--- Log opened Sat Feb 08 00:00:59 2014
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20140208 00:11:30< EliDupree> Hmm... is there any way for scripts to remove or override an idle animation?
20140208 00:11:32-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20140208 00:15:33< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: you should be able to add or delete animations
20140208 00:15:43< EliDupree> How do I delete animations?
20140208 00:15:55< Coffee_irc> wel... let me do some quick research
20140208 00:15:59< EliDupree> TO add animations I use [effect] apply_to=new_animation
20140208 00:17:13< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: whilst not the most convenient, you could potentially store the unit into a variable and delete the corresponding keys for the idle animation
20140208 00:17:33< EliDupree> THat would be convenient, but the animation is not in the unit table.
20140208 00:17:44< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: but I think what you want might be to extend the unit_type to a new unit
20140208 00:17:47< EliDupree> No animations are.
20140208 00:18:03< EliDupree> Then my era'd require download
20140208 00:18:08< Coffee_irc> yes
20140208 00:18:36< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: you could add a new idle animation over the top with a higher match rating
20140208 00:18:43< Coffee_irc> with the base unit image as default
20140208 00:18:58< EliDupree> Oh, separate idle animations don't play separately?
20140208 00:19:02< EliDupree> cool
20140208 00:19:18< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: if they match the same, then it is chosen randomly from that pool
20140208 00:19:27< EliDupree> I can't seem to test it... no idle animations are playing for me, and I've checked my settings
20140208 00:19:47< Coffee_irc> but there is a base_score that you can set that would give a static one priority and be always chosen
20140208 00:20:02< Coffee_irc> see http://wiki.wesnoth.org/AnimationWML#Generic_animation_filters_available_for_all_animations
20140208 00:20:30< EliDupree> yeah, I know it well
20140208 00:20:44< Coffee_irc> so you would add a new idle animation with the default unit image and use base_score to make it always have priority over the moving idle animation
20140208 00:20:46< EliDupree> I'm writing some really complex code that manipulates animations
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20140208 00:21:45< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: cool. I helped get the new animationWML syntax going since 1.11.4 that I hope you find useful
20140208 00:22:13< EliDupree> Actually the 1.11 progressive syntax is cauisng me trouble :p
20140208 00:22:26< Coffee_irc> how so?
20140208 00:22:28< EliDupree> This code modifies existing animations, and that makes there be a lot more cases to handle.
20140208 00:22:44< EliDupree> Especially given that I don't see any documentation for it beyond a few examples.
20140208 00:23:14< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: it's really just a shorthand for the old syntax
20140208 00:23:31< Coffee_irc> so you don't need as many frame declarations
20140208 00:23:32< EliDupree> That doesn't help  me write code that can process it accurately
20140208 00:23:51< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: what is it you are doing?
20140208 00:24:44< EliDupree> for instance, putting a black halo around a unit by copying and scaling its image and blitting it under the original, for every frame
20140208 00:24:58< EliDupree> a lot of modifications like that which go beyond what image_mods can do
20140208 00:25:20< EliDupree> Which means that I make higher-scoring copies of every animation with each frame's image replaced with a composite
20140208 00:26:22< Coffee_irc> then the new syntax should help with that
20140208 00:26:23< EliDupree> To do that in 1.11 I'll basically  need to replicate the whole behavior of the 160-line square_parenthetical_split function
20140208 00:26:37< Coffee_irc> not really
20140208 00:26:46< EliDupree> How not?
20140208 00:26:55< Coffee_irc> you just look for .png
20140208 00:27:03< Coffee_irc> and insert after the image mods
20140208 00:27:16< EliDupree> But I need to know the base image string
20140208 00:27:22< Coffee_irc> why?
20140208 00:27:25< EliDupree> The mods are not simply inserted after
20140208 00:27:36< EliDupree> Notice how I said "blit under"?
20140208 00:27:50< EliDupree> That's not an image mod, that's me replacing the base image and then blitting the original onto it
20140208 00:27:58< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: sure it is
20140208 00:28:19< EliDupree> If it is, then tell me the syntax, it would be useful
20140208 00:28:25< EliDupree> but even if so, that is only  an example
20140208 00:28:37< Coffee_irc> you just copy the existing one, make a black copy scaled, and then append the same with a simultaneous frame of other type on top with different layer?
20140208 00:28:51< Coffee_irc> that's how I would do it to keep from going mad :P
20140208 00:28:54< EliDupree> Copy the existing one without knowing its name?
20140208 00:29:15< EliDupree> Oh, the whole frame
20140208 00:29:19< Coffee_irc> all you are doing is image modding all the images aren't you underneath and then overlaying the regular images?
20140208 00:29:35< EliDupree> Like I said, this is a mere example
20140208 00:29:38< Coffee_irc> you just make 2 copies, and place the blackened scaled version on a layer underneath
20140208 00:29:39< EliDupree> Other mods are more complex
20140208 00:29:59< EliDupree> For some, I have a table of individual image names to manually written data about them
20140208 00:30:04< EliDupree> like where their weapon is
20140208 00:30:12< EliDupree> so htat I can make things appear around the weapon
20140208 00:30:24< EliDupree> For that I need the image name
20140208 00:30:55< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: sound like you need a version for every unit!
20140208 00:31:17< EliDupree> Only the units that can have that specific mod on them, which is more limited
20140208 00:31:52< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: you want to be careful. as the base images in default get updated with animations from time to time
20140208 00:32:01< EliDupree> Technically I could just write copies of the animations, but that is more work and more prone to error than auto-copying them and making the data by image
20140208 00:32:13< EliDupree> You mean from version to version?
20140208 00:32:28< Coffee_irc> as the artists draw them and they get accepted, yes
20140208 00:32:30< EliDupree> I can make the required updates when I update my era to a newer version
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20140208 00:33:31< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: on the "down the road" todo list has been to make a particle engine for animations
20140208 00:34:04< Coffee_irc> so that things like adding weapons in space and shimmering, smoke, paths for particles of magic can be done
20140208 00:34:21< EliDupree> Can't those already be done?
20140208 00:34:28< Coffee_irc> just wanted to let you know, although this may take quite some time to be realised fully
20140208 00:34:55< Coffee_irc> well, yes, but as you probably already know it is hard work for advanced effects
20140208 00:35:22< EliDupree> Shrug, I can just write a script to simplify it
20140208 00:35:48< EliDupree> You can't though, because you're using static files with only a macro system? Lua is nice :P
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20140208 00:36:38< Coffee_irc> there's always going to be some limitations on what you can do
20140208 00:36:51< EliDupree> Yeah, including after  you add this new system
20140208 00:38:22< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: in my UMC addon, The Great Quest, I overlay images over units in a way similar to what you are doing I think
20140208 00:38:29< EliDupree> Anyway, I wasn't *trying* to rain on your parade
20140208 00:38:58< Coffee_irc> np, I am interested in your feedback if you are using it
20140208 00:40:05< EliDupree> It's a problem I have with a lot of different wesnoth systems: wesnoth is bloated with a ton of features that all have their own different behaviors
20140208 00:40:24< Coffee_irc> lol, this is true
20140208 00:40:31< EliDupree> Every feature added is a new one I have to understand as an add-on designer if I want to be compatible with it
20140208 00:40:33< Coffee_irc> but in general it picks up new features where there is a need
20140208 00:41:01< EliDupree> Yeah, but you could rein it in with simpler, more powerful features
20140208 00:41:22< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: it's harder in practise than it first appears
20140208 00:41:27< EliDupree> Some of the features have been obsoleted but are still hanging around
20140208 00:41:35< Coffee_irc> wesnoth is one of the most modifiable games out there
20140208 00:41:38< EliDupree> Well tell me for instance...
20140208 00:41:56< EliDupree> why does filter_adjacent work completely different for weapon specials than for abilities?
20140208 00:42:04< EliDupree> Same tag name, diffferent behavior
20140208 00:42:27< EliDupree> Oh and for SUFs it's yet a third behavior
20140208 00:42:31< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: for the same reason any API has quirks (Java, etc.) :P
20140208 00:42:56< Coffee_irc> it is built up over time with best intentions, but not knowing future uses and integration
20140208 00:42:59< EliDupree> What, historical reasons and inertia becauset there are too many users and you don't want to piss any of them off?
20140208 00:43:15< EliDupree> I thought that;s why to have the dev version / stable version cycle
20140208 00:43:34< Coffee_irc> over time things are getting more standardized
20140208 00:43:36< EliDupree> so you can make invasive changes sometimes without having bitrot happen too fast
20140208 00:43:40< Coffee_irc> you see this in the commits
20140208 00:44:05< Coffee_irc> recently, "elvish castle" was renamed "elven castle" to be more in line with other terrain
20140208 00:44:18< Coffee_irc> this was just a few hours ago, but a good example
20140208 00:44:21< EliDupree> heh
20140208 00:44:56< Coffee_irc> if there is something you'd like changed and it makes sense, just file a bug report or feature request
20140208 00:45:34< EliDupree> Effort changing the details that annoy me would be wasted compared with doing some big restructuring
20140208 00:46:00< Coffee_irc> I don't speak for all the devs of course
20140208 00:46:40< Coffee_irc> but people read the bug reports and feature requests
20140208 00:46:42< EliDupree> I mean, I got into add-on writing when I was much younger,  but nowadays I never would have
20140208 00:47:06< Coffee_irc> even if they don't get acted on all right away, they will be in our minds when we go on to do things
20140208 00:47:15< EliDupree> all the idiosyncracies of WML - plus the lack of docs - are a big barrier to entry for addon designers
20140208 00:51:34< EliDupree> for instance I was just looking through the attack code
20140208 00:52:42< Coffee_irc> yeah, I agree that the syntax put off or made errors creep into UMC units
20140208 00:52:59< Coffee_irc> this is partly what motivated me for the square bracket simplification syntax
20140208 00:53:16< Coffee_irc> all the people that wrote code that didn't work as expected or left animation-less units
20140208 00:53:40< EliDupree> Nah, funnily enough, the animation code is fairly benign from my perspective
20140208 00:53:51< EliDupree> well, no worse than anything else
20140208 00:54:33< EliDupree> But... well, can you document the square bracket syntax fully?
20140208 00:55:19< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: http://wiki.wesnoth.org/AnimationWML#Progressive_parameters
20140208 00:55:22< Coffee_irc> this should be it?
20140208 00:55:47< EliDupree> That is the list of examples I was talking about earlier
20140208 00:55:54< Coffee_irc> the examples give a full summary of the way it works
20140208 00:56:04< EliDupree> A list of examples is useful but it is *NOT* a full documentation of syntax
20140208 00:56:14< Coffee_irc> what is missing?
20140208 00:56:36< EliDupree> Looking at that I only know how to use those specific tricks, not how an arbitrary input will be interpreted
20140208 00:57:18< Jetrel_> http://bropages.org/ ^ relevant
20140208 00:57:50 * Jetrel_ hides and ducks all the rotten fruit
20140208 00:57:52< EliDupree> heh
20140208 00:58:28< Coffee_irc> :)
20140208 00:58:47< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: the syntax expands exactly as in the examples before being imputed into the game
20140208 00:58:54< Coffee_irc> *inputed
20140208 00:59:17< EliDupree> Uh, how do I explain this
20140208 00:59:18< Coffee_irc> it's not an equivalent thing, but a mere syntactic shorthand
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20140208 01:01:31< EliDupree> WHat would happen if I wrote image[001~20].png? What if I wrote image[1~4].png:[10,20]? are those even valid inputs?
20140208 01:02:04< EliDupree> I'm not asking *you* those, but rather
20140208 01:02:10< EliDupree> If that page documented the syntax, I would know
20140208 01:02:12< EliDupree> But it does not
20140208 01:02:15< EliDupree> So I don't
20140208 01:02:47< EliDupree> And I suspect you do not know how to give full documentation, and perhaps you don't understand it yourself, because the function that defines it is *160 lines*
20140208 01:03:27< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: okay, I added one more example with multiple commas used
20140208 01:03:29< EliDupree> I've read through the function myself and I don't understand it yet
20140208 01:03:34< EliDupree> You're not getting it
20140208 01:03:44< Coffee_irc> it expands the string between the commas
20140208 01:03:55< EliDupree> More examples *is definitively the opposite of what I'm asking for*
20140208 01:04:30< Coffee_irc> you want  pseudo code?
20140208 01:06:06< EliDupree> I don't know if that would help. It might
20140208 01:06:09< EliDupree> hrm
20140208 01:06:19< EliDupree> How about you tell me about those two specific examples I gave
20140208 01:06:26< EliDupree> How would the engine interpret them?
20140208 01:06:53< EliDupree> Do you know?
20140208 01:07:31< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: the strings are expanded and they are interpreted as they have always been
20140208 01:07:50< _8680_> How are they expanded?
20140208 01:07:53< EliDupree> How are they expanded?
20140208 01:08:05-!- irker432 [~irker@ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140208 01:08:05< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 713d9bc4e38c / src/campaign_server/campaign_server.cpp: campaign: Remove convert_binary_to_gzip() method and related functionality http://git.io/NF6TvA
20140208 01:08:27< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: pseudocode: http://pastebin.com/LeWB7na6
20140208 01:09:14< EliDupree> That doesn't even produce the behavior of the examples
20140208 01:09:33< EliDupree> the ones on the wiki page that is
20140208 01:09:43< EliDupree> It doesn't include the [a,b] syntax
20140208 01:09:54< EliDupree> or the [a*4] syntax
20140208 01:09:57< Coffee_irc> halo[3,5,7].png has S=halo, T=.png
20140208 01:10:15< EliDupree> or the adding extra preceding zeroes in [07~10]
20140208 01:10:19< Coffee_irc> so you get halo 3 .png, halo 4 .png, halo 5 .png
20140208 01:10:54< EliDupree> How would image[001~20].png be expanded?
20140208 01:11:09< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: as 001, 002, ... 020
20140208 01:11:38< Coffee_irc> because it calculates the number of additional zeros you've put in
20140208 01:11:38< EliDupree> Write me a description so that I could have figured that out myself.
20140208 01:12:05< EliDupree> There! That's a thing you didn't say earlier!
20140208 01:12:28< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: that really is a bug with your input though
20140208 01:12:31< EliDupree> EVERY indivudal thing like that must appear in your description before your description will be proper documentation!
20140208 01:12:39< Coffee_irc> you should write 001~020
20140208 01:12:44< EliDupree> If it's a bug, your documentation must tell me what inputs are valid!
20140208 01:13:02< Coffee_irc> I mean if you were doing it on purpose because an artist had numbered the files like that
20140208 01:13:29< Coffee_irc> there's one guy who has an animatied dragon with over 100 frames!
20140208 01:13:46< Coffee_irc> I'll write that in
20140208 01:14:19< EliDupree> To document code properly, you must be able to write something *before* I ask all the annoying questions!
20140208 01:15:21< EliDupree> And moreover...
20140208 01:15:44< EliDupree> How does this syntax help someone write animations if they didn't already understand the simpler syntax?
20140208 01:16:13< EliDupree> To me it looks like a "power user" feature
20140208 01:17:09< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: it happens more than you might think
20140208 01:17:37< EliDupree> This description you've put on the wiki is ambiguous: "(if you include leading zeros, the digits will be padded throughout the expansion to match)"
20140208 01:17:38< Coffee_irc> artists sometimes like to align the files in the browser, and with more than 10 frames the computer puts 10 after 1
20140208 01:18:07< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: how else might I write it (given the example below it)?
20140208 01:18:08< shadowm> That depends on the file manager's filename sorting implementation.
20140208 01:18:13< EliDupree> Throughout how much of the expansion? Someone might read that and assume that a string with two separate square brackets would have zeroes added to the second one after the first one
20140208 01:18:44< EliDupree> like [06~10].png:[1~2] becoming 06.png:01
20140208 01:19:24< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: you are right, I changed it to sa that particular square bracket expansion
20140208 01:19:44< EliDupree> I, the reader, don't know what that phrase refers to
20140208 01:20:40< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: what would you recommend?
20140208 01:20:44< EliDupree> hmm...
20140208 01:21:08< EliDupree> well given that I don't know what you know, it will be harder, but let me think
20140208 01:22:57-!- mattsc [~mattsc@154.20.32.246] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140208 01:25:45< EliDupree> "Each set of square brackets must contain a list, either defined by a range (e.g. [1~4] becomes a list of four, with increments of one) or a comma-separated list which can contain any strings (e.g. [1,a,2]). All bracketed lists in the same progressive string must have the same length (after ranges are expanded), and the result is a series of that many images."
20140208 01:25:46< EliDupree> "A bracketed range where the first element has leading zeroes will be padded to that length throughout. If so, the number specifying the end of the range must have the same number of digits."
20140208 01:25:46< EliDupree> However... that description doesn't cover [5~3,1]
20140208 01:25:46< EliDupree> I'd have to write a somewhat more complicated description
20140208 01:26:50-!- enchilado [~enchilado@defocus/yummy/enchilado] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
20140208 01:27:26< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: I added that description to the page and added a bit about the reverse range being allowed also
20140208 01:28:03< Coffee_irc> that is really all there is to the function
20140208 01:28:14< EliDupree> What's the bit about asterisks?
20140208 01:28:27< Coffee_irc> oh yeah
20140208 01:28:31< EliDupree> ...
20140208 01:28:31< Coffee_irc> there's them too :P
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20140208 01:28:38< EliDupree> Thatss what I'm talking about
20140208 01:29:33< Coffee_irc> okay, I put something in for that too :)
20140208 01:30:53< EliDupree> If I said [10~01], would that work?
20140208 01:31:00< Coffee_irc> yes
20140208 01:32:13< EliDupree> ok, I think I've got it well enough to write my own code that interprets it
20140208 01:32:23< EliDupree> I bet it'll be like.. 20 lines of Lua :p
20140208 01:32:40< Coffee_irc> good to hear, although I still think you might be able to achieve your tasks without it ;)
20140208 01:32:49< Coffee_irc> thanks for your input
20140208 01:33:39< shadowm> Does anyone know what function I should really be using instead of util::format_time_summary() for this? https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/21371130/screenshots/wesnoth-1.11.9-addon-times.png
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20140208 01:34:56< shadowm> I could always use strftime(), I guess, but...
20140208 01:36:36< shadowm> Dih-
20140208 01:36:39< shadowm> We have a util::strftime().
20140208 01:36:57-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140208 01:36:59< shadowm> That somehow still uses C strings of limited size... :p
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20140208 01:52:48< AI0867> shadowm: what's the issue with format_time_summary?
20140208 01:53:50< AI0867> besides the 2-digit year?
20140208 01:54:14< AI0867> and the middle endian date format??
20140208 01:54:24< AI0867> they're translatable though
20140208 01:55:43< shadowm> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/21371130/screenshots/wesnoth-1.11.9-addon-times-2.png
20140208 01:55:52< shadowm> I hope that format is good enough.
20140208 01:56:26< shadowm> Oh, %c includes the seconds portion.
20140208 01:56:28< AI0867> that's even more middle endian
20140208 01:56:36< AI0867> day of week, month, day, time of day, year
20140208 01:57:11< shadowm> Okay, does strftime have a more natural format somewhere?
20140208 01:57:19< AI0867> the idea of format_time_summary (not that I wrote it) is to leave off everything that's not relevant.
20140208 01:57:30< AI0867> ISO8601?
20140208 01:57:31< shadowm> %F %R ?
20140208 01:57:55< AI0867> sure
20140208 01:58:31< AI0867> I'm currently replacing %y with %Y in format_time_summary
20140208 01:59:14< AI0867> %Y     The year as a decimal number including the century. <-- is there a way to guarantee that it gives me a millennium too?
20140208 01:59:40< shadowm> Should I feel bad about forcing %F %R upon everybod?
20140208 01:59:45< shadowm> *y
20140208 02:00:12< shadowm> Dunno how many countries use other calendar systems nowadays, how does strftime deal with those in that case?
20140208 02:00:52< AI0867> localize to a very limited degree
20140208 02:01:07< AI0867> that's why we have our own strftime, where various things are translatable, probably
20140208 02:01:52< AI0867> _("%a %b %e %H:%M:%S %Y")
20140208 02:01:58< shadowm> Our strftime deals with month and day names AFAICT, nothing else.
20140208 02:02:23< shadowm> So you are suggesting to make the format string localized?
20140208 02:02:57< AI0867> no, that's from strftime.cpp
20140208 02:03:02< AI0867> it already is
20140208 02:03:14< AI0867> similar stuff is in format_time_summary
20140208 02:03:19< shadowm> That's only for the %c and %+ cases.
20140208 02:03:22< AI0867> true
20140208 02:04:07< shadowm> It seems existing code does opt for making it translatable, though:
20140208 02:04:08< shadowm> const size_t res = util::strftime(time_buf,sizeof(time_buf), (preferences::use_twelve_hour_clock_format() ? _("%a %b %d %I:%M %p %Y") : _("%a %b %d %H:%M %Y")), tm_l);
20140208 02:04:14< shadowm> Amongst other things.
20140208 02:05:01< shadowm> So I'll go with that. Why does printing an item's creation or modification time have to be so complicated? :p
20140208 02:05:19< AI0867> 0
20140208 02:05:29< AI0867> that was a keyboard cleaning action
20140208 02:05:48< shadowm> k.
20140208 02:06:28< AI0867> þat still looks very middle-endian to me
20140208 02:06:36< AI0867> huh, looks like I hit my compose key
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20140208 02:10:46< irker432> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth-old:master 04262d12aafc / src/format_time_summary.cpp: Make format_time_summary display 4-digit years http://git.io/flCtLg
20140208 02:10:48< irker432> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth-old:master c6262964ff07 / changelog players_changelog po/wesnoth/nl.po: Flip day/month order in dutch translation http://git.io/GBEJIw
20140208 02:10:50< irker432> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth-old:master f56d09392001 / / (13 files in 8 dirs): Merge branch 'master' of github.com:wesnoth/wesnoth-old http://git.io/0x-Jww
20140208 02:12:19< _8680_> Why show the name of the day of the week?
20140208 02:12:47< AI0867> because infodump
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20140208 02:15:42< _8680_> Also, why not use ‘%c’?
20140208 02:16:57< AI0867> because the locale maintainers are nazis
20140208 02:17:01< AI0867> or so espreon says
20140208 02:17:16< _8680_> Besides being simpler, that would allow the user to change it with the system locale settings— Nazis? Really?
20140208 02:17:42< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 9bed3ef79a7d / src/addon/ (info.cpp info.hpp): addon/info: Support original_timestamp attribute http://git.io/OMjZjQ
20140208 02:17:45< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 7f8d77769db0 / changelog: Update changelog for campaignd changes http://git.io/52MyDA
20140208 02:17:48< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 0f1cbae347b7 / / (3 files in 3 dirs): gui2/taddon_description: Display first/last upload dates http://git.io/BQrP8g
20140208 02:18:00< AI0867> we've written our own %c replacement (using multiple configurable translatable strings) precisely because the default gettext version is insufficient
20140208 02:18:02< _8680_> Shall I assume he wasn’t being literal?
20140208 02:18:09< EliDupree> Coffee_irc: Can't chat much more, but it came out to 31 lines. A lot less than 160, although I guess it's not fair to do it in a language that's more careless with types :P http://pastebin.com/index/LeWB7na6
20140208 02:18:44< AI0867> well, there's stuff about not translating %p to en_GB because the maintainer refuses it
20140208 02:18:49< EliDupree> (And this code is a bit hacky and doesn't validate the inputs, so don't take it as an example of what to do)
20140208 02:19:21< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: hey that's my pseudo code :P
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20140208 02:20:02< EliDupree> whoops
20140208 02:20:40< EliDupree> http://pastebin.com/kJGBM40t
20140208 02:20:43< Coffee_irc> EliDupree: you might have saved me some work doing the validation code :)
20140208 02:22:10< Coffee_irc> for this thing wmlint
20140208 02:22:26< Coffee_irc> cheers and good luck with your project
20140208 02:22:37< AI0867> also stuff about various different cultures sharing a locale
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20140208 02:23:11< AI0867> if you look on gna, you can probably find a related bug report that links to gettext bugs
20140208 02:23:23< _8680_> EliDupree, Coffee_irc: I started writing a revision of the square bracket expansion explanation: <http://wiki.wesnoth.org/User:8680/tmp/AnimationWMLProgressiveStringSquareBracketExpansionSyntax> — obviously unfinished, but is what I have good?
20140208 02:23:48< shadowm> _8680_: Use ASCII quotes and dashes.
20140208 02:24:03< shadowm> Otherwise it simply doesn't fit.
20140208 02:24:07< _8680_> …Right, Unicode is banned the wiki.
20140208 02:24:34< _8680_> I’m missing some words there but whatever.
20140208 02:24:40< shadowm> No, it isn't, but consistency is god, and I honestly believe this is a thing MediaWiki should do on its own instead of demanding it from page authors.
20140208 02:25:14< shadowm> Hm, there wouldn't be an extension that does just that, right?
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20140208 02:27:11< _8680_> If find you one, may I punctuate freely?
20140208 02:27:27< shadowm> There seems to not be any such thing, unfortunately.
20140208 02:27:46< _8680_> Curses.
20140208 02:27:52< Coffee_irc> _8680_: that looks better layed out than what I have documented
20140208 02:28:25< Coffee_irc> _8680_: I'll incorporate the layout and make a separate subheader for that (just to finish up on it)
20140208 02:28:48< shadowm> Look at all these abandoned patches: https://gna.org/patch/?group=wesnoth
20140208 02:28:52< shadowm> Aren't they lovely?
20140208 02:29:35< _8680_> It’s still missing an explanation of how the expansion is actually performed.
20140208 02:32:30< mattsc> Huh, there's even a Micro AI one ...  
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20140208 02:35:51< mattsc> I'll check that one out and either accept or reject it sometime before 1.12.0 ...
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20140208 02:35:56< travis-ci> [travis-ci] wesnoth/wesnoth-old#1594 (master - f56d093 : Alexander van Gessel): The build has errored.
20140208 02:35:56< travis-ci> [travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/builds/18456023
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20140208 02:40:00< Coffee_irc> _8680_: http://wiki.wesnoth.org/AnimationWML#Progressive_string_square_bracket_expansion_syntax
20140208 02:40:14< Coffee_irc> finally documented to suit all I hope :)
20140208 02:40:48< EliDupree> Coffee_irc: whoops my voice control undid my last fix, correct code is at http://pastebin.com/iKHRpUPe
20140208 02:40:56< EliDupree> _8680_ yes I like your revision
20140208 02:41:43< EliDupree> Coffee_irc: you've missed the fact that _8680_'s version is blatantly incomplete at the end :P
20140208 02:45:03< EliDupree> _8680_ that style is exactly what I'm looking for - it would be great for you to complete the description.
20140208 02:45:57< _8680_> I expect we have similar tastes in documentation.
20140208 02:46:12< _8680_> I’m working on the final bit, but I don’t know some of it.
20140208 02:49:05< EliDupree> _8680_ Now if you could document the attack code... >:p
20140208 02:49:40< mattsc> shadowm (or whoever): Some of those patches are clearly unfinished and abandoned (e.g. GSoC patches by people who did not get accepted).  What's our policy on those?  Keep them open indefinitely or close them?
20140208 02:50:28< Coffee_irc> 2 of the patches are mine, and one day I might get around to finishing them :P
20140208 02:50:48< mattsc> Coffee_irc: yours are not the ones I am talking about  :)
20140208 02:51:28< shadowm> mattsc: No idea.
20140208 02:51:44< shadowm> It's probably a subject for the mailing list!
20140208 02:52:04< mattsc> Coffee_irc: For example, look at the last message here: https://gna.org/patch/?3240
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20140208 02:52:28< mattsc> That looks to me like the original submitter is saying "never mind"
20140208 02:52:50< mattsc> shadowm: yeah ...
20140208 02:55:02< AI0867> mattsc: I don't think we have a policy, but if the patch is unfinished and abandoned, closing it sounds reasonable
20140208 02:56:04< _8680_> Coffee_irc: What happens if two ranges in different bracket sets have different sizes? E.g., “img[1~5][1~3].png”.
20140208 02:56:21< _8680_> Or is that the same as “img[1,2,3,4,5][1,2,3].png”?
20140208 02:56:37< mattsc> AI0867: makes sense.  I'll have a closer look at these sometime in the next few days.
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20140208 03:02:35< Coffee_irc> _8680_: an error happens
20140208 03:03:31< Coffee_irc> the output for the errors I tried to make descriptive so that you know what to change
20140208 03:05:43< _8680_> Is [1,2~4,5] the same as [1,2,3,4,5]?
20140208 03:05:51< Coffee_irc> yes
20140208 03:06:07< Coffee_irc> just like with the existing halo syntax
20140208 03:06:15< Coffee_irc> before it
20140208 03:06:53< _8680_> Is it considered to have the same length in elements? E.g., does “img[1~3][1,2,3]” become “img11,img22,img33”?
20140208 03:07:09< Coffee_irc> yes
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20140208 03:10:57< _8680_> Is [1~1] valid?
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20140208 03:12:02< Coffee_irc> _8680_: yes
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20140208 03:13:22< _8680_> “img[1~1]” would become “img1”?
20140208 03:13:33< Coffee_irc> yes
20140208 03:13:44< _8680_> What about “img[01~1]”?
20140208 03:13:56< _8680_> And “img[1~01]”?
20140208 03:14:10< Coffee_irc> well, that is bad syntax, but it would become img01
20140208 03:14:39< _8680_> “img[1~01]” would become “img01”?
20140208 03:14:45< Coffee_irc> yeah
20140208 03:14:53< Coffee_irc> it picks the greates amount of leading zeros
20140208 03:16:17< Coffee_irc> it's basically built "dummy-proof"
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20140208 05:41:58< fendrin> hi shadowm
20140208 05:43:35< fendrin> shadowm: Sorry, I am away for the next bunch of hours. I will be online in ~12 hours again.
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20140208 09:17:42< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 088d50a3b29b / data/core/about.cfg: credits: I'm shadowm http://git.io/zdixZg
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20140208 09:49:30< shadowm> Forgot to mention here that status.wesnoth.org now looks like this: https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/21371130/screenshots/valen2-frontend-prod-1-fake-data.png
20140208 09:49:39< shadowm> I deployed the new version yesterday-ish (depending on your timezone).
20140208 09:50:12< zookeeper> cool
20140208 09:51:02< zookeeper> i wonder, could the multiplayer connect dialog give you a hyperlink to that if connection to the server fails?
20140208 09:51:09< zookeeper> or maybe it does, who knows
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20140208 09:57:00< shadowm> Maybe at some point after it is more feature-complete and has stopped being my pet project.
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20140208 10:10:49< zookeeper> shadowm, so what else is on the same machine on which status.wesnoth.org lives? that is, if s.w.o is down, what else will (likely) be as well?
20140208 10:11:23< shadowm> Me.
20140208 10:11:32< shadowm> Also AI0867.
20140208 10:11:56< shadowm> Oh, and irker too.
20140208 10:13:09< zookeeper> okay
20140208 10:19:25< shadowm> Ivanovic: Where did you get this part from? v
20140208 10:19:27< shadowm> <li>According to Ohloh, a site that collects activity statistics on open-source projects, the ''Wesnoth'' development effort is in the top 2% of largest and most active projects</li>
20140208 10:19:59< shadowm> I don't see that statistic in https://www.ohloh.net/p/wesnoth .
20140208 10:21:06< shadowm> Most of the org description items items are probably best for you to check.
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20140208 10:23:40< shadowm> Same goes for the 2013 results TODO, and the mentors list TODO (I don't even know anything about either of those...).
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20140208 10:30:42< shadowm> wesbot: seen trademark
20140208 10:30:43< wesbot> shadowm: The person with the nick trademark last spoke 11d 15h ago.  7d 20h ago they left with the message: Ping timeout: 248 seconds
20140208 10:30:52< shadowm> You aren't subscribed to the devs ML. ;(
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20140208 10:39:30< Ivanovic> re
20140208 10:39:37< Ivanovic> shadowm: i have no idea where that information is from
20140208 10:39:39< Ivanovic> no idea at all!
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20140208 10:44:31< Ivanovic> AI0867, Coffee_irc, EliDupree, fendrin, Jetrel, loonycyborg, shadowm, Soliton, thunderstruck, timotei_, vultraz_old, zookeeper, everyone else who cares: ready for 1.11.9?
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20140208 10:44:43< Jetrel> sure.
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20140208 10:45:09< vultraz_old> sure
20140208 10:45:23< Ivanovic> boucman: ready for 1.11.9?
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20140208 10:45:34< boucman> fine here
20140208 10:46:02< shadowm> Yes.
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20140208 11:05:27< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 425cce189f71 / utils/mp-server/update_server: Long overdue update to the update_server script to match production http://git.io/zkj0xA
20140208 11:05:30< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master ffc43a10e43e / utils/mp-server/send_server_command: Update send_server_command with code changes from production http://git.io/pZrxfQ
20140208 11:05:33< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 639e78c4c103 / utils/mp-server/tail_log_irc: Update tail_log_irc script from production http://git.io/RCtOuQ
20140208 11:05:36< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master c6c097980094 / utils/mp-server/create_symlinks: Update create_symlinks script from production http://git.io/eGfkvg
20140208 11:05:39< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 6cad83457373 / utils/mp-server/ (logfilter_irc logfilter_irc_color logfilter_irc_logged_color): Updated logfilter_irc* scripts with the current production versions http://git.io/wLsPtQ
20140208 11:05:42< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 01a6a3bb1d13 / utils/mp-server/new_release: Update new_release script from production http://git.io/DpzvYg
20140208 11:05:45< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 7e7a32447eba / utils/mp-server/run_server: Update run_server script from production http://git.io/groL8Q
20140208 11:05:48< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 230fa23f9e8e / utils/mp-server/run_campaignd: Update run_campaignd script from production http://git.io/b0K6vA
20140208 11:05:51< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master fc250334ca89 / utils/tests/ (6 files in 6 dirs): Remove empty directory tree containing nothing but .gitignore files http://git.io/Z1pJ4A
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20140208 11:12:25< zookeeper> fine by me... or at least i don't recall why it wouldn't be
20140208 11:15:24< shadowm> The changelog certainly seems much shorter than 1.11.8's.
20140208 11:20:51< irker432> wesnoth: loonycyborg wesnoth-old:master 5e731bcba920 / SConstruct: Scrub -DNDEBUG from flags returned by mysql_config http://git.io/nqIlow
20140208 11:30:33< Ivanovic> shadowm: it was a significantly shorter time
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20140208 12:18:50< Ivanovic> okay, i updated the information on the "info for google" page
20140208 12:19:10< Ivanovic> i directly wanted to submit it, but there were some slight problems, the site did not allow me, exited with a 500 error...
20140208 12:19:28< Ivanovic> folks, please make sure to give the site another once over: http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SoC_Information_for_Google
20140208 12:19:37< Ivanovic> shadowm: i removed the parts which you highlighted in the description
20140208 12:19:48< Ivanovic> in addition i added results for 2013 and listed our possible mentors
20140208 12:21:35< shadowm> Uh.
20140208 12:21:47< shadowm> I only mentioned one part. :)
20140208 12:21:54< Ivanovic> yeah, the oloho stats
20140208 12:22:05< Ivanovic> i just got rid of those since i also have no idea where that info was from
20140208 12:22:07< shadowm> ohloh.
20140208 12:22:33< shadowm> More important than where they come from is whether they are up to date or not. I presume not.
20140208 12:22:37< Ivanovic> now i will work on the release
20140208 12:22:47< Ivanovic> those stats were outdated as hell
20140208 12:22:56< Ivanovic> i also updated the download numbers and stuff like this
20140208 12:24:00-!- Ivanovic changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: releasing 1.11.9 | asheviere (old server) will be shut down on 16th Feb 2014, migrate all stuff, cf dev mailinglist | 217 bugs, 343 feature requests, 28 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20140208 12:24:31< shadowm> I had a couple of minor suggestions for the beginning of the description, though.
20140208 12:24:55< Ivanovic> i seem to have missed those
20140208 12:25:02< Ivanovic> can you incorporate those yourself?
20140208 12:25:06< shadowm> Yeah, because I haven't mentioned them yet
20140208 12:25:15< shadowm> I wanted to get your opinion first:
20140208 12:25:43< shadowm> * Replace the misleading "with role-playing elements" bit with "with a high-fantasy theme".
20140208 12:26:40< shadowm> * Replace "a great deal of user-maintained content" with "a vast amount of user-maintained content".
20140208 12:27:13< shadowm> * Replace "while the current development branch is 1.11.8 that was released at the beginning of January" with "while the current development branch is at version 1.11.8, released at the beginning of January 2014".
20140208 12:27:23< Ivanovic> sounds good, feel free to add those in
20140208 12:27:28< shadowm> And that was it, because I didn't really see a need to change the rest.
20140208 12:27:44< shadowm> (Disclaimer: I can't assure I didn't miss any punctuation or grammar mistakes in the original.)
20140208 12:27:45< Ivanovic> question, shadowm: have you purged the RELEASE_NOTES document after the announcement of 1.11.8?
20140208 12:28:00< Ivanovic> the mistakes are in there to add some flavor
20140208 12:28:01< Ivanovic> ;)
20140208 12:28:20< shadowm> Yes, I have. See commit d5097e34e6186738ec6dbde063d52ef9f619ead8 (described as "1.11.8-70-gd5097e3").
20140208 12:28:24< Ivanovic> what is not listed in the RELEASE_NOTES is that the input mechanisms are supposed to be back to default
20140208 12:28:33< shadowm> (Meaning 1.11.8 plus 70 commits.)
20140208 12:28:58< shadowm> Yes, I have written a short blurb for my draft covering that point.
20140208 12:29:27< shadowm> "The mouse control scheme used in version 1.11.7 and earlier has been restored as the default in this release. \n\n As with version 1.11.8, it is possible to add, modify, or remove mouse button assignments to game actions in [b]Preferences[/b] → [b]Hotkeys[/b]."
20140208 12:32:25< shadowm> (If you are in doubt, yes, that SotBE rebalancing section is different from the last release.)
20140208 12:32:45< irker432> wesnoth: Nils Kneuper wesnoth-old:master bafde02872c0 / / (281 files in 28 dirs): pot-update and regenerated doc files http://git.io/eVcFfQ
20140208 12:32:47< irker432> wesnoth: Nils Kneuper wesnoth-old:master a33f5f56a8bd / RELEASE_NOTES: add note about input scheme to RELEASE_NOTES http://git.io/CrmIaw
20140208 12:32:49< irker432> wesnoth: Nils Kneuper wesnoth-old:master be60b47d5de5 / changelog players_changelog src/wesconfig.h: version bump to 1.11.9 http://git.io/NEn36Q
20140208 12:32:57< Ivanovic> okay, i just added a short stub to RELEASE_NOTES for the control scheme
20140208 12:33:06< Ivanovic> but your version sounds a lot better, thanks for that!
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20140208 12:34:32< Ivanovic> i will have lunch now and create the package afterwards
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20140208 12:37:48< mordante> servus
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20140208 12:39:03< mordante> shadowm, the addon server is not yet finished, Trademark wants to mentor a GSoC project this year to have it finished
20140208 12:39:15< mordante> shadowm, Trademark mailed to the dev-ml earlier today
20140208 12:41:07< shadowm> I noticed. I haven't had a chance to read all the links yet.
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20140208 12:44:40< shadowm> Ivanovic: Okay, updated the description in the SoC info draft.
20140208 12:46:17< shadowm> mordante: And by "not yet finished" it means it is not ready to replace campaignd yet either? From what I gather you are aiming for a larger feature set.
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20140208 12:49:38< shadowm> Hm, I really need to come up with a small pet project to learn C++11 from. (Otherwise all I can do every time the subject crops up is say "ooh" and "ahh".)
20140208 12:49:57< Ivanovic> hi mordante
20140208 12:50:01< Ivanovic> mordante: ready for 1.11.9?
20140208 12:52:40< mordante> shadowm, exactly
20140208 12:53:36< mordante> shadowm, that's why I think it is a good idea to look at using C++11 for the addon-server so everybody can see how different C++11 is/can be
20140208 12:53:48< mordante> hi Ivanovic 
20140208 12:54:10< mordante> Ivanovic, I've a minor fix pending, but it can wait after 1.11.9, so I'm ready
20140208 12:57:27< Ivanovic> application to google submitted, changes still possible, ideas list needs more content
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20140208 13:07:21< mordante> Ivanovic, I will have a look tomorrow
20140208 13:07:32< Ivanovic> mordante: thanks!
20140208 13:07:53< mordante> Ivanovic, I haven't found time to look at the Pandora issues yet, first want to finish some features, that have been pending
20140208 13:08:05< Ivanovic> sure
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20140208 13:24:53< Ivanovic> okay, 1.11.9 is looking good so far, currently uploading, about to tag
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20140208 13:31:44< irker432> wesnoth: ivanovic wesnoth-old: be60b47d5de5 tagged as 1.11.9
20140208 13:34:31< Ivanovic> mordante: i am now building the pandora version with -O2, lets see if this helps mask the issue with the minimap display...
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20140208 13:50:51< Ivanovic> mordante: the issue persists...
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20140208 13:52:46-!- Ivanovic changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: released 1.11.9, announcing "soon" | asheviere (old server) will be shut down on 16th Feb 2014, migrate all stuff, cf dev mailinglist | 217 bugs, 343 feature requests, 28 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20140208 14:02:53< travis-ci> [travis-ci] wesnoth/wesnoth-old#1600 (1.11.9 - be60b47 : Nils Kneuper): The build passed.
20140208 14:02:53< travis-ci> [travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth-old/builds/18474006
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20140208 14:04:58< mordante> Ivanovic, I would be surprised if it didn't ;-)
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20140208 14:19:49< mordante> fendrin, finally happy with my tooltip code :-) now I only need to polish the code and documentation
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20140208 14:21:42< loonycyborg> Ivanovic: you tagged yet?
20140208 14:22:55< Ivanovic> loonycyborg: yes, it is all tagged
20140208 14:23:02< Ivanovic> currently uploading stuff to sf.net
20140208 14:23:07< Ivanovic> including the pandora build
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20140208 15:37:17< mattsc> Is there a reason why translations don't work when I start Wesnoth from the CL?  Anybody know if that's a general issue or my system/Mac specific?
20140208 15:37:49< Ivanovic> huh?
20140208 15:37:57< Ivanovic> translations work nicely here when i start via commandline
20140208 15:38:06< Ivanovic> especially since i always start wesnoth via commandline
20140208 15:38:31< shadowm> They also work for me, at least when manually selected (my default system language is English, so...).
20140208 15:38:40< mattsc> Hmm, very strange.  I'll look into this later.
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20140208 16:03:19< mordante> Ivanovic, can we already commit again or is trunk still frozen? (I see no post release bump yet)
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20140208 16:20:59< Ivanovic> mordante: ups
20140208 16:21:03< irker432> wesnoth: Nils Kneuper wesnoth-old:master c424ed115259 / changelog players_changelog src/wesconfig.h: post release version bump to 1.11.9 http://git.io/xPuTew
20140208 16:21:04< Ivanovic> yeah, things were all done besides this bump
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20140208 16:21:40< mordante> Ivanovic, thanks
20140208 16:22:04< Ivanovic> i fear i am getting old...
20140208 16:22:21< Ivanovic> forgetting these basic things...
20140208 16:23:31< irker432> wesnoth: Mark de Wever wesnoth-old:master 2e46950e6863 / changelog src/gui/widgets/window.cpp: Fix a DEBUG_WINDOW_LAYOUT_GRAPHS compiler warning. http://git.io/k5ctXg
20140208 16:25:03 * mordante mutters something about checklists…
20140208 16:31:53< irker432> wesnoth: Bär Halberkamp wesnoth-old:master 94cbbb43248e / data/campaigns/Eastern_Invasion/maps/09_Xenophobia.map: EI: Updated map for S9 http://git.io/glHsLQ
20140208 16:31:56< irker432> wesnoth: Bär Halberkamp wesnoth-old:master 6eda35d64b00 / data/campaigns/Eastern_Invasion/maps/10_Lake_Vrug.map: EI: updated S10 map http://git.io/hTIY5w
20140208 16:31:59< irker432> wesnoth: Bär Halberkamp wesnoth-old:master 993454961146 / data/campaigns/Eastern_Invasion/maps/ (11_Captured.map 12_Evacuation.map): EI: Updated Scenario 11 and 12's map http://git.io/DgsWvg
20140208 16:43:49< mattsc> Ivanovic, shadowm: the OS X package is up at SF
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20140208 17:15:09< irker432> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth-old:master d2c971060588 / projectfiles/Xcode/Info.plist: Xcode project: post release version bump http://git.io/x_zhxQ
20140208 17:31:54< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 91f5329d1dfb / changelog: Changelog formatting fix http://git.io/9AcCkg
20140208 17:31:57< irker432> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth-old:master 66aee405f3c7 / Doxyfile: Bump Doxyfile version http://git.io/YfSF5g
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20140208 18:02:23< mordante> Ivanovic, regarding http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SoC_Information_for_Google will you update the latest development release after the notification or should I change it now?
20140208 18:02:41< mordante> s/notification/release announcement/
20140208 18:04:34< loonycyborg> Ivanovic: 1.11.9 windows release is uploaded
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20140208 18:42:35< Ivanovic> mordante: you can update the one now
20140208 18:43:17< Ivanovic> i plan to copy over the latest version of the information later during the week
20140208 18:43:39< Ivanovic> my plan for today was to post "something" so that we don't miss the deadline
20140208 18:47:23< mordante> Ivanovic, done
20140208 18:47:51< Ivanovic> (and to get 1.11.9 out)
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20140208 19:27:11-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: released 1.11.9, announcing "soon" | asheviere (old server) will be shut down on 16th Feb 2014, migrate all stuff, cf dev mailinglist | 217 bugs, 347 feature requests, 28 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20140208 20:18:40< irker432> wesnoth: Mark de Wever wesnoth-old:master b9aef8198267 / changelog src/gui/auxiliary/formula.hpp: Implement the function table in GUI2 formulas. http://git.io/Na6oXA
20140208 20:18:43< irker432> wesnoth: Mark de Wever wesnoth-old:master 8ff55378cc37 / / (6 files in 3 dirs): Add reevaluate_best_size_ function for a window. http://git.io/no0iww
20140208 20:18:45< irker432> wesnoth: Mark de Wever wesnoth-old:master 5da495122a10 / / (7 files in 6 dirs): Add a new GUI2 tooltip. http://git.io/t7nQyA
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20140208 21:45:32< mordante> I'm off bye
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20140208 22:35:04< shadowm> wesbot: seen Velensk
20140208 22:35:05< wesbot> shadowm: The person with the nick Velensk last spoke 2d 22h ago.  1d 22h ago they left with the message: Read error: Connection reset by peer
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20140208 22:45:59< shadowm> Gah.
20140208 22:46:18< shadowm> I accidentally reproduced the editor ToD menu crash.
20140208 22:47:04< Coffee_irc> shadowm: happy to assign you the bug ;)
20140208 22:47:17< shadowm> Coffee_irc: What bug?
20140208 22:47:25< Coffee_irc> if there is a crash
20140208 22:47:35< Coffee_irc> I think I've seen that bug too
20140208 22:47:36< shadowm> No, it's an existing bug assigned to fendrin.
20140208 22:47:43-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20140208 22:48:13< Coffee_irc> I'm sure fendrin wouldn't mind if you wanted to solve it for him
20140208 22:48:40< fendrin> :-)
20140208 22:48:41< shadowm> I would rather not have to see the editor code in my life time.
20140208 22:50:14-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20140208 22:50:32< Ivanovic> n8
20140208 22:51:12< fendrin> Which is a very respectful comment towards ilor who really did a great job implementing the editor framework.
20140208 22:52:03< shadowm> There are many areas I would prefer to not have to look at if I can help it, no offense to the original authors.
20140208 22:52:26< shadowm> I'm too old to enjoy reading C++ nowadays.
20140208 22:52:31< fendrin> rofl
20140208 22:52:39< Coffee_irc> things become specialized over time as well
20140208 22:52:50< Coffee_irc> only natural that they also become hard to understand a bit
20140208 22:53:03< fendrin> May I ask how old you are exactly? I am willing to tell my age as well.
20140208 22:53:42-!- Velvet_Sky [~SkyPc@99-111-224-165.lightspeed.rcsntx.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: #skynexchat @ quakenet.org for vecxis/nexuiz fps chat]
20140208 22:54:35< shadowm> Nah. It would diminish my statement's comedic value.
20140208 22:55:04< fendrin> I thought so. May I guess? 26?
20140208 22:55:16< shadowm> Close.
20140208 22:55:25< Coffee_irc> shadowm is one of those over 60 hermits in the mountains of chile (you can tell by his mobile connection)
20140208 22:55:35< fendrin> hihi
20140208 22:55:41< fendrin> I am 36 by the way.
20140208 22:56:23< Ivanovic> and grandpa is afraid of speeds higher than 100km/h on the german motorway!
20140208 22:56:26< Ivanovic> ^^
20140208 22:56:33< fendrin> Indeed
20140208 22:56:50< fendrin> I was wetting my pants.
20140208 22:57:40< fendrin> And not like you think out of excitement. The color of the fluid was more yellow than white. 
20140208 22:57:56< Coffee_irc> he's had one too many german beers again :P
20140208 22:58:39< fendrin> I am not so much in drinking beer. When I am stooned its mostly from smoking weed.
20140208 23:00:25< Coffee_irc> that explains the new color scheme for the minmap
20140208 23:01:38< fendrin> Oh, that is LordBob's work :-)
20140208 23:01:53< fendrin> Maybe he shares my excellent taste when it comes to drug usage.
20140208 23:02:00< shadowm> The only thing that bothers me about it is the color chosen for impassable terrains, really.
20140208 23:02:46< shadowm> It reminds me a lot of a blood (recolored water because I'm not an artist) terrain I use.
20140208 23:03:39< Coffee_irc> I've got some animation code I'd like to bug fix, but its too damn hot here to think properly
20140208 23:03:41< fendrin> Yes, the red is too shiny. I need to catch LordBob again for fixing that.
20140208 23:03:43< shadowm> For maps like many of our mainline MP maps which are surrounded by impassable hexes, I'd think something closer to 100% black would be more fitting.
20140208 23:04:12-!- exciton [chuck-the-@89.208.170.132] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20140208 23:04:28< Coffee_irc> I agree with shadowm
20140208 23:04:39< Coffee_irc> you don't want to be distracted by strange colors much
20140208 23:05:53< Coffee_irc> but to each their own I suppose
20140208 23:06:17< Coffee_irc> it would be good if the screen to join games you could toggle between the minimap types (regular and colored)
20140208 23:06:19< fendrin> I agree as well.
20140208 23:06:33< Coffee_irc> I think people will otherwise complain
20140208 23:07:01< fendrin> Maybe for the out of scenario map the old scheme only is a best solution.
20140208 23:07:15< Coffee_irc> yes
20140208 23:07:19< Coffee_irc> I was thinking that also
20140208 23:07:32< shadowm> Coffee_irc: I've seen people use quaint maps as icons in the MP lobby.  Is that what you mean?
20140208 23:07:57< fendrin> But, I have to leave you know. A 60th and 70th dance event is waiting for me to join urgently.
20140208 23:07:59< Coffee_irc> shadowm: the new colored terrain style maps are used in the mp lobby at the moment
20140208 23:08:03< fendrin> See you :-)
20140208 23:08:12< shadowm> Coffee_irc: I mean in 1.10.
20140208 23:08:22< Coffee_irc> see you fendrin
20140208 23:09:01< Coffee_irc> shadowm: well... that is up the the addon author I suppose
20140208 23:09:17< Coffee_irc> probably about "branding" so their addon stands out
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20140208 23:09:27< shadowm> Other than that case I don't think one option or the other makes much difference in the lobby.
20140208 23:09:28< Coffee_irc> as there are plenty of ones to choose from
20140208 23:09:45< Coffee_irc> shadowm: one is more pleasant on the eye :)
20140208 23:10:05< Coffee_irc> the other is a tactical map, more useful in-game
20140208 23:10:07< shadowm> Meh, they both have their pros and cons.
20140208 23:10:28< Coffee_irc> shadowm: my gut instinct is that people will complain
20140208 23:10:40< Coffee_irc> if I weren't a dev I know I would
20140208 23:10:44< shadowm> The tactical map looks cleaner, but our terrain variety is slightly less obvious in it, whereas the satellite map solves that but looks more noisy
20140208 23:12:11< Coffee_irc> you should be able to toggle it
20140208 23:12:15< shadowm> Does anyone think I should mention Li'sar's initiative ability in the release announcement?
20140208 23:12:26< shadowm> I don't think anyone cares much for HttT nowadays.
20140208 23:12:28< fendrin> Well, they serve different purposes. That is why you are able to... Coffee_irc ninjad my...
20140208 23:12:29< fendrin> bye
20140208 23:12:49< zookeeper> shadowm, wouldn't hurt
20140208 23:12:59-!- exciton [chuck-the-@89.208.170.132] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20140208 23:14:09< shadowm> Hm, since I'm bored and burnt-out I could as well play mainline campaigns now that development pace is cooling down...
20140208 23:14:20< Coffee_irc> yeah, Li'sar is a likeable character (although recently has had a few too many meals)
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20140208 23:14:58< shadowm> I... don't know how to react to that.
20140208 23:15:07< mattsc> shadowm: I'd say yes.  I get the feeling that a surprising amount of people keeps playing HttT.
20140208 23:15:16< ancestral> Nobles typically were better fed, where peasants were always hungry
20140208 23:15:18< mattsc> Coffee_irc's been sitting in the sun for too long ...
20140208 23:16:26< Coffee_irc> Li'sar is not fat, but put on a bit from the skinny portrait before
20140208 23:16:49< Coffee_irc> makes sense from a semi historical perspective
20140208 23:16:56< shadowm> I'd say that's mostly because they are completely different art styles.
20140208 23:17:05< zookeeper> i'd rather say she's finally started eating at all :p
20140208 23:17:08< shadowm> She actually has armor now, for starters.
20140208 23:17:18< shadowm> And isn't a walking pin-cushion.
20140208 23:18:26< shadowm> Too bad the sprites are still the old ones.
20140208 23:18:38< Coffee_irc> they are well animated
20140208 23:18:51-!- irker432 [~irker@ai0867.net] has quit [Quit: transmission timeout]
20140208 23:19:05< shadowm> Sure, and they don't match her portrait set at all.
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20140208 23:25:02< ancestral> Isn't that like some anime styles that mix Chibi?
20140208 23:25:39< ancestral> Where the sprites are over-emphasized on purpose, and the portraits are regular portraits
20140208 23:26:29< shadowm> Uh, yes, I think I understood all that somehow. But look at her L2 sprite and compare with her portrait -- there is not _just_ a style difference.
20140208 23:27:08< shadowm> Her L3 sprite is probably closer to the portraits.
20140208 23:27:40< Coffee_irc> she's a bit small compared to other level 2s
20140208 23:27:57< Coffee_irc> the level 1 and level 2 are very similar
20140208 23:28:09< shadowm> She has a L1?
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20140208 23:28:32< Coffee_irc> shadowm: there is a level 1 set of sprites for that unit line
20140208 23:28:47< shadowm> Where?
20140208 23:29:07< Coffee_irc> it's animated too
20140208 23:29:09< Coffee_irc> let me find it
20140208 23:29:46< shadowm> Hopefully you aren't thinking of the tutorial, which doesn't count... for several reasons.
20140208 23:29:48< mattsc> Btw, Victoria has 110,000 people and 9 local breweries.
20140208 23:29:53-!- ancestral [~ancestral@63.92.240.233] has quit [Quit: Smell ya later!]
20140208 23:29:59< mattsc> Oops, wrong window  :D
20140208 23:33:33-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140208 23:36:27< shadowm> What does RCA AI mean, again?
20140208 23:36:40< mattsc> Register Candidate Action
20140208 23:36:47< shadowm> Thanks.
20140208 23:41:06< Coffee_irc> shadowm: something like those here http://wiki.wesnoth.org/Contrib:Elvish_Pillager
20140208 23:41:26< Coffee_irc> I can't find the finished sprites, but I've seen them before
20140208 23:41:49< shadowm> You are pointing me to 1.0-style art. :p
20140208 23:42:00< Coffee_irc> shadowm: yeah :P
20140208 23:42:11< EliDupree> lol that [age
20140208 23:42:12< shadowm> It's not obvious to the casual observer, but our sprite style has changed a lot since then.
20140208 23:42:16< EliDupree> *page
20140208 23:42:24< Coffee_irc> it doesn't look as nice as the tidied up level 2 version
20140208 23:42:53< Coffee_irc> but it comes from the same era originally I guess
20140208 23:43:05< EliDupree> The Li'sars from that page were level 2
20140208 23:43:26< Coffee_irc> yeah, the level 1 sprites I mentioned look similar to the level 2 sprites
20140208 23:44:05< Coffee_irc> and hence the size of the level 2 sprite is small compared to other level 2s (this was my main point earlier)
20140208 23:44:27< Coffee_irc> but nearly comparable in size to the elvish druid
20140208 23:45:23< shadowm> The 1.11.9 announcement draft is up: http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=16&t=39985
20140208 23:45:55< shadowm> _8680_: ^
20140208 23:48:08< Coffee_irc> that's pretty nicely worded there shadowm
20140208 23:53:51< shadowm> Well, damn, Firefox now matches Unicode opening and closing curly double/single quotes with ASCII quotes/apostrophes. :
20140208 23:53:58< shadowm> When using CTRL+F.
20140208 23:55:01< Coffee_irc> don't worry, tomorrow there will be a new version of Firefox (version 50) that does things differently again
20140208 23:56:00< shadowm> I mean, that change makes a lot of sense from a user's perspective, but it makes my punctuation normalization work a bit less trivial to do.
--- Log closed Sun Feb 09 00:00:04 2014