--- Log opened Thu May 02 00:00:19 2013
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20130502 00:21:46< fabi> LordBob_: still around?
20130502 00:21:53< LordBob_> yup
20130502 00:22:05< LordBob_> though maybe not for long
20130502 00:23:05< LordBob_> fabi: ^
20130502 00:23:13< fabi> LordBob_: impassable/unwalkable
20130502 00:23:45< fabi> LordBob_: The first can not be occupied by a unit, say a solid cave wall.
20130502 00:24:07 * LordBob_ facepalms
20130502 00:24:11< fabi> LordBob_: The second can not be stand on but flown over. Lava or deep Water.
20130502 00:24:34< LordBob_> all this time I thought the two were a single type
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20130502 00:25:35< LordBob_> got it. I'll keep the white cross on red for impassable and create a new icon for unwalkable
20130502 00:26:36< fabi> LordBob_: Maybe the chasm is the prototype for unwalkable terrain.
20130502 00:26:59< fabi> LordBob_: And chasm might be easy to iconify.
20130502 00:27:32< LordBob_> Fabi: Either that, or a crossed footprint ^^
20130502 00:28:04< fabi> Yeah :-)
20130502 00:28:36< LordBob_> I'll try and have it done in the morning
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20130502 00:37:26< leo42> hello i did not get a chance to do a lot 2day but i have some questions to make before i forget :P
20130502 00:38:41< leo42> when playing the storys the difficulty lvl efects the behevier of the bots or only the ratio's and stats ?? 
20130502 00:39:07< leo42> and in witch file of the source code can  find the senarios ?? :P
20130502 00:43:51< shadowm> Rho: Added.
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20130502 01:11:39< AI0867> 21:10 < mordante> Soliton, like GNA that we can view patches and when applied an automatic message also for bugs <-- github has a redmine hook
20130502 01:12:11< AI0867> fabi: has any work been done on the LDAP and redmine stuff?
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20130502 01:13:01< fabi> AI0867: No
20130502 01:15:54< AI0867> okay
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20130502 01:40:48< irker055> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * cb501d7 / src/editor/editor_display.cpp,src/reports.cpp: Terrain icon info. http://git.io/-4a77w
20130502 01:40:50< irker055> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * e5b3cb8 / images/icons/terrain/ (75 files): Some new terrain type icons + optipng run on the old ones. http://git.io/jyKe1A
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20130502 02:18:33< mattsc> leo42: (just passing through quickly) did you get an answer to your questions?
20130502 02:18:50< leo42> noo not yet :P
20130502 02:19:11< leo42> mattsc: no not yet :p
20130502 02:19:23< mattsc> ok, so: the difficulty level _can_ effect everything, but often it's just gold or something similar to that
20130502 02:19:49< mattsc> as for the code, the scenarios/campaigns are not part of the source code.
20130502 02:19:55< mattsc> Check out data/campaigns
20130502 02:20:41< leo42> found it :)
20130502 02:20:46< leo42> thank you :) 
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20130502 02:21:17< mattsc> .. and with that I'm off again  :)   (although I'll stay logged in for a little)
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20130502 05:05:36-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: current repo: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old (still to be fixed) | http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SummerOfCodeIdeas | Will move the repo to github, please read the dev-ml! | 178 bugs, 333 feature requests, 27 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20130502 05:07:13< Sapient> AI0867: hi
20130502 05:08:11< vinipsmaker> first contribution to Wesnoth: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/pull/3 =DD
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20130502 05:08:46< Sapient> AI0867: just looking through the irclog and noticed something about controller filtering? it might be useful in network IMO
20130502 05:09:06< Sapient> AI0867: sometimes you actually do want an unsynched action
20130502 05:09:24< Sapient> obviously nothing that would result in a gamestate conflict though
20130502 05:10:04< Sapient> vinipsmaker: congrats
20130502 05:10:38< vinipsmaker> Sapient, thx :)
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20130502 05:46:56< nurupo> vinipsmaker: i think wesnoth devs still prefer using patches.wesnoth.org instead of github for patches
20130502 05:47:53< vinipsmaker> nurupo, the info I read here on IRC is that pull requests was on of the reasons to the move to github
20130502 05:48:12< vinipsmaker> nurupo, and I saw an accepted pull request on github too
20130502 05:50:05< nurupo> as far as i know, they want to switch to redmine
20130502 05:50:44< nurupo> and one of pull requests was closed, asking to send patch to patches.wesnoth.org
20130502 05:59:26< nurupo> vinipsmaker: see the discussion between mordante and Soliton starting from 20130501 20:54:57 http://www.wesnoth.org/irclogs/2013/05/%23wesnoth-dev.2013-05-01.log
20130502 06:07:43< vinipsmaker> nurupo, this pr was reopened later
20130502 06:08:15< vinipsmaker> I'll wait for some response and then I might move the fix to a patch
20130502 06:08:37< nurupo> yeah, it was closed by mordante and reopened by Soliton, that's why i suggested to read the log of their discussion
20130502 06:08:43< nurupo> okay
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20130502 07:38:27< Fire_Aura> zz
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20130502 09:24:30< irker625> Wesnoth: Vinícius dos Santos Oliveira :master * d271883 / src/unit.cpp: Fixes bug #20765: Stack overflow in animation because of weird WML files. http://git.io/Hg_u2w
20130502 09:24:32< irker625> Wesnoth: Boucman :master * b4478d6 / src/unit.cpp: Merge pull request #3 from vinipsmaker/master http://git.io/V4i2hg
20130502 09:27:24< vinipsmaker> boucman_work, can you add me as a GSoC student in the forums? My username is also vinipsmaker there
20130502 09:27:46< boucman_work> vinipsmaker: thx for the bug fix, I just pulled it in
20130502 09:28:16< boucman_work> an no, i'm at work and I  don't do much gsoc work this year, but there should be some forum admins around to help you...
20130502 09:29:23< vinipsmaker> boucman_work, thanks, I'll look for them
20130502 09:29:31< boucman_work> np
20130502 09:51:59< shadowm> ... Like me?
20130502 09:52:27< shadowm> It looks like someone else took care of it anyway.
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20130502 11:05:36-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: current repo: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old (still to be fixed) | http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SummerOfCodeIdeas | Will move the repo to github, please read the dev-ml! | 177 bugs, 333 feature requests, 27 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20130502 11:18:22< LordBob_> Hi fabi ; I've updated the editor artwork post in the forum with the completed terrain types
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20130502 11:20:03< LordBob_> fabi; and also, the downloaing of the repo clone is finished
20130502 11:20:13< LordBob_> *downloading
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20130502 11:29:48< fabi> LordBob_: hi
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20130502 11:38:26< fabi> LordBob_: What you got from (who was it?) should contain the binary. Mostly called Wesnoth or wesnoth-debug or maybe a.out.
20130502 11:39:00< fabi> LordBob_: You can execute the binary with ./wesnoth path/to/your/git/clone
20130502 11:41:22< fabi> LordBob_: hihi, the not walkable is funny.
20130502 11:42:37< LordBob_> fabi: it was from mattsc. I'll try it in a few minutes, though this might involve some command-line inquiries
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20130502 11:49:30< fabi> LordBob_: I just looked at the status box components.
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20130502 11:57:58< LordBob_> fabi: back
20130502 11:58:33< LordBob_> So, when you're saying I need to execute the binary you mean run it via the terminal ?
20130502 12:00:50< fabi> yes
20130502 12:00:55< fabi> "./wesnoth-debug
20130502 12:00:58< fabi> "
20130502 12:01:27< fabi> change your location to the directory with the binary
20130502 12:04:56< LordBob_> ok, I'm there
20130502 12:05:03< fabi> ls -l
20130502 12:05:15< fabi> gives you a list of the content
20130502 12:05:55< LordBob_> done. I see the binary, and the repo directory is there as well
20130502 12:06:22< fabi> then "./name_of_the binary
20130502 12:06:25< fabi> "
20130502 12:06:53< LordBob_> says "permission denied"
20130502 12:07:17< fabi> chmod 770 ./name_of_the_binary
20130502 12:07:40< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: I did chmod 777
20130502 12:07:44< LordBob_> done
20130502 12:07:51< fabi> try again
20130502 12:07:51< LordBob_> oh. so which one should it be ?
20130502 12:07:54< bumbadadabum> if 770 doesn't work
20130502 12:08:06< bumbadadabum> I know 777 works
20130502 12:08:06< fabi> LordBob_: even 700 would do it
20130502 12:08:35< fabi> LordBob_: The first is the value for the owner, the second for the group, and the third for all.
20130502 12:08:44< LordBob_> So, I went with 770. Something different happens now, but it's still an error message
20130502 12:09:00< LordBob_> "dyld: Library not loaded: @executable_path/../Frameworks/libintl.framework/Versions/8/libintl
20130502 12:09:01< LordBob_>   Referenced from: /Users/emilien_rotival/./wesnoth
20130502 12:09:02< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: You don't need to run it from the terminal
20130502 12:09:03< LordBob_>   Reason: image not found
20130502 12:09:04< LordBob_> Trace/BPT trap"
20130502 12:09:18< LordBob_> Ah. How then ?
20130502 12:09:19< bumbadadabum> just replace Wesnoth in Contents/MacOS
20130502 12:09:37< bumbadadabum> and the data folder with the one in the git repo
20130502 12:10:42< LordBob_> Bumbadadabum: will that work ? There's more in the package than just the "data" folder
20130502 12:10:59< bumbadadabum> yes, but that's all mac-specific
20130502 12:11:09< bumbadadabum> except images and data
20130502 12:11:49< LordBob_> so I would need to replace both resources/data and resources/images, woudn't I ?
20130502 12:11:55< bumbadadabum> yes
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20130502 12:16:03< LordBob_> It's alive. IT'S ALIVE ! :p
20130502 12:16:16< fabi> LordBob_: Yeah.
20130502 12:16:21< LordBob_> (ok, everything up and running smoothly, thanks bumbadadabum 
20130502 12:16:28< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: I had 1 problem with it though
20130502 12:16:37< bumbadadabum> the end turn button doesn't really work
20130502 12:17:16< fabi> LordBob_: But bumbadadabum's solution is a bad one.(sorry bumbadadabum)
20130502 12:17:38< fabi> LordBob_: You will need to do the copy procedure every time a change happens.
20130502 12:17:55< fabi> LordBob_: Thus, give the commandline a second try.
20130502 12:18:19< LordBob_> ok, ok, let's do it
20130502 12:18:39< bumbadadabum> fabi: But if you just want the binary without building every time
20130502 12:19:03< fabi> ?
20130502 12:19:09< bumbadadabum> fabi: you can use this and pull the data folder and images folder
20130502 12:19:28< fabi> I don't understand.
20130502 12:19:53< bumbadadabum> [12:17] fabi: LordBob_: You will need to do the copy procedure every time a change happens.
20130502 12:20:47< fabi> yes
20130502 12:21:00< bumbadadabum> and you wouldn't if you used the commandline?
20130502 12:21:27< LordBob_> fabi: I gave another try to the command line, this time typing "chmod777 ./wesnoth", then "./wesnoth", but I still receive the same error message
20130502 12:21:48< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: What is the error?
20130502 12:21:54< fabi> LordBob_: How is your directory structure?
20130502 12:22:09< fabi> LordBob_: I mean, where is ./wesnoth and where is the /data dir?
20130502 12:22:51< fabi> LordBob_: The command "pwd" might help you.
20130502 12:22:51< LordBob_> Ah. Wesnoth is in my user directory, of which the repo "wesnoth-old" is a direct child
20130502 12:23:08< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: That doesn't work on mac
20130502 12:23:18< LordBob_> And then "data" a child of wesnoth-old
20130502 12:23:27< fabi> LordBob_: okay
20130502 12:23:32< bumbadadabum> you need to do what I did really
20130502 12:23:38< bumbadadabum> for all the frameworks
20130502 12:23:47< bumbadadabum> and the directory structure
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20130502 12:25:06< fabi> bumbadadabum: frameworks?
20130502 12:25:10< LordBob_> You've lost me, bumbadadabum. Do you mean there is more to update than just data and images ?
20130502 12:26:03< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: No.
20130502 12:26:59< bumbadadabum> fabi: the mac version doesn't have just a binary and a data folder
20130502 12:27:19< fabi> I don't get how you can start the newer binary if only data and images is replaced.
20130502 12:27:41< bumbadadabum> fabi: the binary has the source code in it
20130502 12:28:05< fabi> ?
20130502 12:28:07< bumbadadabum> and for the rest, only the data and images folders contain new stuff
20130502 12:28:16< bumbadadabum> I don't know how everything works
20130502 12:28:19< bumbadadabum> but it just works
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20130502 12:29:11< LordBob_> Either way, as long as it works....
20130502 12:29:37< bumbadadabum> wow
20130502 12:29:46< bumbadadabum> why does it say my git clones aren't git repos
20130502 12:31:48< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: If you do what I told, it works
20130502 12:34:30< LordBob_> bumbadadabum: yeah, thanks. At least I can run a copy of the dev version, which is incredibly better than nothing at all
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20130502 12:44:00< PL_kolek> Hello! I wrote a sketch of my proposal, could someone review it, critisize, give some tips? 
20130502 12:44:02< PL_kolek> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/User:PL_kolek
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20130502 13:58:55< AI0867> 05:08 < Sapient> AI0867: just looking through the irclog and noticed something about controller filtering? it might be useful in network IMO <-- when was this? I don't recall
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20130502 15:25:44< mattsc> LordBob_, bumbadadabum: Good to hear that you got the executable to work.  I wouldn't copy the binary and the data folder though, you can simply set up a link to your git repository and binary location once, and it will automatically work every time you update those.
20130502 15:27:20< LordBob_> mattsc: I was hoping this would be possible. Could you give more detail as to how it is done ?
20130502 15:27:59< mattsc> Lordbob, sure, it's a simple one-liner from the CL:
20130502 15:28:19< mattsc> ln -s path-to-git-repository/data ./data
20130502 15:29:06< mattsc> do this in the directory where the data directory is for the version you want to use.  You need to move the existing data directory out of the way first though (just rename it to data-old or something)
20130502 15:30:17< bumbadadabum> mattsc: Isn't it like an alias?
20130502 15:31:08< mattsc> I think you're right that that's called an alias in Finder.  (I never use them, always do it from the CL)
20130502 15:31:25< bumbadadabum> mattsc: an alias doesn't work
20130502 15:32:14< LordBob_> mattsc: in other words, we trick our current app package into thinking that its binary and data aren't located in the package, but somewhere else ?
20130502 15:32:37< bumbadadabum> mattsc: Ok, the -s makes it work
20130502 15:33:00< bumbadadabum> now to fix my issue with .git folders missing after using git clone
20130502 15:33:24< mattsc> LordBob_: kind of ...  Essentially, you make it think that the content is in the local directory for any practical purposes, when in reality it is somewhere else.
20130502 15:34:35< bumbadadabum> Someone has the same problem http://stackoverflow.com/questions/15081773/git-folder-disappeared-git-status-gives-not-a-git-repository
20130502 15:35:09< mattsc> bumbadadabum: the -s sets up a symbolic link rather than a hard link.  But it's been too long that I cared about what the difference is that I've forgotten  :P
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20130502 15:35:39< mattsc> I'm sure 10 seconds on Google would provide that information ...
20130502 15:36:43< mattsc> Anyways, LordBob_, bumbadadabum: setting up compiling really wasn't that hard (but not 100% smooth either), I could try to walk you trhough if you want.
20130502 15:37:07< mattsc> Problem with that is that I don't know all that much about it either, so if your problems are different from mine, I might not know what to do.
20130502 15:38:10< mattsc> Otherwise, just let me know if there's a critical update you want compiled and I can do that  (since most of what I do is not in the source code, I only compile occasionally)
20130502 15:38:47< LordBob_> mattsc: I would like that, although it'll have to wait until I have some more time on my hands
20130502 15:39:18< bumbadadabum> mattsc: I got sick with trying to compile
20130502 15:39:37< bumbadadabum> kept getting errors
20130502 15:40:01< mattsc> LordBob_: ok - even if it goes smoothly it takes quite a bit of time (lots of deadtime while the computer is thinking), so just let me know.
20130502 15:40:26< mattsc> bumbadadabum: first time I did that the same happened for me.  Every time I set it up since it's gone pretty smoothly.
20130502 15:40:46< bumbadadabum> mattsc: the .git folder missing is more important for me atm
20130502 15:41:28< mattsc> bumbadadabum: of course.  And if you don't want to try it, that's less work for me anyway.  ;)
20130502 15:42:13< bumbadadabum> mattsc: If you want to be especially nice, you could give me your binary every time you compile
20130502 15:42:44< LordBob_> mattsc: just to be sure I'm doing things right...If the app I'm going to use is located in the Applications directory, and the repo I work with in the User directory, I should: 1. Move the CL to Applications/Wesnoth. 2. enter your CL ?
20130502 15:43:07< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: you can drag directories to the terminal window
20130502 15:43:15< mattsc> bumbadadabum: sure - but sometimes there are 2 weeks or more for me in between.  It might be better for you to request it when you think there's something new you want to try.  It's 3 button clicks and a bunch of waiting in between for me, that's all.
20130502 15:43:21< bumbadadabum> so you drag the git repo folder to the terminal
20130502 15:43:26< bumbadadabum> then a space
20130502 15:43:32< bumbadadabum> then drag the destination there
20130502 15:43:46< bumbadadabum> (drag your resources folder there and add /data)
20130502 15:44:01< bumbadadabum> That's how I do it, anyway
20130502 15:44:23< mattsc> bumbadadabum: cool, I didn't know that...
20130502 15:44:23< LordBob_> ôo
20130502 15:44:42< mattsc> LordBob_: I can give you the CL-only sequence if you want.
20130502 15:44:46< bumbadadabum> mattsc: It's very good if I'm too lazy to cd
20130502 15:44:54< mattsc> yeah
20130502 15:44:55< bumbadadabum> It doesn't work with git repos though
20130502 15:45:00< bumbadadabum> git needs a cd
20130502 15:47:14< bumbadadabum> my entire git repo went boom all of a sudden
20130502 15:48:25< mattsc> LordBob_: assuming you have Wesnoth 1.11.2 in the default dir on a Mac:  http://pastebin.com/Q3ncLSk7
20130502 15:49:25< mattsc> LordBob_: sorry, you probably need to replace 1.11 by 1.11.2 in the paths (I rename so that I can always use the same paths for any version of 1.11.x)
20130502 15:49:42< bumbadadabum> well
20130502 15:49:48< bumbadadabum> let's git clone for a fourth time
20130502 15:50:15< LordBob_> mattsc: I renamed the app into Wesnoth-dev for practical purposes. I suppose I'll be using that instead of "wesnoth 1.11.2" ?
20130502 15:50:27< mattsc> yes
20130502 15:50:52< mattsc> you can also walk your way through one dir at a time with an 'ls' in between, or use tab auto-completion
20130502 15:52:45< bumbadadabum> error: RPC failed; result=18, HTTP code = 200 MiB | 40 KiB/s    
20130502 15:52:45< bumbadadabum> fatal: The remote end hung up unexpectedly
20130502 15:52:46< bumbadadabum> fatal: early EOF
20130502 15:52:46< bumbadadabum> fatal: recursion detected in die handler
20130502 15:52:50< bumbadadabum> great.
20130502 15:53:18< LordBob_> mattsc: I'm tryin to do just that, however a los once I'm inside the Wesnoth.app folder doesn't return anything
20130502 15:53:32< LordBob_> mattsc: so I can't reach my resources/data folder
20130502 15:53:48< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: so Wesnoth.app is empty?
20130502 15:53:49< LordBob_> *ls, not los
20130502 15:54:03< LordBob_> that's what the command line tells me at least
20130502 15:54:27< LordBob_> of course, if i ask the finder to show its content, everything's there
20130502 15:55:15< mattsc> LordBob_: there should be exactly one folder in there, called Contents/
20130502 15:55:26< mattsc> That's at least how it is for me (and has been for ages)
20130502 15:56:01< mattsc> LordBob_: if you do 'ls -a' does it show anything then  (except . and ..)
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20130502 16:04:55< LordBob_> mattsc: ls -a does show the previously hidden Contents folder
20130502 16:05:23< mattsc> LordBob_: huh, strange.
20130502 16:06:48< LordBob_> And even stranger: eventhough the terminal kept saying there was no such directory, I was yet able to reach it ôo
20130502 16:08:42< LordBob_> a quick question: how do you move up one directory ?
20130502 16:08:50< mattsc> cd ..
20130502 16:08:52< LordBob_> (in the terminal, that is)
20130502 16:09:01< LordBob_> oh, right. Same as the old MS ODS
20130502 16:09:06< LordBob_> *MS DOS
20130502 16:13:00< LordBob_> Ok, it works. A huge thanks to you, mattsc :)
20130502 16:13:54< mattsc> LordBob_: cool  :)   Just let me know when you need a new binary because you want to check some new code feature.
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20130502 17:43:45< Shofixti> Crab_: Heyo! I finally catch you!
20130502 17:43:52< Crab_> Shofixti: hello!
20130502 17:44:32< Shofixti> Crab_: I really need some help. I've been digging around the Wesnoth source, trying to make a few patches to bolster my application...
20130502 17:44:59< Shofixti> Crab_: But to be honest, diving into the Wesnoth source code like this is a tad overwhelming, i'm having a hell of a time starting out
20130502 17:45:19< Crab_> yes, it's pretty big
20130502 17:45:34< Shofixti> Crab_: Is there some relativly simple patch you could suggest? It's hard for me to gauge from the EasyCoding page what would be good to start with
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20130502 17:48:13< Crab_> Shofixti: (looking...)
20130502 17:48:54< Shofixti> Crab_: No rush man... I've set aside today for just coding. And thanks a ton
20130502 17:50:20< Crab_> shadowm: https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?20734 looks easy enough. The first scenario of the campaign shouldn't be treated differently from others.
20130502 17:50:31< Crab_> shadowm: (sorry, not to you)
20130502 17:50:34< Crab_> Shofixti: ^
20130502 17:51:03< Crab_> Shofixti: the code which handles default gold is in http://svn.gna.org/viewcvs/wesnoth/trunk/src/gamestatus.cpp
20130502 17:52:02< Shofixti> Yeah, I can see how this might work already. Alright, i'll give this a go
20130502 17:52:11< Crab_> Shofixti: it has static const int default_gold_qty = 100; and uses it in a few places. initialize_team or some other method is probably not called on first scenario of the campaign
20130502 17:52:44< Crab_> the idea is to have an empty-or-default carryover information, then apply it to the first scenario of the campaign
20130502 17:52:52< Crab_> and that should set gold to default if it's not set by the scenario
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20130502 17:54:55< Shofixti> Thanks Crab, I'll get back to you if I have any questions
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20130502 17:56:57< Crab_> Shofixti: ok, good luck, then.
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20130502 18:04:31< bumbadadabum> jetrel2: The new mounted units look very good
20130502 18:04:50< bumbadadabum> I especially like the Knight and Elvish Rider
20130502 18:04:53< jetrel2> hey, thanks
20130502 18:05:36< bumbadadabum> I'm not sure about the Scout's sword arm though
20130502 18:05:59< bumbadadabum> It doesn't look like a natural way to hold a sword
20130502 18:06:52< jetrel2> It's actually fairly common with cavalry IRL.
20130502 18:07:00< bumbadadabum> And I can't really see what's going on with the Rider's right arm
20130502 18:08:39< Shofixti> Crab_: Alright, going through each campaign's starting scenario, I see just one where starting gold isin't initilized. It would be an easy fix to just add gold=100 and be done with it, but i'm going to assume you want this patch to actually fix things so that if there is no starting gold, 100 gets used.
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20130502 18:09:05< Crab_> Shofixti: yes, correct. it's better with things fixed.
20130502 18:10:09< Crab_> Shofixti: it would also allow the code to be slightly cleaner in a few places. for example, multiplayer could be later made to set-up and use carryover info, and not do the patch-the-scenario-to-insert-the-correct-leader-for-each-side ugly stuff it does now.
20130502 18:10:19< bumbadadabum> jetrel2: Also, I second vultraz's comments on the Paladin
20130502 18:10:53< bumbadadabum>  /peanut-gallery for now
20130502 18:11:42< Crab_> Shofixti: so, I want a fix not just for gold, I want the code to actually do a regular 'apply carryover information to scenario' logic to first scenario.
20130502 18:12:04< Crab_> and that logic is supposed to have the 'set gold to 100 if it's not defined' part.
20130502 18:12:43< Shofixti> Crab_: Aye. Righto then. Specifically just the first scenario?
20130502 18:12:48< thunderstruck> Crab_, it seems that someone was already working on that bug https://gna.org/patch/?3846
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20130502 18:13:31< Crab_> thunderstruck: let me check the fix, then.
20130502 18:14:16< timotei> Pff, this pull requests are just amazing.
20130502 18:14:24< thunderstruck> Crab_, yeah, I just wanted to point it to you, I don't know much about it, though.
20130502 18:15:14< mattsc> Crab_, Shofixti: just FYI, that bug has a patch already.  Of course, that doesn't mean that Shofixti cannot work on it also to get started.
20130502 18:15:27< Shofixti> Yeah, I'm reading through that patch now
20130502 18:15:35< Shofixti> Seems solid to me
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20130502 18:15:53< Shofixti> Though, it almost sounds as if Crab was looking for something... broader
20130502 18:15:55< Crab_> Shofixti: no, the fix is not good
20130502 18:16:12< Crab_> Shofixti: note that team.cpp duplicates the logic in gamestatus.cpp, which is not good
20130502 18:16:23< Crab_> mattsc, thunderstruck: thanks for pointing out the patch.
20130502 18:16:26< fabi> hello
20130502 18:16:30< Crab_> fabi: hello!
20130502 18:16:35< fabi> hi Crab_
20130502 18:16:37< fabi> hi LordBob_
20130502 18:17:32< Crab_> Shofixti: having two places in the code setting the gold to default value if it's not present is not good.
20130502 18:18:05< mattsc> (oops, sorry, wrote my comment before finishing reading the log...)
20130502 18:18:52< Shofixti> Crab_: Makes sense to me. It'll be easy enough for me to do the same thing in gamestatus, and make sure starting_gold and gold both get set proper.
20130502 18:19:08< Shofixti> That being said though,
20130502 18:19:48< Crab_> Shofixti: gamestatus already sets the default gold on carryover calculation
20130502 18:19:49< Shofixti> Do you want a slightly broader solution? A section where we could easily add defaults for empty config elements?
20130502 18:20:03< Crab_> Shofixti: but it looks like the carryover calculation is not done on first scenario
20130502 18:20:25< Shofixti> Crab_: Alright, yeah, sorry. Give me a bit to understand this a little further.
20130502 18:21:13< Crab_> Shofixti: and since we tasked carryover to handle the defaults on gold, the solution should remove the part from team.cpp which deals with default gold, and ensure that the other part is always executed (and check that nothing else strange happens after the change)
20130502 18:21:40< Crab_> Shofixti: no, I don't want a slightly broader solution until I have a slightly broader problem :)
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20130502 18:22:40< mattsc> Crab_: how hard would it be for students to finish the extCAs, make aspects work when the Lua engine is set, or add more replay-safe AI actions?  
20130502 18:22:41< mattsc> Just trying to help come up with other ideas here, no selfish interest at all.  :D
20130502 18:22:59< Shofixti> mattsc: Appreciated!
20130502 18:23:19< mattsc> Shofixti: as in, I very much have a selfish interest in that  :)
20130502 18:23:35< Crab_> mattsc: I'll try to find/mail someone interested. (note: it's free-to-take )
20130502 18:23:57< Crab_> (and bye for today)
20130502 18:24:03< mattsc> Crab_: I'm asking because I really have no idea how easy/hard it is
20130502 18:24:07< mattsc> bye
20130502 18:24:08< Crab_> Shofixti: I'll read the log in case you'll have any questions
20130502 18:24:14< Shofixti> Righto. Thanks again
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20130502 19:17:20< PL_kolek> Crab_, Shofixti, that discussed patch was written by me.
20130502 19:18:18< PL_kolek> That was my first attempt at coding for wesnoth, so I didn't know that this specific part of code is duplicated or something broader is wrong.
20130502 19:18:43< PL_kolek> I just pinpointed that wrong line, corrected it, that worked and submitted a patch.
20130502 19:19:41< PL_kolek> So if you want me to go deeper into that, I'll work on it. If you, Shofixti, want to take that, I'll find something else to code ;).
20130502 19:24:17< PL_kolek> BTW I'm working on my proposal, if someone could point me some errors, advices and generally destroy my hopes, than please do it :) http://wiki.wesnoth.org/User:PL_kolek
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20130502 19:34:14< Soliton> "The less accurate we estimate, the smaller damage we predict." that does not make sense to me and there is no explanation on how you got to that conclusion.
20130502 19:39:18< Soliton> as a general note: you propse several tags that appear to contain algorithms. plain WML is not particularly suited for that. will they contain lua code or how are they supposed to work?
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20130502 19:49:47< leo42> hello...
20130502 19:50:10< leo42> back again with more questions :P
20130502 19:50:34< leo42> so i can start a micro-ai using an event :P
20130502 19:50:52< leo42> is it posible to also stop tha micro-ai in an event ?? :P
20130502 19:52:12< mattsc> leo42: http://wiki.wesnoth.org/Micro_AIs#2._Activating_and_configuring_.28or_deleting.29_a_Micro_AI
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20130502 19:54:27< leo42> just with the word delete :P exelent i thing i can try working on my first mod now :P
20130502 19:54:36< leo42> thank you :)
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20130502 20:11:40< nurupo> Soliton: should patches be submitted to patches.wesnoth.org or github?
20130502 20:12:26< Soliton> nurupo: github as far as i'm concerned.
20130502 20:12:40< nurupo> Soliton: same for bug reports?
20130502 20:13:02< Soliton> no.
20130502 20:13:13< nurupo> okay, gna for bugreports then
20130502 20:14:05< Soliton> until we have something better, yes.
20130502 20:14:35< nurupo> something like redmine :)
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20130502 21:02:48< kushnewb> Heya everyone
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20130502 21:11:20< perennate> hi, Soliton, what nick/reason makes the ignore not load?
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20130502 21:13:48< Soliton> perennate: currently my preferences just have ignores="test 1 2 3" and it tells me my ignore list is empty.
20130502 21:15:01< perennate> hm, where is the preferences file on linux?
20130502 21:15:25< fabi> LordBob_: ping
20130502 21:15:43< LordBob_> fabi: pong 
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20130502 21:16:29< fabi> LordBob_: Okay, I just enabled the unit palette and the units look quite good above the big backgrounds.
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20130502 21:16:30< Soliton> perennate: if you did not specify anything i think ~/.config/wesnoth or some such.
20130502 21:16:51< perennate> Soliton: ah ok I see
20130502 21:17:12< Soliton> perennate: btw, '(*i).' can be written as 'i->'.
20130502 21:17:27< fabi> LordBob_: But I wonder how I should handle the palette sizes.
20130502 21:17:52< perennate> it seems to work for me; I'll update that
20130502 21:18:01< LordBob_> fabi: meaning ?
20130502 21:18:13< fabi> LordBob_: I mean, the sources for all current palettes are mostly meant to be placed on a hex field.
20130502 21:18:57< fabi> LordBob_: This the artworks size is 72x72 (with some exceptions: fire dragon) for terrain, units and items.
20130502 21:19:10< Soliton> perennate: saving and reading from preference file works for you? i.e. you add some ignores quit wesnoth and when you start it again they're still there?
20130502 21:19:41< perennate> Soliton: yes; I also tried updating to ignores="test 1 2 3" and it seems to work too
20130502 21:19:55< fabi> LordBob_: Thus, we could just give the palette a checkbutton to switch between 36+2 and 72+2 presentation.
20130502 21:20:13< fabi> LordBob_: No matter what content is displayed.
20130502 21:20:46< Soliton> perennate: odd, i see.
20130502 21:21:21< perennate> although I think now that it uses semicolons instead of commas, old settings won't be readable
20130502 21:22:01< Soliton> hmm, good point.
20130502 21:22:11< LordBob_> fabi: not sure. It might be a good idea for terrain, however units and items are hardly going to be usable at 36+2.
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20130502 21:23:38< Soliton> ideally things would be saved in a proper list of tags then there would be no need to remove any characters from the reason...
20130502 21:24:00< fabi> LordBob_: They are still recognizable.
20130502 21:24:22< Soliton> perennate: how fed up are you with this feature by now? :-P
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20130502 21:24:31< perennate> Soliton: lol
20130502 21:24:50< perennate> ok, I'll see about escaping them
20130502 21:25:49< Soliton> perennate: no need for escaping. if you look at your preference file.. ignores should be saved like hotkeys.
20130502 21:26:32< perennate> Soliton: what's the key for that?
20130502 21:26:37< perennate> or do I need to set some hotkeys first
20130502 21:27:00< Soliton> perennate: i.e. [ignore] name="nick1" reason="reason1"
20130502 21:27:10< Soliton> perennate: yeah could be you need to change one.
20130502 21:27:47< perennate> ah
20130502 21:28:33< fabi> LordBob_: Although, the big representation isn't really usable at 800x480.
20130502 21:28:53< Soliton> perennate: maybe even better to use something more general than [ignore] so friends can be transitioned to the same storage model once we want to save more meta data there as well.
20130502 21:29:23< perennate> so
20130502 21:29:37< perennate> something like [friend]name = "nick1"; status="ignored"; reason="reason1"[/friend]?
20130502 21:29:49< Soliton> indeed.
20130502 21:31:38< LordBob_> most of them might be recognizable, but we have no guarantee that every unit ever will be. So I'm wondering if it's worth the extra work
20130502 21:31:50< Soliton> perennate: for future changes better just add commits for now we can squash/force push at the end. easier for me to review the changes after all.
20130502 21:32:13< perennate> Soliton: ok that sounds good
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20130502 21:34:23< _8680_> perennate, Soliton: “friends” and “ignored people” seem to me categories that would generally (though not always) be disjoint — maybe the more general [person] would be better?
20130502 21:35:03< Soliton> person is a bit too general though IMO.
20130502 21:35:30< Soliton> a better word than friend is welcome though.
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20130502 21:36:52< _8680_> …Alas, the alternatives I can currently think of are either equally general or too long.
20130502 21:37:30< Soliton> acquaintance is the only other word coming to my mind.
20130502 21:37:35< LordBob_> fabi: either way, I'd rather have this size switch a very discrete button, if not a menu option
20130502 21:38:13< perennate> relationship or relation
20130502 21:38:30< perennate> but those are also too general probably
20130502 21:38:35< perennate> well the latter is anyway
20130502 21:39:39< _8680_> “relation” implies a familial relationship specifically; “acquaintance” or “relationship” could work, though they’re somewhat long.
20130502 21:40:10< _8680_> Anyway, it’s not exactly my business.
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20130502 21:41:08< fabi> LordBob_: oh
20130502 21:42:54< LordBob_> fabi: thing is, either your screen is large enough to use the 72+2 palette or it's not, bu tI don't picture the use
20130502 21:43:14< LordBob_> but I don't picture the user switching every now and then just for the pleasure of it
20130502 21:48:11< fabi> LordBob_: Hmm, I guess then it is better to just stay within one size for everything at a certain resolution.
20130502 21:54:49< PL_kolek> Soliton, thanks for the feedback. I corrected the first issue, and have a question regarding the general one. Would you mind?
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20130502 22:01:29< Soliton> PL_kolek: just ask.
20130502 22:05:34< PL_kolek> You said that I didn't provide information on how this tags let the user choose or write function.
20130502 22:06:12< PL_kolek> I thought of string (name) value for pre-written by me algorithms
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20130502 22:07:13< Soliton> ah, ok.
20130502 22:07:14< PL_kolek> And possibility to write an LUA function for that. But I'm sure there is more elegant way to specify that. I mean, write the function somewhere aside and use its name in the WML
20130502 22:07:42< Soliton> sounds good.
20130502 22:07:54< PL_kolek> And once again for the criticism, that helps a lot (and lowers my morale :))
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20130502 22:08:12< Soliton> you're welcome.
20130502 22:08:51< PL_kolek> Did you read the question between the lines? ;)
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20130502 22:11:37< Soliton> hmm?
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20130502 22:13:50< PL_kolek> OK. I read saw in the LuaAI guide, that user defined CAs are 'hardcoded' into scenario file. That's ugly, clutters the data with code. Is there any way to set it up ic a more clean way?
20130502 22:14:50< Soliton> you can write lua into separate files, i think. i don't know much about lua though.
20130502 22:16:41< PL_kolek> OK. I will state now in my proposal as I told you in the beginning and then I'll dig into this more
20130502 22:19:13< LordBob_> fabi: which size do you suggest for which resolutions?
20130502 22:20:08< fabi> LordBob_: < 1500 ---> 36px
20130502 22:20:23< fabi> LordBob_: >1500 ---> 72px
20130502 22:21:58< LordBob_> fabi: ...I would still like to see a screenshot with the units at 36 pix. Shrinked pixel art=high risk of resulting in a bloody mess.
20130502 22:22:16< fabi> LordBob_: No doubt, they are ugly as hell.
20130502 22:22:47< LordBob_> fabi: then, why not restrict the 36 pix to 800 res ?
20130502 22:23:21< LordBob_> Even 1024 screens have plenty space for 72 pix units
20130502 22:23:44< LordBob_> So  there's hardly a reason to give the user less than what he previously had
20130502 22:23:59< fabi> previously?
20130502 22:24:00< LordBob_> (or less than he can afford anyway)
20130502 22:24:27< LordBob_> forget the "previously"
20130502 22:24:59< fabi> I don't worry much about the units.
20130502 22:25:32< fabi> The terrain space is a little spare at low resolutions with 72 images.
20130502 22:26:30< LordBob_> Fabi: I don't get it. Is it problematic that the two different palette sizes cohabit ?
20130502 22:27:27< LordBob_> If not, I don't see why we would be willing to force the user the squint at pixelated uglies when we can show him the full size unit
20130502 22:27:54< fabi> Then I would also show him the full size terrains.
20130502 22:29:05< LordBob_> Then let's display the full-size terrains as well
20130502 22:30:00< LordBob_> The only limitation, I think, is that the user might feel he's spending too much time scrolling the palette. But then, this is what terrain categories are for
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20130502 22:31:46< LordBob_> fabi: so, I would say that any display beyond 800 gets full-size everything, and users of low-res displays get to squint hard. They're used to t anyway :p
20130502 22:36:03< fabi> LordBob_: http://imagebin.org/256218
20130502 22:37:02< LordBob_> Erm... Maybe not 72 pix everywhere, then
20130502 22:37:16< LordBob_> You do have a point
20130502 22:38:28< LordBob_> And would you have a screen with the 36 pix units, by chance ?
20130502 22:40:16< fabi> LordBob_: It is compiling right now :-)
20130502 22:42:28< LordBob_> (note to self: next time, wait for screenshot first, discuss afterwards. Much time may be saved)
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20130502 22:45:26< fabi> LordBob_: http://imagebin.org/256219
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20130502 22:47:15< LordBob_> hmmmm...That's a tough one. Ugliest things I've seen in a while, yet functionnally an improvement over the large image
20130502 22:47:43< LordBob_> Fabi: two questions
20130502 22:48:11< LordBob_> 1. Is there any logic as to the sequence in which the units are displayed ?
20130502 22:48:52< fabi> LordBob_: Hmmm, I don't think so. Maybe that is the order in which they got parsed from the files.
20130502 22:48:54< LordBob_> 2. Does the user have a mean to confirm with text that the unit he's selected is really the one he thinks
20130502 22:49:34< fabi> LordBob_: The palette buttons have tooltips.
20130502 22:49:54< LordBob_> fabi: then, it might be interesting to sort them by unit line and level, such as is done by the unit tree
20130502 22:50:13< LordBob_> (and ok, tooltips might save the day)
20130502 22:50:51< LordBob_> fabi: this way, even if the unit is hardly recognizable, having some sort of logic in their placement will help the user
20130502 22:52:14< fabi> Yes, sorting them should be doable. The unit tree sorting isn't that easy but I will make it happen.
20130502 22:53:54< LordBob_> fabi: oh, that's too bad. I was hoping there'd exist a sorting script that you would be able to summon :s
20130502 22:53:59< fabi> LordBob_: And what is the terrain group is the race with units.
20130502 22:54:36< fabi> LordBob_: Well, maybe there is something in the help system which can be reused.
20130502 22:56:12< LordBob_> fabi: either way, I reckon your intuition was right. We will likely end with 36 pix buttons everywhere in resolutions up to 1600
20130502 22:56:59< fabi> LordBob_: ~ 1000 in the vertical might be the lower border.
20130502 22:59:46< LordBob_> Fabi: let's make it another feature of the amazing HD theme, and have a single threshold for both palette and high res display
20130502 23:00:36< fabi> okay
20130502 23:00:56< fabi> I am away now
20130502 23:00:57< fabi> bye
20130502 23:01:03< LordBob_> see ya
20130502 23:01:15< Trademark_> mordante: just a note to say 1) I'm currently discussing about the back-end with a database expert (the relational database seems best but we need further analysis), I also update my proposal with your recommendations and added a class diagram, I hope my design intention will be clearer. Thanks for the advices ;-)
20130502 23:02:08< Trademark_> if anyone want to give a feedback on the class diagram, please feel free to do it :-)
20130502 23:09:08< PL_kolek> Trademark_, my feedback is that your proposal impresses me with the number of details described. Regarding diagrams, I don't like diagrams in general :P
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20130502 23:27:57< PL_kolek> Which project description is taken into account if they differ: from your wiki or from application to google?
20130502 23:36:59< Trademark_> PL_kolek, haha thanks, I'm not a fan of diagram but I think they can help to quickly give you the overall architecture :-)
20130502 23:37:53< Trademark_> PL_kolek, and you should link your wiki application in your google proposal, they shouldn't differ
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20130502 23:38:27< Trademark_> I just add a quick summary on google and a link to my wiki page
20130502 23:40:56< Trademark_> I'm off bye
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20130502 23:51:46< PL_kolek> Good idea, thanks.
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20130502 23:54:38< Zazweda> hey
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20130502 23:56:47< Zazweda> mattsc: I think Crab left some "job" for me on my application, and ended by "ask me of mattsc", so here I am :D
20130502 23:57:32< Zazweda> or*
20130502 23:57:57< mattsc> Zazweda: ok ...  What job?  :)
20130502 23:59:46< Zazweda> It's about the implementation of multiple MAI running per side
--- Log closed Fri May 03 00:00:22 2013