--- Log opened Wed Mar 19 00:00:19 2014
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20140319 00:40:37< battlestar> are you talking about eating them or something else
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20140319 09:34:14< Siddh> hello
20140319 09:34:57< Siddh> I'm trying to make this [harm_unit] macro so that it checks if the unit is gonna die first, like suggested by Dugi on the WML workshop forums
20140319 09:35:21< Siddh> I'm assuming the structure should be if, variable, else, then
20140319 09:35:42< Siddh> but how can I check the units HPs?
20140319 09:36:01< Siddh> inside the variable tags it's probably name=unit. something
20140319 09:36:21< zookeeper> name=unitvariable.hitpoints greater_than_equal_to=1
20140319 09:36:55< zookeeper> dunno what you want to do exactly.
20140319 09:36:58< Siddh> thanks
20140319 09:37:21< Siddh> it's for the harm_unit macro that does damage in other types
20140319 09:39:10< Siddh> hmm is it possible to multiply teh variable with resistance?
20140319 09:39:36< zookeeper> yes
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20140319 09:42:29< Siddh> hmm 
20140319 09:43:01< Siddh> alright I think this should work 
20140319 09:43:37< Siddh> so if I want to multiply it with resistance can I do something like name={unitvariable.hitpoints * unitvariable.resistance.cold}
20140319 09:43:46< Siddh> :D
20140319 09:44:03< Siddh> I'm guessing not with the name= at least
20140319 09:44:03< zookeeper> _something like that_, sure
20140319 09:48:56< Siddh> hmm are resistances stored as damage that would be caused when multiplied by resistance value or value that is multiplied with the damage value to leave the amount of damage that is not dealt? I'm assuming it's probably damage that would be caused
20140319 09:49:17< Siddh> but more than that is it possible to do name={} and have a calculation inside those {}
20140319 09:49:36< Siddh> or should the calculation be like {VARIABLE .. 
20140319 09:51:02< Siddh> I dunno i guess I'll try and see :D
20140319 09:55:59< Siddh> hmm
20140319 09:57:36< Siddh> oh wait
20140319 09:59:34< Siddh> in an attacker hits event
20140319 09:59:48< Siddh> is the unit's HPs before the normal hit that is in question in the event?
20140319 10:00:37< Siddh> I need a cigarette :D
20140319 10:00:37< Siddh> ->
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20140319 10:15:44< Siddh> well it doesnt work so far
20140319 10:15:45< Siddh> :D
20140319 10:16:48< Siddh> http://pastebin.com/2c4D21Sv
20140319 10:16:50< Siddh> any ideas? :D
20140319 10:18:44< Siddh> hmm maybe i should use switch instead?
20140319 10:18:53< zookeeper> no
20140319 10:21:23< Siddh> no for using switch or for not having ideas? :D
20140319 10:21:45< zookeeper> switch
20140319 10:22:31< Siddh> kk
20140319 10:26:01< Siddh> weird
20140319 10:27:38< Siddh> kk so now the ability works only when the ability is used by the attacker
20140319 10:27:44< Siddh> and the if thing doesnt work
20140319 10:27:57< Siddh> meanwhile when the ability is used by the defender, it doesnt use the harm unit at all
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20140319 10:30:15< Siddh> I don't get it 
20140319 10:30:36< Siddh> can't see any reason for it not to work :D
20140319 10:37:41< Siddh> Btw
20140319 10:37:55< Siddh> are the "tabs" important in function or just visually more pleasant?
20140319 10:38:16< Siddh> because I've been assuming it's just a habit of making the macro more readable
20140319 10:38:19< Siddh> :D
20140319 10:38:29< zookeeper> what tabs
20140319 10:38:38< Siddh> like moving te lines with tab
20140319 10:38:48< Siddh> what's the word for that?
20140319 10:38:51< zookeeper> indentation?
20140319 10:38:55< Siddh> yes
20140319 10:39:03< zookeeper> only for readability
20140319 10:39:03< Siddh> kk 
20140319 10:43:27< Siddh> hmm when accessing unit variables it's second_unit.variables and unit.variables
20140319 10:43:42< Siddh> ? and not like first_unit or some exception like that
20140319 10:44:44< Siddh> oh and can you use a reference like {} in the variables clause? since i put there greater_than_equals_to={DAMG} rather than a number
20140319 10:52:01< Siddh> I'm guessing that's the problem 
20140319 10:52:14< Siddh> so let's try switching them for 5 and see if it starts working d
20140319 10:53:33< Siddh> nope
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20140319 11:13:37< Siddh> I guess I'll do this later :D
20140319 11:16:07< Siddh> oh i see
20140319 11:21:28< Siddh> yea
20140319 11:21:39< Siddh> actually this particular ability doesnt work even without this 
20140319 11:23:18< Siddh> yeah and it's teh same for all of them
20140319 11:23:36< Siddh> I'm assuming this is simply because I have the same id for both attacker hits and defender hits events
20140319 11:24:14< Siddh> or because i have {TYPE} in the id of the event
20140319 11:25:29< Siddh> yea
20140319 11:25:44< Siddh> so the if variable routine was probably correct
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20140319 11:25:56< Siddh> I think i had fixed this last time and handt made a back up 
20140319 11:28:08< Siddh> well I think I'll be able to fix them now.. gotta make some coffee :D
20140319 11:29:44< Siddh> yeah that's probably what happened
20140319 11:29:51< Siddh> since i uninstalled wesnoth last time i was making this
20140319 11:29:57< Siddh> and I didnt have a backup of the latest version, 
20140319 11:30:02< Siddh> so I got it from the add-on server
20140319 11:30:07< Siddh> but i think it was an outdated version
20140319 11:30:21< Siddh> Since i remember geting these abilities to work correctly 
20140319 11:30:38< Siddh> other than for the XP problem, I was assuming everything had to be correct otherwise
20140319 11:30:48< Siddh> but instead it was a version which was not yet fixed and I just assumed it was
20140319 11:31:07< Siddh> since this type id business sounds very familiar suddenly :D
20140319 11:31:48< Siddh> and i think it must be because
20140319 11:32:01< Siddh> the stable version now is probably the developement server from before...... :D
20140319 11:32:13< Siddh> so  ishould've gotten it from the obsolete add-on server instead
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20140319 11:35:50< Siddh> could maybe check if that's the case
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20140319 11:58:59< Siddh> can you do 2 [if] tags
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20140319 11:59:24< Siddh> like [if][then][if][then] and mirrored with ////
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20140319 12:09:45< Siddh> oh well
20140319 12:09:51< Siddh> since it was the event id that causedthe defender attacker problem
20140319 12:10:02< Siddh> the XP problem could be caused by the {} in the variable clause
20140319 12:10:05< Siddh> is that possible? or is anyonehere
20140319 12:10:29< Siddh> is there a way to make sure wesnoth tries to resolve the value of the string first before matching it ?
20140319 12:10:48< Siddh> I think there was one
20140319 12:10:50< Siddh> but cant remember
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20140319 12:13:07< Siddh> I'm gonna try [switch] instead
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20140319 12:25:10< Siddh> well the problem is now located it's in the [if][then][else] part 
20140319 12:25:17< Siddh> and more accurately it always picks the [then] 
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20140319 12:25:39< Siddh> do I have to put hte variable's name in {} so that it changes it to number or something?
20140319 12:26:08< Siddh> or maybe put $unit instead of unit?
20140319 12:33:29< Siddh> well it doesnt work and the WML help page if of no use in this case
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20140319 13:20:28< Siddh> actually it's that this unit.variables.hitpoints thing doesnt work
20140319 13:20:46< Siddh> D:
20140319 13:26:27< Siddh> oh man this is such an incredible waste of time:D
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20140319 13:34:31< Siddh> well it cant be helped
20140319 13:34:44< Siddh> i suppose the only way to do thi would be to read some manual which explains how this works because it makes no sense 
20140319 13:35:17< Siddh> even performing hte simplest mundane operation doesnt follow the most logical path and so I've to just rnadomly guess how each of these [things] might work
20140319 13:38:34< Siddh> :D
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20140319 13:59:14< zookeeper> it's a waste of time indeed to just randomly change stuff without referencing for example mainline WML and the WML reference
20140319 14:05:04< Siddh> yea sorry i was getting irritated about it
20140319 14:05:18< Siddh> basically 4-5 hours spent on if then else 
20140319 14:05:37< Siddh> and it's n like I didnt have prior knowledge on what it means exactly before hand
20140319 14:06:18< Siddh> you know zero challenge in terms of managing the concept of what's going on 
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20140319 14:09:30< Siddh> it's hard to explain how frustrating that is
20140319 14:09:44< Siddh> best comparison is maybe you want to count 5+5 with the calculator 
20140319 14:09:53< Siddh> but hte calculator works in a way that 
20140319 14:10:02< Siddh> you just dont know why it doesnt do it
20140319 14:10:30< Siddh> you've done it with other calculators, you know what you're supposed to do, kind of, and there's ntohign surprising about the result, once you get there 
20140319 14:12:36< zookeeper> what you're doing doesn't amount to 5+5 at all, more like 5 + 5 * 7.2^(9 log 1/3)/pi
20140319 14:12:45< Siddh> well not really
20140319 14:12:52< Siddh> maybe it does to you though :E
20140319 14:13:16< zookeeper> and when something like that doesn't work, you're supposed to break it down to its component parts until something works and you can bisect it from there.
20140319 14:14:53< Siddh> yeah what didnt work though was the label you gave me
20140319 14:15:06< Siddh> which in my logic is equivalent to pushing a button that says "5" on it but actually isnt
20140319 14:15:14< zookeeper> what label
20140319 14:15:21< Siddh> unitvariables.hitpoints 
20140319 14:15:31< Siddh>  <zookeeper> name=unitvariable.hitpoints greater_than_equal_to=1
20140319 14:15:36< Siddh> or that to be specific
20140319 14:15:49< zookeeper> yeah, well, when i said "unitvariable" i was expecting you to realize that you need to substitute unitvariable with whatever is the name of the variable the unit is in
20140319 14:15:52< Siddh> isntead whati t should be was name=unit.hitpoints
20140319 14:17:08< Siddh> well how was I supposed to actually realize that?
20140319 14:17:17< Siddh> it'snt that equivalent to just guessing how things work
20140319 14:17:40< bagzie> it's equal to knowing how things work
20140319 14:17:52< Siddh> yea I do get that 
20140319 14:17:56< Siddh> if I knew everything about this
20140319 14:18:00< Siddh> it probably wasnt very hard
20140319 14:18:54< Siddh> but ok that's what happened this time
20140319 14:20:53< Siddh> well if i wanted to get the resistance of a unit 
20140319 14:20:59< Siddh> how would I get it?
20140319 14:21:14< Siddh> I tried looking at inspect from debug command, but it doesnt show the resistances
20140319 14:22:04< Siddh> also you probably wont bother to, but i might ask anyway
20140319 14:22:05< zookeeper> it does!
20140319 14:22:14< Siddh> hmm well it didnt show for me?
20140319 14:23:00< Siddh> is this another one of those situations where I'd just have to know how things work?
20140319 14:23:15< Siddh> instead of the inspect simply showing the resistances, it might be that I'd need to know how to make it show them, perhaps?
20140319 14:23:36< zookeeper> i don't know why you think it didn't show them, but it most certainly does
20140319 14:24:27< Siddh> well I don't know what I don't know
20140319 14:24:34< Siddh> but it clearly doesnt show the resistances 
20140319 14:24:35< Siddh> :D
20140319 14:25:19< zookeeper> then what does it show? movement? defense? everything else you'd expect in a unit?
20140319 14:26:40< Siddh> alright it does show them although not in the most logical order
20140319 14:27:22< Siddh> It's between weaponabilities and abilities, which is pages on both cases
20140319 14:28:41< Siddh> or whatever they're there anyway
20140319 14:28:58< Siddh> now it says they're in [resistance] tag does that mean you cna substitute [] with 
20140319 14:29:01< Siddh> a dot?
20140319 14:29:07< Siddh> like unit.resistance.
20140319 14:29:15< zookeeper> yes
20140319 14:29:56< Siddh> just to make things easier in the future
20140319 14:30:17< Siddh> if there would be a $ in front of a variable, what would be the significance of it? 
20140319 14:30:37< Siddh> and if I would like to do math as part of some function, what supports doing math or is there some special way to it
20140319 14:31:02< zookeeper> $variable means "use the value of the variable named variable"
20140319 14:31:11< zookeeper> and by "use" i mean "put it right here"
20140319 14:31:28< Siddh> yes
20140319 14:31:35< Siddh> however in many cases variables are used without the special $
20140319 14:31:40< Siddh> and still the actual value is used
20140319 14:31:47< zookeeper> no
20140319 14:32:20< zookeeper> what happens in many cases is that you're supposed to give the name of the variable to do something to/with
20140319 14:32:31< zookeeper> like [set_variable] name=myvariable
20140319 14:34:09< Siddh> so based on this information does it seem correct that whenever you would like to do math directly involing a value contained by a variable, youi would use $variable ?
20140319 14:34:44< Siddh> like for an example $unit.hitpoints * $unit.resistance.cold 
20140319 14:35:08< zookeeper> yes
20140319 14:35:34< Siddh> when is it possible to do such things? does WML support doing mathematical operations everywhere?
20140319 14:36:32< Siddh> for an example if I would want to set a variable with hte value that is a product of those variables
20140319 14:36:55< Siddh> would I do [set_variables] name=test_variable value=$unit.hitpoints*$unit.resistance.cold
20140319 14:37:19< zookeeper> they're supported practically everywhere in ActionWML (the stuff that does things, in events), but you have to use the formula syntax; for example value="$($unit.hitpoints*$unit.resistance.cold)"
20140319 14:37:37< zookeeper> the quotes aren't mandatory i suppose, but i like to use them anyway
20140319 14:37:49< Siddh> alright so gotta remember $()
20140319 14:38:05< Siddh> ok that's cool thanks 
20140319 14:38:20< Siddh> how about {} 
20140319 14:38:43< Siddh> if some value is referenced by a.. I assume {} means macro, for an example {VALUE1}
20140319 14:38:58< Siddh> is there some special rules to using such values in calculations?
20140319 14:39:35< zookeeper> {} means macro or macro argument ({VALUE1} being the latter), but i guess there's no practical difference
20140319 14:39:38< Siddh> like $($unit.hitpoints*{VALUE1}) possible? or does {VALUE1} not work? if it has a definiton somewhere
20140319 14:40:16< zookeeper> no special rules, it'll work. macro substitution happens when the game is loaded, whereas that formula will be evaluated at runtime.
20140319 14:40:35< Siddh> kk
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20140319 14:40:47< Siddh> well thanks things make a lot more sense now, if I could remember this too
20140319 14:40:49< Siddh> :D
20140319 14:45:39< Siddh> hmm 
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20140319 15:09:42< Siddh> so far it appears though that this method failed :D
20140319 15:10:18< Siddh> it tried setting a variable with [set_variables] name=nameofthevariable value=$(), and a multiplication inside 
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20140319 15:10:44< zookeeper> [set_variables] is not [set_variable]
20140319 15:10:50< Siddh> yea
20140319 15:10:56< Siddh> so it doesnt work if u do that?
20140319 15:11:40< Siddh> alright
20140319 15:11:46< Siddh> testing if it works as [set_variable]
20140319 15:13:04< Siddh> yes it does 
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20140319 15:15:46< Siddh> however the calculation itself doesnt work
20140319 15:16:01< Siddh> hmm
20140319 15:17:35< Siddh> it's probably that / isnt the symbol for dividing but i replaced it with multiplication and it works
20140319 15:21:12< Siddh> and now there's rounding 
20140319 15:21:14< Soliton> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/FormulaAI#Formula_Basics
20140319 15:21:33< Siddh> thx
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20140319 15:38:18< Siddh> hmm
20140319 15:40:14< Siddh> alright I think this works, or at least worked in the first test
20140319 15:40:15< Siddh> :D
20140319 15:40:41< Siddh> but just to make sure
20140319 15:40:57< Siddh> if you [set_variable] with round=0 , is the rounding behavior for damage the same as it is in the game?
20140319 15:41:09< Siddh> I mean is the rounding behavior the same as it is for damage in the game?
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20140319 15:55:32< Siddh> added the if,then,else routine to all abilities with the feature... :D
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20140319 19:42:02< battlestar> la la 
20140319 19:42:08< battlestar> ♫
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20140319 19:57:00< Patch> Is there something like Notepad++ for Mac?
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--- Log closed Thu Mar 20 00:00:33 2014