--- Log opened Tue Aug 31 00:00:05 2010
20100831 00:00:26< CIA-35> fendrin * r46128 /trunk/ (23 files in 6 dirs): 
20100831 00:00:26< CIA-35> LoW:
20100831 00:00:26< CIA-35> Enabled the second and third chapter of the multiplayer campaign port.
20100831 00:00:29< fendrin> esr:  ping
20100831 00:02:01< esr> fendrin: ack
20100831 00:03:08< fendrin> esr: My last commit introduced a new macro to core. Their usage in LoW cause wmllint to report errors.
20100831 00:04:00< fendrin> The problem is that "side" can also take "global" as value in the new persistent variables global syntax.
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20100831 00:05:25< fendrin> esr: http://wiki.wesnoth.org/PersistenceWML#side
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20100831 00:49:04< alink> esr: I tried several things but that wmlscope warning make no sense, it's a simple call to a simple macro in terrain-graphics/internal-generic.cfg. And most macros in terrain-graphics work like that (but with more nesting, so they are even less simple)
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20100831 00:50:04< alink> As I understand, it seems to fail to recognize 'terrain_code' 
20100831 00:51:42< alink> If someone has a clue it's {GENERIC_SINGLEHEX_PLFB (Ww,Wwf,Wwr) 100 -1000 base ANIMATION_15           water/coast}
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20100831 02:28:27< AI0867> fendrin: can't test now
20100831 02:36:38< AI0867> the titlescreen can be used while the logo is scrolling, but moving the mouse is very laggy here
20100831 02:37:17< AI0867> and I can no longer quit with escape
20100831 02:38:58< AI0867> hmm, F5 is indeed gone
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20100831 04:11:43< fendrin> shadowmaster: Do you know the simplest way to check for a wml variable being empty or unset?
20100831 04:12:10< shadowmaster> hmmmmmm
20100831 04:12:20< shadowmaster> compare it to $null
20100831 04:12:47< fendrin> and $null is unset or empty?
20100831 04:12:51< shadowmaster> according to Sapient, $null will resolve to an empty string by convention, since it's never defined.
20100831 04:12:58< shadowmaster> so yeah, unset
20100831 04:13:11< fendrin> so $null is predefined somehow?
20100831 04:13:35< shadowmaster> any random joe can override that "convention" by actually defining a value for null.
20100831 04:13:43< shadowmaster> kinda like #undef NULL  #define NULL 1  in C
20100831 04:14:00< shadowmaster> but you won't do that, neither will the audience.
20100831 04:14:08< shadowmaster> hopefully, right random UMC coders out there? ;)
20100831 04:14:15< fendrin> hmmm
20100831 04:14:41< shadowmaster> so [variable] name="var" equals="$null"  should do the trick
20100831 04:14:42< fendrin> Did I understand right, that $null is just a random chosen most likely unset variable?
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20100831 04:15:11< fendrin> I could also use $my_empty_for_sure_variable, right?
20100831 04:15:14< shadowmaster> fendrin: well, it's the least likely name to be actually used to store a variable/container/array
20100831 04:15:19< shadowmaster> but yes, any unset variable works
20100831 04:15:33< shadowmaster> the convention is to use $null
20100831 04:15:51< shadowmaster> why it didn't become a reserved name for the variable setter, I don't know.
20100831 04:15:59< CIA-35> alink * r46129 /trunk/src/actions.cpp: 
20100831 04:15:59< CIA-35> Fix FR/bug #16603: Capture villages with waypoints
20100831 04:15:59< CIA-35> Placing a waypoint on a enemy/free village now means that we want to capture it, not just pass there.
20100831 04:15:59< CIA-35> This is simple and nice way to have complex goto to plan multiple villages grabbing.
20100831 04:16:02< CIA-35> alink * r46130 /trunk/src/pathfind/pathfind.cpp: Delete useless (shadowed) variable
20100831 04:16:03< CIA-35> alink * r46131 /trunk/src/pathfind/pathfind.cpp: 
20100831 04:16:03< CIA-35> Use correct turnpoint info for the new "waypoint on village" (bug #16603)
20100831 04:16:03< CIA-35> The capture icon also helps to show that we will stop there, not just pass.
20100831 04:16:43< alink> wesbot: seen beetlenaut
20100831 04:16:44< wesbot> alink: Sorry, I don't know of beetlenaut.
20100831 04:16:54< shadowmaster> alink: he oesn0t do IRC.
20100831 04:16:55< fendrin> shadowmaster: The persistent variable thing could be used to connect the chapters of IftU with each other.
20100831 04:16:59< shadowmaster> argh, typos.
20100831 04:17:06< shadowmaster> fendrin: I know :(
20100831 04:17:23< shadowmaster> or IftU <-> AtS
20100831 04:19:04< fendrin> shadowmaster: You are not happy about that?
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20100831 04:21:20< shadowmaster> it doesn't matter at this point
20100831 04:21:44< shadowmaster> IftU is not maintained since ages, and AtS' development is halted atm
20100831 04:23:33< fendrin> shadowmaster: I can do the coding if you want. 
20100831 04:23:47< shadowmaster> nah.
20100831 04:23:54< fendrin> shadowmaster: Why not?
20100831 04:23:58< shadowmaster> just let it rot.
20100831 04:24:23< shadowmaster> mainline is more important, and I really don't have plans or hopes for it in the short term
20100831 04:26:09< fendrin> Are you working on something in mainline? 
20100831 04:26:52< shadowmaster> no.
20100831 04:27:05< shadowmaster> the problem is that I can't work on anythin right now.
20100831 04:27:18< shadowmaster> and not because of lack of time...
20100831 04:27:40< fendrin> Are you ill?
20100831 04:30:07< shadowmaster> no
20100831 04:30:42< shadowmaster> it's just...depression.
20100831 04:30:59< shadowmaster> spanning years, but I've got worse lately.
20100831 04:31:39< shadowmaster> so I'm pretty much unable to do anything I want (like coding some programs I wanted to make, or finishing my refactoring of the add-ons management code in Wesnoth...)
20100831 04:31:45< shadowmaster> or pixel art :|
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20100831 04:35:47< fendrin> shadowmaster: I am sorry to hear that. Have you ever tried a medicine against that?
20100831 04:36:20< shadowmaster> er, medicines can't really fix that problem alone :)
20100831 04:36:53< shadowmaster> although I'm in therapy regarding that
20100831 04:39:59< fendrin> shadowmaster: Okay, I just read an article regarding that antidepressants have made a huge progress lately.
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20100831 05:58:37-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 147 bugs, 296 feature requests, 13 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20100831 07:36:13< shadowmaster> Ivanovic: what's the current procedure for fixing typos in tstrings in trunk, when they are *not* applicable to stable? (in this case, Dead Water, which only exists in trunk)
20100831 07:36:24< shadowmaster> do I just edit the files, or do I have to mess with this pofix thingy?
20100831 07:37:24< shadowmaster> typos and grammar mistakes, to be even more specific
20100831 08:04:17< CIA-35> silene * r46132 /trunk/src/config.cpp: Fixed segfault at (auto)save time.
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20100831 08:37:40< shadowmaster> wesbot: seen timotei
20100831 08:37:40< wesbot> shadowmaster: The person with the nick timotei last spoke 9d 10h ago.  9d 10h ago was here and on the channel #wesnoth-umc-dev with the message: Quit: Leaving
20100831 08:38:15< shadowmaster> that means he's not been around at least for the last three days since wesbot's return. hmmm...
20100831 08:39:54< Rhonda> https://flattr.com/thing/56371/The-Battle-for-Wesnoth
20100831 08:44:34< shadowmaster> no idea why, but I'm afraid. Not sure what I'm afraid of either. So I'll go to get my two and a half hours of sleep.
20100831 08:46:30-!- shadowm_laptop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit []
20100831 08:51:32< Rhonda> shadowmaster: Hey :)
20100831 09:15:15-!- crimson_penguin [~ben@wesnoth/developer/crimsonpenguin] has quit [Quit: crimson_penguin]
20100831 09:27:07< Rhonda> Hmm. Who has created the gravatar "wesnoth" account?
20100831 09:27:51< Rhonda> wtf, wesnoth.wordpress.com
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20100831 09:36:02< Rhonda> Hmm.
20100831 09:36:10< Rhonda> Do we have the wesnoth icon in bigger size?
20100831 09:36:34< Rhonda> 64x64 seems to be too small. :)
20100831 09:36:50< Rhonda> I could need it in 120x120 at least.
20100831 09:37:01 * Rhonda . o O ( for https://flattr.com/profile/wesnoth )
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20100831 10:17:46< Ivanovic> shadowmaster: yes, plain typo fixes in trunk (while not in string freeze) should be added to pofix.py, too
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20100831 13:53:12< Soliton> alink: special casing villages in waypoints seems unnecessary restrictiv considering whiteboard mode. IMO it'd be better to let waypoints define the path and whiteboard where to stop.
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20100831 14:44:26< shadowmaster> Ivanovic: :|
20100831 14:44:39< shadowmaster> okay, how do I do that? I just figure out the code and add it? No need to run pofix myself?
20100831 14:45:31< shadowmaster> I was under the impression that that was pofix used for stable <-> trunk catalogue exchanges, but meh.
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20100831 15:05:29< shadowmaster> huh, vlc's presence as a background process what making X use over 10% CPU and it wasn't even playing anything.
20100831 15:14:17< Soliton> figure out the context of the original string in a po(t) file and add that plus the correction to pofix.
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20100831 15:17:28< shadowmaster> yeah.
20100831 15:28:59< fabi> hi shadowmaster
20100831 15:30:03< fabi> shadowmaster: Timotei wanted to take a wesbreak for his exams. I hope he will stay with the project longer than being payed.
20100831 15:32:18< shadowmaster> ah, okay. I was just kind of missing him :)
20100831 15:32:51< fabi> Yeah, he was active on irc and seemed to have fun being part of the gang. That is why I think he will stay.
20100831 15:39:34< shadowmaster> note to self: next time I buy a laptop, I must buy a cooling pad too.
20100831 15:40:12< shadowmaster> this thing is overheating on this library desk and I can't do the "english dictionary as cooling platform" trick here.
20100831 15:40:52< zookeeper> urgh...i think in order to get movement anim sounds to work well we'd need some kind of new support for looping
20100831 15:41:15< zookeeper> footsteps sound pretty dumb when triggered on every hex
20100831 15:45:25 * Soliton . o O (libraries have no books?)
20100831 15:48:00< shadowmaster> yes, they have. But I can't take one and possibly damage it with the laptop.
20100831 15:48:41-!- euschn [~eugen@wesnoth/developer/euschn] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
20100831 15:48:58< shadowmaster> I've shed many pages of the start and end of that dictionary since I started using it to lay my laptop on it, and another book's cover got a bit deteriorated with the high temperatures
20100831 15:49:28< shadowmaster> we're talking of thermal zone readings between 55 and 67°C idle, up to 90°C compiling.
20100831 15:49:59< zookeeper> pour some cold water on it
20100831 15:50:11< shadowmaster> I wish ^_^
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20100831 16:37:42< eleazar> re: flattr  are we taking donations again? or is an individual taking donations in Wesnoth's name?
20100831 16:40:30< Soliton> i think we are, no idea where it was discussed though.
20100831 16:46:07-!- dtiger [~dtiger@dynamic-vpdn-93-125-13-36.telecom.by] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100831 16:47:02< AI0867> while we are a non-profit corporation now, we still aren't a charity
20100831 16:47:11< AI0867> so no tax-deductions
20100831 16:47:55< eleazar> AI0867: my question was different
20100831 16:48:08< eleazar> i.e. is this going to Wesnoth?
20100831 16:48:08< eleazar> https://flattr.com/thing/56371/The-Battle-for-Wesnoth
20100831 16:49:04< eleazar> since last i heard we weren't accepting contributions of money
20100831 16:51:23< eleazar> i don't object -- i just want to make sure some random person isn't taking money in our name
20100831 16:54:59< eleazar> rhonda and if it is us, i'd like to get a properly sized icon up there
20100831 16:55:19< eleazar> don't know who to send it to
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20100831 16:57:47< Soliton> doesn't seem to be possible to verify anything on that site.
20100831 16:58:00< AI0867> is what going to wesnoth?
20100831 16:58:28< Soliton> donations to that flattr account.
20100831 16:58:58< Soliton> s/donations/payments/ or whatever.
20100831 16:59:02< AI0867> ah
20100831 16:59:30< AI0867> I have no idea
20100831 16:59:35< AI0867> never heard of it
20100831 17:02:14-!- alink [~alink@wesnoth/developer/alink] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100831 17:04:17< alink> There is a flattr button on our homepage (with the same number (5) of "flattr"). So I guess it's from us
20100831 17:04:43< alink> but need to register to verify
20100831 17:05:24< alink> whoever maintain the mainpage should know
20100831 17:05:52< AI0867> shadowmaster: have you heard of it?
20100831 17:07:10< alink> ah it has the same url when hovering the button
20100831 17:07:59< alink> oh ok it's a 2 parts button.
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20100831 17:25:47< AI0867> http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?p=453572#p453572 <-- the third and fourth error might be legitimate
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20100831 17:33:57< CIA-35> fendrin * r46133 /trunk/data/tools/emacs_mode/wesnoth-wml-data.el: Updated the wesnoth emacs mode's database.
20100831 17:36:19< alink> Soliton: About waypoints, agreed, in some rare cases it may be a problem, but I thought the gain for villages-grabbing was good enough (and much more frequent) to compensate. You can often just put the waypoint after the village to pass it, but indeed,it will annoy someone one day.
20100831 17:36:54< alink> for WB i am not sure what are the plans and timeline for multiturn actions
20100831 17:37:09< Soliton> well, is the village grabbing not possible with WB?
20100831 17:37:53< CIA-35> fendrin * r46134 /trunk/data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/ (4 files in 3 dirs): LoW: Enhanced the loading of the persistent side recall list information.
20100831 17:37:57< alink> Ah I assumed that WB worked only for the immediate turn, but maybe I missed a improvement
20100831 17:38:13< alink> checking...
20100831 17:38:34< Soliton> i'm just assuming, haven't really tried it so far.
20100831 17:38:47< alink> no, it doesn't yet
20100831 17:39:03< Soliton> ok, then we can just keep that in mind for the future.
20100831 17:39:21< alink> and not sure that if/when it will, that's really something harder or different
20100831 17:39:51< Soliton> i see.
20100831 17:40:29< alink> But I still wish to implement some "drag&draw" mode to trace the path, which should solve these kind of problem (passing by an hex and not the other)
20100831 17:40:40< Soliton> doesn't seem more difficult than out-of-turn planning.
20100831 17:41:08< Soliton> ah yeah, drag&draw would be best indeed.
20100831 17:41:27< alink> well for moves no, but WB it's more ambitious like recruit, fights etc
20100831 17:44:26< alink> anyway, I will recheck that later and let the "waypoint on village=capture" for now. I still need to play with it, but the ability to order a village grabber "go get these 4 villages" seems very handy
20100831 17:45:45< alink> I should restart to work on waypoints anyway, it was on pause for 1.8 release and then WB dev, but it should be improved
20100831 17:48:39< Soliton> yes, it's a very nice improvement.
20100831 17:51:04< CIA-35> fendrin * r46135 /trunk/data/core/macros/utils.cfg: Macro for doing conditional operations on variables.
20100831 17:52:04< CIA-35> fendrin * r46136 /trunk/changelog: Updated the changelog with updates on LoW.
20100831 17:54:17< CIA-35> fendrin * r46137 /trunk/data/campaigns/Dead_Water/maps/ (5 files): DW: Map updates with new terrain types.
20100831 17:54:35< alink> I wanted something like that and it's a simple way (without new hotkey) to get it. However, now that I think more about it, at some point we will need a method to order stops anywhere on the goto path, mainly to use good def% or ambush positions. But it's more UI and pathfinding work.
20100831 17:56:10< alink> and capture will be included in that
20100831 17:57:09< alink> IIRC it was part of the initial plan, but waypoints were added much too close to the feature freeze
20100831 17:58:38-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 149 bugs, 296 feature requests, 13 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20100831 17:59:24< alink> the usual:" oh it's easy, just change few lines and you get the feature", and only later you start to see the subtle interactions with other stuff :-/ 
20100831 18:28:08-!- Greywhind [~Greywhind@harkness-49.resnet.brown.edu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
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20100831 19:24:03< anonymissimus> silene: the MSVC builts do currently crash at the start of a scenario in trunk
20100831 19:24:37< anonymissimus> it was introduced by you in rev 45950 I think
20100831 19:24:58< anonymissimus> backtrace: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com/wTx2DD7J
20100831 19:25:21< silene> anonymissimus: when have you last compiled? it should already been fixed
20100831 19:25:30< anonymissimus> hm ok
20100831 19:25:34< anonymissimus> yesterday
20100831 19:26:46< silene> then it should work now
20100831 19:29:25-!- shadowm_laptop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100831 19:30:31< shadowmaster> AI0867: I have heard of what?
20100831 19:31:21< silene> shadowmaster: of someone getting donations in the name of wesnoth
20100831 19:31:56< shadowmaster> I believe you are assuming that we haven't discussed this in other mediums.
20100831 19:32:51< shadowmaster> of course that's for the project or we'd not have edited a restricted-access page in the first place.
20100831 19:33:14< shadowmaster> AI0867: ^
20100831 19:34:09< Soliton> well, i for one have not seen any discussion. i guess i don't know that secret medium...
20100831 19:34:33< Soliton> (nor why it is secret.)
20100831 19:37:39< silene> neither do i; there hasn't even been an anouncement on the dev ml
20100831 19:38:06< alink> only thing I see is http://www.wesnoth.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=31219
20100831 19:39:12< silene> alink: which says exactly the opposite; there must be some logic deep there ;-)
20100831 19:40:28< alink> yeah, very confusing, this thing should be clarified somewhere. dev-ml, anouncement on forum/mainpage  or something like that
20100831 19:40:55< alink> * somewhere more "official"
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20100831 19:42:04< anonymissimus> silene: works
20100831 19:42:57< Soliton> well, initial discussion could go into #wesnoth-dev-nonpublic, but once a decision is reached a dev-ml announcement could be nice, yeah.
20100831 19:43:17< Soliton> or if further input from everyone is needed/wanted.
20100831 19:43:26< anonymissimus> pressing f5 on mainscreen doesn't work still, is it known ?
20100831 19:43:43< shadowmaster> anonymissimus: yes
20100831 19:43:51< shadowmaster> or so I heard.
20100831 19:44:04< shadowmaster> thank you for reminding me I have been wanting to compile trunk for longer than a week
20100831 19:45:04< shadowmaster> so I can whine and force people to fix stuff for me. And make a few DW related fixes so I don't look like an ungrateful bastard.
20100831 19:49:00< shadowmaster> hm, the Ideas forum is slowly becoming more of a "what features would be nice in UMC" with a few drops of "please make code for <thing> so I can use it in my add-on"
20100831 19:50:38-!- grzywacz [~grzywacz@wesnoth/developer/grzywacz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100831 19:50:53< shadowmaster> sure, it's a nice noise sink, but it's not doing any good to the users community, what with the ever increasing rent-a-modding people and such
20100831 19:51:36< shadowmaster> Gambit: sorry, I just forgot my proto-propsal. Back to ##shadowm I guess.
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20100831 20:11:26< Rhonda> eleazzaar: Send it to me, I did set that up in discussion with Sirp. And actually, the server does cost money, for a start.
20100831 20:11:51< Rhonda> And we have a paypal account to.
20100831 20:12:50< eleazzaar> Rhonda: what size is needed?
20100831 20:13:10< Rhonda> But I agree, reports should be done on how the revenue should be used, if it raises to a certain level. For now it's only meant as a testing period.
20100831 20:13:27< Rhonda> One can't properly "donate" to wesnoth through flattr anyway.
20100831 20:13:35< Rhonda> 120x120
20100831 20:13:56< eleazzaar> BTW i don't see a fattr link on our site
20100831 20:14:13< Rhonda> There is, below the screenshot.
20100831 20:14:26< eleazzaar> ahh
20100831 20:16:11< shadowmaster> the server isn't the only thing we pay for though.
20100831 20:16:13< eleazzaar> Rhonda: .PNG allowed?
20100831 20:16:36< shadowmaster> there's also the art scolarship and grants programs we've have had last year and this year, respectively
20100831 20:17:16< Rhonda> Sure, it is currently, isn't it?
20100831 20:17:26< shadowmaster> I think revenue reports are a requirement for non-profits, at least in the UK which is where I've got my references from (PDPC/freenode)
20100831 20:17:57< shadowmaster> s/^/anyway/
20100831 20:18:01< Rhonda> shadowmaster: Right, and it might make sense to create specific "things" for art and music in parts.
20100831 20:19:48< shadowmaster> it took me a while to remember that "thing" is a Flattr thi- term :)
20100831 20:20:04< eleazzaar> Rhonda: i have the image prepared-- how shall i get it to you?
20100831 20:20:48< Rhonda> Can you put it somewhere http accessible?
20100831 20:21:53< eleazzaar> http://imagebin.org/112166
20100831 20:21:59< eleazzaar> Rhonda: ^
20100831 20:22:37< Soliton> there also seems to be a bigger one here: http://cia.vc/images/db/21/9.png
20100831 20:23:17< Ivanovic> http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/wesnoth/trunk/icons/wesnoth-icon-Mac.png?rev=30533&view=markup
20100831 20:23:21< Ivanovic> why not use the one in svn?
20100831 20:23:23< eleazzaar> mine's specifically 120px
20100831 20:23:46< Ivanovic> ah, okay, specific size restrictions
20100831 20:25:58< Rhonda> eleazzaar: Thanks, exchanged.
20100831 20:26:06< eleazzaar> :)
20100831 20:29:03 * eleazzaar doesn't like to see wesnoth icons look bad in public
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20100831 20:50:40< Rhonda> You are more than right on that, sorry. :)
20100831 20:51:47< Rhonda> eleazzaar: Go to the irclogs of today, 7:36 UTC btw.  ;)
20100831 20:51:48< shadowmaster> it can be made to look even better if our dedicated artist ever finished his Duke Nu- I mean sigil update project
20100831 20:51:56< shadowmaster> finishes
20100831 20:52:05< Rhonda> Oh, btw finishing.
20100831 20:52:22< Rhonda> shadowmaster: Do you think gettext is something for getting into frogatto?
20100831 20:52:38< Rhonda> I would be pleased to offer a German translation in return for the nice fun it gave. :)
20100831 20:53:04< shadowmaster> hm, I remember seeing a talk about it from a portuguese/brazilian translator with Dave some time ago. Not sure if there was any conclusion other than "since we use bitmapped fonts it could become a bit complicated"
20100831 20:53:10< shadowmaster> and "we'll consider it"
20100831 20:53:23-!- mordante [~mordante@wesnoth/developer/mordante] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100831 20:53:35< mordante> servus
20100831 20:53:54< shadowmaster> and I keep forgetting to compile trunk to throw paper airplanes at mordante.
20100831 20:54:57 * mordante ignores shadowmaster 
20100831 20:57:01< shadowmaster> ouch
20100831 20:57:16< shadowmaster> Gambit: sorry, I can't help you in your crusade.
20100831 20:58:00< Gambit> Oh okay.
20100831 20:58:07< Gambit> I'll give your pitchfork to someone else then I guess.
20100831 21:00:02< shadowmaster> Espreon is a good candidate.
20100831 21:00:06< shadowmaster> he should be getting his new box today
20100831 21:00:19< shadowmaster> don't forget the torch.
20100831 21:01:28< anonymissimus> silene: what do the macros in data/gui/default/ do ? is the graphical appearance of e.g. the [message] tag not harcoded but defined there instead ?
20100831 21:03:25< silene> i don't know what they do precisely, but yes, [message] is partly defined there
20100831 21:04:32< shadowmaster> anonymissimus: mainly, although it's much more than just [message]
20100831 21:05:10< shadowmaster> basically anthing designed with the GUI2 framework is defined there. Not all user interface elements have been rewritten and replaced with GUI2 code, but many of them already have.
20100831 21:06:24< shadowmaster> campaigns menu, editor settings, new lobby (oops), language selection, most yes/no/ok/cancel pop-up dialogs, the objectives display, part of the storyscreen code, the titlescreen, some transparent pop-ups, and the server connection/authentication dialogs, both for MP and add-ons
20100831 21:07:23< shadowmaster> I'm probably missing more, but there's also some experimental stuff not enabledf by default unless users pass the --new-widgets cmdline switch, aware that they may stumble upon work-in-progress/unusable functionality, or crashes.
20100831 21:09:27< shadowmaster> hey, Wesnoth compiled quickly this time and my ccache was empty. Maybe switching to Ext4 had something to do.
20100831 21:09:55< shadowmaster> although since I pass -pipe, theoretically there shouldn't be much write overhead with temporary files.
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20100831 21:10:52< shadowmaster> augh, titlescreen regressions *uns away*
20100831 21:11:07-!- shadowm_laptop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100831 21:11:09< fabi> shadowmaster: Our conversation about utbs ended somewhat abruptly last week. Did you have a final thought about it?
20100831 21:11:30< shadowmaster> you contined talking about it even after I said I was leaving.
20100831 21:11:40< fabi> oh sorry
20100831 21:11:55< shadowmaster> I don't have any final thoughts other than allowing you to experiment with this development cycle
20100831 21:13:08< shadowmaster> and then check what's the users opinion. There'll always be They Changed It Now It Sucks guys like in every game or software, but that's life and you can't please everyone
20100831 21:13:55< shadowmaster> I'm getting preliminary death thre- I mean complaints from people who are afraid of me stealing their precious Internet Explo- I mean subsilver2 forum style.
20100831 21:14:34< shadowmaster> and I'm blind to those because it's really improved my user (and moderator) experience since I switched to it myself.
20100831 21:16:59< fabi> shadowmaster: I still use the wesnoth theme. 
20100831 21:18:28< shadowmaster> let me gues, you joined during cycholka's rule when it was the default prior to the Great Crash- ah wait, you joined in 2004. Good, you aren't one of the Interne- I mean, default style users.
20100831 21:19:08< shadowmaster> people who just like IE users, don't know of any alternatives and stick to the defaults, whcih is the only reason IE6 still has some marketshare
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20100831 21:28:02< Espreon|Wii> shadowmaster: I'd be a good candidate for what?
20100831 21:28:47< shadowmaster> nothing in particular.
20100831 21:48:17-!- ancestral [~ancestral@97-116-171-199.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
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20100831 22:21:22< fabi> hi kitty_
20100831 22:21:31< kitty_> hi fabi
20100831 22:22:05< fabi> kitty_: I have seen that you redid some of the LoW portraits to make them fit to the current border standards.
20100831 22:22:27< kitty_> huh? when did I do that? and which ones?
20100831 22:22:48< fabi> kitty_: Cleodil at last.
20100831 22:22:59< fabi> s/last/least
20100831 22:23:11< kitty_> that was last year, wasn't it?
20100831 22:23:34< fabi> Yes. Some time has past since then.
20100831 22:23:56< kitty_> are you still usig the wose (what was his name?) on the black background? if so, it should really go and just use the generic one
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20100831 22:24:42< CIA-35> esr * r46138 /trunk/data/campaigns/Delfadors_Memoirs/ (21 files in 3 dirs): Merge in Kitty's new portraits of Delf and Methor.
20100831 22:24:45< fabi> kitty_: My question is, do you still have high resolution images of the new versions? The story part high resolution images are still the versions that have cut of wings in case of Cleodil.
20100831 22:24:59< kitty_> let me have a look
20100831 22:25:21< fabi> esr: Are we still using the outdated Ur'thurudor portraits in DM?
20100831 22:26:56< kitty_> fabi i only have a version cut at the left edge, this is the biggest version I have of it: http://imagebin.org/112188
20100831 22:27:53< fabi> kitty_: Fine, it is better than the current version. I am going to use this.
20100831 22:28:04< kitty_> :)
20100831 22:29:36< fabi> kitty_: Okay, at least the image is still present in wesnoth's file system tree. I will remove it and see where it was still wired in.
20100831 22:29:52< fabi> kitty_: ^Talking about the wose image.
20100831 22:30:14< kitty_> thanks! that one was just not salvageable for transparent backgrounds...
20100831 22:32:29< fabi> kitty_: Etwas schade. The picture had some fans.
20100831 22:34:57< CIA-35> alink * r46139 /trunk/src/mouse_events.cpp: 
20100831 22:34:57< CIA-35> Fix crash when attacking in fog.
20100831 22:34:57< CIA-35> which was currently only possible with a silver move+attacking from a fogged village.
20100831 22:34:57< CIA-35> Also combined few lines common to GUI1 and GUI2 there
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20100831 22:37:08< CIA-35> fendrin * r46140 /trunk/data/campaigns/Delfadors_Memoirs/ (2 files in 2 dirs): DM 08: Removed the depricated Ur'Thorodor image from the campaign.
20100831 22:37:10< fabi> kitty_: ^
20100831 22:38:29< CIA-35> silene * r46141 /trunk/src/scripting/lua.cpp: Marked [era] as a known scenario tag.
20100831 22:38:42< kitty_> and thanks again :)
20100831 22:39:20-!- PeterPorty [~Pete@pc-218-249-120-200.cm.vtr.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100831 22:41:25< shadowmaster> kitty_: I wonder if you could make a new portrait for Chantal at some point? :P
20100831 22:41:36< kitty_> why?
20100831 22:41:43< shadowmaster> the current one used in DM and HttT:scenario 1 feels weird to me.
20100831 22:42:08< shadowmaster> like if it was quickly sketched or something. There's something odd that sets it apart from the rest
20100831 22:42:14< kitty_> I'll ahve to have a look, I don't really rememeber anymore
20100831 22:42:21< shadowmaster> let me give you a link
20100831 22:42:47< kitty_> ah, i  got her
20100831 22:42:53< fabi> shadowmaster, kitty_: It was just a quick edit on Cleodil, since she is her grandmother.
20100831 22:43:03< shadowmaster> ah, okay (the one with both a druid and shyde variation)
20100831 22:43:29< kitty_> no, not a edit,but orientated after her
20100831 22:44:17< kitty_> and yeah, she isn't among my best. but I'll come back to stuff like her when we have portraits for all generic units plus all camapign characters. and that will be a while.
20100831 22:44:42< shadowmaster> hm, what's missing in the generic units line-up? I forget.
20100831 22:45:03< kitty_> I would desperately love to revise all my early elves. they are so boring and lack detail. but that will have to wait as well :(
20100831 22:46:27< kitty_> shadowmaster: some trolls, high level, drakes, various monsters, high level saurians, serveral skeletons, woses...
20100831 22:46:52< shadowmaster> hm,, I see wraiths in your list.
20100831 22:47:20< fabi> Haldric the second is the only old style portrait left in LoW.
20100831 22:47:37< kitty_> yes, one ghost is still misssing, but someone did lineart for that we will probably able to use
20100831 22:47:39< shadowmaster> I thought wer weren't really going to bother with high-level unit portraits when they weren't different enough from their lower level brethen
20100831 22:48:21< shadowmaster> or that was just a "immediate priorities" thing?
20100831 22:48:21< kitty_> fabi: Lordbob is currently redoing trow, you could ask him for a old haldric....
20100831 22:48:49< shadowmaster> young Haldric II? :P
20100831 22:48:54< shadowmaster> and probably a bit older in Sceptre of FIre
20100831 22:49:21< kitty_> shadowmaster: you are right, not all high level units should get specific portraits, but e.g. all saurians just have two atm, one or two more would be nice for variance and storytelling
20100831 22:49:46< shadowmaster> right.
20100831 22:49:53< kitty_> fabi: do you have a link to the current old haldric portrait?
20100831 22:50:11-!- Appleman1234 [~Appleman1@CPE-60-226-176-19.qld.bigpond.net.au] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100831 22:50:41< shadowmaster> I don't think the Ancient Lich case is really worth it in particular, except for user made content. Most (all?) ancient Liches in mainline campaigns are very particular characters on their own and have custom portraits/placeholders
20100831 22:51:02< shadowmaster> unless there's some Lich-Lord Joe I'm forgetting
20100831 22:51:13< fabi> kitty_: http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/wesnoth/trunk/data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/images/story/characters/haldric-ii.png?rev=30533&view=markup
20100831 22:52:20< shadowmaster> eh, and that Grand Portraits List is really ugly. Why couldn't you guys have edited a single post every time? :(
20100831 22:52:35< kitty_> fabi: uh. that's bad (the blurriness, the background :( )! please get rid of that. whether use no portrait or the young haldric LB just did.
20100831 22:52:38< shadowmaster> and deleted the last post and posted a new one at the end to bump it
20100831 22:53:08< kitty_> shadowmaster: thanks, I thought tsi was taking care of it, since he does most of the portrait commiting...
20100831 22:53:39< shadowmaster> no problem, wbut what did I do?
20100831 22:54:11< shadowmaster> I mean, your post seems to be up to date via TSIs edits, but the organization of the thread is ugly since there are so many old posts preceding the current information
20100831 22:54:55< shadowmaster> and nowadays we could use collapsible blocks ;)
20100831 22:55:20< kitty_> just yes, but since it will be very soon obsolet, I don't see much reason to change things now. neyt time we'll use better management ;)
20100831 22:56:05< shadowmaster> (Collapsible Blocks is a registered trademark by Shadowmaster's BBCode Factory service in some countries including the U.S. and Chile. Ask your lawyer if you think Collapsible Blocks is being misused or its owner misrepresented.)
20100831 22:56:14< fabi> kitty_: I think the rise of wesnoth is telling the story of Haldric the first. Haldric the second is his son iirc.
20100831 22:56:39< shadowmaster> fabi: you are right.
20100831 22:56:40< kitty_> shadowmaster: I don't plan to engage in the ancient lich development for that reason on the one hand and because I don't like the general direction it is heading in. it seems like a lot of energy is flowing into it and rather boring monsters come out of it instead of complex personalities for a complex unit....
20100831 22:56:56< shadowmaster> honorifics such as II and III go with the generations progress
20100831 22:57:07< kitty_> fabi: ah, I missed that, how mucn dialogue does he have?
20100831 22:57:23< shadowmaster> i.e. Haldric the First has Haldric II as his son, the latter has Haldric the III...
20100831 22:58:19< shadowmaster> kitty_: I might be partly guilty of that after mentioning to Valkier something Jetrel considered at some point before giving up on updating the A Lich sprite and moving on to other, more urgent projects.
20100831 22:58:31< shadowmaster> :(
20100831 22:58:58< shadowmaster> but yes, I don't see thatprogressing itno mainline quality material. If LordBob and TSI weren't involved I'd have moved it to Workshop already.
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20100831 22:59:23< fabi> kitty_: He has only one appearance in a story only scenario. But he speaks quite much there. And his appearance is somehow important because that is a historical date, signing the treaty between elves and humans that holds until the fall.
20100831 22:59:28< kitty_> fabi: if Haldric II has more than three lines of dialogue I would be willing to add him to my list of mini projects
20100831 23:00:15< kitty_> ok, then he'll be next after the two brothers and two more for deadwater. 
20100831 23:00:18< shadowmaster> don't forget that Haldric II reappears for some lines in the first SoF scenario
20100831 23:00:58< fabi> kitty_: He has 5 lines in LoW.
20100831 23:01:13< kitty_> But tsi didn't do a portrait of him for SoF?
20100831 23:01:19< shadowmaster> no AFAIK
20100831 23:01:36< kitty_> fabi: then he should probably get done sometime next month
20100831 23:01:40< shadowmaster> at least the one in mainline is the same as the one used in LoW
20100831 23:02:06< CIA-35> mordante * r46142 /trunk/utils/wiki_grabber.py: Deprecate the grid table in the wiki_grabber.
20100831 23:02:10< CIA-35> mordante * r46143 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/addon_list.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:12< CIA-35> mordante * r46144 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/campaign_selection.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:19< shadowmaster> except transparent since he participates in the game field, unlike LoW in which it's just storyscreen lines
20100831 23:02:26< CIA-35> mordante * r46146 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/editor_new_map.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:26< CIA-35> mordante * r46147 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/editor_resize_map.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:26< CIA-35> mordante * r46148 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/editor_settings.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:30< CIA-35> mordante * r46145 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/editor_generate_map.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:30< CIA-35> mordante * r46149 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/formula_debugger.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:31< CIA-35> mordante * r46150 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/game_delete.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:33< CIA-35> mordante * r46151 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/game_load.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:37< CIA-35> mordante * r46152 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/game_save.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:42< CIA-35> mordante * r46153 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/gamestate_inspector.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:45< CIA-35> mordante * r46154 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/language_selection.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:50< CIA-35> mordante * r46155 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/mp_cmd_wrapper.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:02:52< shadowmaster> and mordante had to spam the channel in middle of my exposition :)
20100831 23:03:23< CIA-35> mordante * r46156 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/mp_connect.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:03:29< CIA-35> mordante * r46157 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/mp_method_selection.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:03:30< CIA-35> mordante * r46158 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/mp_connect.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:03:31< CIA-35> mordante * r46159 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/mp_connect.cpp: Convert the wiki comment style.
20100831 23:03:31< CIA-35> mordante * r46160 /trunk/utils/wiki_grabber.py: Remove unused deprecated grid table.
20100831 23:03:33< CIA-35> mordante * r46161 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/mp_cmd_wrapper.cpp: Strip trailing whitespace.
20100831 23:04:12< mordante> shadowmaster, you just had to talk during my commit spree :-P
20100831 23:04:28< shadowmaster> I was talking all the time even before that!
20100831 23:04:30< fabi> shadowmaster, kitty_: Do you know where the art thread for SoF is located?
20100831 23:04:44< shadowmaster> does it even haave one
20100831 23:05:03< shadowmaster> hm, story art
20100831 23:05:43< shadowmaster> http://tinyurl.com/29jwvvq  lists all the art contribs threads involving SoF
20100831 23:05:56< shadowmaster> either the object called "Sceptre of Fire", the campaign, or the HttT scenario.
20100831 23:06:10< mordante> anyway I'm off night
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20100831 23:07:38< shadowmaster> nice, phpBB ignored "of". I wonder if it even makes sense to ignore short/common words anymore.
20100831 23:08:07< fabi> kitty_: Fine, shall I remove the old haldric the second image for the meantime?
20100831 23:08:14< kitty_> yes, please
20100831 23:09:57< shadowmaster> fabi: I didn't realize the LoW copy was upscaled for a storyscreen layout.
20100831 23:10:13 * Soliton wonders how it's helpful to seperate a mass conversion into seperate commits for every file.
20100831 23:11:26< shadowmaster> git commit'ting like that also gets tedious on the author side.
20100831 23:11:53-!- grzywacz [~grzywacz@wesnoth/developer/grzywacz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20100831 23:12:08< fabi> shadowmaster: Yes, the upscaling is making it worse.
20100831 23:12:36< Soliton> i'd hope there is some automatism involved or you'd not even get the idea.
20100831 23:13:08< shadowmaster> fabi: the key term here is "eye bleeding". That's the main symptom of upscaled, blurry images.
20100831 23:13:25< shadowmaster> which is why this awesome yet expensive "vector art" technique exists.
20100831 23:15:47< CIA-35> ivanovic * r46162 /trunk/po/ (wesnoth-manpages/ja.po wesnoth-sof/ja.po): updated Japanese translation
20100831 23:15:49< CIA-35> ivanovic * r46163 /branches/1.8/po/wesnoth-sof/ja.po: updated Japanese translation
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20100831 23:20:25< gabba> bonjour
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20100831 23:28:33< shadowmaster> fabi , Random Espreon Ghost: http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?p=453560#p453560 a chaos unit portrait update
20100831 23:32:29< shadowmaster> hm, why doesn't Google Chrome respect my fontconfig rules :/
20100831 23:33:45< fabi> shadowmaster: nice.
20100831 23:33:46-!- Crab_ [~Crab_@wesnoth/developer/crab] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100831 23:33:52< fabi> hi Crab_
20100831 23:33:58< Crab_> hi, fabi
20100831 23:34:24< fabi> Crab_: LoW is now a 3 chaptered multiplayer campaign.
20100831 23:34:48< Crab_> great.
20100831 23:34:56< Crab_> part 2 is till human alliance ?
20100831 23:36:25-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20100831 23:36:39< fabi> Crab_: Part one is 2 player, from 1 till 7.
20100831 23:36:57< fabi> Crab_: Part tow is 3 player, from 9 till 17
20100831 23:37:14< fabi> Part three is 2 player again, from 19 to end.
20100831 23:37:28< Crab_> ok
20100831 23:37:37< Crab_> that's great
20100831 23:37:48< Crab_> now to make parts 2 and 3 more interesting...
20100831 23:38:14< fabi> Crab_: There is also a problem in handling the start of the later chapters.
20100831 23:38:28< Crab_> which problem ?
20100831 23:38:38< fabi> I can either start them anyway, even if there is no recall list saved.
20100831 23:38:49< Crab_> that's good, as for me
20100831 23:38:55< fabi> But that is hard to handle since I would need to introduce two balancing paths.
20100831 23:39:08-!- StealthyCoin [~StealthyC@hawknet-wireless-gw-ext.cabrillo.edu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20100831 23:39:19< Crab_> fabi: well, you can add dummy units to recall list
20100831 23:39:38< fabi> Crab_: Right, that would be an option.
20100831 23:39:52< Crab_> fabi: e.g., something better than nothing, but worse than a good player would have. and/or lvlup the main characters.
20100831 23:40:25< Crab_> also some would like the extra difficulty, as long as they're not forced to reload too much
20100831 23:40:34< fabi> Crab_: Okay, I will go with that. The solution sounds fine.
20100831 23:41:04< Crab_> one way to handle that is to ask the player at his first turn
20100831 23:41:17< fabi> Crab_: There are still some issues left: There is no option to choose from the difficult levels in the multiplayer lobby.
20100831 23:42:10< Crab_> fabi: this should be fixed or worked around... not just for low, but in general
20100831 23:42:35< fabi> fabi: I am currently just defining HARD if MULTIPLAYER is defined. 
20100831 23:42:51< Crab_> but till it's done, let it be HARD or NORMAL.
20100831 23:43:30< fabi> HARD will be NORMAL or even EASY because you have two players with more gold or even 3 players with even more gold.
20100831 23:44:40< Crab_> but it's harder to reload in MP (takes more time)
20100831 23:44:55< Crab_> so, it balances out
20100831 23:45:31< fabi> Still the current mp lobby just isn't fitting to most multiplayer campaign setups. I need to disallow changing some presets at all, there is no sense in choosing a faction and more.
20100831 23:45:58< Crab_> yes, for LoW
20100831 23:46:34< fabi> It would be better if the player can see what "role" he will play. 
20100831 23:46:35< Crab_> it would make sense for the scenario to control MP lobby interface a bit..
20100831 23:46:46< Crab_> e.g. ask questions, dialogs, etc.
20100831 23:46:50< fabi> Right.
20100831 23:47:06< fabi> I have discussed that at fosdem with boucman.
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20100831 23:51:54< fabi> Crab_: But it seems that most of this things will have to wait for some time. YoggiHH was the last one coded in that area and he is busy with the xp fork.
20100831 23:52:36< Crab_> well, lua can trigger dialogs , afair, thanks to silene
20100831 23:52:59< shadowmaster> just what we needed. an XP fork, when I already occasionally slip and call mainline Wesnoth "Windows"
20100831 23:53:07< Crab_> so, if it's decoupled from the scenario controller and made to work in the lobby...
20100831 23:53:21< shadowmaster> can't wait for the 7 fork.
20100831 23:57:57< CIA-35> zookeeper * r46164 /trunk/data/campaigns/The_Rise_Of_Wesnoth/maps/ (A_Summer_of_Storms.map The_Fall.map): Added some forested hills and beautified the maps of the first two scenarios with new terrains.
20100831 23:58:03< shadowmaster> fabi: er, why mention scenarios that remain unchanged in 1.9.1? :P
20100831 23:58:24< shadowmaster> you also seem to have had your post truncated after "Scenario 7:"
20100831 23:58:37-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 150 bugs, 296 feature requests, 14 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20100831 23:58:51< fabi> shadowmaster: I guess until I finished polishing LoW for 1.9.x every single scenario will have at least one change or bugfix.
20100831 23:59:12< shadowmaster> right.
20100831 23:59:30< fabi> So the "no change" are just placeholders.
--- Log closed Wed Sep 01 00:00:11 2010