--- Log opened Thu Oct 24 00:00:08 2013
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20131024 01:39:38< irker947> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth-old:master d5b994c0bb16 / data/ai/lua/dummy_engine_lua.lua src/ai/composite/engine_lua.cpp: Lua AI: make persistent data variable work with external CAs http://git.io/Bwjh3w
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20131024 03:46:39< irker947> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth-old:master 5a6877343101 / src/ai/composite/engine_lua.cpp: Lua AI external CAs: allow parameters for eval/exec functions http://git.io/vO5Udw
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20131024 04:12:11< travis-ci> [travis-ci] wesnoth/wesnoth-old#824 (master - 5a68773 : mattsc): The build has errored.
20131024 04:12:11< travis-ci> [travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/builds/12966339
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20131024 04:34:02< iceiceice> hi
20131024 04:34:15< iceiceice> i'm thinking about doing some work to address a bug #21210, is there anyone present who can speak authoritatively about what the replay server does to read save game files?
20131024 04:59:18< shadowm> Hm.
20131024 05:00:22< shadowm> iceiceice: Maybe try with a more specific question? I have the scripts in front of me atm.
20131024 05:03:35< mattsc> Hmm, do I see that right that the clang build passed and the gcc build did not?  It didn't stop with an error message though, it just hung up...
20131024 05:03:46< shadowm> mattsc: Yes.
20131024 05:03:53< mattsc> Any advice?  (It passed with no issues on my system.)
20131024 05:04:17< shadowm> Travis is a shared CI service used by many other projects AFAIK.
20131024 05:04:39< mattsc> Okay - so I wait?
20131024 05:04:43< shadowm> So hang-ups like that affecting build results don't seem that surprising.
20131024 05:04:59< shadowm> No, you don't wait. You just assumed the build would have succeeded under normal conditions. :p
20131024 05:05:03< shadowm> *assume
20131024 05:05:31< mattsc> Cool.  Thanks.  :)
20131024 05:05:48< shadowm> error: unable to unlink old 'data/advanced_preferences.cfg' (Permission denied)
20131024 05:05:54< shadowm> Okay, what's going on with my working tree.
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20131024 05:06:40< shadowm> _8680_: You are the git wizard, right?
20131024 05:06:54< shadowm> Oh wait.
20131024 05:07:15< shadowm> Yeah never mind. Now I remember I messed up the parent dir's permissions the other day on purpose.
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20131024 05:09:51< Coffee_irc> iceiceice: from my UMC MP campaign it appears the MP server reads the 'save_id' field
20131024 05:10:01< Coffee_irc> and stips any macros out
20131024 05:10:14< Coffee_irc> replacing them with blanks
20131024 05:10:20< Coffee_irc> for the name in the replays
20131024 05:10:44< Coffee_irc> *strips
20131024 05:10:56< shadowm> Yeah, I suspect many people might be able to come to that conclusion on their own.
20131024 05:11:07< Coffee_irc> shadowm: well he did ask
20131024 05:11:20< Coffee_irc> and I remember spending some time trying to work around that myself without success
20131024 05:11:39< shadowm> I think he asked for an authoritative source.
20131024 05:11:42< Coffee_irc> because you need individual save_id's that you know to recall the same units in the next scenario or something
20131024 05:11:54< shadowm> I don't understand the script, so here you have the relevant fragments: http://pastebin.com/GnkzENn0
20131024 05:12:02< shadowm> Line 4 onwards is parse_replay.
20131024 05:12:27< shadowm> $replaycat is either cat, zcat, or bzcat depending on whether the replay is compressed and what it's compressed with.
20131024 05:15:52< shadowm> mattsc: The build passed for me using gcc 4.8.1 in case you are still uncertain about the job failure.
20131024 05:16:25< mattsc> shadowm: thanks for letting me know!
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20131024 05:19:16< shadowm> Coffee_irc: By the way, macros don't ever reach the MP server (which is in charge of generating the replays for archiving).
20131024 05:19:40< Coffee_irc> shadowm: then it is strange that the {SIDE} gets chopped off from my campaign and from WC
20131024 05:19:57< shadowm> The MP server exclusively receives and handles data that has already been preprocessed by the clients.
20131024 05:20:11< Coffee_irc> oh well, maybe it is the number then
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20131024 05:27:52< Coffee_irc> shadowm, iceiceice: maybe you want the 'name' field to be used instead of the 'save_id' and check that the '1' is okay and doesn't strip the last numbers (unless you want this)
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20131024 05:35:50< iceiceice> hi sry i missed the chat window notifications ><
20131024 05:36:57< iceiceice> so basically what i'm asking is, if i wrote a shell script using like sed and grep that gave better results for some replays without making things worse, would that be useful?
20131024 05:38:19< iceiceice> ok actually i'm just going to read what u sent carefully now 
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20131024 05:38:47< iceiceice> coffee: yeah i was going to try to read name tags from within side tags of the "inner" replay_start tags
20131024 05:38:49< Coffee_irc> iceiceice: maybe shadowm can answer better, but it looks like you could just change that one line shadowm posted
20131024 05:39:11< Coffee_irc> might want to check what happens if a player disconnects though
20131024 05:40:14< shadowm> I am not very experienced using sed beyond simple substitutions and I don't know for sure what that part of the pipeline does.
20131024 05:40:16< Coffee_irc> which you can of course already do by creating a game on the server and disconnecting one player and check that the parse gives the appropriate 'name' still
20131024 05:44:22< iceiceice> y so i i looked at some save files already
20131024 05:44:41< iceiceice> the way it seems to work, theres a portion of the replay data which corresponds to start of game
20131024 05:44:44< iceiceice> and a portion for the end of game
20131024 05:44:49< iceiceice> the end of game names are bad if someone dc's
20131024 05:44:55< iceiceice> usually they all end up as host for instance
20131024 05:45:09< iceiceice> but i think the names at start of game snapshot should be good
20131024 05:45:12< Coffee_irc> iceiceice: you will probably need that differentiation for it to work properly and not have something similar to deal with in the future
20131024 05:46:26< iceiceice> yeah i'll make sure to test it on a bunch to see what happens
20131024 05:47:40< vultraz> fabi: I got my wesnoth clone transferred to my new laptop and seemingly working, so I can now fix that issue with the editor tod dialog if you haven't already
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20131024 05:56:26< iceiceice> hmm
20131024 05:56:57< iceiceice> so in this second line /\[side\]/,/\[\/side]/s/^save_id="\([^"]*\)."/\1,/p
20131024 05:57:09< iceiceice> i think the period which appears is causing it to drop the last character of saveid
20131024 05:57:14< iceiceice> i wonder why that is there
20131024 05:57:45< iceiceice> so what i think this is doing is
20131024 05:57:50< iceiceice> theres two distinct commands
20131024 05:58:08< iceiceice> theres /\[side\]/,/\[\/side\]/
20131024 05:58:19< iceiceice> which says to grab text between a [side] and [/side] line
20131024 05:59:32< iceiceice> and the second part is to match within the remainder, a quote free segment after save_id=", followed by one character followed by a quote
20131024 05:59:45< iceiceice> maybe the . is in case there are "save_id" = empty sides
20131024 06:00:15< iceiceice> idk i will mess around with it for a bit
20131024 06:00:21< iceiceice> thx :)
20131024 06:01:12< Coffee_irc> iceiceice: glad you can read computer talk -- me I studied chinese and that was unintelligble enough ;)
20131024 06:02:23< shadowm> The last . matches the next character that isn't something that is not a quote.
20131024 06:04:09< iceiceice> coffee :) i was reading a sed tutorial earlier today, so it is all fresh atm. i am glad i was never inspired to try chinese ^^
20131024 06:04:41< iceiceice> shadowm: y so this . is, i think, the reason why the server says "RBY_Side" 4 times for all RBY 1 v 1's
20131024 06:05:08< iceiceice> presumably it is also dropping last character of everyones name in all replays?
20131024 06:05:09< shadowm> Whenever people use txtspk I have trouble telling the difference between 'yes' and 'why'.
20131024 06:05:31< iceiceice> haha i used to always think y was why?, and wesnoth players got me to think its yes now
20131024 06:06:39< iceiceice> also, i think it is getting 4 RBY sides instead of two because it looks like these replays have two [replay_start] tags
20131024 06:06:47< iceiceice> like its getting the duplicates for start of game and end of game
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20131024 06:08:46< iceiceice> hrm
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20131024 08:44:02-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: current repo: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old (Please read the dev-ml for the latest status!) | 199 bugs, 343 feature requests, 28 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20131024 08:54:30< Coffee_irc> boucman_work: do you have some time later for a few questions on unit_animaiton 'if' 'else' blocks?
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20131024 08:56:02< boucman_work> Coffee_irc: not sure, but I note that you want to me... i'll try to ping you today but no promises
20131024 08:56:09< boucman_work> you'll probably have more luck tomorow
20131024 08:56:18< boucman_work>  want to see me
20131024 08:56:26< Coffee_irc> ok
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20131024 11:20:28< boucman_work> Coffee_irc: around ?
20131024 11:20:57< Coffee_irc> boucman_work: pong
20131024 11:21:16< boucman_work> ok, so... how can I help you :)
20131024 11:21:30< Coffee_irc> then question I have is about the 'if' 'else' blocks in the unit_animation.cpp
20131024 11:21:34< Coffee_irc> the implementation
20131024 11:21:45< boucman_work> ok
20131024 11:21:49 * boucman_work opens github
20131024 11:21:58< Coffee_irc> I'd like to fix the problem of it being so that you can have as many 'if' 'else' blocks and it will work
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20131024 11:22:41< Coffee_irc> at the moment you can only have one 'if' block with as many 'else' blocks as you like, but if you do another further down the animation it doesn't work properly
20131024 11:22:55< boucman_work> oh ?
20131024 11:23:08< Coffee_irc> yes
20131024 11:23:10< boucman_work> I thought that worked...
20131024 11:23:30< Coffee_irc> it looks like at some point you must have implemented the nested 'if' thing
20131024 11:23:35< Coffee_irc> because that seems to work
20131024 11:24:09< Coffee_irc> from the documentation, this is the opposite of what you originally intended?
20131024 11:24:58< boucman_work> gimme a sec to look at the doc
20131024 11:25:09< Coffee_irc> I'd like to work on doing an anything goes in any order bug fix to simplify things for artists
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20131024 11:25:27< Coffee_irc> but I could do with a general pointer or pseudo code
20131024 11:25:59< boucman_work> hmm
20131024 11:26:51< boucman_work> honestly, if you could just rewrite/change [if] to have something that makes sense and doesn't have all the caveats, it would be awesome. maybe with some sort of [new_if] block or something like that
20131024 11:27:02< boucman_work> I'm not sure how fixable the current syntax is...
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20131024 11:27:45< Coffee_irc> well, I was thinking of rewriting the implementation to work with any usage case
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20131024 11:28:01< Coffee_irc> I like the 'if' 'else' idea
20131024 11:28:25< boucman_work> yeah, but the current syntax is very hard to make foolproof
20131024 11:28:50< Coffee_irc> boucman_work: you got any suggestions?
20131024 11:28:58< boucman_work> because conditions are not explicit and the combinatory of multiple [if] block can't take contradictions into account...
20131024 11:29:45< Coffee_irc> hmm
20131024 11:29:48< boucman_work> hmm
20131024 11:30:01< Coffee_irc> so more like the other 'if' blocks that are used elsewhere?
20131024 11:30:06< Coffee_irc> with 'or' and 'and?
20131024 11:30:40< Coffee_irc> could even be a 'filter' tag>
20131024 11:31:02< Coffee_irc> except 'filter' is already used it seems
20131024 11:31:08< boucman_work> I don't remember the syntax but i'll check
20131024 11:31:58< Coffee_irc> boucman_work: I think the current 'if' 'else' syntax might be salvagable without limits on it
20131024 11:32:30< boucman_work> if you can do that, that would be awesome. The current problem is that we don't detect contradictions
20131024 11:32:41< Coffee_irc> what do you mean?
20131024 11:33:44< boucman_work> have a look at http://pastebin.com/6Av6ZG7b
20131024 11:34:13< Coffee_irc> oh
20131024 11:34:15< Coffee_irc> I see
20131024 11:34:28< Coffee_irc> would fixing this require new syntax?
20131024 11:34:55< Coffee_irc> or just drop the 'hits=false' from the 'else' tag with code implementation?
20131024 11:38:30< boucman_work> hmm
20131024 11:39:01< boucman_work> remember that not having a tag is different from having a tag with the only value available (animation scoring)
20131024 11:39:40< boucman_work> the first thing I would do would be to add some sort of debug facility that would dump post-[if]-expansion WML so it helps with debugging
20131024 11:40:03< Coffee_irc> that makes sense
20131024 11:40:30< Coffee_irc> they all turn into separate animation blocks if I remember correctly
20131024 11:40:57< boucman_work> then I'd study how possible it is to detect at expansion time (or post-expansion but that less likely) if an animation WML is self-contradicting (i.e has contradictory conditions) and drop them (with a warning durinc conception, probably silently afterward)
20131024 11:41:20< boucman_work> exactly. [if] really is preprocessing, which was a design mistake.
20131024 11:41:42< Coffee_irc> boucman_work: I don't know, I think it is okay
20131024 11:42:02< boucman_work> Coffee_irc: that just means you havn't spent enough time thinking about it :P
20131024 11:42:32< boucman_work> I mean... we are thinking of contradictions in hits= wich is easy
20131024 11:42:33< Coffee_irc> well it is better IMO to do the processing in C++ rather than WML where possible
20131024 11:42:48< boucman_work> how could you detect contradictions in [unit_filter] for example...
20131024 11:43:25< boucman_work> yes and no, explicit preprocessing wouldn't have tricked the user as much. people understand what the PP does much better and can debug their problems themselves...
20131024 11:43:25< Coffee_irc> boucman_work: I think the number of occurrences would be low enough to do manually
20131024 11:43:35< boucman_work> hmm
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20131024 11:43:54< Coffee_irc> could be that everyone uses the 'if' and 'else' blocks mutually exclusively
20131024 11:43:58< Coffee_irc> and there is no problem
20131024 11:44:07< Coffee_irc> but it would need to be debugged first
20131024 11:44:22< boucman_work> maybe... but remember that you have [if] in macros, so there can be contradictions without the user knowing
20131024 11:45:55< Coffee_irc> boucman_work: thanks for that
20131024 11:46:06< Coffee_irc> I should be able to get a debugging output going I think
20131024 11:46:35< boucman_work> anyway... there is no easy fix that I know of, you need to detect when a conditional field is affected twice and make sense of that. there is no simple fix that i know of...
20131024 11:47:12< boucman_work> but if you start to have some ideas on how to fix this, feel free to discuss it with me, i'm probably the only one that can help you find problems with my understanding of the problem...
20131024 11:47:55< boucman_work> and yes, the debugging output will (at least) help you debug animation problems. you could maybe limit it to animations that actually have (if] blocks
20131024 11:50:33< Coffee_irc> cheers boucman_work, I've got some time off for next few days at least to do this kind of thing
20131024 11:51:04< boucman_work> yes, "a couple of days" sounds like a reasonable amount to figure out the problem
20131024 11:51:20< Coffee_irc> :)
20131024 11:51:45< Coffee_irc> well I'm off from work, so I also try to spend time playing with my 3d printer and such :)
20131024 11:52:14< Coffee_irc> a balanced life you know
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20131024 11:55:26< boucman_work> hehe
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20131024 15:07:56< irker024> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth-old:master 6c39832c8681 / src/ai/composite/engine_lua.cpp: Lua AI external CAs: change order of eval/exec parameters http://git.io/cQSd_Q
20131024 15:07:56< irker024> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth-old:master 1e8fe60b3abb / data/ai/micro_ais/ais/micro_ais_wml_tags.lua: [micro_ai] tag: add code for using external CAs http://git.io/Irb2Aw
20131024 15:07:57< irker024> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth-old:master 79e28544a011 / data/ai/micro_ais/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Lurkers MAI: switch to using external CAs http://git.io/MCJZ5g
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20131024 15:11:19< mattsc> Hi flix.
20131024 15:11:37< flix> mattsc: Hi!
20131024 15:12:08< mattsc> flix: I was going through bug reports recently and there are three that I think are either fixed by your new recruitment or don't apply any more:
20131024 15:12:34< mattsc> https://gna.org/bugs/?17591 https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?19662 https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?16823
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20131024 15:14:44< flix> mattsc: okay, wait a moment...
20131024 15:17:09< flix> mattsc: The first one (bug #17591) is fixed "as good as possible". If recruitment_diversity is small, still some units may never be recruited.
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20131024 15:20:07< flix> The seccond one (bug #19662) should be fixed. (The AI will now recruit a worse unit if a good unit exceeds the limit). Just as a reminder: The aspect "recruitment" doesn't work anymore. Use "recruitment_instructions" instead.
20131024 15:25:08< flix> The third bug (bug #16823) is fixed
20131024 15:27:00< mattsc> flix: great, that's what I thought.  Are you set up to mark them as fixed or should I do it?
20131024 15:27:12< flix> mattsc: I can do it
20131024 15:27:24< mattsc> flix: cool, thanks.
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20131024 15:32:02< flix> mattsc: done
20131024 15:34:02< mattsc> flix: great, thanks.
20131024 15:37:08< flix> mattsc: Well, closing Bug reports is kind of fun, isn't it? :)
20131024 15:37:25< mattsc> Indeed!  :)
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20131024 15:41:35< travis-ci> [travis-ci] wesnoth/wesnoth-old#825 (master - 79e2854 : mattsc): The build passed.
20131024 15:41:35< travis-ci> [travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/builds/12990338
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20131024 18:28:04< Soliton> re the replay parsing script: i don't remember why we drop the last character of the save_id. testing on some replays without that hopefully reveals any issues.
20131024 18:29:34< Soliton> i'm happy to help with the sed part if someone figures out if there are better suited tags/keys from the replay we could use.
20131024 18:30:12< Soliton> it's also fine to switch to something else for parsing it just shouldn't become too slow...
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20131024 18:59:39< mattsc> Hah, it works!  The Micro AIs do not require engine definitions any more, which also means they can be combined arbitrarily in any scenario without having to go through any hoops.
20131024 18:59:57< mattsc> So now we're down to only needing the [micro_ai] tag, nothing else at all.
20131024 19:00:36< mattsc> Sorry for bugging everybody with that, but I've been waiting for this since I started writing them.  :P
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20131024 19:23:11< Soliton> mattsc: good work! :-)
20131024 19:23:56< mattsc> Soliton: thanks!
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20131024 20:33:25< irker160> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth-old:master ff2ead45bfe9 / data/ai/micro_ais/ (4 files in 3 dirs): Goto MAI: switch to using external CAs http://git.io/hnsMLg
20131024 20:33:27< irker160> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth-old:master d7e3b87584c2 / data/ai/micro_ais/ (7 files in 3 dirs): Messenger MAI: switch to using external CAs http://git.io/C_-lrw
20131024 20:44:02-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: current repo: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old (Please read the dev-ml for the latest status!) | 196 bugs, 343 feature requests, 28 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20131024 21:48:04< fabi> mattsc: :-)
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20131024 21:53:57< mattsc> fabi: my sentiment as well.  Thanks.  :)
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--- Log closed Fri Oct 25 00:00:05 2013