--- Log opened Tue Apr 10 00:00:48 2012
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20120410 01:06:29< neofutur> hi all
20120410 01:06:45< neofutur> i cant find a package for 1.10 on ubuntu 10.04 lucid
20120410 01:08:34< shadowm> neofutur: check in lucid-backports
20120410 01:09:12< shadowm> I can see 1.10.1 there
20120410 01:10:16< neofutur> thanks i needed the keyword "lucid-backports" to find it
20120410 01:10:44< neofutur> there should be a word or a link on http://wiki.wesnoth.org/WesnothBinariesLinux
20120410 01:11:03< neofutur> no way to find 1.10 on wiki.wesnoth.org/WesnothBinariesLinux
20120410 01:11:04< shadowm> you are free to edit that page yourself
20120410 01:12:10< neofutur> ok I will
20120410 01:17:23< neofutur> done
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20120410 01:32:52< inkybutton> hi
20120410 01:34:28< inkybutton> are you guys aware of an "official" android port on android market?
20120410 01:34:33< inkybutton> https://play.google.com/store/apps/details?id=com.androthsoft.battle
20120410 01:35:20< inkybutton> i went on their website, they don't provide any way to download their source
20120410 01:35:25< shadowm> yes, we are
20120410 01:35:43< inkybutton> i see
20120410 01:35:44< shadowm> the author is even one of us
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20120410 01:37:02< inkybutton> ok
20120410 01:37:13< inkybutton> and is it licensed under GPL?
20120410 01:37:20< shadowm> yes
20120410 01:38:18< inkybutton> oic - does it mean the source release for the port will be soon? :)
20120410 01:38:43< shadowm> the source has been available in a git repository online for a good while already
20120410 01:39:41< shadowm> it's probably in the interest of the author to keep it relatively secret to avoid people plagiarizing it in some fashion
20120410 01:40:01< inkybutton> well, that kinda doesn't conform to GPL...
20120410 01:40:17< shadowm> the GPL requires you to provide the source if asked for it
20120410 01:40:28< shadowm> he's provided the link to the repository before when asked for it, and here it is: https://github.com/cjhopman/Battle-for-Wesnoth-on-Android
20120410 01:40:44< inkybutton> it requires a written offer actually
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20120410 01:40:48< shadowm> so there's no violation as far as I am concerned as one of the copyright holders
20120410 01:41:32< inkybutton> so it should have a link, or a paragraph that says it can send you a CD containing source for a fee
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20120410 01:46:13< inkybutton> sorry if i sound prying shadowm
20120410 01:46:38< inkybutton> i've been a fan of the game for years, and one of the reasons why i love it is because it's FOSS
20120410 01:46:51< shadowm> sure, we all do
20120410 01:48:11< shadowm> but this kind of concerns are better sent to the maintainer directly in my experience
20120410 01:48:25< inkybutton> but atm it doesn't seem to be conforming to the letter, or if not that, the spirit of free software
20120410 01:48:33< inkybutton> cheerio
20120410 01:52:18< inkybutton> shadowm, i read a comment on the android market page where someone asked them for the source code
20120410 01:52:25< inkybutton> they apparently never replied
20120410 01:52:52< shadowm> well, I said 'directly' above
20120410 01:53:14< shadowm> he's cjhopman in the forums and can be dropped a private message as such
20120410 01:54:35< inkybutton> well ok
20120410 01:57:33< Gambit> 04-09 19:46:39| <inkybutton> i've been a fan of the game for years, and one of the reasons why i love it is because it's FOSS
20120410 01:57:38< Gambit> The game itself could be total shit!
20120410 01:57:46< Gambit> I only care that it's open source and doesn't cost me a dime!
20120410 01:58:05< Gambit> Conversely it could be the most amazing game of all time, and if they charge so much as a dollar for it; EVIL!
20120410 01:58:14< inkybutton> thanks troll
20120410 01:58:38< Gambit> And god forbid they copyright their art/music assets so they don't have to worry about others releasing their hardwork and circumventing their attempts to feed their families.
20120410 01:59:30< Gambit> That said, the two ports could use a bit more transparency :P
20120410 01:59:36< shadowm> The GNU GPL isn't public domain and you know it.
20120410 01:59:53< shadowm> Then again, you could have expressed your point in a far more sensible fashion altogether.
20120410 02:00:16< inkybutton> GPL allows you to charge money
20120410 02:00:32< Gambit> shadowm: It's a statistically safe bet that he's just another random FSF zealot who's upset the game is on an app store.
20120410 02:00:36< inkybutton> i didn't even mention that it costs $4.~ because I would buy it
20120410 02:00:45< shadowm> Gambit: Are you having a bad day there?
20120410 02:00:48< inkybutton> IF the source came with it
20120410 02:01:09< shadowm> It's not like you to go around insulting people like that. Being annoying? Yes, but insulting? No.
20120410 02:03:06< inkybutton> shadowm, heh, it's ok, i come from the internet
20120410 02:03:41< inkybutton> that was easymode
20120410 02:04:35< Gambit> inkybutton: Source is here: https://github.com/cjhopman/Battle-for-Wesnoth-on-Android
20120410 02:04:40< Gambit> He does a horrible job at keeping it up to date
20120410 02:04:54 * shadowm linked it above before.
20120410 02:05:00< inkybutton> yeah
20120410 02:05:04 * Gambit brings the android port sticky up to the standards set by the ios port sticky
20120410 02:05:16< shadowm> 13 days doesn't sound that horrible right now.
20120410 02:05:32< shadowm> Also, it's rude to edit other people's topics with your powers without asking them first.
20120410 02:05:33< Gambit> shadowm: he's underway in updating it to 1.10.x IIRC
20120410 02:06:15< shadowm> Some people, including me, like to hold on public repository updates to avoid leaking subpar work-in-progress material.
20120410 02:08:36< Gambit> shadowm: it's a sticky
20120410 02:08:43< Gambit> he only has ownership to make editing possible/easier
20120410 02:08:56< shadowm> And it currently belongs to cjhopman.
20120410 02:09:05< shadowm> Also, I am the admin and I told him to make it, not you. :)
20120410 02:10:00< shadowm> If you want to propose additions, you should prod him unless you would prefer to bypass his implicit authority for some specific reason, but even then you'll have to go through me first seeing as you are neither an admin nor a moderator.
20120410 02:10:37 * Gambit looks for the ios port source
20120410 02:11:01< shadowm> It's known to be outdated.
20120410 02:12:20 * Gambit puts a little note next to both of them
20120410 02:12:58< shadowm> Are you ignoring my requirements above?
20120410 02:13:16< Gambit> shadowm: About that, I'd like to go back on active moderator status.
20120410 02:13:21< shadowm> Denied.
20120410 02:13:26< Gambit> rofl
20120410 02:16:44< inkybutton> wow there's an iOS port?
20120410 02:16:55< inkybutton> is it distributed on the app store?
20120410 02:17:03< shadowm> ... yes.
20120410 02:17:30< Gambit> inkybutton: And it actually has legitimate reasons to be upset about it :o
20120410 02:17:49< inkybutton> pretty sure App Store's terms are incompatible with the GPL
20120410 02:17:56< shadowm> Please, let's not go there.
20120410 02:17:58< Gambit> That is not among them.
20120410 02:18:33< Gambit> Unless you're a major contributor to the game.
20120410 02:18:41< inkybutton> does it matter?
20120410 02:18:45< Gambit> (out of the current conversation, only shadowm applies)
20120410 02:18:58< inkybutton> i have not contributed the game in any useful way, except for playing it, ill confess
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20120410 02:19:32< inkybutton> but there must be hundreds or thousands of individuals who contributed to the source of wesnoth
20120410 02:19:42< Gambit> Yes it matters because only the developers have the right to take legal issue with it.
20120410 02:20:02< inkybutton> i'm pointing out a problem, not taking you to court
20120410 02:20:20< Gambit> And minor developers (like myself) can simply have their stuff removed if they really want to be a wrench in the gears.
20120410 02:21:25< Gambit> All that legal stuff aside, the big reason to be upset about the port is that it's fallen woefully out of date and has major bugs
20120410 02:21:32< Gambit> It's ripping people off in Wesnoth's name :(
20120410 02:21:45< Gambit> (the iOS port I mean)
20120410 02:22:05< inkybutton> and can other people contribute?
20120410 02:22:38< shadowm> Wesnoth uses an open development model and there are four primary contribution channels.
20120410 02:22:46< Gambit> The code diverged so much from normal Wesnoth, and it's so many years out of date that that would be impractical.
20120410 02:22:56< inkybutton> hehe
20120410 02:23:09< shadowm> The iOS port does not use such model.
20120410 02:23:15< Gambit> The port would need redone from scratch really.
20120410 02:23:39< Gambit> Currently the multiplayer (a major advertised feature) does not even work :\
20120410 02:23:54< Gambit> It really should just be pulled from the store at this point...
20120410 02:23:55< shadowm> Gambit: Yes, but there's no need to keep igniting the fire.
20120410 02:24:00< Gambit> Until the author comes back and updates it
20120410 02:24:12< Gambit> Oh but wait. He's busy selling digital trading cards!
20120410 02:24:51< inkybutton> shadowm, right, but it's still illegal of him to do that port
20120410 02:25:13< Gambit> inkybutton: And this is why I get upset at people like you
20120410 02:25:17< Gambit> I have real, practical concerns
20120410 02:25:25< inkybutton> and im just raising another concern
20120410 02:25:32< Gambit> And they're buried under an ocean of abstract legal crap
20120410 02:25:41< inkybutton> i agree it sucks that it doesn't play well
20120410 02:25:53< shadowm> Our contributors already had their chance to raise their concerns back in the day and the matter was settled internally.
20120410 02:26:02< Gambit> It's only illegal if the developers say it is.
20120410 02:26:08< Gambit> And they haven't done so.
20120410 02:26:19< inkybutton> well ok
20120410 02:26:34< inkybutton> if they all have licensed it differently it's fine
20120410 02:26:58< inkybutton> different*
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20120410 02:32:56< Gambit> inkybutton: There's a great article on the matter here: http://shadowm.rewound.net/blog/archives/195-The-Fall-of-Wesnoth-for-iOS.html
20120410 02:33:25< shadowm> Could you stop linking that around?
20120410 02:34:02< Gambit> shadowm: Okay.
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20120410 02:37:12< inkybutton> interesting read
20120410 02:37:25< inkybutton> shadowm, why not just take it off?
20120410 02:37:28< inkybutton> i mean, the blog post.
20120410 02:37:48< shadowm> Because I don't feel a need to do so.
20120410 02:38:05< shadowm> Not yet anyway.
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20120410 10:57:35< Blah> hi
20120410 10:57:49< Blah> I registerd for GSoC and I got an email saying that I should attempt to fix 1-2 bugs
20120410 10:57:59< Blah> the email delivered late so I just knew about it today
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20120410 10:58:20< Blah> should I start working on some bugs?
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20120410 11:06:52< Crendgrim> Blah: best ask in #wesnoth-dev about GSoC stuff
20120410 11:07:11< Blah> oh ok thanks
20120410 11:07:21< Blah> how do I change channels :D
20120410 11:07:31< Blah> sorry I have not been using IRC for a long time
20120410 11:07:31< Crendgrim> /join #wesnoth-dev
20120410 11:07:34< Blah> thanks
20120410 11:07:58< Crendgrim> yw
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20120410 12:07:25< matthiaskrgr> is there anything like a "retro-wesnoth" with the current engine but graphics and units from versions like 0.8 ? 
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20120410 12:13:53< loonycyborg> matthiaskrgr: Why would you want that?
20120410 12:14:20< loonycyborg> Considering you could just use old versions without much additional work..
20120410 12:14:34< matthiaskrgr> hmm, if if compiles...? :P
20120410 12:14:37< matthiaskrgr> I'll try
20120410 12:15:02< matthiaskrgr> did anyone make a script which gets some useful version tags into git-svn  ? 
20120410 12:17:27< loonycyborg> git svn fetch
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20120410 12:24:10< matthiaskrgr> loonycyborg:  I already have a full git-svn clone
20120410 12:25:24< loonycyborg> 'git svn fetch' gets all tags and branches too.
20120410 12:25:37< matthiaskrgr> oh
20120410 12:25:39< loonycyborg> And old versions happen to be tags :P
20120410 12:27:12< matthiaskrgr> mmh
20120410 12:27:55< matthiaskrgr> "git tag" doesn't say anything
20120410 12:32:29< loonycyborg> git branch -r
20120410 12:33:28< matthiaskrgr> git-svn
20120410 12:34:20< matthiaskrgr> well, I did   git log --grep="0.8"  now  and checked out something which looked promising
20120410 12:35:20< matthiaskrgr> but mmh,  the old versios will probably not compile with gcc 4.7 
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--- Log closed Wed Apr 11 00:00:48 2012