shadowmaster> the [filter] goes inside the [object], too
20100604 06:37:15< PK2> I use tabs, but when I get a file from someone else their tabs come in groups of 4 spaces.
20100604 06:37:17< PK2> or less.
20100604 06:37:30< PK2> things that I don't get help on are generally tidy. >>
20100604 06:37:42< shadowmaster> the standard WML indentation unit is 4 whitespaces
20100604 06:37:50< shadowmaster> no tabstops, just whitespace
20100604 06:38:39< PK2> Awh D: but tabs is so much quicker to input.
20100604 06:38:55< PK2> and most things jump it to 4 spaces.
20100604 06:39:09< shadowmaster> real editors will allow you to set an option to expand tabs automagically
20100604 06:39:20< shadowmaster> for example, in Kate I can press tab and get 4 whitespaces instead of a tabstop
20100604 06:39:39< PK2> I use Notepad, not even ++
20100604 06:39:46< shadowmaster> bad idea
20100604 06:39:49< PK2> yeah I know :D
20100604 06:40:06< shadowmaster> Notepad++ (which besides the name has no relation whatsoever to Notepad) is much closer to a real text editor than Notepad
20100604 06:40:22< shadowmaster> the latter should be called Scratchpad
20100604 06:40:47< shadowmaster> it's not good for anything but quick text writing
20100604 06:41:21< PK2> ah well, it's gotten me this far.
20100604 06:41:36< PK2> admittedly, I use it for both of those.
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20100604 06:45:06< Espreon> How dare he use Notepad.
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20100604 06:46:12< Espreon> shadowmaster: Out of curiosity, did you have to put up with the same type of shit that my literature teacher spurts?
20100604 06:47:45< shadowmaster> uh, what?
20100604 06:49:28< Espreon> Read my textwall.
20100604 06:49:35< Espreon> Jeß.
20100604 06:49:44-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20100604 06:50:51< shadowmaster> well, the answer is no
20100604 06:51:04< Espreon> Lucky!
20100604 06:51:09< Espreon> Dealing with bitches is annoying...
20100604 06:51:24< shadowmaster> the few teachers that were like that didn't last
20100604 06:51:41< shadowmaster> ...don't look at me like that
20100604 06:51:45< shadowmaster> I didn't kill them
20100604 06:52:11< Espreon> Oh?
20100604 07:05:33 * Espreon wishes that shadowmaster would think of some moar awesome ideas
20100604 07:06:09< shadowmaster> I'm always busy with that
20100604 07:06:14< shadowmaster> writing them down? unlikely
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20100604 07:06:34< shadowmaster> didn't PK2 just quit
20100604 07:06:34-!- PK8 [~pk@r74-192-30-57.bcstcmta01.clsttx.tl.dh.suddenlink.net] has quit [Client Quit]
20100604 07:06:42< shadowmaster> we don't need extra PKs
20100604 07:06:43< Espreon> Hmmmm...
20100604 07:06:46< Espreon> Indeed.
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20100604 07:07:02< Espreon> AAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAAHHHHHHHHHHHHHHHH!
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20100604 07:07:07< shadowmaster> now the #5
20100604 07:07:09< PK5> screams of agony?
20100604 07:07:11< Espreon> PK5: Either stay or GTFO.
20100604 07:07:12< shadowmaster> it must be an invasion
20100604 07:07:22< PK5> apologies.
20100604 07:07:33< PK5> the screen was blank, so I had to leave.
20100604 07:07:34< Espreon> It's fine, I suppose. LOL.
20100604 07:07:36< shadowmaster> PK5: can't find a permanent nick to register?
20100604 07:07:37< Espreon> Ah, I see.
20100604 07:07:40< PK5> I'm on freenode.
20100604 07:07:50< Espreon> Use NickServ...
20100604 07:07:55< shadowmaster> [shadowmaster:+QZw] [Lag: 0.15] [2:Freenode/#wesnoth-umc-dev:+Cfnt] [anthony.freenode.net] 
20100604 07:08:01< shadowmaster> damn, I couldn't tell
20100604 07:08:05< PK5> people getting me onto this in the firstplace was hard enough.
20100604 07:08:05< shadowmaster> we are on freenode!
20100604 07:08:11< shadowmaster> Espreon: WE ARE ON FREENODE!!
20100604 07:08:19< PK5> oh, I thought everyone used some application.
20100604 07:08:19< Espreon> I knew that.
20100604 07:08:24< Espreon> LOL, wut?
20100604 07:08:31< shadowmaster> no idea
20100604 07:08:38< shadowmaster> what he's talking about ;)
20100604 07:08:50< PK5> something like xfire that popped up on your sidebar.
20100604 07:08:56< Espreon> PK5: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/IRC
20100604 07:09:01< shadowmaster> I use irssi
20100604 07:09:21< Espreon> Same.
20100604 07:09:25< shadowmaster> it's a console-based IRC client with a nice command-oriented interface
20100604 07:09:39< shadowmaster> and incredible flexibility which goes above most people's heads
20100604 07:09:58< PK5> see. I thought that freenode was just a site that connected to the IRC thing
20100604 07:10:08< PK5> and that everyone else was using some fancy application that did for them.
20100604 07:10:10< shadowmaster> freenode is the IRC network
20100604 07:10:17< PK5> I was misinformed.
20100604 07:10:19< Espreon> http://sco.wikipedia.org/wiki/Main_Page ... this is fun.
20100604 07:10:30< shadowmaster> anyway I was recommending that you settled for a nick and registered it instead of fooling around with multiple
20100604 07:10:36< shadowmaster> nicknames
20100604 07:10:56< shadowmaster> but since you barely understand what IRC is, I feel it might be more trouble than it's worth
20100604 07:11:02< shadowmaster> :p
20100604 07:11:05< PK5> that's why I didn't try.
20100604 07:11:13< PK5> I just let it hand me a number each time.
20100604 07:11:20< shadowmaster> and PK happens to be registered already
20100604 07:11:42 * PK5 doesn't feel like typing PsychoticKittens everytime he logs in
20100604 07:11:47< Espreon> http://ang.wikipedia.org/wiki/C%C4%93cel ... this... angers me.
20100604 07:12:02< PK5> the cake is a lie
20100604 07:12:06< shadowmaster> PK5: use a real IRC clients that allows you to save your config :|
20100604 07:12:12< shadowmaster> I don't type stuff whenever I log in
20100604 07:12:25< PK5> aaanyway.
20100604 07:12:28< shadowmaster> I just configured irssi to use shadowmaster:overlylongpass as my pass and shadowmaster as my nickname
20100604 07:12:32< Espreon> PK5: No, I just wish tht the Old English Wikipedia had moar content.
20100604 07:12:37< Espreon> *that
20100604 07:12:41< PK5> oh I see.
20100604 07:12:42< shadowmaster> so I only need to type "irssi", press enter, and I get an IRC client
20100604 07:12:49< shadowmaster> that join freenode with all my configured channels
20100604 07:13:11< PK5> but yes. Would either of you fine gentlemen know what the "variable" in unit.variable is when said "variable" is to define the current terrain defense of unit?
20100604 07:13:27< shadowmaster> depends on what the current terrain is
20100604 07:13:30< PK5> I tried unit.defense ; but that appears to be blank.
20100604 07:13:37< shadowmaster> *current terrain's alias
20100604 07:13:54< shadowmaster> there's no easy way to get that
20100604 07:14:42< shadowmaster> also, are you using 1.8? if you can get to store a unit, you can use :debug :inspect in the game to check all the contents of a stored unit like a WML container
20100604 07:14:59< Espreon> Yeah, the inspect dialog is teh shit.
20100604 07:15:20< PK5> I tried that on one of my mods once because someone suggested it to me, and my game lagged out.
20100604 07:15:29< PK5> then again, there were like a kabillion variables.
20100604 07:15:44< shadowmaster> yeah...that's a problem with its GUI toolkit in general
20100604 07:15:49< Espreon> Blame the following: mordante, mordante, and... mordante.
20100604 07:16:04< shadowmaster> it'll still work well with a few variables if you want to try it
20100604 07:16:18< PK5> I guess I'll just use the [have_unit] filtering to get defense.
20100604 07:16:36< shadowmaster> the long answer:
20100604 07:17:02< shadowmaster> all the current movetype stats of a unit are stored inside the unit's container (can't remember the name, though)
20100604 07:17:25< shadowmaster> however, there's no such a thing like an attribute that holds the unit's defense for the current location where it is (or was)
20100604 07:18:07< shadowmaster> same goes for movement costs
20100604 07:20:31< PK5> yeah, I had just misread the first way to find it
20100604 07:20:56< PK5> because it was [have_unit] x,y=$x1,$y1 defense=# [/have_unit] [then]
20100604 07:21:13< PK5> and the then defined a variable.
20100604 07:21:49< PK5> would placing 2 to 8 objects every fight bog the game down?
20100604 07:22:14< shadowmaster> I don't know. You'd need to try
20100604 07:22:18< PK5> alrighty.
20100604 07:24:07< shadowmaster> also note that unit filters and unit variables don't necessarily represent a 1:1 relation
20100604 07:24:53< shadowmaster> unit filters are designed to match units in a more human way than how Wesnoth internally stores units
20100604 07:25:55< shadowmaster> since Wesnoth is a game engine, it may hold less information about a unit in a point of time than you'd expect because it doesn't need all that information if it can obtain it using a more complicated logic
20100604 07:26:33< shadowmaster> in other words, defense and movement cost are calculated from the unit's movetype information, instead of a dedicated defense or movement cost attribute for the unit on its current location
20100604 07:27:37< shadowmaster> along the same line, a unit's location isn't an attribute of the unit as far as the gamemap engine is concerned
20100604 07:27:45< shadowmaster> rather, the *unit* is an attribute of the location
20100604 07:28:58< shadowmaster> but yeah, WML coders don't need to remember all the implementation crap (especially since we can always change it as we please - in fact, this is precisely why WML coders *shouldn't* ever have anything to do with the engine implementation)
20100604 07:29:24< shadowmaster> oh, sorry, I think I went into rant mode by accident
20100604 07:29:25< shadowmaster> :P
20100604 07:31:07< shadowmaster> anyway, good night. I want to sleep
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20100604 15:11:13< AI0867> esr: last night we were discussing the possibility of causing a (partially shaxthalized) drake to forcefully mature into a dragon. Do you have any insights beyond what the secret lore wiki page says?
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20100604 15:47:15< Elvish_Pillager> Hmm. I seem to have found a repeatable crash with the "inspect" window. :(
20100604 15:47:21< Elvish_Pillager> This is interfering with my debugging. :(
20100604 15:55:33< AI0867> Elvish_Pillager: any specifics?
20100604 15:55:37< Elvish_Pillager> oh
20100604 15:55:53< AI0867> I'm guessing you're on windows and therefore can't run gdb?
20100604 15:55:56< Elvish_Pillager> no
20100604 15:55:58< Elvish_Pillager> I can
20100604 15:56:25< Elvish_Pillager> terminate called after throwing an instance of 'gui2::tlayout_placement_failed'
20100604 15:56:25< Elvish_Pillager> Aborted
20100604 15:56:42< Elvish_Pillager> oh, that comes after:
20100604 15:56:45< Elvish_Pillager> 20100604 09:46:44 error gui/general: vertical_scrollbar [_vertical_scrollbar] recalculate: Can't recalculate size, force a Window layout phase.
20100604 15:57:07< Elvish_Pillager> It's when clicking on a unit with a lot of variables
20100604 15:57:20< Elvish_Pillager> I have the savefile and it's simple to load it and produce the crash
20100604 15:57:36< Elvish_Pillager> I'm still on 1.8.0 though, might things have been fixed since?
20100604 16:04:46< Elvish_Pillager> ran in gdb, the backtrace only shows the exception-handling code, not the relevant code
20100604 16:06:25 * Elvish_Pillager can't find it on bugs.wesnoth.org, is submitting it
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20100604 17:00:27< Gambit> clever post is clever: http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?p=432215#p432215
20100604 17:00:36< Gambit> I'm not allowed to be upset at him calling me a prick now.
20100604 17:00:45< Gambit> Because he *politely* called me a prick.
20100604 17:00:57< Gambit> Amazing really.
20100604 17:02:30< Gambit> I could translate a basic "How the hell were we supposed to discern any of that?" message into politeinese. But bugger him.
20100604 17:02:48< Gambit> *discern any of that information from a little floating eye.
20100604 17:03:06< Valkier> Well were you a prick?
20100604 17:03:13< Gambit> No I wasn't a prick.
20100604 17:03:32< Gambit> All I said was that wesnoth sprite face southeast. His was facing south.
20100604 17:03:39< Gambit> *wasn't a prick _that time_ :P
20100604 17:06:26< Valkier> I dunno.
20100604 17:06:29< Valkier> ;-)
20100604 17:07:40< zookeeper> prick or not, the facing just doesn't really matter at all for such a unit.
20100604 17:11:40< Valkier> I am getting my cat shaved.
20100604 17:11:44< Valkier> Lion cut!
20100604 17:12:16< Gambit> Picture it with all the other art though.
20100604 17:12:21< Gambit> It'd look out of place (imo)
20100604 17:13:04< Valkier> Bah
20100604 17:13:11< Valkier> Put it next to my sprites and it will look amazing.
20100604 17:14:39< Gambit> dubito
20100604 17:15:11< Gambit> Valkier: You're too hard on your art.
20100604 17:15:27< Valkier> I'm not so sure. My sprites are pretty bad.
20100604 17:25:50< thespaceinvader> well, make them better then Valkier
20100604 17:26:05< thespaceinvader> spriting can be much quicker than full sized artwork
20100604 17:26:11< thespaceinvader> it's quite rewarding in that regard
20100604 17:29:06< Valkier> Pfft
20100604 17:29:12< Valkier> Dirty hippie
20100604 17:31:14< Gambit> Valkier: Blasphemer!
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20100604 17:37:41< Valkier> Gambit: Why am I a blasphemer?
20100604 17:38:18< Gambit> For calling TSI a "dirty hippie"
20100604 17:38:53< Valkier> Yeah well.
20100604 17:38:57< Valkier> He smells funny.
20100604 17:39:05< Elvish_Pillager> Hmm. Why are my pirates acting as ai_special=guardian units when they're not?
20100604 17:39:33< Gambit> He could be a really clean hippie with some sort of odor though.
20100604 17:41:46< Valkier> "Clean" and "Hippie" are false truths.
20100604 17:42:13< Elvish_Pillager> "That is total nonsense" is a true lie.
20100604 17:43:03< Valkier> Gambit: Anyways, my art does suck. My designs are terrible.
20100604 17:43:58< Valkier> Hah! Everyone check this out quick. http://images.4chan.org/g/src/1275665386046.png
20100604 17:44:58< Elvish_Pillager> Isle of the Damned, eh?
20100604 17:46:11< Valkier> A quote from the forum I got that from. "Wesnoth is a great game. Completely unpolished, bad graphics, spelling errors, awful story, but amazing mechanics and gameplay"
20100604 17:46:26< Elvish_Pillager> lol
20100604 17:46:33< Elvish_Pillager> Recently?
20100604 17:46:47< Valkier> Within the past 5 minutes.
20100604 17:47:00< Elvish_Pillager> Yeah... that's not really a selling point of Wesnoth anymore
20100604 17:47:11< Valkier> We have a selling point?
20100604 17:47:17< Elvish_Pillager> The bad graphics, I mean
20100604 17:47:18< AI0867> yeah, we can't advertise our horrible graphics any more
20100604 17:47:21< Gambit> Valkier: Ask them when the last time they downloaded it was :s
20100604 17:47:38< Elvish_Pillager> Now, it's only partially unpolished.
20100604 17:47:44< Valkier> lol
20100604 17:47:45< Elvish_Pillager> Can't claim it's completely unpolished anymore.
20100604 17:47:53< Elvish_Pillager> They're LYING to advertize our game.
20100604 17:48:47< Elvish_Pillager> Awful story is right though. I can't decide whether it's better than Eragon.
20100604 17:49:23< Valkier> I can't even find a cohierant story myself.
20100604 17:49:41< Valkier> I played through about half the campaigns, and man. It all felt disjointed.
20100604 17:49:51< Gambit> You don't like the Inheritance trilogy?
20100604 17:49:55< Valkier> As in the only thing any of them had in common was the word "Wesnoth"
20100604 17:49:56< Gambit> EP^
20100604 17:50:06< Valkier> I didn'
20100604 17:50:09< Elvish_Pillager> Gambit: I didn't say I don't like it, I just said it had an awful story :)
20100604 17:50:13< Valkier> eh. Can't type.
20100604 17:50:24< Valkier> I didn't not enjoy any of it. I just couldn't find a link.
20100604 17:50:42< Elvish_Pillager> Some of the campaigns are more connected than others
20100604 17:51:29< Valkier> I asked when the last time they downloaded Wesnoth was. Waiting on a response.
20100604 17:51:30< AI0867> TB takes the cake
20100604 17:51:44< Valkier> Anyone know what the acronym GNU means?
20100604 17:51:50< Elvish_Pillager> Yes.
20100604 17:51:52< AI0867> GNU's Not Unix
20100604 17:52:04< AI0867> first you follow some escaping adepts (from the northwest corner of the map) straight north
20100604 17:52:13< AI0867> then you head north-east to a castle
20100604 17:52:23< Elvish_Pillager> what, I thought it was north-west
20100604 17:52:24< AI0867> where you arrive at the south-east corner of the map
20100604 17:52:30< AI0867> that was recently changed
20100604 17:52:34< Elvish_Pillager> Huh.
20100604 17:52:35< AI0867> then you go back home
20100604 17:52:43< AI0867> and you arrive to the SOUTH-WEST of your town
20100604 17:52:47< Elvish_Pillager> So basically it's set on a very small spherical planet?
20100604 17:53:07< AI0867> so, you go north, then northeast
20100604 17:53:16< Elvish_Pillager> ...then northeast, and end up back where you started
20100604 17:53:17< Valkier> The edge of the world just kind of teleports you to the other side. Like Pacman.
20100604 17:53:24< AI0867> and then the shortest way home is apparently to complete the circle
20100604 17:54:58< Elvish_Pillager> ...while UtBS is the complete opposite - you go north in EVERY scenario
20100604 17:55:14< Elvish_Pillager> (and you actually end up way far to the north)
20100604 17:59:26< Valkier> Huh. Apparently we have basic music too.
20100604 17:59:33< Elvish_Pillager> lol
20100604 18:00:01< Elvish_Pillager> this person will just hate it when they download 1.8...
20100604 18:00:17< Elvish_Pillager> "ALL MY NOSTALGIA HAS BEEN KILLED NOOOOOOOO"
20100604 18:00:23< Valkier> lol
20100604 18:00:31< Valkier> I told him he should try playing the game.
20100604 18:03:18< Gambit> The progress will probably melt his brain.
20100604 18:05:37< Valkier> I seriously doubt I'm going to get anyone to play. :-P
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20100604 19:19:24< Valkier> Gambit: Make a campaign with me.
20100604 19:19:24< Valkier> Now.
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20100604 21:41:13< shadowmaster> http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?p=432237#p432237
20100604 21:41:28< shadowmaster> I have deleted this guy's post like 3 times before
20100604 21:41:32< shadowmaster> I suppose he didn't get the hint
20100604 21:57:26< Elvish_Pillager> ...you silently deleted the post? Why?
20100604 22:00:01< loonycyborg> Because he's evil :P
20100604 22:00:26< Elvish_Pillager> never attribute to malice what can be explained by incompetence =)
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20100604 22:01:06<@shadowmaster> I wanted to do that since long ago
20100604 22:01:33<@shadowmaster> since the day he said something to the effect that I just like putting random races in IftU for no good reason
20100604 22:01:56-!- mode/#wesnoth-umc-dev [-o shadowmaster] by shadowmaster
20100604 22:05:06< Gambit> shadowmaster: Well do you?
20100604 22:05:21< shadowmaster> no
20100604 22:05:42< shadowmaster> a bunch of morons have claimed that IftU is the EE campaign
20100604 22:06:08< shadowmaster> it's not the EE campaign. EE just happened to have stuff I could use and that had no historical background whatsoever (other than the Aragwaithi faction)
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20100604 22:48:41< Elvish_Pillager> Hmm. I daresay the random map generator I just wrote is fairly decent.
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20100604 23:26:34< Espreon> Hmmmm... IftU being the EE campaign? How absurd.
20100604 23:36:05<+CIA-32> wesnoth-umc-dev: ln-zookeeper * r7228 /trunk/Brotherhood_of_Light/ (7 files in 2 dirs): Updates in preparation for 0.6.0.
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--- Log closed Sat Jun 05 00:00:48 2010