--- Log opened Thu Aug 05 02:48:46 2010
20100805 02:48:54-!- lobby [~wesnoth@wesnoth/bot/lobby] has joined #wesnoth-umc-dev
20100805 02:48:54-!- Topic for #wesnoth-umc-dev: <Aethaeryn> Gambit: told you that shad0w only allows off topic if he's part of it | Wesnoth-UMC-Dev Project discussion and support channel | http://wesnoth-umc-dev.ai0867.net | Staff: AI0867, Espreon, shadowmaster | Project @ SF.net: http://tinyurl.com/umcdev | IRC logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org, http://irclogs.ai0867.net
20100805 02:48:54-!- Topic set by shadowmaster [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] [Mon Aug  2 01:28:57 2010]
20100805 02:48:54[Users #wesnoth-umc-dev]
20100805 02:48:54[@ChanServ  ] [ Aethaeryn       ] [ fendrin       ] [ shadowmaster] 
20100805 02:48:54[+CIA-36    ] [ AI0867          ] [ Gambit        ] [ Valkier     ] 
20100805 02:48:54[+shikadibot] [ elvish_sovereign] [ lobby         ] 
20100805 02:48:54[+wesbot    ] [ Espreon         ] [ shadowm_laptop] 
20100805 02:48:54-!- Irssi: #wesnoth-umc-dev: Total of 14 nicks [1 ops, 0 halfops, 3 voices, 10 normal]
20100805 02:48:55-!- Home page for #wesnoth-umc-dev: http://wesnoth-umc-dev.ai0867.net
20100805 02:49:09-!- Channel #wesnoth-umc-dev created Mon Mar 31 16:51:24 2008
20100805 02:49:57< Gambit> lobby: Where are my forums?!
20100805 02:50:05-!- Irssi: Join to #wesnoth-umc-dev was synced in 78 secs
20100805 02:51:18< Gambit> shadowmaster: Hurray.
20100805 02:55:20< Valkier> My hand moved? What?
20100805 02:56:06< Gambit> I did say I'd F anything that moved.
20100805 02:56:14< Gambit> And clearly your fingers moved to type.
20100805 02:56:28< Gambit> Your mom F's anything that moves too!
20100805 02:56:33< Gambit> Ha!... nope not funny
20100805 02:56:36< Valkier> I was taking a gigantic crap at the time actually.
20100805 02:56:49< Valkier> I kind of want to take a picture and send it to you now.
20100805 02:56:50 * Gambit sadness
20100805 02:57:09< Valkier> Also, do they have Sheetz over in your area?
20100805 03:03:10< Gambit> That depends upon your definition of my area,.
20100805 03:07:18< Gambit> shadowmaster: poke
20100805 03:07:22< Gambit> Talk about something exciting.
20100805 03:08:36< shadowmaster> Gambit: I'm busy tracking information that could allow us to fix the source of wesnoth.org's problem
20100805 03:08:45< Gambit> Awesome!
20100805 03:08:47< shadowmaster> since this appears to be a persistent issue
20100805 03:09:09< Gambit> It's all part of some sorta whacked out conspiracy.
20100805 03:10:30< shadowmaster> no
20100805 03:10:53< shadowmaster> it's a technical issue, but I can't disclose further information until I can determine what exactly it is.
20100805 03:11:02< shadowmaster> (besides the obvious out-of-memory condition)
20100805 03:11:09< Gambit> I hate it when people don't get my movie references.
20100805 03:11:18< Valkier> shadowmaster: Not that you're his keeper, but any idea where esr may be?
20100805 03:12:33< shadowmaster> he's busy for a tabletop games torunament or something IIRC
20100805 03:12:33< shadowmaster> tournament
20100805 03:13:28< shadowmaster> 10:26:38 <esr> Hello all. I'm about to sign off; availability will be spotty until Sunday, as I'll be at World Boardgaming Championships
20100805 03:13:34< shadowmaster> Valkier: ^
20100805 03:13:58< shadowmaster> not sure when he said that
20100805 03:14:03< shadowmaster> ...let me look
20100805 03:14:26 * Espreon is disappoint...
20100805 03:14:32< Gambit> Could be worse.
20100805 03:14:35< Espreon> I saw the following on a menu:
20100805 03:14:36< Gambit> He could be LARPing
20100805 03:14:43< Espreon> "Nachos Grande"
20100805 03:14:50< Espreon> "Pizza Italiano"
20100805 03:14:54< Espreon> Sigh...
20100805 03:14:56< Gambit> Oh you're not disappointed that ESR plays tabletop tourneys?
20100805 03:15:09< Espreon> IDK.
20100805 03:15:18< Espreon> As long as he's not LARPing, 'tis fine.
20100805 03:15:18< shadowmaster> Valkier: he said that yesterday
20100805 03:15:28< shadowmaster> wow, the scrollback is long.
20100805 03:15:35< shadowmaster> I didn't think so much stuff happened in this channel.
20100805 03:16:06< Gambit> I'z in yer baklog.
20100805 03:16:12< Gambit> Makin it biggur.
20100805 03:16:32< Espreon> shadowmaster: Why do businesses try to be cool and then fail miserably?
20100805 03:16:49< shadowmaster> 155 mb
20100805 03:16:57< shadowmaster> wrong channel.
20100805 03:17:27< Gambit> Because by the time you get out of the twisted education that leads to a career in marketing you've forgotten what it was like to be a human being.
20100805 03:17:29< Gambit> Espreon: ^
20100805 03:18:08< Espreon> I see...
20100805 03:18:42< Espreon> But... "Pizza Italiano"... seriously...
20100805 03:19:13< shadowmaster> I think I've just pinpointed the source of the issue and I've contacted the relevant coder to take a look at it.
20100805 03:19:23< Gambit> Espreon: Well there is Hawaian Pizza
20100805 03:20:00< Espreon> Gambit: Do you realize what the problem is?
20100805 03:20:08< Gambit> So Pizza Italiano is thier way of saying "We don't serve fruit here mofuckas! Pepperoni and cheese!"
20100805 03:20:14< Gambit> *their
20100805 03:20:20< shadowmaster> of course I'm talking about Wesnoth.org's recent tendency to go OOM
20100805 03:20:32< Espreon> Gambit: No, seriously.
20100805 03:20:43< shadowmaster> which is far more serious than your language shit
20100805 03:21:15< Espreon> But shadowmaster...
20100805 03:21:17< shadowmaster> what, I save the day and nobody notices it ?
20100805 03:21:34< Espreon> I just got back.
20100805 03:21:42< shadowmaster> and yes, I am the one who managed to get the server back, somewhat.
20100805 03:21:51< Gambit> shadowmaster: You should sign it next time.
20100805 03:22:01< shadowmaster> i.e. I'm the one who contacted someone to contact upstream to reboot w.o
20100805 03:22:11< Gambit> shadowmaster: You know how Spiderman wraps up all the bad guys he catches and hangs 'em from a lamp post?
20100805 03:22:20< Gambit> shadowmaster: Or how Superman flies them to jail himself?
20100805 03:22:21< shadowmaster> I've never liked Spiderman.
20100805 03:22:33< shadowmaster> he looks like a pussy emo kid
20100805 03:22:40< Gambit> shadowmaster: Or how Zoro cuts a Z into their shirt
20100805 03:22:44< Gambit> shadowmaster: et cetera
20100805 03:22:47< shadowmaster> you mean Zorro
20100805 03:22:55< Gambit> shadowmaster: You need a calling card that says I WAS HERE AND I FIXED THIS!
20100805 03:23:05< shadowmaster> UPTIME
20100805 03:23:06< Gambit> shadowmaster: Because you just want the attention ;)
20100805 03:23:16< Gambit> [insert shadowmaster's hurtful quote here]
20100805 03:23:33< Gambit> also
20100805 03:23:36< Gambit> People we have a...
20100805 03:23:40< Gambit> SCRUBS REFERENCE!
20100805 03:23:46< Gambit> shadowmaster: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rRBq-6lVxzU
20100805 03:25:00< shadowmaster> I'm unpacking my external HDD
20100805 03:25:34< Gambit> shadowmaster: Watch the video, and do exactly what he did. :)
20100805 03:25:41< shadowmaster> no
20100805 03:27:18< shadowmaster> People, we have...a HARD DISK DRIVE!
20100805 03:27:20< Gambit> shadowmaster: Well that doesn't help at all
20100805 03:27:28< Gambit> shadowmaster: Watch the video XOR do exactly what he did. :)
20100805 03:27:46< shadowmaster> shouldn't that be inclusive or?
20100805 03:27:48< Valkier> So any idea when the site will be back up?
20100805 03:27:53< Valkier> Was hoping to post things tonight.
20100805 03:27:59< shadowmaster> Valkier: it is back up.
20100805 03:28:02< Gambit> shadowmaster: Well I'm trying to figure out which you said no to.
20100805 03:28:07< shadowmaster> since a while ago.
20100805 03:28:16< Gambit> saying no to an AND is like saying yes to an OR.
20100805 03:28:21< shadowmaster> Valkier: so hurry up in case it goes down again while I figure out how to solve the problem
20100805 03:28:45< Valkier> I wasn't going to do it right now. Just meant later tonight.
20100805 03:28:51< shadowmaster> k
20100805 03:29:14< Gambit> Though I guess yes or no to a XOR is also quite unhelpful...
20100805 03:29:20< Gambit> shadowmaster: Watch the video? :)
20100805 03:29:21< shadowmaster> it may depend a bit on luck since we seem to have a faulty program with a memory leak
20100805 03:29:32< shadowmaster> but hopefully it won't happen again very soon
20100805 03:29:36< Valkier> kk
20100805 03:30:02-!- PetePorty [~Pete@pc-235-252-120-200.cm.vtr.net] has joined #wesnoth-umc-dev
20100805 03:31:04< shadowmaster> the hard disk is out of the box
20100805 03:31:27 * shadowmaster smells it
20100805 03:32:30< shadowmaster> I guess I'll format it with XFS
20100805 03:34:03< shadowmaster> argh.
20100805 03:34:16< shadowmaster> power supply doesn't include an adapter for our outlets
20100805 03:34:32< shadowmaster> okay, I can steal greycore's
20100805 03:34:49< Gambit> I love that monkey picture.
20100805 03:34:56< Gambit> http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?p=447462#p447462
20100805 03:36:01< shadowmaster> Gambit: uhhh...
20100805 03:36:04< shadowmaster> don't tell Espreon but,
20100805 03:36:06< shadowmaster> http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VisualPun
20100805 03:36:23< Gambit> Don't tell Espreon what and why?
20100805 03:36:39< shadowmaster> http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/VisualPun
20100805 03:36:49< shadowmaster> because he hates TV Tropes for no particular reason at all
20100805 03:36:53< Gambit> Oh okay.
20100805 03:36:53< shadowmaster> probably for the "lulz"
20100805 03:37:06< shadowmaster> however, that trope is relevant
20100805 03:37:09< Gambit> shadowmaster: He's just angry because you banished his true interests from the channel.
20100805 03:37:11< shadowmaster> for your pic
20100805 03:37:15< Espreon> shadowmaster: No, it just doesn't amuse me.
20100805 03:37:28< shadowmaster> Espreon: who said that it needed to amuse anyone?
20100805 03:37:32< Gambit> shadowmaster: Just look at all that bottled up anger!
20100805 03:37:38< shadowmaster> wikipedia isn't there to entertain people either.
20100805 03:37:46< Espreon> Well, it entertains me.
20100805 03:37:46< Gambit> The strong words like "doesn't" and "amuse".
20100805 03:38:05< shadowmaster> Espreon: whatever. You suck.
20100805 03:38:11< shadowmaster> not really
20100805 03:38:15< Espreon> Yeah, that's nice.
20100805 03:38:36< shadowmaster> Gambit: doesn't doesn't sound strong to me
20100805 03:38:41< Gambit> On the other hand; your mo...
20100805 03:39:29< Gambit> shadowmaster: It's part of my "Act like you're stating the obvious when you're really just bs'ing" humor.
20100805 03:39:41< Gambit> Usual tells: fake psychology
20100805 03:39:54< shadowmaster> you broke my mind
20100805 03:40:02< shadowmaster> I'll sue you unless you fix it
20100805 03:40:41 * shadowmaster moves to blackcore's place
20100805 03:42:26-!- shadowm_laptop is now known as shadowm_battery
20100805 04:02:33-!- Gambit is now known as SolitaryMan
20100805 04:03:26< SolitaryMan> shadowmaster: How does lobby tell if you're voiced or not?
20100805 04:03:51< SolitaryMan> shadowmaster: It uses the names list and then maintains that list when people join and what not?
20100805 04:03:58< SolitaryMan> Or does it just have a seperate verification list?
20100805 04:04:49< SolitaryMan> Yeah the raw IRC gives no indication.
20100805 04:06:17< shadowm_battery> ?
20100805 04:06:22-!- shadowm_battery is now known as shadowm_AC
20100805 04:06:25-!- shadowm_AC is now known as shadowm_laptop
20100805 04:06:42< shadowm_laptop> what are you talking about?
20100805 04:06:46< SolitaryMan> shadowmaster: Lobby passes messages from voiced users to the lobby
20100805 04:06:50< SolitaryMan> But how does it know?
20100805 04:06:58< shadowmaster> by checking the message prefix
20100805 04:07:08< shadowmaster>  +  @   etc
20100805 04:07:10< shadowmaster> I guess
20100805 04:07:15< shadowmaster> I haven't seen lobby's sources
20100805 04:07:32< shadowmaster> Primary connections complete
20100805 04:08:27< SolitaryMan> :SolitaryMan!~Gambit@unaffiliated/gambit PRIVMSG #wesnoth-xp :janebot: test?
20100805 04:08:34< SolitaryMan> ^the raw IRC gives no indication
20100805 04:09:19< SolitaryMan> Oh... it's an issri addon isn't it?
20100805 04:09:29< SolitaryMan> Or some other such lame thing.
20100805 04:09:30< shadowmaster> hard disk plates are go
20100805 04:09:52< shadowmaster> SolitaryMan: yes, it appears to be an irssi plugin
20100805 04:10:00< shadowmaster> irssi caches mode changes
20100805 04:10:20< shadowmaster> and syncs to /who lists when joining channels
20100805 04:10:36< shadowmaster> the /names list also provides the prefixes IIRC
20100805 04:11:18< shadowmaster> the hard disk appears to work properly
20100805 04:11:25-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-4-146-0.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #wesnoth-umc-dev
20100805 04:11:31< shadowmaster> sd 35:0:0:0: Attached scsi generic sg5 type 0
20100805 04:11:31< shadowmaster> sd 35:0:0:0: [sdd] 3905656832 512-byte logical blocks: (1.99 TB/1.81 TiB)
20100805 04:11:35< SolitaryMan> "Let's back up the entire system just to be sure."
20100805 04:12:25< shadowmaster> sd 35:0:0:0: [sdd] Attached SCSI disk
20100805 04:12:32< shadowmaster> okay, let's see
20100805 04:14:00< shadowmaster> an embedded (probably flash-based) drive that emulates a CD-ROM
20100805 04:14:26< shadowmaster> and the proper hard disk is formatted with NTFS
20100805 04:14:40< shadowmaster> for some reason it has a Windows system restore dir on it
20100805 04:15:02< shadowmaster> I guess they couldn't be bothered to use a separate mechanism to format these. No, they use Windows for that.
20100805 04:15:20< shadowmaster> back in the day hard disks would be formatted using FDISK.EXE/FORMAT.COM
20100805 04:15:45< SolitaryMan> Real Men™
20100805 04:16:56< shadowmaster> I'll leave it idle for some minutes just to make sure it doesn't go bonkers and self-destruct like the internal SATA one I also bought from this manufacturer.
20100805 04:17:07< shadowmaster> (Western Digital)
20100805 04:17:28< shadowmaster> meanwhile I'll ponder whether to use Ext3, Ext4 or XFS.
20100805 04:17:37< SolitaryMan> Mine too! We have so much in common. Blagh
20100805 04:17:46< SolitaryMan> shadowmaster: Is yours slow as... something that's... really slow?
20100805 04:17:49< shadowmaster> Ext4 isn't supported by the currently installed OSes on blackcore though, so that might be out of the question.
20100805 04:18:07< shadowmaster> SolitaryMan: laptop's internal HDD (hitachi IIRC) or the new external HDD?
20100805 04:18:15< SolitaryMan> External
20100805 04:18:31< SolitaryMan> If I stop using it for a while then it seems to go into some sort of standby state.
20100805 04:19:01< shadowmaster> probably to save power
20100805 04:19:07< SolitaryMan> Also there appears to be a hidden directory named $RECYCLE.BIN
20100805 04:19:15< shadowmaster> that's windows crap
20100805 04:19:16< SolitaryMan> Never noticed that before...
20100805 04:19:29< shadowmaster> windows likes to have the recycle bin on every volume by default
20100805 04:19:44< shadowmaster> to allow "deleting" files on removable media, etc. non-permanently
20100805 04:20:13< shadowmaster> Unix desktop environments following some specification also have trash bins but seriously, I never delete anything nowadays
20100805 04:20:21< shadowmaster> and when I want to delete it, I want to delete it completely
20100805 04:20:42< shadowmaster> so the trash bin / recycle bin are just decoration on my Linux and Windows installations
20100805 04:21:40< shadowmaster> Aug  4 22:14:15 bluecore hald: mounted /dev/sdd1 on behalf of uid 1000
20100805 04:21:42< shadowmaster> heh
20100805 04:26:34-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-4-146-0.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Blueblaze]
20100805 04:34:48< Valkier> My 5 shots of vodka and my three shots of espresso are having a battle to the death.
20100805 04:34:51< Valkier> Any takers?
20100805 04:35:33< shadowmaster> SolitaryMan: I like you better as Gambit.
20100805 04:35:37 * shadowmaster *wink*
20100805 04:35:44< SolitaryMan> :\/
20100805 04:35:57< SolitaryMan> I got my hands on the new "The Old Republic" book.
20100805 04:36:32< SolitaryMan> A book based on a currently-unreleased, expected to be crappy video game, based on another video game that was good, based on a series of books, based on a series of good movies
20100805 04:37:20< SolitaryMan> However considering that "Force Unleashed" (the video game) was total crap and the "Force Unleashed" book (by the same author) was really really good; I'm optimistic.
20100805 04:37:24-!- SolitaryMan is now known as Gambit
20100805 04:38:44< Gambit> Do I expect it to beat The Legacy Era arc? No. But it should be at least as good as the total shite that is the Clone Wars.
20100805 04:39:35< Gambit> Also, if anyone cares, the worst Star Wars book to date was Revenge of the Sith.
20100805 04:42:52< shadowmaster> "ReiserFS v3 images should not be stored on a ReiserFS v3 partition (e.g. backups or disk images for emulators) without transforming them (e.g., by compressing or encrypting) in order to avoid confusing the rebuild."
20100805 04:42:56< shadowmaster> LOL?
20100805 04:43:05< shadowmaster> what the hell, you fucking murderer...
20100805 04:43:13< shadowmaster> ( http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hans_Reiser )
20100805 04:47:59< shadowmaster> okay, I'll go with ext4
20100805 04:50:25< shadowmaster> Gambit: yes, it seems to park the disk after a while of inactivity
20100805 04:50:32< shadowmaster> or something.
20100805 04:50:39< Gambit> sucks
20100805 04:51:25< shadowmaster> still doesn't explain why the internal one crashed itself, since it didn't stop spinning for all those 15 minutes, so i'll rely on the PSU theory for that one
20100805 04:51:52< shadowmaster> DIE NTFS PARTITION!
20100805 04:53:14-!- Espreon|Wii [47af4857@wesnoth/developer/espreon] has joined #wesnoth-umc-dev
20100805 04:53:42< Espreon|Wii> DAMN IT! My screen/graphics card was fried!
20100805 04:54:12< Espreon|Wii> KMS+Gallium? NO THANKS! Maybe in five years!
20100805 04:54:28< shadowmaster> making multiterabyte filesystems is slo-
20100805 04:54:31< shadowmaster> Espreon: WHAT?
20100805 04:54:38< shadowmaster> Espreon: how? what?
20100805 04:54:40< shadowmaster> the symptoms?
20100805 04:54:56< shadowmaster> are you sure it isn't working?
20100805 04:55:10< shadowmaster> I let mine cool down when that happened and it was working normally afterwards
20100805 04:55:44< Espreon|Wii> I was testing the Milgram fight... then... things froze. I switched view to another terminal; everything looked slightly weird. I rebooted, and the BIOS splash thingy was grainy, so I turned it off... and when I turned it on... NOTHING!
20100805 04:56:19< shadowmaster> Espreon: okay, try waiting some minutes.
20100805 04:56:25< shadowmaster> hopefully it'll help you like in my case
20100805 04:56:49< shadowmaster> .... :/   I guess I'll stick to my current UMS configuration.
20100805 04:57:26< Espreon|Wii> If something did fry, I hope that the graphics card did... so that I can have it replaced with a real card... an nVidia card!
20100805 04:58:08< shadowmaster> :(
20100805 04:58:37< shadowmaster> it might be that something screws up with the firmware upload.
20100805 04:58:49< shadowmaster> generally faulty firmware can easily destroy hardware
20100805 04:59:09< Espreon|Wii> Firmware upload? WHAT!
20100805 04:59:33< shadowmaster> the KMS stack needs to replace the online firmware for some reason AFAIK
20100805 04:59:53< shadowmaster> and in particular, bad EDID data can kill display devices according to the radeon DDX man page
20100805 05:00:14< Espreon|Wii> ... blargh...
20100805 05:00:17< shadowmaster> (that's not relate to firmware, but since the KMS stack is new and has to deal with the EDID data itself...)
20100805 05:00:53< Espreon|Wii> Well, hopefully, I can get an nVidia card installed...
20100805 05:01:32< Espreon|Wii> But, how would I get Windows XP to work... with the new card and all?
20100805 05:01:55< shadowmaster> top
20100805 05:02:15< shadowmaster> oops.
20100805 05:03:09< Espreon|Wii> If the card did survive and is just being stupid right now... fuck KMS... Maybe I'll try it again in five years.
20100805 05:03:18< shadowmaster> by the way, SSHing into wesnoth.org and keeping a top process running on the current tty allows me to force this USB modem's network technology selection/bandwidth throttling
20100805 05:03:30< shadowmaster> i.e. no more SSH lags on my IRC session.
20100805 05:03:33< shadowmaster> damn ISP.
20100805 05:04:35< Espreon|Wii> shadowmaster: Why do things have to break for us?
20100805 05:05:15< shadowmaster> because ATI sucks?
20100805 05:05:53< Espreon|Wii> Not just our graphics cards...
20100805 05:05:55< shadowmaster> I've only heard good things about KMS support for some Intel GPUs...which of course aren't on par with ATIs or NVIDIAs and are mostly intended for embedded or low-class systems
20100805 05:06:19< shadowmaster> I'm googling more about KMS but I can't seem to find any breakage stories :/
20100805 05:07:03< Espreon|Wii> Maybe I should start blogging... so that my story can be heard...
20100805 05:07:12< shadowmaster> Espreon|Wii: so I'd like you to confirm this as soon as you let that shit cool down
20100805 05:07:21< shadowmaster> I might write a follow-up on this.
20100805 05:07:36< Espreon|Wii> Oh?
20100805 05:07:36< shadowmaster> if you can remember your exact chipset/model, better yet
20100805 05:08:12< shadowmaster> my wonderland story is the 3rd google result for "kernel modesetting damage"
20100805 05:08:31< shadowmaster> unfortunately the rest are related to the X damage protocol extension
20100805 05:12:08< shadowmaster> nope. nothing.
20100805 05:12:20< shadowmaster> I can't find any stories similar to ours.
20100805 05:13:51< shadowmaster> dammit, why is mkfs.ext4 so slow?
20100805 05:14:02< shadowmaster> I know its writing over nine thousand inode tables, but...
20100805 05:14:19< shadowmaster> 21 minutes of running time seems excessive
20100805 05:14:56< shadowmaster> ah
20100805 05:14:59< shadowmaster> now creating journal
20100805 05:15:03< Espreon|Wii> shadowmaster: Well, if you were curious, my card is the Mobility Radeon x1400.
20100805 05:15:06< shadowmaster> (32768 blocks)
20100805 05:15:08< shadowmaster> just great
20100805 05:15:26< shadowmaster> Espreon|Wii: I assume that's a PCIexpress thing?
20100805 05:15:43< Espreon|Wii> I have no idea.
20100805 05:15:52< shadowmaster> yeah, it is
20100805 05:15:55< shadowmaster> according to AMD's website
20100805 05:16:56< shadowmaster> boy e2fsck really consumes a lot of CPU time
20100805 05:17:00< shadowmaster> 99%
20100805 05:17:30< shadowmaster> now I know I don't want to have it fscked very ften
20100805 05:17:46< shadowmaster> considering it already takes ages for my 100 GB homefs... /
20100805 05:18:06< shadowmaster> and I wonder what's the clicking I hear
20100805 05:18:21< shadowmaster> ah.
20100805 05:18:27< shadowmaster> the thing reporting that it's parked or something
20100805 05:22:49< Espreon|Wii> shadowmaster: OK, it probably fried. I was using radeon, mesa, and libdrm HEAD as of thirty/forty/fifty minutes ago. I was using Xorg 1.8.2... Linux 2.6.35... Gallium enabled... for both r300 shit and the software renderer... and the tradgedy began halfway through the cutscene that takes place before the Milgram fight. I was using Frogatto head as of about thirty/forty minutes ago.
20100805 05:23:08< shadowmaster> fuck AMD.
20100805 05:23:16< shadowmaster> they don't provide the chipset model in their specs page
20100805 05:23:22< shadowmaster> I'll have to do further research.
20100805 05:23:49< shadowmaster> Espreon|Wii: so, now when you turn on the laptop the screen just doesn't turn on? not even the backlight?
20100805 05:24:13< Espreon|Wii> Although it won't probably help, my laptop is a Dell Inspiron e1705.
20100805 05:24:27< Espreon|Wii> Not even the backlight.
20100805 05:25:07< shadowmaster> and does the rest of the laptop display activity? (i.e. HDD LED, maybe system beeping if your BIOS software does that...)
20100805 05:25:45< shadowmaster> also, define "weird" when you switched to a text vt
20100805 05:26:06< Espreon|Wii> Linux still actually boots, though. I can tell due to the activity light and the activation of the WiFi light... the timing and all. I don't think that X was working, because when I tried to log in, nothing happened.
20100805 05:26:36< shadowmaster> :/
20100805 05:26:42< shadowmaster> okay, then it might be the screen
20100805 05:26:43-!- Gambit [~Gambit@unaffiliated/gambit] has quit [Quit: insanity]
20100805 05:26:47< Espreon|Wii> There were some vertical lines... and the colors looked a bit washed out.
20100805 05:26:59< shadowmaster> Espreon|Wii: woo, they were horizontal for me.
20100805 05:27:10< Aethaeryn> I got Gambit to quit.
20100805 05:27:15< Aethaeryn> <_<
20100805 05:27:16< Aethaeryn> >_>
20100805 05:27:19< shadowmaster> and the colors were increasingly bright. And no, I couldn't switch VTs because the OS also locked up
20100805 05:27:35< shadowmaster> I'm not sure the laptop would want to boot if the GPU was fried.
20100805 05:27:41< shadowmaster> Espreon|Wii: so it could be just the display.
20100805 05:27:55< Espreon|Wii> Damn it!
20100805 05:28:09< shadowmaster> although I'm not sure that if the display gets fried the backlight will not turn on...
20100805 05:28:22< shadowmaster> hard to say really, since I haven't fried any displays so far.
20100805 05:28:24< shadowmaster> well, almost.
20100805 05:28:34< shadowmaster> I still remember the fast blinking at the GNU GRUB menu
20100805 05:28:35-!- PetePorty [~Pete@pc-235-252-120-200.cm.vtr.net] has quit [Quit: Saliendo]
20100805 05:29:08< shadowmaster> but since it got better after cooling down, in my case it could really have been the display
20100805 05:29:41< shadowmaster> maybe the KMS code at the kernel crashes jumping into the wrong code segment and that could cause bogus parameters to be set for the display.
20100805 05:30:03< shadowmaster> and if the display isn't turned off ASAP, it dies.
20100805 05:30:10< shadowmaster> :/
20100805 05:30:36< shadowmaster> it could also have helped that in my case I did the following:
20100805 05:30:49< shadowmaster> * noticed that the screen was going brighter and brighter and brighter
20100805 05:30:58< shadowmaster> * closed the lid.
20100805 05:31:24< shadowmaster> * removed the AC adapter plug at the laptop's side and pulled the battery off its bay to force shutting down everything
20100805 05:31:54< shadowmaster> by closing the lid I forced the screen to shutdown regardless of what the GPU might have been trying to do with it
20100805 05:32:40< shadowmaster> Espreon|Wii: so yes, it's very likely that the screen got fried rather than the GPU.
20100805 05:32:43< shadowmaster> :/
20100805 05:34:11< Espreon|Wii> I guess that I shouldn't have ran "sudo reboot".... I should have just held the power button...
20100805 05:35:30< Espreon|Wii> This sucks... it was just the screen... Why couldn't it have been the shitty GPU?
20100805 05:37:06< Espreon|Wii> shadowmaster: What is to be done? We can't have this bomb lingering in... whatever.
20100805 05:38:04< shadowmaster> I'm asking in #radeon anyway
20100805 05:38:19< shadowmaster> but I'll later publish a blog story and hope Google blesses me.
20100805 05:39:32< Espreon|Wii> shadowmaster: Thank you so much!
20100805 05:39:44< shadowmaster> for now, snack
20100805 05:40:54< Espreon|Wii> Now, what the hell will I do? I wanted to finalize the redesign of the Quenoth elves with zookeeper... but... .... blargh...
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20100805 05:46:39< Espreon|Wii> shadowmaster: When zookeeper comes on, would you please tell him to just look at the plans for the Quenoth elves, Mr. Müller's new ToD schedule, and so forth, think about them, see if there's anything wrong with them, and generate ideas. Of course, tell him about... THIS.
20100805 05:47:08< Espreon|Wii> I especially want that ToD schedule judged, so that we can determine what is to be done with it...
20100805 05:47:46< shadowmaster> ok
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20100805 05:47:58< shadowmaster> good luck :(
20100805 05:48:05< Espreon|Wii> Thanks.
20100805 05:48:53< Espreon|Wii> shadowmaster: And of course, no replies in #radeon yet, right?
20100805 05:49:31-!- StandYourGround [~Adium@adsl-69-155-132-19.dsl.hstntx.swbell.net] has left #wesnoth-umc-dev []
20100805 05:51:10< Espreon|Wii> shadowmaster: BTW, with the BIOS splash looking weird, it looked like parts of the splash were raining. So, there's a little description... yeahz...
20100805 05:53:32-!- un214 [~quassel@adsl-75-45-13-122.dsl.scrm01.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20100805 05:55:23< shadowmaster> Espreon|Wii: yes, there was a reply, but the person isn't a dev AFAIK
20100805 05:56:00< Espreon|Wii> Just the typical "OMFG!" reply?
20100805 05:56:04< shadowmaster> Espreon|Wii: no
20100805 05:56:09< shadowmaster> long paste beigns
20100805 05:56:11< shadowmaster> begins
20100805 05:56:26< shadowmaster> 23:33:37 <shadowmaster> out of curiosity, is there any possibility for bugs in the KMS code to cause hardware damage on a laptop's screen or GPU?
20100805 05:56:30< shadowmaster> 23:34:03 <AstralStorm> laptop's? impossible
20100805 05:56:32< shadowmaster> 23:34:13 <AstralStorm> GPU, possible if it's power management and it overclocks it
20100805 05:56:35< shadowmaster> 23:34:41 <shadowmaster> okay, because a friend of mine just got his damaged and while the laptop works, he says the screen or backlight won't turn on again.
20100805 05:56:39< shadowmaster> 23:35:05 <shadowmaster> and that reminded me of a similar experience I had with mine while testing KMS, except I removed the battery and power adapter  quickly and let it cool down
20100805 05:56:44< shadowmaster> 23:35:21 <AstralStorm> oh, yes, it could overheat
20100805 05:56:46< shadowmaster> 23:35:30 -!- mattst88 [~mattst88@208-104-165-241.rhhe1.2wcm.comporium.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20100805 05:56:49< shadowmaster> 23:35:34 <AstralStorm> but that'd mean laptop cooling is broken
20100805 05:56:52< shadowmaster> 23:35:50 <AstralStorm> see, the driver does put the card in the highest clock mode by default
20100805 05:56:55< shadowmaster> 23:35:54 <AstralStorm> on AC, at least
20100805 05:56:58< shadowmaster> 23:36:26 <AstralStorm> although I bet it'd break in any serious gaming on windows
20100805 05:57:02< shadowmaster> 23:36:37 <AstralStorm> unless there were some driver hacks involved...
20100805 05:57:04< shadowmaster> 23:36:44 <AstralStorm> (see previous point about power management)
20100805 05:57:06< shadowmaster> 23:37:01 <shadowmaster> hm, in my case the fan didn't go faster or temperature increase as far as I could feel.
20100805 05:57:09< shadowmaster> 23:37:16 -!- mattst88 [~mattst88@208-104-165-241.rhhe1.2wcm.comporium.net] has joined #radeon
20100805 05:57:13< shadowmaster> 23:37:25 <shadowmaster> although after turning off the laptop and on again the BIOS splash and GRUB's menu were...flickering.
20100805 05:57:17< shadowmaster> 23:37:54 <shadowmaster> then I let it cool down (?) for a longer while and things went to normal, but in my friend's case he didn't try that.
20100805 05:57:20< shadowmaster> long paste ends
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20100805 05:58:43 * shadowmaster goes to write the article
20100805 05:59:00< Espreon|Wii> Thanks.
20100805 05:59:48< Espreon|Wii> If we get this fixed, I'm having the modem taken out... to increase ventilation... The ethernet card's probably going too... I don't think it even works anymore...
20100805 06:00:24< Espreon|Wii> TV card? Bye bye!
20100805 06:00:42< shadowmaster> unless you felt your laptop getting hotter
20100805 06:01:09< shadowmaster> I don't think that'd be the issue
20100805 06:01:24< shadowmaster> at least mine didn't go hotter than usual
20100805 06:01:40< shadowmaster> damn this cat wants to steal my dessert
20100805 06:01:47< Espreon|Wii> Well, this thing can get hot very easily. So... I've resorted to using it on a wooden table at all times...
20100805 06:02:01< shadowmaster> and I've got to protect both the external HDD power and data wires, and the USB modem
20100805 06:02:04< shadowmaster> from him
20100805 06:02:22< shadowmaster> Espreon|Wii: uh, I resorted to laying it on a DICTIONARY.
20100805 06:02:38< shadowmaster> which allows the tiny ventilation area to be unobstructed
20100805 06:02:56< Espreon|Wii> Great, now there's a fly in my room!
20100805 06:03:13< shadowmaster> the dictionary in question is my first big (i.e. not a pocket edition) English dictionary, which I got when 6 years old
20100805 06:03:37< Espreon|Wii> Oh shit, I think it's actually a wasp.
20100805 06:03:38< shadowmaster> it's falling down to pieces, but I still keep it since it's got a special place in my heart.
20100805 06:04:17< Espreon|Wii> Nah...
20100805 06:04:58< Espreon|Wii> Regardless, I'm turning on all of the lights in my room and hope that the fly roasts itself...
20100805 06:06:09< shadowmaster> Debian Squeeze will ship with Radeon KMS by default :/
20100805 06:06:14< shadowmaster> what the crap?
20100805 06:06:17< Espreon|Wii> Oh no, there are two!
20100805 06:06:23< shadowmaster> where's the non-free firmware controversy?
20100805 06:06:33< shadowmaster> the UMS driver didn't require external non-free firmware.
20100805 06:06:39< shadowmaster> what the hell Debian? :/
20100805 06:06:59< Espreon|Wii> Maybe my story will spook them.
20100805 06:07:28< shadowmaster> it's unfortunate that this kind of bug is expensive to reproduce
20100805 06:07:40< shadowmaster> (i.e. you need to buy new guinea pigs after every test)
20100805 06:08:27< shadowmaster> maybe HP and AMD could team up and donate AMD-powered HP laptops with ATI Radeons to the relevant Linux developers? ;)
20100805 06:09:08< Espreon|Wii> Heh, yeah...
20100805 06:12:04< Espreon|Wii> I seriously hope that the GPU was fried... because I want nVidia... Once I get nVidia, I won't have to worry about this type of shit for a while...
20100805 06:14:27< Espreon|Wii> While I get this fixed, why don't I actually get the fans replaced? YEAH! That and have all that shit I don't even use removed! Things need to be adequately cooled!
20100805 06:14:45< Espreon|Wii> ... this sucks, man!
20100805 06:19:02< Valkier> I made a portrait of Espreon, for those interested. http://forums.wesnoth.org/download/file.php?id=44011
20100805 06:19:22< Valkier> It is only coincidental that is bares a resemblance to Stalrag.
20100805 06:20:09< Espreon|Wii> No... it has to look moar like Yog-Sothoth... or Cthulhu...
20100805 06:21:47< Valkier> Why are you on your Wii again?
20100805 06:22:12< Espreon|Wii> Valkier: Either my laptop's screen or my GPU was fried.
20100805 06:22:53< Valkier> Well if your GPU was friend I doubt it would turn on at all.
20100805 06:23:05< Espreon|Wii> Valkier: Also, I have dark brown hair... And yes, it needs to look moar like Yog-Sothoth.
20100805 06:23:06< Valkier> In my experience they take out the motherboard more often than not.
20100805 06:23:26< Espreon|Wii> Nah, Linux still boots... I can tell.
20100805 06:23:51< Valkier> I'm just saying it sounds more like the screen died.
20100805 06:24:03< Valkier> But who knows.
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20100805 06:25:19< Espreon|Wii_> Did I miss anything?
20100805 06:25:32< shadowmaster> 00:23:51 <Valkier> I'm just saying it sounds more like the screen died.
20100805 06:25:32< shadowmaster> 00:24:02 <Valkier> But who knows.
20100805 06:25:39< shadowmaster> Espreon|Wii_: only that
20100805 06:25:50< Valkier> So nothing but my pointless conjecture.
20100805 06:26:04< shadowmaster> yeah, I agree that it could be just the screen
20100805 06:26:29< shadowmaster> since I guess the laptop would refuse to boot if the GPU circuitry was damaged
20100805 06:26:30< Valkier> shadowmaster: So you never did say. Why was it a bad day and how did it lead to you investing in a 2 TB external?
20100805 06:26:32< Espreon|Wii_> I really hope that it's the GPU. I want that piece of shit replaced.
20100805 06:26:55< shadowmaster> Valkier: the 2 TB disk is something I'd been planning to buy since long ago.
20100805 06:27:02< shadowmaster> bad day? ...personal stuff.
20100805 06:27:08< Valkier> Ahh, gotcha.
20100805 06:27:30< Valkier> I spent the first half of my day getting my car inspected.
20100805 06:27:34< Valkier> It was frustrating.
20100805 06:27:55-!- Espreon|Wii [47af4857@wesnoth/developer/espreon] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20100805 06:29:45< Espreon|Wii_> Well, now to do random bullshit.
20100805 06:29:55< Espreon|Wii_> Bye...
20100805 06:30:01< shadowmaster> bye :(
20100805 06:31:29 * Valkier comforts shadowmaster
20100805 06:31:56< shadowmaster> I'm not the one whose laptop died.
20100805 06:32:06< shadowmaster> *semi-died
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20100805 06:46:45< Valkier> True
20100805 06:46:51< Valkier> My laptop died not long ago.
20100805 06:47:00< Valkier> Still pissed about how terribly HP treated me.
20100805 07:09:00< shadowmaster> hm, I've got bogus non-UTF-8 multibyte sequences on some old filenames.
20100805 07:09:25< shadowmaster> probably scp screwing up when I transferred those from greycore on xmas 2008
20100805 07:13:56< Valkier> I understood none of that.
20100805 07:15:08< Valkier> But here is a hairy dwarf. http://forums.wesnoth.org/download/file.php?id=44012
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20100805 18:33:28< Zerovirus> Fendrin you were looking for me?
20100805 18:44:44< Gambit> Repeatedly.
20100805 18:45:38< Valkier> Sounds hawt.
20100805 18:45:43< Zerovirus> Right okay well he seems to be MIA right now
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20100805 21:13:57< Gambit> shadowmaster: Is debian more or less newb friendly than Ubuntu?
20100805 21:14:48< timotei> Gambit: windows is the most friendly
20100805 21:14:53< shadowmaster> no fucking idea and I don't fucking care because I'm a fucking Debian fanboy
20100805 21:14:58< shadowmaster> Ubuntu ftl.
20100805 21:15:02< shadowmaster> just kidding.
20100805 21:15:09< timotei> Gambit: I can tell you: is less 'friendly'
20100805 21:15:13< timotei> but you will learn more
20100805 21:15:14< shadowmaster> Ubuntu is so newbie-friendly that it can lead to bad habits.
20100805 21:15:16< timotei> than on ubuntu
20100805 21:15:32< shadowmaster> bad habits including eternal newbieness
20100805 21:15:40< timotei> shadowmaster: no offense but I see people picking Ubuntu just because it's a trend to use
20100805 21:15:46< timotei> "OMG I need to learn linux"
20100805 21:15:52< shadowmaster> if you are just a generic Joe C. O'mputer User, Ubuntu is for you.
20100805 21:15:53< timotei> "pick ubuntu. It rocks!"
20100805 21:15:59< shadowmaster> if you are a geek, Debian is for you.
20100805 21:16:10< timotei> but debian doesn't like cold fusion :D
20100805 21:16:14< timotei> Gambit: use sabayon 
20100805 21:16:21< timotei> Gambit: really. he's beating ubuntu :D
20100805 21:16:24< shadowmaster> timotei: don't get me wrong, I'd install kubuntu on blackcore.
20100805 21:16:31< shadowmaster> timotei: you mean "it"
20100805 21:16:33< timotei> shadowmaster: hmm, kubuntu is ok
20100805 21:16:43< shadowmaster> unless sabayon happens to be a man
20100805 21:16:49 * Gambit dislikes dolphin extremely
20100805 21:16:56< shadowmaster> I like dolphin
20100805 21:17:01< timotei> dolphin is nice :D
20100805 21:17:03< shadowmaster> then again I grew up with WIndows 95.
20100805 21:17:06< timotei> Gambit: hmm
20100805 21:17:10< timotei> Gambit: then use sabayon gnome
20100805 21:17:18< shadowmaster> so dolphin makes me feel nostalgic
20100805 21:17:18< timotei> although that sucks a bit I don't like the color used
20100805 21:17:31< shadowmaster> also note that there are alternate file managers for KDE 4, including Konqueror and krusader
20100805 21:17:42< timotei> yeah
20100805 21:17:52< shadowmaster> I prefer bash as my file manager.
20100805 21:17:52< timotei> Gambit: so, before trying debian, try sabayon
20100805 21:17:55< timotei> :D
20100805 21:17:57< shadowmaster> and Dolphin as my file picker
20100805 21:18:09< Gambit> Well I've got to make up my mind by the 21st.
20100805 21:18:29< shadowmaster> hm.
20100805 21:18:29< Gambit> And if Shadowmaster Uses it, Then it Must Be Good
20100805 21:18:38< shadowmaster> is there a cronjob running apt-get update in my laptop or what?
20100805 21:18:46< shadowmaster> I don't remember having refreshed the archive cache this morning.
20100805 21:19:02< shadowmaster> anyway.
20100805 21:19:15< Gambit> Chrome and ColdFusion both work on Debian.
20100805 21:19:24< Gambit> And I guess Minecraft would; being java and all.
20100805 21:19:32< shadowmaster> I'm pondering whether to use Kubuntu, Sabayon, PC-BSD (!!!), openSUSE 11.3 or Debian testing on blackcore.
20100805 21:19:34< Gambit> Wesnoth and Frogatto I compile so they'd work.
20100805 21:19:51< timotei> Gambit: you see? he likes Sabayon too
20100805 21:19:55< Gambit> shadowmaster: So debian + KDE is what you use?
20100805 21:19:58< shadowmaster> except I still have to give both PC-BSD and openSUSE a try on VirtualBox
20100805 21:20:19< shadowmaster> timotei: I've heard good stuff about it from Espreon. I haven't used it otherwise and I still feel hesitant about using source-based distros
20100805 21:20:27< shadowmaster> Gambit: yes, Debian testing + KDE
20100805 21:20:39< Gambit> And it has a software manager thinger?
20100805 21:20:45< shadowmaster> the current Debian stable has KDE 3.5.10, Debian testing has KDE 4.4.5
20100805 21:20:48< Gambit> Of course there's no way for me to install and test first.
20100805 21:20:54< shadowmaster> Gambit: kpackage should be it but I use synaptic
20100805 21:21:01< Gambit> Unless Debian has an equivilant of Wubi
20100805 21:21:03< shadowmaster> and apt-get and aptitude for some special tasks
20100805 21:21:17< shadowmaster> you could always use VirtualBox for trying it out
20100805 21:21:21< shadowmaster> it also runs on Windows
20100805 21:21:23< timotei> shadowmaster: well, it's binary damn :D
20100805 21:21:32< shadowmaster> timotei: hybrid.
20100805 21:21:37< timotei> well ok:P
20100805 21:21:42< shadowmaster> I'm pretty sure Espreon compiles stuff with a package manager
20100805 21:22:12< shadowmaster> I use synaptic here because I've used it before or seen people using it before.
20100805 21:22:16< timotei> I don't and won't compile anything
20100805 21:22:20< timotei> I just use the binary one
20100805 21:22:21< shadowmaster> actually, it's the first package manager front-end I heard about, on TV
20100805 21:22:22< timotei> and I'm fine
20100805 21:22:40< timotei> I hate debian can't be installed from usb stick
20100805 21:22:42< timotei> that sucks!
20100805 21:22:47< shadowmaster> timotei: duh.
20100805 21:22:59< shadowmaster> convert your netinstall CD image into something for the USB drive.
20100805 21:23:06< shadowmaster> there's a way to do that that's quite popular AFAIK
20100805 21:23:12< shadowmaster> I don't know exactly what it is.
20100805 21:24:09< timotei> yeah
20100805 21:24:10< timotei> lol
20100805 21:24:12< timotei> emacs sucks
20100805 21:24:16< timotei> I can't find the download button
20100805 21:24:43< timotei> lol
20100805 21:24:52 * shadowmaster raises eyebrow.
20100805 21:24:52< timotei> they are speaking of GNU like it is an standalone OS
20100805 21:25:00< shadowmaster> GNU is.
20100805 21:25:04< shadowmaster> it only lacks a kernel
20100805 21:25:21< shadowmaster> Linux, Hurd (?????????), FreeBSD's kernel have been used for that purpose
20100805 21:26:03< shadowmaster> (note: Debian has, GNU/Linux, GNU/Hurd and GNU/kFreeBSD distributions, except that the last two haven't had an official release yet and GNU/Hurd in particular is...GNU/Hurd)
20100805 21:26:17< timotei> well yeah
20100805 21:26:21< timotei> GNU is much like of category...
20100805 21:26:32< timotei> I want the OS GNU!
20100805 21:26:35< shadowmaster> (and Hurd in particular has been built upon like over nine thousand microkernels including GNU Mach)
20100805 21:27:15< shadowmaster> you won't have GNU until those idiots stop digging themselves into a blackhole of ambitious perfectionism and volatile designs.
20100805 21:27:29< shadowmaster> the blackhole here is Hurd.
20100805 21:28:32< Gambit> shadowmaster: You can get a version of debian that comes with KDE? Because I didn't have much luck switching desktop managers last time...
20100805 21:28:47-!- Daravel [~h_i_s_s@86.144.127.236] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20100805 21:29:09< shadowmaster> Gambit: no.
20100805 21:29:11< shadowmaster> however.
20100805 21:29:30< shadowmaster> there's a slightly hacky way to get KDE installed by default that involved some installation switch
20100805 21:29:41< Gambit> Oh wait I hate dolphin...
20100805 21:29:43< shadowmaster> I think I used it for installing on bluecore, not sure.
20100805 21:29:44< Gambit> shadowmaster: It comes with gnome?
20100805 21:29:49< shadowmaster> Gambit: yes
20100805 21:29:52< Gambit> Okay cool
20100805 21:30:17< timotei> hmm
20100805 21:30:25< timotei> shadowmaster: so GNU Hurd is... what GNU wants to be?
20100805 21:30:27< timotei> a perfect OS?
20100805 21:30:52< shadowmaster> yes, or what they think they want to be.
20100805 21:31:02< timotei> there is no stable version
20100805 21:31:04< timotei> =))
20100805 21:31:39< shadowmaster> I told you Debian doesn't have any official releases with kFreeBSD or Hurd kernels yet
20100805 21:31:56< shadowmaster> Gambit: you can choose from GNOME, KDE, Xfce, Lxde, Enlightement, Fluxbox, WindowMaker, a GNUStep based desktop, Icewm and many other less known desktop environments and/or window managers
20100805 21:32:02< timotei> well...
20100805 21:32:14< shadowmaster> however, the installation program (at least in Debian 5) doesn't let you choose an will install GNOME by default
20100805 21:32:23< shadowmaster> unless you pass this obscure switch at the boot prompt.
20100805 21:32:30< timotei> lol
20100805 21:32:33< shadowmaster> which I did but I don't remember what it is or where I found it.
20100805 21:32:33< timotei> is there a SWITCH????
20100805 21:32:39< shadowmaster> probably in the installation FAQ.
20100805 21:32:42< timotei> damn
20100805 21:32:45< timotei> when installed debian
20100805 21:32:48< shadowmaster> timotei: switch. you know, like --help, etc. :|
20100805 21:32:53< timotei> yeah yeah
20100805 21:32:58< shadowmaster> the multiple question marks don't help a lot either
20100805 21:32:59< timotei> but I was talking: a switch for KDE?
20100805 21:33:04< shadowmaster> yes
20100805 21:33:16< shadowmaster> it's supposed to override the default desktop environment task IIRC.
20100805 21:33:40< timotei> nice
20100805 21:33:51< timotei> last time installed debian, remained with console only :))
20100805 21:34:48< timotei> shadowmaster: emacs or vi?
20100805 21:35:06< shadowmaster> I choose my own third option.
20100805 21:35:19< timotei> kate?:D
20100805 21:35:20< shadowmaster> Kate, the KDE Advanced Text Editor.
20100805 21:35:21< shadowmaster> yes
20100805 21:35:23< timotei> ha!
20100805 21:35:23< timotei> :D
20100805 21:35:36< timotei> well, yeah, but no console for kate:(
20100805 21:35:41< shadowmaster> maybe because it has a female name I feel more comfortable using it, if you know what I mean.
20100805 21:35:45< timotei> I mean, no kate for console:P
20100805 21:35:49< timotei> yep
20100805 21:36:18< shadowmaster> otherwise, vim is what I use for simple tasks on text-only terminals, and at wesnoth.org and my website
20100805 21:36:58< shadowmaster> if you think vim isn't user friendly, consider that I prefer vim over vi because vi doesn't feel user friendly.
20100805 21:37:41< loonycyborg> Can you even use vi now?
20100805 21:37:41< timotei> I like vim
20100805 21:38:34< shadowmaster> no
20100805 21:38:57< shadowmaster> if I were to look for web hosting, I'd make sure they provide vim at the very least.
20100805 21:40:00< timotei> vim in webhosting??
20100805 21:40:02< timotei> lol?
20100805 21:40:07< timotei> via SSH?
20100805 21:40:16< loonycyborg> Sure.
20100805 21:40:25< timotei> Nice. My host doesn't support that :(
20100805 21:40:40< timotei> I can only 'manage ssh keys' in cPanel. but Can't use otherwise:(
20100805 21:41:10 * shadowmaster doesn't see what's funny about vim on ssh sessios
20100805 21:41:14< shadowmaster> sessions
20100805 21:42:08< timotei> sorry. I have a bad habbit of 'lol'-ing at things that seem ... weird
20100805 21:42:16< timotei> or unkown/surprises
20100805 21:42:18< timotei> :P
20100805 21:42:38< timotei> so if you'd tell me debian runs natively windows, I'd say: LOL!
20100805 21:42:55< shadowmaster> Debian + VirtualBox = run anything you want
20100805 21:42:59< loonycyborg> That even doesn't make sebse :P
20100805 21:43:01< timotei> yeah
20100805 21:43:07< timotei> hmm
20100805 21:43:13< loonycyborg> Unless with virtualbox of course.
20100805 21:43:16< timotei> loonycyborg: do you have a picture of you?:D
20100805 21:43:35< loonycyborg> No. And don't want to.
20100805 21:44:22< shadowmaster> http://shadowm.rewound.net/vbox1.png
20100805 21:44:52< timotei> I don't know why (no offense), when saying loonycyborg I'm thinking of an old and nice steam locomotive... like that in polar express(http://images.allmoviephoto.com/2004_The_Polar_Express/2004_the_polar_express_wallpaper_002.jpg)  or in: http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/3/3b/Jacobite_Steam_Train_2003.JPG/220px-Jacobite_Steam_Train_2003.JPG
20100805 21:45:23< timotei> shadowmaster: nice stack!
20100805 21:45:41< timotei> ah, nostalgy. 8->
20100805 21:45:48< timotei> windows 95 OSR and windows 98 SE :D
20100805 21:45:53< timotei> I'm gonna cry
20100805 21:46:07< timotei> good ol' days, when getting: No microprocessors found when installing w98
20100805 21:46:39< timotei> or even older, when my computer was broken. I could only log into DOS, and only had 2 MBs in rom
20100805 21:46:45< shadowmaster> not appearing in that picture: Damn Small Linux, Debian GNU/Linux 5.0.2 (Lenny), Windows NT 4.0 SP6a, and Windows XP SP3
20100805 21:47:03< loonycyborg> timotei: Your associations with trains are sure weird LOL :P
20100805 21:47:17< timotei> when needed to switch games, I'd had to delete all on the drive and install from diskette
20100805 21:47:24< timotei> loonycyborg: for me trains are very ... nice
20100805 21:47:35< timotei> I like old steam ones
20100805 21:47:39< timotei> like those in harry potter:D
20100805 21:48:00< timotei> I might try solaris
20100805 21:49:51< shadowmaster> I was into trains when younger.
20100805 21:50:14< shadowmaster> then I became obsessed with computer operating systems
20100805 21:50:18< timotei> :P
20100805 21:50:27< timotei> you're saying I'm still a kid?
20100805 21:50:36< loonycyborg> I was once obsessed with railroad systems :P
20100805 21:50:43< shadowmaster> timotei: wut?
20100805 21:50:47< timotei> nvm :P
20100805 21:50:58< shadowmaster> no.
20100805 21:51:08< shadowmaster> you don't know this medic who lives in our same area
20100805 21:51:14< shadowmaster> he's bought real train wagons
20100805 21:51:36< timotei> hmm, I hate eclipse forums. can't set once and forever the 'plain view' for forum view
20100805 21:51:39< shadowmaster> and material for building a mini railroad, real size
20100805 21:51:39< timotei> shadowmaster: nice :D
20100805 21:51:42< timotei> oh
20100805 21:51:43< timotei> ...
20100805 21:51:46< timotei> that's too big:P
20100805 21:52:18< shadowmaster> indeed.
20100805 21:52:24< shadowmaster> some people are just plain crazy.
20100805 21:58:50< timotei> loonycyborg, shadowmaster good night guys;)
20100805 21:58:56< shadowmaster> night
20100805 21:59:03< loonycyborg> gn
20100805 21:59:05-!- timotei [~timotei@wesnoth/developer/timotei] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20100805 22:02:12< shadowmaster> trying out debirf
20100805 22:02:34< shadowmaster> http://packages.debian.org/unstable/main/debirf
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20100805 22:21:26< Gambit> shadowmaster: How does the debian net installation work?
20100805 22:21:39< Gambit> It puts on just the OS essentials and then you boot into debian and it downloads the rest?
20100805 22:21:57< shadowmaster> no, it downloads them from the CD step of the installation
20100805 22:22:00< shadowmaster> *at
20100805 22:22:24< Gambit> How's that work without having an OS running?
20100805 22:22:26< shadowmaster> so if the netinst image doesn't support <insert crappy network interface here>, you need to use something else
20100805 22:22:38< shadowmaster> Gambit: because the netinst image has a small OS image on itself
20100805 22:22:51< Gambit> shadowmaster: So... exactly what I said? :\
20100805 22:22:55< shadowmaster> all the Debian installation media have a minimal Debian image that's used to do the installation
20100805 22:23:20< shadowmaster> that minimal system can mount the target partitions and install stuff to them and configure them using chroot techniques
20100805 22:23:42< shadowmaster> so it's basically the same that Windows does when installing itself since Windows 95.
20100805 22:24:10< shadowmaster> Gambit: naturally, the minimal OS image that runs the netinst has a Linux kernel
20100805 22:24:24< shadowmaster> since Linux is a monolithic kernel, all drivers are either built-in or provided as companion modules
20100805 22:24:53< shadowmaster> the Debian installation system can then use hardware that has builtin kernel support, or probe other hardware and load their driver modules as required
20100805 22:25:27< shadowmaster> it expects to be able to connect to the network gathering info using DHCP, or asking you to input your ISP's config
20100805 22:25:46< shadowmaster> so yeah, I'm off now.
20100805 22:26:07< shadowmaster> if I didn't answer your question, leave a more elaborate wording in here.
20100805 22:33:29< Gambit> Okay debian virtually through a tiny virtual ubuntu partition.
20100805 22:33:33< Gambit> This should go well :D
20100805 22:33:49 * Gambit is afraid if he boots back into windows he won't come back. :o
20100805 22:35:05< Gambit> hopefully the virtual OS won't do anything permanent.
20100805 22:36:16< Gambit> Looks like it doesn't matter what OS I'm on; as soon as I install virtualbox I lose 20kbps bandwidth. Wtf?
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20100805 22:50:49< Gambit> Wait why am I doing this again?
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20100805 23:02:37< Valkier> What has science done!?
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20100805 23:07:35< Espreon|Wii> shadowmaster: Yeah, I got rid of Entropy, thus I only use Portage.
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20100805 23:37:25<+CIA-36> wesnoth-umc-dev: mnewton1 * r7519 /branches/1.8/Ageless_Era/ (9 files in 9 dirs):
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--- Log closed Fri Aug 06 00:00:47 2010