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20120722 10:23:48< shadowm> boucman: You forgot to mention in your answer that art should exclusively go through the Art Contributions forum or a director, and music through Music & Sound Development.
20120722 10:24:24< boucman> good point, could you add a post, i'm late and I must run...
20120722 10:24:31< shadowm> Okay.
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20120722 11:10:24< CIA-87> fendrin * r54815 /trunk/src/ (17 files in 3 dirs): The palette is now a part of theme wml instead of being placed at hardcoded coordinates. Windows and Mac build systems still have to be adjusted.
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20120722 12:51:01< CIA-87> fendrin * r54816 /trunk/src/image.hpp: Fixed spelling in comments.
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20120722 13:04:24< CIA-87> fendrin * r54817 /trunk/src/ (9 files in 3 dirs): 
20120722 13:04:24< CIA-87> Enabled the side menu in the editor.
20120722 13:04:24< CIA-87> It allows side creation and switching for now.
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20120722 13:25:32< CIA-87> fendrin * r54818 /trunk/src/editor/editor_controller.cpp: 
20120722 13:25:32< CIA-87> Redraw the palette every time a side is switchted.
20120722 13:25:32< CIA-87> This updates the unit's team color for example.
20120722 13:33:39< fendrin> hi loonycyborg
20120722 13:33:49< loonycyborg> Hello
20120722 13:34:12< fendrin> loonycyborg: I think I broke Windows building, would you please fix it?
20120722 13:35:10< loonycyborg> How exactly?
20120722 13:35:32< fendrin> the src/editor/palette/palette_layout.*pp files are no more.
20120722 13:36:30< fendrin> I fixed scons and cmake building, no idea about msvs and others.
20120722 13:36:47< loonycyborg> I use scons on windows too.
20120722 13:38:17< loonycyborg> Better warn anony or timotei or whoever maintains them :P
20120722 13:39:17< timotei> loonycyborg, fendrin: I'll fix them.
20120722 13:40:16< vultraz> I'll fix the XCode one
20120722 13:41:50< fendrin> cool, tx everybody :-)
20120722 13:46:36< CIA-87> vultraz * r54819 /trunk/projectfiles/Xcode/Wesnoth.xcodeproj/project.pbxproj: Removed refs to deleted files
20120722 13:49:51-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: 179 bugs, 337 feature requests, 17 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20120722 15:17:24< CIA-87> timotei * r54820 /trunk/projectfiles/VC9/wesnoth.vcproj: Update the MSVC9 solution file - remove the palette_layout files
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20120722 16:02:35< mordante> servus
20120722 16:02:43< mordante> wesbot, seen akihara
20120722 16:02:43< wesbot> mordante: The person with the nick Akihara last spoke 5d 23h ago.  1d 6h ago was here and on the channel #wesnoth with the message: Remote host closed the connection
20120722 16:02:51< lipkab> hi mordante
20120722 16:02:59< mordante> hi lipkab 
20120722 16:03:42< lipkab> mordante: Does the GUI2 toggle button have an attribute to set its initial state/value?
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20120722 16:04:37< mordante> lipkab, probably not
20120722 16:09:17< mordante> timotei regarding r54814 some comment on why setting the failbit and MSVC's behaviour on it would be appreciated
20120722 16:09:27< mordante> in a year somebody will wonder why it was done
20120722 16:09:44< timotei> mordante: I recall I've written about it in the catch(std::ios::failure).
20120722 16:10:04< mordante> timotei, there is some information, but at the point where it is set not
20120722 16:10:06< timotei> Or isn't that the (only) right place?
20120722 16:10:09< timotei> Ah. OK
20120722 16:10:11< mordante> no
20120722 16:10:34< timotei> I'll write at the point where it's set too
20120722 16:10:40< mordante> we set the bit since we want our exception to propagate instead of only setting the fail state
20120722 16:10:52< timotei> Yup
20120722 16:15:07< CIA-87> timotei * r54821 /trunk/src/serialization/preprocessor.cpp: Add more clarifications regarding setting the exceptions mask in the preprocessor.
20120722 16:15:35< timotei> mordante: ^
20120722 16:16:22< mordante> thanks
20120722 16:16:48< timotei> YW
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20120722 18:29:20< CIA-87> fendrin * r54822 /trunk/ (11 files in 6 dirs): 
20120722 18:29:20< CIA-87> Implemented a dialog for editing the map labels in the editor.
20120722 18:29:20< CIA-87> Changes to the side menu generation:
20120722 18:29:20< CIA-87> Shows the correct side numbers and names,
20120722 18:29:20< CIA-87> sadly the default for a side name is "1".
20120722 18:30:02< fendrin> timotei, vultraz ^ New files...
20120722 18:30:49< vultraz> kk
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20120722 18:35:42< timotei> Hmm, maybe I could write a script that updates automatically the MSVC solution...
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20120722 18:37:47< vultraz> fendrin: shouldn't the old editor gui files go in the new folder too? eg editor_generate_map
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20120722 18:38:36< CIA-87> alarantalara * r54823 /trunk/projectfiles/Xcode/Wesnoth.xcodeproj/project.pbxproj: Add new files to Xcode project
20120722 18:42:45< fendrin> vultraz: yeah
20120722 18:43:02< fendrin> Alarantalara: tx
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20120722 19:15:33< CIA-87> mordante * r54824 /trunk/src/editor/editor_controller.cpp: Remove an old-style-cast.
20120722 19:17:15< CIA-87> timotei * r54825 /trunk/projectfiles/VC9/wesnoth.vcproj: Update the MSVC9 project
20120722 19:19:08< lipkab> fendrin: When I move the cursor over the label tool, the icon slightly moves vertically. Not a big deal, but it looks strange.
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20120722 19:22:42< CIA-87> anonymissimus * r54826 /trunk/src/editor/palette/common_palette.hpp: fix MSVC warning about struct/class declaration inconsistency
20120722 19:22:55< CIA-87> anonymissimus * r54827 /trunk/projectfiles/CodeBlocks/wesnoth.cbp: cb project update
20120722 19:25:12< anonymissimus> timotei: output directory!
20120722 19:25:41< timotei> anonymissimus: ?
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20120722 19:30:58< anonymissimus> timotei: if you add files in subdir they should  have the according output dir for the .obj set
20120722 19:31:08< anonymissimus> especialy for gui/
20120722 19:31:19< fendrin> lipkab: I see. Seems like a shift in the artwork.
20120722 19:31:27< fendrin> vultraz: ^
20120722 19:31:39< timotei> anonymissimus: Ah damn. I fiorgot
20120722 19:31:42< timotei> forgot*
20120722 19:32:26< vultraz> fendrin: what label button is currently in trunk? the new blue one or the old brown one
20120722 19:32:39< timotei> anonymissimus: I'll fix it.
20120722 19:32:59< anonymissimus> timotei: pls don't I commit
20120722 19:33:05< timotei> anonymissimus: OK :)
20120722 19:33:20< timotei> I think I really have to make a script for this kind of situations.
20120722 19:33:21< timotei> It'
20120722 19:33:25< timotei> It's a PITA 
20120722 19:33:46< anonymissimus> thats futile AFAICT
20120722 19:33:49< timotei> Why?
20120722 19:33:54< timotei> It seems scriptable
20120722 19:33:59< anonymissimus> the structure is too complicated and unstable
20120722 19:34:00< timotei> It's basically just XML
20120722 19:34:15< CIA-87> fendrin * r54828 /trunk/src/editor/action/mouse/mouse_action_unit.cpp: 
20120722 19:34:15< CIA-87> Mouse overlay for the place unit editor tool.
20120722 19:34:15< CIA-87> Even in team color, yeah!
20120722 19:34:27< anonymissimus> and for VC10 you have everything new
20120722 19:34:35< timotei> anonymissimus: Well, let's drop VC10
20120722 19:34:36< timotei> xD
20120722 19:34:43< timotei> It's not maintained anyway
20120722 19:34:47< fendrin> vultraz: It's still brown.
20120722 19:34:54< timotei> We could just jump to VC11 if we want
20120722 19:35:15< vultraz> fendrin: well, there's a new blue version, lemme see if the problem is there too
20120722 19:35:39< anonymissimus> timotei: I don't mind removing the VC10 files
20120722 19:35:52< timotei> anonymissimus: Could you do that too if you fix the MSVC9 then?
20120722 19:35:59< anonymissimus> if I use it the next time I'll upconvert the vc9 ones anyway
20120722 19:36:06< timotei> Yeah
20120722 19:36:46< anonymissimus> okay, anythign in there worth being kept ?
20120722 19:37:12< timotei> Nope
20120722 19:37:57< anonymissimus> fendrin: more files to come ?
20120722 19:42:16< vultraz> fendrin: ok, there's a little brightening of the icon and it looks like it moves a little, but that happens for all icons, not just label
20120722 19:43:26< CIA-87> anonymissimus * r54829 /trunk/projectfiles/VC9/wesnoth.vcproj: vc project update
20120722 19:43:46< CIA-87> anonymissimus * r54830 /trunk/projectfiles/CodeBlocks/wesnoth.cbp: cb project update
20120722 19:43:55< CIA-87> anonymissimus * r54831 /trunk/projectfiles/VC10/ (12 files): 
20120722 19:43:55< CIA-87> remove VC10 project files
20120722 19:43:55< CIA-87> They are unmaintained; it should in any case be easier to upconvert
20120722 19:43:55< CIA-87> the VC9 files and use them, so this prevents people from trying
20120722 19:43:55< CIA-87> VC10 and getting stuck.
20120722 19:44:00< vultraz> fendrin: if you want, I can commit the new label icon ( http://imagebin.org/221737 )
20120722 19:49:11< fendrin> vultraz: yes, please do so.
20120722 19:49:47< fendrin> anonymissimus: Yes, there are still some files on their way.
20120722 19:50:42< lipkab> vultraz: The label is the only one with noticable movement...
20120722 19:51:31< vultraz> lipkab: huh....ok lemme compile latest trunk and see if it's different
20120722 19:55:43< CIA-87> vultraz * r54832 /trunk/images/buttons/ (3 files): Adding new editor label icon images
20120722 19:56:07< vultraz> fendrin: ^
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20120722 20:02:41< fendrin> vultraz: The label tool still misses the hex overlay image, or do I remember incorrectly?
20120722 20:03:07< vultraz> yes, it does
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20120722 20:09:35< CIA-87> espreon * r54833 /trunk/src/gui/dialogs/addon/ (filter_options.cpp filter_options.hpp): Ran umcpropfix.
20120722 20:10:20< vultraz> fendrin: I can draw one now
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20120722 20:21:35< fendrin> vultraz: Nice, maybe just a A in a bigger font?
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20120722 21:29:46< vultraz> fendrin: http://imagebin.org/221751
20120722 21:31:33< fendrin> vultraz: Please commit it.
20120722 21:38:04< vultraz> fendrin: BTW got a warning on src/editor/map/context_manager.cpp http://imagebin.org/221752 
20120722 21:41:07< shadowm> vultraz: What is that for and why is it so terribly aliased?
20120722 21:41:43< vultraz> shadowm: label tool overlay. what, need less aliased?
20120722 21:42:00< shadowm> I can see the pixels in the letter edges at 100%.
20120722 21:42:00< vultraz> aliasing* 
20120722 21:42:18< shadowm> The dark pixels, that is.
20120722 21:42:33< vultraz> hm..what are you saying...make them lighter?
20120722 21:42:47< shadowm> I don't know what I am saying because I have no idea what that is for.
20120722 21:43:16< vultraz> you know how like a flag appears in the hex in the editor when you're setting starting positions?
20120722 21:43:28< vultraz> well this is supposed to be the same thing, but for labels
20120722 21:43:39< shadowm> Oh. The editor.
20120722 21:44:46-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20120722 21:44:51< ancestral> Typically, a serif-ed capital A is used for text. It's a convention of sorts
20120722 21:45:07< ancestral> (for a button, if that's what you're making)
20120722 21:45:17< shadowm> Thank you, Captain Obvious.
20120722 21:45:17< shadowm> I wasn't asking that.
20120722 21:45:22< vultraz> I already did the button...
20120722 21:45:51< ancestral> shadowm: And I wan't talking to you…
20120722 21:46:03< ancestral> *wasn't
20120722 21:46:37< vultraz> ancestral: serif-ed?
20120722 21:46:38< fendrin> vultraz: Thanks, that is the fix for a bug.
20120722 21:46:52< shadowm> https://dl.dropbox.com/u/21371130/screenshots/serif-capital-a.png
20120722 21:47:01< ancestral> Hmm, it seems maybe a capital T is at least equally used.
20120722 21:47:20< vultraz> shadowm: fat o_O
20120722 21:47:21< ancestral> Eh, whatever, I'm sure it's fine
20120722 21:47:34< shadowm> vultraz: And looks better in my opinion.
20120722 21:47:55< vultraz> hm..
20120722 21:48:03< shadowm> Also, it's called "bold".
20120722 21:48:14< shadowm> Serif Bold 58, to be specific.
20120722 21:48:17< vultraz> lemme thin and color it a bit and see
20120722 21:48:58< shadowm> What font did you use for yours¡
20120722 21:49:00< shadowm> * ?
20120722 21:49:14< vultraz> none...I just drew an A
20120722 21:49:18< shadowm> I suspected that.
20120722 21:49:25< shadowm> That's why it looks so terrible. :p
20120722 21:49:42< vultraz> ¬_¬
20120722 21:49:55< vultraz> fine I'll use yours for the overlay...
20120722 21:50:01< vultraz> keep mine for the button
20120722 21:50:02< shadowm> Don't use mine.
20120722 21:50:14< vultraz> you said MINE sucked
20120722 21:50:18< shadowm> Ask your image editor to draw a non-antialiased A in Serif Bold 58 or so and then use that.
20120722 21:51:01< shadowm> Mine happens to be antialiased, and uploaded in an inadequate format for editing.
20120722 21:51:05< lipkab> Does the label need an overlay at all? It's basically just saying "hey, there's a label below me!".
20120722 21:51:29< shadowm> No, it's for when you are hovering hexes.
20120722 21:51:44< shadowm> The overlay indicates that the text tool is the currently selected tool.
20120722 21:51:55< lipkab> Ah, I see.
20120722 21:53:50< vultraz> shadowm: regular serif looks better I think..
20120722 21:53:59< shadowm> lipkab: re the China block thing (assuming it's true in the first place), wesnoth isn't the only user of the same server provider.
20120722 21:54:52< lipkab> shadowm: So it may got blocked because of a different site?
20120722 21:55:03< shadowm> Odds are they blocked the IP block to which we belong, or broke the route.
20120722 21:56:30< shadowm> Yes, that's what I mean in simpler words I guess.
20120722 21:58:40< lipkab> Frankly, what came to my mind first is that their monitoring program auto-blacklisted wesnoth.org after digging up some political topic in Offtopic.
20120722 21:59:03< mordante> I'm off night
20120722 21:59:07< shadowm> That's possible too... I forgot about Off-Topic.
20120722 21:59:29< shadowm> I stopped paying attention when a bunch of retards decided to start a topic for doomed forced memes.
20120722 22:01:10< shadowm> lipkab: How goes your patch's approval, by the way?
20120722 22:01:23 * lipkab shrugs
20120722 22:01:28< lipkab> I don't know.
20120722 22:01:32< shadowm> I think I haven't heard anything through my email inbox for a while.
20120722 22:02:22< lipkab> Originally I planned to do it in two patches, the first of which is already done.
20120722 22:02:36< shadowm> "shadowm@reicore:~/src/wesnoth$ svn patch --help
20120722 22:02:36< shadowm> "patch": unknown command.
20120722 22:03:00< shadowm> What's this svn patch command you talk about?
20120722 22:03:28< lipkab> "svn patch", it works for me...
20120722 22:03:44< shadowm> What svn version are you using?
20120722 22:04:06< lipkab> 1.7.5
20120722 22:04:44< lipkab> Back to the patch, I might push some big, groundbreaking changes soon.
20120722 22:04:49< shadowm> Okay, I guess that's the problem. I am using 1.6.17, and so are most Debian users because upstream did something terrible with 1.7 and the checkout storage format IIRC.
20120722 22:05:28< lipkab> I didn't have any problems when migrating from 1.6 to 1.7
20120722 22:05:55< shadowm> But they didn't provide any means of backwards compatibility, which can be a problem in a number of valid scenarios.
20120722 22:06:06< shadowm> (IIRC)
20120722 22:06:39< shadowm> Anyway, big, groundbreaking changes could delay your patch's review further, seeing as how the person in charge hasn't said anything on the matter yet.
20120722 22:07:29< vultraz> shadowm: http://imagebin.org/221754
20120722 22:08:00< lipkab> shadowm: The problem (as I see) isn't that it takes too much time to review it but rather that mordante is being too busy right now.
20120722 22:08:01< shadowm> The thing about contributing code to unmaintained components is that if you are lucky, anyone will commit the patch without doing a thorough review ;)
20120722 22:08:29< shadowm> But when it's about maintained components, yeah, you are restricted by the time the target's maintainer can dedicate to reviewing patches.
20120722 22:08:55< lipkab> Yeah, it wasn't good idea to make such a nice GUI ;)
20120722 22:09:26< shadowm> vultraz: It's a better start.
20120722 22:09:49< vultraz> shadowm: should I redo the button too..?
20120722 22:09:53< shadowm> vultraz: I just realized why your hand-drawn A looks horrible.
20120722 22:10:02< vultraz> why
20120722 22:10:04< shadowm> You don't know how to design fonts, that's why. :p
20120722 22:10:23< shadowm> But more seriously, the middle bridge was too high.
20120722 22:10:25< vultraz> :P
20120722 22:10:42< shadowm> Yes, redo the button too. It always struck me as terrible-looking.
20120722 22:11:32< shadowm> The vertical component's angle was perhaps a tad too large too.
20120722 22:11:34< shadowm> *components
20120722 22:13:04< vultraz> shadowm: serif looks weird on the button..can I use arial?
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20120722 22:13:29< shadowm> You can use whatever you wish.
20120722 22:13:38< shadowm> I was only prodding you in the right direction. I'm not an artist.
20120722 22:13:52< shadowm> Much less a font designer.
20120722 22:15:31< shadowm> Of course, using a font with a very customized and recognizable A letter shape would be a bad idea for the legal department too.
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20120722 22:19:48< vultraz> shadowm: http://imagebin.org/221756
20120722 22:20:08< mordante> lipkab, reviewing costs a lot of time for this patch, especially since your formatting doesn't fit with the rest of the code :-(
20120722 22:20:32< lipkab> hi mordante
20120722 22:20:42< mordante> and my time is reather limited at the moment
20120722 22:20:43< lipkab> Aren't you "off night"? :P
20120722 22:20:53< shadowm> vultraz: You see what's wrong with it, right?
20120722 22:21:32< vultraz> it doesn't look very nice
20120722 22:21:45< shadowm> You see why it doesn't look very nice, right?
20120722 22:21:54< vultraz> wait, does it mean mine or that one
20120722 22:22:04< shadowm> The one you just linked.
20120722 22:22:05< lipkab> mordante: I was just thinking that because boucman ran through it 30 minutes or so... of course he didn't have as many comments as you, though.
20120722 22:22:40< mordante> lipkab, I was, but somebody pinged me before I was gone
20120722 22:23:14< vultraz> shadowm: bad outline..?
20120722 22:23:39< shadowm> Yes. It's very evident, isn't it?
20120722 22:23:54< vultraz> yes
20120722 22:23:57< shadowm> Let me ask you a question: Why don't you run these through Jetrel?
20120722 22:24:07< vultraz> bc...he's Jetrel...
20120722 22:24:19< shadowm> But he'd be a better choice than a random non-artist programmer.
20120722 22:24:51< shadowm> Programmers tend to appreciate crap that fills a blank, regardless of style and consistency.
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20120722 22:25:54< shadowm> Wesnoth's art department isn't run by a non-artist programmer and that's why things look good nowadays.
20120722 22:27:14< vultraz> Jetrel: around?
20120722 22:30:03< vultraz> shadowm: doesn't seem to be around.. so.. http://imagebin.org/221760
20120722 22:30:07< vultraz> better outline?
20120722 22:30:35< shadowm> And you obviously can't wait a few days if necessary.
20120722 22:31:07< shadowm> It still looks bumpy.
20120722 22:31:22< vultraz> hm...guess I have to alias it
20120722 22:32:11< lipkab> *antialias
20120722 22:32:17< timotei> anonymissimus: btw, why you insist of setting that output dir really?
20120722 22:32:34-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
20120722 22:32:52< mordante> I commit crappy artwork in the hope an artist wants to improve it ;-)
20120722 22:33:08< vultraz> hehe :P
20120722 22:33:13< shadowm> I haven't seen crappy artwork coming from you yet, but that's a terrible idea.
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20120722 22:34:16< shadowm> Our artists often do not pay attention and won't find out there's crappy placeholders awaiting replacement unless you prod them directly.
20120722 22:35:17< shadowm> And in this case, fendrin is using vultraz as his artist (even though vultraz isn't an art contributor) so he presumably asked him to make *non* placeholder art.
20120722 22:35:26< mordante> shadowm, does that mean I artwork is good?
20120722 22:35:50< shadowm> That means vultraz's output should not be placeholder-quality, otherwise it'd be a waste of everyones time.
20120722 22:36:00< CIA-87> mordante * r54834 /trunk/src/editor/map/context_manager.cpp: Fix operator precedence.
20120722 22:36:33< vultraz> shadowm: I hope you don't think my soundsource icon is placeholder quality...
20120722 22:36:52< shadowm> Hang on, I'm lagging.
20120722 22:38:14< vultraz> ohgod this anti- aliasing looks horrible o_o
20120722 22:39:04< shadowm> mordante: No, I mean I haven't seen any placeholder art pfrom you  yet. :p
20120722 22:40:01< shadowm> (Other than a few versions of existing assets with opacity changes, but that doesn't really count.)
20120722 22:41:35< vultraz> shadowm: DO you think my soundsource icon is placeholder quality..?
20120722 22:41:41< mordante> shadowm, spot the placeholder ;-) http://www.wesnoth.org/images/sshots/wesnoth_editor-1.3.4.jpg
20120722 22:42:05< shadowm> vultraz: I haven't seen it.
20120722 22:42:21< shadowm> mordante: Ugh.
20120722 22:42:36< shadowm> Yeah.
20120722 22:43:32< vultraz> shadowm: http://imagebin.org/221764
20120722 22:43:44< mordante> really off now, night
20120722 22:43:52< vultraz> cya mordante 
20120722 22:44:03< shadowm> vultraz: It looks much better than your silly 'A'.
20120722 22:44:10-!- mordante [~mordante@wesnoth/developer/mordante] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20120722 22:44:23< shadowm> It could still use some improvement, but I'm not sure what.
20120722 22:45:27< Jetrel> vultraz:  sometimes
20120722 22:47:54< vultraz> shadowm, Jetrel: http://imagebin.org/221765
20120722 22:48:17< vultraz> shadowm: no border, just AA
20120722 22:48:28< vultraz> border doesn't seem to work at that scale
20120722 22:48:45< Jetrel> vultraz:  I'd suggest using the same sort of outlining as on the musical note - that kind of consistency would be helpful, and the icon would be more readable against different backgrounds.
20120722 22:49:17< Jetrel> I actually had to settle for this on one of the bitmap fonts I drew for frogatto - the lack of outlines made it awkward in a lot of situations.
20120722 22:49:46< vultraz> Jetrel: well i did try that...but it didn't work.. http://imagebin.org/221766
20120722 22:50:34< timotei> Night
20120722 22:50:34-!- timotei [~timotei@wesnoth/developer/timotei] has quit [Quit: SIGKILL]
20120722 22:50:51< Jetrel> Because it's not wide enough and not AAed.  Not because the idea is inherently unviable.
20120722 22:51:03< vultraz> hm...
20120722 22:52:52< Jetrel> Also, why the gradient?
20120722 22:53:31< CIA-87> fendrin * r54835 /trunk/src/editor/ (4 files in 2 dirs): drag and drop support for the unit placement tool
20120722 22:54:58< vultraz> Jetrel: gradient?
20120722 22:55:06< Jetrel> On the letter A
20120722 22:55:15< Jetrel> bright at the top, dark at the bottom.
20120722 22:55:25< Jetrel> Only use gradients to serve an actual purpose.
20120722 22:56:04< vultraz> well...how else would you shade an A in that tiny space
20120722 22:57:28< vultraz> well I guess..
20120722 22:57:59< Jetrel> Why do you NEED to shade it?
20120722 22:58:14< Jetrel> There is no need.  It doesn't make it look better.
20120722 22:58:56< vultraz> you mean..i can make it solid color?
20120722 22:59:10< vultraz> huh..I thought it needed to be shaded
20120722 22:59:22< shadowm> fendrin: The "Place a map label Tool" (terrible name choice btw) and "Sound source Tool" tools in the editor are actions and they can be potentially found in popup menus, and the main Hotkeys dialog, so they should use Title Case instead of mixed case.
20120722 22:59:25< Jetrel> vultraz:   YES.
20120722 22:59:37< Espreon> Hoo boy...
20120722 22:59:43< shadowm> fendrin: e.g. "Place a Map Label Tool" (should really be just "Label Tool") and "Sound Source Tool"
20120722 22:59:52< anonymissimus> timotei: because it tends to resolve linker errors
20120722 23:00:29< shadowm> fendrin: I can't fail to notice you haven't fixed the transparent tile icon overpainting regression in the palette.
20120722 23:00:39< anonymissimus> timotei: I insist on it since I needed 3 months or so and several trials until I got 1.8 to compile again
20120722 23:01:53< anonymissimus> since apparently in the 1.7 dev cycle nobody was maintaining MSVC build system
20120722 23:01:57< Jetrel> vultraz:  http://imagebin.org/221767
20120722 23:02:18< fendrin> shadowm: Yes, I haven't merged that part of my branch in yet, please be a little more patient for it.
20120722 23:02:48< shadowm> fendrin: Hm, okay. But "a little more patient"? I think I last complained about it back in May.
20120722 23:03:15< vultraz> Jetrel: http://imagebin.org/221768
20120722 23:03:40< fendrin> shadowm: Yes, compared to the time you already waited, only a little more :-)
20120722 23:04:27< shadowm> Okay, but the Title Case fix should preferably land before the next pot-update.
20120722 23:04:35< vultraz> Jetrel: I think you're is better tho...
20120722 23:05:06< shadowm> Of course at this point I begin to suspect it'll happen on Christmas or so.
20120722 23:05:41< Jetrel> vultraz:   thanks;  because I hate fighting over that when I provide an edit. :P
20120722 23:05:47< fendrin> shadowm: The fix of the string or the next pot-update?
20120722 23:05:51< vultraz> hehe
20120722 23:06:00< shadowm> fendrin: The next pot-update before 1.11.0.
20120722 23:06:20< vultraz> Jetrel: ok I'll use yours. thanks. now for the big one...
20120722 23:06:28< fendrin> shadowm: I think Ivanovic wanted to release very soon, next weekend or so.
20120722 23:06:30< shadowm> I had hoped we'd be approaching 1.11.1 at this point, but... I guess this will be another two years long cycle.
20120722 23:06:32< Jetrel> vultraz:   yours was a substantial improvement over what you had before, in terms of readability.  The letter-form still has issues in that the width of the bars on the side isn't the same as the top or middle.
20120722 23:06:50< Jetrel> My version solves those, I'm just stating this for your edification.
20120722 23:06:56< shadowm> fendrin: Unlikely. He's not poked me yet and the topic says nothing about it.
20120722 23:07:20< shadowm> Whenever he decides on a potential tag date he does the mass-pokey thing.
20120722 23:07:57< fendrin> Hmmm, yeah. A new dev version release would be fine in the near future.
20120722 23:08:14< shadowm> And one week would be very little time for people to finish their stuff.
20120722 23:08:20< shadowm> I mean one working week, 5 days.
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20120722 23:10:01< shadowm> But even more important than the Title Case fix, which is just for consistency's sake, is choosing your UI labels carefully and avoiding extra linguistic cruft that only serves to reinforce an already obvious meaning.
20120722 23:10:43< shadowm> Case in point, the "Place a map label Tool". If it were just "Label Tool", it'd be just as obvious that it's for doing something with map labels.
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20120722 23:11:44< shadowm> And the only things that can be done with them on a map is adding, editing, and deleting them, and from gameplay people should already know that the three actions are really the same action (deleting is implemented by setting an empty label, I don't like this but whatever)
20120722 23:12:20< vultraz> Jetrel: can I safely make this solid too? http://imagebin.org/221769 (it's the overlay that goes at the center of the hex when teh tool is active)
20120722 23:12:24< shadowm> That's why "Label Tool" does the job just fine, and without creating difficulties for translators who already have to cope with limited screen space in e.g. the Hotkeys dialog.
20120722 23:12:50< Jetrel> vultraz:   yeah.
20120722 23:13:41< shadowm> I'd go further and suggest the "Tool" suffix is unnecessary, but removing it could make it harder to distinguish editor tool hotkeys from the rest in Hotkeys.
20120722 23:13:51< fendrin> shadowm: Well, I wrote it after "Set Starting Positions Tool". 
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20120722 23:14:27< CIA-87> vultraz * r54836 /trunk/images/buttons/ (3 files): Updated label tool buttons by Jetrel
20120722 23:14:32< shadowm> Yeah, the "Set" there is also redundant.
20120722 23:14:51< shadowm> It should be noted that existing practice here isn't always the best.
20120722 23:15:16< fendrin> I will delete the "Set"
20120722 23:15:20< Jetrel> fendrin:   I would second almost all of shadowm's suggestions;  they're widely accepted as UI best-practice.
20120722 23:15:29< shadowm> For example, it wasn't too long ago that existing practice for checkboxes as to use Title Case and Sentence case indiscriminately in the same dialog.
20120722 23:15:36< shadowm> *was
20120722 23:15:39< Jetrel> (not to butt into the discussion)
20120722 23:17:05< vultraz> Jetrel: so, like this is ok, or does it need some border fringe like yours in the smaller one http://imagebin.org/221770
20120722 23:17:23< fendrin> There is not much need to convince me, I am glad for every help with the UI issues I can get.
20120722 23:19:58< Jetrel> vultraz:  Yes, the AA around the edge is essentially mandatory.  Try to keep the color-count for doing so really low so it doesn't get blurry (why I only used two colors).  AA on a line like this that takes 2/3/2/3/2/3 steps will be tougher than for a simple 3/3/3/3/3 or 2/2/2/2/ interval, but it's quite doable.
20120722 23:20:19< lipkab> fendrin: Well, you could uniform the linebreaks in the descriptions as well. Currently some of them are "Tool Name, description" style while others are "Tool Name \n description"
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20120722 23:21:36< fendrin> lipkab: That is the gui code. Those which are not selectable miss their title. 
20120722 23:22:04< lipkab> Ah, I see.
20120722 23:22:45< fendrin> I will see if that is a bug or a feature. 
20120722 23:23:35< shadowm> It's probably some kind of oversight. I don't think there's any precedent for tool buttons that can be disabled, in Wesnoth.
20120722 23:24:21< shadowm> Those buttons seem to have been implemented specifically for the old (pre-1.5.x) featureless editor's use, after all.
20120722 23:24:43< fendrin> But there are some gui elements which display a different tooltip when disabled, I would like to use that mechanism.
20120722 23:26:12< vultraz> Jetrel: http://imagebin.org/221772
20120722 23:26:54< Jetrel> vultraz:   ..  do you understand how AA works?
20120722 23:27:18< Jetrel> It's NOT a fringe.
20120722 23:27:51< vultraz> balgh...
20120722 23:28:03 * vultraz heads back to Gimp
20120722 23:28:15< Jetrel> AA is an attempt to reconcile how geometric lines don't cover square pixels evenly.
20120722 23:29:02< Jetrel> When you're drawing a line, your raster representation is meant to "approximate" a real, geometric line superimposed on the pixel grid.
20120722 23:29:15< Jetrel> This line has width - in this case it's about a pixel wide.
20120722 23:29:31< Jetrel> AA is a matter of approximating how much this line covers adjacent pixels.
20120722 23:30:05< Jetrel> If it sat over, say, 1/3 of an adjacent pixel in a gap there, that pixel would get a weak AA darkening.
20120722 23:30:14< Jetrel> If it sat over 2/3, a stronger one.
20120722 23:30:33< Jetrel> over "almost all", we use solid black (as is being correctly done already).
20120722 23:32:19< CIA-87> fendrin * r54837 /trunk/ (data/themes/editor.cfg src/hotkeys.cpp): 
20120722 23:32:19< CIA-87> Fixed some language issues
20120722 23:32:19< CIA-87> Enabled a box for displaying the active side on the editor's topbar.
20120722 23:32:44< fendrin> shadowm: ^ I think I got everything you mentioned.
20120722 23:34:04< vultraz> hm...ok I'm probably still doing this wrong..but.. http://imagebin.org/221773
20120722 23:35:35< vultraz> fendrin: should I also commit the soundsource buttons?
20120722 23:36:06< shadowm> Incidentally, the only reason it's Map Editor instead of just Editor in the titlescreen is because there were concerns newbies could mistake it for a Scenario Editor.
20120722 23:36:17< shadowm> Otherwise, the extra word is a PITA for translators.
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20120722 23:37:11< Jetrel> vultraz:   still considerably wrong
20120722 23:37:24< vultraz> :( ifail
20120722 23:37:29< shadowm> fendrin: Yes, although the label hack for the unimplemented sound source and village ownership tools went away with that commit.
20120722 23:38:03< shadowm> Probably unimportant if they will be implemented before 1.11.0.
20120722 23:42:08< fendrin> village ownership was easy and mostly fun to implement. The biggest issue was the side definitions which is already there. Most likely the code can just be taken from the branch.
20120722 23:42:36< Jetrel> grrr
20120722 23:42:50< Jetrel> vultraz:   I can't find a single good tutorial on AA;  I've been looking.
20120722 23:46:14< Jetrel> well, there are some good diagrams on this page:  http://www.beatstamm.com/typography/RTRCh4.htm
20120722 23:46:30< Jetrel> Don't bother reading it, it's too technical and you'll miss the forest for the trees.
20120722 23:47:18< Jetrel> He makes extensive use of before/after mouseovers on the images
20120722 23:49:22< Jetrel> The basic premise though is having a "real" geometric shape, and picking where pixels go based on this 'virtual/imaginary' real shape you're trying to convey:  http://www.beatstamm.com/typography/Illus/PalatinoItaliclcn8pt96dpiBWHinted.png
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--- Log closed Mon Jul 23 00:00:49 2012