--- Log opened Tue Apr 30 00:00:46 2013
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20130430 00:13:03< Soliton> perennate: i'd like them through github but we've just switched there, you need to allow for some transition period.
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20130430 00:27:34< shadowm> mordante: The status is "I don't know".
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20130430 00:29:23< anonymissimus> fabi: it looks as if I sometimes cannot click end turn unless I did something
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20130430 00:31:27< shadowm> I don't even know what you pepople want re the commit emails.
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20130430 00:31:32< shadowm> *people
20130430 00:32:17< AI0867> shadowm: I pointed the github email hook to wesnoth-commits@gna.org
20130430 00:32:22< shadowm> It looks like someone else (AI0867?) activated the email hook in the GithH-
20130430 00:32:24< AI0867> but yeah, that's the first I heard of it
20130430 00:32:30< shadowm> AI0867: Hm, isn't the list moderated?
20130430 00:32:55< AI0867> yeah, so a moderator or admin will probably need to add noreply@github.com to the "always allow" filter at some point
20130430 00:32:56< shadowm> That is, I don't think you can send emails there without an admin approving your address, not sure.
20130430 00:33:11< shadowm> AI0867: Yeaaaaah. That is the problem; you will need to prod Ivanovic about it.
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20130430 00:34:39< shadowm> "secret fills out the Approved header to automatically approve the message in a read-only or moderated mailing list."
20130430 00:34:47< shadowm> AI0867: Any idea what that setting means?
20130430 00:35:23< shadowm> Also, there's a "send from author" (the commit author's email) option too that's currently unchecked.
20130430 00:35:32< shadowm> But I assume we don't want that?
20130430 00:35:43< bumbadadabum> I noticed you cannot change movement_used= with an [effect]
20130430 00:35:53< bumbadadabum> (which applies to an attack}
20130430 00:35:57< shadowm> I don't even use our commits ML.
20130430 00:36:00< shadowm> *didn't
20130430 00:36:18< bumbadadabum> Was this never added or is this a bug?
20130430 00:36:30< shadowm> So I really don't know how it worked.
20130430 00:37:26< AI0867> shadowm: well, it will probably not match for all our devs, so the current setting will be less work
20130430 00:37:36< AI0867> as for the secret, I'm not sure
20130430 00:37:46< shadowm> From the digest I'm seeing that SVN commits were sent with the user's address.
20130430 00:37:58< AI0867> true
20130430 00:38:11< AI0867> but that was when the repo and mailinglist were hosted by the same entity
20130430 00:38:38< shadowm> Yeah...
20130430 00:38:57< shadowm> OTOH it's dead easy to forge the From address.
20130430 00:39:19< shadowm> No idea if the ML software at Gna.org would be able to tell.
20130430 00:39:52< shadowm> No idea if anyone is interested in spamming a commits ML using noreply@github.com as the From address.
20130430 00:40:27< shadowm> Argh, I'll let you deal with this. This email crap escapes me.
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20130430 00:42:59< AI0867> shadowm: again, the issue is that people may not use the same mail for git commits and their gna account
20130430 00:43:03< AI0867> in which case the forging won't help
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20130430 00:44:42< shadowm> Right.
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20130430 00:45:34< shadowm> I was wondering if it wouldn't be within the realm of possibility to spam the ML using noreply@g.c as the From address.
20130430 00:45:54< shadowm> Not sure why anyone would do that though.
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20130430 00:49:59< shadowm> Because obviously it wouldn't be targeted specifically at wesnoth-commits@gna.org, but rather to at least a hundred different lists.
20130430 00:52:16< AI0867> shadowm: just as possible as forging one of the devs' mail addresses
20130430 00:52:38< shadowm> Yeah.
20130430 00:52:48< anonymissimus> mattsc: the max_aggression=0.0 in healer support doesn't work correctly, it still sometimes attacks
20130430 00:53:16< anonymissimus> even if there's risk of counetr damage
20130430 00:54:56< mattsc> anonymissimus: ok, thanks.  I'll check it out.
20130430 00:56:08< AI0867> well, I just hit test on the mail hook
20130430 00:56:31< AI0867> so, now we ask ivanovic or another gna mail admin to take a look
20130430 00:56:31< mattsc> anonymissimus: just to be confirm that this ^ is a typo, it should be 'aggression', not 'max_aggression'
20130430 00:56:43< shadowm> AI0867: I suspect Ivanovic would be the only one who is active.
20130430 00:57:19< shadowm> The footer says the ML is run by him and Dave, but Dave is obviously not active here anymore.
20130430 00:58:18< anonymissimus> yes, in my code is aggression
20130430 00:58:22< AI0867> Ivanovic: if you could go to https://mail.gna.org/admindb/wesnoth-commits/ and approve + add to auto-approve the few (3?) mails from noreply@github.com, that'd be great
20130430 00:59:22< mattsc> anonymissimus: ok, I'll check it out.
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20130430 02:39:50< irker600> Wesnoth: mattsc :master * 1951cc2 / data/ai/micro_ais/ais/micro_ais_wml_tags.lua: Healer Support Micro AI: bug fix for aggression= key http://git.io/9cu6kw
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20130430 05:14:39-!- Topic for #wesnoth-dev: current repo: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old (still to be fixed) | http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SummerOfCodeIdeas | Will move the repo to github, please read the dev-ml! | 177 bugs, 333 feature requests, 27 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20130430 05:14:39-!- Topic set by wesbot [~wesbot@asteria.debian.or.at] [Mon Apr 29 23:05:36 2013]
20130430 05:14:39[Users #wesnoth-dev]
20130430 05:14:39[ [Relic]   ] [ Crendgrim      ] [ happygrue ] [ loonycyborg] [ shadowm        ] [ Upthorn    ] 
20130430 05:14:39[ _8680_    ] [ crimson_penguin] [ harsh__   ] [ mattsc     ] [ shadowm_desktop] [ vinipsmaker] 
20130430 05:14:39[ _Coffee   ] [ DHost          ] [ Ingmar    ] [ melinath   ] [ shikadibot     ] [ vultraz    ] 
20130430 05:14:39[ AI0867    ] [ ejls           ] [ irker600  ] [ Necrosporus] [ Shofixti       ] [ wesbot     ] 
20130430 05:14:39[ Anakonda  ] [ elias          ] [ Ivanovic  ] [ nurupo     ] [ skyfaller_     ] [ yann       ] 
20130430 05:14:39[ apoi      ] [ enchilado      ] [ iwaim     ] [ pelotron   ] [ Smar           ] [ {V}        ] 
20130430 05:14:39[ balrog    ] [ Espreon        ] [ janebot   ] [ perennate  ] [ Soliton        ] 
20130430 05:14:39[ bderooms  ] [ ettin          ] [ jleldridge] [ rei4dan    ] [ timotei21      ] 
20130430 05:14:39[ beetlenaut] [ fabi           ] [ kelpy     ] [ Rhonda     ] [ timotei_       ] 
20130430 05:14:39[ Blueblaze ] [ Gallaecio      ] [ knotwork  ] [ rsyh93     ] [ ToBeFree       ] 
20130430 05:14:39[ cjhopman__] [ Gambit         ] [ lobby     ] [ Samual     ] [ Upth           ] 
20130430 05:14:39-!- Irssi: #wesnoth-dev: Total of 61 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 61 normal]
20130430 05:14:45-!- Channel #wesnoth-dev created Tue Jan 27 06:28:41 2009
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20130430 05:48:47< shadowm> argh the editor looks different why is everything pretty all of a sudden i don't understand anything asdf
20130430 05:49:30< shadowm> And more seriously, why am I not seeing any tooltips for tool buttons?
20130430 05:50:33< shadowm> So yeah, "I don't understand anything" might be a more accurate reflection of my actual thoughts than I originally intended, now that I think of it.
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20130430 06:19:17< Sirp> hi everyone
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20130430 07:42:43< Ivanovic> AI0867, shadowm: just make sure that one mail is sent to the list, then i can approve it
20130430 07:43:22< Ivanovic> AI0867, shadowm: currently there are no pending requests, so no way for me to easily add new addresses in as "allowed sender"
20130430 07:43:29< shadowm> AI0867: ^^
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20130430 08:42:42< LordBob_> fabi: ping ?
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20130430 13:06:16< fabi> LordBob_: pong
20130430 13:14:55< fabi> LordBob_: "<shadowm> argh the editor looks different why is everything pretty all of a sudden i don't understand anything asdf" shadowm is cute.
20130430 13:14:59< thunderstruck> fabi, hi. It seems to me that changing "end turn" button from menu to action made it won't work as expected. Now it is always disabled on 2nd game turn.
20130430 13:15:13< thunderstruck> to not work as*
20130430 13:15:57< fabi> thunderstruck: Ah yes, the game isn't using the automagic state system properly.
20130430 13:17:00< thunderstruck> fabi, so it is not just "end turn" button, right?
20130430 13:17:55< fabi> thunderstruck: [end turn] is the only [action] button in the game isn't it? Maybe the replay control buttons will malfunction as well.
20130430 13:18:16< thunderstruck> fabi, I just did little debugging so I don't know yet.
20130430 13:18:45< thunderstruck> fabi, what does "bool browse_" supposed to represent in controller_base?
20130430 13:19:34< thunderstruck> fabi, I guess that it was causing the problem. But again, I've just started to look at the problem and I thought I'll consult you, because you might know something.
20130430 13:19:34< fabi> thunderstruck: good question. I would like to know myself.
20130430 13:19:46< thunderstruck> is causing the problem*
20130430 13:19:55< fabi> thunderstruck: Yes, I have an idea.
20130430 13:21:13< fabi> thunderstruck: hotkey.cpp line 1235 set_button_state() is most likely where things go wrong.
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20130430 13:21:45< thunderstruck> fabi, yes, that's true
20130430 13:22:12< thunderstruck> fabi, and to be more precise it is can_execute_command inside playsinglecontroller.cpp4
20130430 13:22:24< fabi> thunderstruck: Do you want some background info?
20130430 13:22:30< thunderstruck> fabi, yes, please.
20130430 13:24:20< fabi> thunderstruck: The hotkey action state system was only used for handling menus and context menus.
20130430 13:25:06< fabi> thunderstruck: The set_button_state is new and extending its usage by the button handling.
20130430 13:25:15< thunderstruck> fabi, hmm.. so "browse_" could mean that some menu is displayed right now.
20130430 13:25:59< thunderstruck> fabi, oh, nevermind.
20130430 13:26:39< fabi> thunderstruck: Every button in the editor uses the new system already, the game buttons states are all hacked.
20130430 13:32:44< fabi> thunderstruck: Thus the button state should now be in sync with the "end turn" in the menu.
20130430 13:34:47< fabi> thunderstruck: Okay, it is most of the time.
20130430 13:35:13< thunderstruck> fabi, I've just checked and "end turn" from the menu is available when the button is disabled.
20130430 13:35:33< fabi> thunderstruck: Recruit another unit, the "end turn" will appear again.
20130430 13:35:46< fabi> thunderstruck: The game does not refresh the button states.
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20130430 13:50:53< LordBob_> fabi: back
20130430 13:51:11< fabi> LordBob_: :-)
20130430 13:53:43< LordBob_> fabi: I won't have much time until tomorrow evening, but we can try and get over with the terrain type problem
20130430 13:54:21< fabi> okay
20130430 13:54:45< LordBob_> fabi: also, http://forums.wesnoth.org/download/file.php?id=61582&mode=view
20130430 13:56:03< LordBob_> fabi: the "default" window isn't the best I've produced, but I suspect that it needs to be broken down into tilable components, which wasn't the case with earlier tries
20130430 13:57:01< LordBob_> fabi: so if we have time, I'd like to check how dialogs are build and therefore what options I do have
20130430 13:57:18< thunderstruck> fabi, I suspect this to be a cause of a problem: playsingle_controller::end_turn()
20130430 13:58:13< thunderstruck> fabi, But now I have to go AFK for a ~15mins. I'll look at it more closely when I'm back.
20130430 13:58:57< fabi> LordBob_: You had already a look at images/dialogs?
20130430 14:00:39< LordBob_> fabi: I have, and it tells me how it is currently done. What I'm interested in is, do other possibilities exist
20130430 14:00:57< LordBob_> fabi: also, I'm 
20130430 14:01:53< AI0867> 07:43 < Ivanovic> AI0867, shadowm: currently there are no pending requests, so no way for me to easily add new addresses in as "allowed sender" <-- I hit the "test hook" button, and commits have happened since, so there should be pending emails. I'll go test it on my own server.
20130430 14:03:48< LordBob_> fabi: (sorry, hit the wrong key) also, I don't get the big picture. I see in that folder the components required to assemble the background panels of dialogs, but I'm not sure where the rest comes from when the system displays a dialog such as campaign selection
20130430 14:04:38< LordBob_> fabi: are they entirely done with the basic three classes you had mentionned (defaut, message, hotkey) ?
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20130430 14:06:00< fabi> LordBob_: The campaign selection dialog is a gui2 one. The 3 "styles" are gui1 dialog components.
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20130430 14:09:49< fabi> LordBob_: But both dialog systems share the same images.
20130430 14:10:54< fabi> LordBob_: The campaign selection has a gui element called listbox on the left.
20130430 14:11:24< fabi> LordBob_: The right side is some kind of scroll panel.
20130430 14:15:10< LordBob_> fabi: Would you know wether the listbox uses specific artwork ? A quick search didn't return any png file that contains "listbox"
20130430 14:15:19< fabi> LordBob_: Note that the listbox is already using your new artwork.
20130430 14:16:01< fabi> LordBob_: Do you want a screenshot?
20130430 14:16:20< LordBob_> Ah. You're right, I really need to get my hands on a working copy of the game. (and screenshot would be welcome)
20130430 14:16:48< LordBob_> If only because it would help immensely when I do this kind of guessing
20130430 14:16:58< Soliton> thunderstruck: browse_ == true means you're watching a replay IIRC.
20130430 14:17:17< fabi> LordBob_: You can just replace the files in your old copy and see.
20130430 14:17:47< fabi> LordBob_: I did nothing more than just that.
20130430 14:17:55< LordBob_> fabi: of course, and it's probably what I'll do for the time being
20130430 14:18:38< LordBob_> anyway, thanks. I will also try and discuss this with mordante so that I can produce artwork that makes the best of both UI systems
20130430 14:19:07< LordBob_> fabi: and now, back to the subject of the terrain type display
20130430 14:20:02< LordBob_> fabi: have you had a chance to check wether it would be possible to use a single display area with changinf content ?
20130430 14:21:29< fabi> No, I did not have a look at that. Anyway, if it is not possible out of the box, I can do that easily.
20130430 14:21:56< fabi> It's more a problem of the annoying factor.
20130430 14:22:28< LordBob_> fabi; a reminder of what we had last discussed: position a status box at the top of the right sidebar and display as default content the hex coordinates + terrain type icons; if the cursor remains fixed on this same hex for a few more seconds, replace the content of the terrai info box with the text label
20130430 14:24:44< fabi> Sorry, but I can't find the right words.
20130430 14:25:01< fabi> I guess this solution is a terrible one.
20130430 14:25:44< fabi> We can't save much space with dropping the icons.
20130430 14:26:10< fabi> If we also drop the location (and the defense, movement) 
20130430 14:26:56< fabi> Then all the game relevant information are gone, just to display a meaningless name.
20130430 14:27:22< LordBob_> fabi: then, maybe it is a matter of the purpose for this display
20130430 14:27:59< fabi> On the other hand, someone who searches for a location by it's terrain name, will be slowed down enormous.
20130430 14:28:28< LordBob_> fabi: so far I had considered it merely informed of the terrain type+coordinates; but if we want to add game-related information, then maybe we ought to relocate it somewhere else and dedicate more space to it
20130430 14:30:13< LordBob_> Fabi: Alternately, how about doing this in an hex-specific tooltip ? This way, the information would be right as close as possible to where the user wants it, and space isn't a problem anymore
20130430 14:30:43< fabi> LordBob_: Sorry, I didn't mention before. I thought you would know about that. The location information is enriched by the defense and movement values of a unit under cursor.
20130430 14:31:59< LordBob_> Fabi; all the more reason to display it in a tooltip
20130430 14:33:13< LordBob_> Although as far as I'm concerned, movement is much better represented by the hex overlay than by any number
20130430 14:33:34< fabi> ?
20130430 14:33:38< LordBob_> Oh wait
20130430 14:34:08< LordBob_> Movement values= how much MP a unit must spend on said terrain, not how much MP the unit under the cursor has left ?
20130430 14:34:20< fabi> yes
20130430 14:34:26< LordBob_> My mistake
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20130430 14:35:27< LordBob_> So yeah, would it be possible to do it with a tooltip ?
20130430 14:35:51< LordBob_> Or do you think this information should be immediately available
20130430 14:36:35< fabi> LordBob_: We have two different tooltip systems and both are immediately.
20130430 14:36:59< fabi> I guess a tooltip following the mouse cursor is annoying as hell.
20130430 14:37:09< fabi> But the help system can be used.
20130430 14:37:32< fabi> LordBob_: If you open the preferences, you see a help string on the south border.
20130430 14:37:36< vultraz> why not just bind tooltips to their buttons
20130430 14:37:58< fabi> vultraz: ?
20130430 14:38:15< vultraz> [23:37:00]	fabi	I guess a tooltip following the mouse cursor is annoying as hell.
20130430 14:38:20< vultraz> yes, it would be
20130430 14:38:44< vultraz> so why not have it just appear when and where you hover  over  button
20130430 14:39:03< fabi> We talk about terrain info.
20130430 14:39:18< LordBob_> fabi: indeed, maybe the help system could be our solution
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20130430 14:42:48< LordBob_> fabi: Although if we're going to use a method that overlays information on the map, maybe it would be preferable that the user willingly summons it lest it is perceived as spam by players who would not want to use said info
20130430 14:44:53< fabi> LordBob_: I guess the help string will be annoying enough to everyone ending having it disabled.
20130430 14:45:53< LordBob_> fabi: so, we're back where we started. We have an unpredictable amount of information and no place to properly display it :s
20130430 14:46:24< fabi> LordBob_: And if we just make it the title of the context menu?
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20130430 14:48:10< LordBob_> you mean, right-click any hex and see the terrain info added to the content of the context menu ? 
20130430 14:49:04< fabi> LordBob_: Well, the first entry could be the terrain name and if triggered an dialog opens giving all information we have about the terrain in question.
20130430 14:49:43< LordBob_> Maybe that's a possibility, yes.
20130430 14:50:29< pelotron> Can anyone tell me if I need to add a particular repository to have access to the build-dep wesnoth package on Ubuntu?
20130430 14:50:58< LordBob_> Fabi: but do we really need it ? I mean, terrain defenses are already shown when we move a unit, and as for movement costs, in time the player tends to become familiar with them
20130430 14:51:17< pelotron> apt tells me it's "unable to find a source package for wesnoth-1.10"
20130430 14:52:08< fabi> pelotron: Your apt_sources.list needs to have dep-src entries it it.
20130430 14:52:09< AI0867> Ivanovic: well, I just received a commit mail for dd7a49 (though only the one), so the email hook seems to work for me
20130430 14:53:53< fabi> LordBob_: We can put the movement costs into the hex field overlay as well.
20130430 14:54:56< LordBob_> fabi: do you mean, show them while a unit is in the process of moving, or propose them as a toggle option similar to the grid ?
20130430 14:55:27< fabi> The former.
20130430 14:55:38< LordBob_> fabi: but overall, yes; the hex is where they belong, not the sidebar :)
20130430 14:55:58< LordBob_> fabi: so yes, this could work
20130430 14:56:11< fabi> LordBob_: And the coordinates?
20130430 14:56:49< LordBob_> Fabi: ideally, I would like to devise a solution where it's only the coordinates and terrain type in the HUD.
20130430 14:57:12< LordBob_> fabi: which means we only need to figure what we do with the text labels
20130430 14:58:19< fabi> text labels?
20130430 14:58:36< LordBob_> the full or short text name for a terrain
20130430 14:58:52< LordBob_> So far, we have:
20130430 14:59:02< LordBob_> coordiantes => HUD
20130430 14:59:08< LordBob_> terrain type icons => HUD
20130430 14:59:15< LordBob_> movement cost => hex overlay
20130430 14:59:27< LordBob_> defense => hex overlay
20130430 14:59:35< pelotron> fabi: thanks
20130430 14:59:45< LordBob_> so we're only left with the name of the terrain
20130430 15:00:24< fabi> LordBob_: zookeeper asked about full support for terrain semantics.
20130430 15:00:35< fabi> LordBob_: Maybe it is time to tell you about that.
20130430 15:00:51< LordBob_> ah. And what does that imply ?
20130430 15:01:16< fabi> LordBob_: Let's say a terrain is mixed between forest and hills.
20130430 15:02:03< fabi> LordBob_: The normal mode is that defense is the best of what a unit has on the underlying terrains and the movement is the worse.
20130430 15:02:43< fabi> LordBob_: But that is not true for every terrain.
20130430 15:02:44< thunderstruck> fabi, manually enabling "end turn" in playsingle_controller::before_human_turn does the job.
20130430 15:02:59< thunderstruck> fabi, although it is quite a hack, so I think for a better way to do it a bit later.
20130430 15:04:04< thunderstruck> I'll look for*
20130430 15:04:08< fabi> LordBob_:  In theory you can even mix the movement and the defense from different base terrains.
20130430 15:04:41< fabi> thunderstruck: I had problems to find the right places for the set_button_state() call on the editor code path as well.
20130430 15:11:21< LordBob_> fabi: so far, ok, but how does this impact terrain info ?
20130430 15:11:59< fabi> LordBob_: Well, the player needs to know about it.
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20130430 15:15:40< LordBob_> Of course. But isn't that what the hex overlays are for ? I mean, certainly the player wants to know wether his unit receives 30% or 70% defense, but he already does
20130430 15:16:20< LordBob_> As for movement costs, I'm all for displaying them in the same fashion
20130430 15:16:27< LordBob_> What more ould you tell the player ?
20130430 15:16:31< LordBob_> *would
20130430 15:19:00< fabi> LordBob_: Well, the player should know how and why the unit is doing that fine on the terrain.
20130430 15:19:19< fabi> the how is displayed in the hex overlay, and that is fine.
20130430 15:19:35< fabi> The why is partly displayed in the terrain info icon box.
20130430 15:20:04< LordBob_> Ah. Then indeed, maybe this sort of detailed would be best left in the contextual menu as you suggested. 
20130430 15:20:07< fabi> But only half. The player sees what underlying ones a terrain consists of.
20130430 15:20:12< LordBob_> *detailed info
20130430 15:20:42< fabi> Okay
20130430 15:20:56< LordBob_> So, if we sums things ups:
20130430 15:21:17< LordBob_> coordinates + terrain type icons => HUD
20130430 15:21:28< LordBob_> movement cost + defense => hex overlay
20130430 15:21:37< fabi> What exactly is HUD?
20130430 15:21:47< LordBob_> detailed info / calculations / specific rules => contextual menu
20130430 15:22:23< LordBob_> Head Up Display; I couldn't think of a more appropriate shortcurt for "status box located at the top of the right sidebar" ^^;;
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20130430 15:23:31< irker920> Wesnoth: mattsc :master * 4aba43d / projectfiles/Xcode/Wesnoth.xcodeproj/project.pbxproj: Xcode project: add tristate_button.?pp files http://git.io/4U-vZA
20130430 15:24:50< fabi> mattsc: Would you provide a binary for Lord Bob?
20130430 15:26:08< mattsc> fabi, LordBob_: umm, sure, I think.  (I have no idea how to pack something into a dmg, but I guess I could make a .gz file)
20130430 15:26:21< mattsc> LordBob_: How do I get it to you?
20130430 15:27:18< mattsc> Also, this is a debug build.  I assume that's ok?
20130430 15:27:39< vultraz> mattsc: if you're sending off builds, can I have the link too?
20130430 15:28:15< LordBob_> mattsc: format-wise, anything would be fine provided that it saves me the trouble of compiling. You can send it via wetransfer to wesnoth.lordbob@gmail.com
20130430 15:29:18< mattsc> vultraz: sure (but as I said, I don't know how to do this "correctly", so I need to figure this out first - unless you can tell me what I should be doing)
20130430 15:29:58< fabi> mattsc: Just the binary should be fine.
20130430 15:30:29< mattsc> fabi: on a Mac, this is not just one file, but an directory with all kinds of stuff
20130430 15:30:51< vultraz> fabi: it just looks like a file, but it's actually a package
20130430 15:31:15< mattsc> vultraz, LordBob_: this is for 10.6.8.  I think that's what you said you were using too?
20130430 15:31:24< fabi> Sure, but in that package is a binary. And LordBob_ will only need to replace that single file.
20130430 15:31:25< LordBob_> absolutely
20130430 15:31:26< bumbadadabum> mattsc: Send me it as well
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20130430 15:32:11< vultraz> mattsc: I have 10.7.5, but I don't think it matters
20130430 15:32:42< mattsc> fabi: know off the top of the head which dir that file is in?
20130430 15:33:13< fabi> mattsc: well, on my system it is build/wesnoth-debug
20130430 15:33:14< mattsc> fabi: never mind, found it
20130430 15:33:20< fabi> or just wesnoth
20130430 15:33:58< fabi> mattsc: But the debug option is what makes it huge.
20130430 15:34:15< fabi> mattsc: The gcc produces a 500MB+ binary with test.
20130430 15:34:25< fabi> mattsc: It's only about 12MB without.
20130430 15:34:34< fabi> s/test/debug
20130430 15:34:35< mattsc> Hmm, then maybe I did not find it.  This one is 55MB
20130430 15:34:45< fabi> That's fine enough.
20130430 15:34:49< mattsc> Well, let me build the production version then...
20130430 15:35:03< fabi> gcc isn't very efficient when it comes to adding debug symbols.
20130430 15:35:28< mattsc> Also, I'm at a coffee shop at the moment, so might not have the bandwidth to upload until I am at work.
20130430 15:35:42< fabi> mattsc: Just start the binary on the commandline.
20130430 15:35:54< fabi> mattsc: You will see if it is working.
20130430 15:36:18< mattsc> fabi: it is
20130430 15:37:06< fabi> mattsc: Anyway, to save bandwith a non debug build is a good solution. LordBob_ won't need a debug version.
20130430 15:37:22< vultraz> mattsc: just build the release build
20130430 15:37:37< mattsc> fabi, LordBob_, all: I'm getting an error message (base SDK missing) for the release build.
20130430 15:37:53< mattsc> So I can either try to figure that out, or send you the 55MB debug binary instead ...
20130430 15:38:46< mattsc> ... and I really don't have time for the former right now ...
20130430 15:38:57< LordBob_> mattsc: whichever is easier for you. This is only so that I can see a working version of the recent editor changes, so I wouldn't want to waste your time
20130430 15:39:29 * vultraz just realized something
20130430 15:39:35< vultraz> I, uh...oh
20130430 15:39:40< vultraz> nevermind, I don't have a working clone
20130430 15:39:52< mattsc> Anybody know a general dropbox site for things like this?
20130430 15:39:53< LordBob_> ?
20130430 15:39:59< bumbadadabum> mattsc: mediafire?
20130430 15:40:16< vultraz> if I did, I could build myself, and get to the editor, since for some weird reason, I can get to the editor but the regular game crashes
20130430 15:40:17< LordBob_> mattsc: https://www.wetransfer.com/
20130430 15:41:48< mattsc> LordBob_: but that means I need the email for everybody who wants it?  It doesn't give me a link?
20130430 15:42:00< mattsc> Sorry for all the stupid questions  :P
20130430 15:42:16< vultraz> mattsc: don't you have a dropbox account?
20130430 15:42:22< mattsc> You could have complied in the time it took to answer all my questions  :D
20130430 15:42:29< LordBob_> mattsc: it does allow link sharing
20130430 15:42:42< vultraz> if you do, just stick it in your Public folder, and give us the link
20130430 15:42:49< mattsc> vultraz: nope.  We have a work dropbox that I am using for that.  Never needed anything else.
20130430 15:43:15< LordBob_> mattsc: check the bottom left button, it allows to choose between mail or link
20130430 15:43:50< mattsc> vultraz: ah!  Thanks.
20130430 15:44:28< mattsc> Ok, uploading.  I have no idea how slow this is going to be from here ...  If it doesn't work, I'll do it in an hour from work.
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20130430 15:47:22< fabi> LordBob_: Okay, which layout should I choose?
20130430 15:47:39< LordBob_> fabi: what for ?
20130430 15:47:48< fabi> LordBob_: The one where the menubar covers the whole horizontal space?
20130430 15:48:35< fabi> Or simpler, where shall I display the coordinates, and how?
20130430 15:49:06< LordBob_> fabi: ah. If possible, I'd like to keep the one where the sidebar occupies the full vertical space. 
20130430 15:49:22< fabi> Okay
20130430 15:49:35< vultraz> er...just realized something...
20130430 15:49:43< LordBob_> fabi: so, a status box with copper border located above the minimap with coordinates + icons
20130430 15:49:46< vultraz> I need the data folder
20130430 15:51:42< fabi> LordBob_: Do you have a mockup?
20130430 15:52:33< fabi> vultraz: Download from github.
20130430 15:54:38< mattsc> LordBob_, vultraz, bumbadadabum: http://we.tl/E6cK2qmgoH
20130430 15:55:56< vultraz> fabi: slow internet, I was kinda waiting for shadowm to provide a zip
20130430 15:56:08< LordBob_> fabi: http://imagebin.org/255920
20130430 15:56:31< fabi> vultraz: Why don't you download the zip from github? Should be as good as one from shadowm.
20130430 15:56:57< vultraz> fabi: the zip from github is only a snapshot of the HEAD rev
20130430 15:57:01< vultraz> no .git folder included
20130430 15:57:21< vultraz> I learned that when I downloaded the zip of the frogatto repo from github and I ended up with no .git folder
20130430 15:57:22< bumbadadabum> then just do git clone
20130430 15:57:40< LordBob_> mattsc: thanks
20130430 15:57:50< bumbadadabum> mattsc: how does this work?
20130430 15:58:48< mattsc> bumbadadabum: ask fabi ;)  I assume you replace the binary in 1.11.2 with this.
20130430 15:59:05< bumbadadabum> mattsc: I meant how to download?
20130430 15:59:19< bumbadadabum> I'm just getting a "preparing" screen
20130430 16:00:21< vultraz> bumbadadabum: I think you're supposed to point that binary to your clone
20130430 16:00:29< bumbadadabum> yeah yeah yeah
20130430 16:00:31< mattsc> bumbadadabum: uh, no idea.  Never used this before...
20130430 16:00:32< vultraz> since 1.11.2 doesn't have the necessary data images
20130430 16:00:38< bumbadadabum> I KNOW HOW WESNOTH WORKS
20130430 16:00:52< bumbadadabum> I just don't know how wetransfer works
20130430 16:01:11< timotei> bumbadadabum: don't use wetransfer
20130430 16:01:14< timotei> Use something like dropbox
20130430 16:01:19< bumbadadabum> ^ mattsc
20130430 16:01:28< mattsc> bumbadadabum: I saw it ...
20130430 16:01:38< fabi> LordBob_: The mockup shows a version with menubar not covering the whole screen...
20130430 16:02:00< mattsc> bumbadadabum: I got a "we're ready" after a while...
20130430 16:02:12< bumbadadabum> hmm
20130430 16:02:29< bumbadadabum> mattsc: works now thanks
20130430 16:02:32< mattsc> bumbadadabum: I can upload it to dropbox once I am at work...
20130430 16:02:40< mattsc> oh, ok.  Next time then ...
20130430 16:02:55< bumbadadabum> but the download is slow as hell
20130430 16:03:04< vultraz> bumbadadabum: I would clone
20130430 16:03:11< vultraz> but the bloody friggin repo is 2.6 GB
20130430 16:03:23< bumbadadabum> vultraz: rly?
20130430 16:03:31< bumbadadabum> it went pretty fast then :p
20130430 16:03:32< bumbadadabum> for me
20130430 16:04:04< LordBob_> Fabi: yes. Isn't that what I wrote above ?
20130430 16:04:32< LordBob_> mattsc: thanks, download's finished here
20130430 16:04:52< fabi> LordBob_: Okay, seems I misunderstood :-)
20130430 16:05:18< mattsc> LordBob_: hope it works.  I'll figure out how to make the release build work sometime so that it will be smaller
20130430 16:05:23< vultraz> bumbadadabum: because you live in dutchland with crazy fast internet
20130430 16:05:35< bumbadadabum> It's not called "Dutchland"
20130430 16:05:46< bumbadadabum> sounds too much like "Deutschland"
20130430 16:06:05< bumbadadabum> mattsc: download failed
20130430 16:06:51< bumbadadabum> mattsc: I gtg now though
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20130430 16:07:19< LordBob_> bumbadadabum: normally, the file ought to remain available for 2 weeks
20130430 16:07:37< mattsc> bumbadadabum: me too.  I'll provide another link later today.
20130430 16:07:38< LordBob_> try it agian in a while, it went pretty fast for me
20130430 16:07:47< LordBob_> *again
20130430 16:07:49< bumbadadabum> 4 minutes...
20130430 16:07:54< bumbadadabum> for a 55 mb file
20130430 16:08:04< mattsc> Also, I seem to have figured out the SDK thing (was pretty trivial really)
20130430 16:08:10< bumbadadabum> (is that a first world problem?)
20130430 16:08:27< LordBob_> Nono. More like 30 seconds (probably)
20130430 16:08:33< bumbadadabum> nonono
20130430 16:08:37< bumbadadabum> it says 4 minutes here
20130430 16:08:46< bumbadadabum> which means it's probably 2 minutes
20130430 16:09:33< fabi> LordBob_: Please send me the proper sized copper panel.
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20130430 16:10:03< bumbadadabum> I can't wait for new GUI stuff :]
20130430 16:10:13< bumbadadabum> download fails at the last mb
20130430 16:11:27< LordBob_> fabi: will do so. It'll have to wait until tomorrow evening, though: I have to some work to finish right now
20130430 16:11:58< fabi> LordBob_: cool, tx
20130430 16:12:23< bumbadadabum> I might make some FR's about [effect]
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20130430 16:36:01< irker920> Wesnoth: anonymissimus :master * 3f2f24d / src/side_filter.cpp: allow filtering sides on controller= http://git.io/N6yokA
20130430 16:36:03< irker920> Wesnoth: anonymissimus :master * b2ab637 / changelog,players_changelog: chamgelog updates for some recent commits of mine http://git.io/adwrEg
20130430 16:38:40< J3ny> hi all
20130430 16:41:04-!- LordBob_ [~chatzilla@2a01:e34:ee82:47e0:21e:c2ff:fe01:261f] has quit [Quit: back tomorrow evening]
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20130430 16:59:51< irker920> Wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel :master * 04b42cb / / (63 files): Optipng run http://git.io/NGVDnA
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20130430 17:00:07< Trademark_> Hello
20130430 17:00:13< vladimir_> hi
20130430 17:00:32< Trademark_> AI0867, could you tell me if the following diagram is correct ? http://wiki.wesnoth.org/User:Trademark/GSoC_2013/Addon_Server:_Create_a_new_and_shiny_one#Integration
20130430 17:03:07< AI0867> 1) espreon isn't the only one who can update translations (and occasionally we get pull requests, rather than emails) (this is not very important)
20130430 17:04:05< AI0867> 2) www.wesnoth.org/gettext/ contains direct links to github for the translator. It does use wescamp.py to generate statistics, but that's all
20130430 17:04:18< AI0867> er, let me qualify that
20130430 17:04:49< AI0867> it uses wescamp.py to get everythin on the server, and then generates the statistics in PHP, but it doesn't serve the PO or POT files from there
20130430 17:06:14< AI0867> 3) currently, there is no direct link between github and the add-on server. That is done by a separate wescamp.py run
20130430 17:07:03< AI0867> the wescamp.py run in 2) (which is just a clone + update) is done by cron, to provide up-to-date statistics
20130430 17:07:32< AI0867> the wescamp.py run that copies stuff from the addon server to github is done by hand by me and espreon
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20130430 17:12:40< AI0867> if the graph was intended to be a design rather than a description of the current state, then that's a lot better
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20130430 17:16:00< Trademark_> AI0867, in fact I just draw it like I though it was, with some logic assumption. Thanks for the comments, what do you think if I do a "current state diagram" and a "expected final design" ?
20130430 17:16:54< AI0867> that makes sense
20130430 17:17:11< AI0867> from your wiki page: "The front and back-end must be independent, so some high levels choices must be made."
20130430 17:17:31< AI0867> where'd that come from?
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20130430 17:27:34< Trademark_> AI0867, not sure to understand the question
20130430 17:29:22< Trademark_> AI0867, it's the bridge between the request handler layer and the database 
20130430 17:29:55< Trademark_> the idea is to permit to change only a restrictive part of code if we change the database, as in classic MVC
20130430 17:32:53< AI0867> well, you've split the addond up into two pieces and then assert that these must be indepenedent
20130430 17:33:10< AI0867> while that's typically good practice, I don't see anything else supporting it
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20130430 17:34:11< AI0867> as for the backend choices, given the current featureset, I think an actual database might be massive overkill ;)
20130430 17:36:09< AI0867> Ivanovic: I've also received mails for every commit since, so it does seem to be working on this end
20130430 17:37:44< Trademark_> AI0867, I also though that a database would be overkill, however, after some analysis, I'm totally sure we need it. Going with a flat hierarchy would be the same than coding from scratch a light database
20130430 17:39:31< Trademark_> AI0867, for example, when an add-on request arrives, you must go through all the files stored, which is in O(n), then you see that it's inefficient, and you try to add a simple index, etc. And you continue until you see that a simple database would be easier
20130430 17:40:59< Trademark_> I don't see any valuable reason for which we wouldn't use a database, yes it's overkill, but in it simplify a lot the code, and a database is not really heavy (for example sqlite), and not so overkill that we could think at first.
20130430 17:42:03< Trademark_> however, I propose 3 options, with a nice separation between back-end and front-end to let us the choice.
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20130430 17:43:48< mattsc> bumbadadabum, vultraz, LordBob_: So I succeeded making a release build (half the size of the debug build; 26 MB)
20130430 17:43:59< bumbadadabum> mattsc: awesome
20130430 17:44:45< mattsc> I'm still trying to figure out where best to put it.  If I use Droppbox, it appears that I can only share it with specific people, rather than just provide and open link, is that correct?  (Sorry, really never had a need to do this outside work before)
20130430 17:44:52< bumbadadabum> no
20130430 17:45:00< bumbadadabum> you can right-click on a file in your folder
20130430 17:45:11< bumbadadabum> and go to dropbox>share link
20130430 17:45:22< bumbadadabum> and everyone should be able to access it
20130430 17:46:13< mattsc> ok, let me set things up and try that
20130430 17:47:06< flix1> mattsc: I think the files have to be in the "public" folder to do that.
20130430 17:48:52< vultraz> mattsc: they can be in any folder
20130430 17:49:01< vultraz> however, if they're in Public, it's easier
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20130430 17:58:40< Trademark_> AI0867, in the future, I guess that wescamp.py and the add-on server could be merged right ?
20130430 17:59:30< fabi> hi esr
20130430 17:59:54< mattsc> bumbadadabum, vultraz, LordBob_: release built for OSX 10.6.8 (26MB): https://www.dropbox.com/s/bqhbxl9jeuktyeq/Wesnoth?v=1mcic
20130430 18:00:05< mattsc> *build
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20130430 18:06:51< irker920> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * e49cc1f / src/widgets/button.cpp: Default image for the turbo button type. http://git.io/T6ADfg
20130430 18:06:53< irker920> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * e466728 / images/misc/ (18 files): Listbox artwork from Lord Bob. http://git.io/eN_tOQ
20130430 18:16:50< vultraz> hm...
20130430 18:21:10 * vultraz waits for shadowm
20130430 18:22:06< esr> I'm back from Penguican and resuming work on the conversion.
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20130430 18:33:22< AI0867> Trademark_: I believe the current server simply has a single index file. The umcd design document specifies a single metadata file per add-on, which is read in *on startup*, so in both cases you can do O(log n) lookup
20130430 18:34:13< AI0867> Trademark_: depending on the design, some/many/all features could be merged *somewhere*
20130430 18:35:08< AI0867> but the "update gettext.wesnoth.org statistics" thing it helps with probably shouldn't be
20130430 18:35:15< AI0867> into the add-on server that is
20130430 18:42:06< Ivanovic> AI0867: there is nothing in the pending list
20130430 18:42:13< Ivanovic> AI0867: can you forward me one of the messages you receive?
20130430 18:43:07< Ivanovic> AI0867: there are zero pending mails at wesnoth-commits@gna.org
20130430 18:43:41< AI0867> k
20130430 18:44:15< Ivanovic> and there is nothing suspicious on the "autodiscard" list
20130430 18:44:43< AI0867> sent
20130430 18:47:13< Ivanovic> i mean one of the "your messages are pending" mails
20130430 18:47:27< Ivanovic> that is: are you 100% sure the correct email address is being sent to?
20130430 18:50:09< AI0867> I don't receive any of those because it's being sent by noreply@github.com
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20130430 18:59:18< Trademark_> AI0867, I see, thank you a lot for all the comments. Could just give a quick look on the latest schema: http://wiki.wesnoth.org/User:Trademark/GSoC_2013/Addon_Server:_Create_a_new_and_shiny_one#Integration
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20130430 19:01:46< AI0867> Trademark_: looks good
20130430 19:03:25< Trademark_> AI0867, thank you, you helped a lot.
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20130430 19:12:27< Soliton> esr: does the conversion also include the planned separate repositories for website and resources? it seems like they somehow ended up as sub directories in the current state.
20130430 19:13:51< AI0867> Soliton: esr did that intentionally after nobody offered another opinion
20130430 19:14:15< Soliton> an opinion on what?
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20130430 19:14:29< AI0867> on what to do with them
20130430 19:14:53< Soliton> afair we've repeatedly talked about those two becoming separate repositories.
20130430 19:14:58< AI0867> they couldn't stay as branches, so the options were to split them out into separate repositories, merge them into master or invent something new
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20130430 19:15:57< Soliton> i don't remember any talk about converting them to sub directories.
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20130430 19:18:01< AI0867> I think we discussed it, but I don't see any mention in the mailinglist
20130430 19:19:35< AI0867> Soliton: true, I was surprised by that move too
20130430 19:21:02< zookeeper> so, as someone who hasn't really participated, am i missing something when i think that this whole moving to git thing seems rather poorly planned and executed and quite fiasco'ish (so far)? D:
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20130430 19:23:48< Soliton> well, the delay in moving to github was poor communication/planning. other than that it went fairly well IMO.
20130430 19:24:17< Soliton> it was to be expected that we'd find some issues with the first conversion.
20130430 19:25:37< esr> I certainly expected some glitches.
20130430 19:26:14< esr> Such conversions are inevitably messy, even given good tools.
20130430 19:26:35< esr> And the sheer size of this repo make experiments costly.
20130430 19:27:45< Soliton> esr: so any issue with converting the resource and website branches/subdirs to their own repos?
20130430 19:28:46< esr> zookeeper: This is what it looks like going fairly well.  If you think this hasd been a fiasco, you never want to be anywhere near a conversion that's going badly.
20130430 19:29:16< zookeeper> all right then
20130430 19:30:18< esr> Soliton: Yes.  It could easily be done, but I think it's a bad idea.  What do you think would be gained by splitting them out?
20130430 19:32:19< Soliton> how in the world is a website subdir supposed to work?
20130430 19:33:03< Soliton> so we'd gain usability and separation of concerns.
20130430 19:33:49< Soliton> for resources it's a question of checkout space and maybe history size as well.
20130430 19:34:14< esr> Not seeing the usability gain.  I see a usability loss in that website changes are no longer using the same set of release tags as the code.
20130430 19:34:38< Soliton> how is that useful?
20130430 19:34:50< Soliton> i guess there are some misconceptions here.
20130430 19:35:04< esr> The case is a little stringer for resources, but the main repo is so large that the incremnent to checkout size is noise.
20130430 19:35:14< esr> s/stringer/stronger/
20130430 19:36:12< Soliton> 20+% of checkout size is not noise to me.
20130430 19:36:59< esr> Wan't that large when I computed it.  How did you measure?
20130430 19:37:11< vultraz> I still have my old svn checkout, if someone zipped me their .git folder and I removed the .svn files, would I be able to get a working clone without having to start a clone from scratch?
20130430 19:37:13< Soliton> du?
20130430 19:37:35< Soliton> vultraz: .git contains everything anyway.
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20130430 19:38:43< esr> Soliton: Some of the larger files have been in both repos.  So to get the actual checkout size savings I'd have to go back, find them, and excise them from the main repo's history. This seemed dubious.
20130430 19:39:06< Soliton> esr: i'm underestimating also since i already have build files in my checkout.
20130430 19:39:31< vultraz> Soliton: er...I'm just trying to figure a way to get a clone without having to download 2.6 GB of stuff in one shot
20130430 19:39:38 * Soliton wonders what checkout size has to do with history.
20130430 19:39:42< vultraz> especially since I have the data still
20130430 19:40:11< Soliton> vultraz: it's 1.6GB. there will be a tarball or whatever you can get.
20130430 19:41:01< Soliton> vultraz: we have not reached the final state though so unless you're in a hurry better wait some more.
20130430 19:41:49< vultraz> 1.6? then why is everyone telling me 2.6
20130430 19:42:28< Soliton> esr: in short: 1) website is not workable as a subdir. 2) resources is a considerable part of the checkout size.
20130430 19:45:05< AI0867> vultraz: pretty close, but the .git and .svn directories are the most of the size
20130430 19:45:28< AI0867> and yes, the .git dir contains everything you need to regenerate the rest
20130430 19:47:03< AI0867> resources were originally put in an svn branch so people wouldn't have the heavyweight files in their regular checkouts
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20130430 20:08:16< anonymissimus> fabi: looks as if the end turn button not working quite right was already reported ? pls fix it asap
20130430 20:09:30< anonymissimus> mattsc: it looks as if the healer support micro ai ignores the [ai][avoid] setting from its [side], can that somehow be fixed ?
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20130430 20:13:14< Ivanovic> esr: the website (sub)repo is not directly connected to any tags
20130430 20:13:35< Ivanovic> esr: there we "just" have all the announcements, g.w.o and stuff like this
20130430 20:13:50< Ivanovic> but since this is not part of "trunk" this is not part of any of the tagging
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20130430 20:25:17< esr> Soliton: I don't understand why you say "not workable".
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20130430 20:27:45< Soliton> esr: the website has about zero connection to the game. where i want a checkout of the website i do not want a checkout of the whole game. the people contributing to either are quite disconnected as well.
20130430 20:30:58< esr> Soliton: The website seems to me to have has a verious obvious connection to the game through the release chronology.
20130430 20:31:47< Soliton> that's like one page which is loosely coupled...
20130430 20:33:00< zookeeper> err, if we're talking about whether i should receive a copy of the website stuff when i download the git repo then, uh, it would sound pretty silly.
20130430 20:33:20< esr> And you're overestimating the gain by splitting out the resources directory.  As I said, the size of a main repo checkout wouldn't decrease by nearly as much as the size of a hyopothetical resource branch, because there's overlap of large files in the history.
20130430 20:33:54< Soliton> esr explain to me what the history size has to do with the checkout size.
20130430 20:35:20< esr> Soliton: When you clone a git repo you have to download the whole history.  For a repo as large and old as Wesnoth checkout size per se is barely even relevant as a cost metric.
20130430 20:35:26< thunderstruck> Soliton, maybe you might know what 'linger_' means as well? The "end scenario" phase?
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20130430 20:36:07< Soliton> i'm not sure why we're discussing this again anyway or why the concensus reached last time was just silently? changed.
20130430 20:37:22< Soliton> thunderstruck: yes, that's the phase after a scenario ended.
20130430 20:37:59< anonymissimus> mattsc: oh, and the github version of ai demos gives me Macro/file '~add-ons/AI-demos/micro_ais/activate_micro_ais.cfg' is missing at ~add-ons/Wesnoth-AI-Demos/_main.cfg:100
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20130430 20:43:40< esr> Soliton: I wasn't aware of a consensus on this.
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20130430 21:00:37< thunderstruck> fabi, I've decided that "before_human_turn" is probably the best place to enable that button. But instead of enabling just that one button, I wrote a call to "set_button_state()" in case in the future there will be something else.
20130430 21:00:52< thunderstruck> fabi, if you are fine with it, I'll submit a patch.
20130430 21:01:16< Soliton> esr: http://www.wesnoth.org/irclogs/2013/02/%23wesnoth-dev.2013-02-18.log starting at 20:00
20130430 21:02:22< bumbadadabum> mattsc: Desktop/Wesnoth.app/Contents/MacOS/Wesnoth: Permission denied
20130430 21:02:47< bumbadadabum> I got this error when trying your thingy
20130430 21:04:16< bumbadadabum> nice, a little chmod 777 solved my problem
20130430 21:04:26< bumbadadabum> mattsc: Thanks again!
20130430 21:06:45< bumbadadabum> fabi: Love the editor
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20130430 21:14:28< anonymissimus> fabi: this is perhaps the third or forth time this dev cycle that I can click around in the editor without any clue what I'm doing then...
20130430 21:16:38< mattsc> bumbadadabum: glad you got it to work
20130430 21:16:51< anonymissimus> looks as if this category drop-down menu just vanished the moment I got used to it
20130430 21:17:15< bumbadadabum> 2 things
20130430 21:17:23< bumbadadabum> 1. How do you sort by terrain group?
20130430 21:17:35< mattsc> anonymissimus: yes, the Micro AIs as a general rule do not take the standard aspects into account because for most of them that doesn't make sense (I think)
20130430 21:17:48< bumbadadabum> 2. some buttons are displayed behind the minimap
20130430 21:18:16< mattsc> anonymissimus: but in this case, it does make sense for HS to use [avoid], so I'll look into that.  It shouldn't be too hard.
20130430 21:18:16< bumbadadabum> (not sure if that's already fixed since mattsc gave me his file)
20130430 21:20:58< mattsc> anonymissimus: as for the error message, I have no idea what that is as the file seems to be there: https://github.com/mattsc/Wesnoth-AI-Demos/tree/master/micro_ais
20130430 21:21:51< mattsc> anonymissimus: Oh, no I see the problem.  You need to install AI-demos into ~add-ons/AI-demos/ otherwise it does not work
20130430 21:24:11< bumbadadabum> The End Turn button seems to be grayed out even when it's my turn
20130430 21:24:20< anonymissimus> mattsc: but your folder is called Wesnoth-AI-Demos at guthub thats why I had that name
20130430 21:24:24< bumbadadabum> there's not yet a bug report for that
20130430 21:24:32< bumbadadabum> so is this just me?
20130430 21:25:25< mattsc> anonymissimus: yes, I know...  It's an unfortunate inconsistency ...  Hmm, can I rename the github repository?
20130430 21:27:05< mattsc> If I rename the directory, it will show up as a different add-on on the add-ons server ...
20130430 21:27:37< bumbadadabum> mattsc: Isn't that dependent on the _server.pbl?
20130430 21:28:14< bumbadadabum> else, removing the add-on and re-uploading can work
20130430 21:28:56< mattsc> bumbadadabum: AFAIK, if you add it in a different directory with the same _Server.pbl, it will show up twice
20130430 21:29:14< bumbadadabum> you could always test
20130430 21:29:41< mattsc> bumbadadabum: I've "tested" it before (accidentally)
20130430 21:29:47< mattsc> bumbadadabum: yes, it will.  So, if I want to make it consistent, I either have to rename the git repository or the add-on
20130430 21:30:12< mattsc> Either way some people will have to uninstall and reinstall on or the other
20130430 21:30:31< bumbadadabum> git repo will affect the least people
20130430 21:30:52< mattsc> So far, it was easier just to tell people to rename the directory, since we've had a total of, oh, 3 people or so working on it  :)
20130430 21:31:32< mattsc> bumbadadabum: yep, I'll add it to the list.  anonymissimus is causing a lot of work.  ;)
20130430 21:31:52< mattsc> ... which, as I said yesterday, is great.  Feedback is good!
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20130430 21:32:38< mattsc> anonymissimus: the aggression= key issue should be fixed (I hope), but I haven't had time for the other things you brought up yet.
20130430 21:32:58< bumbadadabum> mattsc: you could always put in the readme that you should put it in ~add-ons/AI-demos/
20130430 21:34:15< mattsc> bumbadadabum: I should
20130430 21:40:07< bumbadadabum> mattsc: Have you been getting any trouble with the end turn button lately?
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20130430 21:43:18< mattsc> bumbadadabum: I haven't really tried lately.  Most of my testing is done AI vs. AI and even if not, I almost always use alt-space to end a turn
20130430 21:43:33< bumbadadabum> mattsc: could you try for me
20130430 21:43:51< mattsc> bumbadadabum: already did, writing ...
20130430 21:44:05< mattsc> But just a quick check in an MP game showed that the button seems to work but jump between the button and the tooltip display.
20130430 21:44:16< mattsc> ... when clicked, I mean
20130430 21:44:32< bumbadadabum> hmm
20130430 21:45:05< Soliton> there's a bug and thunderstruck already has a fix.
20130430 21:45:10< mattsc> That's with a custom large-font theme though, which has all kinds of other issues ...
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20130430 21:47:23< mattsc> anonymissimus: oh, and before you find that, it looks like the SUF in the Healer Support MAI might not work correctly in combination with aggression=0 in some situations.  I'm planning to check that out too.
20130430 21:49:01< Crab_> (sorry for the spam, but..) note to all potential GSoC students: you have until 19:00 UTC on 3rd of May  to submit your application to Google - that's a hard deadline, we can only accept proposals from Google's tracker. Also, we'll give extra comments and feedback on applications submitted to Google.
20130430 21:50:36< thunderstruck> Crab_, thanks for the feedback. It was really helpful.
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20130430 21:53:37< Crab_> thunderstruck: also take a look at what things we have in the main wesnoth WML config, and what types of user-made content we have (like eras, scenarios, etc). 
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20130430 21:54:34< Crab_> thunderstruck: you might need to add code to quickly switch between different modes like 'base and list of eras and campaigns loaded', 'base and list of campaigns and era X and campaign Y loaded'
20130430 21:54:56< Crab_> thunderstruck: And the 'quickly' part might take time (there might be need to have some extra caches)
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20130430 22:07:51< Vodkano> Hello.
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20130430 22:10:39< Vodkano> Crab_, are you there?
20130430 22:10:51< Crab_> Vodkano: hello! yes, I'm here
20130430 22:11:08< thunderstruck> Crab_, I understand that improving config loading times would be a good thing, but do my current proposed changes imply that I am forced to do that?
20130430 22:11:35< thunderstruck> Crab_, or is it just an additional thing?
20130430 22:12:21< Vodkano> I wanted to discuss my GSoC project.
20130430 22:12:42< Crab_> Vodkano: great. do you have any specific questions?
20130430 22:13:02< Crab_> thunderstruck: if the speed remains as is (or gets like 2..4 times slower) there'll be no need to do anything extra
20130430 22:13:17< Crab_> thunderstruck: if it'll get 10..100 times slower, then I guess we'll need to do something.
20130430 22:13:43< Crab_> thunderstruck: and having an good up-front design of how it'll work would save time.
20130430 22:14:03< Crab_> thunderstruck: if you design it in a way to minimize the number of config reloads, it'll probably work as is.
20130430 22:14:43< thunderstruck> Crab_, I agree with you, but since you emphasized it so much, I got a bit confused why it became so important and thought that I was missing something.
20130430 22:15:16< Vodkano> I wanted to take a look at a new and updated campaign, and wondered if you knew of any.
20130430 22:15:45< Crab_> thunderstruck: I empathised it because I wanted you to take a look at it - because in your description there were a few places where it mattered.
20130430 22:15:49< Trademark_> I'd would like to have some feedbacks on my proposal, if someone have time, it would be great :-) (http://wiki.wesnoth.org/User:Trademark/GSoC_2013/Addon_Server:_Create_a_new_and_shiny_one)
20130430 22:16:43< Crab_> Trademark_: I'm going into all the proposals submitted to google's tracker now, but addon server is more of a mordante's project, so it's best to ping him (can be done via google's tracker page)
20130430 22:17:48< Trademark_> Crab_, I didn't submitted it to google yet, I'm going to so. Is there some tips to avoid reformatting all the proposal in google-melange compatible html ?
20130430 22:18:22< Crab_> Trademark_: easy: add 2-3 paragraphs with the project abstract, then put a link to wiki.
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20130430 22:18:41< Crab_> Trademark_: remember that you have until  19:00 UTC on 3rd May to submit.
20130430 22:18:49< Crab_> google is strict with that deadline
20130430 22:19:13< Trademark_> Crab_, is it allowed ? google-melange has a deadline, if I put a link on an external resource, it's like the deadline goes away
20130430 22:19:30< Crab_> Vodkano: there's no updated campaign, but there's a description of various new things that the AI can be taught to do , like http://wiki.wesnoth.org/Micro_AIs 
20130430 22:19:48< Crab_> Vodkano: and we want to use those (or several of those) in campaigns, where appropriate
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20130430 22:21:12< Crab_> Trademark_: yes, allowed. google-melange has a deadline for getting your application in. then, it's "frozen" but org admins can "unfreeze" it, allowing the student to do changes after the deadline.
20130430 22:21:48< Crab_> Trademark_: in wesnoth, we mainly select students based on their coding and IRC interaction, so we would like them to continue interacting with us and improving their proposal even after the application deadline.
20130430 22:21:59< Crab_> Trademark_: that deadline is for google to know the number of proposals per org
20130430 22:22:13< Crab_> Trademark_: and for orgs to know all the applicants.
20130430 22:23:52< Trademark_> Crab_, ok I didn't know that ! I'll submit it soon so 
20130430 22:23:56< Vodkano> Crab_: I see you participated in GSoC 2009. How did it go?
20130430 22:24:33< Crab_> Vodkano: success. it was with wesnoth, as well :) that's how I got into the project. you can take a look at my proposal here http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SummerOfCodeProposal_AI_Improvement_Crab
20130430 22:25:15< Crab_> Trademark_: yes, just submit it  (if you'll inet connection will suddenly die on the last day, it'll be bad. and it happened to some people)
20130430 22:26:59< Trademark_> Crab_, I don't know how you found the time to do such a proposal, and you resolved a lot of bug too. Quite impressive actually.
20130430 22:27:52< Crab_> Trademark_: last year student, had no lessons during spring (had a half a year lecture-free just to write my diploma). so was able to work full-time during the application period, and enjoyed it.
20130430 22:30:20< Trademark_> Crab_, ho ok, it's nice ;-)
20130430 22:30:49< Trademark_> Crab_, so it was your last chance to do the gsoc as student in 2009 ?
20130430 22:31:16< Vodkano> Yeah your work is awesome
20130430 22:33:05< Crab_> Trademark_: yes (of course, it's pretty easy to enroll again if you want it, or to go post-graduate, but I went to work after getting a Master's diploma)
20130430 22:33:41< Crab_> Vodkano: take a look at http://wiki.wesnoth.org/GSoC-WesnothWhiteboard_Gabba - that's even better.
20130430 22:34:54< Crab_> it has plenty of pictures :)
20130430 22:40:31< Trademark_> I'm leaving, good night
20130430 22:41:46< Crab_> Trademark_: good night
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20130430 22:52:52< Vodkano> Crab_: The micro AI page mentions a micro_ai_test scenario, but wesnoth can't locate it
20130430 22:54:42< mattsc> Vodkano: which version of Wesnoth are you using?
20130430 22:55:33< Vodkano> 1.10.6
20130430 22:55:49< Vodkano> and 1.10.3
20130430 22:55:53< mattsc> Vodkano: Micro AIs were introduced in 1.11.2
20130430 22:56:15< Vodkano> Oh, i see it now
20130430 22:56:20< Vodkano> Thank you
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20130430 22:59:14< perennate> Soliton: it seems like the merge commit is correctly handled by github according to the "files changed" tab
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20130430 23:01:06< Soliton> perennate: alright, not really familiar with how that works yet.
20130430 23:02:58< perennate> Soliton: thanks for looking at the pull request!
20130430 23:04:42< Soliton> you're welcome. thanks for contributing to wesnoth! :-)
20130430 23:06:03< perennate> should I overwrite the first commit, or can I just add more commits?
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20130430 23:06:36< Soliton> i'd rewrite it or whatever if possible.
20130430 23:07:01< perennate> ok
20130430 23:07:07< Soliton> not to useful to have every iteration of the patch recorded IMO.
20130430 23:07:11< Soliton> too*
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20130430 23:28:32< fabi> hello
20130430 23:29:11< Crab_> fabi: hello
20130430 23:29:25< fabi> hi Crab_
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20130430 23:30:09< irker746> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 2a48e5f / src/events.cpp,src/events.hpp: Insert a call for the tooltips in the event processing queue. http://git.io/Yk_-Uw
20130430 23:31:58< perennate> oh oh, I messed the pull request up
20130430 23:32:00< perennate> uh oh*
20130430 23:34:15< Soliton> well, as pull request 1 you're just setting an example for everyone to follow. no pressure!
20130430 23:37:04< perennate> :P
20130430 23:37:20< perennate> it put the merge commits as separate commits or something
20130430 23:37:40< perennate> so now there's one commit in the pull request, kind of by accident (not sure what I did wrong when rebasing); but it looks better that way
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20130430 23:51:32< AI0867> Ivanovic: I got another email for 2a48e5f, so I don't know what's wrong with wesnoth-commits
20130430 23:53:52< shadowm> Maybe it just rejects everything?
20130430 23:54:03 * AI0867 tries mailing it himself
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--- Log closed Wed May 01 00:00:02 2013