--- Log opened Thu Dec 05 00:00:11 2013
--- Day changed Thu Dec 05 2013
20131205 00:00:11< justinzane_> It's making me want to buy a desktop just so I have something with a decent GPU to experiment with.
20131205 00:00:18< mattsc> gfgtdf: yes, I almost always start Wesnoth in debug mode
20131205 00:00:47< gfgtdf> mattsc: ye me too
20131205 00:01:14< gfgtdf> mattsc: could you test on 1.11.7 again in debug mode ?
20131205 00:01:23< shadowm> justinzane_: Wesnoth isn't really just for desktops though, and until we decide otherwise we still have to support crappy systems without accelerated rendering.
20131205 00:01:43< mattsc> gfgtdf: sure, give me a minute.
20131205 00:02:14< mattsc> gfgtdf: what is the "other oos error" you're talking about  (just reading up on the logs for the half hour I was gone).
20131205 00:02:46< gfgtdf> mattsc: its another oos error, that i found during invastigating this.
20131205 00:03:02< justinzane_> shadowm: Oh, I'm thinking about getting an ARM device for experimentation as well. And I've got an old Intel Atom with the crappy third party onboard graphics.
20131205 00:03:11< gfgtdf> would be nice of you could test that too.
20131205 00:03:16< mattsc> gfgtdf: I am aware of that one and I know what causes it.
20131205 00:03:36< mattsc> I think I described it here on the order of a week ago.
20131205 00:05:01< gfgtdf> mattsc: hm i tihnk maybe switching the order of there 2 line could fix it : https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/blob/master/src/actions/create.cpp#L935
20131205 00:05:36< mattsc> which of the two?  :)
20131205 00:06:01< gfgtdf> mattsc: have you tested the error the the wose in debug mode?
20131205 00:06:13< gfgtdf> mattsc: the unit creating and teh recording
20131205 00:06:16< justinzane_> And, as far as I can tell, by the time that Wesnoth is ready to mainline SDL2, just about every device in use will have some level of GPU/OpenGL capability.
20131205 00:06:47< gfgtdf> the recording.* but its just a guess.
20131205 00:07:27< gfgtdf> meanign recording before creating  the unit.
20131205 00:07:34< mattsc> No, I mean which of the two bugs would it fix.
20131205 00:07:55< gfgtdf> mattsc: the one you said you noticed a week ago.
20131205 00:07:58< mattsc> Well, I've tested with turning on debug mode at the beginning of the MP game.  That did not reproduce the problem.
20131205 00:08:04< mattsc> Let me start from the CL in debug mode.
20131205 00:08:43< mattsc> Umm, no that won't fix it.  The problem is different.
20131205 00:08:55< gfgtdf> mattsc: why not ?
20131205 00:09:04< mattsc> But I can't do the test you want me to do and describe the problem at the same time.  :P
20131205 00:11:12< gfgtdf> ok do the test with debug from commanline and talk after.
20131205 00:11:36< mattsc> gfgtdf: first, yes, if I start from the CL in debug mode, I do get the double-wose in 1.11.7 also
20131205 00:11:46< mattsc> let me do one other test
20131205 00:12:09< gfgtdf> mattsc: which other ?
20131205 00:15:04< mattsc> gfgtdf: ah, no the other test did not makes sense.  I wanted to start a game, switch to debug mode, then start another already being in debug mode.  But apparently debug mode is not preserved unless you specify it from the CL.
20131205 00:15:57< gfgtdf> mattsc: i think this line https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/blob/master/src/replay.cpp#L225 caused the problem i think mp_debug is onyl true when you start debug from cl
20131205 00:16:41< mattsc> Now as for the reason for the other OOS: the RNG system consists of a seed and a counter.  When you reload in the middle of a game, the counter gets reset.  However, if you then play through a replay of that, the replay has no record of the counter being reset, which causes the OOSs for any RNG access after that.
20131205 00:16:42< gfgtdf> when this command is added to the replay than replay undo just removed this from the replay instead of the original recruiting command.
20131205 00:17:45< mattsc> oh, cool
20131205 00:17:51< gfgtdf> mattsc: you sure? cn you tell me the file/line when the counter is reset ?
20131205 00:17:56< gfgtdf> can*
20131205 00:18:16< mattsc> No, I have not looked into where in the code that is happening.
20131205 00:18:32< gfgtdf> mattsc: and how do you know ?
20131205 00:18:48< mattsc> patience, I'm already typing it.  :D
20131205 00:19:09< mattsc> gfgtdf: start Wesnoth from the CL with the --log-debug=random option and watch it while you play through test cases like the one you describe.
20131205 00:19:24< mattsc> Watch the terminal output, I mean
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20131205 00:20:33< mattsc> gfgtdf: this is on my (growing) list of things to look into, but I won't fight you for it if you want to do it.  Not at all.
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20131205 00:21:35< gfgtdf> mattsc: i'll test what you said
20131205 00:22:53< mattsc> gfgtdf: I'll be away again for the next 45 min or so.  And this time I'll actually be physically away from the computer.
20131205 00:23:07< mattsc> Thanks for looking into this.
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20131205 00:25:50< gfgtdf> mattsc: i couldnt confirm what you said: i 1)started the game 2) recuited a orseman 3)saved and loaded 4) recruited 2 other horseman, herer the file (1.11.7) 
20131205 00:27:20< gfgtdf> mattsc: http://pastebin.com/3kKccaYh, the synced random it the one with seed 4798, and for that the random calls are not reset, the other randoms are used for unsynced things like unit names (1.11.7)
20131205 00:27:42< gfgtdf> mattsc: i still think "recording before unit creating" is worth a try.
20131205 00:28:10< mattsc> gfgtdf: your pastebin shows exactly the problem
20131205 00:28:36< gfgtdf> mattsc: o it doesnt only teh random calls with seed 4798 are important
20131205 00:31:40< mattsc> gfgtdf: I have no argument against that...
20131205 00:31:57< mattsc> gfgtdf: sorry, I really have to run off now.  I'll check back in later.
20131205 00:32:48< gfgtdf> mattsc: ok i'll go to bed now bb
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20131205 01:19:38< irker926> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master a20b6d264795 / data/core/music/ (defeat2.ogg victory2.ogg): Downsample defeat2.ogg and victory2.ogg from 48 KHz to 44.1 KHz http://git.io/rwNwzA
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20131205 11:39:55< fabi_> elias: units.wesnoth.org is broken for dev
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20131205 12:01:47< elias> fabi_: thanks
20131205 12:02:05< elias> that shouldn't be possible, worst case it should have stopped updating, hm
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20131205 13:00:43< irker852> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth-old:alep_android_port 18d202233e77 / src/hotkeys.cpp: Android port 1.10.7-20 update from Alessandro Pira http://git.io/8Tyy_A
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20131205 15:05:45< gfgtdf> mattsc: i think in commit b2cb594f3409a2cb41d10efb339f756e07f96763 the order of unit creation and replay logging was accidently switched
20131205 15:08:14< mattsc> gfgtdf: you mean line 935 vs. 939 ?
20131205 15:09:24< gfgtdf>  line 935 vs. 938+939
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20131205 15:11:12< mattsc> Hmm - so you think that it needs to be recorded before the RNG counter gets changed by creating the unit?
20131205 15:12:31< gfgtdf> mattsc: my thought was, that random is always logged in teh scope of the last puttet (replay-)command so after that commit the random logs during unit creataion was recordet in teh scope of the comit before, and that fails in case of a fresh loaded file because there is no command before and created corrupted replays  though.
20131205 15:12:56< gfgtdf> s/comit/(replay-)command
20131205 15:14:24< mattsc> gfgtdf: it sounds plausible, but I really don't know this well enough to be sure.
20131205 15:17:33< gfgtdf> that theory fits my experince bacause the replays from the saves  from which i get this erros looks liek this: http://pastebin.com/wSnK5rEV  the important is teh [command] that only contains [random]   which are actualy used at the unit recruitement.
20131205 15:18:06< mattsc> yes, I have seen those as well
20131205 15:18:27< mattsc> Well, please go ahead and try it.  And let me know if you want me to do any testing.
20131205 15:19:11< gfgtdf> wesbot: seen jamit
20131205 15:19:12< wesbot> gfgtdf: The person with the nick jamit last spoke 14d 11h ago.  4d 1h ago they left with the message: Read error: Connection reset by peer
20131205 15:24:42< irker852> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth-old:master 92bcca25fc7a / src/actions/create.cpp: record unit recuitment before unit creation. http://git.io/UYlqqg
20131205 15:25:15< gfgtdf> -,- pressed accidently enter before writing the commit message to the end.
20131205 15:26:50< gfgtdf> mattsc: ^
20131205 15:27:24< mattsc> gfgtdf: just to confirm, this is supposed to fix the recruit, save, load, recruit OOS error, right?
20131205 15:27:54< mattsc> I was a bit rushed all day yesterday, so just making sure I didn't miss something.
20131205 15:28:16< gfgtdf> mattsc: ye not related to undo. But i think teh recuit before the saveload is not needed to reproduce this bug.
20131205 15:28:56< mattsc> gfgtdf: agreed.  And I think your explanation why that one (the undo bug) happens makes sense too.
20131205 15:29:26< gfgtdf> mattsc: this one is not te undo bug
20131205 15:29:54< mattsc> I know.  But yesterday you provided an explanation why the undo bug happens in debug mode as well.
20131205 15:31:28< gfgtdf> mattsc: ah yes, to disallow undo we could just remove the "if" in https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/blob/master/src/actions/create.cpp#L952
20131205 15:33:20< mattsc> gfgtdf: hold on to that thought for a moment.  First:
20131205 15:34:43< mattsc> I tested your change both in an MP game and in the first scenario of HttT (in both cases I could get an OOS for the recruit/save/load thing previously) and they both seem to work now.  Well done!
20131205 15:35:19< mattsc> Let me test another thing quickly.  There's another replay bug which might be related (although I don't think so)
20131205 15:35:36< gfgtdf> mattsc: which bug do you mean ?
20131205 15:38:20< mattsc> No, that one (I'll describe it in a moment) is not fixed yet, which is what I expected since it's been around since at least 1.10
20131205 15:39:27< mattsc> Do this: start a scenario, play a couple turns, save a replay, go a turn or two into it.  Then save the game from there, load that save.  Play a couple more turns and save another replay.  That replay will also be corrupt (and is so in 1.10.7 as well)
20131205 15:41:02< mattsc> gfgtdf: as for the undo bug, couldn't we leave the "undoability" of such recruits and just check whether the removed action was a checksum, and if so, remove the previous one as well?
20131205 15:42:22< mattsc> Well, that would fix that bug, but I guess it would still keep the OOS error that is likely introduced by syncing names and genders.
20131205 15:42:38< gfgtdf> mattsc: ye
20131205 15:43:01< mattsc> Which reminds me, I haven't tested that yet since it was overshadowed by the debug-undo bug.  But since I now know how to work around it, let me try that quickly.
20131205 15:44:15< gfgtdf> mattsc: i think you cannot strt the game in debug mode if you want to test that.
20131205 15:44:36< mattsc> yes, that's what I am doing (not using debug mode)
20131205 15:46:49< mattsc> gfgtdf: yes, that does indeed cause OOS errors.
20131205 15:47:50< mattsc> gfgtdf: so we should remove the possibility to undo for recruiting for units that have names and more than one gender.
20131205 15:49:38< mattsc> gfgtdf: I'll be offline for ~30min
20131205 15:50:00< gfgtdf> mattsc: i think there is a third option to create synced random that can be undone: using unsaynced random inside mp_sync::user_choice, that would require undoing the user coice aswell when undoing a the recuit.
20131205 15:51:15< mattsc> gfgtdf: sure, if you want to do that.
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20131205 16:15:47< AI0867> gfgtdf: you can --amend commit messages if you haven't pushed them yet
20131205 16:16:12< gfgtdf> AI0867: i made them with the github web interface
20131205 16:16:21< AI0867> ah
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20131205 16:32:22< Soliton> how's that a sane idea?
20131205 16:37:07-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20131205 16:44:10< mattsc> Soliton: which one?
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20131205 17:04:44< Soliton> committing from a web interface.
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20131205 17:52:25< AI0867> shadowm: any particular reason why game_config::test_version is an std::string?
20131205 17:53:13< AI0867> it's used only for comparison to version_info objects, in which case I believe a new version_info object is constructed on the fly
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20131205 18:17:42< AI0867> fabi_: if hotkey_preferences_dialog::process_event is called with tab_ == SCOPE_COUNT, then on line 459, NULL will be dereferenced
20131205 18:20:24< fabi_> AI0867: Do you have that problem?
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20131205 18:23:21< AI0867> fabi_: no, but coverity pointed it out
20131205 18:23:50< fabi_> Thank you. I will put an assert(false) somewhere
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20131205 18:36:21< gfgtdf> Soliton: why should it be a bad idea? i the chanches of forgetting something aren't higher than on normal commits. You cannot do complicated commits with that anyway becaus it doesn't allow you to change more than one file in one commit.
20131205 18:37:01< gfgtdf> mattsc: ye i would like to change that but it could take a lot of time.
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20131205 18:43:56< gfgtdf> does anyone knows why we do in %32768 in https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/blob/master/src/random.cpp#L267   ?
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20131205 18:44:34< AI0867> lop off the top bit?
20131205 18:45:11< AI0867> I think there was some issue with it containing less entropy
20131205 18:45:28< AI0867> but I'm not an expert on that
20131205 18:46:46< irker852> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth-old:master a7b99d3d8320 / src/ (game_config.cpp game_config.hpp): Make game_config::test_version a version_info object http://git.io/VPuUGA
20131205 18:46:48< irker852> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth-old:master 62b17ea33ff1 / src/game_config.cpp: Assert that the game_config-provided version_info objects are good http://git.io/uRqOZw
20131205 18:46:50< irker852> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth-old:master 416ab3c2810f / src/savegame.cpp: Check if the save_version is sane before comparing with it http://git.io/pCFboQ
20131205 18:46:52< irker852> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth-old:master 6a1e4bc09b18 / src/actions/create.cpp: Merge branch 'master' of github.com:wesnoth/wesnoth-old http://git.io/4jfvKQ
20131205 18:50:26< gfgtdf> AI0867: you know who is an expert at that ?
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20131205 18:55:19< AI0867> gfgtdf: I don't know if we have one =P
20131205 18:55:30< AI0867> but check the history of the code
20131205 18:55:37< AI0867> whoever committed it might have an idea
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20131205 19:02:33< gfgtdf> AI0867: someone named Mark de Wever made it in: 06d19f9a4f82bf9f00eca8d9b438d8f4e3ff8829
20131205 19:12:39< AI0867> that's mordante
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20131205 19:16:18< gfgtdf> 	AI0867: ah ok
20131205 19:20:51< gfgtdf> wesbot: seen mordante
20131205 19:20:51< wesbot> gfgtdf: The person with the nick mordante last spoke 59d 22h ago.  59d 22h ago was here and on the channel #wesnoth-de with the message: Quit: Leaving
20131205 19:21:14< gfgtdf> wesbot: seen mordante
20131205 19:23:51< gfgtdf> wesbot: seen mordante
20131205 19:28:04< gfgtdf> wesbot doesnt like me. :( 
20131205 19:28:26< gfgtdf> AI0867: has mordante another irc nick ?
20131205 19:28:51< mattsc> gfgtdf: wesbot replied the first time you asked
20131205 19:29:25< gfgtdf> mattsc: so its normal that he doesn't answer the second time ?
20131205 19:29:49< mattsc> I don't know.  But why do you need the same reply twice?
20131205 19:30:14< gfgtdf> i thought that i maybe made a typo the first time.
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20131205 20:19:49< fabi_> hi LordBob_
20131205 20:20:21< LordBob_> good evening fabi_ , it's been a while :)
20131205 20:20:39< fabi_> Yes, a little.
20131205 20:20:50< fabi_> Let's start work, shall we?
20131205 20:21:35< LordBob_> Sure. Let me grab the list you'd sent
20131205 20:21:54< fabi_> Are you still able to compile your own binary?
20131205 20:25:02< LordBob_> I haven't tried for a while. Give me a minute to update my repo and I'll tell you if it still works
20131205 20:25:37< LordBob_> (but yeah, I'm totally rusty on this after a few months' worth of break ^^;;
20131205 20:26:19< fabi_> LordBob_: Do you remember when we talked about a different, semantic minimap mode?
20131205 20:27:01< LordBob_> Yup. That was pretty much the lat thing we did before I dropped off of the Internet
20131205 20:27:07< LordBob_> *last
20131205 20:27:29< fabi_> Nice
20131205 20:27:41< fabi_> It is part of the game since 2 days.
20131205 20:28:03< fabi_> Using the colors you defined for the terrain icons.
20131205 20:28:30< LordBob_> Wow
20131205 20:28:42< fabi_> People claim it to be ugly.
20131205 20:29:01< fabi_> But I bet there can be something done by tuning the colors a little.
20131205 20:29:22< LordBob_> You mean part of the current main theme, or part of our experimental Unit Box theme ?
20131205 20:29:42< fabi_> That is whereever the minimap code is used.
20131205 20:29:57< fabi_> Everywhere.
20131205 20:30:02< LordBob_> On a side note, I last updated my repo in late august. this might take a while...
20131205 20:30:49< LordBob_> Anyway, I'm impressed :)
20131205 20:31:05< Ivanovic> LordBob_: do you plan coming to fosdem?
20131205 20:31:10< LordBob_> Did you find a way around the resizing problem that was preventing the use of icons ?
20131205 20:31:13< shadowm> AI0867: It's not really a proper version string, that's why I didn't convert it.
20131205 20:31:46< LordBob_> Ivanovic: yup, looks like I will
20131205 20:32:56< LordBob_> Ivanovic: got a program of sorts written somewhere ? I'd be curious to know what subjects are usually up at those events
20131205 20:33:02< fabi_> LordBob_: Well, I just fill the color. In case of mixed terrains the color gets mixed as well.
20131205 20:33:10< Ivanovic> LordBob_: there is no talk program yet
20131205 20:33:19< Ivanovic> that is: there will be the games devroom on saturday
20131205 20:33:26< Ivanovic> but i still need to define the list of talks
20131205 20:34:00< fabi_> LordBob_: That way I do not need the icons to symbolize overlay terrain.
20131205 20:34:02< LordBob_> fabi_: so in the end, how did you manage villages ?
20131205 20:34:14< AI0867> shadowm: yeah, but it's only ever used as one nonetheless
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20131205 20:34:47< fabi_> LordBob_: Like units I draw small rectangles. Just a little smaller than the unit ones.
20131205 20:34:56< Ivanovic> LordBob_: to give you an idea what we did in the wesnoth hacking room, here is the stuff from 2012: http://wiki.wesnoth.org/Fosdem2012
20131205 20:36:28< irker852> wesnoth: anonymissimus wesnoth-old:master d1d045a416d5 / projectfiles/CodeBlocks/wesnoth.cbp: cb project update http://git.io/ablVQQ
20131205 20:36:30< irker852> wesnoth: anonymissimus wesnoth-old:master 32fee2b4479f / projectfiles/VC9/wesnoth.vcproj: vc project update http://git.io/pbwG2g
20131205 20:37:28< LordBob_> Hmm...This is all rather technical and/or gameplay stuff ; not much to say for artist types :s
20131205 20:41:28< LordBob_> fabi_: ok, "only" 1.2k commits to catch up and I'll be able to get the game running again
20131205 20:44:22< shadowm> The object count isn't really a 1:1 match to the commit count.
20131205 20:45:22< LordBob_> oh well, you know how proficient I am with technical things ^^;;
20131205 20:45:44< shadowm> I don't really know what it actually means either.
20131205 20:45:44< LordBob_> anyway, it went faster than I expected ; pull's over
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20131205 20:47:32< irker852> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master 5e82305bc0ff / src/tests/utils/game_config_manager.hpp: Spelling fix http://git.io/jmBYCQ
20131205 20:47:34< irker852> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master 3464f9946987 / src/ (image.cpp image.hpp): Added cache for highlighted minimap images. http://git.io/XRze_Q
20131205 20:47:37< irker852> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master 5afac25dd8b7 / src/ (minimap.cpp minimap.hpp): Support for drawing highlighted regions. http://git.io/IHu8ng
20131205 20:47:38< irker852> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master c31a065340f7 / src/ (display.cpp display.hpp game_display.cpp game_display.hpp): Lifted the reach map data structure from game_display to display. http://git.io/4z89mA
20131205 20:47:40< irker852> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master bd2f9271e51e / src/ (4 files in 2 dirs): Put title screen hotkeys in there own scope. http://git.io/PNcm4Q
20131205 20:47:57< fabi_> LordBob_: ^
20131205 20:48:01< shadowm> fabi_: "their" and "there" are not the same thing.
20131205 20:48:30< LordBob_> pulling them right now
20131205 20:50:48< fabi_> LordBob_: I also did a 800x480 theme for the open pandora thing.
20131205 20:51:20< LordBob_> I saw that in the list ; remind me, what's Open Pandora ?
20131205 20:51:35< fabi_> It is a open version of the playstation portable.
20131205 20:51:38< fabi_> And more.
20131205 20:51:47< fabi_> A small gaming pocket computer.
20131205 20:51:58< LordBob_> oooh, shiny :D
20131205 20:52:11< fabi_> LordBob_: http://boards.openpandora.org/page/homepage.html
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20131205 20:53:25< anonymissimus> fabi_: hi
20131205 20:53:34< fabi_> hi anonymissimus
20131205 20:53:47< shadowm> anonymissimus: How is a new different sound (that'll be the turn bell at first because we don't have a dedicated SFX team anyway) "confusing"?
20131205 20:53:52< anonymissimus> fabi_: okay, so why can't I select any unit ?
20131205 20:54:27< fabi_> anonymissimus: Bind a hotkey to the action.
20131205 20:54:49< fabi_> anonymissimus: Or reset default hotkeys.
20131205 20:55:04< anonymissimus> shadowm: well, its a new sound which you need to know what it means (and tend to think mp players are stupid, on average)
20131205 20:55:58< shadowm> anonymissimus: Re your post in Ideas, whenever I read you I worry that your opinions might be mostly built around the purpose of preserving the status quo.
20131205 20:56:10< shadowm> This thing you just said only helps reinforce that notion.
20131205 20:56:16< fabi_> Left Mouse Button -> "Select/Move/Attack" Right Mouse Button -> "Deselect Hex"
20131205 20:56:30< shadowm> "Players are stupid, let's not change or improve a single thing."
20131205 20:57:51< fabi_> ^ Yeah. No changes please!
20131205 20:58:07< anonymissimus> fabi_: an what if I don't wanna use this new mouse control ?
20131205 20:58:34< fabi_> anonymissimus: I told you the way to restore the old one :-)
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20131205 21:02:03< anonymissimus> fabi_: it doesn't work
20131205 21:02:32< anonymissimus> if I could write "mouse0button1" there, but when I click it doesn't auto-enter it
20131205 21:02:54< anonymissimus> now, I did not want to take part in this testing...I want to use not test
20131205 21:03:48< shadowm> It's hard to not partake in general testing when you are playing a development version, let alone git master.
20131205 21:04:17< anonymissimus> fabi_: okay, now it did; but it seems removing it previously caused the problem
20131205 21:04:36< anonymissimus> "Tastenkürzel entfernen" that is
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20131205 21:06:49< anonymissimus> well, they are shown to be set correctly but I still can't to anything
20131205 21:07:38< anonymissimus> shadowm: as for "preserving status quo", yeah that's probably right
20131205 21:08:10< anonymissimus> as most of the time I hit things that annoy me then (such as not being able to do something atm)
20131205 21:08:35< shadowm> The release announcements are very clear on this matter.
20131205 21:09:57< shadowm> And while it is true that this change shouldn't have landed in master before the hotkey code was fixed, it's also true that 1.11.8 hasn't been released yet and won't be until that is done.
20131205 21:11:11< fabi> anonymissimus: I can't reproduce it.
20131205 21:11:58< fabi> anonymissimus: Both ways of controlling don't work on your system and you discover a bug in the assign dialog?
20131205 21:12:37< anonymissimus> oh well
20131205 21:12:53< anonymissimus> okay, firstly, I think I discovered one in the hotkey dialog, yes
20131205 21:13:22< anonymissimus> that is, if I click the button mentioned above, I can't reassign a hotkey
20131205 21:14:17< anonymissimus> I click "Tastenkürzel entfernen" for Move/Attack and then cant reassign Mouse0Button1 to it
20131205 21:14:23< shadowm> fabi: The Load Game hotkey (ctrl+o, yes, it _is_ assigned) isn't working on the titlescreen anymore (it does on 1.11.7).
20131205 21:14:40< anonymissimus> If I don't remove previously however, and let them swap, it works
20131205 21:15:13< fabi> anonymissimus: Okay, so the controls work, but the clear hotkey is a deal breaker?
20131205 21:15:30< anonymissimus> fabi: no, the controls also don't work
20131205 21:15:34< anonymissimus> (2. bug)
20131205 21:16:48< anonymissimus> fabi: so, I have Move/Attack on Mouse0Button1 and Select Hex on Mouse0Button3 but left button doesn't select
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20131205 21:17:19< fabi> Oh
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20131205 21:17:22< anonymissimus> if i right-click on a hex and then left click a unit it moves to that hex...
20131205 21:17:29< fabi> rofl
20131205 21:18:02< fabi> "Select/Move/Attack" --> Left
20131205 21:18:10< fabi> "Deselect" --> right
20131205 21:18:56< anonymissimus> ?
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20131205 21:19:11< anonymissimus> fabi: explain
20131205 21:19:34< fabi> You want to restore the old behavior.
20131205 21:19:48< fabi> And that is the binding to do so.
20131205 21:20:09< fabi> Left mouse button is for select move and attack.
20131205 21:20:16< fabi> The right is just for deselecting.
20131205 21:22:48< anonymissimus> fabi: okay, seems to work now
20131205 21:23:17< anonymissimus> fabi: however, I strongly suggest you should put an explanation somewhere about how to restore the old behavior
20131205 21:24:34< shadowm> It's considered a bug atm. Users aren't supposed to do this by hand.
20131205 21:25:12< anonymissimus> fabi: and for non-developers (or rather for everyone not working with the game UI interface) it's not clear what "deselect hex" and such actually refer to
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20131205 21:26:27< LordBob_> fabi: ok, the game is up and running at last. Compilation went smoothly, we can begin to do actual work
20131205 21:26:35< anonymissimus> and as shadowm claims I only defend the status quo, I know quite a number of games, and it seems basically sensible to adept to the common way of mouse controls yes
20131205 21:27:48< fabi> LordBob_: Okay, let's use resolutions > 1024x768.
20131205 21:28:06< fabi> LordBob_: The small ones are broken from time to time, I will take care of them last.
20131205 21:28:46< LordBob_> Okay. I'm running in 1600*1200 here
20131205 21:30:21< LordBob_> fabi: he first thing that should need fixing, I guess, is the crown / gem display bug
20131205 21:30:32< fabi> LordBob_: yes
20131205 21:30:38< anonymissimus> and about defending status quo, player reaction to this mouse control change will be much worse than mine xD
20131205 21:30:49< shadowm> anonymissimus: I do not just claim so. You basically confirmed my suspicion yourself.
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20131205 21:31:57< shadowm> I have no idea what the new bindings are supposed to be, to be honest, because I restored the previous ones right away.
20131205 21:32:03< mattsc> fabi: I get a whole bunch of warnings of this type now:  http://pastebin.com/23zp5g21
20131205 21:32:29< mattsc> fabi: since you say you treat warnings as errors, do you not get those?
20131205 21:32:37< shadowm> They make sense to me and I don't need anything different for this game I've been playing for 7 years.
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20131205 21:34:54< travis-ci> [travis-ci] wesnoth/wesnoth-old#1097 (master - bd2f927 : fendrin): The build has errored.
20131205 21:34:54< travis-ci> [travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/builds/15004933
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20131205 21:35:22< fabi> mattsc: travis does not like it as well.
20131205 21:35:53< mattsc> fabi: no, the build errored, it did not fail.  There's an important difference. :)
20131205 21:36:29< mattsc> I learned that by getting all upset about it once ...
20131205 21:37:31< anonymissimus> shadowm: says the one accusing me of defending the status quo
20131205 21:38:10< fabi> mattsc: No, I don't get the warnings here.
20131205 21:38:31< shadowm> The basics are a completely different thing.
20131205 21:38:37< shadowm> For me, changing the way players interact with the core of the game (the game map) isn't much different from changing the game rules (which is forbidden territory).
20131205 21:38:42< mattsc> fabi: hmm, that seems to be one of those clang vs. gcc things  :(
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20131205 21:39:26< mattsc> fabi: does gcc have a -Wmismatched-tags flag?
20131205 21:40:06< mattsc> Well, I assume it would be enabled by -Wall if it did check for that ...
20131205 21:41:00< fabi> I don't know.
20131205 21:41:50< mattsc> I get 8 total of those warnings now, in 8 different files.
20131205 21:45:24< fabi> mattsc: Well, your compiler is right: map_location is in fact a struct.
20131205 21:45:40< fabi> I guess just changing the keywords will solve the problem and save the day.
20131205 21:45:53< mattsc> :)
20131205 21:46:17< mattsc> (that's a comment on the saving the day bit, not about being right)
20131205 21:46:30< shadowm> mattsc: What clang version are you running?
20131205 21:46:45< irker852> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth-old:master f6e19fa36463 / src/minimap.hpp: Changed a wrong keyword spotted by mattsc's brave compiler. http://git.io/sSP8RQ
20131205 21:47:04< shadowm> "Brave"?
20131205 21:47:38 * anonymissimus goes listening to some Status Quo
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20131205 21:47:53< mattsc> shadowm: umm, I'm using LLVM 5.0, which I understand is a front end to clang, but I don't know which version.  I'm sure there's a way of figuring that out...
20131205 21:48:10< shadowm> Oh, some person added -Wno-mismatched-tags to the cmake recipe.
20131205 21:48:20< shadowm> mattsc: No, clang is a front-end to llvm.
20131205 21:48:37< mattsc> shadowm: oh.  Opps.  Shows you how much I know ...
20131205 21:48:44< mattsc> *Oops
20131205 21:49:30< shadowm> The cmake recipe is getting on my nerves. It's so horribly broken.
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20131205 21:49:41< mattsc> shadowm: In that case, I am using Xcode 5.0.2 which uses LLVM 5.0 ...
20131205 21:50:10< shadowm> It keeps readding -Wno-mismatched-tags to CMAKE_CXX_FLAGS.
20131205 21:53:52< fabi> LordBob_: How do you fix the orb problem?
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20131205 21:55:48< mattsc> fabi: confirming that the warning is gone.  Thanks.
20131205 21:56:06< fabi> :-)
20131205 21:56:35< fabi> mattsc: By the way, did you change to the new control method?
20131205 22:00:00< mattsc> fabi: no, not yet.  I've done essentially no ingame testing that involved actually moving units in the last week or two, so there's been no point to do so yet.  Let me switch now, or I'll just forget.
20131205 22:03:03< mattsc> fabi: while doing that, I see that there is no "load game" hotkey option in the new title screen section, which might explain what shadowm said earlier (which I can confirm, btw)
20131205 22:03:36< fabi> load game should be in general
20131205 22:04:48< LordBob_> fabi: I'm looking at it right now, but it's frustrating because there really isn't a 'good' solution 
20131205 22:05:25< fabi> We can move the end of the bar down a little.
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20131205 22:06:46< LordBob_> Not much, I think : with units that have a lot of HP/XP/MP, it's the bars that will overlap the neighbouring hex.
20131205 22:08:10< justinzane_> LLVM5?
20131205 22:08:33< LordBob_> We'd need to gain at least 7 rows if we were to fit even the smallest crown + orb inside the hex
20131205 22:08:50< fabi> Why did it work before?
20131205 22:09:14< mattsc> fabi: well, in that case that hotkey only works in the game, not in the title screen as it used to be.
20131205 22:09:17< justinzane_> as far as I know llvm and its associated tools are released together, with current being v3.3 and 3.4 scheduled for release at the end of the month.
20131205 22:09:22< shadowm> mattsc, fabi: Yeah, it's in General, assigned to ctrl+o. It doesn't work anymore.
20131205 22:09:45< justinzane_> I just built LLVM and Clang from their SVN last night, at it 3.4
20131205 22:09:46< shadowm> This is a big thing because IIRC the conversion of the titlescreen to GUI2 in 1.9.x was precisely meant to make these hotkeys work.
20131205 22:10:22< justinzane_> fabi: have you looked at SDL2 lately?
20131205 22:10:36< fabi> justinzane_: No.
20131205 22:10:43< fabi> justinzane_: Are there any news?
20131205 22:10:50< mattsc> shadowm: actually, cmd+o now works for me both in game and in the title screen again.  I just hit a "restore defaults" though, maybe that is the reason.  It did only work in game half an hour ago.
20131205 22:11:41< shadowm> Ivanovic: You are the only cmake person I know of who is currently around. I sent a message to the mailing list regarding a couple of problems I've found with it.
20131205 22:11:55< justinzane_> Not really. Just finished experimenting with CIELab space conversions. Checking out my SDL2 branch again now.
20131205 22:12:37< Ivanovic> shadowm: when did you sent that message?
20131205 22:12:42< shadowm> Ivanovic: Now.
20131205 22:13:05< Ivanovic> okay, it was in my spambox...
20131205 22:13:50< mattsc> justinzane_: http://imagebin.org/280776
20131205 22:14:11< shadowm> justinzane_: May I know what this mysterious CIELab thing that's occasionally mentioned in here is about?
20131205 22:14:48< shadowm> (Yes, it's a color space. I know that. That's not what I'm asking.)
20131205 22:14:55< justinzane_> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lab_color_space
20131205 22:15:01< fabi> LordBob_: Why did it work before? Were the old crowns and orbs that much smaller?
20131205 22:15:23< justinzane_> shadowm: It is just another colorspace, like CMYK, RGB, Yuv, Yiq, etc.
20131205 22:15:30< shadowm> justinzane_: Did you read the part in parentheses?
20131205 22:15:42< LordBob_> fabi: I think that was because the crowns were smaller, and offset to the right compared to the new ones
20131205 22:15:51< shadowm> ¬_¬
20131205 22:15:59< Ivanovic> shadowm: uhm, no idea, really...
20131205 22:16:11< LordBob_> Problem is, if we do offset them again, I'm not sure that they won't overlap a unit :/
20131205 22:16:14< Ivanovic> sorry, i will need some sleep before i can think about anything
20131205 22:16:32< shadowm> Ivanovic: Sure.
20131205 22:16:40< justinzane_> It was developed to very closely match human visual perception, so while it is a computational pain, it means that things like changing hue do not great changes in relative brightness.
20131205 22:18:13< justinzane_> The reason I got interested, shadowm, was that in scenarios with more that 3 teams, the colors for the teams were greatly mismatched in "visibility". I wanted to provide a framework for allowing team colors to be perceptually the same brightness and saturation while allowing as many hues as necessary for the scenario.
20131205 22:18:27< shadowm> I guess I'm not too familiarized with it because the software I use for drawing pixel art only supports RGBA and HS[LV], but what I actually want to know is --
20131205 22:19:13< shadowm> justinzane_: I find the team colors thing to be more complex than the color choice.
20131205 22:19:28< justinzane_> Right.
20131205 22:19:46< justinzane_> That is why Lab color routines, not just a Lab color picker.
20131205 22:20:49< shadowm> Is this intended to adapt to the different terrains a unit may be standing on? Because that's the primary issue with team colors right now.
20131205 22:20:53< justinzane_> It also matters for more complex things like illuminating uints, darkening units, halos, etc.
20131205 22:21:21< shadowm> I.e. the brown team color is barely visible against di[D[Drt, but it's clear against snow, etc.
20131205 22:21:27< justinzane_> Not specifically, it is intended as a replacement for RGB space color manipilations generally.
20131205 22:23:07< justinzane_> That means that whatever terrain "brightness" "hue" and "sat" were originally created should stay more consistent as "effects" are composed onto them.
20131205 22:23:51< shadowm> Relatedly, we've been wanting HSL or HSV transforms for a while for things such as ToD lighting (which currently uses a simple RGB shift) or image path function-based manipulations in general. So you are saying Lab would be a suitable alternative?
20131205 22:25:51< shadowm> For images that have to be first rendered on the fly before they may enter the image cache, I guess computational complexity may be a concern regardless of the colro space choice.
20131205 22:27:28< LordBob_> fabi: I've compared the new crowns with the old ones, and indeed the problem is their size. The old crown fitted inside the hex because it was a whopping 5 pixels shorter, and pyramidal in shape
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20131205 22:28:40< justinzane_> shadowm: That is my goal. I started writing HSV, but it does not help with maintaining perceptually similar brightness and saturation when rolling the hue around.
20131205 22:28:57< LordBob_> fabi: maybe the bast solution is to just forget about fancy crowns and just replace everything with the old one, on which we apply the new color scheme as a facelift?
20131205 22:29:02< LordBob_> *best
20131205 22:29:10< justinzane_> Since I often work in L*a*b* when editing my photos, I decided to make it work here.
20131205 22:29:48< fabi> LordBob_: Yes, I am fine with that solution.
20131205 22:30:07< justinzane_> shadowm: the biggest issue with using a perceptual space like Lab is that some transforms yield out of gamut colors, which means that the number of trips between R
20131205 22:30:42< justinzane_> oops... RGB and Lab need to be minimized. That was why I was asking about the image cache yeaterday.
20131205 22:30:45< LordBob_> It's  frustrating, but I guess it's the least troublesome choice out there
20131205 22:32:03< justinzane_> shadowm: I've written and done basic testing on both HSV and Lab transforms that work with SDL/SDL2 surfaces. I'm trying to add them to sdl_utils and see how they look
20131205 22:32:15< shadowm> LordBob_, fabi: Why isn't fixing/changing the crown rendering an option?
20131205 22:33:10< shadowm> It seems to me like all that's really needed is to have it follow similar rules to unit animations (inc. standing animtions).
20131205 22:34:02< fabi> shadowm: I did not manage to fix it. boucman advised us to better stay within the hex field.
20131205 22:34:26< shadowm> Some performance concern?
20131205 22:34:37< fabi> Yes.
20131205 22:34:48< fabi> But I don't know if that really is a problem.
20131205 22:34:50< shadowm> Well, that's a pity. I love the new crowns. :\
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20131205 22:34:52< travis-ci> [travis-ci] wesnoth/wesnoth-old#1101 (master - f6e19fa : fendrin): The build passed.
20131205 22:34:52< travis-ci> [travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/builds/15008264
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20131205 22:35:09< fabi> shadowm: If you find a way to fix it, please do so. 
20131205 22:35:35< shadowm> Yeah, well, I do not know much about the rendering code other than the fact that it exists.
20131205 22:36:02< fabi> We will keep the new crowns around.
20131205 22:36:22< fabi> Maybe they can be put in use during the next development cycle.
20131205 22:37:06< LordBob_> Yeah, it would be nice. :)
20131205 22:45:50< fabi> LordBob_: What do think about the new minimap features?
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20131205 22:50:27< shadowm> fabi: The minimap options' tooltips are derived from hotkey menu entries?
20131205 22:51:23< fabi> ?
20131205 22:52:02< LordBob_> fabi: you're right in saying that the colors are confusing. Roads appear green amidst the desert, for example
20131205 22:52:15< shadowm> fabi_: I'm asking whether the minimap options' tooltips are derived from hotkey menu entry labels.
20131205 22:53:13< LordBob_> there might also be a new kind of problem caused by the reduced contrast between units and the background
20131205 22:53:23< fabi> they are part of the hotkey_command struct.
20131205 22:53:43< shadowm> fabi: kay. There are two options whose labels aren't in Title Case.
20131205 22:54:57< fabi> LordBob_: Indeed. Units and terrain are too similar.
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20131205 22:57:33< LordBob_> fabi: I don't know if there exists such a function, but maybe adding a 1 pixel stroke of either a dark or light color around the units would make them stand out
20131205 22:58:57< shadowm> draw_rectangle().
20131205 22:58:59< fabi> LordBob_: Can't we adjust the terrain type colors to be nicer and provide a better contrast?
20131205 23:00:06< LordBob_> we could, but then this might in turn mess up the readability of the terrain type icons
20131205 23:00:18< LordBob_> Still, it's worth a shot.
20131205 23:01:13< fabi> LordBob_: The mixed color terrains are also a problem. Currently shallow_water and flat looks very similar to swamp when mixed.
20131205 23:03:35< LordBob_> Oh wait ; maybe it wouldn't be so much of a problem. I see in team_colors.cfg that we can define a specific color for minimap markers
20131205 23:04:11< LordBob_> So we can have both a nice icon and a readable map marker for terrain types :)
20131205 23:04:15-!- exciton [chuck-the-@89.208.169.104] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20131205 23:04:57< LordBob_> As for the mix, how does it work exactly ?
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20131205 23:05:35< fabi> Well, I searched for a function that gives similar results to when you mix colors in a palette.
20131205 23:05:46< fabi> Like blue + yellow = green
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20131205 23:07:19< shadowm> What's leader-crown-alt.png for?
20131205 23:07:36< fabi> LordBob_: I take the low() for fogged terrain, the mid() for normal terrain and max() for highlighted terrain.
20131205 23:16:06< LordBob_> fabi: don't we do fog with just an overlay of transparent black/grey ?
20131205 23:17:11< shadowm> OK why does the ellipse rendering code use snprintf of all things?
20131205 23:17:37< LordBob_> besides, using those colors isn't a good thing, because they're not necessarily the same hue and / or relative brightness, being tailored for the icon backgrounds
20131205 23:17:51< shadowm> It effectively imposes a 99 bytes (not characters!) limit on the full ellipse image path, functions included.
20131205 23:18:31< shadowm> unit.cpp line 2018 onwards.
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20131205 23:19:50< LordBob_> shadowm: I seem to remember that this alternate crown is used by a rare few scenarios, however I'm not sure what for
20131205 23:21:07< gfgtdf> mattsc: online?
20131205 23:22:11< shadowm> This code is from _at least_ March 2006. Somehow I doubt snprintf was chosen to address performance concerns.
20131205 23:23:47< shadowm> Of course it was introduced by a "merge with trunk" commit by Xan, which doesn't really tell me exactly where it came from.
20131205 23:24:06< mattsc> gfgtdf: yes, but only for a ~15 more minutes
20131205 23:25:08< gfgtdf> mattsc: enough time to test a bugfix ?
20131205 23:25:22< mattsc> gfgtdf: possibly.  Let's try
20131205 23:26:18< irker852> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth-old:master 88d214a934e0 / src/replay.cpp: fix an oos error. http://git.io/RPY2mA
20131205 23:26:29< gfgtdf> mattsc: ^
20131205 23:27:15< gfgtdf> mattsc: could fix teh double wose problem.
20131205 23:27:18< irker852> wesnoth: Emilien Rotival wesnoth-old:master 4fcf6d0d9595 / / (6 files in 2 dirs): Updated and nudged the orb and crowns so that they fit within the hex http://git.io/5BrFTA
20131205 23:27:20< irker852> wesnoth: Emilien Rotival wesnoth-old:master d0af7d7bde45 / src/ (minimap.hpp replay.cpp): Merge branch 'master' of https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth-old http://git.io/MNpJ5A
20131205 23:27:37< mattsc> gfgtdf: okay, it's compiled.  let me test.
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20131205 23:28:36< mattsc> gfgtdf: I need to start Wesnoth in debug mode from the CL for testing this, right?
20131205 23:28:50< gfgtdf> yes
20131205 23:30:43< mattsc> gfgtdf: okay, the double wose problem is gone
20131205 23:31:12< mattsc> Is there any other specific test you want me to do?  I don't have time to play around with random tests right now.
20131205 23:32:21< gfgtdf> mattsc: no there isn't. What is 'right now' ?
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20131205 23:33:41< mattsc> gfgtdf: don't know yet, but I need to leave shortly and won't be back for at least 2 hours.  I assume that you'll be gone by then?
20131205 23:33:50< gfgtdf> ye
20131205 23:33:53< LordBob_> fabi: crowns & orb are done, there shouldn't be a problem with them anymore. Should be look into the minimap terrain colors next, or is there something more pressing that you would have me do ?
20131205 23:34:16< shadowm> Well, at first glance it seems unit animation frames and unit bars (which include the icon overlays) use the exact same code path to get rendered.
20131205 23:34:28< fabi> LordBob_: no, minimap colors is a good next
20131205 23:34:32< mattsc> gfgtdf: I like the method you used to solve this, but could you add some punctuation to the comment please?  It's really hard to parse.
20131205 23:34:56< gfgtdf> mattsc: the commit message ot teh comment in code?
20131205 23:35:13< LordBob_> Good. Although "next" will be tomorrow or the day after, because right now I'm set on a collision course with my pillow.
20131205 23:35:14< mattsc> The comment in l.637.
20131205 23:35:41< mattsc> Also, especially is spelled with two l (but that's easy to understand the way it is  :) )
20131205 23:36:06< shadowm> ... which is weird because you need to render the bars on top of the animation frame, which breaches the hex mask all the time.
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20131205 23:37:52< shadowm> Maybe multi-hex unit animation frames are refreshed for other hexes without refreshing their origin hex?
20131205 23:38:08< mattsc> gfgtdf: before I run off, are you going to work on the OOS problem caused by syncing names and genders as well?  (no rush, I just want to know whether I should think about it, in which case it's not going to happen for a while)
20131205 23:38:31< fabi> LordBob_: Good Night :-)
20131205 23:38:38< gfgtdf> mattsc: ye im thinking about it.
20131205 23:39:17< mattsc> gfgtdf: thanks for working on all this, and sorry for always rushing out on you.  Or scheduled aren't very well aligned at the moment...
20131205 23:40:04< shadowm> Hm, right, that's exactly what happens. It searches for overlapping hexes that'd need to be invalidated and invalidates them. But this is within the animation framework. Bars and overlays are not part of it.
20131205 23:42:05< shadowm> I have an idea about how to go about this but I'm unsure I might implement it since it seems to involve numbers.
20131205 23:43:27< shadowm> So in the meantime I'll lift the ellipse path restriction.
20131205 23:44:52< gfgtdf> mattsc: did you discover any serious drawbacks of storing teh underlying_id in replays ?
20131205 23:46:51< mattsc> gfgtdf: I'm not sure I understand the question.  I haven't done anything with under_lying ids in replays and haven't seriously thought about it.  I guess it's mentioned in that bug report, but I haven't done anything about it.
20131205 23:47:21< mattsc> shadowm: numbers are fun - but right now I have to go...  :(
20131205 23:48:23< mattsc> should I check back in with you later?
20131205 23:48:45< shadowm> Nah, I haven't even decided on a schedule for this yet.
20131205 23:48:55-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20131205 23:51:07< mattsc> okay - well, talk to you all later
20131205 23:51:11-!- mattsc [~mattsc@154.20.32.246] has quit [Quit: Ciao]
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20131205 23:57:24< gfgtdf> mattsc: about syncing unit names: can you rely of unit names beeing the same on all languages?
20131205 23:59:17< shadowm> > 20131205 20:58:45 error display: could not open image 'This_Is_An_Incredibly_Long_File_Name_That_Has_A_Lot_Of_Characters_And_Because_Of_This_A_Word_Is_Goi'
20131205 23:59:24< shadowm> Just as expected.
--- Log closed Fri Dec 06 00:00:23 2013