--- Log opened Wed Feb 23 00:00:20 2011
20110223 00:09:48<+CIA-41> wesnoth-umc-dev: aethaeryn * r8874 /trunk/Master_of_Dungeons/lua/ (inventory.lua use_lua.cfg): Moving the inventory system into an object.
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20110223 00:24:03<+CIA-41> wesnoth-umc-dev: aethaeryn * r8875 /trunk/Master_of_Dungeons/lua/ (core.lua inventory.lua): Moving the DungeonInventory class to core.lua, but keeping the actual item table in inventory.lua
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20110223 00:58:58<+CIA-41> wesnoth-umc-dev: aethaeryn * r8876 /trunk/Master_of_Dungeons/lua/core.lua: Making it so any object name works when using the class.
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20110223 01:54:04<+CIA-41> wesnoth-umc-dev: espreon * r8877 /trunk/The_Silver_Lands/integrated_packages/Elementals_Sandbox/_main.cfg: TSL: ran umcpropfix.
20110223 01:54:35<+CIA-41> wesnoth-umc-dev: espreon * r8878 /trunk/The_Silver_Lands/ (4 files in 4 dirs): TSL: ran wmlindent.
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20110223 03:09:59<+CIA-41> wesnoth-umc-dev: aethaeryn * r8879 /trunk/Master_of_Dungeons/lua/core.lua: Cleaning up DungeonInventory's code a bit.
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20110223 03:47:09<+CIA-41> wesnoth-umc-dev: aethaeryn * r8880 /trunk/Master_of_Dungeons/lua/ (core.lua inventory.lua): Further cleanup of the basic inventory code.
20110223 04:08:45< Aethaeryn> I found a legitimate use for Figlet.
20110223 04:10:49< Espreon> Aethaeryn: Oh?
20110223 04:12:51< Aethaeryn> Headings.
20110223 04:14:36< Espreon> Ah.
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20110223 04:47:26<+CIA-41> wesnoth-umc-dev: aethaeryn * r8881 /trunk/Master_of_Dungeons/lua/ (DungeonInventory.lua DungeonOpt.lua core.lua use_lua.cfg): Spitting off DungeonOpt and DungeonInventory into their own files; cleaning up the way files are loaded in use_lua.cfg
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20110223 09:28:26< shadowm_laptop> woo, esr down!
20110223 09:28:31< shadowm_laptop> ;)
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20110223 10:17:38< vultraz> i'm still confused about reading attacks off a unit
20110223 10:22:59< vultraz> i'm not sure how to store them in a variable and then read it
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20110223 10:30:19< fendrin> vultraz: What exactly are you trying to do?
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20110223 10:31:13< vultraz> create a macro that displays a menu item when on a village that lets you leave some attacks in a chest for your allies to pick up
20110223 10:31:55< vultraz> and i can't create a conditional statement for every attack in wesnoth ;)
20110223 10:39:50< vultraz> u there
20110223 10:39:52< vultraz> ?
20110223 10:42:58< fendrin> vultraz: yes
20110223 10:43:01< fendrin> still there
20110223 10:43:50< vultraz> ok so how might i do what i want to do
20110223 10:43:52< fendrin> so a unit is able to leave its weapons in a village?
20110223 10:44:27< vultraz> that's what i'm trying to do :)
20110223 10:45:04< fendrin> hmmm
20110223 10:45:12< fendrin> I guess that is not an easy task.
20110223 10:45:15< fendrin> Let's see.
20110223 10:46:21< vultraz> i've got the menu item up, but i need the attacks to show now
20110223 10:46:57< fendrin> Saving the unit to a variable can be done manualy or you use the $unit that is stored by the moveto the village event.
20110223 10:47:20< fendrin> Inside the stored unit variable is an array called [attack] that does contain all the attacks of the unit.
20110223 10:47:42< zookeeper> in simple terms: it's too complicated, don't try it.
20110223 10:47:56< zookeeper> (unless you get someone to write it for you)
20110223 10:49:14< fendrin> You need to iterate over that array and create an [option] for every single item.
20110223 10:50:00< fendrin> vultraz: zookeeper is right that the task is not one of the easiest. But I guess with some reading and try and error you can figure it out.
20110223 10:50:17< vultraz> ok
20110223 10:50:27< vultraz> well, i gtg now
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20110223 12:16:15< AI0867> vultraz: it's possible in WML, but you'll probably get a large amount of convulated code. It's probably a lot easier in lua
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20110223 14:41:26<+CIA-41> wesnoth-umc-dev: grickit * r8882 /branches/irc-bots/Gambot/processors/plugins/conversation/quotes.txt: Moar quotes
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20110223 17:10:38<+CIA-41> wesnoth-umc-dev: grickit * r8883 /branches/irc-bots/Gambot/processors/plugins/conversation/quotes.txt: I found some more comedy gold quotes from Michele Bachmann. Apparently she huffs carbon-dioxide and hates gay people very passionately. Are the two linked? Who knows. :P
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20110223 17:26:45< zaroth> damage attribute in http://wiki.wesnoth.org/FilterWML#Filtering_Weapons is not entirely clear to me
20110223 17:27:00< zaroth> does it filter over damage or damage*strikes?
20110223 17:27:25< zookeeper> damage
20110223 17:28:32< zaroth> how can I do filtering over total damage (damage*strikes) then?
20110223 17:29:37< zookeeper> humm
20110223 17:29:39< zaroth> I would like to deprive players of weapons of damage potential over 20 by guards before they enter the city :-)
20110223 17:29:42< zookeeper> i guess you can't?
20110223 17:30:02< zaroth> all right, damage will have to do then...
20110223 17:30:04< zaroth> thanks :-)
20110223 17:30:21< zookeeper> well
20110223 17:30:30< zookeeper> i bet you can still do it with [filter_wml]
20110223 17:31:05< zookeeper> it'd get a bit more complicated though
20110223 17:52:29< zaroth> currently, if a terrain on a hex changes, it can be seen instantly by all players, even behind the fog, right?
20110223 17:52:46< zaroth> (of course not behind the shroud :) )
20110223 17:53:10< zaroth> if so, what can I do to prevent that?
20110223 17:55:31< Gambit> Nothing.
20110223 17:55:58< Gambit> Except shroud that hex. But then they'll know something's up there.
20110223 17:56:27< zaroth> Maybe is there a way to use shroud in a fog-wise way?
20110223 17:56:39< zaroth> so, basically thicken the fog a lot?
20110223 17:57:29< Gambit> That would be possible if add-ons could override mainline art.
20110223 17:57:49< Gambit> fendrin: Do you still have plans for swappable cores?
20110223 17:58:17< Gambit> Oh wait… They could still hover over the hex and read the terrain type.
20110223 18:00:57< zaroth> aww...
20110223 18:01:40< zookeeper> zaroth, why would you need it not display to all players immediately?
20110223 18:01:56< zaroth> because my add-on is about building your own dungeon
20110223 18:02:03< zaroth> you can imagine that involves a lot of digging
20110223 18:02:15< zaroth> and you wouldn't like your opponents to know where are you digging
20110223 18:02:30< Gambit> But then why not use shroud?
20110223 18:02:43< zaroth> is there an easy way to make it behave just like fog?
20110223 18:02:56< zaroth> or will I have to write nightmarish line of sight procedures?
20110223 18:03:00< zookeeper> well, you can use [place_shroud]
20110223 18:03:36< zookeeper> see what happens when you place shroud everywhere and then use [redraw]; i'd expect everyone's shroud vision to "reset" to what their units can currently see
20110223 18:04:28< zaroth> thanks for the pointer! I'll play with these :-)
20110223 18:05:00< zookeeper> you might need to add side=1,2,3,4,howevermanysidesyouhave to the [redraw]
20110223 18:05:44< zookeeper> so basically if you do what i just said in a side turn event, you should get shroud which behaves sort of like fog
20110223 18:06:08< zaroth> but won't it be like super slow during replays since I'll have to do after every unit's move?
20110223 18:07:06< zookeeper> if you do it every side turn then you're not doing it after every unit's move...
20110223 18:07:23< zookeeper> and there's not really any reason to do the latter that i can see
20110223 18:07:47< zaroth> ah, right
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20110223 18:55:23< zaroth> let me just ramble for a moment now, if anyone has useful suggestions, please give them :-)
20110223 18:55:54< zaroth> the thing is, I initially wanted to implement digging by choosing in a context menu with a miner "switch to mining mode"
20110223 18:56:12< zaroth> which would change the movement type of the miner to a mining one
20110223 18:56:52< zaroth> which would have movement costs over different kinds of impassable terrains (the more mp cost, the less experienced miner and the harder the terrain is to dig)
20110223 18:57:59< zaroth> upon standing on an impassable hex, the terrain would change to cave floor/anything else applicable
20110223 18:58:53< zaroth> it would be convenient for player, because it would allow him to easily see how far this miner can dig in this turn
20110223 18:59:32< Gambit> That is an interesting way to work with the existing system.
20110223 18:59:41< zaroth> but I noticed a problem with this idea... the miner would see behind the wall he is able to dig
20110223 19:00:00< zaroth> so he would notice a tunnel behind a wall prior to digging the wall
20110223 19:00:49< zaroth> and I think he would still see the tunnel even if I set the movement costs on cave floor (which the tunnel behind the wall would be made of) to infinity
20110223 19:00:52< zaroth> in the digging mode
20110223 19:01:03< zaroth> or am I wrong?
20110223 19:02:05< zaroth> so perhaps I will have to stick to one hex - one context menu - one click mode :(
20110223 19:10:35< zaroth> or is there a way to somehow force line of sight to 1? that would be great :D
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20110223 19:39:57< zaroth> nevermind my previous idea then, I'm going to implement this by right clicking next to a miner and choosing dig
20110223 19:40:28< zaroth> however, this concept has a problem of choosing the miner which should do this task if two of them are standing next to the clicked hex
20110223 19:40:59< zaroth> does anybody know of an add-on where units have such abilities and you have many of them?
20110223 19:41:28< zaroth> i'd like to see how the author solved this problem...
20110223 19:42:05< zaroth> in bob's rpg era you can set traps by clicking next to you, but only your one unit can do it, so determining which unit should do the task isn't hard ;-)
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20110223 20:44:11< zookeeper> zaroth, that's solvable
20110223 20:45:01< zaroth> zookeeper: you mean the issue with seeing tunnels behind or picking the right adjacent unit?
20110223 20:45:09< zookeeper> picking the right unit
20110223 20:45:42< zookeeper> make a select event which for example stores the selected unit, and then in your menu item you make that unit do the digging. and also make the menu item appear only when the stored unit is a digger.
20110223 20:45:44< zaroth> is there a working solution on add-on server so I could look at it and not bother others with questions ? :-)
20110223 20:46:14< zookeeper> not sure, probably there is but i can't name any
20110223 20:48:13< zaroth> thanks
20110223 20:49:09< zookeeper> of course you could also make it work so that when you right-click a digger and select "dig", the digger gets a different movetype and 1MP
20110223 20:50:04< zookeeper> and then when you move him into the cave wall, he changes that hex and then either reverts back to normal or you get 1MP more and can continue as long as you wish
20110223 20:50:28< zaroth> but how do I make him able to dig several hexes then? do I store previous mp number in a variable?
20110223 20:50:43< zookeeper> yes
20110223 20:50:44< zaroth> but this variable should span across several different digging events for this unit
20110223 20:51:05< zookeeper> you can store unit-specific variables inside the unit itself
20110223 20:51:17< zookeeper> {VARIABLE mystoredunit.variables.mycustomvariable "foo"}
20110223 20:51:32< zaroth> OH! :D
20110223 20:51:56< zookeeper> so you could do something like {VARIABLE mydigger.variables.real_moves_left $mydigger.moves}
20110223 20:52:33< zaroth> that's awesome, I think that my random approach to learn WML is the reason I don't know such things :-)
20110223 20:53:05< zookeeper> ...and then you can change the movetype and mp's, and when you later change them back you just do {VARIABLE mydigger.moves $mydigger.variables.real_moves_left} (and maybe decrement by 1 or whatever)
20110223 20:53:17< zaroth> but I doubt if there exists a WML tutorial to learn things in organized way right now
20110223 20:53:25< zookeeper> there doesn't
20110223 20:54:20< zaroth> yeah, but I think the problem with seeing tunnels behind a wall one-hex wide will still persist
20110223 20:54:38< zookeeper> sure
20110223 20:54:43< zaroth> since even when I can't step on deep water
20110223 20:54:52< zaroth> I can see it when it's next to grassland
20110223 20:55:30< zookeeper> if you want to prevent that completely, then you need to make it work so that you just right-click on the wall and never allow the diggers to actually move onto walls
20110223 20:55:50< zookeeper> hmh
20110223 20:55:58< zaroth> I thought of a solution involving forced shrouding of distances further than one hex when in a dig mode
20110223 20:56:18< zookeeper> (nevermind the hmh)
20110223 20:56:35< zaroth> but it's all kind of messy...
20110223 20:57:29< zaroth> I'd really love to implement the walking-digging approach
20110223 20:57:46< zaroth> since I played zombie apocalypse rpg
20110223 20:57:49< zaroth> and already know
20110223 20:58:08< zaroth> that a map where you have to right-click every moment on nearly every hex
20110223 20:58:15< zaroth> doesn't give a pleasant playing experience
20110223 20:59:37< zaroth> and the idea for at least some maps in my addon is that it'll be nearly sandbox mode... so just some gold here and there, two keeps and the rest of the map is diggable cave wall
20110223 21:00:16< zaroth> with varying difficulty of digging through it
20110223 21:01:41< zookeeper> well there's not really any way around it; your vision is always your movement range + 1 hex
20110223 21:01:57< zookeeper> so if you can move into a hex of cave wall, you'll always see all its neighbouring hexes as well
20110223 21:02:18< zaroth> maybe I could program some line of sight tags into WML then, since my addon is for 1.9 anyway?
20110223 21:02:53< zookeeper> "line of sight tag" meaning what? the vision rules are hardcoded, there's no way to change them in an add-on
20110223 21:03:24< zaroth> yeah, but I mean adding it to WML, so changing it in C++ code
20110223 21:03:40< zaroth> (my winter holidays are just starting so I consider crazy things)
20110223 21:04:15< zookeeper> well, i guess that'd work if you could implement it well
20110223 21:05:12< zaroth> are you the developer by whom would I have my patch accepted if I wrote it?
20110223 21:05:22< zaroth> I mean
20110223 21:05:46< zookeeper> nope, i don't touch c++
20110223 21:05:48< zaroth> which is responsible for this code area and the one I'd have to ask for acceptation
20110223 21:06:05< zookeeper> i have a say about how the feature should work though
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20110223 21:07:02< zaroth> I thought about something like limit_los = {no,1,2,3,4,x hexes}
20110223 21:07:09< zookeeper> oh, wait
20110223 21:07:13< zaroth> in UnitWML
20110223 21:07:15< zookeeper> i might have remembered something
20110223 21:07:37< zaroth> with default of "no" obviously
20110223 21:08:41< zookeeper> you could do this: change the digger's movetype, set the moves to 1 but max_moves to 0; that might work.
20110223 21:08:59< zookeeper> moves can be higher than max_moves, but only max_moves is used for calculating vision
20110223 21:09:00< zaroth> nice one!
20110223 21:09:18< zaroth> I'll try it right now :D
20110223 21:09:57< zookeeper> in any case, about the feature: what you're suggesting would be pretty limited. my pet idea is to just support an optional [vision_costs] tag alongside [movement_costs].
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20110223 21:12:49< zaroth> that doesn't sound too hard to code (I'm speaking about C++), it sounds like "duplicating" (not exactly) some code that already exists and making line of sight use it with a fallback to movement_costs
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20110223 21:13:23< zaroth> probably easier than adding a whole new tag which would be taken care of in the los algorithm ;-)
20110223 21:13:38< zaroth> as a limitation
20110223 21:14:27< zaroth> it also wouldn't confuse the player with 1/0 MPs...
20110223 21:25:13< zaroth> zookeeper: which C++ developer of the team would be the most appropriate to ask questions to about this area if I decided to do something in this field?
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20110223 22:00:41< zookeeper> zaroth, maybe sapient
20110223 22:09:26< fendrin> Gambit: hello
20110223 22:09:39< fendrin> Gambit: Yes, what do you want to know about the cores?
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--- Log closed Thu Feb 24 00:00:20 2011