--- Log opened Wed May 28 00:00:59 2014
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20140528 00:07:45< gfgtdf> wesnoth: seen thunderstruck
20140528 00:07:50< gfgtdf> wesbit: seen thunderstruck
20140528 00:07:55< gfgtdf> wesbot: seen thunderstruck
20140528 00:07:55< wesbot> gfgtdf: The person with the nick thunderstruck last spoke 2d 7h ago.  4h 9m ago was here and on the channel #wesnoth with the message:
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20140528 00:25:44< iceiceice> hmm it was just a wierd typo i couldn't see for some reason ><
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20140528 00:43:39< gfgtdf> iceiceice: what caommand can assign another player host ?
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20140528 00:43:58< gfgtdf> iceiceice:  meaning i am hist i want to give "host" to another client
20140528 00:44:01< gfgtdf> host
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20140528 00:46:44< iceiceice> i think you have to leave and rejoin
20140528 00:46:51< gfgtdf> iceiceice: hmm 
20140528 00:46:55< gfgtdf> :/
20140528 00:46:59< iceiceice> its not useful to give host away
20140528 00:47:07< iceiceice> idk it would complicate the server
20140528 00:47:10< iceiceice> why do you want to do it?
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20140528 00:48:04< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i want to test host reassigns durign linger mode
20140528 00:48:46< gfgtdf> iceiceice: it currently seems liek when teh host leaves during linger mode than the other clinet drops to teh lobby whn clicking end scenario
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20140528 00:57:18< iceiceice> y i thik thats right
20140528 00:57:23< iceiceice> i think the server doesnt actualy know about linger mode
20140528 00:57:47< iceiceice> when the game ends and goes to linger mode, and the host uploads the new level,
20140528 00:57:52< iceiceice> i think the server destroys the game object
20140528 00:58:04< iceiceice> and from server's point of view the clients are already in the lobby
20140528 00:58:16< iceiceice> when they ask for the new level, from the server's point of view its like they just decided to join a new game
20140528 00:58:26< iceiceice> althoguh from the users point of view they just clicked end scenario
20140528 00:58:37< iceiceice> but i have seen on 1.10 server,
20140528 00:58:41< iceiceice> if you spectate a game to the end, 
20140528 00:58:57< iceiceice> at some point you will start recieving chat messages from the general lobby in your game
20140528 00:59:04< iceiceice> as thoguh everyone in the lobby was an observer
20140528 00:59:15< iceiceice> i think its because at that point the game is a fiction which exists only on the clients
20140528 01:05:43< gfgtdf> iceiceice: but if teh host ends in this case it shouldnt have uploaded the new level already
20140528 01:05:53< gfgtdf> iceiceice: that happens after the lingre mode i thought
20140528 01:06:13< iceiceice> i dont remember
20140528 01:06:22< iceiceice> i think you are right
20140528 01:06:36< iceiceice> i mean we changed it also, right?
20140528 01:06:45< iceiceice> now as soon as the level is available the clients must transition
20140528 01:07:25< iceiceice> hmm you know,
20140528 01:07:34< iceiceice> it might be a good idea to write some additional commands that the server can issue to the client
20140528 01:07:35< iceiceice> that are unused
20140528 01:07:53< iceiceice> but which we could use to fix possible bugs later after 1.12 is released without breaking compatibility
20140528 01:07:58< iceiceice> by adding server code
20140528 01:08:14< iceiceice> i'm not sure what exactly thoguh :)
20140528 01:08:43< iceiceice> it would be nice if the server coudl ask the client to join a certain game or smth
20140528 01:09:06< iceiceice> that might be useful later
20140528 01:10:37< iceiceice> i could perhaps use that to run unit tests actually
20140528 01:10:46< iceiceice> idk anyways i have to go
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20140528 02:00:27< irker163> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master f7f914c84f21 / src/tod_manager.cpp: Update tod_manager.cpp http://git.io/2F_SpQ
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20140528 02:34:42< irker163> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master 84556b11fc40 / src/ (14 files in 2 dirs): remove num_turns parameter http://git.io/psK4Ug
20140528 02:41:41< vultraz> RiftWalker: how's the project going?
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20140528 03:12:23< travis-ci> [travis-ci] wesnoth/wesnoth#2834 (master - 84556b1 : gfgtdf): The build was broken.
20140528 03:12:23< travis-ci> [travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/26181846
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20140528 03:33:00< irker163> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master 5d53e2714d6e / src/tests/utils/fake_display.cpp: fixup build http://git.io/4A7Ppg
20140528 03:55:08< iceiceice> stupid question: how do i convert a lua table to a wml array?
20140528 03:55:21< iceiceice> i tried a few things and they didnt work, i think i need to just read campaigns now...
20140528 03:55:43< ancestral> iceiceice: What’s your favorite unit?
20140528 03:55:53< iceiceice> ooh
20140528 03:55:54< iceiceice> hard question
20140528 03:55:58< ancestral> Hehe
20140528 03:56:36< iceiceice> probably...
20140528 03:56:44< iceiceice> i think grunts :)
20140528 03:56:56< iceiceice> grunts are pretty awesome
20140528 03:57:10< ancestral> Wanna play with something cool?
20140528 03:57:11< ancestral> http://wesnoth.io/bestiary/orcish_grunt
20140528 03:57:24< iceiceice> if its by portrait its probably skeleton
20140528 03:57:44< ancestral> (I know there are alternates, I don’t have them showing yet)
20140528 03:57:51< iceiceice> hehe
20140528 03:57:58< iceiceice> i think i saw your link on forums earlier
20140528 03:57:59< iceiceice> it looks nice
20140528 03:58:07< ancestral> Thanks :)
20140528 03:58:49< ancestral> I have some work to do with the unknown images. I’m trying to do file and data calls as minimally as possible
20140528 03:58:57< ancestral> I think I might preparse that stuff
20140528 03:59:22< iceiceice> now what would *really* be cool, is if you had links to their wml definitions in core on github or something :)
20140528 03:59:32< ancestral> (The terrain table is sortable btw)
20140528 03:59:37< iceiceice> oh didnt see that
20140528 04:00:02< ancestral> Also, full back/forward support
20140528 04:00:06< iceiceice> wait so your program just reads all of core?
20140528 04:00:15< ancestral> Yeah I parse core
20140528 04:00:19< ancestral> I could have it show the files
20140528 04:00:31< ancestral> http://wesnoth.io/bestiary/data/units/
20140528 04:01:07< ancestral> iceiceice: It fully parses everything, the project is self-contained it just reads from an existing Wesnoth installation
20140528 04:01:15< ancestral> https://github.com/ancestral/Wesnoth-Bestiary
20140528 04:02:38< ancestral> (Well, it uses wmlparser2.py so that requires running the executable. But it’s a one time step.)
20140528 04:04:08< ancestral> iceiceice: Maybe I should have it where if you hover over the unit’s icon in the advancement table it will animate it
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20140528 04:04:42< travis-ci> [travis-ci] wesnoth/wesnoth#2835 (master - 5d53e27 : gfgtdf): The build was fixed.
20140528 04:04:42< travis-ci> [travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/26183659
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20140528 05:40:11< irker163> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master 6cb367594bd7 / / (4 files in 3 dirs): test [store_locations], and try to characterize [find_path] http://git.io/vr5OYg
20140528 05:40:13< irker163> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master 3a102774b5b2 / / (4 files in 4 dirs): fixup pathfind tests, add reachability tests http://git.io/VFyKhA
20140528 05:40:15< irker163> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master 6c55e29a93ab / / (5 files in 4 dirs): Merge branch 'pathfinding_tests' http://git.io/8jd9sg
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20140528 09:32:38< AI0867> fabi: in afef2497bbef10821a716 you adjusted scenario 7, but not scenario 3
20140528 09:32:47< AI0867> fabi: see http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=4&t=40508
20140528 09:33:39< fabi> AI0867: Thank you :-)
20140528 09:34:05< AI0867> though it would seem that some labels would fall off the map if lowered by 6 hexes
20140528 09:44:55< fabi> yeah, but that is no problem.
20140528 09:56:57< Necrosporus> wmlindent doesn't recognize comments
20140528 09:58:09< AI0867> Necrosporus: yes it does
20140528 09:58:14< AI0867> what doesn't it recognize?
20140528 09:59:02< Necrosporus> It tries to align comments too, even if it was a block of code commented 
20140528 09:59:17< Necrosporus> like #      [something]
20140528 09:59:29< Necrosporus> it tries to add whitespaces before #
20140528 09:59:35< AI0867> yes
20140528 09:59:45< AI0867> so comment it out like "        #[something]" this
20140528 09:59:46< Necrosporus> I think it shouldn't
20140528 10:00:08< Necrosporus> AI0867, my text editor comments it other way
20140528 10:00:09< AI0867> your issue isn't that it doesn't recognize comments, it's that it does...
20140528 10:00:24< AI0867> or that it doesn't recognise the specific case of commented-out code
20140528 10:00:29< Necrosporus> It should recognize and ignore comments probably
20140528 10:00:31< AI0867> Necrosporus: which editor are you using?
20140528 10:00:35< Necrosporus> kwrite
20140528 10:01:01< AI0867> and it places the # at the start of the line?
20140528 10:01:14< Necrosporus> yes
20140528 10:01:23< AI0867> well, go fix your editor =P
20140528 10:01:40< Necrosporus> But then it's easier to filter and remove
20140528 10:01:50< Necrosporus> Like sed s/^#//
20140528 10:01:50< AI0867> why do you have commented-out code lying around anyway?
20140528 10:02:34< Necrosporus> One example profile=<some path>
20140528 10:02:57< Necrosporus> If you don't have a portrait yet, but plan to add it in future
20140528 10:03:14< Necrosporus> you could just uncomment this line without need to write file path again
20140528 10:04:44< Necrosporus> anyway I think there should be an option to ignore lines with comments 
20140528 10:05:17< Necrosporus> with pattern like ^\s*#
20140528 10:05:34< Necrosporus> or rathe like ^\s*#\s
20140528 10:05:54< Necrosporus> Could you write '# enddef' with a space?
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20140528 10:17:02< Necrosporus> AI0867, and there's commented code in even mainline campaigns
20140528 10:20:16< Necrosporus> AI0867, I think it threats comments like everything else
20140528 10:20:30< Necrosporus> So it doesn't recognize them
20140528 10:26:15< fabi> Necrosporus: Ever tried the emacs wml mode? Kwrite knows nothing about wml iirc.
20140528 10:26:46< Necrosporus> you don't recall correctly
20140528 10:26:54< Necrosporus> it has wml mode
20140528 10:27:15< fabi> Where can I download it?
20140528 10:28:03< fabi> And why did it not end in our tools directory?
20140528 10:32:58< Necrosporus> kwrite is a KDE text editor
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20140528 10:33:52< Necrosporus> It's probably installed in your system
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20140528 10:55:21-!- wesbot changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: string+feature freeze active on 1.12 | 245 bugs, 344 feature requests, 29 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Alternate logs: http://wesnoth.debian.net | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20140528 11:08:44< Necrosporus> wmlscope doesn't work for me http://pastebin.com/aZSgjSTE
20140528 11:14:41< AI0867> Necrosporus: fabi means the wml mode, not the editor itself
20140528 11:14:59< Necrosporus> What does it mean?
20140528 11:15:06< AI0867> there's plenty of indented comments with the format of ^\s*# whatever$
20140528 11:15:20< AI0867> 12:26 < Necrosporus> it has wml mode
20140528 11:15:25< AI0867> the files that provide that
20140528 11:18:35< Necrosporus> KWrite highlights WML code correctly and has WML in options for syntax highlighting
20140528 11:18:47< Necrosporus> I do not know if that's what you mean or not
20140528 11:19:22< AI0867> you didn't have to install anything for that?
20140528 11:19:31< Necrosporus> yes
20140528 11:20:17< Necrosporus> File "data/tools/wmllint", line 1041: note_trait = {p[1]:p[0] for p in notepairs} SyntaxError: invalid syntax
20140528 11:20:56< Necrosporus> Though I replaced it with note_trait = dict(map(lambda p: (p[1], p[0]), notepairs)) from http://svn.gna.org/svn/wesnoth/trunk/data/tools/wmllint and it works
20140528 11:21:25< Necrosporus> I do not know python but I guess it's equivalent
20140528 11:25:19< AI0867> whaaaaaaaaaaat
20140528 11:25:26< AI0867> you copied an old version from GNA?
20140528 11:25:34< AI0867> we don't use GNA for source control anymore
20140528 11:25:45< AI0867> your issue is that you have an ancient version of python
20140528 11:26:23< AI0867> the dict comprehension syntax isn't that new anymore
20140528 11:26:55< Necrosporus> AI0867, nope, I just replaced one line to get rid of message
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20140528 11:39:50< AI0867> Necrosporus: yes, you essentially reverted a syntax upgrade that was made intentionally
20140528 11:40:05< AI0867> because your python install is too old
20140528 11:40:49< Necrosporus> What's a reason to upgrade syntax in one line in incompatible name?
20140528 11:41:04< Necrosporus> * way
20140528 11:42:18< AI0867> because it's clearer, and because the old version may not be supported or do quite what you want in newer versions
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20140528 11:43:28< AI0867> Necrosporus: what kind of WML did wmlscope crash on? That code hasn't been touched for quite a while
20140528 11:44:17< AI0867> yeah, that code was there from the start
20140528 11:52:27< Necrosporus> wmlscope should not change any files?
20140528 11:53:29< AI0867> so?
20140528 11:53:35< AI0867> I'm asking what you ran wmlscope on
20140528 11:54:02< AI0867> afaict, this issue has existed since wmlscope was created, and nobody's complained about it before
20140528 11:54:13< AI0867> so I need to understand why it's happening now
20140528 11:56:14< Necrosporus> AI0867, I guess it's related with old python version too as I get same error with wmllint at the end
20140528 11:56:42< Necrosporus> Though it may also be related with something else
20140528 12:00:00< Necrosporus> Anyway, wesnoth tools are in rather poor state
20140528 12:00:22< Necrosporus> Noone bothered to make a summary of all files in utils/ and data/tools for example
20140528 12:02:35< Necrosporus> data/tools/wmlscope data spams console with 'more than one definition of JOURNEY is visible here.' and similar stuff about schedule png files
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20140528 12:53:13< fabi_> Necrosporus: Yes, I am a kde user and thus kwrite is installed on my system.
20140528 12:53:36< fabi_> Necrosporus: But it does not come with a wml mode, so I am asking again how to install it.
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20140528 12:54:45< Necrosporus> fabi_, tools -> highlighting -> markup - Wesnoth Markup Language
20140528 12:55:00< Necrosporus> Do you have such item in window menu?
20140528 12:55:53< Necrosporus> if not do you have any other items?
20140528 12:56:11< fabi_> Necrosporus: Found it. Thank you :-)
20140528 12:56:31< fabi_> Necrosporus: Does it come with tab completion and syntax checking?
20140528 12:57:44< Necrosporus> completion is present but it reuses words from same opened file
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20140528 12:58:28< fabi_> Oh, okay. That means the emacs mode is still much more useful for me. Anyway, good to know that kwrite supports at least some wml.
20140528 12:58:32< Necrosporus> like if you define a unit if=evil_king and then type in filter id=ev you will get completion independently of programming language used
20140528 12:59:18< fabi_> The emacs mode even knows about all of Wesnoth's macros and completes them with argument support.
20140528 13:00:19< fabi_> Additional to tab and attribute completion.
20140528 13:02:36< Necrosporus> wmllint is quite broken
20140528 13:02:53< Necrosporus> or I'm using it incorrectly
20140528 13:03:58< fabi_> No wonder, it is not actively maintained for a long time. Sometimes it receives some love from a developer but no one really has adopted it properly.  
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20140528 13:07:13< gfgtdf> fabi_: do you know aout https://gna.org/bugs/?22073 ?
20140528 13:07:16< Necrosporus> Why do devs change definitions for existing terrains?
20140528 13:08:18< fabi_> gfgtdf: No, not until now. Would you please assign it to me?
20140528 13:08:36< fabi_> Necrosporus: Because of the terrain help browser changes.
20140528 13:08:54< gfgtdf> fabi_: no i dont have the password on this pc
20140528 13:09:03< fabi_> gfgtdf: Same here :-)
20140528 13:09:24< fabi_> Necrosporus: Although I tried to restrict the changes to the pure necessary.
20140528 13:09:43< gfgtdf> fabi_: maybe i'll think about it when i'm on other pc
20140528 13:10:09< Necrosporus> fabi_, is there a catalogue of terrains?
20140528 13:10:15< fabi_> gfgtdf: That would be really helpful... My memory isn't the best anymore. I fear that I get older every day.
20140528 13:10:32< Necrosporus> Like Wwr means 'reef' or something
20140528 13:11:16< fabi_> No, I don't know about one.
20140528 13:11:51< fabi_> But you can activate the terrain code display in the editor which also adds them to the terrain's tooltip iirc.
20140528 13:12:30< fabi_> Or start wesnoth with --debug which does also enable additional information in the terrain help browser.
20140528 13:12:56< Necrosporus> What's Wdt? 
20140528 13:13:18< Necrosporus> It also has no image
20140528 13:14:03< fabi_> Water deep terrain.
20140528 13:14:31< fabi_> The virtual terrain prototype on which every instance of deep water is based on.
20140528 13:15:13< fabi_> It should never appear on a map file itself.
20140528 13:15:28< Necrosporus> What happens if it will?
20140528 13:16:11< c74d> Necrosporus, fabi_: <http://wiki.wesnoth.org/TerrainCodesWML>, <http://wiki.wesnoth.org/TerrainCodeTableWML>
20140528 13:16:31< fabi_> It will work like deep water terrain but not have an image as you noted. Thus the map tile stays black.
20140528 13:17:03< fabi_> The editor should not allow to "draw" the virtual prototype terrains, thus it can only appear in a manual edited map.
20140528 13:18:05< fabi_> c74d: Thanks
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20140528 14:04:19< Necrosporus> esr, seems wmllint is quite broken
20140528 14:05:11< Necrosporus> File "data/tools/wmllint", line 2964, in consistency_check() // File "data/tools/wmllint", line 1766, in consistency_check utypes.append(utype) // UnboundLocalError: local variable 'utype' referenced before assignment
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20140528 14:24:38< iceiceice> :/ maybe i shoudl switch to kwrite
20140528 14:24:55< iceiceice> normally i use gedit for everything but i never figured out how to get the wesnoth syntax highlighting to work
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20140528 15:42:19< Necrosporus> iceiceice, I think kwrite is a lot better
20140528 15:42:34< Necrosporus> gedit can hang on files with very long line 
20140528 15:42:43< Necrosporus> Kwrite can even open wesnoth map as text
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20140528 15:55:03< irker338> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth:master a4e30b627511 / data/tools/wmllint: Fix a wmllint crash http://git.io/Xu2h8Q
20140528 15:55:11< irker338> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth:1.12 21f3a01f9567 / data/tools/wmllint: Fix a wmllint crash http://git.io/NEsaKQ
20140528 15:55:14< AI0867> Necrosporus: ^
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20140528 16:10:27< Necrosporus> Is it ideologically better to use Lua instead of action WML?
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20140528 16:12:13< Necrosporus> If WML was introduced as data-only language how was it possible to make scenarios with complex code before action wml introduction?
20140528 16:13:03< c74d> I don’t think it was.
20140528 16:13:33< Necrosporus> Ok, how was it possible to make any scenarios at all?
20140528 16:13:48< Necrosporus> Or there was no objects, nothing but keeps, terrains and leaders?
20140528 16:14:01< c74d> To the latter, yes.
20140528 16:15:02< Necrosporus> And then events was introduced to let mermans get storm trident, humans get gold by stepping on specified tiles and so on?
20140528 16:15:05< c74d> (And units (UnitTypeWML).)
20140528 16:15:17< c74d> I guess so.
20140528 16:15:50< c74d> For all I know ActionWML might have existed since the earliest releases.
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20140528 16:17:43< Necrosporus> I wonder why won't wesnoth use a more standard programming language instead of wml
20140528 16:17:57< Necrosporus> Tcl perhaps
20140528 16:18:03< iceiceice> we have lua
20140528 16:18:05< Necrosporus> or python, lua or something
20140528 16:18:08< Necrosporus> I know
20140528 16:18:26< Necrosporus> but can you make an addon entirely in lua?
20140528 16:18:38< iceiceice> ok, the short answer is , theres something between 100,000 to half a million lines of WML already written? (give or take?)
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20140528 16:23:43< Necrosporus> only 290722 actually (not counting addons)
20140528 16:24:47< Necrosporus> iceiceice, I do not propose getting rid of WML, anyway
20140528 16:25:09< Necrosporus> I just wonder what if Wesnoth have used a standard programming language from very beginning
20140528 16:25:10< iceiceice> i mean counting add-ons actually
20140528 16:25:19< iceiceice> its pretty important to support them backwards
20140528 16:25:32< iceiceice> theres 300,000 lines of wml in the core project? really?
20140528 16:26:02< iceiceice> Necrosporus: if you go whole hog on lua, you end up using pretty much no wml
20140528 16:26:05< iceiceice> other than like top level tags
20140528 16:26:13< Necrosporus> find data -name \*.cfg -execdir cat {} \+ | wc -l
20140528 16:26:47< Necrosporus> 53912 in core
20140528 16:27:02< Necrosporus> 180981 in campaigns
20140528 16:27:09< iceiceice> i didnt realize that
20140528 16:27:15< iceiceice> i might have to revise my estimate :O
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20140528 16:34:54< Necrosporus> iceiceice, it's nearly equal to number of lines in C++ code
20140528 16:35:03< Necrosporus> 326070
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20140528 16:47:54< Necrosporus> iceiceice, is there a campaign written in lua?
20140528 16:48:26< Necrosporus> I wonder if resulting code would be easier to understand
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20140528 16:49:47< irker338> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master de55f1dfc717 / data/test/ (macros/pathfind_answers.cfg scenarios/characterize_pathfinding.cfg): increase coverage of reachability tests, and rebuild answers http://git.io/pqS9nw
20140528 16:49:49< irker338> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master 55addc299948 / data/tools/wmllint: Merge branch 'master' of git://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth http://git.io/DihlXw
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20140528 17:19:46< Necrosporus> So WML macros do not support variable number of arguments?
20140528 17:20:01< Necrosporus> or even default value?
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20140528 17:21:45< c74d> They do not.
20140528 17:23:14< vultraz> Though you can obviously exclude an argument with ()
20140528 17:23:31< c74d> Exclude an argument?
20140528 17:23:34< vultraz> or "" 
20140528 17:23:48< vultraz> yes
20140528 17:23:49< c74d> That’s just passing the empty string, it’s still an argument.
20140528 17:24:06< vultraz> close enough to what he needs
20140528 17:24:21< c74d> Oh, what’s that?
20140528 17:26:38< vultraz> macros with variable numbers of arguments
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20140528 17:27:36< Necrosporus> vultraz, imagine you have a set of similar items, and want to make a macros taking list of coordinates and putting one item at each coordinate with correspondent event
20140528 17:27:45< c74d> I don’t see how passing empty strings is “close enough” for that.
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20140528 17:28:03< vultraz> give the macro an X and Y argument
20140528 17:28:06< Necrosporus> like {PUT_ITEMS 2,5 3,7 11,12 53,34}
20140528 17:28:18< vultraz> then pass it like
20140528 17:28:40< vultraz> {PUT_ITEMS (2,3,11,53) (5,7,12,34)|
20140528 17:28:42< vultraz> }*
20140528 17:28:45< c74d> Even were the maximum quantity of arguments finite, which it seems to not be.
20140528 17:29:09< vultraz> each pair is an X Y coord
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20140528 17:29:23< Necrosporus> vultraz, and what in body?
20140528 17:29:26< vultraz> you can pass it into an array  with [store_location]
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20140528 17:29:33< vultraz> then iterate over it to place items
20140528 17:29:40< vultraz> c74d please explain im in a game of dota
20140528 17:34:39< Necrosporus> vultraz, ok, lets say you want a macro which could be invoked as {PUT_UNIT Mage 1,2} or {PUT_UNIT 2,3} in second case unit would be spearman
20140528 17:35:15< c74d> From memory, it would be *something like* <https://www.refheap.com/86024>.
20140528 17:35:22< Necrosporus> Even if you can use () how do you replace empty string with spearman and leave non-empty as it is?
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20140528 17:36:47< c74d> In WML preprocessor language? You can’t.
20140528 17:38:07< c74d> You could use ActionWML (including [lua]), unless this is intended to work outside an [event] tag.
20140528 17:39:03< c74d> …Which I guess isn’t so bad of a limitation.
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20140528 17:55:24< iceiceice_> y that woudl actually be kind of nice
20140528 17:55:28< iceiceice_> if we let wml macros be variadic
20140528 17:55:29< aquileia> iceiceice_: I just passed all your WML tests on Windows - the timeout works like a charm
20140528 17:55:44< iceiceice_> cool :)
20140528 17:55:51< iceiceice_> what does your script look like?
20140528 17:55:55< iceiceice_> you should probably commit it
20140528 17:56:19-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@f050181028.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20140528 17:56:35< aquileia> I'll commit the two files to my fork
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20140528 17:59:15< aquileia> Unfortunately, it currently depends on wesnoth.exe being in wesnoth/, and the debug build of VC won't be there
20140528 17:59:23< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: i wonder whether we should put a limitation of [lua_ai] command.
20140528 17:59:32< aquileia> I can change that easily, though
20140528 17:59:42< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: its quiet powerful and coudl easily be used for any cheat
20140528 17:59:58< iceiceice_> and it's synced?
20140528 18:00:02< gfgtdf> gfgtdf: yes it is
20140528 18:00:09< iceiceice_> hmm
20140528 18:00:12< iceiceice_> was it always that way
20140528 18:00:17< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: yes
20140528 18:00:38< iceiceice_> hmm
20140528 18:00:42< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: ofc cou can know by loking at the replays
20140528 18:00:45< iceiceice_> maybe it shoudl check that the controller is ai?
20140528 18:00:48< gfgtdf> the files i mean
20140528 18:00:49< iceiceice_> otherwise do nothing
20140528 18:01:02< iceiceice_> we have ai and network_ai now i think
20140528 18:01:16< iceiceice_> so in principle we shold be able to accurately figure that out
20140528 18:01:39< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: but i also think it quiet useful for umc in 1.13 when we have [do_command]
20140528 18:02:01< iceiceice_> hmm
20140528 18:02:08< iceiceice_> well maybe we can work out a different solution there
20140528 18:02:13< iceiceice_> dont need to do all at once
20140528 18:02:20< gfgtdf> hmm
20140528 18:03:08< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: i currently think that in 1.12 without do_command youl have tomodify the client binary to mkae use of ifso maybe it's not that important
20140528 18:03:21< gfgtdf> make bad use of it*
20140528 18:03:30< iceiceice_> i see
20140528 18:03:41< iceiceice_> right that makes sense
20140528 18:04:18< iceiceice_> gfgtdf: i am thinking to start trying to make a better pathfinding system
20140528 18:04:31< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: sounds liek a difficula job
20140528 18:04:35< gfgtdf> difficult
20140528 18:04:38< iceiceice_> i dont think its so difficult,
20140528 18:04:42< iceiceice_> the thing that is hard though is
20140528 18:04:56< iceiceice_> all of the objects are separated widely thoughout the code
20140528 18:05:02< iceiceice_> unit map and game map are in resources
20140528 18:05:03< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: why are you unhappy with the current pathfinding ?
20140528 18:05:12< iceiceice_> because it is slow
20140528 18:05:18< iceiceice_> it could be much faster 
20140528 18:05:25< iceiceice_> an dit would greatly improve ai
20140528 18:05:36< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: ye that sounds good
20140528 18:05:57< iceiceice_> so the thing i am thinking to do is,
20140528 18:06:00< iceiceice_> i want to make a new object,
20140528 18:06:02< iceiceice_> game_board
20140528 18:06:16< iceiceice_> which will hold the unit_map and the game_map as private objects
20140528 18:06:27< iceiceice_> and offer functions to their interface
20140528 18:06:31< iceiceice_> i think it also needs to hold the list of teams
20140528 18:06:43< iceiceice_> i think i will name all the functions the same but it will provide all of them at first
20140528 18:06:50< iceiceice_> and substtite resources::game_map etc.
20140528 18:06:56< iceiceice_> for references to thsi guy
20140528 18:07:12< iceiceice_> the idea of the class is that it shoudl be the back end for the graphical info that is dispalyed in the game map on scree
20140528 18:07:46< iceiceice_> it needs to be able to control privately all the info that could affect shortest paths, otherwise it cannot guarantee that the cached info is accurate because it might not have been told of an update
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20140528 18:10:10< iceiceice_> i am thinking that i might make it a preference to disable the caching i gues, if you are in super low mem or something
20140528 18:10:25< iceiceice_> but even if we dont add this, i think such a reorganization is worthwhile
20140528 18:10:34< iceiceice_> to reduce the spaghetti code factor
20140528 18:11:18< iceiceice_> idk do you agree with that?
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20140528 18:15:08< aquileia> iceiceice_: https://github.com/aquileia/wesnoth/tree/minor_VC_fix/projectfiles/VC9 (I'll refine it later)
20140528 18:15:51< aquileia> I added WindowsTimeout.cpp and WML_tests.cmd
20140528 18:16:29< aquileia> I'll also add a vcproj file for WindowsTimeout
20140528 18:16:36< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: idk cus i don't know anything about the currnet pathfind code :/
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20140528 18:21:52< iceiceice_> gfgtdf: the main thing is if you think that would be good or bad for the rest of the engine
20140528 18:22:20< iceiceice_> can you think of why the unit map needs to be publicly visible at resources:: for some reason?
20140528 18:22:29< iceiceice_> idk it seems unnecessary to me
20140528 18:22:49< iceiceice_> wesnoth pathfinding is like, the standard thing that is done in videogames, A* search
20140528 18:22:55< iceiceice_> you just do depth first search
20140528 18:23:07< iceiceice_> and you guide the search with a heuristic, which is normally just euclidean distance
20140528 18:23:16< iceiceice_> our A* is actually kidn of bizarre,
20140528 18:23:38< iceiceice_> it depends partly on the distance on the hex grid, but also partly on the *rectangular* screen distance
20140528 18:23:41< iceiceice_> and this was intentional
20140528 18:25:33< iceiceice_> sry i guess i shouldn't say its depth first, we do actually use heaps, so its like dijkstra + heuristic
20140528 18:25:56< iceiceice_> anyways the thing is that,
20140528 18:26:01< iceiceice_> when you move any unit,
20140528 18:26:11< iceiceice_> all of the searches for all of the other units are invalidated
20140528 18:26:15< iceiceice_> and have to be redone
20140528 18:26:43< iceiceice_> if you remember the shortest path trees that you find,
20140528 18:26:50< iceiceice_> you can do things like update them cheaply
20140528 18:27:22< iceiceice_> i think it would be very good for ai, we could write special hooks so that it could consider different positions without triggering rebuild of all of the trees
20140528 18:28:13< iceiceice_> if you look at the data structures papers, there are many different approaches, but the naive one which i am considering will drop from O(n^3) time to do all pairs shortest path to amortized O(n^2)
20140528 18:28:22< iceiceice_> where n is the number of hexes
20140528 18:28:47< iceiceice_> for wesnoth its more complicated though because i guess each movetype needs to have a new data structure
20140528 18:29:15< iceiceice_> even with that though it hink it would speed things up alot if you have sufficient memory
20140528 18:29:57< iceiceice_> i dont know what exactly the "fog calculation" issues that have been discussed are?
20140528 18:30:02< iceiceice_> meaning like, i didnt observe or profile those
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20140528 18:37:11< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: there seemed to be diffrernt fog calculation issues
20140528 18:37:43< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: so the reason that you want to 'hide' game mao is that you want to be informed when a unit moves so that you knwo when you ahve to recalculate ?
20140528 18:37:47< gfgtdf> game map*
20140528 18:38:35< iceiceice_> y
20140528 18:38:47< iceiceice_> it seems like good OO style
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20140528 18:39:54< iceiceice_> maybe theres a better way though, idk
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20140528 18:40:17< iceiceice_> i dont like how much stuff we have just in resources though, it makes it very gnarly when you start to read the code for the first time...
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20140528 18:40:28< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: ye true
20140528 18:40:44< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: i always wanted to remove "state_of_game" of there
20140528 18:40:49< gfgtdf> but its hard
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20140528 18:47:38< thunderstruck> gfgtdf: you were looking for me?
20140528 18:48:35< gfgtdf> thunderstruck: ye but i don't remember ywhy right now.
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20140528 19:08:09< iceiceice_> aquileia: i'm going to take a look at your thing now
20140528 19:08:24< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: i madea pr aboit random_tod
20140528 19:08:28< gfgtdf> about
20140528 19:09:04< aquileia> iceiceice_: If you would wait a minute, I'd upload a newer version
20140528 19:09:42< iceiceice_> ok
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20140528 19:15:15< aquileia> iceiceice_: pushed
20140528 19:15:44< aquileia> still not perfect, but a minor improvement
20140528 19:20:43< aquileia> Now the user can see the progress of the tests and doesn't wait two minutes without any sign
20140528 19:23:31< iceiceice_> its this right?
20140528 19:23:31< iceiceice_> https://github.com/aquileia/wesnoth/compare/minor_VC_fix
20140528 19:24:05< iceiceice_> y so i cant run it but it looks good
20140528 19:24:07< aquileia> iceiceice_: Yes, that's all I did up to now
20140528 19:24:15< iceiceice_> what does it do when the test times out?
20140528 19:24:36< iceiceice_> in mine i ended up catching the error codes that correspond to term signal for that
20140528 19:24:47< aquileia> It reports back the timeout code 2, which the script (if it isn't intended) reports as a warning
20140528 19:25:15< iceiceice_> so you run with wesnoth --timeout option?
20140528 19:25:28< iceiceice_> hmm i guess im not following completely
20140528 19:25:31< iceiceice_> one sec :)
20140528 19:25:35< aquileia> no, without - WindowsTimeout does that for me
20140528 19:25:46< iceiceice_> i see
20140528 19:26:06< aquileia> it's just a wrapper to implement a clean timeout
20140528 19:26:35< aquileia> and btw it works for any executable
20140528 19:27:53< iceiceice_> i see
20140528 19:28:03< iceiceice_> do you want me to pull and merge or are you goign to make a PR?
20140528 19:28:15< aquileia> iceiceice_: I'm not yet ready
20140528 19:28:16< iceiceice_> or are you wanting someone to test it first?
20140528 19:28:17< iceiceice_> ok
20140528 19:28:43< aquileia> I tested it extensively, but I still have to implement:
20140528 19:28:53< aquileia> - debug build compatibility
20140528 19:29:20< aquileia> - VC post build event (I have that ready, but not tested)
20140528 19:29:43< aquileia> then it'd be nice if you merged it...
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20140528 19:30:08< shadowm> mary page, it says the following: http://creativecommons.org/licenses/by/4.0/
20140528 19:30:17< aquileia> But now I unfortunately will have to leave
20140528 19:30:59< aquileia> shadowm: context?
20140528 19:31:47< shadowm> Uh.
20140528 19:31:53< shadowm> I guess I accidentally middle-clicked.
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20140528 19:34:00< iceiceice_> gfgtdf:
20140528 19:34:17< iceiceice_> so we randomize TOD at the time that unit traits are initailized?
20140528 19:34:21< iceiceice_> and not host side before the game starts?
20140528 19:34:52< iceiceice_> it makes me wonder if we should move some other stuff out of connect engine that is like that
20140528 19:35:09< iceiceice_> i guess it doesnt make sense to shuffle sides that late though? idk
20140528 19:35:15< iceiceice_> i guess it would confuse the server
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20140528 19:36:20< iceiceice_> gfgtdf: in your PR i mean
20140528 19:36:58< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: this code: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/src/multiplayer_connect_engine.cpp#L328 has no effect anymore
20140528 19:37:16< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: since teh "const" parameter is nor really a const
20140528 19:37:29< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: (previously there was an ugny const_cast)
20140528 19:37:40< iceiceice_> y 
20140528 19:37:45< iceiceice_> i think we shld delete that then if its dead now
20140528 19:37:51< iceiceice_> or will be
20140528 19:37:52< gfgtdf> s/nor/now
20140528 19:38:03< iceiceice_> in fact could delete the whole "update tod" parameter of update_and_send_diff
20140528 19:38:32< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: hm ye i also think we shoudl do that+
20140528 19:38:36< gfgtdf> that*
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20140528 19:49:43< travis-ci> [travis-ci] gfgtdf/wesnoth-old#112 (random_tod - 59880e9 : gfgtdf): The build failed.
20140528 19:49:43< travis-ci> [travis-ci] Build details : http://travis-ci.org/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/builds/26242736
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20140528 19:52:21< Necrosporus> What do you do when you discover unit's legs are not in center of its ellipse?
20140528 19:57:09< iceiceice_> Necrosporus: tbh i dont even know what that means
20140528 19:57:21< iceiceice_> i dont actually know what the term ellipse means in the context of wesnoth
20140528 19:58:16< Necrosporus> iceiceice_, that's it
20140528 19:58:54< Necrosporus> the ellipse has center and unit should be aligned so their legs are in center of their ellips
20140528 20:02:57< iceiceice_> idk so its a sprite problem?
20140528 20:09:50< zookeeper> it's a sprite problem and people always fk that up.
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20140528 20:16:57< aquileia> Necrosporus: You're talking about a khalifate unit, by coincidence?
20140528 20:20:57< Necrosporus> aquileia, nope
20140528 20:21:09< aquileia> ok
20140528 20:21:41< Necrosporus> iceiceice_, ellipse in context of wesnoth is that thing you see when you turn team color on
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20140528 20:22:14< Necrosporus> It's a red ellipse with gradient by default
20140528 20:22:45< iceiceice_> mm
20140528 20:22:51< iceiceice_> is this something you can correct in wml?
20140528 20:22:57< iceiceice_> like put a shift into the code or smth?
20140528 20:23:13< iceiceice_> idk maybe thats a bad idea, it might be slow
20140528 20:24:03< Necrosporus> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/ImagePathFunctionWML
20140528 20:25:33< Necrosporus> zookeeper, why there's no shift function?
20140528 20:25:52< Necrosporus> Or I'm overlooking it?
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20140528 20:37:13< Necrosporus> iceiceice_, I guess not
20140528 20:37:22< Necrosporus> standing animation maybe?
20140528 20:38:06< iceiceice_> Necrosporus: i guess you could fix all the sprites for the unit?
20140528 20:38:11< iceiceice_> maybe a robot can do that
20140528 20:38:50< iceiceice_> if its viewed as an error when that happens then perhaps we could merge upstream for 1.14 idk, it would be up to people that aren't me :)
20140528 20:39:14< iceiceice_> by robot do that, i mean, you figure out the right shift, and a script would shift all the sprites that many pixels
20140528 20:39:36< iceiceice_> at least you could usei t in your add-on
20140528 20:39:41< iceiceice_> if it really bothers you
20140528 20:39:42< Necrosporus> iceiceice_, I wonder why there's no such image path function?
20140528 20:39:54< iceiceice_> idk i dont know anything about those
20140528 20:39:56< iceiceice_> or SDL for that matter
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20140528 20:54:05< RiftWalker> vultraz: still working on config loading. I'm hoping to finish with this by the end of the week and get started on adapting the mp codepath for sp
20140528 20:55:08< gfgtdf> RiftWalker: i recently has a discussion about making [multiplayer] and alias for [scenario]/[campaign] that is resolved durign config loading what do yo think about the ?
20140528 20:55:32< gfgtdf> RiftWalker: so taht we dont have to think about the difference after
20140528 20:55:47< gfgtdf> s/has/had
20140528 20:55:53< gfgtdf> s/and/an
20140528 20:59:10< RiftWalker> gfgtdf: I'm not sure I understand.
20140528 20:59:39< RiftWalker> What you're proposing, that is
20140528 21:00:28< RiftWalker> Currently [multiplayer] denotes a standalone scenario. scenarios in a campaign are denoted by [scenario], but those tags are converted to [multiplayer] for loading
20140528 21:01:56< gfgtdf> RiftWalker: hmm i gues my plan would be doing the opposite. Also i have heaed that [mulitplayer] can also have a next scenario (not sure)
20140528 21:02:48< gfgtdf> heared*
20140528 21:06:20< RiftWalker> It makes sense that it would have next scenario, as that's how it works for campaigns, i believe
20140528 21:06:44< RiftWalker> at the end of each [scenario] (which becomes [multiplayer]), you have a next_scenario
20140528 21:06:49< RiftWalker> I could be wrong
20140528 21:06:50< RiftWalker> but
20140528 21:07:29< RiftWalker> As for the other point, the relevant code is in game_config_manager::load_game_config (where it converts the tags and adds campaign info)
20140528 21:08:24< RiftWalker> and then create_engine::prepare_for_campaign (actually searching for [multiplayer] config with id matching [campaign]'s first_scenario)
20140528 21:08:56< gfgtdf> RiftWalker: do you plan to allow [options] for sp campaigns too ?
20140528 21:12:32< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: i thought about it again, and i think in single m games it might be acceptable if the game onyl ends for one side but in a mp campaign its definitely not
20140528 21:12:39< gfgtdf> only
20140528 21:12:55< RiftWalker> I don't see why not. I may end up merging [multiplayer] into [scenario] and converting them accordingly to [scenario]. Then whether they're tied to a campaign or standalone, sp or mp, could be defined by attributes.
20140528 21:14:40< RiftWalker> The nice thing is, it'll all be a lot more lightweight since every add-on (and probably scenarios, campaigns in data/) will have its own metadata file.
20140528 21:14:54< RiftWalker> which also allows for some powerful loading capabilities
20140528 21:15:07< iceiceice_> gfgtdf: i think i see what you mean about the victory_when_enemies_defeated
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20140528 21:15:18< iceiceice_> i think it could still work though with current design,
20140528 21:15:25< iceiceice_> if the next scenario has allow_new_game
20140528 21:15:36< iceiceice_> so they will switch in a new player if someone is defeated
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20140528 21:15:44< iceiceice_> but its sort of a workaround
20140528 21:17:08< iceiceice_> if you want i guess we could do my original patch for that
20140528 21:17:17< iceiceice_> so the level ends for all at the same time
20140528 21:17:23< iceiceice_> based on finding human or network human
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20140528 21:19:33< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: hmm maybe we shoudl make a forum thread
20140528 21:19:43< gfgtdf> if anyone has a use or teh current system
20140528 21:20:22< iceiceice_> y that can't hurt
20140528 21:21:10< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: e another question in a mp camoaihn with 2 players when one players looses and the other wins both should advance to teh next scenario i assume ?
20140528 21:21:17< gfgtdf> campaign*
20140528 21:21:41< iceiceice_> hmm
20140528 21:21:57< iceiceice_> would make sense 
20140528 21:22:22< iceiceice_> idk the toher way could be good too
20140528 21:22:34< iceiceice_> for instnace i could imagine,
20140528 21:22:42< iceiceice_> you know that scenario at the end of DiD?
20140528 21:22:49< iceiceice_> endless night?
20140528 21:22:51< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: ye i know
20140528 21:23:13< iceiceice_> someone could make that into a 2p campaign, where the P1 tries to survive as many times as possilbe,
20140528 21:23:18< gfgtdf> iceiceice_:  i think its impossible to make the campaignas completed ?
20140528 21:23:20< gfgtdf> mark
20140528 21:23:28< iceiceice_> and each time the challenger loses a new challenger subs i
20140528 21:23:29< iceiceice_> n
20140528 21:23:37< iceiceice_> mark what campaigns?
20140528 21:23:39< iceiceice_> mp campaigns?
20140528 21:23:55< iceiceice_> i think you are right, by default the human players should always advance
20140528 21:24:00< iceiceice_> if they want different behavior they can save and reload
20140528 21:24:01< gfgtdf> have the won camoaugn image in the sp campaign selection dilaog
20140528 21:24:21< iceiceice_> y i dont think it exists for mp campaign
20140528 21:24:33< gfgtdf> no that was just a question about DiD
20140528 21:28:01< iceiceice_> oh i think .. idk
20140528 21:28:08< iceiceice_> i think you get it if you beat that last one once? idk
20140528 21:28:13< iceiceice_> i dont remember now
20140528 21:34:50< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: i just testes by addin victory_when_enemies_defeated=no in on of teh defaul 2p mp mps
20140528 21:35:07< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: when side 1 looses the following happens:
20140528 21:35:21< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: side 1 gets a "you get defeated", side 2 continues
20140528 21:35:46< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: when side 1 checks "end scenario" side 2 gets a "side 1 has left the game..."
20140528 21:36:11< iceiceice_> what happens for side 1 when ti is side 2's turn
20140528 21:36:11< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: then i clickes "Control by human" on client 2
20140528 21:36:18< iceiceice_> liek suppose there is a an ai also and side 1 keeps playing
20140528 21:36:27< iceiceice_> against side 3 say
20140528 21:36:40< gfgtdf> and i could normal contine playing side 1 side client 2
20140528 21:36:42< iceiceice_> does it hang waiting for side 2's turn , or does side 2 become empty on side 1's client
20140528 21:36:58< gfgtdf> sid 1 on clinet 2*
20140528 21:38:28< iceiceice_> ok this sounds like bad behavior
20140528 21:38:41< iceiceice_> i think we shoud just make it,
20140528 21:38:44< iceiceice_> check if there is a human or network
20140528 21:38:46< iceiceice_> and be done with it
20140528 21:38:49< iceiceice_> and update the wiki documentation
20140528 21:39:26< iceiceice_> it sounds like this has no useful behavior in mp othwerise
20140528 21:39:30< iceiceice_> unless i dont understand
20140528 21:46:42< gfgtdf> iceiceice_:  hm ok
20140528 21:56:47< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: ok i'll chang eit
20140528 21:56:50< gfgtdf> change
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20140528 21:57:41< iceiceice_> ok sounds good
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20140528 21:58:47< irker318> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master d808b7c78744 / src/play_controller.cpp: Update check_victory http://git.io/Ye_M6w
20140528 21:59:01< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: ^
20140528 21:59:24< aquileia> Necrosporus: You can shift with ~crop, I think - one side negative, the other positive
20140528 22:00:28< iceiceice_> gfgtdf: i think i will write something on scenarioWML 
20140528 22:00:31< iceiceice_> explaining how check victory works
20140528 22:00:41< iceiceice_> i guess its simpler now than it used to be maybe, because defeat_condition sort of explains it
20140528 22:00:52< iceiceice_> but anyways i can do that, i said iw ould before
20140528 22:02:43< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: the descrition of the "enemied defeated" event is also very outdated :)
20140528 22:04:27< gfgtdf> iceiceice_: ubnrelated to my commit it was also outdated before
20140528 22:04:29< gfgtdf> unrelated
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20140528 22:46:27< shadowm> iceiceice: Did https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?22038 only affect master between releases? Bugs that never appeared in a release before being fixed may be closed immediately.
20140528 22:47:08< shadowm> FYI I'm making https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?22042 public now. If it turns out there's a way to retrieve the file contents we're doomed (re 1.10).
20140528 22:48:15< shadowm> I really wonder how you guys manage to fix all those weird sync issues without going crazy in the process.
20140528 22:48:51< shadowm> Or having the entire Wesnoth source code parsed and tagged in your heads, which would be pretty much the same thing.
20140528 22:52:12< shadowm> Closed all bugs fixed in the last two releases plus #22038 which AFAIU only affected master.
20140528 22:52:39< shadowm> All this amounts to the 100% of fixed bugs that were open.
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20140528 23:38:47< irker318> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master 472c0cda4577 / src/windows_tray_notification.cpp: use windows unicode functions explicitly http://git.io/DjKxwQ
20140528 23:41:15< aquileia> Does anyone still have VC2008? While the VC12 conversion should tell me about errors, you never know whether it silently fixes something broken from the beginning...
20140528 23:42:02< aquileia> So if I commit my changes, they are based on "It upgrades the project correctly, so it should be fine"
20140528 23:53:15< gfgtdf> aquileia: maybe annonimious have vc2008 ?
20140528 23:53:52< aquileia> gfgtdf: Right, that's possible... anonymissimus?
20140528 23:54:15< aquileia> ah, he isn't here
--- Log closed Thu May 29 00:00:40 2014