--- Log opened Sat May 04 00:00:45 2013
20130504 00:04:06-!- LordBob_ [~chatzilla@2a01:e34:ee82:47e0:21e:c2ff:fe01:261f] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 00:05:21-!- skyfaller_ [~skyfaller@ool-43551edd.dyn.optonline.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 00:05:55-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20130504 00:08:30-!- skyfaller [~skyfaller@wikipedia/Skyfaller] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20130504 00:08:59< fabi> hi anonymissimus
20130504 00:09:54-!- lipkab [~lipk@apn-94-44-219-46.vodafone.hu] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20130504 00:22:16-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 00:24:46-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@g224185106.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 00:29:51-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 00:30:10-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.157.252] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 00:30:12< irker447> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 226ede1 / src/editor/map/map_context.cpp: Enable the loading of the extra wml config map file. http://git.io/PplhjQ
20130504 00:32:16-!- noy_ [~Noy@208.181.105.129] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 00:32:16-!- noy_ [~Noy@208.181.105.129] has quit [Changing host]
20130504 00:32:16-!- noy_ [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 00:32:16-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 00:32:16-!- noy_ is now known as noy
20130504 00:41:40-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20130504 00:50:39-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.157.252] has left #wesnoth-dev ["Leaving"]
20130504 00:51:18-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
20130504 01:10:01-!- LordBob_ [~chatzilla@2a01:e34:ee82:47e0:21e:c2ff:fe01:261f] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20130504 01:29:29-!- Trademark_ [~ptalbot@mne69-1-82-67-17-201.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 01:31:08-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-158-45-47.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 01:33:28-!- {V} [~V@139-79-ftth.on.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20130504 02:02:34-!- {V} [~V@139-79-ftth.on.nl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 02:04:10-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: bumbadadabum]
20130504 02:17:55-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20130504 02:24:58-!- ancestral [~ancestral@mobile-198-228-235-223.mycingular.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 02:25:57-!- mattsc [~mattsc@d154-20-34-165.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 02:33:03-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 02:33:03-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has quit [Changing host]
20130504 02:33:03-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 02:38:37-!- ancestral [~ancestral@mobile-198-228-235-223.mycingular.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20130504 02:43:08-!- perennate [~wizardus@MACGREGOR-THREE-TWENTY-EIGHT.MIT.EDU] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 02:43:09-!- perennate [~wizardus@MACGREGOR-THREE-TWENTY-EIGHT.MIT.EDU] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20130504 02:43:16-!- perennate [~wizardus@MACGREGOR-THREE-TWENTY-EIGHT.MIT.EDU] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 02:50:36-!- anonymissimus [~chatzilla@HSI-KBW-149-172-228-192.hsi13.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 11.0/20120312181643]]
20130504 02:52:30-!- ancestral [~ancestral@67-6-53-117.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 02:53:10-!- jleldridge [~chatzilla@cpe-098-026-227-236.triad.res.rr.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 02:55:35-!- loonybot [~loonybot@wesnoth/bot/loonybot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 03:06:43-!- ancestral [~ancestral@67-6-53-117.mpls.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Smell ya later!]
20130504 03:08:46-!- stikonas__ [~gentoo@as932.girton.cam.ac.uk] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20130504 03:11:01< leo42> hey anyone online that know's if i can use a unit tipe as a speaker in a message ?? 
20130504 03:11:40< _8680_> leo42: Not as speaker=, but you could try type=.
20130504 03:12:32< leo42> okkk i try it :P
20130504 03:12:40< leo42> thanx :P
20130504 03:14:56< leo42> i think im done with my first senario mod :D  he he but il leave the testing for 2mr :P
20130504 03:15:10< leo42> gn wesnoth :P
20130504 03:15:28-!- leo42 [~leantros@cpe-384193.ip.primehome.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20130504 03:25:34-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 03:25:52-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 03:30:14-!- irker447 [~irker@ai0867.net] has quit [Quit: transmission timeout]
20130504 03:46:51-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-158-45-47.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Blueblaze]
20130504 03:48:20-!- perennate [~wizardus@MACGREGOR-THREE-TWENTY-EIGHT.MIT.EDU] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20130504 03:56:16-!- vinipsmaker [~vinipsmak@179.235.172.172] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20130504 04:03:32-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-158-45-47.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 04:05:36-!- vultraz_laptop [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 04:17:10< jleldridge> How do I go about accessing the scenarios that test the Micro-AIs from inside of the game?
20130504 04:19:44-!- vultraz_laptop [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20130504 04:20:39-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
20130504 04:23:05< mattsc> jleldridge: http://wiki.wesnoth.org/Micro_AIs#Micro_AI_Test_and_Demo_Scenarios
20130504 04:23:26< jleldridge> Thank you :)
20130504 04:36:35-!- Ivanovic_ [~ivanovic@dtmd-4db2c035.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 04:36:35-!- Ivanovic_ [~ivanovic@dtmd-4db2c035.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Changing host]
20130504 04:36:35-!- Ivanovic_ [~ivanovic@wesnoth/developer/ivanovic] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 04:40:33-!- Ivanovic [~ivanovic@wesnoth/developer/ivanovic] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20130504 04:40:35-!- Ivanovic_ is now known as Ivanovic
20130504 04:47:14-!- EliDupree2 [~eli@dhip-029.rrw.residences.colby.edu] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20130504 04:49:39-!- vultraz_laptop [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 04:58:45-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 05:04:11-!- Fire_Aura [Fire_Aura@115.242.188.213] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 05:05:37-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: current repo: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old (still to be fixed) | http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SummerOfCodeIdeas | Will move the repo to github, please read the dev-ml! | 178 bugs, 333 feature requests, 27 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20130504 05:09:54-!- Fire_Aura [Fire_Aura@115.242.188.213] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20130504 05:25:43-!- mattsc [~mattsc@d154-20-34-165.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: bye]
20130504 05:59:46-!- ancestral [~ancestral@67-6-53-117.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 06:05:45< jleldridge> Can anyone help me with an error cmake is giving me while trying to set it up to compile wesnoth?
20130504 06:14:23-!- jleldridge [~chatzilla@cpe-098-026-227-236.triad.res.rr.com] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90 [Firefox 20.0.1/20130409194949]]
20130504 06:23:36-!- Samual [diotecktec@xonotic/core-team/Samual] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20130504 07:08:16-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-158-45-47.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Blueblaze]
20130504 07:16:23-!- nphro [~nphro@cpc4-broo8-2-0-cust224.14-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20130504 07:26:49-!- Kexoth [~kex@89.205.70.185] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 07:28:44-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-158-45-47.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 07:31:35-!- Kexoth [~kex@89.205.70.185] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 07:33:59-!- Kexoth [~kex@89.205.70.185] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 07:44:44-!- LordBob_ [~chatzilla@2a01:e34:ee82:47e0:21e:c2ff:fe01:261f] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 07:53:31-!- ancestral [~ancestral@67-6-53-117.mpls.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: i go nstuf kthxbai]
20130504 07:54:16-!- ancestral [~ancestral@67-6-53-117.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 07:58:31-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-158-45-47.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Blueblaze]
20130504 08:09:38-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-158-45-47.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 08:11:32-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 08:22:50-!- irker144 [~irker@ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 08:22:50< irker144> Wesnoth: Emilien Rotival :master * 843a370 / images/icons/status/ (2 files): new status icons for the upper menu bar http://git.io/FYuQ0Q
20130504 08:22:52< irker144> Wesnoth: mattsc :master * ae71a23 / data/ai/micro_ais/scenarios/animals.cfg: Animals MAI test scenario: remove SLFs that always evaluate true http://git.io/SFpKPA
20130504 08:22:54< irker144> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 3d3bbc3 / src/display.hpp: Fix the spelling in a comment. http://git.io/jfTphQ
20130504 08:22:56< irker144> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 0b22b70 / data/core/images/themes/status_box/ (9 files): New status box art from Lord Bob. http://git.io/c-6iiQ
20130504 08:22:58< irker144> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 95f0ed8 / images/buttons/button_selectable/button_selectable_74_base-normal.png: Deleted a wrong named image. http://git.io/OpO7Yw
20130504 08:23:00< irker144> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 627ca32 / images/icons/terrain/ (2 files): Artwork for cave terrain. http://git.io/YyLH3A
20130504 08:23:02< irker144> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 1a3a7b3 / images/icons/terrain/ (2 files): Icon for unwalkable terrain. http://git.io/w7aCQg
20130504 08:23:04< irker144> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * a8b7bb5 / src/editor/palette/ (5 files): Adjust the palette size for low resolutions. http://git.io/65i7vQ
20130504 08:23:06< irker144> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 1a44707 / src/editor/map/context_manager.cpp,src/editor/map/context_manager.hpp: Add support for selecting the transition mode directly. http://git.io/1sVNqQ
20130504 08:23:08< irker144> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 8ab9659 / src/variable.cpp: Avoid a null pointer access. http://git.io/iR0STg
20130504 08:23:10< irker144> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 734d30d / src/editor/action/ (6 files): Fix drawing issues with the editor tools. http://git.io/4Xv3Ug
20130504 08:23:12< irker144> Wesnoth: fendrin :master * 226ede1 / src/editor/map/map_context.cpp: Enable the loading of the extra wml config map file. http://git.io/PplhjQ
20130504 08:27:40-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.174.196] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 08:28:05< irker144> Wesnoth: Emilien Rotival :master * 7c10f60 / images/icons/action/ (8 files): Removed blank files that should not have been included in the icon package http://git.io/B5N84Q
20130504 08:28:07< irker144> Wesnoth: Emilien Rotival :master * 97652dd / images/icons/action/ (18 files): updated editor tool icons for unit and item http://git.io/tqRI0Q
20130504 08:28:09< irker144> Wesnoth: Emilien Rotival :master * f2d0016 / images/icons/action/ (3 files): renamed 3 editor tool icon files that did not follow the naming convention http://git.io/-A4-aw
20130504 08:31:18< irker144> Wesnoth: Emilien Rotival :master * 181e3a9 / images/icons/action/ (3 files): Removed editor tool icon files that became redundant after renaming http://git.io/3vl-OA
20130504 08:32:12-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.174.196] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20130504 08:40:36-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 08:45:32-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 08:56:23-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20130504 09:09:02-!- timotei [~timotei@79.119.97.62] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 09:09:02-!- timotei [~timotei@79.119.97.62] has quit [Changing host]
20130504 09:09:02-!- timotei [~timotei@wesnoth/developer/timotei] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 09:13:11-!- Gambit [~gambit@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 09:18:45-!- exciton [chuck-the-@89.208.169.104] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 09:19:00-!- exciton [chuck-the-@89.208.169.104] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 09:22:30-!- darius42 [1f939ed3@gateway/web/freenode/ip.31.147.158.211] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 09:23:48-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 09:29:44-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-158-45-47.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Blueblaze]
20130504 09:31:06-!- LordBob_ [~chatzilla@2a01:e34:ee82:47e0:21e:c2ff:fe01:261f] has quit [Quit: back on tuesday]
20130504 09:38:54-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 09:46:41-!- vultraz_laptop [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20130504 09:46:43-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20130504 09:47:50-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20130504 09:51:48-!- Necrosporus [~Necrospor@unaffiliated/necrosporus] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20130504 09:57:40-!- vultraz_laptop [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 09:59:43-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 10:02:15-!- ancestral [~ancestral@67-6-53-117.mpls.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: i go nstuf kthxbai]
20130504 10:03:15-!- Trademark [~ptalbot@mne69-1-82-67-17-201.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 10:04:21-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 10:05:47-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@g224185043.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 10:07:02-!- jetrel2 [~jetrel2@mn-10k-dhcp1-437.dsl.hickorytech.net] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 10:08:02-!- jetrel2 [~jetrel2@mn-10k-dhcp1-437.dsl.hickorytech.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 10:23:08-!- stikonas [~gentoo@128.232.240.234] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 10:23:08-!- stikonas [~gentoo@128.232.240.234] has quit [Changing host]
20130504 10:23:08-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 10:34:49< Trademark> why does the github repository of Wesnoth is called "Wesnoth-old" ?
20130504 10:45:53-!- darius42 [1f939ed3@gateway/web/freenode/ip.31.147.158.211] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20130504 10:50:53< timotei> Trademark: because it was meant as a temporary repo while the migration to git was finished
20130504 10:51:17-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20130504 10:53:26-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
20130504 11:04:20-!- Crendgrim [~quassel@f050094195.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20130504 11:05:30-!- PL_kolek [~PL_kolek@77-253-195-70.adsl.inetia.pl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 11:06:38-!- Crendgrim [~quassel@g224212091.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 11:07:11-!- mordante [~mordante@wesnoth/developer/mordante] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 11:07:26< mordante> servus
20130504 11:08:20< mordante> Soliton, I see you don't care about patch history and therefore nobody should care? :-|
20130504 11:18:47< mordante> vinipsmaker I'll review your proposal later, will review all projects posted to Wesnoth
20130504 11:21:15< Trademark> timotei, it was ? (so not anymore ?)
20130504 11:21:15-!- PL_kolek [~PL_kolek@77-253-195-70.adsl.inetia.pl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 11:22:09< mordante> Trademark, will also try to look at your proposal in more detail today, not sure whether I manage, still have a lot others to review as well
20130504 11:22:45< Trademark> mordante, no problem, I still need to update the back-end part
20130504 11:22:51< mordante> ok
20130504 11:22:59< Trademark> indeed the best would be to have a talk about it some days
20130504 11:23:06< mordante> ok
20130504 11:23:26< Trademark> mordante, I also forked the wesnoth repo (https://github.com/TrademarkPewPew/wesnoth-old) I will try to begin the front end part of the campaign server
20130504 11:23:41< mordante> then ping me (or leave a message in the log) once you want me re-review your proposal
20130504 11:23:52-!- Octalot [~noct@host86-159-207-143.range86-159.btcentralplus.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 11:24:40< timotei> mordante: You mean we need all the discussions that happen around each pull request?
20130504 11:25:05< Trademark> IMO, the best would be to have a discussion about the back-end, then I could update it (I think to add a database schema if we choose relational database) and then you could give me a feedback on the overall proposal
20130504 11:25:46< mordante> timotei, yes I reread patch discussions when it seems they cause a problem later on
20130504 11:25:59< timotei> I see
20130504 11:26:13< mordante> timotei, especially if somebody else reviewed the patch I sometimes like to see more background information
20130504 11:26:50< mordante> Trademark, discuss it soon or after you did your update?
20130504 11:27:07< timotei> Well, I guess we should talk with the Github guys to see if we can export them if we need :)
20130504 11:28:01< Trademark> mordante, we can quickly discuss it now if you have 10 or 15 minutes
20130504 11:31:23-!- irker144 [~irker@ai0867.net] has quit [Quit: transmission timeout]
20130504 11:31:33< mordante> timotei, well IMO we need them, we wanted to put everything in our own tracker
20130504 11:32:00< mordante> Trademark, ok
20130504 11:32:48-!- EliDupree2 [~eli@dhip-029.rrw.residences.colby.edu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 11:33:02< timotei> I agree that we might find the discussions useful, and have them in our own tracker, but I think this is moot. I mean, we have to decide (for now) between: streamlined pull requests and simple patches.
20130504 11:33:31< timotei> I think for many of us it matters more to have an easy workflow with commenting on the commits we got inside the pull requests
20130504 11:33:53< timotei> Not to talk about the simple way our prospective users might want to contribute to wesnoth.
20130504 11:34:02< timotei> s/want to/can
20130504 11:34:42< timotei> Probably, we can create a simple bot that scans all wesnoth's pull requests, and save the html of the discussion ;)
20130504 11:34:58< timotei> Then we can have some sort of pullrequestsarchive.wesnoth.org, just like with irc logs.
20130504 11:35:01< mordante> timotei, my whole point is we said on the mailing list we wanted to look at the tracker later and now suddenly that is ignored
20130504 11:35:03< timotei> And then nothing is lost :)
20130504 11:35:17< Trademark> mordante, so I discuss with a university teacher specialized in database about the different options we had
20130504 11:35:26< timotei> The problems arised because we didn't even finish the migration completely
20130504 11:35:33< timotei> And people started already to contribute to wesnoth ;)
20130504 11:35:44< mordante> timotei, and we should have discussed it _before_ using it
20130504 11:35:55< Trademark> mordante, even if I was very enthusiastic with the RDF database I don't think it's interesting here
20130504 11:36:13< Trademark> so we would go with a simple relational database with SQLite
20130504 11:36:15< mordante> timotei, IMO this only makes things a larger mess and the transistion already turned into a mess due to the double move
20130504 11:36:53< mordante> Trademark, I haven't looked closer at the RDF database yet and I'm not familiar with it
20130504 11:37:31< Trademark> mordante, it's a graph database, meaning that you have a very flexible schema, you can add document node and relation between them very easily
20130504 11:37:33< mordante> Trademark, what would be the advantage of using a database for the addon server
20130504 11:39:27< Trademark> the fact is that using some flat file hierarchy is : 1) not maintainable, each little schema modification will be hard to do 2) We will lose time to design the index, the hierarchy, the request mechanism,… 3) SQLite is a database that you use into your program so it doesn't request an external service
20130504 11:39:51< Trademark> So it's fast, easy to maintain, and the code will be most readable with less LOC
20130504 11:41:55< Trademark> furthermore, if needed in the future, we'd easily get add-on sort on a specific criteria such as "give me all the add-on of the author XXX"
20130504 11:43:03< timotei> mordante: So, what do you say about the 'pull requests logging' idea? Once per day save all (modified) requests page locally.
20130504 11:43:31< timotei> It can work simply with wget and some simple api fiddling (json - just to see the exact pull requests we have, and last modified date)
20130504 11:43:46< timotei> And those pages include the commit diff too ;)
20130504 11:44:39< mordante> Trademark, we're a kind of reluctant to use extra dependencies that's why I like to have really convincing arguments
20130504 11:44:41< Trademark> I also forgot to say that concurrent request could happen, it would be something more to handle with a home-craft database.
20130504 11:45:27< mordante> Trademark, when coding our own filebased `database' we don't have an external dependency
20130504 11:45:38< Trademark> it's an extra dependency for the server not for the client so it's not a big deal, just a package to install and no service to configure, it's a kind of library
20130504 11:45:47< mordante> Trademark, how does SQLite handle large blobs?
20130504 11:46:19< Trademark> mordante, I'd store the path to the add-on instead of storing it in the database
20130504 11:46:50-!- PL_kolek [~PL_kolek@77-253-195-70.adsl.inetia.pl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 11:46:55< mordante> Trademark, I know only the server needs it, but we in general tend to dislike extra dependencies
20130504 11:47:05< Trademark> mordante, I understand that
20130504 11:47:24< mordante> ok good so the database only stores the meta-information
20130504 11:47:34< Trademark> yes
20130504 11:49:04< Trademark> without a database a summer won't be enough
20130504 11:49:38< Trademark> and for the add-on server a summer is already a short timeframe
20130504 11:49:53< mordante> please make sure it's clear in your proposal the blob is not stored in the database but as files
20130504 11:50:21< Trademark> I'm gonna put a relational database diagram so it will be clearly stated
20130504 11:51:33< mordante> ok
20130504 11:52:17< Trademark> do you still think that a filebased database would be better ?
20130504 11:52:18< mordante> I agree the addon-server might be a lot of work for a summer, but it is always hard for us to estimate how much work something is
20130504 11:52:38< mordante> therefore we like to have mandatory and optional goals
20130504 11:52:39-!- vernon [~quassel@54034205.catv.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 11:53:13< mordante> another question how easy would it be to use MySQL instead of SQLite
20130504 11:54:58< mordante> I'm not convinced a SQL database is better for this task, but I want to think a bit more about it
20130504 11:55:08-!- PL_kolek [~PL_kolek@77-253-195-70.adsl.inetia.pl] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
20130504 11:55:13< mordante> and also study your proposal in more detail
20130504 11:55:25< mordante> that might convince me
20130504 11:55:47< Trademark> I think it would be as easy as with SQLite because MySQL propose some C++ connectors, however I think MySQL is heavier than SQLite
20130504 11:56:28< mordante> true, but we already have MySQL running on the server, not sure what the server administrators like better
20130504 11:56:47< mordante> also not sure how easy it would be to have a generic database interface
20130504 11:57:01< Trademark> it doesn't really matters for me, so it's up to the server administrator
20130504 11:57:12< mordante> (something which would be great if it were in boost...)
20130504 11:57:48< Trademark> there is some sql-related project but not even if in the boost-sandbox yet…
20130504 11:58:22< mordante> yes I recall reading some proposals on their mailing list, some of them really interesting
20130504 11:58:25< Trademark> in my proposal, I propose a generic class AddonDatabase where each method stand up for a request
20130504 11:59:11< mordante> I see
20130504 12:00:20< Trademark> but you know I'm totally sure that this design will evolve because I didn't think about some important things, it's always like that.
20130504 12:00:44< Trademark> I just designed it from my past experiences
20130504 12:01:15< mordante> true, most projects tend to evolve during discussing them, that's why we like to discuss with our students
20130504 12:01:33< Trademark> but I don't have enough experience yet to know if it's the best for the add-on server
20130504 12:02:11< mordante> for now leave the database in the proposal, if you think the RDF is not usable remove it
20130504 12:02:46< mordante> then we can postpone the database discussion until I reviewed the entire application
20130504 12:02:52< Trademark> one other things about the back-end, because I clearly separate the front from the back end, I could start to code using a flat file hierarchy and then, if it's not working, I'd switch to the MySQL database ?
20130504 12:02:57< Trademark> ok
20130504 12:03:41< mordante> exactly the back-end is separate so its implementation details are not too important for now
20130504 12:03:55< mordante> I'd like to decide before you start coding
20130504 12:04:29< Trademark> I'll modify the back-end part this week-end
20130504 12:04:57< mordante> but also like to know how other developers feel about a database dependency and whether they prefer MySQL or SQLite
20130504 12:05:47< Trademark> ok
20130504 12:06:10< mordante> both are at mature projects so I don't feel too uncomfortable to use them
20130504 12:06:37< Trademark> let me know (prefer by email) if you have any news about other developers feeling
20130504 12:07:24< mordante> timotei, if that is a way to get it in our tracker (in semi-realtime) I would be satisfield
20130504 12:07:59-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 12:08:04< mordante> Trademark, are you subscribed to the dev-ml?
20130504 12:08:15< Trademark> mordante, no, I will so
20130504 12:08:44< mordante> Trademark, good then you can follow it there
20130504 12:08:58< Trademark> ok nice
20130504 12:09:29< mordante> more questions for now?
20130504 12:10:19< Trademark> mordante, no thanks ;-) 
20130504 12:10:28< mordante> you're welcome
20130504 12:10:43< mordante> then I'm going to hunt for some food now, bbl
20130504 12:12:27< Trademark> me too, I'm also away a good part of the afternoon so see you later
20130504 12:26:09-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.174.196] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 12:45:32-!- nphro [~nphro@cpc4-broo8-2-0-cust224.14-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 12:47:24-!- DCW [~Thunderbi@cpc1-finc14-2-0-cust12.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 12:48:57< fabi> hi mordante
20130504 12:49:28-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20130504 12:49:42-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.174.196] has left #wesnoth-dev ["Leaving"]
20130504 13:06:59-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 13:11:57< Ivanovic> wesbot: seen Crab_
20130504 13:11:57< wesbot> Ivanovic: The person with the nick Crab_ last spoke 1d 1h ago.  1d 1h ago person left:
20130504 13:22:06-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
20130504 13:22:36-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20130504 13:31:07-!- DCW [~Thunderbi@cpc1-finc14-2-0-cust12.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: DCW]
20130504 13:32:01-!- Necrosporus [~Necrospor@unaffiliated/necrosporus] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 13:47:23-!- loonybot [~loonybot@37.190.123.35] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 13:47:23-!- loonybot [~loonybot@37.190.123.35] has quit [Changing host]
20130504 13:47:23-!- loonybot [~loonybot@wesnoth/bot/loonybot] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 13:48:59-!- exciton [chuck-the-@89.208.169.104] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20130504 13:51:24< mordante> hi fabi 
20130504 13:51:42-!- exciton [chuck-the-@89.208.169.104] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 13:51:44< fabi> Ivanovic: hi
20130504 13:52:02< fabi> Ivanovic: What do you think about a new dev release in the near future?
20130504 14:14:42-!- enchilado is now known as zenchilado
20130504 14:15:15-!- zenchilado is now known as Znchilado
20130504 14:30:14-!- exciton [chuck-the-@89.208.169.104] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20130504 14:30:58-!- exciton [chuck-the-@89.208.169.104] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 14:33:52-!- Gambit [~gambit@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 14:41:49-!- vernon [~quassel@54034205.catv.pool.telekom.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20130504 14:43:47-!- Znchilado is now known as enchilado
20130504 14:50:51-!- darius42 [1f9399c5@gateway/web/freenode/ip.31.147.153.197] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 14:53:44< timotei> Does anyone know by chance what date/time format is this? 2011-01-26T19:14:43Z
20130504 14:54:40-!- bumbadadabum_ [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 14:54:40-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 14:54:40-!- bumbadadabum_ is now known as bumbadadabum
20130504 14:55:34< mordante> timotei, looks like the xml datetime format http://www.w3schools.com/schema/schema_dtypes_date.asp
20130504 15:04:46< Rhonda> https://cfp.linuxwochen.at/de/lww2013/public/events/100 btw.  :D
20130504 15:05:57< mordante> nice Rhonda 
20130504 15:06:34< mordante> Rhonda, will there be a video of the talk?
20130504 15:06:47< Rhonda> mordante: The cause for adding that talk was this one: https://cfp.linuxwochen.at/de/lww2013/public/events/42
20130504 15:07:11< Rhonda> (i.e., "how to install steam on fedora and use wine to play commercial games")
20130504 15:07:25< Rhonda> … which I consider a tiny bit inappropriate for a free software conference.
20130504 15:07:46< Rhonda> So I hijacked the topic in my subtle way. :)
20130504 15:09:30< mordante> I see, weird talk, pretending only Windows games are fun enough to make Linux a gaming platform...
20130504 15:10:41< Rhonda> And I'll quote both of my "I love working on wesnoth because ..." moments in the talk. :D
20130504 15:10:59< Rhonda> The one was while waiting for a train I saw someone playing wesnoth on his mac also waiting for the train.
20130504 15:11:31< Rhonda> And the other being skyping with a former girlfriend, asking her what she's playing, and she responded "you might not know the game ..."  :)
20130504 15:11:49< mordante> :-)
20130504 15:12:17< Rhonda> hmm
20130504 15:12:36< Rhonda> I wonder … the wesnoth android app.  Do we have the code for generating it in our repository?
20130504 15:12:48< Rhonda> If not, why not? :)
20130504 15:13:14< Rhonda> … and what was the name of that free software market that one can use on their android phones/tablets?
20130504 15:13:59< Rhonda> f-droid, found it
20130504 15:14:33< mordante> not sure whether we have it in our repository we have some native client code (IIRC it has something to do with Android)
20130504 15:18:36< zookeeper> someone put me in restraints before i say anything about linux as a gaming platform
20130504 15:19:55< timotei> zookeeper: The s word? :P
20130504 15:20:31< zookeeper> i dunno what s word you mean :p
20130504 15:21:45< Rhonda> Wasn't there some bigger game company that got fed up with all the windows changes over time and now for windows 8 decided to give in and port everything to linux?
20130504 15:21:52< timotei> Steam
20130504 15:21:58< timotei> But IDK if they'll succeed.
20130504 15:22:05< timotei> Even if Gabe is ultra overoptimistic
20130504 15:22:26< timotei> Thought if they will support Ubuntu out of the box... it might work
20130504 15:22:48< Ivanovic> fabi: i have not been thinking too much lately due to drowning in real life work
20130504 15:22:59< Rhonda> timotei: I will explicitly *NOT* cover the s word.  Heck, this is a free software event, why should I talk about a closed source DRM encumbered thing??
20130504 15:23:00< Ivanovic> fabi: but yeah, a dev release next weekend should be possible
20130504 15:25:58< fabi> Ivanovic: This week's weekend or the next week's weekend?
20130504 15:26:15< Rhonda> this weekend is already here
20130504 15:26:18< timotei> xD
20130504 15:26:50< fabi> Ivanovic used to release on Sundays.
20130504 15:27:19< Rhonda> That doesn't make my statement in any way wrong. :)
20130504 15:27:29< Ivanovic> once upon the time when i was not driving long distances late on sunday
20130504 15:27:41< Ivanovic> these days it is more likely that i release on a different day
20130504 15:29:25< Rhonda> I want wesnoth in f-droid.org repository. :)
20130504 15:29:42< zookeeper> i wish some of the free software games were games i'd like to play D:
20130504 15:33:13 * vultraz reccomends Shiver: Vanishing Hitchhiker. A paid game, but really good.
20130504 15:33:48< zookeeper> yeah, paid != free in this context, i suppose
20130504 15:34:04< Rhonda> zookeeper: Not a fan of shooter games, or other strategic games like warzone2100 and globulation2?
20130504 15:34:20< Rhonda> Puzzle games also not interested? Brain teasers?
20130504 15:35:36< zookeeper> Rhonda, sure i enjoy games from all those genres
20130504 15:35:44< zookeeper> well, not puzzles really
20130504 15:36:59< Rhonda> nexuiz, glob2, warzone2100 are great examples
20130504 15:37:34< timotei> Rhonda: glob2 looks a lot like wesnoth
20130504 15:37:40< timotei> At least a bit from the UI point of view :P
20130504 15:37:43< timotei> http://globulation2.org/images/7/71/Alpha23-attack.jpg
20130504 15:37:52< Rhonda> uh?
20130504 15:38:00< Rhonda> glob2 is realtime
20130504 15:38:07< Rhonda> and not hexagon based
20130504 15:38:44< Rhonda> Just because it has a top bar and a right bar with a map in it doesn't it make look like wesnoth. :)
20130504 15:39:03< zookeeper> Rhonda, i'm sure you could already guess that my point is that they're great examples of free software strategy and shooter games, not great examples of strategy and shooter games
20130504 15:40:24< Rhonda> Well, I don't really agree with it for nexuiz and warzone2100, to be honest.  After all, nexuiz was comercially bought, so they definitely did do something right. :)
20130504 15:40:28-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 15:40:36-!- vultraz_laptop [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 15:41:51-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 15:41:55-!- vultraz_laptop [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 15:42:20< Rhonda> Unless you also would want to put wesnoth in the same category of great FOSS examples but not great examples per se.
20130504 15:42:33< zookeeper> btw isn't nexuiz commercial now, and the free version is xonotic?
20130504 15:42:47< Rhonda> xonotic, or nexuiz-classic, yes.
20130504 15:43:02< Rhonda> 'sactly my point. :)
20130504 15:43:17< zookeeper> no, wesnoth is the exception, as it easily holds its own against commercial games. that's why i'm here and not on the channels of those other games :p
20130504 15:43:32 * vultraz is afraid his gaming experience extends as far as P&CHOPA games from BigFish
20130504 15:43:34< vultraz> (Point & Click Hidden Object Puzzle Adventure)
20130504 15:43:59< Rhonda> vultraz: "the room"
20130504 15:44:14< Rhonda> (not foss though)
20130504 15:44:39< Rhonda> But scummvm is great. :)
20130504 15:45:59< zookeeper> Rhonda, may i ask what commercial shooters you've played in the last 10 years for example?
20130504 15:45:59< Rhonda> And Flight of the Amazon Queen, and Beneath a Steel Sky are FOSS games for scummvm.
20130504 15:46:26< Rhonda> farcry, halo
20130504 15:46:43< zookeeper> you think xonotic beats them? O.o
20130504 15:47:04 * vultraz has always wanted to play Bioshock
20130504 15:51:40< zookeeper> i've completely fallen off the bandwagon of modern commercial games in the past ~5 years. portal is probably the latest "must play" game i've had.
20130504 15:53:06< Rhonda> Yes, I like it better.  Maybe I'm stuck with the times I enjoyed in quake 1 and it's myriads of mods, I don't know.
20130504 15:53:42< Rhonda> If it "beats" them is out of my judgement.  I don't see it falling behind though, not noticably at least.
20130504 15:54:33< zookeeper> i enjoyed quake 3 back in the day as much as anyone might, but... no thanks, no multiplayer arena twitch shooters for me anymore
20130504 15:54:55< Rhonda> I don't need "realistic blood'n'gore" in a shooter, that rather turns me off than is something I actually want to have in a game to enjoy.
20130504 15:56:10< Rhonda> It's the challenging part that I appeal to, not photo-realistic stuff which makes people feel like they are really shooting at other people.
20130504 15:57:43-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.174.196] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 15:58:33< zookeeper> considering that i've played countless hours of ace of spades, i don't think i'm in the realism camp either
20130504 16:00:22< vultraz> You still should play any of the Mystery Case Files games after Return to Ravemhearst or Shiver: Vanishing Hitchhiker or Poltergiest
20130504 16:01:02< zookeeper> eww, point & click
20130504 16:02:12< vultraz> hey, don't diss P&C >:(
20130504 16:02:49< timotei> OK mordante 
20130504 16:02:51< timotei> Good news :D
20130504 16:02:52< timotei> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/462510/personal/pull_requests_logger.py
20130504 16:03:11< timotei> A simple python script which downloads the  new & updated pull requests from github
20130504 16:03:21< timotei> The entire page with comments the the code diff
20130504 16:04:15< timotei> We can even create the .patch files from the json we get ;)
20130504 16:04:17< zookeeper> vultraz, i've played several point & click adventures (mostly long time ago), and i've never managed to finish one. either because i got stuck or bored. :|
20130504 16:04:30< vultraz> hmmp
20130504 16:04:49< timotei> So, if this is really wanted, we can put it in a cron job somewhere and we'll not lose ever the pull requests :P
20130504 16:05:20< vultraz> There's a Hint button and/or strategy guide for when you get stuck, usually.
20130504 16:06:50< vultraz> As for being bored...I really can't say. It depends on taste, really
20130504 16:07:20-!- mattsc [~mattsc@d154-20-34-165.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 16:09:29< vultraz> I almost always finish them, though that's probably since I like the story :P
20130504 16:10:31< vultraz> (And the fact that I play the trials before buying any)
20130504 16:27:29< Soliton> mordante: can you point out what statement of mine led you to believe that?
20130504 16:33:49-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.174.196] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20130504 16:37:55< mattsc> zookeeper: you told me to remind you to test the new Liberty - The Raid AI sometime.
20130504 16:40:44-!- bumbadadabum is now known as Cis
20130504 16:40:54-!- Cis is now known as Cis_Scum
20130504 16:44:09-!- vernon [~quassel@54034205.catv.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 16:44:15< zookeeper> mattsc, ah, so i did :P good catch, i had totally forgotten about it already :>
20130504 17:03:06-!- Cis_Scum is now known as bumbadadabum
20130504 17:09:46-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20130504 17:10:08-!- nphro [~nphro@cpc4-broo8-2-0-cust224.14-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 17:10:33-!- nphro [~nphro@cpc4-broo8-2-0-cust224.14-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 17:14:39-!- Soliton [~Soliton@wesnoth/developer/soliton] has quit [Quit: Battle for Wesnoth: http://www.wesnoth.org/]
20130504 17:15:50-!- Soliton [~Soliton@wesnoth/developer/soliton] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 17:28:25-!- perennate [~wizardus@MACGREGOR-FIVE-TWENTY-ONE.MIT.EDU] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 17:29:42-!- Kexoth [~kex@212.158.180.212] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 17:34:13-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 17:39:17< Soliton> nurupo: what's the idea behind the chatlog timestamp patch?
20130504 17:40:48< Soliton> nurupo: especially behind overwriting the timestamp on the receiver side.
20130504 17:45:51-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.174.196] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 17:45:54-!- itomsawyer [~tomsawyer@2001:da8:215:da1b:862b:2bff:fe83:8a57] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 17:46:08-!- Kexoth [~kex@212.158.180.212] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 17:46:54< darius42> where can i find the code for debug mode? More specifically, where can i edit debug mode options?
20130504 17:47:05< nurupo> Soliton: the idea was just to display local timestamps, time(NULL), in the chatlog, like they are displayed in the regular chat messages. sending timestamp over the network is a side-effect that comes after storing timestamp in the config, which i do in order to retrieve timestamps when populating chatlog
20130504 17:49:00< Soliton> if that was the idea you wouldn't have to put timestamps into the config sent over the network.
20130504 17:49:19< nurupo> i use `config` to set time in the `chat_msg` instance, which is then used in populating the chatlog. if you look into `chat_msg` constructor, it uses config for all of it's variables
20130504 17:49:59< nurupo> *its
20130504 17:52:28< nurupo> Soliton: how would you set time in `chat_msg` without using config? it sounds like a better idea, i would change my patch right away
20130504 17:52:45< Soliton> right, so there are two ways we can go. 1) add local timestamps on receive which we can do in the chat_msg constructor, no need to modify any config. 2) record the time the message was sent and save it in the replay etc.
20130504 17:54:23< Soliton> i think way 2 is actually interesting.
20130504 17:54:25< nurupo> if i go with the first one, would timestamps work in the reply-file?
20130504 17:54:39< Soliton> no.
20130504 17:54:45< nurupo> i mean, when watching replay of a game
20130504 17:54:47< nurupo> oh
20130504 17:55:02< Soliton> well, depends what you mean with "work".
20130504 17:55:31< nurupo> yeah, it will show the current time when viewing the replay
20130504 17:55:45-!- Kexoth [~kex@89.205.70.185] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 17:55:53< nurupo> which is kind of usless :)
20130504 17:56:56< nurupo> so, what do you mean by "save in the replay"?
20130504 17:58:02-!- itomsawyer [~tomsawyer@2001:da8:215:da1b:862b:2bff:fe83:8a57] has quit [Quit: Leaving.]
20130504 17:58:07< Soliton> what you implemented in send_chat_message().
20130504 17:58:29< Soliton> without the overwriting on receiving part.
20130504 17:59:12-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.174.196] has quit [Quit: Later]
20130504 18:00:19< nurupo> but if i don't overwrite it, the received timestamp will be used, no?
20130504 18:00:48< Soliton> that's the point, yes.
20130504 18:01:09< nurupo> i already tried that a few weeks ago
20130504 18:01:34< Soliton> the time you receive is about as meaningful as the time you display unless you're one of the players or observed the whole time.
20130504 18:01:35< nurupo> if the sender's system time is messed up, you would get some strange timestamps
20130504 18:01:55< Soliton> naturally.
20130504 18:02:55< nurupo> like if players sent time every minute and one of them instead of changing timezone just changet his/her time to -0700 you would see 20:01, 20:02, 20:03, 13:04, 20:05
20130504 18:03:18< nurupo> *changed
20130504 18:03:31< Soliton> yes, it's what people do all the time...
20130504 18:04:07< nurupo> that's the con. pos is that when viewing the replay, you see the actual time messages were sent, not the current time
20130504 18:04:30< nurupo> also, if you okay vs. someone that doesn't send timestamps, you simply won't see any
20130504 18:05:01< Soliton> we can fallback to received time then.
20130504 18:05:44< nurupo> oh, that also would fix the issue when you have a dialog opened for a while why players sent messages, then you exit the dialog and all received messages have the sime timestamp - of when you closed the dialog
20130504 18:06:18< Soliton> right, that's what i meant with meaningfulness of received timestamps.
20130504 18:06:39< nurupo> idk, i did i few weeks ago and thought that players might have system time set up wrong, so i decided to use local time instead
20130504 18:07:36< Soliton> i would actually not expect a lot of systems with completely bogus time settings.
20130504 18:08:36-!- mattsc [~mattsc@d154-20-34-165.bchsia.telus.net] has quit [Quit: bye]
20130504 18:09:41< Soliton> nurupo: so if you just remove the const_cast hack and handle time not being in the config your patch should be good.
20130504 18:09:46< nurupo> i mean, it works as long as users have timezon set up right, instead or adding/subtracting hours for a wrong timezone
20130504 18:09:52< nurupo> okay
20130504 18:10:22< nurupo> Soliton: any idea how do i undo commit to my fork in git? :)
20130504 18:10:30< nurupo> not used to git =\
20130504 18:10:53< Soliton> force push a rewritten commit.
20130504 18:11:01< nurupo> anyway, will gust google it
20130504 18:11:23< _8680_> nurupo: You could ask in #git.
20130504 18:11:30< Soliton> use --amend to rewrite it.
20130504 18:11:55< nurupo> yeah, but then i need to undo it in my local repository, to rewrite the remote one
20130504 18:13:01< Soliton> git reset, but amending your commit should be enough in this case.
20130504 18:13:28< Soliton> just change it to the way you want and git commit --amend.
20130504 18:16:41-!- stikonas [~gentoo@128.232.240.234] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 18:16:41-!- stikonas [~gentoo@128.232.240.234] has quit [Changing host]
20130504 18:16:41-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 18:25:32-!- lipkab [~lipk@apn-94-44-73-249.vodafone.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 18:30:56-!- prkc [~negusnyul@4E5C105D.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 18:31:58< mordante> Soliton, which part?
20130504 18:35:42< Soliton> mordante: i'm refering to your only statement to me: "Soliton, I see you don't care about patch history and therefore nobody should care?"
20130504 18:36:18< nurupo> Soliton: btw, do you realize that "we can fallback to received time then." requires to keeping the `const_cast` on config when receiving messages, only now in case if there is no "time" was sent?
20130504 18:36:21-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: bumbadadabum]
20130504 18:36:43-!- Blesso_ [5d880dca@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.136.13.202] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 18:36:43< nurupo> *requires keeping
20130504 18:37:07< nurupo> just making sure :)
20130504 18:37:23-!- Octalot [~noct@host86-159-207-143.range86-159.btcentralplus.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 18:37:29< Soliton> no, the fallback should be in the chat_log constructor.
20130504 18:38:29< nurupo> but then in replay all non-fallback times will be of the actual game, but fallback ones on the time of watching the replay
20130504 18:39:52< Soliton> yes. an arbitrary time either way. we can also fallback to no time.
20130504 18:40:12< nurupo> received timestamps are already in the config, sent too, but not the fallback
20130504 18:41:05< nurupo> by your logic i might as well just remove all timestamps from the game -_-
20130504 18:41:44< Soliton> no idea what you're talking about now.
20130504 18:42:05< Soliton> you need a fallback in the chat_log constructor one way or another.
20130504 18:42:43-!- thunderstruck [~thunderst@cpc5-sgyl29-2-0-cust174.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 18:43:48< Soliton> if we go with some arbitrary time it should probably be distinguishable from actual timestamps in the GUI.
20130504 18:44:20< nurupo> Soliton: do you actualy mean the constructor, or the function that populates chatlog?
20130504 18:44:22< Soliton> or it might be more confusing than no timestamp.
20130504 18:45:13< Soliton> nurupo: i meant chat_msg constructor.
20130504 18:45:43< nurupo> i see
20130504 18:46:06< nurupo> because `chat_log` constructod didn't make any sense :)
20130504 18:49:51< nurupo> Soliton: i putting the fallback in two places: the `chat_msg` constructor, this is for chatlog, and also when displaying a regular, received, chat message
20130504 18:50:13< nurupo> because if i don't do si, it won't have any timestamp
20130504 18:52:59< Soliton> what's a regular received chat message?
20130504 18:56:40-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 19:03:13< nurupo> Soliton: by "a regular received chat message" i mean the chat message that appears on the left of the screen when someone sends it. code in `chat_msg` will add a timestamp in the chatlog only, the chat messages that appear on the left side of the screen would be missing it
20130504 19:03:35-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 19:10:10< Soliton> nurupo: do you mean game_display::add_chat_message()?
20130504 19:14:19-!- flix [~flix@178.77.129.78] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 19:19:33-!- irker827 [~irker@ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 19:19:33< irker827> Wesnoth: mattsc :master * 1dab481 / changelog: Update changelog with Micro AI additions http://git.io/T4-GNg
20130504 19:22:12< nurupo> Soliton: yes. anyway, i already made the patch and figuring out the git stuff
20130504 19:31:24-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-158-45-47.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 19:33:37< perennate> mordante: the http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SoC_Ideas_Addon_Server page implied that Python was the preferred language for the addon server due to integration with the various tools, if there is concern about maintainability then C++ is fine too
20130504 19:33:58< perennate> mordante: also, what language is the web interface (that lists the addons) currently in?
20130504 19:35:28< perennate> mordante: as for the database, SQLite I think is not as efficient for concurrent access than MySQL, and some degree of concurrent access may be desired if there are multiple applications interacting with the addon database, e.g., the addon server itself and something that lists addons
20130504 19:39:05< perennate> mordante: overall MySQL is more scalable than SQLite
20130504 19:45:46< perennate> mordante: as for why have web interface at all, I modified proposal a bit so mostly it's mostly just replicating features like it currently does (with the listing the addons and making it so that users can download from web browser); for the administration features (have special access to some users to delete any addon and such): it'd make it more accessible so you can administrate it from anywhere even if you aren't able to run 
20130504 19:48:09< Soliton> you were cut off after "able to run".
20130504 19:49:11< perennate> oh :P
20130504 19:49:17< perennate> [...] so you can administrate it from anywhere even if you aren't able to run the wesnoth client, I don't see a use case where administrating through the client would be particularly useful; for the search features: the client should support these actually
20130504 19:50:29< nurupo> Soliton: updated https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/pull/4
20130504 19:51:31< Trademark> perennate, SQLite respects the ACID properties ;-) and there are not so much add-ons
20130504 19:52:07< Soliton> perennate: addons.wesnoth.org is produced by a python script. (data/tools/wesnoth_addon_manager)
20130504 19:52:39< perennate> Trademark, I thought SQLite was less efficient though when you have many concurrent accesses; but yeah there won't be so many, still, there already is a MySQL server
20130504 19:52:52< Trademark> perennate, true !
20130504 19:54:22< perennate> Soliton: so the Python script generates a static file?
20130504 19:55:34-!- Blueblaze [~Blueblaze@adsl-99-158-45-47.dsl.hstntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Blueblaze]
20130504 19:56:05-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20130504 19:56:36< Trademark> perennate, don't you think that providing a new web-interface is out of scope for this summer project ? 
20130504 19:56:57-!- vernon [~quassel@54034205.catv.pool.telekom.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20130504 19:57:51< perennate> Trademark, I wanted to add the administration features to the web-interface only because I didn't see it desirable to have administration of add-ons in the wesnoth client
20130504 19:58:10-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 19:58:33< perennate> I was thinking, like, make it easier to give specific forum users permission to do things such as delete any add-on, update passphrases, etc
20130504 20:02:08< Trademark> I don't say this because I think it's a bad idea, if all Wesnoth was centralized, automatic,... it would be great. However your description is mainly from a client point of view, which is, I guess, a little out of scope for a server
20130504 20:04:00< perennate> well, updating the server implies some updates to the client
20130504 20:04:22< perennate> how is dependencies handled right now for example?
20130504 20:06:12< perennate> anyway see http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SoC_Ideas_Addon_Server, it includes suggested improvements on both server and client side
20130504 20:06:24< perennate> improving the addon server doesn't just mean the server side of things, improving it also requires changes in the client
20130504 20:06:54< perennate> "Both the server side and the  client side need to be improved. "
20130504 20:11:11< Trademark> how did you find this link ?
20130504 20:11:37< Trademark> I didn't see any link to it from the SOC2013 page
20130504 20:11:55-!- fabi [~fabi@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20130504 20:12:09< perennate> I found it on DuckDuckGo, it was the most comprehensive page I could find
20130504 20:12:15< perennate> yeah some of the links look like they're lost
20130504 20:12:47< Trademark> yep ;-)
20130504 20:18:19< Soliton> perennate: several, but yes.
20130504 20:20:24< perennate> is there a search function on the wiki?
20130504 20:20:29< perennate> nvm
20130504 20:20:52< perennate> yeah the search function on the wiki would be easier than search function to find the pages
20130504 20:21:10< perennate> the link above is the first one returned for "addon"
20130504 20:21:48< perennate> the search function is a bit out of the way though IMO
20130504 20:24:34-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has quit [Quit: bumbadadabum]
20130504 20:26:55-!- Crab_ [~chernyi@wesnoth/developer/crab] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 20:28:41-!- vernon [~quassel@BC064A81.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 20:34:43-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20130504 20:34:53-!- vultraz_laptop [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20130504 20:46:59-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 20:48:45-!- vultraz_laptop [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 20:52:56-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20130504 20:57:47< Trademark> perennate, however, it seems weird that this page (http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SoC_Ideas_Addon_Server) hasn't been written by mordante, because he's the one who propose this project.
20130504 20:58:24-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.174.196] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 20:58:57< perennate> Trademark: the project was there in previous years too
20130504 20:59:09< perennate> Soliton: is there supposed to be an exclamation mark next to friends on the friends list?
20130504 21:00:09-!- Blesso_ [5d880dca@gateway/web/freenode/ip.93.136.13.202] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
20130504 21:04:14< perennate> Soliton: well anyway I updated the pull request
20130504 21:11:18-!- vernon [~quassel@BC064A81.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
20130504 21:14:34-!- TheMonster [~TheMonste@41.69.174.196] has quit [Quit: Later]
20130504 21:15:57-!- vernon [~quassel@4E5C5155.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 21:19:30-!- lipkab [~lipk@apn-94-44-73-249.vodafone.hu] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20130504 21:31:58< flix> Crab_: Hello! I'm back from the desert :)! Anyone thought of solve this *recruiting a good mix in a combat-point of view so that the enemy cannot counter easily*-problem with tools from Game Theory? Are you familiar with Game Theory? I think this problem could be  *solved* by finding a "mixed strategy nash equilibrium".
20130504 21:32:47< Crab_> flix: hello! yes, you are right, this problem can be solved in this way.
20130504 21:33:07< Crab_> flix: and it'll naturally bring some diversity into the army, as well
20130504 21:34:39< flix> Crab_: Somebody tried to actually implement this? Otherwise I would like to try it over the next days...
20130504 21:43:22-!- mattsc [~mattsc@d154-20-34-165.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 21:47:39< mattsc> flix: I don't think anybody has done that (although I am not familiar with it so I might not recognize it if it hit me in the head)
20130504 21:48:56< mattsc> The most sophisticated recruiter out there atm is probably Alarantalara's generic recruit engine, but that's been developed empirically.  Would be interested to pitch that one against yours in the end.
20130504 21:49:42< mattsc> Crab_: I assigned a couple of the AI patches to you  :)
20130504 21:50:12< Crab_> flix: no, I have though about it a long time ago, but I hasn't actually implemented code to do it.
20130504 21:50:22< Crab_> mattsc: thanks
20130504 21:53:28-!- vultraz_laptop [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20130504 21:53:44-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
20130504 21:56:09< flix> Crab_, mattsc: okay, I want to try it! I notify you if I can make progress...
20130504 21:59:03< flix> mattsc: I think one could even implement it without knowing Game Theory at all. (And it's not so hard to understand). I will check out Alarantalara's generic recruit engine and try to run my stuff against it as soon as I am a worthy challenger...
20130504 22:06:50< Soliton> as far as i understand it game theory is not going to help the biggest problem which is evaluating a position.
20130504 22:09:47< flix> Soliton: hey! You're right that Game Theory has its limits! But I only concern about one aspect of the recruiting phase (*recruiting a good mix in a combat-point of view so that the enemy cannot counter easily*) and this have nothing to do with positions. And I think Game Theory could be useful there...
20130504 22:11:24< Soliton> so how do you figure out what a "good mix in a combat-point of view" is?
20130504 22:17:11-!- flix [~flix@178.77.129.78] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 22:18:58-!- flix [~flix@178.77.129.78] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 22:19:35-!- irker827 [~irker@ai0867.net] has quit [Quit: transmission timeout]
20130504 22:23:29< flix> Soliton: Basically I will assign each unit combination a effectivity (Like unit A is 10 effective against Unit B). Then after I recruted some Units one could say *now our mix is 20 effective against Unit X and 30 effective against Unit Y* where X and Y are enemies units. Then I want to try to recruit such a mix so this effective scores will be the same, so the enemy can not counter easily.
20130504 22:24:06< flix> Soliton: This can (but need not) be modeled with Game Theory.
20130504 22:25:34< Soliton> ok, i see you already have an evaluation function. all good then.
20130504 22:25:51-!- viku [uid11086@gateway/web/irccloud.com/x-ohdkzeiyitokumzz] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20130504 22:25:51-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 22:27:56-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 22:27:58< Soliton> my point was just that this evaluation function (unit a is X effective against b) is the biggest issue.
20130504 22:29:49< flix> Soliton: I wanted to use int recruitment_phase::compare_unit_types() in ca.cpp for it. (I didn't use it yet but it seems to give me exactly what I need)
20130504 22:31:24-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 22:32:20< Soliton> that sounds like a good start, yes.
20130504 22:36:13< mordante> perennate, ah ok, that page is a bit aged, wasn't aware of its existence the 2013 page suggests boost asio... hence implying C++
20130504 22:36:38-!- thunderstruck [~thunderst@cpc5-sgyl29-2-0-cust174.sgyl.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20130504 22:37:05< mordante> perennate, not sure what the current webinterface is written in nor where it is
20130504 22:37:45< perennate> mordante, Soliton said the web interface is generated by a Python script; I think it's a static page
20130504 22:38:28< perennate> well, I think C++ is possible too
20130504 22:41:16< mordante> ok
20130504 22:41:25< mordante> perennate, do you have more questions?
20130504 22:41:51< perennate> what about the administration features; would you want that implemented within the game client?
20130504 22:42:16< perennate> I thought it might be awkward to have to open the client for administration of addons; like could have actions such as changing passphrase/deleting addons
20130504 22:42:27< mordante> perennate, administration of our administrators or the addon maintainer?
20130504 22:42:35< perennate> mordante, administrators probably
20130504 22:42:37-!- Crab_ [~chernyi@wesnoth/developer/crab] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20130504 22:43:10< perennate> mordante, I mean it anyway it looks like the feature wouldn't be needed much
20130504 22:43:41< mordante> perennate, I'm not sure how much administration is done. They will delete inane/not appropriate content and probably password recovery
20130504 22:44:12-!- mattsc [~mattsc@d154-20-34-165.bchsia.telus.net] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20130504 22:44:20< mordante> afaik it is now done from the command-line, I don't see a need to improve that
20130504 22:44:24< perennate> ok
20130504 22:44:37-!- mattsc [~mattsc@d154-20-34-165.bchsia.telus.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 22:45:28< perennate> is there any dependency managing currently?
20130504 22:45:36< perennate> or automatic updates for addons?
20130504 22:45:45< mordante> no and no
20130504 22:46:04< perennate> ok, so the dependency PML is just for reference/manual usage then?
20130504 22:46:29< mordante> well is intended to be implemented
20130504 22:46:39< perennate> alright
20130504 22:46:43< mordante> but afaik nobody every finished that
20130504 22:46:54-!- mordante_ [~mordante@roadie.xs4all.nl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 22:46:54-!- mordante_ [~mordante@roadie.xs4all.nl] has quit [Changing host]
20130504 22:46:54-!- mordante_ [~mordante@wesnoth/developer/mordante] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 22:46:54-!- mordante_ [~mordante@wesnoth/developer/mordante] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20130504 22:50:38< mordante> I'm off night
20130504 22:50:52< perennate> good night
20130504 22:50:57-!- mordante [~mordante@wesnoth/developer/mordante] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20130504 22:52:53-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20130504 22:56:40-!- perennate [~wizardus@MACGREGOR-FIVE-TWENTY-ONE.MIT.EDU] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20130504 23:00:42< Soliton> addon dependencies are resolved at install time.
20130504 23:01:27-!- mtawfeek88 [~User@197.132.37.59] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 23:02:11-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 23:05:25-!- nphro_ [~nphro@cpc4-broo8-2-0-cust224.14-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 23:05:50-!- prkc [~negusnyul@4E5C105D.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20130504 23:08:14-!- nphro [~nphro@cpc4-broo8-2-0-cust224.14-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20130504 23:08:19-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20130504 23:08:35-!- vernon [~quassel@4E5C5155.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20130504 23:08:58-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 23:11:10-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 23:14:08-!- Maccer [~Ted@199.115.228.135] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 23:20:16-!- balden [balden@c-68-60-120-111.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 23:23:10-!- _8680a [~8680@m910536d0.tmodns.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130504 23:23:53-!- Kexoth [~kex@89.205.70.185] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 23:25:08< Soliton> can anyone assign ctrl+space to end turn in preferences?
20130504 23:34:11< AI0867> timotei: iso8601
20130504 23:40:39-!- balden [balden@c-68-60-120-111.hsd1.mi.comcast.net] has quit []
20130504 23:45:51-!- _8680a [~8680@m910536d0.tmodns.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20130504 23:47:43-!- timotei [~timotei@wesnoth/developer/timotei] has quit [Quit: SIGKILL]
20130504 23:55:14-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
--- Log closed Sun May 05 00:00:27 2013