--- Log opened Tue Jun 04 00:00:15 2013
20130604 00:10:19< Gambit> fabi: The problem with an add-on rating system is the same problem with a persistent stats/score system in multiplayer.
20130604 00:10:24< Gambit> Competition fosters hostility.
20130604 00:10:52< bumbadadabum> Gambit: Didn't you see dugi's OP
20130604 00:10:59< bumbadadabum> the hostility is already present
20130604 00:11:12< bumbadadabum> "HE STOLE MUH FIRST PLACE"
20130604 00:12:15< Gambit> Fortunately it isn't widespread.
20130604 00:12:40< Gambit> It's limited to someone who was already prone to hostility towards other add-on authors.
20130604 00:13:33< bumbadadabum> Gambit: Hostility towards anyone
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20130604 02:06:13< flix> Crab_: In the ai-test-suite I'd like to substitute Postgres with sqlite. It would make the installation much easier. Is that okay with you?
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20130604 04:58:40< irker887> wesnoth: JaMiT wesnoth-old:master bd6a85 / changelog src/scripting/lua.cpp: Make the x1,y1,x2,y2 variables within Lua match those in WML events. http://git.io/uZdIyg
20130604 04:58:42< irker887> wesnoth: JaMiT wesnoth-old:master 59c597 / CMakeLists.txt INSTALL SConstruct changelog src/text.cpp: Merge branch 'master' of github.com:wesnoth/wesnoth-old http://git.io/slV_Pg
20130604 05:00:40< jamit> Uh-oh. What is that second commit?
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20130604 05:01:53< _8680_> jamit: A merge commit. They are generated when you merge one branch into another (e.g., a topic branch into master). To avoid them, use rebase instead.
20130604 05:03:02< jamit> 'git pull' then 'git rebase'?
20130604 05:03:48< shadowm> git pull --rebase
20130604 05:03:58< shadowm> Assuming you work directly on master in the first place, anyway.
20130604 05:04:54< jamit> OK, I'll try that next time.
20130604 05:05:41< jamit> I'm sure I'll find out what's so great about git eventually, but so far it's just making things more complicated for me.
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20130604 07:16:24< shadowm> I am appalled that the gender attribute isn't a primary field for proxy units, or at least it isn't listed in http://wiki.wesnoth.org/LuaWML:Units .
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20130604 09:01:13< LordBob_> hello people
20130604 09:02:42< shadowm> Hi.
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20130604 10:35:26< Crab_> flix: definitely. I used postgresql just because I was convenient for me at that time.
20130604 10:41:00< vultraz> LordBob_: around?
20130604 10:41:15< LordBob_> yup
20130604 10:42:02< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: question: copper images are supposed to be for menus?
20130604 10:43:23< LordBob_> that's how we used them so far. copper for menus because they need to stand out less amidst the wooden panels; gold for buttons and such 
20130604 10:43:41< vultraz_laptop> ok
20130604 10:44:27< vultraz_laptop> if that is so, how come we have copper variations of the buttons in buttons/button_normal?
20130604 10:44:43< vultraz_laptop> since we have a folder called buttons/menu_buttons
20130604 10:45:06< vultraz_laptop> which I assume should only contain copper variations
20130604 10:46:05< LordBob_> When I started doing those buttons, I wasn't sure which variants were going to be used. since it's not much extra work, I created the extra images
20130604 10:46:36< vultraz_laptop> oh, so, we have more images than needed?
20130604 10:48:09< LordBob_> We do. Additionnally, you may want to make sure that images in buttons/menu_buttons are really used for menus only. I initially dropped them in this folder because we were doing menus, but maybe they're used somewhere else as well
20130604 10:48:22< vultraz_laptop> alright
20130604 10:48:31< vultraz_laptop> so, I guess I'll do cleanup.
20130604 10:48:40< LordBob_> That would be very welcome
20130604 10:48:45< vultraz_laptop> Should copper variations be removed from button_normal?
20130604 10:49:18< LordBob_> Yes. I think you can safely put them in the extra resources folder for the time being
20130604 10:49:29< vultraz_laptop> alright, will do
20130604 10:49:43< vultraz_laptop> I was using the copper images for the regular buttons, I need to fix that
20130604 10:50:50< LordBob_> What's also worth checking is if any non-menu buttons do use artwork from buttons/menu_buttons, and if so rewire them to artwork from buttons/button_normal
20130604 10:51:37< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: additionally, should there be no non-copper variations in menu_buttons? (really should renamed that to button_menu)
20130604 10:52:42< LordBob_> normally, there shouldn't. Exceptions may exist in the manner of what I described above.
20130604 10:53:24< vultraz_laptop> alright, so I'll remove copper from button_normal, and non copper from menu_buttons
20130604 10:53:56< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: on to another issue: it turns out we need transparent versions of the normal button. the [message] dialog uses it.
20130604 10:54:36< LordBob_> Hmm...Isn't this something that could be done with the ImagePath functions ? 
20130604 10:54:41< vultraz_laptop> I cannot use ~O(), unfortunately, since the paths aren't specific
20130604 10:54:57< LordBob_> Ah.
20130604 10:55:05< LordBob_> Well.
20130604 10:55:29< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: another issue: bumba came across this while using the editor a few days ago, and it screwed up his diaplay: 20130531 19:10:27 error display: could not open image 'themes/editor/classic/sidebar_tools-small.png'
20130604 10:56:08< shadowm> vultraz_laptop: You actually can use ~O() if you adapt the macro a bit.
20130604 10:56:18< vultraz_laptop> shadowm: how so?
20130604 10:56:29< shadowm> Make the image path a parameter for the macro.
20130604 10:56:43 * vultraz_laptop kicks himself
20130604 10:56:53< vultraz_laptop> fucking DUH >_.
20130604 10:56:56< shadowm> *path function
20130604 10:57:20< shadowm> You are now demoted back to Captain Obvious. Make sure you don't lose that rank too.
20130604 10:57:37< vultraz_laptop> better than Admiral Obvious, I guess...
20130604 10:57:47< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: ok, guess we may not need the transparent images
20130604 10:57:50< vultraz_laptop> :P
20130604 10:57:57< LordBob_> Keep me informed ^^
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20130604 11:04:37< LordBob_> vultraz_laptop: as for the editor display thing, it might be that fabi has not yet updated the low-res theme (the image in the error message was previously used in the 800*480 display, and was renamed in the latest backgrounds commit)
20130604 11:05:09< vultraz_laptop> bumba was using 1366x713
20130604 11:05:15< vultraz_laptop> that doesn't seem low-res :/
20130604 11:05:21< LordBob_> Ah-ah
20130604 11:07:15< LordBob_> I think it's still the same problem: with a screen height lower than 768 pixels, the display might default to an extended 800*480
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20130604 11:07:44< LordBob_> fabi would know for sure
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20130604 11:16:14< irker887> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth-old:master 28afae / / (120 files in 3 dirs): Moved spare button images to attic http://git.io/VDe_jQ
20130604 11:19:48< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: what is the correct opacity for transparent buttons?
20130604 11:20:04< LordBob_> Errrrrr... good question
20130604 11:20:34< vultraz_laptop> should I just go for 50%?
20130604 11:20:46< shadowm> Can't you check the old files?
20130604 11:21:02< shadowm> Or play with the opacity until it looks good?
20130604 11:22:11< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: what transparency is the transparent dialog bg you made?
20130604 11:22:19< vultraz_laptop> the buttons should probably the same
20130604 11:25:38< LordBob_> vultraz_laptop: I used 65%
20130604 11:26:05< vultraz_laptop> alright
20130604 11:26:50< shadowm> I've never really understood why the buttons themselves have to be transparent.
20130604 11:27:20< LordBob_> note that this is kind of a default value ; the dialogs folder holds a dozen different transparent backgrounds 
20130604 11:27:24< shadowm> It seems such a baffling violation of design principles.
20130604 11:27:39< LordBob_> shadowm: me neither. I couldn't even say where they're used
20130604 11:28:04< shadowm> In [message] dialogs (conversations between characters) where the user is offered a list of choices.
20130604 11:28:19< shadowm> First mainline example I can think of is the choice Konrad is given at the end of Bay of Pearls.
20130604 11:28:37< vultraz_laptop> but you can double click the [options]
20130604 11:28:47< shadowm> Dialogs that contain too much text also get a button.
20130604 11:29:01< shadowm> For example, the "Manual" hex in the test scenario.
20130604 11:29:12< vultraz_laptop> I have never found use for that button
20130604 11:29:31< shadowm> Also dialogs that have an input box for test.
20130604 11:29:40< irker887> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth-old:master 5211a9 / data/gui/default/widget/button_default.cfg: Used regular as opposed to copper button variation images for default button http://git.io/ZmLcCA
20130604 11:29:43< irker887> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth-old:master ea5677 / data/gui/default/widget/ (button_25x25.cfg button_default.cfg): Use opacity IPF for transparent button images. Value set to 65% http://git.io/QK3DYQ
20130604 11:29:44< shadowm> The "parrot" hex in the test scenario would be an example of the last case.
20130604 11:30:17< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: BTW, re the theme problem, the image is missing entirely...maybe you forgot to commit it?
20130604 11:31:37< LordBob_> shadowm: wow. I must have seen them, then. I just had not paid attention to opacity
20130604 11:31:50< shadowm> vultraz: You did something horribly wrong.
20130604 11:31:52< LordBob_> vultraz: nope. Renamed
20130604 11:32:10< shadowm> vultraz: Try going to the Load Game dialog.
20130604 11:32:41< vultraz_laptop> ugh, problem with using xcode is you have to rebuild when modifying data >_>
20130604 11:33:06< shadowm> And Preferences aborts the game entirely.
20130604 11:33:13< vultraz_laptop> ...fucking FUCK
20130604 11:33:31< shadowm> ... Okay.
20130604 11:33:57 * vultraz_laptop builds to see what the problem is
20130604 11:34:00< LordBob_> vultraz_laptop: this might be one of those cases where standard buttons were using artwork located in menu_buttons
20130604 11:34:16< shadowm> Yeah, everything GUI1 is throwing an exception that ends up winding up the stack to main().
20130604 11:34:37< vultraz_laptop> shadowm: and what is the original traceback 
20130604 11:35:05< shadowm> Probably nothing that's of much use to you.
20130604 11:35:07< shadowm> Here's something that might help, though:
20130604 11:35:10< shadowm> 20130604 05:34:36 error display: could not open image 'buttons/button_normal/button_copper_H22.png'
20130604 11:35:12< shadowm> 20130604 05:34:36 error display: could not open image 'buttons/button_normal/button_copper_H22-pressed.png'
20130604 11:35:15< shadowm> 20130604 05:34:36 error display: could not open image 'buttons/button_normal/button_copper_H22-active.png'
20130604 11:35:22< vultraz_laptop> oh...wtf I thought I got rid of that
20130604 11:35:36 * vultraz_laptop greps
20130604 11:37:00< vultraz_laptop> ah, there we go
20130604 11:38:10< vultraz_laptop> ok we have a slight problem
20130604 11:38:24< vultraz_laptop> src/widgets/button.cpp:			button_image_name_ = "buttons/button_normal/button_copper_H22";
20130604 11:38:34< vultraz_laptop> GUI1 buttons are used both in themes and dialogs
20130604 11:38:47< vultraz_laptop> copper is supposed to be used only for menu buttons...
20130604 11:38:56< vultraz_laptop> I guess I need a new case for that button :/
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20130604 11:39:16< vultraz_laptop> else all gui1 buttons will use the wrong image
20130604 11:39:25 * shadowm resets to a previous commit in order to continue his playtesting.
20130604 11:39:39< vultraz_laptop> in some places and the right ones in others
20130604 11:39:41< vultraz_laptop> god damn this
20130604 11:39:50< vultraz_laptop> ok
20130604 11:39:52< vultraz_laptop> ok ok
20130604 11:39:55< vultraz_laptop> lemme see
20130604 11:41:00< vultraz_laptop> IJFHJKH
20130604 11:41:36< vultraz_laptop> TYPE_PRESS is assigned to copper ATM
20130604 11:41:39< vultraz_laptop> it shouldn't be
20130604 11:42:12< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: can I just merge menu_buttons and buttons_normal?
20130604 11:43:30< LordBob_> On principle, you can. But...Won't this break even more things ?
20130604 11:43:30< vultraz_laptop> theoretically
20130604 11:43:35< vultraz_laptop> I dunno
20130604 11:43:40< vultraz_laptop> Im trying to find a solution to this
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20130604 11:45:49< LordBob_> But yeah. Design-wise, there isn't a reason to keep them in separate directories. It was done on a whim in the first place.
20130604 11:50:14< irker887> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth-old:master 226578 / src/widgets/button.cpp: Made default imagepath for GUI1 button non-copper http://git.io/uauK6Q
20130604 11:50:17< irker887> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth-old:master e551ca / src/storyscreen/controller.cpp: Made next/prev storyscreen buttons use non-copper images http://git.io/AWF0JA
20130604 11:50:20< irker887> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth-old:master fe5df5 / src/dialogs.cpp: Made unit preview pane use non-copper regular image as opposed to menu-button im http://git.io/2OHBSA
20130604 11:51:54< vultraz_laptop> hm..
20130604 11:52:06< vultraz_laptop> all the menu buttons are shorter than the regular buttons
20130604 11:52:53< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: what's the point of having menu button small H18 AND H20?
20130604 11:53:31< vultraz_laptop> I propose moving H20 to attic, and making the standard for menu buttons H18
20130604 11:53:57< vultraz_laptop> and standard for regular buttons H22
20130604 11:54:41< LordBob_> Hmmm...That's not to be done lightly. We're using the smaller variant for low-res displays, where screen height is instrumental, and the taller one for 1024*768 and beyond
20130604 11:55:46< LordBob_> Switchng it will certainly change things in the editor displays and require further theme adjustments
20130604 11:55:52< vultraz_laptop> hm...
20130604 11:56:11< LordBob_> And probably an update of the panels artwork as well
20130604 11:56:22< vultraz_laptop> I'll keep it as is, then
20130604 11:56:52< LordBob_> In truth, what you suggest is the best course of action since it reduces the amount of artwork. 
20130604 11:58:44< LordBob_> It does involve some extra work, but I think we should do it when we have time
20130604 12:02:08< vultraz_laptop> lemme do a test and see what happens if I point all H20 images to H18
20130604 12:04:15< shadowm> Because they are cheap and have swords.
20130604 12:04:44< shadowm> Ignore that.
20130604 12:09:55< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: I see no real difference
20130604 12:11:17< LordBob_> Hmm...Check the alignment of menu buttons with the village/unit status boxes, and the minimap
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20130604 12:12:39< LordBob_> The part where extra work would be involved, in fact, is if we decide to use a single top bar for high and low res (which is just logical if we use a single kind of menus)
20130604 12:13:40< vultraz_laptop> there's a barely noticeable gap right under the menu buttons, now
20130604 12:14:11< vultraz_laptop> but I'm sure I could solve that by changing the rects just a little
20130604 12:15:14< vultraz_laptop> but I'll deal with it later, maybe when fabi returns
20130604 12:15:23< LordBob_> Yeah, let's do that
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20130604 12:17:16< LordBob_> Nudging them up or down by a pixel ought to suffice
20130604 12:17:25< LordBob_> Anyway, I'll be going now. Later
20130604 12:24:37< irker887> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth-old:master f8761a / data/themes/editor.cfg: Fixed path to low-res tools editor theme image http://git.io/2JAksg
20130604 12:25:13< vultraz_laptop> for some reason that gets rid of the image not found error..
20130604 12:25:23< vultraz_laptop> but the theme still gets messed up :/
20130604 12:27:22< vultraz_laptop> shadowm: please confirm that the segfault thing is now gone
20130604 12:27:28< vultraz_laptop> when you're done being killed
20130604 12:28:11< shadowm> There wasn't a segfault.
20130604 12:28:40< shadowm> The program just did what it was supposed to do: exit after main() caught an exception that wasn't supposed to happen.
20130604 12:29:10< shadowm> A segfault refers to a signal raised by the operating system when the program (or a system call) does something it isn't supposed to do with its memory.
20130604 12:29:48< shadowm> Also, I am playtesting, I can't help you now.
20130604 12:31:12< vultraz_laptop> -10
20130604 12:31:40< vultraz_laptop> ignore that
20130604 12:36:15< fabi> hi vultraz_laptop
20130604 12:36:21< fabi> hi LordBob_
20130604 12:39:13< vultraz_laptop> hullo fabi 
20130604 12:43:16< vultraz_laptop> fabi: what do you think of using H18 for menu buttons exclusively?
20130604 12:43:26< vultraz_laptop> or even, ditching H18 in favor of H20?
20130604 12:43:43< fabi> I am fine with both
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20130604 12:58:26< vultraz_laptop> oh, nice, all menu buttons in the editor are H20 already
20130604 13:04:52< LordBob_> hello again, hello fabi
20130604 13:05:14< fabi> hi LordBob_
20130604 13:05:25< fabi> LordBob_: Where you on vacation?
20130604 13:05:39< fabi> Have you been on vacation?
20130604 13:05:59< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: turns out H18 is basically not used at all, which is good :D
20130604 13:06:00< LordBob_> yup. Gone for 3 days
20130604 13:06:21< vultraz_laptop> so no need to fancy editor conversion
20130604 13:06:25< vultraz_laptop> s/to/for
20130604 13:06:36< irker887> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth-old:master ca06fe / data/themes/dfool.cfg: Made dfool them use correct images (non menu image for End Turn button and H20 m http://git.io/9paslw
20130604 13:06:54< fabi> LordBob_: I would like to discuss a game ui thing with you, before you get the first prototype.
20130604 13:06:57< LordBob_> vultraz_laptop: hmmm...I'm pretty certain I made those for a reason.
20130604 13:07:40< fabi> vultraz_laptop: I guess dfool and experimental are pretty much obsolete, don't fix them. I guess we should just remove.
20130604 13:07:48< LordBob_> vultraz_laptop:  regarding the low-res editor, the latest batch of changes switched to a single-layer panel to panel background+palette overlays ; this is why the editor's still broken despite the name change
20130604 13:08:11< vultraz_laptop> fabi: alright
20130604 13:08:13< LordBob_> fabi: sure, let's discuss it
20130604 13:08:30< vultraz_laptop> fabi: should we delete them now, or maybe have a poll?
20130604 13:08:41< fabi> vultraz_laptop: No poll
20130604 13:08:55< fabi> LordBob_: Okay, let me fetch a green tea and start.
20130604 13:09:06< vultraz_laptop> fabi: so, can I remove them?
20130604 13:10:02< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: since there doesn't seem to be any use of H18 for now, can I move them to attic?
20130604 13:12:35< LordBob_> vultraz: considering the recent glitches, "there doesn't seem to" isn't enough. Run a check if possible, I'm pretty certain I made them for a purpose
20130604 13:13:01< vultraz_laptop> I did run a check
20130604 13:13:23< vultraz_laptop> I grepped for all uses of H18, and the only ones are two commented out lines in the editor theme
20130604 13:13:33< LordBob_> Oh well. In this case, move 'em
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20130604 13:13:56< fabi> vultraz_laptop: How do you know they are not used?
20130604 13:14:13< vultraz_laptop> grep
20130604 13:15:06< fabi> vultraz_laptop, LordBob_: I do not want to move images around like mad. Let's finish the stuff and clean up afterwards.
20130604 13:15:36< vultraz_laptop> oh
20130604 13:15:55< vultraz_laptop> I was going to move the H18 images, then merge menu_button with buttons_normal, but if you want to wait, alright
20130604 13:17:04< fabi> LordBob_: The minimap is right over what you called "endturn_panel.png".
20130604 13:17:37< fabi> LordBob_: Minimap displayed the units in the color of their sides since ages.
20130604 13:18:19< LordBob_> fabi: it is, in the mock-up. But we considered moving the endturn button back to where it currently is, didn't we ?
20130604 13:18:46< fabi> LordBob_: I have changed that completely. Allies have a blue orb, thus every allied unit is blue on the minimap, no matter which side it belongs to.
20130604 13:19:21< fabi> LordBob_: Enemy units have no orb (which could be changed) thus I just took the black color to represent them.
20130604 13:19:44< LordBob_> sounds reasonable on paper
20130604 13:19:49< fabi> The third class of units are the player's one.
20130604 13:20:29< LordBob_> how does this translate in multiplayer games, though ?
20130604 13:20:46< fabi> The are either green (green orb == not moved yet) yellow (yellow orb == already moved but movepoints left) 
20130604 13:21:00< fabi> or red (red orb == unit can't do anything anymore)
20130604 13:22:02< fabi> LordBob_: It translates 1:1, there are no changes to be made.
20130604 13:22:56< LordBob_> Hmm...So in single player mode the minimap shows [green/yellow/red] for the player, blue for allies, black for ennemies. That's good. However, in multiplayer wouldn't a player want to differenciate ennemies ?
20130604 13:23:49< fabi> LordBob_: Yeah, maybe. That's why we have that button to toggle the colors back to side representation.
20130604 13:24:05< LordBob_> Aaaah, now that's convenient :)
20130604 13:24:40< fabi> I have not yet implemented anything village related.
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20130604 13:24:51< fabi> But I think villages will be handled similar.
20130604 13:25:50< LordBob_> How is the minimap drawn ? Is there specific artwork, aside from the shrinked terrain tiles ?
20130604 13:25:52< fabi> LordBob_: I really would like to have an orb for the enemy.
20130604 13:26:04< fabi> LordBob_: No, no artwork involved.
20130604 13:26:46< fabi> LordBob_: And there needs to be a solution for red/green blind people.
20130604 13:27:00< LordBob_> Indeed
20130604 13:27:46< LordBob_> About that black orb, wouldn't there be a risk to confuse shroud with enemy units on the minimap ?
20130604 13:31:19< LordBob_> fabi: while we're in the minimap, do you think it might be interesting to simplify the display, similar to that game you showed last week ? (i.e have the minimap show the base terrain types)
20130604 13:32:23< fabi> LordBob_: Yes, the game we had a look at does much better with the minimap. I would like to call that semantic display, since it only shows how terrain behaves, not how it looks.
20130604 13:33:13< fabi> LordBob_: Thus another toogle between satellite/semantic display.
20130604 13:34:08< fabi> LordBob_: Black is indeed a bad color for the enemy, both on the orb and on the minimap.
20130604 13:37:40< LordBob_> fabi: there is another thing that they do well, though it is mostly cosmetic: it's a lot easier to make out individual hexes in their display, and not only because of scale
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20130604 13:38:08< fabi> LordBob_: Yes, a hex is actually hex shaped.
20130604 13:38:09< LordBob_> fabi: their minimap is smooth, whereas ours is pixelated
20130604 13:41:19< fabi> I will see what I can do there.
20130604 13:42:59< LordBob_> fabi: the one thing that bothers me is that our minimap is, AFAICT, scaled automatically depending on the map size. Which complicates, if not forbids, the use of any symbol that might have helped differenciate units on the minimap (re: the colorblind users)
20130604 13:45:21< fabi> LordBob_: I just zoomed out to have a look how the actual map does. If you zoom out until the map is the size of the minimap, you see that the map is still doing better.
20130604 13:49:08< LordBob_> Hmmm....Indeed. Even with a 6x6 map, the minimap is quite pixelated
20130604 13:50:41< LordBob_> So there's room for improvement indeed, but it al lrests on your shoulders I'm afraid :s
20130604 13:51:15< fabi> :-)
20130604 13:51:38< fabi> LordBob_: The "endturn-panel" would be directly under the minimap.
20130604 13:52:14< fabi> LordBob_: And use the same colors to display how many units you have moved already and which not.
20130604 13:54:43< fabi> Including all the buttons related.
20130604 13:54:59< LordBob_> Yes, this could work. Instead of the "turn sequence" status I had placed in there, have a variable status that also serves as a legend for the minimap. good.
20130604 13:55:58< LordBob_> For instance, when switched to side colors, it shows the turn sequence ; when switched to movement, it shows moved/unmoved/etc.
20130604 13:56:08< LordBob_> Or display both info at the same time
20130604 13:56:23< fabi> sounds fine
20130604 13:57:26< fabi> The endturn button itself... I think it is best put to the bottom of the sidebar. Just because the player will most likely use the "map toolbar" quite often and you do not want to click accidentally on end turn.
20130604 14:00:26< LordBob_> Sure, we can do that
20130604 14:00:44< LordBob_> For the minimap, I'll try a few different color combinations
20130604 14:01:21< LordBob_> See which ones work best for the moved/unmoved/ally/enemy scheme and for the semantic display
20130604 14:02:02< LordBob_> I'm thinking the semantic display might recycle the background colour of the terrain type icons
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20130604 14:02:55< fabi> LordBob_: cool
20130604 14:08:30< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: anything else you'd like me to do with the images?
20130604 14:08:39< vultraz_laptop> since I can't move the H18s yet
20130604 14:10:15< vultraz_laptop> well, I guess I can rename menu_buttons to button_menu
20130604 14:12:27< LordBob_> vultraz_laptop: I would hold the renaming for now: if we're going to merge the directories later, better spare the extra effort
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20130604 14:12:59< vultraz_laptop> I'm not sure they should be merged, now that I think about it. They're different sizes; they might get mixed up
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20130604 14:13:28< LordBob_> vultraz_laptop: in this case, then, yes, why not rename the directory
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20130604 14:14:44< LordBob_> vultraz_laptop: another thing that needs doing, maybe with some guidance from fabi, is to update the editor's 800*480 theme. 
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20130604 14:18:27< irker887> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth-old:master 44ec96 / images/buttons/ (80 files in 2 dirs): Renamed images/buttons/menu_buttons to images/buttons/button_menu for consistenc http://git.io/PMWmDw
20130604 14:18:30< irker887> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth-old:master 6daa64 / data/themes/editor.cfg: Updated menu button image paths http://git.io/iLh7Qw
20130604 14:20:01< vultraz_laptop> Ok, only think that remains is the H18 images, which I'll deal with probably before 1.11.5
20130604 14:20:05< vultraz_laptop> thing*
20130604 14:21:10< vultraz_laptop> and possibly deleting the dfool and experimental themes, if fabi and anyone eles agrees
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20130604 14:21:53< vultraz_laptop> LordBob_: what needs to be done with the 800*480 theme?
20130604 14:22:52< vultraz_laptop> ah, I see, it doesn't have any contents
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20130604 14:27:48< LordBob_> vultraz_laptop: in doubt, you'd better ask fabi how the theme works exactly, but here's the thing: the new image set should make use of sidebar_top-800 and sidebar to create a sidebar background that extends all the way down. After which minimap-800, tools-800, palette-top and palette are overlayed on top 
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20130604 14:28:13< LordBob_> vultraz_laptop: the first step should be to take a good look at the 1024*768 theme and see how it works
20130604 14:35:56< vultraz_laptop> god dammit, I screwed something up with my last commit, as always
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20130604 14:46:22< vultraz_laptop> oh, nvm, it was just XCode not copying the images folder >_<
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20130604 15:33:56< mattsc> Hi Crab_ 
20130604 15:34:08< Crab_> mattsc: hello
20130604 15:34:34< mattsc> Crab_: how hard would it be to have the default aspects work when a version number is given for the AI engine?
20130604 15:34:53< mattsc> With the Micro AIs being used more now, this is starting to become an issue.
20130604 15:35:12< Crab_> you mean aspects given as X=Y ?
20130604 15:35:21< mattsc> yes, sorry
20130604 15:36:15< Crab_> no, it's ok, I was just clarifying. It is not hard, especially if you're ok with them being rewritten in the saves to new style.
20130604 15:36:50< Crab_> e.g. "load as X=Y even with 'version=' defined,  save as [aspect]..."
20130604 15:37:02< mattsc> Yeah, that's no problem.
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20130604 16:07:20< Crab_> mattsc: I'll see if I can get it done quickly
20130604 16:07:41< mattsc> Crab_: That would be great, thank you!
20130604 16:09:22< mattsc> Crab_: the other thing still missing is the persistent variable thing and parameter passing for extCAs.  But Nephro has that essentially working, he and I just need to do some trouble shooting, now that I am back.
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20130604 16:43:50< mattsc> flix: hi
20130604 16:44:49< flix> mattsc: hello :)
20130604 16:45:16< mattsc> I have been playing with the advancements aspect a little.  I am not done yet, but I have a couple comments/questions.
20130604 16:45:47< mattsc> In general, I like it.  A lot, but I found a couple things that are either not working, or not as I expected them to work.
20130604 16:46:08< mattsc> First, setting it without using Lua (Method 3.) doesn't seem to work.
20130604 16:47:01< mattsc> I simply copied your example into a side in my test scenario, and it doesn't do the job.  Moreover, if I check the AI config with :inspect, it doesn't show up.
20130604 16:47:16< flix> mattsc: That's to bad
20130604 16:47:38< mattsc> Am I missing something, or is it supposed to be that simple?
20130604 16:47:39< flix> mattsc: Did you check it in the "full overview" section?
20130604 16:47:46< mattsc> flix: yes
20130604 16:48:12< mattsc> "ai config full" is what I checked.  The aspect is there, but without the new content.
20130604 16:49:37< flix> mattsc: okay, give me some minutes to test things
20130604 16:49:37< mattsc> Second, if I set advancements to "Javelineer,Pikeman" (2 of the 3 options for a Spearman), what is supposed to happen in that case?
20130604 16:50:01< flix> mattsc: It will pick always the first one
20130604 16:50:25< mattsc> Ok, that would not be my preferred option, but moreover, that's not what's happening.
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20130604 16:50:38< mattsc> It advances the spearmen to swordsmen
20130604 16:51:42< flix> mattsc: can you send me your test scenario? 
20130604 16:51:44< mattsc> In other words, it's ok if it chooses the first one (we just need to point it out on the wiki), but apparently it's also not working.
20130604 16:52:13< mattsc> flix: do you have AI-demos installed?
20130604 16:52:27< flix> yes
20130604 16:52:51< mattsc> Then you have it already, just start wesnoth with '-d -t aid_test'
20130604 16:53:46< flix> mattsc: and you just copied the code from the wiki to the cfg, right?
20130604 16:53:55< mattsc> correct
20130604 16:54:05< mattsc> for Side 2
20130604 16:54:29< mattsc> flix: It works perfectly for Method 2., but not for Method 3.
20130604 16:54:59< flix> mattsc: and for 1. ?
20130604 16:55:28< mattsc> Well, I had a question about that...  1. is just a special version of 2., right?
20130604 16:56:54< mattsc> I actually didn't use 2. literally as on the wiki, but uses a hardcoded return value (without deleting the advance function).  So I guess I have not tested all of the functionality in 2.  That's what I meant, I'm not done yet.
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20130604 17:04:24< flix> mattsc: how are you advancing the units in aid_test?
20130604 17:06:42< mattsc> flix: I am putting some Side 2 units out there and givem the max_exp-1 (in debug mode), then end the Side 1 turn.
20130604 17:06:56< mattsc> s/givem the/give them
20130604 17:09:53< mattsc> flix: if you know how to use debug commands efficiently, that's much faster than modifying the scenario code and restarting every time.
20130604 17:10:51< mattsc> flix: also note that for testing AI commands/code (with Side 1), there's a right-click option to execute code in lua/test_lua.lua
20130604 17:11:21< mattsc> That doesn't work here, but it is very convenient for testing custom lua code as it requires no reloading at all.  Just change the code and right-click again
20130604 17:14:30< flix> mattsc: yes, sounds good indeed
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20130604 17:49:22< flix> mattsc: method 3 is working for me in this scenario. I can see it under "ai overview". All I've done is added the following to side 2: [ai] advancements = "Troll Rocklobber, Saurian Oracle" [/ai]
20130604 17:51:15< mattsc> flix: hmm, strange.  Let me try again (in a few minutes, need to finish something else first)
20130604 17:51:27< flix> mattsc: http://pastebin.com/Gmw01S7y <-- my modified test.cfg
20130604 17:52:58< mattsc> flix: that looks exactly like what I tried, just with different unit types...
20130604 17:53:03< flix> mattsc: did you try to reload savefiles?
20130604 17:53:13< mattsc> flix: nope
20130604 17:53:40< mattsc> flix: give me a few minutes, I'll try again
20130604 17:56:55< mattsc> flix: hmm, yes, it is working now.  Not sure why it didn't before.  Sorry for that.
20130604 17:57:10< mattsc> Must have been a typo or something...
20130604 17:58:42< mattsc> flix: however, the second problem I mentioned persists
20130604 17:59:08< mattsc> Is set 'advancements = "Javelineer, Pikeman"' and the spearmen all advance to swordsmen
20130604 18:00:54< flix> mattsc: okay, I'll test this one now
20130604 18:01:25< mattsc> flix: I've done that both with Methods 2. (1.?) and 3. now, with the same result.
20130604 18:05:04< flix>  mattsc: I can't reproduce it neither. when I use this (http://pastebin.com/bgVhaedA) by Spearman will always advance to a Pikeman. (So not the first but the last option)
20130604 18:05:36< mattsc> flix: ah, crap, I'm an idiot!  And wasting your time...
20130604 18:06:30< mattsc> flix: yes, it's working indeed and I am too embarrassed to tell you why I thought it wasn't.  :)
20130604 18:06:56< mattsc> flix: question: so what you have there is what you'd call Method 1. on the wiki, right?
20130604 18:07:26< flix> mattsc: No problem, I'm rather relieved that it is working :D
20130604 18:07:29< flix> mattsc: yes
20130604 18:10:10< mattsc> flix: ok, so all that I have tried so far seems to be working (I have done a few other tests that I didn't mention here because I didn't screw them up).  I'll do some more tests and then I'd like to rearrange some of the information on the wiki.
20130604 18:11:10< mattsc> (not what you have on this page, but I want to add this to AiWML in a slightly different form.
20130604 18:12:33< flix> mattsc: okay, when the next release comes I will start a new topic in the forums to let people know about this new feature.
20130604 18:13:13< mattsc> flix: sounds good.  Have you added this (and your other commits) to the changelog?
20130604 18:13:37< flix> mattsc: yes
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20130604 18:45:46< fabi> LordBob_: still around?
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20130604 19:28:14< Soliton> [lua] code in a [multiplayer] scenario is also executed if not playing that scenario?
20130604 19:28:34< Soliton> mattsc: maybe you know? ^
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20130604 19:32:47< mattsc> Soliton: I don't.  I would have said that it isn't but I don't remember that I have ever tried.  Where would that [lua] tag be placed?
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20130604 19:33:22< Soliton> mattsc: directly in [multiplayer].
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20130604 19:34:08< mattsc> Soliton: I don't think I have ever done that.  Do you want me to test it?
20130604 19:34:22< Soliton> mattsc: if you don't mind that be cool.
20130604 19:35:41< Soliton> mattsc: i'm curious because it seems that this http://oi43.tinypic.com/j582lh.jpg was caused by lua code that is only included in a different scenario then what was played.
20130604 19:36:21< mattsc> Soliton: ok, give me a little ...
20130604 19:36:44< mattsc> *time
20130604 19:36:53< Soliton> no worries. nothing urgent. :-)
20130604 19:36:59 * Soliton goes home.
20130604 19:37:48< mattsc> Soliton: ok, I'll leave a message here when I'm done
20130604 19:40:24< Soliton> mattsc: the lua in question: http://sprunge.us/bdOg
20130604 19:41:05< mattsc> Soliton: okay
20130604 19:42:41< _8680_> I found the problem — the [lua] was not in a [multiplayer] tag, it was at toplevel.
20130604 19:44:56< _8680_> The add-on’s _main.cfg includes its “macros” directory in a `#ifdef MULTIPLAYER`, and one of the .cfg files in that “macros” directory is that sprunge.us paste.
20130604 19:46:10< mattsc> _8680_: ah, yes, that would happen then.  I'll stop my tests then.  :)
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20130604 20:17:19< Soliton> _8680_: ah, good catch.
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20130604 20:53:41< anonymissimus> Soliton: "[lua] code in a [multiplayer] scenario is also executed if not playing that scenario": no, but it could be from a modification, era or at toplevel (as happened)
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20130604 20:57:52< anonymissimus> Soliton: from where is the lua inyour srpunge paste; from the addon mentioned in http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=38941&p=554630#p554630 ?
20130604 21:00:24< anonymissimus> that code looks as if someone tried to code some fight special; namely, a transfer of the attack a killed unit has to its killer, and it was just called virus by chance, not because of a malevolent intention of the author
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20130604 22:12:32< anonymissimus> I get a lot of these since very recently: 20130604 22:11:55 warning gui/event: Unhandled event 13.
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20130604 22:13:13< anonymissimus> this is just from starting up to the titlescreen
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20130604 22:13:51< anonymissimus> there are so many that I should have a script to filter them out
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20130604 22:30:23< mattsc> Is there a (correct) way to have a weapon special with a [chance_to_hit] tag without the value= key set?
20130604 22:30:32-!- LordBob_ [~chatzilla@2a01:e34:ee82:47e0:21e:c2ff:fe01:261f] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20130604 22:31:22< mattsc> In other words, is value= a required key inside [chance_to_hit]?
20130604 22:31:42< bumbadadabum> mattsc: I think it won't do anything if you don't have it
20130604 22:32:19< bumbadadabum> (I never tried a [chance_to_hit] without an actual value, though
20130604 22:32:29< mattsc> bumbadadabum: well, it crashes the experimental recruitment AI, so the question is whether I need to fix it or can blame it on the UMC author.  :)
20130604 22:32:36< _8680_> mattsc: As far as I know, [chance_to_hit]value= is not required — you could have add= or sub= or multiply= or divide= instead.
20130604 22:32:59< bumbadadabum> *value or another modifier
20130604 22:33:16< mattsc> _8680_: ah, right.  And those are instead of value=, rather than in addition to it...
20130604 22:33:33< LordBob_> fabi_: I'm back
20130604 22:33:51< fabi_> hi LordBob_
20130604 22:33:56< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: Did vultraz report my issues to you?
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20130604 22:34:00< mattsc> I'm so out of practice with WML...  (not that my Lua skills are a whole lot better)
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20130604 22:34:28< bumbadadabum> mattsc: as long as you know wmlindent, you're already better than 90% of WML coders
20130604 22:34:29< bumbadadabum> :p
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20130604 22:35:50< LordBob_> bumbadadabum: he did report a number of issues, but I'm not sure which of them were specifically yours
20130604 22:36:00< lipkab> KRunner is really strange today. I told it to open QtCreator at it started playing music instead... hmm.
20130604 22:36:10< lipkab> I guess no one cares, though.
20130604 22:36:32< lipkab> Probably I shouldn't care either.
20130604 22:36:35< LordBob_> bumbadadabum: was your problem the editor crash with missing artwork ?
20130604 22:37:56< bumbadadabum> LordBob_: Not a crash, but there is missing artwork
20130604 22:38:11< bumbadadabum> as well as the one with transparent buttons in messages with [option]s
20130604 22:40:50< LordBob_> bumbadadabum: ok. We discussed both matters and he committed a fix that uses the ImagePathFunctions to generate transparent buttons, so this one should be solved
20130604 22:42:11< bumbadadabum> Ok
20130604 22:44:29< LordBob_> bumbadadabum: the missing artwork, however, is because (I think) we still haven't updated the "low-res" theme, which also covers any display with a height below 768 pixels
20130604 22:46:16< LordBob_> bumbadadabum: to be more precise, I recently updated and renamed some elements of the new backgrounds so that they're assembled in a different manner. fabi_ wired this in the default 1024*768 resolution, but I think he hasn't done/committed it yet for lower resolutions
20130604 22:46:37< fabi_> indeed
20130604 22:48:42< LordBob_> fabi_: btw, I've been thinking some more about the "semantic" display for the minimap. How would we show terrain with multiple base types such as hills+forest ?
20130604 22:49:29< fabi_> I thought about an inner and and outer color.
20130604 22:52:09< LordBob_> Hmm...Does this still work when the map is very large and the minimap has a subsquently small scale ? As far as I understand, the minimap has a fixed pixel size and is scaled depending on the overal hex size of the map, right ?
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20130604 22:57:14< fabi_> LordBob_: Yes, on large maps this gives us problems.
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20130604 23:02:15< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master 73d946 / src/editor/action/mouse/mouse_action_unit.cpp: Extended the unit tool's tooltip. http://git.io/S8Ad7g
20130604 23:02:15< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master 16dd13 / / (6 files in 3 dirs): Put the new custom tod dialog into use. http://git.io/uIWuXg
20130604 23:02:15< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master e8ad6b / src/terrain.hpp: Fix spelling in a comment. http://git.io/vZafZQ
20130604 23:02:17< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master d7f3b5 / data/core/macros/schedules.cfg: Correct indentation. http://git.io/y2jK9A
20130604 23:02:24< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master 53b3e3 / / (22 files in 6 dirs): UnitBox experimental theme. http://git.io/J4kg0Q
20130604 23:02:26< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master e82a16 / data/themes/editor.cfg: Fixed an image path. http://git.io/GIvGTw
20130604 23:02:28< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master fa125e / src/editor/editor_controller.cpp: Don't add every music title to the playlist. http://git.io/mIMJog
20130604 23:02:30< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master e423d7 / src/display.cpp: Change the minimap unit's color coding. http://git.io/epIzgw
20130604 23:02:32< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master 643009 / data/themes/unit_box.cfg src/reports.cpp: Render the global time of day beyond the local one. http://git.io/_BNaVw
20130604 23:02:34< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master ebe7ca / src/ (editor/editor_controller.cpp gui/dialogs/editor/custom_tod.cpp): Remove obsolete method and call to redraw(). http://git.io/enOhxQ
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20130604 23:09:13< irker377> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master 6693a7 / src/CMakeLists.txt: Fix the build with cmake. http://git.io/1Zlr1w
20130604 23:09:48< fabi_> LordBob_: When you update your repository, you can find the prototype of the game theme.
20130604 23:10:22< LordBob_> Ahaah :D
20130604 23:10:47 * LordBob_ pulls and builds
20130604 23:18:27< LordBob_> btw, mattsc, it seems some recent commit has removed the need for the pango workaround in text.cpp ? I don't know if you're the person behind this, but it makes things a lot easier
20130604 23:20:27< mattsc> LordBob_: hi.  It was mordante.  Somebody else brought up the question how to deal with it, to which I replied, and then mordante took over.  Yeah, it's nice.
20130604 23:21:08< mattsc> Well, a whole bunch of people were involved, but I forgot who exactly.  It's in the logs.  :)
20130604 23:21:17< LordBob_> fabi_: two errors during the "link" phase make the build fail :(
20130604 23:22:19< LordBob_> Mattsc: my thanks go to everyone involved, then :)
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20130604 23:25:40< fabi_> LordBob_: additional files from vultraz implementing the custom time schedule dialog are most likely the cause.
20130604 23:25:55< fabi_> LordBob_: maybe mattsc can update Xcode files for you.
20130604 23:27:51< LordBob_> fabi_ : there is a mention of a "gui2::tcustom_tod" in one of those messages, so yeah this might be it
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20130604 23:28:27< mattsc> LordBob_: let me see
20130604 23:28:36< LordBob_> Here, let me connect my laptop and paste the exact message
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20130604 23:30:44< LordBob_laptop> mattsc: http://pastebin.com/btWG7zzL
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20130604 23:32:54< mattsc> LordBob_: thanks.  Compiling myself at the moment.  Unfortunately, I had to do a "clean" first, and my laptop's not as fast as yours, so it will be a moment.
20130604 23:33:22< LordBob_> ok. I'll be waiting, then
20130604 23:33:25< mattsc> ... and I just had to restart because I messed up.  grrr...
20130604 23:33:43< mattsc> not restart the computer, just the build  :P
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20130604 23:54:44< mattsc> LordBob_: umm, somehow this is not as easy as I expected it to be ...
20130604 23:54:57< LordBob_> damn :s
20130604 23:55:14< LordBob_> At least you get those same messages ?
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20130604 23:57:55< mattsc> Yes, I'm past that point.  But I am not sure if I messed up badly enough that I might have to start from scratch again...
20130604 23:59:09< mattsc> LordBob_: unfortunately, I can't deal with this right now, sorry ...
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--- Log closed Wed Jun 05 00:00:30 2013