--- Log opened Tue Oct 12 00:00:51 2010
20101012 00:19:10-!- alink [~alink@wesnoth/developer/alink] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20101012 00:19:17< alink> hi
20101012 00:21:42< alink> mordante: weird, you should have at least 1. But I will make the error non-fatal to test if it's just an error in the query about the supported number
20101012 00:23:36< alink> Ivanovic: your error with LIBGL_ALWAYS_INDIRECT=1 is weird. All check are green and say that you support FBO, but at the first simple call (which has no real option that I could do wrong) it fails
20101012 00:24:25< alink> I will probably need to write a simple test program to verify this.
20101012 00:25:07< alink> Ivanovic: ok, since your last halo bug is driber specific, it will wait
20101012 00:25:35< alink> *driver
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20101012 00:25:55< zookeeper> esr, around?
20101012 00:26:38< alink> but I could use a screenshot showing well the pattern of the glitch. Like if the underlying terrain is streched or flipped, etc... And also if it's always changing
20101012 00:28:27< alink> and since this doublebuffer problems prevent to test other things, I think I will abstract it and start to support several methods.
20101012 00:29:04< zookeeper> esr, there's one type of tool which might be useful for artists: something that would check for animation frames which contain colours not present in the base frame. it'd be useful because being able to easily do palette shifting (like make a hero unit have a differently coloured hair, horse or whatever) pretty much depends on the animation frames not having colours which aren't there in 
20101012 00:29:04< zookeeper> the base frame.
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20101012 00:32:44< CIA-88> alink * r47028 /branches/ogl/src/video.cpp: 
20101012 00:32:44< CIA-88> Make an FBO error (Not enough FBO colour attachment points) non fatal,
20101012 00:32:44< CIA-88> just in case it's bogus. But note that if the error is real, it will still fail few lines later.
20101012 00:34:35< alink> btw I will probably be less active this week
20101012 00:35:02< alink> bye
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20101012 00:44:02< esr> zookeeper: That might be doable.
20101012 00:44:57< Jetrel> esr:  furthermore, useful for many projects besides wesnoth.
20101012 00:45:42< Jetrel> Due to the influence of 8 and 16-bit consoles, many, many game programmers are aware of the benefits of palette shifting.
20101012 00:47:10< esr> Jetrel: Not if the tool parses AnimationWML, which I assumed it should from zookeeper's spec.  The color table checking in itself could be done with PIL pretty easily - I've written similar code before.
20101012 00:47:32< zookeeper> no, it'd only need to check the image files themselves
20101012 00:48:13< Jetrel> esr:  honestly, the tool should just take a list of images, and just note any that introduce new colors not in the others.  Example usage:   myimagetool  fighter*.png
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20101012 00:48:39< Jetrel> esr:  so we wouldn't need anything wesnoth-specific, and it greatly simplifies the tool.
20101012 00:49:24< zookeeper> actually i figured the typical usecase would be to run it on the whole images/units/ dir, and it'd be smart enough to detect base frames by filename and then check the animation frames
20101012 00:50:29< zookeeper> but since Jetrel is more likely to be the actual user of that tool, i suggest choosing his suggestions ;)
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20101012 00:52:42< noy> I got a question for you programming types; what would you consider the main programming areas of wesnoth. 
20101012 00:53:58< noy> I know that is a broad question... I guess what are the main segmentations within the code per area
20101012 00:56:59< Jetrel> noy:  typically, in RL programming, the divisions between such areas aren't really well-defined.  Not disparaging your question, mind you.  Just saying that I suspect that in wesnoth, you'd need to actually sit back and really think about where such "territory divisions" should be drawn - a very analogous problem to that metaphor.
20101012 00:57:30< noy> Meh, I'll just ask dave, its his comment. 
20101012 00:57:54< Jetrel> They are if you have really, really well-factored code, but in practice, few do, and having overly well-factored code can lead to certain design tradeoffs.
20101012 00:58:55< noy> The point that Dave was trying to make that the program's structure is fairly parallel that an issue with one aspect of code does not easily affect others. 
20101012 00:59:06< noy> I just wanted to elaborate on it
20101012 00:59:23< Jetrel> Having really well-factored code is like having an altogether too strict "chain of command".  It's very clean, but informal messages can't be passed outside the stated chain of command, and that makes doing certain things that could be easy to do, difficult.
20101012 00:59:35< noy>  Okay... that doesn't help. 
20101012 00:59:57< noy> Its not really what I'm asking about either. 
20101012 01:00:27< CIA-88> zookeeper * r47029 /trunk/data/campaigns/Liberty/units/ (Rogue_Mage.cfg Shadow_Lord.cfg Shadow_Mage.cfg): Balance changes and some attack renames for the Rogue Mage line, mostly according to elvish_sovereign's suggestions.
20101012 01:00:34< Jetrel> Endless religious wars have been waged over which side to fall on this design area, and I won't pick sides, frankly.
20101012 01:01:04< noy> you can read the chapter we're writing, it talks about that extensively. 
20101012 01:02:09< noy> I guess I'm less asking about the separations in responsibilities, than the program architecture. 
20101012 01:11:29< esr> Jetrel: As you just specified it, that's extremely easy.  How do you want the exiguous colors reported, as RGBs?
20101012 01:12:47< Jetrel> Yeah;  RGBA would be cool.
20101012 01:13:22< Jetrel> The alpha value is useful since at a glance it can say if, for example, there are nearly-transparent pixels lurking outside the normal sprite area.
20101012 01:13:30< esr> Jetrel: Almost trivial, then.  Got some test image series to suggest for me to test with?
20101012 01:14:14< Jetrel> esr:  orcs will probably pass this test without reporting many erroneous colors;  elves will likely fail this test, hard, and report dozens of erroneous colors
20101012 01:14:44< esr> OK.
20101012 01:14:51< Jetrel> grunt and archer are probably especially clean.
20101012 01:15:03< esr> That's useful to know.
20101012 01:15:11< esr> I'll get on it.
20101012 01:15:29< shadowmaster> a tool that checked for TC bits' sanity might also be a good idea in mainline
20101012 01:15:43< shadowmaster> i.e. to report which images have TC pixels that aren't a 1:1 match of the elements of the magenta key palette
20101012 01:16:57< esr> shadowmaster: How would I tell what pixel is a TC bit?
20101012 01:17:25< shadowmaster> hm, by comparing it against the magenta paette?
20101012 01:17:40< esr> I think we see a problem here... :-)
20101012 01:17:58< shadowmaster> and if there's a small difference, consider it a boken tc bit? as opposed to ignoring it if the pixel's color diff is big
20101012 01:18:17< shadowmaster> I don't see the problem. Who's the other person seeing it?
20101012 01:19:00< esr> You want me to check if TC bits are in the magenta palette.  Then you tell me a TC is detectable by being magenta.
20101012 01:24:15< Jetrel> esr:  TC is detectable by being a tiny subset of the very loosely-defined "magenta" area of colors.  This subset is a very specifically defined set of 16 colors.
20101012 01:25:02< esr> OK, I don't want to get distracted here.  Exiguous color detector first.
20101012 01:25:02< Jetrel> So, yes, "TC is magenta" is a true statement, but it's shorthand for a more specific thing.
20101012 01:25:10< Jetrel> Indeed.
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20101012 01:53:50< esr> Jetrel: That's odd.  PIL thinks some of these images don't *have* color tables.
20101012 01:55:00< esr> Never mind.  Found a way around it.
20101012 01:56:29< shadowmaster> shikadibot: PIL?
20101012 01:56:30< shikadibot> Sorry, I don't know what 'PIL' means...
20101012 01:57:01< esr> PIL = Python Imaging Library.  Exactly the right tool for this job.
20101012 01:57:22< esr> I'm already listing RGB color rtables. 
20101012 01:57:35< shadowmaster> uh.
20101012 01:57:51< shadowmaster> and when I tried to make an "rcint" app I messed with ImageMagick. Bad idea I guess.
20101012 01:57:57< shadowmaster> *rclint, for team color validation
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20101012 02:00:33< Jetrel> esr:  yes, if they're stored as PNG24s, they likely don't have indexes that comprise a "color table".  The colors are just stored as absolute values.
20101012 02:01:05< Jetrel> esr:  in which case you'd need to iterate over the pixels in the file and build your own list of the colors in it.
20101012 02:01:41< esr> Jetrel: Actually, all I had to do was call PIL's convert("RGB") method.  PIL is *fantastic* for this kind of job.
20101012 02:03:24< esr> I dunno how to get the transparency info out yet, though.  Gonna do a first version that just reports RGB.  As a bonus from the PIL API, you'll get pixel counts of the exiguous colors for free. 
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20101012 02:05:25< zookeeper> TC breakage would be nice to report too, but i guess it'd require coming up with some kind of a fuzzy algorithm which might produce false positives...
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20101012 02:05:48< esr> zookeeper: Yeash, that's the psrt that worries me.
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20101012 02:42:14< esr> Jetrel: The grunt animations have more than a dozen extra colors each.  Were you expecting this>
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20101012 03:35:51< Jetrel> esr:  kinda.  Are they on frames 3 and 4 of the melee?
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20101012 04:31:02< esr> Jetrel: On pretty much all the frames I can see clor tables for. 2, 3, and 7 I can't; I'm still trying to figure that out.
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20101012 06:29:09< Swordsman> Hi
20101012 06:29:23-!- Swordsman is now known as Sharpshootr
20101012 06:29:30< Sharpshootr> I have a question
20101012 06:29:46< Sharpshootr> How do I get the terrain type at a specific coordinates?
20101012 06:30:35< Sharpshootr> Is it possible?
20101012 06:32:29< Sharpshootr> Is anybody there? :)
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20101012 07:29:55< esr> Jetrel: ping
20101012 07:30:03< CIA-88> esr * r47030 /trunk/data/tools/imgcheck: 
20101012 07:30:03< CIA-88> Initial version of imgcheck.
20101012 07:30:03< CIA-88> PIL is failing to extract color tables from some images.
20101012 07:30:03< CIA-88> This needs to be investigated.
20101012 07:32:10< Jetrel> hola
20101012 07:32:38< Jetrel> Okay, so to run this, I just need python?
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20101012 07:38:49< esr> Jetrel: Yep.  It's not done yet - I need to figure out why PIL doesn't recover a color table for some images.  I was hoping you might have a PNG analysis tool that would reveal a key difference.
20101012 07:39:05< Jetrel> Hm.
20101012 07:39:23< Jetrel> so, can you give me an example A & B to compare?
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20101012 07:44:56< boucman> esr: what does that tool check exactly ?
20101012 07:45:52< esr> Jetrel: Yes.  ../core/images/units/orcs/grunt-die-[12].png
20101012 07:46:36< esr> PIL recovers a color table from 1 but not from 2.  ImageMagick identify says they're in the same format.
20101012 07:47:02< esr> boucman: It looks for colors in animation frames not present in base frames.
20101012 07:47:15< boucman> nice
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20101012 07:53:28< Jetrel> esr:  dang, I can't find any differences.
20101012 07:53:42< Jetrel> Same PNG "filter", same compression method..
20101012 07:54:13< esr> Jetrel: I couldn't either.  But PIL extracts a cvolor table from one and fails on the other.  Mysterious.
20101012 07:54:25< Jetrel> esr:  what I can say is that grunt-die-1.png might have been a modified "direct" copy of the grunt standing frame, and 2 might have just been copy-pasted into a new file.
20101012 07:54:31< esr> Guess I'll file a bug report.
20101012 07:55:02< Jetrel> esr:  it's possible that the modifying programs were lazy about removing a color-table when converting to PNG24.
20101012 07:55:29< Jetrel> Since PNG24 should not be storing actual color tables/indexes any more, due to being in absolute color.
20101012 07:55:35< esr> You think these are all in PNG24, ans ome have fossil tables iun them?
20101012 07:55:45< Jetrel> esr:  yeah, I think that's possible.
20101012 07:55:57< esr> Hm.
20101012 07:56:10< esr> I may have a way to tell.
20101012 07:56:18< shadowmaster> AI recently converted all indexed images to RGBA I think
20101012 07:56:32< esr> You know what sng is?
20101012 07:56:35< shadowmaster> I mean, not recently
20101012 07:56:36< Jetrel> The one difference I saw that that the first one had a different "background color" than the second, which is apparently a PNG data field that does ... something.
20101012 07:56:42< Jetrel> esr:  no clue.
20101012 07:57:37< esr> Little tool I wrote yeasrs back that takes a PNG and dumps the entire contents in textual form - and can undump its own dumps. 
20101012 07:58:15< esr> I think I'll sic sng on both of those and see what it tells me about the chunk and image types.
20101012 07:59:10< Jetrel> "can undump its own dumps".  Sounds suspiciously like a dog.  >_>
20101012 07:59:17< Jetrel> (yes, bad joke, I know)
20101012 07:59:25< shadowmaster> heh
20101012 08:00:14< shadowmaster> and exactly how do you take a dump in reverse anyway?
20101012 08:00:19< shadowmaster> I mean, make a reverse dump.
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20101012 08:03:34< Jetrel> shadowmaster:  by eating your own shit, which I've seen dogs do.  This is one of a number of reasons calling someone a dog can be considered derogatory.  :T
20101012 08:03:56< shadowmaster> ah, I have seen mine do that :(
20101012 08:03:57< Jetrel> (or used to be, at least)
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20101012 08:04:33< esr> Jetrel: sng doesn't see any format difference either.
20101012 08:04:52< Jetrel> esr:  curiouser and curiouser
20101012 08:05:00< shadowmaster> neither does this little set of nifty PNG analyzing tools I found in the Debian repos
20101012 08:05:10< esr> I shall go poke the PIL maintainer.  This is clearly a bug at his level.
20101012 08:06:45< Jetrel> esr:  anyways, on a very related note, it appears opengameart.org is starting to take off, nicely, and it'd actually be useful to talk to bart and see about getting a section opened up there for useful little scripts like this.
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20101012 08:07:47< esr> Jetrel: OK.  I'm willing to write such small tools, and I'm expert in PIL and a credited PNG contributor.
20101012 08:08:07< Jetrel> esr:  one of the things that irks me to no end is that, to this day, there's still a huge indie community around proprietary software like (AFAIK) GameMaker.  Don't get me wrong - closed-source software can be good in a lot of areas, but "middleware tools for game development" is really a place that ought to be open-source.
20101012 08:08:11 * shadowmaster shudders
20101012 08:08:27< shadowmaster> too bad you didn't do enough work to blame you for the endless pain libpng has caused to me.
20101012 08:08:45< Jetrel> esr:  so I figure, opengameart.org would be a good clearing-house for game-development tools, since they've got a very general community there.
20101012 08:08:47< esr> shadowmaster: Really?  What are the issues?
20101012 08:09:04< shadowmaster> esr: everything from the documentation upwards.
20101012 08:09:16< shadowmaster> I hate libpng with all my might nowadays :)
20101012 08:09:41< esr> shadowmaster: Maybe I need to pay more attention to it, then.
20101012 08:15:37-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 163 bugs, 298 feature requests, 15 patches | logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://wesnoth.pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20101012 09:21:00< timotei> morning
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20101012 10:07:21 * fendrin got hurt while being seriously drunk. Feck!
20101012 10:11:00< boucman> anybody here knows the magic command line to do a git-svn checkout ?
20101012 10:15:23< fendrin> boucman: git clone url
20101012 10:16:37< boucman> well, I tried git clone -s svn+ssh://boucman@svn.gna.org/svn/wesnoth
20101012 10:16:59< boucman> and I got an unitialized value in concatenation somewhere in a svn related perl library
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20101012 10:21:20< fendrin> boucman: git svn clone svn+ssh://path_to_root_of_repo -t wesnoth/trunk
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20101012 10:22:16< Ivanovic> moin
20101012 10:24:29< boucman> didn't help... my guess is that the problem is earlier, it doesn't even ask for my gna password...
20101012 10:24:31< boucman> hmm
20101012 10:24:35< boucman> ok, i'm stupid
20101012 10:24:47< boucman> new computer => new certificate to add to gna
20101012 10:24:48< boucman> :P
20101012 10:30:14< fendrin> :-)
20101012 10:48:19< Ivanovic> :)
20101012 10:52:28< Soliton> boucman: files.wesnoth.org/hidden/git/
20101012 10:52:42< boucman> what is it ?
20101012 10:53:07< Soliton> a git repo of wesnoth.
20101012 10:53:49< boucman> hmm, is it to gain checkout time, or is it a real repo we can commit to and everything ?
20101012 10:54:16< Soliton> if you'd take a look you'd see it's a tarball.
20101012 10:54:49< boucman> k, but my clone is almost done now
20101012 10:54:51< boucman> thx anyway
20101012 10:55:51< Soliton> that's pretty quick. maybe because it's just trunk.
20101012 10:56:54< Espreon> alink: http://gna.org/bugs/?16859 ... I'm pretty sure that dialog supported Pango markup. Would you fix it/enable Pango markup support for it?
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20101012 11:11:43< timotei> hi fendrin :)
20101012 11:11:47< timotei> fendrin: how are you doing?
20101012 11:12:55< CIA-88> espreon * r47031 /trunk/data/tools/imgcheck: Ran umcpropfix.
20101012 11:14:57< CIA-88> espreon * r47032 /trunk/data/core/images/ (17 files in 4 dirs): Ran umcpropfix.
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20101012 12:21:09< CIA-88> zookeeper * r47033 /trunk/data/core/terrain-graphics.cfg: Made forests use the small variants when next to ice, and made mushroom groves not do so when next to sand dunes.
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20101012 12:47:38< fendrin> Hello timotei, slightly damaged after a post exam party where I got seriously drunk. I don't remember the point where my noise got squeezed, a good hint that the party was fun. 
20101012 12:47:56< timotei> fendrin: wow:))
20101012 12:48:01< fendrin> timotei: How are you doing?
20101012 12:48:02< timotei> fendrin: well, at least you're still alive :P
20101012 12:48:32< timotei> fendrin: well, I didn't thought this 2nd year was so 'complicated', so managed to get a hold, to resume my work on the plugin D:
20101012 12:50:00< timotei> fendrin: at least we'll do some nice and interesting  classes (assembly, computer circuits, mathematica )
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20101012 12:52:11< fendrin> timotei: Yeah, math at university level is quite demanding.
20101012 12:52:26< fendrin> timotei: I have still a math lecture left to pass. 
20101012 12:52:37< fendrin> One out of three still left.
20101012 12:53:32< fendrin> I have read your talk about the missing feedback, I guess that will change as soon as there is an easy to get ready standalone version.
20101012 12:56:38< timotei> fendrin: yeah. I hope that too
20101012 12:56:51< timotei> fendrin: oh, forgot to say, the bad news also, that my notebook was stolen :(
20101012 12:56:58< timotei> fendrin: from within my house lol
20101012 12:57:00< fendrin> uh
20101012 12:57:14< timotei> jumping through the window in the middle of the day (15.30)
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20101012 12:57:32< fendrin> Let me guess: It was your ex girl friend?
20101012 12:57:41< timotei> nope
20101012 12:58:01< timotei> didn't found yet the thiefs
20101012 12:58:17< timotei> I don't have any ex girlfriend:P
20101012 13:00:36< fendrin> Yeah, girlfriendlessniess is a common illness througout computer science.
20101012 13:01:34< timotei> You may be right that it's illness, but tbh, I didn't want to have any, though I could have one(or more)
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20101012 13:01:51< timotei> too much time taken for foolish thingys:P
20101012 13:02:04< fendrin> timotei: I would go for more, a single women is just to demanding.
20101012 13:02:15< timotei> ?
20101012 13:02:19< fendrin> s/to/too
20101012 13:02:22< timotei> oh
20101012 13:05:42< timotei> muhahaha
20101012 13:05:45< timotei> found the run menuitem>:)
20101012 13:12:53< timotei> fendrin: hehe, managed to remove the damn 'run' menu :D
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20101012 13:38:12< shadowmaster> channel 2: open failed: administratively prohibited: open failed
20101012 13:38:15< shadowmaster> er.
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20101012 13:46:33< zookeeper> the dwarvish scout's description says they have poorer armour than other dwarves, but actually their resistance are the same as those of the fighter...
20101012 13:47:14< zookeeper> same for the explorer vs lord. only the steelclad has slightly better resistances than the pathfinder.
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20101012 14:00:09< timotei> fendrin: I wanted to ask you something
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20101012 14:41:50< timotei> janebot: !check-auth
20101012 14:41:51< janebot> timotei: Admin: no | Staff:  yes | Channels: timotei|(#wesnoth.*)
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20101012 15:04:23< Crab_> Ivanovic: seen the logs.
20101012 15:04:28< Ivanovic> okay
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20101012 15:29:47< timotei> Ivanovic: ping me when you're around
20101012 15:30:07< Ivanovic> no
20101012 15:30:18< timotei> :P
20101012 15:30:53 * Ivanovic *hates* those completely empty pings
20101012 15:31:04< timotei> I want to ask you something. The umc plugin will have about ... 7 versions for different platforms (linux/mac/windows  + x86/x64). will it be sourceforge good for uploading it?
20101012 15:31:15< Ivanovic> sure
20101012 15:31:35< timotei> do we have some... bandwith limits or stuff?
20101012 15:31:41< timotei> each version of the plugin will take about 70 mega
20101012 15:31:42< Ivanovic> no limits at all
20101012 15:31:50< timotei> oh good
20101012 15:32:26< timotei> how will I upload the files? do I need some permissions?
20101012 15:32:35< Ivanovic> yes, you need permissions
20101012 15:32:39< timotei> or should I email you those :)
20101012 15:32:43< Ivanovic> first you tell me your sf.net account name
20101012 15:32:52< timotei> one sec
20101012 15:32:57< timotei> (i think i need to create one first)
20101012 15:37:02< timotei> Ivanovic: dtimotei
20101012 15:39:42< Ivanovic> timotei: okay, gave you permissions to upload stuff
20101012 15:40:05< timotei> Ivanovic: thanks
20101012 15:40:11< Ivanovic> this is the general command for uploading files:
20101012 15:40:21< Ivanovic> rsync -avP -e ssh FILES dtimotei,wesnoth@frs.sourceforge.net:/home/frs/project/w/we/wesnoth/STREAM/RELEASENAME
20101012 15:41:16< Ivanovic> for "STREAM" you likely want to use something like Wesnoth_UMC_Editor
20101012 15:41:23< Ivanovic> and for release name eg the version number
20101012 15:41:32< timotei> wow
20101012 15:42:01< timotei> that's in case I want to upload from command line, right?
20101012 15:42:04< Ivanovic> okay, wesnoth-umcplugin wants, too
20101012 15:42:16< Ivanovic> yeah, that is the commandline command for uploading using rsync via ssh
20101012 15:42:50< Ivanovic> if you go to the wesnoth project site at sf.net you can probably go to the file manager somewhere in the top bar
20101012 15:42:56< timotei> yeah
20101012 15:43:03< Ivanovic> for me it is under "project admin"->"file manager"
20101012 15:43:10< timotei> for me too
20101012 15:43:32< Ivanovic> you can also upload using your webbrowser, but personally i prefer using rsync since that once does show progress as well as allow resuming if you get disconnected
20101012 15:43:54< timotei> really? resume takes it all. thanks
20101012 15:44:44< timotei> for that rsync, I'll need to input my account name right?
20101012 15:44:56< timotei> or it's working with keyfiles?
20101012 15:45:42< Ivanovic> you use the accountname and enter your sf.net password after hitting enter
20101012 15:45:47< timotei> ok
20101012 15:45:50< timotei> thanks.
20101012 15:49:22< CIA-88> timotei * r47034 /trunk/utils/java/org.wesnoth/src/org/wesnoth/product/WMLPerspective.java: eclipse plugin: add the console view to default WMLPerspective
20101012 15:49:38< CIA-88> timotei * r47035 /trunk/utils/java/org.wesnoth/ (3 files in 2 dirs): eclipse plugin: finally wipe the 'Run' menu from main menu
20101012 15:49:56< CIA-88> timotei * r47036 /trunk/utils/java/org.wesnoth/build.properties: 
20101012 15:49:56< CIA-88> eclipse plugin: add all required items (help and graphics)
20101012 15:49:56< CIA-88> in the built application too
20101012 15:50:13< CIA-88> timotei * r47037 /trunk/utils/java/org.wesnoth/org.wesnoth.product: 
20101012 15:50:13< CIA-88> eclipse plugin: add fragments for building on
20101012 15:50:13< CIA-88> multiple platforms
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20101012 16:13:50< boucman>  Elvish_Pillager: around ?
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20101012 16:20:14< CIA-88> boucman * r47038 /trunk/ (changelog src/unit_frame.cpp src/unit_frame.hpp): add auto_vflip and auto_hflip animation parameters, partial fix for FR 16365
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20101012 17:01:08< timotei> fendrin: hehe, cross-compiling from windows for mac/linux/windows works nice:D
20101012 17:01:15< timotei> fendrin: need to test on mac too
20101012 17:04:55< timotei> I don't get it. why if I update my branches/ogl
20101012 17:05:00< timotei> I get the updates from trunk aswell
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20101012 17:11:54< Elvish_Pillager> boucman: around now
20101012 17:12:06< Elvish_Pillager> I saw the comment on bug 16365 :)
20101012 17:12:44< boucman> yes, the problem is that I pass a modifier string I build myself which contains all sort of info, and getting it into individual fields is tricky
20101012 17:13:00< Elvish_Pillager> I don't understand
20101012 17:13:50< boucman> well, at the unit level (so before the animation engine proper kicks in) we concatenate a dozen image path modifiers, including the ones for poison, the ones for TC, the ones that are specified by WML
20101012 17:14:12< Elvish_Pillager> hmm
20101012 17:14:22< Elvish_Pillager> wait, what?
20101012 17:14:23< boucman> and that string is passed as is to the anime engine, so reseparating is tricky
20101012 17:14:37< boucman> yes ?
20101012 17:14:38< Elvish_Pillager> poison can't be expressed as an image path function (at least not a documented one)
20101012 17:15:07< boucman> hmm, maybe not poison, recoloring might be a bit different...
20101012 17:15:10< Elvish_Pillager> also, why would you need to reseparate it?
20101012 17:15:38< boucman> well, didn't you want to be able to specify for each one if they are applied or not ?
20101012 17:16:20< Elvish_Pillager> oh, you mean TC and poison and petrification are all lumped together, and you want to be able to separate them
20101012 17:16:21< Elvish_Pillager> I see
20101012 17:16:52< boucman> well," I" don't want to, but I thought that's what your FR was about :P
20101012 17:16:56< Elvish_Pillager> and that's stuck onto the main unit image before it's passed to the animation engine? that's weird
20101012 17:17:16< Elvish_Pillager> well, I didn't have a particular reason for wanting the ability to control them *separately*, just whether all of them were applied or none
20101012 17:18:16< boucman> k, i'll try to do a quick list, and then we'll see if we can handle these as a whole
20101012 17:18:38< Elvish_Pillager> Is there any conceptual problem with moving the construction of the modifier list to the animation code proper?
20101012 17:19:47< boucman> yes, the animation proper don't know the unit, and thus don't know things like the team color etc...
20101012 17:19:58< boucman> we could pass these as a dozen strings, though
20101012 17:20:09< Elvish_Pillager> that seems like the right solution from my perspective
20101012 17:20:11< boucman> it's just more work. I might do that if I don't find another way...
20101012 17:20:32< Elvish_Pillager> or, like, pass booleans for whether it's poisoned, whether it's stoned, and a string for the team color thing
20101012 17:21:21< Elvish_Pillager> or just one string to control it all at once? truly separating them would make it a bit confusing how it's supposed to interact with [effect] apply_to=image_mod
20101012 17:22:51< boucman> ok, my problem seems to only be to separate the image_mod that you add with apply_modification and the TC is it ok if I leave these two together with a single flag to command both ?
20101012 17:23:05< Elvish_Pillager> yes, it is okay
20101012 17:23:30< boucman> ok, i'll do it that way, then
20101012 17:23:43< Elvish_Pillager> I guess it'd be somewhat nicer if they were separate, but I don't have any immediate use for it
20101012 17:24:21< Elvish_Pillager> (arrows with teamcolored fletching come to mind, but then again, wooden bows can already be poisoned :P)
20101012 17:25:38< boucman> hmm, wait a sec...
20101012 17:26:20< boucman> did you have problems with TC, or was it only with poison... because afaict both main and secondary frames are TCed, so you shouldn't have aproblem there
20101012 17:26:29< boucman> (poison would be a problem, though)
20101012 17:26:33< Elvish_Pillager> oh, I didn't know that
20101012 17:26:55< Elvish_Pillager> in that case, uh, doesn't that mean they're separated already?
20101012 17:27:05< boucman> afaict, the only difference between primary and secondary at this point are
20101012 17:27:25< boucman> * if the image is incorrect, primary will have a default one, secondary will be invisible
20101012 17:27:56< boucman> * engine generated color blending (poison) is only applied to primary frames
20101012 17:28:27< boucman> * engine generated highlighting (unit selection+invisible) is only applied to primary frames
20101012 17:28:40< boucman> * submerge is only applied to primary frames
20101012 17:29:04< boucman>  
20101012 17:29:07< boucman> and that's it
20101012 17:29:10< Elvish_Pillager> okay
20101012 17:29:25< Elvish_Pillager> it'd make sense to control all of those together, except submerge
20101012 17:29:33< Elvish_Pillager> submerge should be entirely refactored :/
20101012 17:29:56< boucman> why ?
20101012 17:30:08< Elvish_Pillager> well...
20101012 17:30:28< Elvish_Pillager> right now you can indicate a submerge value in the frames
20101012 17:30:32< Elvish_Pillager> but that forces it
20101012 17:30:38< Elvish_Pillager> that includes secondary frames
20101012 17:30:42< Elvish_Pillager> and overrides it for primary frames
20101012 17:31:08< Elvish_Pillager> it seems to me that it should work by having a boolean parameter to frames that indicates whether they can be submerged by the terrain or not
20101012 17:31:27< boucman> hmm
20101012 17:31:46< Elvish_Pillager> and...
20101012 17:31:53< boucman> tbh, submerge just works like everything else, but it's true that it makes little sense in that case
20101012 17:32:10< Elvish_Pillager> and currently, a "submerged" frame drawn above another frame shows the other frame through it, instead of the terrain
20101012 17:35:53< Elvish_Pillager> doing submerge in a truly nice way would be very complicated, and I haven't come up yet with a simple way that doesn't have some annoying problem
20101012 17:37:38< Elvish_Pillager> Hmm, what if you change it so that terrain-that-can-submerge-units has an extra, partially-transparent frame drawn at a higher layer?
20101012 17:38:09< Elvish_Pillager> Then you could decide whether a unit frame should be submerged by setting its layer, much the way you decide whether it appears in front of other hexes' castles and stuff.
20101012 17:38:43< Elvish_Pillager> (boucman:)
20101012 17:49:50< boucman> i'm not sure that the simplest/most robust way to do it
20101012 17:50:24< boucman> i'll do a global switch for everything left for the moment, and we can tweak submerge later
20101012 17:52:06< Elvish_Pillager> okay
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20101012 18:05:03< boucman> bbl
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20101012 18:17:25< zookeeper> wesbot, bug 16365
20101012 18:17:25< wesbot> Bug #16365  Assigned to: Jérémy Rosen <boucman>  Status: None  Priority: 5 - Normal
20101012 18:17:28< wesbot> Summary: Allow specific control of the current differences between [frame] and [xxx_frame]
20101012 18:17:31< wesbot> Original submission: currently, in an animation, a [frame] image is automatica
20101012 18:17:34< wesbot> lly recolored based on poison and petrification, while an [xxx_frame] is not, an
20101012 18:17:37< wesbot> URL: https://gna.org/bugs/?16365
20101012 18:18:17< zookeeper> why does wesbot split the Original submission line like that?=
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20101012 21:43:37< noy> Ivanovic: is there a list of all our years GSOC projects?
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20101012 21:49:07< gabba> bonjour
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20101012 21:49:58 * Soliton tips hat.
20101012 21:50:59< Ivanovic> noy: no
20101012 21:51:21< Ivanovic> the summary from last year is in the forums
20101012 21:51:30< Ivanovic> no idea about 2008
20101012 21:51:43< Ivanovic> and there is no dedicated summary about this years gsoc projects
20101012 21:52:14< Soliton> wiki category for soc might be a good overview.
20101012 21:55:06< noy> I looked through everything... 2008 was a missing year
20101012 21:55:13< noy> maybe we should take this to the mentor section
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--- Log closed Wed Oct 13 00:00:57 2010