--- Log opened Fri Feb 28 00:00:56 2014
20140228 00:06:14-!- Aishiko_laptop [~unknown@cpe-065-191-176-226.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:10:39-!- Grickit is now known as Gambit
20140228 00:12:43-!- aquileia [5fd017e3@gateway/web/freenode/ip.95.208.23.227] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 00:22:19-!- cib0 [~cib@p20030067CE0E5A01267703FFFEE75B84.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:31:36-!- happygrue_ [~happygrue@c-66-30-155-184.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:31:36-!- happygrue_ [~happygrue@c-66-30-155-184.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 00:31:36-!- happygrue_ [~happygrue@wesnoth/developer/wintermute] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:32:24-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 00:34:36-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@190.91.80.125] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:34:48-!- happygrue [~happygrue@wesnoth/developer/wintermute] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 00:35:00-!- shadowm_desktop is now known as Guest8940
20140228 00:38:29-!- melinath [~melinath@li341-41.members.linode.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 00:39:18-!- melinath_ [~melinath@li341-41.members.linode.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:39:18-!- melinath_ is now known as melinath
20140228 00:39:36-!- Spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 00:40:48-!- iwaim___ [~iwaim@2001:2c0:40e:2002:0:4:14:80] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 00:42:15-!- timotei_ [~timotei@wesnoth/developer/timotei] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 00:42:15-!- Crendgrim [~crend@wesnoth/forum-moderator/crendgrim] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 00:42:15-!- Crendgrim_ [~crend@wesnoth/forum-moderator/crendgrim] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:42:16-!- iwaim___ [~iwaim@2001:2c0:40e:2002:0:4:14:80] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:47:12-!- mattsc [~mattsc@fw.hia.nrc.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 00:47:47-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:47:47-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 00:47:47-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:47:47-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Write error: Broken pipe]
20140228 00:47:48-!- Guest8940 [ignacio@190.91.80.125] has quit [Write error: Broken pipe]
20140228 00:47:57-!- melinath_ [~melinath@li341-41.members.linode.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:51:35-!- Grickit [~derek@pa-67-234-76-186.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:51:41-!- Grickit [~derek@pa-67-234-76-186.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 00:51:41-!- Grickit [~derek@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 00:54:04-!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: werlley, melinath
20140228 00:54:04-!- melinath_ is now known as melinath
20140228 01:07:25-!- lobby [~wesnoth@wesnoth/bot/lobby] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 01:07:25-!- Topic for #wesnoth-dev: string+feature freeze active on master | 215 bugs, 350 feature requests, 28 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Alternate logs: http://wesnoth.debian.net | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
20140228 01:07:25-!- Topic set by wesbot [~wesbot@asteria.debian.or.at] [Thu Feb 27 07:27:11 2014]
20140228 01:07:25[Users #wesnoth-dev]
20140228 01:07:25[ _8680_         ] [ DHost_     ] [ Grickit   ] [ lobby      ] [ Samual          ] [ Upth   ] 
20140228 01:07:25[ AI0867         ] [ elias      ] [ happygrue_] [ loonycyborg] [ shadowm         ] [ vultraz] 
20140228 01:07:25[ Aishiko_laptop ] [ EliDupree  ] [ immortui  ] [ LordNasty  ] [ shadowm_desktop2] [ werlley] 
20140228 01:07:25[ alcedine       ] [ enchilado  ] [ irker423  ] [ mattsc     ] [ shikadibot      ] [ wesbot ] 
20140228 01:07:25[ apoi           ] [ Espreon    ] [ Ivanovic  ] [ melinath   ] [ Smar            ] [ Yasin  ] 
20140228 01:07:25[ bumbadadabum   ] [ esr1       ] [ iwaim___  ] [ molgrum    ] [ Soliton         ] [ {V}    ] 
20140228 01:07:25[ ChrisOelmueller] [ exciton_   ] [ janebot   ] [ noy        ] [ stikonas_       ] 
20140228 01:07:25[ cib0           ] [ fabi       ] [ Jetrel_   ] [ nurupo     ] [ timotei_        ] 
20140228 01:07:25[ Crendgrim_     ] [ Fortescue  ] [ justinzane] [ Rhonda     ] [ ToBeFree        ] 
20140228 01:07:25[ crimson_penguin] [ Gallaecio  ] [ kex       ] [ Rishabh    ] [ tomreyn         ] 
20140228 01:07:25[ DDR            ] [ goblinThing] [ knotwork  ] [ sachith500 ] [ trewe           ] 
20140228 01:07:25-!- Irssi: #wesnoth-dev: Total of 61 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 61 normal]
20140228 01:07:29-!- Channel #wesnoth-dev created Tue Jan 27 05:28:41 2009
20140228 01:08:37-!- Irssi: Join to #wesnoth-dev was synced in 80 secs
20140228 01:12:14-!- MaraJade [goossenm@shell.onid.oregonstate.edu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 01:22:06< Aishiko_laptop> how big is wesnoth it seems huge
20140228 01:24:09< Aishiko_laptop> I'll find out once it finishes cloning =0 I just hope I cleared enough space for it!
20140228 01:25:04-!- sachith500|2 [~kvirc@112.134.150.74] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 01:27:40< fabi> Aishiko_laptop: The clone ~1.5gb
20140228 01:28:08< fabi> Aishiko_laptop: My build directory consumes ~6GB.
20140228 01:29:01-!- AI0867_ [~ai@wesnoth/developer/ai0867] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 01:29:09-!- timotei__ [~timotei@wesnoth/developer/timotei] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 01:29:45-!- sachith500 [~kvirc@112.134.150.74] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 01:29:46-!- melinath [~melinath@li341-41.members.linode.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 01:29:47-!- irker423 [~irker@ai0867.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 01:29:48-!- timotei_ [~timotei@wesnoth/developer/timotei] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 01:29:48-!- AI0867 [~ai@wesnoth/developer/ai0867] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 01:30:29-!- melinath [~melinath@li341-41.members.linode.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 01:34:21< Aishiko_laptop> fabi, ouch!  guess I need to clear up some more space (I recently had a HDD failure on my laptop here and went from 500GB to 160GB)
20140228 01:35:07-!- trewe [~trewe@52.210.137.78.rev.vodafone.pt] has quit [Quit: quit]
20140228 01:35:16< fabi> Aishiko_laptop: The build dir includes the source and objects for a debug build. Thus the 6GB are some sort of worst case scenario.
20140228 01:43:31-!- mattsc [~mattsc@fw.hia.nrc.ca] has quit [Quit: Ciao]
20140228 01:47:38-!- happygrue_ [~happygrue@wesnoth/developer/wintermute] has quit [Quit: No Ping reply in 180 seconds.]
20140228 01:47:56-!- happygrue [~happygrue@c-66-30-155-184.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 01:47:56-!- happygrue [~happygrue@c-66-30-155-184.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 01:47:56-!- happygrue [~happygrue@wesnoth/developer/wintermute] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 01:51:23< Aishiko_laptop> I'd rather be prepared for a worse case and not have needed to
20140228 01:53:22< Aishiko_laptop> so knowing that 6GB is likely the worse case scenario (so far) I'll prepare for that =)
20140228 01:55:53-!- JunJM [484dcf0f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.72.77.207.15] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 01:55:58< JunJM> hello
20140228 01:59:15< Aishiko_laptop> hi JunJM 
20140228 02:01:11-!- immortui is now known as dragonofair0
20140228 02:10:21-!- AI0867_ is now known as AI0867
20140228 02:15:40-!- sachith500|2 [~kvirc@112.134.150.74] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 4.2.0 Equilibrium http://www.kvirc.net/]
20140228 02:16:53-!- JunJM [484dcf0f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.72.77.207.15] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 02:22:31-!- matthiaskrgr [matthiaskr@gateway/shell/panicbnc/x-wmpdscurhdwcigof] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 02:25:48-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 02:46:23-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20140228 02:49:27-!- dragonofair0 [~immortui@2601:7:8800:359:9485:73c9:1d26:6e10] has quit [Quit: dragonofair0]
20140228 03:19:13-!- Ivanovic_ [~ivanovic@x2f47985.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 03:22:29-!- Ivanovic [~ivanovic@wesnoth/developer/ivanovic] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 03:23:07-!- Ivanovic_ is now known as Ivanovic
20140228 03:26:30-!- JunJM [484dcf0f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.72.77.207.15] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 03:26:59-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 03:29:36-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has quit [Read error: Operation timed out]
20140228 03:32:38-!- Gallaecio [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 03:35:22-!- mattsc [~mattsc@154.20.32.246] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 03:36:02-!- Gallaecio [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 03:36:24-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 03:36:26< JunJM> Hey there. 
20140228 03:36:50< JunJM> ANy gamers here xD
20140228 03:37:29< AI0867> of course
20140228 03:37:38< goblinThing> another one here.
20140228 03:37:48< JunJM> Everyone here with coding experience or any nubs here
20140228 03:37:53< JunJM> You guys into RTS??
20140228 03:38:14< goblinThing> yeah, total war especially. That and Wesnoth.
20140228 03:38:50< goblinThing> I
20140228 03:39:29< goblinThing> sorry.. I'm unfamiliar with this locale. is it on-topic developer stuff only, or a place where people related to wesnoth just hang out?
20140228 03:40:46< JunJM> Good question... 
20140228 03:41:12< goblinThing> You new, too?
20140228 03:44:28< JunJM> Yea. Just the posting for this and seems pretty awesome. Never have particptated in a open source
20140228 03:44:48< JunJM> Is the bug tracker link for gna.org suppose to raise security flags?
20140228 03:45:09< JunJM> Using chrome, and everytime I try to follow I get a certificiate issue
20140228 03:45:21< vultraz> Yeah, ignore that
20140228 03:46:05< JunJM> fair enough. Just curious. Also, is there any system preferences for these projects?
20140228 03:46:59< vultraz> What type of preference?
20140228 03:47:39< JunJM> Oh like if the projects were better in ubuntu or windows or if it matters at all
20140228 03:48:04< vultraz> Wesnoth works on Windows, Mac OS X, and Linux
20140228 03:48:21< goblinThing> Blast it. beat me to the punch.
20140228 03:48:27< JunJM> msvc ok?
20140228 03:48:31< vultraz> and has devs using all three
20140228 03:48:40< goblinThing> msvc?
20140228 03:48:42< JunJM> i like that
20140228 03:48:48< JunJM> sorry, visual studios
20140228 03:49:08< vultraz> msvc works
20140228 03:49:49< vultraz> also code::blocks (windows), XCode (mac), scons or cmake (all three)
20140228 03:52:58< shadowm> #wesnoth-dev is for development work, #wesnoth is for general chatter; but general chatter isn't uncommon around here when no actual work is being done.
20140228 03:53:47< goblinThing> Ah. Thank you for the clarification. Is actual work being done right now? I'm guessing no?
20140228 03:53:53< vultraz> no
20140228 03:54:01< shadowm> I don't see anyone talking about development work atm.
20140228 03:56:11< goblinThing> Started playing through the campaign with Kalenz recently. Playing with only elvish fighters/archers threw me for a little bit of a loop...
20140228 03:56:32< goblinThing> I was happy when I got the scouts and shamans.
20140228 03:56:59< JunJM> For the project on allocating and display the game statistics, would using a system of booleans work (most optimal)?
20140228 03:57:01< vultraz> Legend of Wesmere?
20140228 03:57:28< goblinThing> That's the one! Can't remember names worth a dead squid.
20140228 03:58:01< goblinThing> I'm on "the treasury".
20140228 03:59:06< shadowm> The maintainer told me to stop at Elves' Last Stand because it was suspected broken or something, I don't know. Good luck, in any case.
20140228 04:00:00< goblinThing> Ah.
20140228 04:01:58< mattsc> JunJM: that might be a question for happygrue 
20140228 04:04:18< JunJM> happygrue: For the project on allocating and display the game statistics, would using a system of booleans work (most optimal)?
20140228 04:04:45< JunJM> I have no idea if that pokes or not...sorry, new to irc
20140228 04:05:10< happygrue> it pokes ;)
20140228 04:05:29< happygrue> I'm not quite sure what you mean, can you elaborate?
20140228 04:11:36-!- Grickit [~derek@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 04:14:00< JunJM> Im interested in this project. I was thinking of having a system of boolean to raise flags and using those to record the data for the database.
20140228 04:14:21< goblinThing> 0_0   ......
20140228 04:14:36< JunJM> for example when the opponent wins the game (destroying others base. ...) their flag is raised true for winner. 
20140228 04:15:11< JunJM> and the code records it
20140228 04:16:21< JunJM> do it however times needed to record each variable
20140228 04:17:00< JunJM> happygrue: does this sound optimal at all.
20140228 04:17:07< goblinThing> What's the end point? You want to try to use it for faction balancing, perhaps?
20140228 04:19:03< happygrue> JunJM: I don't think that would work as described, because the problem is that it's hard to tell when someone has actually won the game - many games end with players agreeing to surrender
20140228 04:19:03< JunJM> Guessing so. Would be a good raw data to go off of to. Somewhere to start an investigation on
20140228 04:19:10< happygrue> and then just leaving the game
20140228 04:20:03< happygrue> so what is needed is a mechanic for the players to easily say which side won or lost.  
20140228 04:20:18< happygrue> we can't assume the side that leaves first is the loser, because sometimes people save the game to continue later
20140228 04:20:31< JunJM> happygrue: ohhhhhh
20140228 04:20:46< goblinThing> How about a mechanic that allows a player to kill their own king?
20140228 04:21:08< goblinThing> Right-click the king, surrender, reduces HP to 0, loses.
20140228 04:21:16< happygrue> that could also work, but however it happens it should be about as easy as possible, and on the way out anyway (next to quit)
20140228 04:21:40< JunJM> ok so I have a secret to tell...
20140228 04:22:02< goblinThing> This is a public location. That might not be a good idea.
20140228 04:22:41< JunJM> no no its not a bad one haha.
20140228 04:23:37-!- tomreyn [~tomreyn@megaglest/team/tomreyn] has quit [Quit: tomreyn]
20140228 04:23:43< JunJM> afk real quick
20140228 04:23:43< goblinThing> Oh, that's not what I meant. My point is that it's not a secret if you talk about it where anyone can hear... or read.
20140228 04:24:36< goblinThing> AFK?
20140228 04:27:42< happygrue> Away From the Keyboard
20140228 04:27:46< happygrue> much like I'm about to be
20140228 04:27:49< happygrue> goodnight!
20140228 04:28:17< goblinThing> Good night.
20140228 04:33:59-!- happygrue [~happygrue@wesnoth/developer/wintermute] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 04:37:16-!- Gallaecio_ [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 04:37:29-!- Gallaecio [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 04:42:00-!- Gallaecio [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 04:42:51-!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: MaraJade, werlley, Gallaecio_, shadowm_desktop2
20140228 04:43:44-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20140228 04:43:57-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@190.91.80.125] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 04:44:00< goblinThing>  what does "[*.net *.split]" mean in IRC terms?
20140228 04:44:20-!- shadowm_desktop is now known as Guest3995
20140228 04:47:40< AI0867> goblinThing: it means that the network (which is a tree) broke in two, so people who are on the other side of the split will disappear from your point of view
20140228 04:47:43-!- Netsplit over, joins: werlley
20140228 04:48:41< AI0867> it's a single link between two servers that breaks, so usually, there's two server names there [serverone servertwo], but freenode decides not to disclose that info
20140228 04:48:41< goblinThing> ...*visuallising*...
20140228 04:49:03< goblinThing> Ok, I think I understand.
20140228 04:49:37< goblinThing> Are you AI on the wesnoth forums?
20140228 04:49:39< AI0867> yes
20140228 04:50:36< goblinThing> Ah! Thanks for telling me how to get on here. I was totally lost.
20140228 04:51:04< JunJM> tell me about it. first time learning about irc
20140228 04:51:20< JunJM> in general. just learned about bouncers and the like. 
20140228 04:53:26< goblinThing> It's kind of funny. Talking to you guys, I'm realising just how much I don't know about the internet.
20140228 04:54:10< goblinThing> ..and computer thing in general.
20140228 04:54:54-!- sachith500_ [c0f80841@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.248.8.65] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 04:58:33-!- goblinThing [44bd8c2c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.189.140.44] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 05:01:08-!- Gallaecio_ [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 05:01:34< JunJM> yea right
20140228 05:01:46< JunJM> events like these just always amaze me
20140228 05:01:56< JunJM> how much more there is to something (w.e that is)
20140228 05:02:08< JunJM> *philosophical rant off
20140228 05:02:54-!- shadowm_desktop2 [ignacio@190.91.80.125] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 05:03:54-!- goblinThing [44bd8c2c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.189.140.44] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 05:04:18< goblinThing> sorry, my internet likes to break. Did I miss anything?
20140228 05:05:34< JunJM> nope
20140228 05:05:34< JunJM> just others connecting and disconnecting.
20140228 05:05:34< JunJM> you here for gsoc?
20140228 05:05:34< goblinThing> Ok, thx.
20140228 05:05:41-!- AI0867_ [~ai@wesnoth/developer/ai0867] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 05:05:46< goblinThing> Why, yes, I am. 
20140228 05:06:23< goblinThing> I'm not going to try to write my proposal 'till tommorow. I din't have the energy right now... 
20140228 05:07:03< Aishiko_laptop> my proposal draft is somewhat ready, it just feels like its missing something
20140228 05:08:17< goblinThing> I really hope to be selected, but I've got an interesting challenge: I don't know a lick of C++. I know Java. I'll learn C++ next semester, but probably not enough to be useful to the Wesnoth project.
20140228 05:08:19< _8680_> goblinThing: You can check the channel logs (URLs available in the channel topic) if you disconnect.
20140228 05:08:30-!- irker074 [~irker@ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 05:08:31< irker074> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth:master 17f305c709b2 / src/serialization/preprocessor.cpp: Some fixes to the whitespace-disallowing http://git.io/zMDnYw
20140228 05:08:31< irker074> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth:master cb86f5e868be / / (39 files in 11 dirs): Merge branch 'master' of github.com:wesnoth/wesnoth http://git.io/ZtPX9Q
20140228 05:08:43< JunJM> which projects are you guys going for if you dont mind me asking
20140228 05:08:49-!- AI0867 [~ai@wesnoth/developer/ai0867] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20140228 05:09:04< JunJM> java and c++ arent so off except of pointers
20140228 05:09:11< AI0867_> shadowm, mattsc: I pushed a fix, but irker seems to be having connectivity issues, like the rest of us
20140228 05:09:21< JunJM> java has garbage collection c++ doesnt
20140228 05:09:40-!- AI0867_ is now known as AI0867
20140228 05:09:46< JunJM> but that also  makes c fast due to the potential micromanage of memory
20140228 05:09:51< goblinThing> @Jun: ...?
20140228 05:11:00-!- Guest3995 [ignacio@190.91.80.125] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 05:11:00-!- Gallaecio [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 05:11:16< JunJM> c++ and java arent too terribly off. you will need to learn some things but you are not completely on square one
20140228 05:12:03< JunJM> the learning curve is much more forgiving in learning the two 
20140228 05:13:31< goblinThing> Yeah, I wasn't on square one with Java, either. I'm a longtime amateur programmer, with Flash Actionscript. I've always meant to get into C++, but could not convince a compiler to work on my computer.
20140228 05:14:21< JunJM> students can get free visual studios (for US, unsure of others). Really good for c++
20140228 05:14:33< JunJM> g++ for ubuntu,
20140228 05:14:46< JunJM> technically eclipse can do c++ if i am correct
20140228 05:14:57< goblinThing> Eclipse can do c++?\
20140228 05:15:04< JunJM> i think it can
20140228 05:15:23-!- Gallaecio_ [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 05:15:26< goblinThing> I [i]love[/i] eclipse.
20140228 05:15:32< JunJM> http://www.eclipse.org/downloads/moreinfo/c.php
20140228 05:15:34< JunJM> haha
20140228 05:15:38< JunJM> glad to help.
20140228 05:15:51< JunJM> gonna head out as its midnight over here.
20140228 05:15:57< JunJM> good chatting. see ya later
20140228 05:16:06< goblinThing> Goodness. Talk to you later.
20140228 05:16:12-!- Gallaecio [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 05:17:08-!- aquileia [52d4193f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.212.25.63] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 05:20:13-!- JunJM [484dcf0f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.72.77.207.15] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 05:23:50-!- Gallaecio_ [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 05:27:59-!- Gallaecio [~quassel@84.120.219.139.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 330 seconds]
20140228 05:29:58< goblinThing> goodbye, all.
20140228 05:30:01-!- goblinThing [44bd8c2c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.68.189.140.44] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
20140228 05:35:13-!- Rishabh [67157d4f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.103.21.125.79] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 05:51:21-!- noy [~Noy@50.98.14.44] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 06:05:13-!- irker074 [~irker@ai0867.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 539 seconds]
20140228 06:15:55-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 06:20:16-!- shadowm_desktop2 [ignacio@190.91.80.125] has quit []
20140228 06:20:43-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 06:24:18-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 06:27:08-!- trademark_ [~trademark@nsg93-8-88-175-59-164.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 06:31:08-!- sachith500_ [c0f80841@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.248.8.65] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
20140228 06:49:49< Aishiko_laptop> the only time to clone is when america is in bed
20140228 07:03:56-!- {V} [~V@72-69-ftth.on.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
20140228 07:04:39-!- {V} [~V@72-69-ftth.on.nl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 07:20:16-!- Ivanovic [~ivanovic@x2f47985.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 07:20:16-!- Ivanovic [~ivanovic@wesnoth/developer/ivanovic] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 07:21:03< Ivanovic> fabi: if a commit broke the stringfreeze: revert that commit!
20140228 07:21:27< fabi> Ivanovic: okay
20140228 07:25:22-!- cib0 [~cib@p20030067CE0E5A01267703FFFEE75B84.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 07:41:53-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 07:43:58-!- boucman_work [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 07:45:22< Aishiko_laptop> I
20140228 07:46:07< Aishiko_laptop> I'm a bit lost I can't seem to find the village naming part of WML I found lots of WML files but so far nothing that deals with how the naming is done
20140228 07:46:29-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 08:00:50-!- Crab_ [~Crab_@wesnoth/developer/crab] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 08:01:09-!- Crab_ [~Crab_@wesnoth/developer/crab] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20140228 08:24:24< shadowm> Ivanovic, fabi: Ehm, no, we agreed that this was a thing that needed to be fixed before 1.12.
20140228 08:27:34< shadowm> fabi: Your commit is rather large and confusing. Which part breaks the string freeze in your opinion?
20140228 08:29:09< shadowm> What is going on in src/reports.cpp line 997, too?
20140228 08:30:43< aquileia> Aishiko_laptop: I was in pretty much the same position some hours ago with map generation. core/macros/names contains a "VILLAGE_NAMES" macro. If you grep for that, you find the [naming] tag and then generate_name()
20140228 08:33:22< shadowm> Ivanovic: We had already decided that the alignment and race sidebar labels needed to return for 1.12, and it's one of the most common complaints since 1.11.8, especially given how important the alignment label is for new players or people trying out the Khalifate for the first time. So, unless you'd rather see the same complaints repeated over and over for the next two years...
20140228 08:33:43-!- alcedine [~alcedine@151.236.26.17] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20140228 08:43:00< Aishiko_laptop> thank you aquileia I'll do that in the morning
20140228 08:45:27< fabi> shadowm: line 997 is work in progress, I need to get a proper tooltip which covers every weapon/attack to give a full set of weapons even when they don't fit the screen.
20140228 08:46:39< shadowm> Is it German for something about someone's posterior? That's what Google Translate seems to believe.
20140228 08:46:51< Aishiko_laptop> I found it, thank you aquileia 
20140228 08:47:13< fabi> shadowm: Yeah, I was a little angry when I wrote it :-)
20140228 08:48:10< shadowm> Okay, but you see now why changes should be properly organized into logical atomic commits?
20140228 08:49:24< shadowm> Okay, I just ran my own pot-update here and I'm getting all kinds of noise in the wrong textdomains even though I have all the correct tools installed.
20140228 08:50:08< fabi> "Level" was changed to "lvl" this one breaks the string freeze.
20140228 08:50:12< shadowm> I guess reviewing pot diffs isn't going to get me anywhere.
20140228 08:51:22< shadowm> fabi: Hm, you think?
20140228 08:51:28< shadowm> shadowm@nanacore:~/src/wesnoth-1.11.10% egrep -ni 'lvl' po/*/*.pot
20140228 08:51:28< shadowm> po/wesnoth/wesnoth.pot:2823:msgid "statuspanel^lvl"
20140228 08:51:28< shadowm> po/wesnoth/wesnoth.pot:4131:msgid "Level^Lvl."
20140228 08:52:09< fabi> hmmm
20140228 08:53:07< Rhonda> Do we have new campaigns in 1.12 vs. 1.10?
20140228 08:53:48< fabi> Rhonda: No more campaigns. But a new faction in MP.
20140228 08:53:56< shadowm> I can't even find "lvl" in the commit.
20140228 08:54:59< fabi> shadowm: In the default.cfg
20140228 08:56:05< shadowm> shadowm@nanacore:~/src/wesnoth% git show -p ca2eec45b96fe5e89e1838a879f8fac231c7cbbc | fgrep -i lvl
20140228 08:56:08< shadowm> Nothing.
20140228 08:56:24< fabi> Cool, then this one is no problem.
20140228 08:56:55< shadowm> These are the translatable string changes I found, though: http://pastebin.com/Ya0qKLNt
20140228 08:57:54< shadowm> I only see one that could actually be a problem, the addition of "VJ/JP".
20140228 08:58:34< shadowm> And "Attacks".
20140228 08:58:34< fabi> Yes
20140228 08:59:11< fabi> "Attacks" will most likely be translated elsewhere.
20140228 08:59:44< shadowm> src/reports.cpp is in the wesnoth textdomain, "Attack" only existed in the wesnoth-lib textdomain in 1.11.10, and "Attacks" didn't exist.
20140228 09:01:00< shadowm> Leaving aside the fact that these were all crammed together into the same commit, I don't think the Attacks/Attack addition could be considered a problem by any reasonable standards.
20140228 09:02:24< fabi> Well, the only idea behind the "Attack" label is it being an Anchor for a detailed and complete weapon list in the form of a tooltip.
20140228 09:03:15< shadowm> The VJ/JP thing, though? That one falls square in the red zone under my standards because I don't even know what it means (... "vision jamming/jamming points"? but that doesn't make sense to me, not that I've ever seen the 'jamming' feature in use anywhere before).
20140228 09:04:14< fabi> "VJ/JP" is only visible in UMC when explicitly called for. They are less important, I can revert them easily.
20140228 09:04:26< fabi> "VP/JP"
20140228 09:07:45< shadowm> Well, my mission here is complete, good to see the whole commit doesn't need to be reverted, geez. Later.
20140228 09:09:31-!- Crab_ [~Crab_@wesnoth/developer/crab] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 09:09:37< fabi> hi Crab_
20140228 09:18:58-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20140228 09:27:48-!- Spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 09:34:40-!- EdB [~edb@85.69.242.6] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 09:40:08-!- Upth [~ogmar@108-85-91-228.lightspeed.frokca.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 09:40:52-!- Upth [~ogmar@108-85-91-228.lightspeed.frokca.sbcglobal.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 09:40:53-!- mattsc [~mattsc@154.20.32.246] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 09:44:00-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 09:44:22-!- mattsc [~mattsc@154.20.32.245] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 09:48:32-!- EdB [~edb@85.69.242.6] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20140228 09:50:30-!- vorobeez [~quassel@85.142.148.12] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 09:50:36-!- EdB [~edb@85.69.242.6] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 09:51:56< vorobeez> Hello, guys. I'am a student. 
20140228 09:52:35< vorobeez> i would like to code for you(google summer code)
20140228 09:53:46< vorobeez> i want to start with fixing some bugs and understand in archetecture of your project
20140228 09:54:35< vorobeez> i'm from Russia and it is hard for me to speak English
20140228 09:55:29< vorobeez> but i understand more or less everything
20140228 09:55:48< vorobeez> who can help me?
20140228 09:57:23< vorobeez> i want to fix this one: https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?17498
20140228 09:58:00< vorobeez> what namespace correspond help-menu?
20140228 10:02:42< vultraz> vorobeez: not many people are around right now
20140228 10:06:51-!- sachith500_ [c0f80841@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.248.8.65] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 10:08:13-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 10:15:37-!- boucman_work [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 10:16:00-!- boucman_work [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 10:35:12-!- Spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 11:00:33-!- Crendgrim_ is now known as Crendgrim
20140228 11:13:06< aquileia> How can I distinguish GUI1 and GUI2? I'm looking at  data\gui\default\macros\vertical_scrollbar.cfg
20140228 11:14:23< aquileia> Is 'namespace gui2' a good indicator?
20140228 11:16:49< aquileia> The [grid] tag is part of GUI2, but I don't know GUI1, so...
20140228 11:17:46-!- Spoffy [~spoffy@2001:630:d0:ed05:516e:69ca:dddb:d767] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 11:20:16-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@f048038060.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 11:20:23< aquileia> Ok, I figured it out...
20140228 11:20:48-!- trademark_ [~trademark@nsg93-8-88-175-59-164.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 11:22:43-!- sachith500_ [c0f80841@gateway/web/freenode/ip.192.248.8.65] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
20140228 11:23:18-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 11:23:27< Soliton> i think everything under data/gui is GUI2.
20140228 11:28:05< aquileia> ok, good to know
20140228 11:28:36< Soliton> vorobeez: see src/help.[hc]pp
20140228 11:28:39< aquileia> I try to do a vertical slider for my mockup from yesterday
20140228 11:29:06< aquileia> It seems that I need a new widget
20140228 11:37:27< aquileia> It would be nice if it was reuseable... what should I do with the three text fields I planned? Have them all in the macro?
20140228 11:38:30< aquileia> again for reference: https://github.com/aquileia/wesnoth-resources/blob/master/other/mockup1.png
20140228 11:39:27< Soliton> you may want to add some context for those of us not currently trying to implement a widget or dialog or whatever. what is "it" and "the macro"?
20140228 11:41:22-!- aquileia [52d4193f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.212.25.63] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
20140228 11:41:34-!- EdB [~edb@85.69.242.6] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20140228 11:41:46-!- aquileia [52d4193f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.212.25.63] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 11:44:09< aquileia> Next to the slider, three text fields would be displayed (in my mockup: deep sea, flat, impassable mountains). Should these be part of the widget? The widget is packed into a macro which then would have three more arguments
20140228 11:44:45< aquileia> Sorry, I have to go right now... I'll read the logs and be back in an hour
20140228 11:51:39-!- DCW [~Thunderbi@cpc66863-finc15-2-0-cust393.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 11:54:57-!- Spoffy [~spoffy@2001:630:d0:ed05:516e:69ca:dddb:d767] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 11:55:08-!- DCW [~Thunderbi@cpc66863-finc15-2-0-cust393.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20140228 11:55:31-!- DCW [~Thunderbi@cpc66863-finc15-2-0-cust393.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 12:07:17< vultraz> Vertical slider? now that would be nice to have
20140228 12:07:35< vultraz> aquileia: that is actually a much simpler mockup than I imagined
20140228 12:11:29< vultraz> However it won't totally suffice
20140228 12:12:12< vultraz> You still need to have a terrain selector, a theme selector, size selector,preview pane, etc
20140228 12:14:54< vultraz> But it's a good start
20140228 12:17:40< zookeeper> aquileia, so let's see if i got this right; there's always 3x3 "tiles", each has a height, and you modify those heights by selecting a tile with the 3x3 radio buttons and then using the slider to adjust its height?
20140228 12:19:32< vultraz> That's how I understand it
20140228 12:20:48< vultraz> (assuming tiles = sections of the map)
20140228 12:27:54-!- sachith500 [~kvirc@112.134.66.180] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 12:37:15-!- DCW [~Thunderbi@cpc66863-finc15-2-0-cust393.4-2.cable.virginmedia.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 12:42:02-!- Aishiko_laptop [~unknown@cpe-065-191-176-226.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 12:42:45< aquileia> vultraz: It's a mockup for the 5 alteration parameters, not for the full dialog
20140228 12:42:53< aquileia> zookeeper: I had something simpler in mind - with 9 areas the 5 parameters (middle, NW, SW, SE, SW) would be overdefined.
20140228 12:43:01< aquileia> Instead I'd let the user select only one and have the code adjust up to 3 parameters, all others are 0
20140228 12:43:35< aquileia> So the functionality is reduced a bit, but the handling is easier
20140228 12:44:41< zookeeper> i don't get it
20140228 12:45:11< zookeeper> "with 9 areas the 5 parameters (middle, NW, SW, SE, SW) would be overdefined."? you mean the generator internally only deals with 5 "directions"?
20140228 12:45:18< aquileia> yes
20140228 12:45:24< zookeeper> oh, okay
20140228 12:45:36< zookeeper> why would you let the user only select one though?
20140228 12:45:46< aquileia> there's the "patch" option to have an arbitrary number, but that's rather advanced
20140228 12:46:32< aquileia> If you want 9 settings - no problem, but IMHO that's too complicated
20140228 12:47:08< zookeeper> too complicated for the user to have to deal with?
20140228 12:47:21-!- stikonas [~gentoo@cpat003.wlan.net.ed.ac.uk] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 12:47:21-!- stikonas [~gentoo@cpat003.wlan.net.ed.ac.uk] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 12:47:21-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 12:47:47< aquileia> Let's say you want mountains all around - why should you manipulate all 8 tiles on the outside if you only have to lower the middle?
20140228 12:48:13< aquileia> Yes, the user interface can't display all options
20140228 12:48:24< aquileia> So I want to reduce the complexity
20140228 12:50:38< aquileia> Right now I have a list of 14 parameters the dialog should handle, 5 out of that are alteration control
20140228 12:53:03< zookeeper> ok, so the generator can give each tile or patch a lot of different parameters, not just height?
20140228 12:58:24< aquileia> It's just height - the other parameters are for all of the map
20140228 12:58:42< zookeeper> okay. in that case...
20140228 12:59:09< zookeeper> how does giving the user the ability to tweak the height of any of the 5/9 tiles take up more space than allowing them to tweak the height of only one?
20140228 12:59:12< aquileia> e.g. number of villages, player castles, additional keeps, burgs (village clusters), ...
20140228 12:59:46< aquileia> It's not about space, it's about clarity
20140228 13:00:42< aquileia> If there is a myjority for fine tuning, I'll offer the option to di so
20140228 13:00:48< aquileia> s/di/do
20140228 13:02:08< aquileia> And it would be a little harder to visualize it on the 9 tiles (but fabi already ha a suggestion to help with that)
20140228 13:02:19-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20140228 13:03:15< zookeeper> well it's not an important issue for me, i just think that it could be designed in a way that would remain clear
20140228 13:04:19< aquileia> let me just post a second mockup
20140228 13:07:27< aquileia> https://github.com/aquileia/wesnoth-resources/blob/master/other/mockup2.png
20140228 13:08:10< aquileia> It grows step by step
20140228 13:09:35< aquileia> If you want all 9 tiles configurable together, I'd use blue and yellow points (which fortunately already exist) for 'above 0' and 'below 0'
20140228 13:10:06< aquileia> white would stay for the selected one
20140228 13:10:07-!- spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 13:10:36< zookeeper> does the slider only have 3 steps or does it just have 3 labels?
20140228 13:10:49< aquileia> 3 labels, about 100 steps
20140228 13:11:16< zookeeper> okay
20140228 13:11:28< aquileia> oh, theoretically 200
20140228 13:11:36< aquileia> -100 to +100
20140228 13:11:42< aquileia> 201
20140228 13:12:00< aquileia> It's just simplification for the UI
20140228 13:13:52< aquileia> But if there are no complaints I'd first implement the single setting version - this can be changed later on
20140228 13:14:09< aquileia> and there's a lot of time before 1.14
20140228 13:14:42< zookeeper> sounds like a decent idea to me
20140228 13:14:52< vultraz> I don't think you need 200 steps
20140228 13:14:59< vultraz> 20 should suffice
20140228 13:15:03< vultraz> maybe even 10
20140228 13:15:12< aquileia> It's what the code enables
20140228 13:15:17< vultraz> Really?
20140228 13:15:31< aquileia> I can of course say that only multiples of 5 are chosen
20140228 13:15:58< aquileia> probably a better solution
20140228 13:17:00< zookeeper> one thing that's not relevant for you right now but which does relate to setting heights etc; it'd be handy if the generator could take the existing map as a "base" and then further evolve it. like, if you wanted a river to flow through the map, you could just draw a thick line of deep water through the map and the generator would respect that.
20140228 13:17:25< aquileia> That's exactly the reason YAMG is vastly superior
20140228 13:17:33< zookeeper> oh.
20140228 13:17:52< aquileia> As long as 'seed' stays the same, you only get variations
20140228 13:18:13< aquileia> and the river would be a 'patch'
20140228 13:18:25< vultraz> well you definitely seem to understand the code
20140228 13:18:37< aquileia> not really
20140228 13:18:44< vultraz> What about seed selection, however?
20140228 13:18:48< aquileia> all the interfaces are driving me crazy
20140228 13:18:56< vultraz> In the standalone version you could specify one
20140228 13:19:29< aquileia> It's not yet in the mockup - but it'll be in the dialog for sure
20140228 13:20:25< vultraz> I think perhaps we should ask LordBob for help with the mockup
20140228 13:20:33< vultraz> Or I could do one
20140228 13:20:57< aquileia> There will be a text field and a 'random' button, so you can either specify a seed you know or experiment
20140228 13:21:41< vultraz> Makes sense
20140228 13:21:44< aquileia> No need to hurry, I won't be able to implement it the next two weeks
20140228 13:23:47< aquileia> Hmm... if the white point (arrows_center_25-active) would be team-colored, that would be nice however (right now there are only 3 colors)
20140228 13:24:26< vultraz> Why do you need such?
20140228 13:24:30< aquileia> I could do it myself, but LordBob would be a lot faster
20140228 13:25:11< aquileia> If - an only if - all 9 tiles should be functional at once, their current height should be displayed as a color map
20140228 13:25:51< aquileia> e.g. from deep blue to light blue to light yellow to bright yellow
20140228 13:26:03< vultraz> Hm...
20140228 13:26:11< vultraz> I don't think that's optimal
20140228 13:26:23< aquileia> but as I said I'll first implement it without that gimmick
20140228 13:26:34< aquileia> proposals?
20140228 13:28:30< aquileia> In case LorBob reads this in the logs - it's not yet necessary, and I just noticed it'd be the -30 version, not -25
20140228 13:29:42-!- Jetrel_ [~Jetrel@c-75-73-180-126.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: Textual IRC Client: www.textualapp.com]
20140228 13:30:20< vultraz> I propose to use the new color-coded minimap. As the map would be regenerated live and the results shown there anyway, a user could simply look at that to see their results (also toggle between map and satellite)
20140228 13:31:27< aquileia> that's damn hard... parsing the height map YAMG creates isn't easy...
20140228 13:32:06< aquileia> Or do you mean just the regular minimap?
20140228 13:32:24< vultraz> Yes
20140228 13:32:37< vultraz> However....
20140228 13:32:45< vultraz> I'm not sure if it's GUI2 yet
20140228 13:32:51< vultraz> It might have to be converted
20140228 13:34:25< vultraz> It's part of the theme widgets and the theme code is still GUI2
20140228 13:34:27< vultraz> er
20140228 13:34:29< aquileia> I'll keep that in mind, but right now that's distant future (and I don't want to dive into minimap code...)
20140228 13:34:29< vultraz> GUI1
20140228 13:35:52< vultraz> GUI2 is supposed to eventually take over all graphical aspects but....well...it was started in 2008 :/
20140228 13:36:29< aquileia> Converting the minimap, fixing YAMG, creating a widget and a dialog, implementing the interface to YAMG ... that's far from an EasyCoding task
20140228 13:36:57-!- spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20140228 13:36:58< vultraz> Definitely
20140228 13:37:06< aquileia> Please keep in mind I'm only here since about two weeks
20140228 13:37:30< aquileia> Playing for years isn't helping with code
20140228 13:39:04< aquileia> So the minimap would have to be one by someone else, the best I could do are TC points on the tiles
20140228 13:39:20< aquileia> s/one/done
20140228 13:39:58 * aquileia looks at fabi...
20140228 13:42:33< aquileia> vultraz: And is real-time minimap updating doable?
20140228 13:43:11< vultraz> aquileia: it's what happens when you use the map editor. also when you use the generator in the mp create screen
20140228 13:43:13< vultraz> so yes
20140228 13:43:42< aquileia> IIRC pyrophorous wrote that it won't work for all of the map due to calculating the transitions, but on the minimap... no idea
20140228 13:44:29< aquileia> with real-time I mean that while you use the slider the map would be dynamically adapted
20140228 13:45:07< aquileia> You would see the mountains rising from the ocean...
20140228 13:45:37< aquileia> but I will not implement it, that's sure
20140228 13:45:59< vultraz> just feed the same thing into it as you would if drawing a large range of mountains in the editor
20140228 13:46:10< vultraz> it's simple...ish...maybe...I think...
20140228 13:48:35< aquileia> I hope I can get it working at all (widget + dialog + interface), and such additional things are unrealistic for my level
20140228 13:49:40< aquileia> of course you are invited to add them!
20140228 13:50:00< vultraz> Are you planning on implementing this?
20140228 13:50:40< aquileia> I'll leave a big open space 'TODO vultraz' there
20140228 13:50:52< aquileia> I'll try at least
20140228 13:51:29< aquileia> else all the time you devs invested to answer my questions would be wasted, and I don't want that
20140228 13:52:50< aquileia> But like I said, the minimap will be a hole left open for someone more knowledgeable
20140228 13:53:50-!- Bodhi-Baum [~Bodhi@dslb-084-063-038-094.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 13:54:05-!- Bodhi-Baum [~Bodhi@dslb-084-063-038-094.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 13:54:21-!- Bodhi-Baum [~Bodhi@dslb-084-063-038-094.pools.arcor-ip.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 13:55:44-!- mattsc [~mattsc@154.20.32.245] has quit [Quit: Computer's napping]
20140228 13:58:40-!- Bodhi-Baum [~Bodhi@dslb-084-063-038-094.pools.arcor-ip.net] has quit [Client Quit]
20140228 14:04:35-!- mattsc [~mattsc@207.230.251.234] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 14:15:43< mattsc> AI0867: thank you!  I confirmed that everything works again for me.
20140228 14:16:19-!- Spoffy [~spoffy@2001:630:d0:ed05:516e:69ca:dddb:d767] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 14:19:40-!- cib0 [~cib@p20030067CE0E5A01267703FFFEE75B84.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 14:26:12-!- Aishiko_laptop [~unknown@198.85.71.253] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 14:28:02-!- iceiceice [~chris@cpe-66-108-20-80.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 14:28:12< iceiceice> hi i have a quick AI question:
20140228 14:28:31< iceiceice> i remember reading something about the "machine learning recruiter", this is now the default AI recruitment stage, right?
20140228 14:28:57< iceiceice> if you want to use it with a non-default era / faction, don't you need to have a training phase or something for it to work right?
20140228 14:28:57< mattsc> Not quite  :)
20140228 14:29:28< mattsc> The new default recruitment stage is what flix did for his GSoC project last year
20140228 14:30:19< mattsc> The machine learning recruiter was an experimental project done by SeattleDad that so far only exists as part of the AI-demos add-on.
20140228 14:30:41< mattsc> And to answer last question: yes
20140228 14:30:49< mattsc> *your last question
20140228 14:31:43< iceiceice> i see
20140228 14:31:56< iceiceice> how does flix's recruiter work?
20140228 14:33:02< mattsc> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/AI_Recruitment
20140228 14:34:07< mattsc> iceiceice: in addition to that, there's also Alarantalara's recruiter (which seems to have a slight edge over flix' in some situations, even though overall it seems pretty close)
20140228 14:34:37< mattsc> That one is in the 'Experimental AI' and is the 'rush recruiting' Micro AI 
20140228 14:34:57-!- Spoffy [~spoffy@2001:630:d0:ed05:516e:69ca:dddb:d767] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 14:35:28< mattsc> And if you ever start an MP game in debug mode, you'll notice a whole bunch more recruiting AI attempts, but none of the other ones is even close to these.
20140228 14:36:09< iceiceice> i see, thanks
20140228 14:41:27< mattsc> I have a question of my own: why does the first screen of the MP creating dialogs not remember the last map I chose any more?
20140228 14:41:58< mattsc> fabi, thunderstruck: ^  are you able to answer that, or somebody else?
20140228 14:41:58< mattsc> s/creating/creation
20140228 14:47:06< aquileia> vultraz: I only have 480 px height, right?
20140228 14:47:44< aquileia> vultraz, zookeeper : updated concept https://github.com/aquileia/wesnoth-resources/blob/master/other/mockup2.png
20140228 14:53:02< aquileia> I'll have to move the lower part to the side, below the minimap... then it'll fit into 480
20140228 14:54:34< aquileia> I'll ask fabi whether there's an easy way to have two different layouts for small screens and PCs
20140228 14:54:54-!- boucman_work [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 14:55:14< vultraz> aquileia: too tall
20140228 14:55:20< vultraz> use some horizontal space
20140228 14:55:47< aquileia> [15:53] <aquileia> I'll have to move the lower part to the side
20140228 14:56:31-!- boucman_work [~rosen@193.56.60.160] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 14:56:33-!- boucman_work [~rosen@193.56.60.160] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 14:56:33-!- boucman_work [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 14:57:07< aquileia> should the minimap be to the left or right? I somehow prefer left, but see no reason for that
20140228 14:57:51< aquileia> perhaps it's because it's there in the load dialog
20140228 14:59:31-!- Jetrel [~Jetrel@c-75-73-180-126.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 15:02:37-!- ChrisOelmueller [~eoc@2a01:238:42b6:4400:f140:fff4:e413:e393] has left #wesnoth-dev ["Where's those banana cream pies, eh?  He dangles two pillows and watches her."]
20140228 15:04:01< vultraz> aquileia: top right corner
20140228 15:04:26< aquileia> wait a sec, I'll change the mockup
20140228 15:05:13-!- irker194 [~irker@ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 15:05:13< irker194> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth:master 0b6fa7ed192e / data/ai/lua/generic_rush_engine.lua: Experimental AI: remove potential of causing errors through WML events http://git.io/TOU6fQ
20140228 15:05:13< irker194> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth:master 496a58d343fa / data/ai/lua/ (generic_recruit_engine.lua generic_rush_engine.lua move_to_any_target.lua): Experimental AI: use checked versions of the AI actions http://git.io/E-7X_Q
20140228 15:06:29-!- mattsc [~mattsc@207.230.251.234] has quit [Quit: Computer's napping]
20140228 15:07:16-!- thunderstruck [~zaibotren@cpc13-sgyl31-2-0-cust696.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 15:09:36< aquileia> vultraz: https://github.com/aquileia/wesnoth-resources/blob/master/other/mockup3.png
20140228 15:10:12-!- Delfinisko [~Delfinisk@46.229.231.211.vnet.sk] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 15:10:44< vultraz> you know you could put the mockup in dropbox or edit the same file instead of committing a new instance each time
20140228 15:11:15< vultraz> What is "Multiplayer Balancing"?
20140228 15:12:04< aquileia> pyro has a mp mode where village distribution is controlled more tightly
20140228 15:12:30< aquileia> meaning each player has approximately exual income
20140228 15:13:02< aquileia> in sp you don't need that, so the maps can be more appealing
20140228 15:13:14< aquileia> s/exual/equal
20140228 15:13:55< Delfinisko> do anyone know about a scenario, when player have to control all villages to win? or something similar?
20140228 15:13:56< aquileia> Ivanovic: ^ Would this work with the pandora?
20140228 15:14:07< thunderstruck> 0140228 14:41:27< mattsc> I have a question of my own: why does the first screen of the MP creating dialogs not remember the last map I chose any more?
20140228 15:14:14< thunderstruck> Do you know when did it stop working?
20140228 15:15:57-!- MaraJade [goossenm@shell.onid.oregonstate.edu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 15:16:55< Aishiko_laptop> aquileia, thanks for the assistance in finding the names however, it only has a listing of names (first names) I'm still on the hunt for the rest of the macro information =) I'll let you know what I find
20140228 15:17:03< vultraz> aquileia: generally, it looks pretty good. A few things would be tweaked in the actual dialog, but for now, nice start 
20140228 15:18:56< aquileia> Aishiko_laptop: I gave you some hints for what you should search... the [naming] tag and the generate_name() function. The latter should be what you want to work on, I think
20140228 15:19:29< aquileia> vultraz: what tweaks? The better the mockup the better the result
20140228 15:19:50< vultraz> Positions of widgets so they fit in the grid, etc.
20140228 15:20:02< vultraz> Extending the text boxes to fill that empty space
20140228 15:20:13< zookeeper> Delfinisko, the second scenario of DiD probably
20140228 15:20:25< vultraz> Making the elevation check boxes flush with the label to the left
20140228 15:20:36< vultraz> Don;t forget it needs a title
20140228 15:20:50< Aishiko_laptop> aquileia, right sorry, I wasn't really coherent then.  I feel a bit slow at the moment
20140228 15:21:00< vultraz> Capitalize labels
20140228 15:21:20< vultraz> I'm really not sure what you mean by Burgs
20140228 15:21:46< vultraz> Don't forget the Generate and Cancel buttons
20140228 15:22:01< aquileia> The title will be the biggest problem... it's already 456 px
20140228 15:22:08-!- cib0 [~cib@p20030067CE0E5A01267703FFFEE75B84.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 15:22:22< vultraz> aquileia: there are other dialogs bigger than 456
20140228 15:22:24< zookeeper> what's wrong with >456px?
20140228 15:22:49< aquileia> I think 480 is the limit
20140228 15:22:53< aquileia> isn't it?
20140228 15:22:54< vultraz> No
20140228 15:23:06< zookeeper> i don't know what's the smallest officially supported res
20140228 15:23:35< vultraz> I think 480xsomething
20140228 15:23:53< aquileia> Ivanovic: The pandora is 480x640 and thereby minimum resolution, right?
20140228 15:24:09< AI0867> 800x480
20140228 15:24:10< vultraz> aquileia: minimum, not maximum
20140228 15:25:01< zookeeper> well i'm sure it'd be fine to just not have the title if it can't fit.
20140228 15:25:25-!- mattsc [~mattsc@fw.hia.nrc.ca] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 15:25:44< zookeeper> although i dunno how easily you can make it conditional like that
20140228 15:27:20< vultraz> Um, you can have dialogs larger than 400x800
20140228 15:27:26< vultraz> 480
20140228 15:27:39< _8680_> vultraz: If this is pyrophorous’s map generator, I believe ‘burgs’ are clusters of villages.
20140228 15:29:20< aquileia> Yes, _8680_ is right
20140228 15:30:46< mattsc> thunderstruck: not exactly, but I just checked and it is still working in 1.11.7 and not in 1.11.8
20140228 15:30:59< aquileia> In MP mode those lables would change however - the slider would instead control the number of spread villages (those that aren't considered property of one of the players)
20140228 15:31:49< aquileia> pyrophorous only supports burgs in SP
20140228 15:32:47< aquileia> in MP there would be balance objections to village clusters
20140228 15:33:11< Soliton> i'd call that option equal village distribution or so. "multiplayer balancing" suggests much more...
20140228 15:33:32< Soliton> (and is obviously unrealistic.)
20140228 15:34:28< mattsc> Delfinisko: in SotBE S11, you must be in control of all villages in the north when turns run out or you'll lose.  Does that count as "or something similar"?
20140228 15:36:39< aquileia> Soliton: there are also randomly spread villages - would you rather chose 'mp village distribution' or 'equal village distribution' ?
20140228 15:37:16< aquileia> and is everybody else ok with this change?
20140228 15:37:35< aquileia> s/chose/choose
20140228 15:38:09< Delfinisko> mattsc: yep, i will look at it. also second map on descent into darkness :)
20140228 15:38:11< aquileia> oh and it also influences the keeps
20140228 15:39:46< Soliton> maybe just call it "balanced" then and have a tooltip explain what it exactly does.
20140228 15:39:55-!- noy [~Noy@50.98.14.44] has quit [Quit: noy]
20140228 15:40:52< aquileia> A lot of work for 1.14 translators
20140228 15:41:29< Soliton> if you're going to write an essay, i suppose so.
20140228 15:41:34< aquileia> but if it isn't a tooltip, it would have to be in the help
20140228 15:41:45< thunderstruck> mattsc: That's a bit strange. I'll check it later.
20140228 15:42:08< Soliton> i'd leave out multiplayer references unless it really has anything to do with multiplayer games.
20140228 15:42:22-!- Spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 15:42:23< aquileia> In fact I love concise explanations
20140228 15:42:48< mattsc> thunderstruck: okay, thanks.  Btw, it does remember all other settings, it's only the map that is affected.
20140228 15:43:09< thunderstruck> at least eras should be remembered as well
20140228 15:43:12< Soliton> i mean it could be mentioned in the tooltip as an example use but it does not seem to be more than that.
20140228 15:43:22< mattsc> let me check that
20140228 15:43:22< aquileia> ok
20140228 15:44:45< mattsc> thunderstruck: yes, era is remembered
20140228 15:44:53-!- spoffy_ [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 15:45:06< aquileia> Well, that's a lot of feedback - thanks! I have to work on something else for now, but as soon as I have the time I'll try to implement the dialog.
20140228 15:45:14< aquileia> Bye
20140228 15:47:13< Aishiko_laptop> bye and thank you again
20140228 15:47:40< Aishiko_laptop> who knew being awake when talking actually results in better memory retention?
20140228 15:49:13-!- spoffy_ [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has quit [Client Quit]
20140228 15:51:09-!- tomreyn [~tomreyn@megaglest/team/tomreyn] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 15:52:46-!- happygrue [~happygrue@c-66-30-155-184.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 15:52:46-!- happygrue [~happygrue@c-66-30-155-184.hsd1.ma.comcast.net] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 15:52:46-!- happygrue [~happygrue@wesnoth/developer/wintermute] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 16:05:52-!- aquileia [52d4193f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.212.25.63] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
20140228 16:16:57< irker194> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth:master c89449786e2c / src/ai/configuration.cpp: Change deprecation version for AI aspects http://git.io/fsr0Xg
20140228 16:17:00< irker194> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth:master 910f8c9d4df6 / changelog: Update changelog with AI bug fixes http://git.io/_Sl8WQ
20140228 16:20:15< mattsc> Ivanovic: with that ^ I am done with my current round of bug fixes and am ready for a release this weekend
20140228 16:20:57< zookeeper> shadowm, how far along are you in EI?
20140228 16:26:04-!- Spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has quit [Excess Flood]
20140228 16:27:25-!- spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 16:27:57< spoffy> Why is the UMCD so heavily buried in Wesnoth's game files?
20140228 16:29:49< Soliton> what's UMCD?
20140228 16:30:56< vultraz> successor of wesnothd, IIRC
20140228 16:31:08< spoffy> User Made Content Daemon. Yeah.
20140228 16:31:32< spoffy> Oh, no.
20140228 16:31:41< spoffy> Success of... campaignd I think.
20140228 16:31:52< Soliton> sounds more plausible.
20140228 16:32:14< Soliton> so what exactly are you talking about?
20140228 16:32:28< spoffy> I'm hoping to take it on as a gsoc project, I was looking through the code and it's in wesnoth-old/src/umcd 
20140228 16:32:55< spoffy> Since it's pretty much a seperate application, it seems weird to buried in the main wesnoth source.
20140228 16:33:27< Soliton> well, you really have to give a link or something. whatever you're talking about is not in wesnoth-old afaict.
20140228 16:33:35< spoffy> Ah, sorry.
20140228 16:33:38< Soliton> which is just wesnoth now, btw.
20140228 16:33:51< spoffy> Hehe, I should probably rename the folder on my hdd.
20140228 16:34:04< spoffy> Yeah, it's in branch 'asio_umcd'
20140228 16:34:13< Soliton> i guess then that you're talking about trademark's gsoc project from last year.
20140228 16:34:19< spoffy> That'll be the one.
20140228 16:34:29< Soliton> ok, no idea. :-P
20140228 16:34:34< spoffy> Haha :L
20140228 16:35:02< Soliton> being in a sub dir doesn't sound too bad though.
20140228 16:35:14< spoffy> Yeah, but it's not covered by wesnoth's build system either.
20140228 16:35:18< spoffy> It needs its own.
20140228 16:35:24< spoffy> So it'd be a project in a project.
20140228 16:35:39< Soliton> that sounds odd indeed.
20140228 16:36:04< spoffy> I'm tempted to try and remove it, but not sure if it's permitted :P
20140228 16:42:21< Rhonda> #
20140228 16:43:01< happygrue> 6!
20140228 16:43:19-!- sachith500|2 [~kvirc@112.135.13.143] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 16:45:21< happygrue> 42?
20140228 16:45:55< happygrue> What is the advantage of updating the changelog with a seperate commit?  I don't understand why it is ideal.
20140228 16:46:01-!- sachith500 [~kvirc@112.134.66.180] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20140228 16:47:47< Soliton> it helps when porting changes to a different branch (with a different changelog).
20140228 16:48:01< happygrue> I see
20140228 16:48:02< Soliton> i don't consider it ideal though.
20140228 16:48:39< happygrue> I haven't been, I was wondering if I should start but I just want to know why
20140228 16:49:10< Soliton> IMO changelog entries belong to the commit even if the above mentioned can be a hassle.
20140228 16:49:55< Soliton> i think most people just often forget to add to the changelog and thus do that in a later commit.
20140228 16:50:28< Soliton> is the seperate changelog commit mentioned somewhere?
20140228 16:50:42< happygrue> I would never do that...
20140228 16:50:43 * happygrue steps out in a fit of coughing
20140228 16:51:02< mattsc> happygrue: you're talking about my last commit?
20140228 16:51:11-!- boucman_work [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20140228 16:51:27< happygrue> no actually, this:  http://wiki.wesnoth.org/Git_for_Wesnoth_Crash_Course
20140228 16:51:41< happygrue> in step 3 in the middle
20140228 16:51:44< mattsc> oh, okay
20140228 16:52:04< happygrue> but I have seen it happen a few times, I was just curious if I was doing it wrong?  Or what the advantages are either way
20140228 16:52:06< happygrue> iceiceice: ^
20140228 16:52:17< mattsc> happygrue: in my case, if I make a single change, I try to add the changelog entry to that commit (although often I forget)
20140228 16:52:35< happygrue> shame on you, for forgetting something like that
20140228 16:52:38 * happygrue starts coughing again
20140228 16:52:40< mattsc> If it's a series of commits that only have one changelog entry, I usually do that latter separately.
20140228 16:52:49< happygrue> yeah, that makes sense
20140228 16:53:01< mattsc> Yes, I hang my head in shame.  Repeatedly.
20140228 16:53:20< mattsc> But I just do that because it "feels right to me", not because I have any real reason.
20140228 16:53:42< mattsc> happygrue: btw, you need to check your maths.  6! = 720, not 42.
20140228 16:54:15< happygrue> well, I can imagine there being reasons for changelog commits being seperate, if it makes stuff easier to read for someone somewhere... but it also means reverting a commit where the changelog was edited elsewhere is another thing someone has to remember...
20140228 16:54:29< happygrue> mattsc: it was a seperate guess, I assumed 720 was not the right number ;)
20140228 16:54:39< mattsc> I see  :)
20140228 16:55:48< mattsc> However, the real answer is 42424242
20140228 16:56:30< mattsc> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/src/pathfind/pathfind.hpp#L63
20140228 16:58:30< happygrue> heh
20140228 16:58:59< happygrue> I think what we really need to know is the question...
20140228 17:00:39< mattsc> If you can wait 10 million years ...   and with that I'll pull out of this ;)
20140228 17:01:02-!- spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has quit [Excess Flood]
20140228 17:01:29-!- spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:02:09< happygrue> I'll let you know how it turns out.
20140228 17:02:21-!- trademark_ [~trademark@nsg93-8-88-175-59-164.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:03:37-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:08:58-!- [1]Delfinisko [~Delfinisk@ip-85.163.221.165.o2inet.sk] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:11:12-!- Delfinisko [~Delfinisk@46.229.231.211.vnet.sk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 17:11:13-!- [1]Delfinisko is now known as Delfinisko
20140228 17:11:30-!- cib0 [~cib@p20030067CE0E5A01267703FFFEE75B84.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:11:59-!- Soliton [~Soliton@wesnoth/developer/soliton] has quit [Quit: Battle for Wesnoth: http://www.wesnoth.org/]
20140228 17:13:44-!- Soliton [~Soliton@wesnoth/developer/soliton] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:17:23-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 17:18:56-!- cib0 [~cib@p20030067CE0E5A01267703FFFEE75B84.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 17:21:35-!- cib0 [~cib@p20030067CE0E5A01267703FFFEE75B84.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:26:08-!- stikonas [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:26:08-!- stikonas [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 17:26:08-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:30:19-!- thunderstruck [~zaibotren@cpc13-sgyl31-2-0-cust696.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Quit: leaving]
20140228 17:36:41< Aishiko_laptop> I think I've found the right function to modify, however, I'm undecided on how I want to make the changes.  To add more naming options for the villages.  Wait a second it looks like its already been done, it appears to have swamps, mountains, bridges, roads, forests, as well as lakes and rivers....
20140228 17:37:03-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:37:37 * Aishiko_laptop is trying to do the easy coding task of expanding the naming of villages to use more then rivers and lake names as a second naming article.
20140228 17:39:10< happygrue> shadowm: regarding the sidebar you mentioned yesterday, the change to be looking at is the alignment display, there isn't another change I'm missing, right?
20140228 17:39:29< Aishiko_laptop> could I get someone else to take a look and see if I'm right or if I'm miss reading it?  mapgen.cpp lines 1334-1383~?
20140228 17:39:58< happygrue> the font is a bit faded, but I guess that is intended for effect?  I don't have a problem with it, it's much better than it was - though the case could be made to make it easier to read I guess
20140228 17:40:00 * happygrue shrugs
20140228 17:40:43< happygrue> Aishiko_laptop: if it's already in there but you wanted to add something, having the closest village named after the leader would be fun.  :D
20140228 17:41:10< happygrue> afk a few
20140228 17:43:03-!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: irker194, spoffy, vorobeez, stikonas, MaraJade, mattsc, Delfinisko, noy, Crab_, kex,  (+5 more, use /NETSPLIT to show all of them)
20140228 17:44:16-!- Netsplit over, joins: Soliton
20140228 17:46:37-!- MaraJade [goossenm@shell.onid.oregonstate.edu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:50:42-!- Crab_ [~Crab_@222-26.63-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:50:42-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:50:42-!- spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:50:42-!- stikonas [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:50:42-!- trademark_ [~trademark@nsg93-8-88-175-59-164.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:51:48-!- Crab_ [~Crab_@222-26.63-188.cust.bluewin.ch] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20140228 17:51:59-!- spoffy_ [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:52:25< Aishiko_laptop> well my easy coding task was not actually available, ohhhh well
20140228 17:52:27-!- spoffy [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has quit [Client Quit]
20140228 17:52:46-!- spoffy_ is now known as spoffy
20140228 17:53:12-!- Delfinisko [~Delfinisk@ip-85.163.221.165.o2inet.sk] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:56:11< Aishiko_laptop> are we allowed to use special characters in the passwords for the wiki?
20140228 17:59:42-!- stikonas [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 17:59:42-!- trademark_ [~trademark@nsg93-8-88-175-59-164.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 17:59:44-!- stikonas [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 17:59:44-!- stikonas [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 17:59:44-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:00:38-!- exciton_ [chuck-the-@89.208.170.132] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20140228 18:00:52-!- exciton [chuck-the-@89.208.170.132] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:04:54-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 18:05:17-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@f048038060.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:09:05-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 18:11:15-!- qal [~sabban@reverse-62.fdn.fr] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:11:26-!- qal is now known as manu___
20140228 18:12:17-!- Jetrel [~Jetrel@c-75-73-180-126.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:13:26-!- sabban__ [~sabban@reverse-62.fdn.fr] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:14:08-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:16:37-!- sabban__ [~sabban@reverse-62.fdn.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 18:16:37-!- manu___ [~sabban@reverse-62.fdn.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 18:17:44-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 18:19:42-!- kex [~kex@212.158.180.2] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:22:18-!- stikonas [~gentoo@anon-40-81.vpn.ipredator.se] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:22:18-!- stikonas [~gentoo@anon-40-81.vpn.ipredator.se] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 18:22:18-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:25:13-!- mattsc [~mattsc@fw.hia.nrc.ca] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:25:44-!- Aishiko_laptop [~unknown@198.85.71.253] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20140228 18:26:34-!- aquileia [52d4193f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.212.25.63] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:31:52-!- 17SAAMJIO [~trademark@nsg93-8-88-175-59-164.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:33:37< Soliton> i'd assume utf8 is valid.
20140228 18:38:02-!- Kexoth [~kex@89.205.75.19] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:38:22-!- Kexoth [~kex@89.205.75.19] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 18:38:59-!- Kexoth [~kex@89.205.75.19] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:40:48-!- kex [~kex@212.158.180.2] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 18:43:12-!- Kexoth [~kex@89.205.75.19] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 18:46:34-!- aquileia [52d4193f@gateway/web/freenode/ip.82.212.25.63] has quit [Quit: Page closed]
20140228 18:52:47-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:52:47-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 18:52:47-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 18:52:48-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 19:05:46-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@apn-89-223-200-71.vodafone.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 19:45:54-!- 17SAAMJIO is now known as trademark_
20140228 19:46:11< AI0867> fabi: there's a hotkey for toggle_ellipses, but it seems to me that that preference doesn't actually do anything anymore
20140228 19:46:22< AI0867> ellipses are controlled by "show team color"
20140228 19:46:55< AI0867> I'm not sure why I'm telling this to you in particular, other than the fact that there's a hotkey involved
20140228 19:54:05-!- iceiceice [~chris@cpe-66-108-20-80.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20140228 19:55:07-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20140228 19:55:08-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@apn-89-223-200-71.vodafone.hu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 20:02:10< Delfinisko> question here. i wish to modify a scenario
20140228 20:02:38< Delfinisko> so i can recruit woses only if one wose from previous scenario survived
20140228 20:03:00< Delfinisko> at start of this scenario, that wose is also recalled
20140228 20:03:34< zookeeper> in an event, use an [if] to check if the player side's recall list contains a wose and then use [recall] and [allow_recruit] in it.
20140228 20:03:41< Delfinisko> so something like if i have id=thiswose, then it will modify side 1 to allow recruit woses
20140228 20:04:33< Delfinisko> yep, exactly. just not sure about syntax. but it looks simple (by plain logic :D)
20140228 20:04:57< zookeeper> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/ReferenceWML
20140228 20:11:49< Delfinisko> 	[event]
20140228 20:11:50< Delfinisko> 		side=1
20140228 20:11:50< Delfinisko>  [if]
20140228 20:11:50< Delfinisko>     [has_unit]
20140228 20:11:50< Delfinisko>        id=Tambaddum
20140228 20:11:50< Delfinisko>     [/has_unit]
20140228 20:11:50< Delfinisko>     [then]
20140228 20:11:51< Delfinisko>        [allow_recruit]]
20140228 20:11:51< Delfinisko> 			type=Wose
20140228 20:11:52< Delfinisko> 			side=1
20140228 20:11:57< Delfinisko>        [/allow_recruit]]
20140228 20:11:57< Delfinisko>     [/then]
20140228 20:11:57< Delfinisko>  [/if]
20140228 20:11:57< Delfinisko> [/event]
20140228 20:13:52< Delfinisko> okay, or... not okay?
20140228 20:14:27< AI0867> not okay
20140228 20:14:35< AI0867> an [event] triggers at some point
20140228 20:14:44< AI0867> when should this trigger?
20140228 20:15:09< AI0867> [if] is ActionWML. It's executable content for an [event], not a filter
20140228 20:16:41< Delfinisko> yep, you are right. i can add it after some messages inside start event, not as additional event
20140228 20:16:57-!- Aishiko_laptop [~unknown@cpe-065-191-176-226.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 20:19:00-!- spoffy_ [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 20:19:06-!- spoffy_ [~spoffy@152.78.175.8] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20140228 20:20:24-!- trademark_ [~trademark@nsg93-8-88-175-59-164.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 20:22:04-!- trademark_ [~trademark@nsg93-8-88-175-59-164.fbx.proxad.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 20:25:33< Delfinisko> okay, one last thing. i wish to add an orcish grunt on selected x,y - every two turns. how to do such a cycle?
20140228 20:26:26-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 20:28:05< Delfinisko> in another words, new grunt will show himself on turn 2, 4, 6 etc
20140228 20:30:48-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 20:41:39-!- ALourenco [0252303e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.82.48.62] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 20:41:55< ALourenco> Hello
20140228 20:42:09< Delfinisko> hi
20140228 20:42:32< ALourenco> I am interested in the spritesheet project. Is there anyone that I could specificaly ask questions if I need or I just ask here?
20140228 20:43:41-!- iceiceice [~chris@cpe-66-108-20-80.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 20:49:57< ALourenco> Is here any mentor that could help me?
20140228 20:53:13< mattsc> ALourenco: hello.  It is always best simply to ask your question.  The mentor/developer knowing the answer might not currently be online/available, but they do read the log and will get back to you eventually.
20140228 20:54:23< ALourenco> ok thank you for the help. I still have to explore more the game. Although I already did something using a spritesheet. It was a small one but compatible with biger ones.
20140228 20:55:08< ALourenco> And this is a greate oportunity to create an improved one. 
20140228 20:55:17< ALourenco> *great
20140228 20:55:55< mattsc> Also, be aware that people are spread out all around the world (and some of us even have a life outside Wesnoth ;) ), so it might take quite a while until the right person is around.
20140228 20:59:23-!- ALourenco [0252303e@gateway/web/freenode/ip.2.82.48.62] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 21:23:26-!- apeeyush_ [67f66a0a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.103.246.106.10] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:24:53-!- ToBeFree [ToBeFree@unaffiliated/tobefree] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 21:25:00-!- Ivanovic [~ivanovic@wesnoth/developer/ivanovic] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20140228 21:25:26-!- Soliton [~Soliton@wesnoth/developer/soliton] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 21:25:34-!- Ivanovic [~ivanovic@x2f47985.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:27:05-!- Soliton [~Soliton@baldras.wesnoth.org] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:27:16-!- shadowm [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 21:27:16-!- Ivanovic [~ivanovic@x2f47985.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 21:27:16-!- Ivanovic [~ivanovic@wesnoth/developer/ivanovic] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:27:16-!- apeeyush_ [67f66a0a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.103.246.106.10] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20140228 21:27:52-!- Soliton [~Soliton@baldras.wesnoth.org] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 21:27:52-!- Soliton [~Soliton@wesnoth/developer/soliton] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:28:28-!- shadowm [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:29:25< AI0867> Delfinisko: well, you can do a "new turn" event with first_time_only=no, then check if turn_number is even
20140228 21:29:25< AI0867> there are other ways too
20140228 21:33:18-!- Guest65903 [ToBeFree@unaffiliated/tobefree] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:33:41-!- timotei__ [~timotei@wesnoth/developer/timotei] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 21:34:00-!- timotei_ [~timotei@wesnoth/developer/timotei] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:36:57-!- Gambit [~derek@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:38:24-!- trademark_ [~trademark@nsg93-8-88-175-59-164.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 21:39:40< Aishiko_laptop> if anyone would care to check out my application and give me some feed back I'd be interested in any that's given.  Please note it is a very rough draft, http://wiki.wesnoth.org/SpriteSheetApplicationSAB
20140228 21:50:22-!- [1]Delfinisko [~Delfinisk@ip-85.163.221.165.o2inet.sk] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:53:15< Aishiko_laptop> Delfinisko, Your Final Exam is a bit short
20140228 21:53:15< Aishiko_laptop> but otherwise it was enjoyable\
20140228 21:53:17-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 21:53:17-!- iceiceice [~chris@cpe-66-108-20-80.nyc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 21:53:18-!- Delfinisko [~Delfinisk@ip-85.163.221.165.o2inet.sk] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 21:53:19-!- mattsc [~mattsc@fw.hia.nrc.ca] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 21:53:20-!- Gambit [~derek@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20140228 21:53:21-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@46.246.48.27] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:53:21-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@46.246.48.27] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 21:53:21-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:53:21-!- [1]Delfinisko is now known as Delfinisko
20140228 21:53:32-!- iceiceice [~chris@cpe-66-108-20-80.nyc.res.rr.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:53:38-!- shadowm [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20140228 21:53:47-!- Gambit [~derek@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:53:49-!- shadowm [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:54:01-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@f048038060.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 21:54:19-!- mattsc [~mattsc@fw.hia.nrc.ca] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:54:32-!- Aishiko_laptop [~unknown@cpe-065-191-176-226.nc.res.rr.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 21:54:51-!- Aishiko_laptop [~unknown@cpe-065-191-176-226.nc.res.rr.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 21:55:08-!- mattsc [~mattsc@fw.hia.nrc.ca] has quit [Client Quit]
20140228 21:58:51< Delfinisko> final exam is going to be a bit longer, working on it right now :) but yeah, it is made to be short :)
20140228 22:01:53< Aishiko_laptop> I'm wishing there was a task that I could do that is related more to the sprites so I could make a contribution at the same time as getting more familiar with the sprite subsystem.
20140228 22:03:00< Ivanovic> Aishiko_laptop: i guess that mordante or boucman might be able to tell you something sprite/animation related which could be done
20140228 22:03:45< Ivanovic> Aishiko_laptop: you could also check if there is something which sounds related to you in the bugtracker
20140228 22:03:59< Ivanovic> though it might make sense to ask in here for the difficulty of implementation before going ahead
20140228 22:04:08< Ivanovic> some parts might sound trival but are extremely problematic
20140228 22:07:16-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@f048038060.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:08:06< Aishiko_laptop> Ivanovic, I'm actually looking in the bug tracker at the moment and not finding much that is confirmed, like http://gna.org/bugs/index.php?3869  but have the updated stats appear on the sidebar when the unit is selected.  
20140228 22:08:39-!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: timotei_, iceiceice, stikonas_, Gambit
20140228 22:09:32< Aishiko_laptop> I would think (at first glance) that adding a conditional where if there is a variation after getting the base stats it gets the modified stats for that unit and overwrites the defaults for that unit's object with the modified values
20140228 22:10:00-!- stikonas__ [~gentoo@46.246.48.27] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:10:46-!- Netsplit over, joins: timotei_
20140228 22:10:55-!- JunJM [60fc984b@gateway/web/freenode/ip.96.252.152.75] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:10:58< Aishiko_laptop> I mean its a small thing and not even a real bug but a wished for feature form what? 10 years ago and last updated 5 years ago?  thats a long time
20140228 22:11:34-!- Gambit [~derek@pa-67-234-76-186.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:11:42-!- Gambit [~derek@pa-67-234-76-186.dhcp.embarqhsd.net] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 22:11:42-!- Gambit [~derek@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:13:11< JunJM> Do you want us to implement the easy/notsoeasy coding problem solutions with our project proposals?
20140228 22:13:27< JunJM> hello again, not to be rude xD
20140228 22:13:40< fabi> hi JunJM
20140228 22:13:55-!- werlley [~werlley@179.124.130.66] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20140228 22:14:25< JunJM> fabi: have you had any experience with open source projects?
20140228 22:14:26-!- Crab_ [~Crab_@wesnoth/developer/crab] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:14:29-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:14:52< fabi> JunJM: When I joined Wesnoth?
20140228 22:15:07< Aishiko_laptop> JunJM, I think the idea is to do them and submit them normally and just reference the commit number when you send it in.  That was my understanding as a fellow student
20140228 22:17:13< JunJM> Aishiko_laptop: ohhhh that makes more sense. Thanks. 
20140228 22:17:24< JunJM> fabi: in general.
20140228 22:17:47< Aishiko_laptop> your welcome JunJM 
20140228 22:17:53< JunJM> the reason I ask is because I am new to opensource projects and the likes. never used github. 
20140228 22:18:17< JunJM> Just wondering how the learn difficulty is to get around it. Right now trying to find a good guide to help me get the lingo down
20140228 22:18:29< fabi> JunJM: I don't have much experience with open source projects other than Wesnoth.
20140228 22:19:20-!- kex [~kex@89.205.75.19] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 22:19:54< JunJM> fair enough. are you all here to do gsoc then?
20140228 22:20:28< Aishiko_laptop> http://pastebin.com/3HbeTjJK was shared earlier by someone in here a few days ago
20140228 22:20:58< Aishiko_laptop> JunJM, no this is the channel what the regular devs use, the students just invade it
20140228 22:21:03< fabi> JunJM: Well, no. This is our regular development channel. Thus most people are Wesnoth developers. Some are gsoc students, some are just lurkers.
20140228 22:21:31< JunJM> ohhhhh wow 
20140228 22:21:37< JunJM> well this is awakard...
20140228 22:21:44< fabi> Why?
20140228 22:21:51< JunJM> im just kidding. 
20140228 22:21:58< JunJM> haha. 
20140228 22:22:08< JunJM> to be honest I have never heard of this game and i dont know how. 
20140228 22:22:17< JunJM> But it looks really interesting. 
20140228 22:22:33-!- mattsc [~mattsc@fw.hia.nrc.ca] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:22:37< JunJM> been trying to find a good strat game. 
20140228 22:22:52< fabi> Well, it is mature. The MP factions are balanced.
20140228 22:23:18< Aishiko_laptop> I'm just having a hard time finding something to do for my first contribution, as 2.5GB (which is what my clone came out to being) is alot of code to shift through to find that one bug that catches your eye when your just starting out on a project
20140228 22:23:26< JunJM> I have to admit, the game project seems very nicre
20140228 22:24:13< JunJM> *nice. Aishiko_laptop : are you talking about testing?
20140228 22:24:35< Ivanovic> Aishiko_laptop: it will not be one bug which catches our eye
20140228 22:24:47< Ivanovic> Aishiko_laptop: what catches our eye is how you interact and how you handle the bug
20140228 22:24:53< Ivanovic> so basically the approach is what matters
20140228 22:24:57< Ivanovic> the same for the proposal
20140228 22:25:00< Aishiko_laptop> Ivanovic, I know that it'll be how we handle it is it a good coding approach
20140228 22:26:54-!- Grickit [~derek@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:27:07< Aishiko_laptop> I'm doing some reading and then talking to mordante to get a better idea of a timeline, testing, etc
20140228 22:27:14-!- Delfinisko [~Delfinisk@ip-85.163.221.165.o2inet.sk] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20140228 22:27:30< JunJM> happygrue: did you guys have any idea on the type of implementation of figuring out who the winner is
20140228 22:27:35-!- Gambit [~derek@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 22:27:45< JunJM> happygrue: anything in mind
20140228 22:28:26< Aishiko_laptop> but what I really meant is you saw a bug and were like I'm new I don't know where everything is, hunt it down, and do it.  That to me is the hardest part, finding the bug so you can analyze it and fix it!
20140228 22:28:45< _8680_> Aishiko_laptop, JunJM: I believe <http://pastebin.com/3HbeTjJK> was subsequently expanded into <http://wiki.wesnoth.org/Git_for_Wesnoth_Crash_Course>.
20140228 22:29:26-!- iceiceice [~chris@207-237-132-90.ny.subnet.cable.rcn.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:29:35< Aishiko_laptop> _8680_,  thank you I didn't know that, though I had heard of it possibly becoming a blog or wiki article for us (us being those that are still struggling with the Git)
20140228 22:29:43< Soliton> Aishiko_laptop: that's the hardest part for everyone though, i'd say. :-)
20140228 22:31:29< Aishiko_laptop> Soliton, unless your some sort of savant coder!  like that guy on perception the other night and all that train data he keeps track of in his head.... though the communication hindering aspect makes me go yeah, happy as is
20140228 22:38:21-!- Grickit [~derek@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has quit [Read error: Connection timed out]
20140228 22:38:38-!- Gambit [~derek@wesnoth/developer/grickit] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:39:35< fabi> Aishiko_laptop: Debugging and Testing is a discipline you can learn at university for example.
20140228 22:40:05< shadowm> zookeeper: The elven allies scenario.
20140228 22:40:55< shadowm> happygrue: I don't know, fabi seems to have also added a side flag and changed the abilities and alignment coloring.
20140228 22:41:08< Aishiko_laptop> fabi, sadly we've not done much of that, I've started adding things like input validation even though we're told "assume its a perfect world and your always given good data by your users...."
20140228 22:41:21< shadowm> I don't really like how the alignment is now permanently close to unreadable.
20140228 22:42:23-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowmaster] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:42:33< shadowm> Plus the side number and flag are too close to each other.
20140228 22:43:02< zookeeper> shadowm, ohh, okay. it sucks massively.
20140228 22:43:19< zookeeper> i mean the scenario, not the fact that you're there :p
20140228 22:43:22< shadowm> It also doesn't work as well as I expected for sides > 9.
20140228 22:44:11< shadowm> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/21371130/screenshots/wesnoth-1.11.11-sidebar-test-2.png
20140228 22:44:15< shadowm> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/21371130/screenshots/wesnoth-1.11.11-sidebar-test-3.png
20140228 22:45:59< Soliton> fairly unreadable indeed.
20140228 22:46:17-!- Crab_ [~Crab_@wesnoth/developer/crab] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20140228 22:48:33-!- irker854 [~irker@ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:49:59-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 22:50:09< iceiceice> _8680_: actually, i didnt see this before: http://pastebin.com/3HbeTjJK ... i guess maybe should paste this at the end of the crash course as an addendum or something? it seems like it might be useful for someone
20140228 22:50:34< _8680_> Oh, I thought you wrote it.
20140228 22:51:06< Aishiko_laptop> would it be hard to implement http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?t=7199  perhaps with a show/hide in a preference dialog?
20140228 22:52:30< zookeeper> doesn't sound hard.
20140228 22:52:46< Aishiko_laptop> so that new players (or players that have yet to memorize all that advancement trees) can have what unit came from what, and what it can turn into, readily avalible but turned off for the old hands (or the diehards/devs that can recite each by heart?)
20140228 22:53:43< zookeeper> but the help already displays that
20140228 22:55:41< Aishiko_laptop> right but pulling up the help takes you out of play longer then having a glance at the left hand side of the screen
20140228 22:56:03< zookeeper> that thread is about the help
20140228 22:56:53< zookeeper> there's nothing about the "left side of the screen" there
20140228 22:57:20< Aishiko_laptop> ohhh, I miss read it, I thought it was to be displayed under the unit on the side of the screen!  Guess I don't get a cookie =P
20140228 22:57:47< iceiceice> Aishiko: i think there is already a command :discover, :undiscover
20140228 22:58:04< iceiceice> that does pretty much what you are talking about
20140228 22:58:10< fabi> Aishiko_laptop: The sidebar already features the "advance into" information in a tooltip.
20140228 22:58:12< zookeeper> yeah, no cookie, you get a...
20140228 22:58:16 * zookeeper unleashes a wookiee
20140228 22:58:24< fabi> :-)
20140228 22:59:05< fabi> Aishiko_laptop: And the forum thread is already a little older, 2005. Everything mentioned there is already implemented in the help system.
20140228 23:02:02< Aishiko_laptop> ahh  this calls for more research *loads BoW and disappears for a week, comes back with the same knowledge going in
20140228 23:02:23< Soliton> s/Bow/BfW/
20140228 23:02:27< zookeeper> s/BoW... yeah, that
20140228 23:04:55< Aishiko_laptop> see I can't get the acrynom right!  I'm going to check on something
20140228 23:07:57< Aishiko_laptop> it appears that passwords are still saved as plain text, could changing that so the passwords are encrypted be something to do?  Sorry I just got off a security sequence of classes, and its still on the brain apparently.
20140228 23:09:48< iceiceice> i guess the standard thing you are suppose hash the passwords with salt when you store in a database?
20140228 23:09:52< iceiceice> not an expert here though
20140228 23:10:02< iceiceice> also i'm not sure if packets to the server are already encrypted or not?
20140228 23:10:06< _8680_> Gambit: ^
20140228 23:11:32< Gambit> The client stores them in the clear on the user's computer
20140228 23:11:45< Gambit> They are hashed and salted before being sent to the server
20140228 23:12:18< Gambit> Someone basically ported phpbb's method of hashing and salting to C++ for the client
20140228 23:12:37< Gambit> So that MP and Forum accounts are one and the same
20140228 23:13:23< Gambit> If phpbb ever gets around to using per-user salts, that system will break and be a pain to fix.
20140228 23:14:15< Gambit> Actually I'm not too familiar with what the client does
20140228 23:14:26< Gambit> I just remember reading a document someone wrote on after they made a wesnoth bot.
20140228 23:14:39< Gambit> *+vaguely
20140228 23:15:31< Gambit> I remember md5 was involved :P
20140228 23:15:58< Gambit> And I'm assuming that nobody here would send reversible passwords or clear passwords over the wire.
20140228 23:17:20< Aishiko_laptop> iceiceice, basically your right the best way is to store each with a salt, however, in this case just hashing and storing the hash as a text string might be an improvement but if its encrpyted and not stored on a shared the computer the risk is minimal here I would think, as you can't take over anything like an email account or merchant account if a hacker gets your wesnoth password, assuming you use different passwords for
20140228 23:17:20< Aishiko_laptop>  everything and not the same one for everything.
20140228 23:18:12< Aishiko_laptop> fabi, thank you for telling me that, I found it after you told me and have to say it was much better then what I was thinking of
20140228 23:18:20< Gambit> The first thing to do would be research exactly what phpbb does.
20140228 23:18:27< Gambit> And then keep some core principles in mind:
20140228 23:18:37< Gambit> 1. at no point should clear passwords be sent over the internet
20140228 23:18:45< Gambit> 2. at no point should the salt string be sent over the internet
20140228 23:18:52< Aishiko_laptop> that my good madam/sir is a given!
20140228 23:19:10< Gambit> Aishiko_laptop: Sadly not always :P
20140228 23:19:51 * Aishiko_laptop is not your average person when it comes to security, I'm going slightly paranoid!  sung to the tune of "going slightly mad"
20140228 23:20:03< Gambit> 3. since we're open source, anything that can be reversed by a MITM will be
20140228 23:21:16-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20140228 23:22:59< iceiceice> aishiko: imo the most significant security problem, if you can call it that, right now in wesnoth is that in mp the rng is controlled entirely be the host
20140228 23:23:04< iceiceice> *by the host
20140228 23:23:14< Gambit> Aishiko_laptop: The forum staff sure would sleep easier at night knowing that privileged accounts do not have their passwords stored in the clear on their computers. :)
20140228 23:23:16< iceiceice> so if the host has compiled from source he can corrupt the rng and there will be no oos message
20140228 23:23:40< iceiceice> but i'm not sure if this is considered a really important issue
20140228 23:23:41< Gambit> Don't random numbers come from the server since like 1.8?
20140228 23:23:50< iceiceice> no they are generated on host as i understand
20140228 23:24:04< iceiceice> there was a long post about this:
20140228 23:24:05< iceiceice> http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=39611#p562502
20140228 23:24:08< iceiceice> *thread
20140228 23:24:29< Gambit> I thought that was a 1.8 feature, and it was announced alongside a joke that there would be a monthly fee for that service.
20140228 23:25:25< iceiceice> hmm maybe i am remembering incorrectly, as i review the thread...
20140228 23:25:30< iceiceice> sorry let me reread
20140228 23:27:48< iceiceice> gfgtfd writes: 
20140228 23:28:03< iceiceice> the deterministic random is generated on all cleints independently which is possible because it is deterministic.
20140228 23:28:12< iceiceice> the non deterministic random for attacks is currently generated at the server (if i remember correctly).
20140228 23:28:20 * iceiceice end quote
20140228 23:28:41< iceiceice> so i guess i''m not sure what changes gfgtfd made but at some point we actually had two rngs used in mp
20140228 23:29:03< iceiceice> that may even still be the case, i haven't read this code, this thread was well before i was a dev
20140228 23:29:30-!- mattsc [~mattsc@fw.hia.nrc.ca] has quit [Quit: Ciao]
20140228 23:31:10< shadowm> Aishiko_laptop: There's an "Aishiko" forum account awaiting confirmation. Is that you?
20140228 23:32:26< Aishiko_laptop> shadowm, yes it is actually.  ohh I forgot to go and check for the email once I got home, I'll do that now
20140228 23:35:07< Aishiko_laptop> done, sorry I'm a busy with all the assignments I have, and the 4 hour peer study session I lead today, didn't help I spent the whole time helping others and little on getting anything done
20140228 23:36:33-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@f048038060.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 23:40:11-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20140228 23:44:06-!- stikonas__ [~gentoo@46.246.48.27] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds]
20140228 23:44:06-!- stikonas [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 23:44:06-!- stikonas [~gentoo@cpc18-sgyl27-2-0-cust35.18-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Changing host]
20140228 23:44:06-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140228 23:46:40< Aishiko_laptop> shadowm, I'm going to look into how phpbb requires and see if it is feasible to store the passwords encrypted.  Though that means I need to look up the version of phpbb currently being used so I can look at the right documentation.
20140228 23:47:25< shadowm> Aishiko_laptop: 3.0.11.
20140228 23:47:38< shadowm> I mean 3.0.12.
20140228 23:48:33< Aishiko_laptop> shadowm, yeah I just found a reference to phpbb 3 problems, but the exact version might help more, thank you.  I'll let you know what I find out.
20140228 23:56:45< shadowm> This is the latest stable version, in any case. There aren't any other options if you want phpBB's support.
20140228 23:57:10< shadowm> phpBB 2.0.x is obsolete and unsupported since ages ago, and 3.1.0 is still in alpha.
--- Log closed Sat Mar 01 00:00:59 2014