--- Log opened Sun Oct 12 00:00:45 2014
--- Day changed Sun Oct 12 2014
20141012 00:00:45< shadowm> Also, #9 sounds bad, there's no reason why AI sides should be undroided unless the host specifically changes their controller in the setup screen.
20141012 00:01:13< shadowm> #8 is how it's always worked AFAIK.
20141012 00:02:17< shadowm> To put it this way, the whiteboard is perpetually on and has some state. The player may choose to display and alter the whiteboard state, or let it run its course.
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20141012 00:04:21< shadowm> mattsc: I rember planning in advance to start the announcement with something cheesy like "this is it guys, the end is nigh" or so.
20141012 00:04:36< shadowm> You'd probably hate it even more.
20141012 00:05:16< mattsc> shadowm: nope, I think that would be good, actually.  :)
20141012 00:05:46< mattsc> Maybe not that exact phrase (or maybe yes), but I think the first paragraph (and sentence) should be written to catch people’s attention.
20141012 00:06:18< mattsc> Anyway, I’m done with reading the announcement; the rest looks good to me.
20141012 00:06:30< mattsc> shadowm: Thank you very much for doing this after I said that I would !!
20141012 00:08:26< shadowm> You've done most of the organization work behind this during the past week or so. So it's only fair that somebody else gets to write the announcement, IMO.
20141012 00:08:48< shadowm> Plus your pastebin still saved me like half of the effort.
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20141012 00:12:03< mattsc> shadowm: thanks - I was really going to do it though (and happily; more or less at least, as happy as I ever am when I have to write things), today just turned out even crazier than I thought …  :)
20141012 00:12:30< mattsc> … and with that I am away again for a while.
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20141012 00:53:37< gfgtdf> iceiceice: online ?
20141012 00:53:42< iceiceice> y
20141012 00:56:11< shadowm> mattsc: I have restructured the initial few paragraphs of the RC announcement. Perhaps you'd like to check it out?
20141012 00:56:32< gfgtdf> i investigated the sdl_mixer issue and i am no  very sure that we need somethign like AI SDLrwops patch, i investigated this issue and it seems like teh current sdlmixer we use checks whether that file exists (as locale AND as utf8) so that in the end only acsi characters are valid.
20141012 00:56:35< gfgtdf> iceiceice: ^
20141012 00:56:36< mattsc> Coffee_irc: if you want to help with MP stuff, could you tell us how serious you think bugs #7 and #9 listed in this thread are:  http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&t=40745&start=15#p575565
20141012 00:58:15< iceiceice> hmm... i'm confused by this
20141012 00:58:50< iceiceice> so the current sdlmixer checks "as locale and as utf8" (good?) but as a consequence only ascii characters are valid (bad?) ?
20141012 00:59:14< mattsc> shadowm: I think that “flows” much better now than it did before, I like it
20141012 00:59:34< gfgtdf> iceiceice: no that bad, because it aborts if it cannot find te hfile as utf8 and it aborts if it cannot find teh file as local
20141012 01:00:22< iceiceice> i see
20141012 01:00:38< iceiceice> so when wrote "i am no very sure" that was "i am now very sure" and not "i am not very sure" ?
20141012 01:00:55< iceiceice> i think i understand
20141012 01:00:57< gfgtdf> yes i mwan ti am now very sure
20141012 01:01:03< gfgtdf> i meant *
20141012 01:01:50< iceiceice> hmm ok
20141012 01:01:58< iceiceice> so how can we do this?
20141012 01:02:07< iceiceice> iirc the RW_OPS patch is currently mergeable
20141012 01:02:21< iceiceice> but it might conflict with the filesystem branch you started?
20141012 01:02:41< iceiceice> presumably i guess we should try them in some order on master and test it, and then if it works out try to repeat on 1.12?
20141012 01:02:56< gfgtdf> iceiceice: no the RW patch is currently not mergable
20141012 01:03:06< gfgtdf> its mergable on 1.12
20141012 01:03:10< gfgtdf> but not on master
20141012 01:03:17< iceiceice> ok
20141012 01:03:19< iceiceice> i see now
20141012 01:03:42< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i also made apr: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/pull/296 about teh boost_filesystem branch
20141012 01:03:59< iceiceice> yeah i saw it
20141012 01:04:10< iceiceice> i am willing to try to review it
20141012 01:04:23< iceiceice> but its going to take me a little while because i have deadline on something else soon...
20141012 01:04:33< iceiceice> also while i can test on linux, i can't test on windows
20141012 01:04:37< iceiceice> i guess you did that presumably
20141012 01:05:25< gfgtdf> iceiceice: the rewiew is mainly about the merge -s 'ours' and the 'dont rebase others commits' sonce i rebased AIs commits and tries to fix that with the merge 
20141012 01:05:53< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i have a windows check(mine) and a linux check (travis)
20141012 01:06:40< iceiceice> yeah i guess the travis test actually does test the file system quite a bit
20141012 01:07:09< gfgtdf> iceiceice: that pr is a pure refactor, (renaming, moving of methods)
20141012 01:08:27< gfgtdf> iceiceice: but what i dont know is how strict, the 'dont rebase others commits' rule is.
20141012 01:09:10< iceiceice> so i think what can happen is, 
20141012 01:09:17< iceiceice> if AI comes back and tries to fetch wesnoth,
20141012 01:09:29< iceiceice> his git will be like omg the history is conflicting
20141012 01:10:09< iceiceice> i dont know what he can do then, i guess either it would ask him to overwrite the history, or he wont be able to fetch master
20141012 01:10:17< iceiceice> maybe he can fix it by deleting his boost file system branches
20141012 01:10:30< gfgtdf> iceiceice: that doesnt sound good 
20141012 01:10:30< shadowm> What is the question and what is the logic leading to that answer?
20141012 01:11:12< iceiceice> shadowm: the PR 296 is I guess a fairly gnarly merge of sorts of AI's branch to make it mergable with current master
20141012 01:11:23< iceiceice> i think what happened is, the first commit (which was huge) got cherry-picked
20141012 01:11:28< iceiceice> and the rest got rebased on top (?) 
20141012 01:11:35< iceiceice> you'll have to ask gfgtdf
20141012 01:11:40< shadowm> Okay, sounds good so far.
20141012 01:11:46< iceiceice> so what i would be concerned is,
20141012 01:11:50< iceiceice> if you rebase someone else's commit
20141012 01:12:03< iceiceice> and merge it into master
20141012 01:12:08< iceiceice> their history becomes incompatible
20141012 01:12:16< iceiceice> because... this hash is being used twice
20141012 01:12:24< shadowm> It isn't.
20141012 01:12:50< iceiceice> yeah so i dont really know what happens, i never rebased someone else's commit
20141012 01:12:54< iceiceice> but i thought that was the issue
20141012 01:13:08< shadowm> If you've managed to get different commits with the same hashes, then congrats, you found a SHA1 duplicity-based security hole in Git.
20141012 01:13:44< shadowm> Otherwise all commits have different messages, diffs, timestamps, authors, or committers, which ensures their uniqueness.
20141012 01:14:18< shadowm> Also ancestors. The ancestor of a commit is part of the input for the hash.
20141012 01:14:30< iceiceice> i see
20141012 01:14:36< shadowm> The moment you rebase a commit, the ancestor changes, thus altering the commit's id/hash.
20141012 01:14:46< iceiceice> so the moral is, actually you can rebase as long as you want, as long as you don't end up force pushing master at the end?
20141012 01:15:09< shadowm> As long as you don't cause conflicting refs (branches/tags) for other people.
20141012 01:15:10< iceiceice> or its just "bad form" to do so, but
20141012 01:15:31< iceiceice> what does "conflicting refs" mean here
20141012 01:15:40< shadowm> AI0867's master is presumably an older snapshot of our master, and it doesn't any other commits.
20141012 01:16:10< shadowm> Applying commits from his repository (doesn't matter where they came from, really) to our master means he has to rebase or merge our master into his master.
20141012 01:16:20< shadowm> Which is just regular business for everyone using Git here.
20141012 01:16:26< iceiceice> so let me ask this
20141012 01:16:39< iceiceice> suppose i pull ai's branch and start rebasing it
20141012 01:16:53< iceiceice> when i do this, the "original" commits are gone, they got replaced with the rebased commits
20141012 01:17:03< shadowm> For you, not for him.
20141012 01:17:05< iceiceice> yes
20141012 01:17:11< iceiceice> can i then get them back?
20141012 01:17:16< iceiceice> by fetching from him or whatever?
20141012 01:17:23< shadowm> Yes.
20141012 01:17:25< iceiceice> i see
20141012 01:17:33< iceiceice> for some reason i thought once i rebased it i can't have it again
20141012 01:17:46< iceiceice> i wonder why rebase destroys the old commits?
20141012 01:17:56< iceiceice> if its possible for it to retain it
20141012 01:18:14< shadowm> I thought it'd disconnect them from history and leave the rest to the garbage collection settings.
20141012 01:18:23< iceiceice> ok
20141012 01:18:34< iceiceice> that makes sense
20141012 01:18:47< shadowm> I don't know, I haven't tried myself but it's trivial to do so.
20141012 01:19:19< shadowm> I have like a dozen local branches that I get to rebase every once in a while.
20141012 01:21:40< Coffee_irc> mattsc: I think bug #8 is actually pretty important
20141012 01:21:41< shadowm> Yep, the original commits continue to exist for me, just disconnected and subject to gcing.
20141012 01:22:07< Coffee_irc> I've done a test on the MP online server with 2 clients and found something about the whiteboard
20141012 01:22:27< shadowm> iceiceice: You can always duplicate the branch to avoid gcing the unrebased commits.
20141012 01:22:38< Coffee_irc> when any attack is planned the planning mode doesn't work properly
20141012 01:23:17< shadowm> e.g. git checkout -b my_unrebased_backup_branch the_original_branch
20141012 01:23:42< Coffee_irc> an invalid position is sent to the other player and the synchronisation stops until "end turn" is pressed (and then the game is frozen unless the mouse cursor hovers over the game board on the other client)
20141012 01:24:15< Coffee_irc> this is something that I think might need fixing before an eventual release
20141012 01:24:39< Coffee_irc> because it could lead to oos as well as "frozen" games
20141012 01:24:57< Coffee_irc> although I suspect it is the same in 1.10 as well
20141012 01:25:09< shadowm> iceiceice: What you can't do is apply a commit twice because that results in an empty commit for Git, and Git doesn't like empty commits.
20141012 01:25:22< Coffee_irc> all the other aspects of planning mode seem to work for me
20141012 01:25:59< shadowm> So given a commit A, having an ancestry chain like A -> B -> C -> A' (where A' is the rebased version) is usually a physical impossibility.
20141012 01:26:47< shadowm> Something like Z -> { A -> B -> C, A' -> B' -> C' } -> D should be possible when merge commits get involved, though.
20141012 01:26:56< iceiceice> i think i understand
20141012 01:27:33< iceiceice> so if you could also take a look at gfgtdf's PR and just help to make sure it looks kosher...
20141012 01:27:38< iceiceice> that would probably be pretty helpful
20141012 01:27:49< iceiceice> esp. if our plan is to try to get it right and backport to 1.12
20141012 01:30:56< shadowm> Okay, I'll look at it in 30 minutes or so.
20141012 01:31:30< mattsc> shadowm, iceiceice: do you have any comments on what Coffee_irc wrote there ^
20141012 01:31:34< gfgtdf> ok another question when i do git pull and there are merging conflits but git sill calls it 'fast forward' what happened ?
20141012 01:31:53< mattsc> because I don’t really feel like I know much about that at all
20141012 01:31:56< mattsc> or gfgtdf ^
20141012 01:32:29< mattsc> [that can wait though, finish your current discussion first]
20141012 01:32:34< shadowm> gfgtdf: No idea because that sounds like an oxymoron. *Unless* it's confliting on newly added files that already existed unversioned in your tree.
20141012 01:33:16< shadowm> Because fast-forward merges are only feasible when there are no other commits standing in the way.
20141012 01:33:19< iceiceice> mattsc, Coffee_irc: i didnt realize there were still bugs there, if its what you describe then yeah probably we should fix it
20141012 01:33:39< Coffee_irc> iceiceice: I'm trying to test it more thoroughly at the moment
20141012 01:33:56< Coffee_irc> apologies for the timing :P
20141012 01:34:08< shadowm> mattsc: Don't ask me about planning mode, I've only used it once or twice. :p
20141012 01:34:26< shadowm> I know it's kind of chronically bugged.
20141012 01:34:28< iceiceice> IMO the whole thing is fubar, it should be rewritten...
20141012 01:34:45< iceiceice> i have a plan to try to improve it and some other things...
20141012 01:35:18< iceiceice> what i would like to see is, there should be a "gamestate" object that exists as a unit independent of, a shit ton of pointers in resources.hpp,
20141012 01:35:27< iceiceice> and it should be possible to have a "simulated gamestate" which is created from a gamestate
20141012 01:35:30< shadowm> gfgtdf: Oh right, I forgot an important thing.
20141012 01:35:44< iceiceice> and the whiteboard should be implemented actually a queue of actions that get applied to simulated gamestates
20141012 01:35:59< iceiceice> rather than having the high level code distilled down into these monstrous callback functions we have everywhere
20141012 01:36:07< iceiceice> with these RAII objects "future_map" etc.
20141012 01:36:32< iceiceice> we could reuuse the "simulated actions" thing for AI
20141012 01:36:33< shadowm> gfgtdf: Rebase operations (git rebase, git pull --rebase, etc.) first reset the branch to the old upstream commit, then fast-forward merge to the new upstream commit, and *then* apply your commits on top.
20141012 01:36:40< iceiceice> since thats kind of necessary for AI anyways...
20141012 01:36:53< iceiceice> even the GSOC student in AI added a bunch of new simulated actions code
20141012 01:36:54< shadowm> So you will see the FF merge notification first and then the rebase conflict notices.
20141012 01:37:02< iceiceice> i think all of this should be unified, and unit tested rigorously
20141012 01:37:06< iceiceice> so that both things actually work
20141012 01:38:00< shadowm> gfgtdf: So it effectively means you did a pull+rebase, either by passing --rebase or setting the autorebase option for the branch.
20141012 01:38:37< shadowm> `git config branch.<name>.rebase true` or so.
20141012 01:39:16< gfgtdf> shadowm: no i just did a stupid mistake and pullen A into B where B was already merged with comflicts into A. i instead meant to pull C which hasnt B merged in.
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20141012 01:44:23< gfgtdf> shadowm: it it possible tha pulling A into B will give me dirrente merging conflicts than pulling B into A ?
20141012 01:44:27< gfgtdf> is*
20141012 01:44:58< gfgtdf> different*
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20141012 01:46:04< shadowm> Yes.
20141012 01:46:24< shadowm> Probably.
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20141012 01:48:10< shadowm> Ultimately it depends on what the diff contents and the merge strategy.
20141012 01:48:14< shadowm> s/what//
20141012 01:49:30< gfgtdf> ye i meant the default strategy,
20141012 01:49:32< gfgtdf> bbl
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20141012 01:51:15< shadowm> It's unfortunate that GitHub doesn't visualize merge commits in lists like the PR view in a less linear fashion.
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20141012 01:51:58< shadowm> Because I have a hard time wrapping my head around the concept of joining together two divergent timelines.
20141012 01:52:55< shadowm> OK, so what I see here is a PR consisting of a merge at the end joining together two series of commits:
20141012 01:53:10< shadowm> 1) AI0867's commits.
20141012 01:53:30< shadowm> 2) A parallel version of some of AI0867's commits committed by gfgtdf.
20141012 01:54:51< shadowm> gfgtdf's version of the timeline has a newer version of master as its ancestor, whereas AI0867's is from a year ago.
20141012 01:55:52< shadowm> Sooo... do I need to read the diffs? :(
20141012 01:56:49< iceiceice> i was going to read the diffs, at least in some detail,
20141012 01:56:52< shadowm> Because it's like quadratic effort given that a parallel timeline is involved.
20141012 01:57:03< iceiceice> i think all you really need to do is look for any cloven hooves, squirrels, etc.
20141012 01:57:41< iceiceice> we're going to determine the quality ultimately by testing i think
20141012 01:58:14< shadowm> I wish GitHub showed me a path-wise TOC at the start of a diff view.
20141012 01:58:43< shadowm> OK, so *everything* in filesystem.hpp goes into the new filesystem namespace. That simplifies the review a lot.
20141012 01:58:47< iceiceice> i'm going afk, be back in a bit
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20141012 02:00:10< shadowm> filesystem_common.cpp emerges as the implementation place for high-level stuff.
20141012 02:00:35< shadowm> (I'm reading gfgtdf's timeline first.)
20141012 02:01:10< shadowm> AI0867's commits include a lot of distracting tangential fluff.
20141012 02:01:35< shadowm> Namely, distracting tangential fluff that could've been merged into mainline at the time instead.
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20141012 02:02:20< shadowm> When working on my own branches for prolonged periods of time I tend to cherry-pick and discard that kind of fluff as soon as I can to keep them tidy.
20141012 02:03:09< shadowm> OK, gfgtdf's side deals with reconciling the fluff.
20141012 02:03:35< shadowm> Mysteriously out of order, but whatever.
20141012 02:04:08< shadowm> Actually, the whole branch deals with the fluff.
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20141012 02:05:44< shadowm> gfgtdf: As far as I can tell, this is the only commit that doesn't exist in your side of the merge: https://github.com/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/commit/596c2461b83ab3587f98d4fc3a1d93c5d2f3f43d
20141012 02:05:55< shadowm> At least judging by the commit subjects.
20141012 02:06:02< shadowm> So... why do we need two sides?
20141012 02:06:54< shadowm> If it's to ease merging a later set of commits from AI0867, a cleaner alternative would be to keep cherry-picking them on top of your side.
20141012 02:08:54< shadowm> lol I can't read.
20141012 02:09:08< shadowm> "I had to rebase a lot of these commits in order to make every commit compilable then i merged the corresponding commits from AIs branch whith "merge -s ours" to make git know that it can treat those commits as merged."
20141012 02:09:37< shadowm> Icky, but it works I guess. There's little point to doing this if his later commits will be causing conflicts anyway, though.
20141012 02:11:10< shadowm> Though, it also raises the question: why not branch his timeline at the last commit of his you took for this PR (ecf8f3d55cfd9ebc76e99941270500a5781d7819), and then perform a regular merge resolving conflicts in the merge itself?
20141012 02:13:15< shadowm> Also, you excluded this in your side, why was that? <https://github.com/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/commit/596c2461b83ab3587f98d4fc3a1d93c5d2f3f43d>
20141012 02:13:55< shadowm> (All this merge and timeline babble is making my head spin.)
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20141012 02:59:15< gfgtdf> shadowm: about https://github.com/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/commit/596c2461b83ab3587f98d4fc3a1d93c5d2f3f43d: when i cherrypicked 043f4dec600a88ca916a741c82b602ed72b54091 there were a  lot of other occurances i had to add so i put that ocurance tehre too
20141012 03:00:21< gfgtdf> shadowm: the original commit https://github.com/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/commit/043f4dec600a88ca916a741c82b602ed72b54091 changes 5 files less
20141012 03:13:43< shadowm> Right.
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20141012 03:22:22< gfgtdf> i go to bed now
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20141012 03:36:53< shadowm> iceiceice: From the 1.11.10 changelog: "[endlevel] now has two optional subtags [next_scenario_settings], [next_scenario_append], which can be used to reconfigure next scenario."
20141012 03:37:04< shadowm> I believe this is what you wanted to check?
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20141012 04:00:24< iceiceice> shadowm: yes, thanks
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20141012 04:14:29< shadowm> The changelog claims that the overlapping ctrl+a notifications were fixed, but they are not.
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20141012 04:31:13< iceiceice> no, they were fixed
20141012 04:31:46< iceiceice> i think maybe our understandings of the issue were different
20141012 04:32:23< shadowm> I'm not sure what alternate interpretations for the issue can possibly exist.
20141012 04:32:28< iceiceice> its not about "repeated togglings"
20141012 04:32:46< iceiceice> its just that, on a single toggling, the hotkey prints two messages to the screen
20141012 04:32:53< iceiceice> but instead of using one print statement with a \n,
20141012 04:32:58< iceiceice> for some reason fabi called print twice
20141012 04:33:05< iceiceice> so they appear int he same location and are unreadable
20141012 04:33:16< iceiceice> i remember fixing this
20141012 04:33:24< shadowm> Uhhhhhhh.
20141012 04:33:46< shadowm> No.
20141012 04:34:03< shadowm> It loks exactly the same to me on both 1.11.16 and 1.11.17.
20141012 04:34:07< iceiceice> i'll find the commit
20141012 04:34:47< iceiceice> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/7477e9d5dbe7ffa5552dd5df795c481289e724ef
20141012 04:34:49< shadowm> That is: on 1.11.16 the message for enabling fast mode looks fine to me.
20141012 04:35:34< iceiceice> on 1.12: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/13c044f346d2235628b7b9c7e89226c5289574f2
20141012 04:35:56< iceiceice> it looked really bad for me
20141012 04:36:01< iceiceice> and also for bob apparently
20141012 04:36:05< shadowm> It didn't affect me somehow.
20141012 04:36:24< iceiceice> i'll rebuild that commit to check
20141012 04:38:32< shadowm> It looks the same to me on 1.11.10 through 1.11.16, with 1.11.17's change only barely affecting the horizontal position of the second line.
20141012 04:39:53< shadowm> I've reworded the RA entry accordingly anyway.
20141012 04:40:00 * shadowm goes back to figuring out the MP server.
20141012 04:40:46< shadowm> Hm, it's very involved.
20141012 04:43:59< iceiceice> hmm i see what you are saying though about repeated toggling
20141012 04:44:01< iceiceice> that also doesn't look so great
20141012 04:44:11< iceiceice> i dont know how we could fix thta
20141012 04:44:14< iceiceice> *that
20141012 04:44:29< iceiceice> it also affects the "planning mode toggle" hotkey
20141012 04:45:37< iceiceice> i guess we could change display::announce so that instead of making the floating label with a fixed timer, it holds a pointer to the last one and kills it when a new announcement is made?
20141012 04:47:01< shadowm> I don't know, I remember having a glance at the code and deciding that the fix would be too involved for my taste.
20141012 04:48:08< shadowm> I think what made me give up was that I didn't find an obvious way to replace the previous floating text without potentially interfering with WML [print] actions.
20141012 04:48:49< iceiceice> yeah i mean...
20141012 04:49:03< iceiceice> its not really good that hotkeys and wml are putting messages in the same place
20141012 04:49:08< iceiceice> thats bound to create collisions
20141012 04:49:21< shadowm> I'm not entirely sure if that's the case, my memory is very unreliable!
20141012 04:49:38< iceiceice> hmmm
20141012 04:49:57< iceiceice> ok
20141012 04:50:59< shadowm> Ivanovic: As far as I am concerned, all preparations for announcing RC 1 are done, so I'll update the wiki pages and front page after the 24 hours from the tag have passed OR I find my way online, whichever comes last.
20141012 04:51:40< shadowm> I also played a scenario of TSG and found nothing obviously broken.
20141012 04:53:05< shadowm> I'll also close open bugs after the announcement, I've found that makes more sense in case we wind up having to hold it back.
20141012 04:56:09< shadowm> iceiceice: I'm going to review the UI part of #297 if you don't mind.
20141012 04:56:20< iceiceice> ok thank you
20141012 04:58:26< shadowm> Hm.
20141012 04:59:21< shadowm> "Lobby Alerts" or "Lobby Notifications" would be a better name since it covers more than just sounds.
20141012 04:59:55< iceiceice> yeah... it also covers outside the lobby now as it turns out
20141012 05:00:10< iceiceice> i guess "alerts" might be a good title
20141012 05:00:23< iceiceice> i was thinking of "sounds and notifications" but alerts is better
20141012 05:00:32< shadowm> Those long column headers might prove troublesome for localization.
20141012 05:00:49< shadowm> But I don't have better ideas right now. 
20141012 05:01:24< shadowm> It would make sense to center the checkboxes in their columns, too.
20141012 05:02:14< shadowm> I'm also not sure what's the use of naming the underlying WML attribute. We don't really do that anywhere else
20141012 05:02:25< iceiceice> just to help people reconfigure it
20141012 05:02:40< shadowm> Why would they need to change the WML directly?
20141012 05:02:49< iceiceice> if they want to play a different sound
20141012 05:02:51< shadowm> Oh, it's the sound files.
20141012 05:02:53< iceiceice> for the event
20141012 05:03:16< shadowm> (Incidentally, tooltips are not meant to end with a period.)
20141012 05:03:32< iceiceice> yeah, i realized that later
20141012 05:03:47< shadowm> OK, but basically most people won't really understand what the tooltips are about.
20141012 05:04:39< iceiceice> i guess actually, since i adjusted all the names,
20141012 05:04:43< iceiceice> its fairly obvious what entry means what
20141012 05:04:55< iceiceice> maybe the tooltips are pointless
20141012 05:05:22< shadowm> "What's this file and why should I worry about?" (also, I've met Windows users who don't really get file separators other than \.)
20141012 05:05:52 * shadowm is skipping words too often like a broken disc.
20141012 05:06:55< shadowm> I'd like to implement automatic WML cache GC. I just randomly decided to bring up the cache window and it says it's 117 MiB in size.
20141012 05:07:35< shadowm> Looking at the directory contents, I surmise most of that space is wasted with stale entries from previous commits.
20141012 05:08:53< shadowm> Technically I already have the tools to implement that, I just don't know where and when to do that.
20141012 05:09:26< iceiceice> i find that periodically purging it does the trick
20141012 05:09:26< shadowm> Being a potentially I/O expensive, it'd be best delegated to a background thread. :\
20141012 05:09:36< shadowm> * operation,
20141012 05:09:40< iceiceice> its not very expensive to regenerate it
20141012 05:09:50< shadowm> No, I mean to delete all those stale files.
20141012 05:10:17< iceiceice> hmm does purge not do that?
20141012 05:10:18< shadowm> It's easy to underestimate the amount of work the underlying filesystem has to perform to unlink a thousand files.
20141012 05:10:24< shadowm> Yes, manually.
20141012 05:10:55< iceiceice> one thing i would like would be if you could get stats to see how much of the cache is taken up by what
20141012 05:11:08< iceiceice> or, how many wml nodes your add-on is generating post processing for example
20141012 05:12:07< iceiceice> there's a few wiki pages / forum threads about "wml bloat" but it would be a good thing if you could actually see what impact a change has ont his
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20141012 05:18:21< mattsc> shadowm: 1.11.17: http://imgur.com/Fc5Stvw
20141012 05:18:57< mattsc> 1.11.16: http://imgur.com/zyQcrUr
20141012 05:19:17< shadowm> Yeah, that doesn't happen here for some reason.
20141012 05:19:55< shadowm> I wonder if it's somehow linked to https://gna.org/bugs/?21649 .
20141012 05:20:52< mattsc> maybe
20141012 05:21:04< shadowm> Incidentally, I believe I could come up with a workaround for that bug, although it may impact performance for large text objects.
20141012 05:21:47< shadowm> I'm not sure if it'd be worth it because I'm a biased party in the evaluation of this bug, being a UMC author and all.
20141012 05:22:30< mattsc> Well, I am biased in that respect as well
20141012 05:22:50< mattsc> I used to enter lines with a single space in them to make it look more to my liking
20141012 05:23:04< mattsc> until I set up my editor to strip out trailing spaces
20141012 05:23:40< shadowm> I've got my editor configured to do that as well, otherwise my patches would be really ugly and annoying.
20141012 05:25:32< mattsc> anyways, got to go again, I just needed to figure out whether I had just imagined that I had tested that bug fix
20141012 05:34:18< mattsc> Interesting, never thought of that before (it’s probably obvious to everybody else)
20141012 05:34:56< mattsc> Lines in messages containing only an empty space get stripped out by my editor, but lines containing ‘<i> </i>’ (without the quotes) do not.
20141012 05:35:12< mattsc> Well, the spaces get stripped out, not the lines.
20141012 05:35:48< iceiceice> hmm so i'm noticing something a bit wierd,
20141012 05:35:51< mattsc> I think that’s what I’ll do for empty lines from now on.  Because it’ll work the same whether this bug is fixed or not.
20141012 05:35:59< iceiceice> is it the case that preferences cannot be changed from the title screen?
20141012 05:36:20< iceiceice> with my dialog, if i fiddle around with the checkboxes after launching from mp lobby, then it remembers my changes
20141012 05:36:32< iceiceice> but if i launch it from the title screen it doesn't remember them
20141012 05:37:23< iceiceice> (very minor issue...)
20141012 05:38:43< mattsc> iceiceice: i just changed the setting of ‘skip AI moves’ in the title screen, went into a saved game, and the changed setting was still present
20141012 05:38:48< mattsc> is that what you mean?
20141012 05:39:39< iceiceice> so even more simply, change something, close the preferences, and then reopen the preferences
20141012 05:40:07< mattsc> while in the title screen?
20141012 05:40:21< iceiceice> hmm it must be specific to my dialog somehow...
20141012 05:40:45< mattsc> works for me
20141012 05:40:51< mattsc> with the normal preferences
20141012 05:41:48< iceiceice> welp i'm a bit stumped
20141012 05:42:16< iceiceice> im going to sleep on it i think
20141012 05:42:42< mattsc> good night then
20141012 05:43:39< shadowm> mattsc: What about <i></i>?
20141012 05:43:53< mattsc> tried it, does not produce an empty line
20141012 05:44:03< mattsc> you do need the space in there
20141012 05:44:35< shadowm> So all intraline whitespace works, okay.
20141012 05:45:08< mattsc> without having tried all options, it appears so
20141012 05:45:37< shadowm> iceiceice: All preferences should be modifiable from the titlescreen even if they don't have an instant effect in some cases. If they don't work then it's a bug.
20141012 05:46:06< shadowm> By the way, I've decided to finally write that UI style guide and get it approved by the ML.
20141012 05:46:30< mattsc> cool
20141012 05:46:47< mattsc> well, and I’m really off now too, good night
20141012 05:46:52< shadowm> So I can retire without worrying about an era of UI inconsistency starting afterwards.
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20141012 05:51:02< iceiceice> is there an easy way to block myself from compiling with libdbus?
20141012 05:51:42< shadowm> scons notifications=no ?
20141012 05:52:21< iceiceice> i think i figured it out
20141012 05:52:23< iceiceice> yeah thanks
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20141012 08:24:01< shadowm> Front page news block draft is up: http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?p=576616#p576616
20141012 08:29:31< shadowm> vultraz: Review that if you are around, please.
20141012 08:46:10-!- Necrosporus [~Necrospor@unaffiliated/necrosporus] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
20141012 09:00:37< vultraz> shadowm: it's fine
20141012 09:04:54< shadowm> Ivanovic: So unless you have any objections, I'll do as I said in the admins channel and announce now.
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20141012 09:30:43< irker432> wesnoth: Charles Dang website:Vultraz_template_revisions 931d2a9c513b / start/1.12/template.html: Changed unmatched XHTML br and hr closing tags to HTML regular tags http://git.io/PYu-5w
20141012 09:31:01< shadowm> No objections? No objections.
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20141012 09:37:25< zookeeper> no objections.
20141012 09:48:01< irker432> wesnoth: Charles Dang website:Vultraz_template_revisions bab149cb8dce / start/1.12/template.html: Style cleanup http://git.io/kG3fGw
20141012 10:01:22< vultraz> I see you removed the link the the eclipse plugi
20141012 10:01:24< vultraz> n
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20141012 10:25:14-!- shadowm changed the topic of #wesnoth-dev to: string+feature freeze active on 1.12 | 256 bugs, 338 feature requests, 29 patches | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Alternate logs: http://wesnoth.debian.net | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: http://pastebin.com | http://imagebin.org
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20141012 11:35:42< gfgtdf> shadowm: why not branch his timeline at the last commit of his you took for this PR (ecf8f3d55cfd9ebc76e99941270500a5781d7819), and then perform a regular merge resolving conflicts in the merge itself? Because for me resolving the  merge conflicts in each commit waseasierthan doing them alltogether.
20141012 11:36:53< shadowm> *shrug*
20141012 11:37:19< shadowm> It's at this point that I'm unsure what I was supposed to review in that PR in the first place.
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20141012 11:42:03< gfgtdf> shadowm: ok,ill merge it then as soon as a i have access to accesto my gihub account.
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20141012 12:39:48< gfgtdf> do all our travis build use scons and non cmake ?
20141012 12:45:13< shadowm> vultraz: <br> without a closing tag is invalid XML/XHTML, that's why the original used <br />.
20141012 12:45:36< vultraz> But this is not XML/XHTML
20141012 12:45:41< shadowm> It *is* XHTML.
20141012 12:45:44< shadowm> Read the doctype.
20141012 12:48:00< shadowm> Also, use ems for defining the size of elements involving text, not pixels. We went over this already months ago.
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20141012 12:48:31< vultraz> the px are for the image sizes
20141012 12:48:38< vultraz> I use % for text size
20141012 12:48:55< shadowm> (Why using image buttons is a bad idea. Just watch it break with a translation.)
20141012 12:50:19< shadowm> > <div id='div-multiplayer' style='overflow-y:hidden'>
20141012 12:50:25< shadowm> What were you trying to accomplish here?
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20141012 12:53:14< vultraz> Prevent the MP section from starting next to the campaign image, since there's Y space there
20141012 12:53:25< vultraz> but perhaps that's only needed on the campaign div
20141012 12:53:27< vultraz> I wasn't sure
20141012 12:53:29< shadowm> Not every single element needs an id.
20141012 12:53:37< vultraz> so I just stuck all three sections in a div
20141012 12:53:51< shadowm> You only need ids if you intent to match id-based selectors or use link anchors.
20141012 12:54:38< shadowm> However, for this purpose a class makes more sense than repeating the same inline style over and over.
20141012 12:55:00< shadowm> Inline styles are supposed to be an exceptional thing, not the common case.
20141012 12:56:23< Crendgrim> vultraz: note also that the meta and link tags close themselves. Removing it from <br> was inconsistent at the very minimum.
20141012 12:56:43< vultraz> You people confuse me
20141012 12:57:24< shadowm> Me?
20141012 12:57:26< Crendgrim> You changed "<br />" to "<br>", but not "<link ... />" to "<link ...>".
20141012 12:57:40< shadowm> I didn't force you to break XML syntax.
20141012 12:57:53< vultraz> Oh
20141012 12:57:59< vultraz> Why is it XML anyway...
20141012 12:58:00< Crendgrim> Now I am not saying you should change <link />.
20141012 12:58:26< shadowm> XHTML is an XML-compliant HTML port.
20141012 12:58:35< shadowm> Valid XHTML must be valid XML.
20141012 12:58:53< vultraz> I mean, why does the page have to be XHTML and not just plain HTML
20141012 12:59:20< shadowm> Probably because 1) XHTML was the cool thing back when glamdrol was designed; and 2) the translation tool probably uses an XML parser.
20141012 12:59:52< shadowm> Note that it is possible to write valid HTML5 that's XML-parseable.
20141012 13:00:14< Crendgrim> <br></br>
20141012 13:00:29< shadowm> However, I suspect the translation tool might still sniff the doctype and barf if it doesn't find what it wants.
20141012 13:01:07< shadowm> I don't know, I haven't tried, and as far as I can tell translation tools behave very differently here compared to Ivanovic's machine, and guess whose machine I don't have access to.
20141012 13:04:11< vultraz> so you want me to make it XHTML again?
20141012 13:04:30< shadowm> I'm trying to teach you.
20141012 13:05:00< shadowm> I know my time is usually better spent on other things since you are rebellious like that, but still.
20141012 13:05:06< shadowm> :\
20141012 13:06:24< vultraz> I get the lesson, yes
20141012 13:07:10< shadowm> > using Trebuchet MS like everyone is running Windows
20141012 13:10:31< vultraz> Suggested alternative?
20141012 13:10:58< shadowm> That's up to you.
20141012 13:13:20< vultraz> Is that it?
20141012 13:13:37< vultraz> font, xml issues, and recommendation of inline style to external class?
20141012 13:14:04< shadowm> Yes.
20141012 13:14:25< vultraz> what about improvements of your own, are you working on any
20141012 13:14:33< shadowm> Yes.
20141012 13:16:16< shadowm> Your idea of deleting the download section is very evil.
20141012 13:16:32< vultraz> ...why
20141012 13:16:54< shadowm> It means there's no mention of the license or what downloading the source code entails.
20141012 13:17:33< vultraz> Most games don't stick their license in their announcement, and the average user isn't going to be interested in the course code
20141012 13:17:39< vultraz> If they want it, it's right on the Downloads page, anyway
20141012 13:17:42< shadowm> This isn't "most games".
20141012 13:17:42< vultraz> What's the problemn
20141012 13:18:27< shadowm> You are thinking <AAA title here>, this is an open-source game and it's still very associated with the Linux ecosystem in particular.
20141012 13:18:55< shadowm> Half of our Linux users will actually want the source from us because it's usually the only way they can stay up to date.
20141012 13:19:00< Crendgrim> If I find an open source game, but am not sure whether it's open source or only freeware, I'm less likely to try it out.
20141012 13:19:50< vultraz> Alright, we can have a section about the license
20141012 13:20:18< vultraz> But I still think the source code can stay on the download page, accessible by the nice Download button
20141012 13:20:26< shadowm> No.
20141012 13:21:16< shadowm>     <h4 id='multiplayer' class="visualClear">Multiplayer</h4>
20141012 13:21:31< shadowm> Much cleaner than the icky div-wrapping workaround.
20141012 13:21:50< shadowm> (The alternative is placing a visualClear div above.)
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20141012 13:22:59< shadowm> I just noticed, "brand new map editor".
20141012 13:23:13< shadowm> It's the same map editor as always, just greatly improved.
20141012 13:23:40< shadowm> I'm not sure if we should be applying the same logic behind that bit and call it a brand new Wesnoth too?
20141012 13:23:50< vultraz> In terms of functionality it might as well be a new one
20141012 13:24:05< shadowm> Not really.
20141012 13:25:24< shadowm> This bothersome download button.
20141012 13:25:36< shadowm> It's floating at the center of everything like some kind of bug.
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20141012 13:25:49< irker027> wesnoth: Charles Dang website:Vultraz_template_revisions 0811a19fe642 / start/1.12/template.html: Applied VisualClear class to the mp section header, instead of div-wrapping http://git.io/yyZ8aw
20141012 13:26:00< shadowm> It's visualClear, not VisualClear.
20141012 13:26:17< vultraz> I got it right in the file
20141012 13:26:31< shadowm> Don't make assumptions about translation lengths.
20141012 13:26:37< shadowm> visualClear every section.
20141012 13:32:09< irker027> wesnoth: Charles Dang website:Vultraz_template_revisions 4c1cac44eab6 / start/1.12/template.html: Use visualClear class in all three main text sections http://git.io/CJ33ew
20141012 13:32:12< irker027> wesnoth: Charles Dang website:Vultraz_template_revisions bbf3428a8f6b / start/1.12/template.html: Revert "Changed unmatched XHTML br and hr closing tags to HTML regular tags" http://git.io/5mfi3Q
20141012 13:32:14< irker027> wesnoth: Charles Dang website:Vultraz_template_revisions f22d737d43e2 / start/1.12/template.html: Revert "Fixed an invalid break tag" http://git.io/eT4s8A
20141012 13:33:00< shadowm> Why are the large buttons in /images/buttons/button_normal broken? :\
20141012 13:33:19< shadowm> The hovered versions have the light source at the opposite end.
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20141012 13:33:42< travis-ci> gfgtdf/wesnoth-old#266 (aibfs_copy_2 - 3f84511 : gfgtdf): The build passed.
20141012 13:33:42< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/builds/37742396
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20141012 13:35:40< fabi_> mattsc: ping
20141012 13:36:09< mattsc> hi fabi_ 
20141012 13:36:50< zookeeper> the tooltips in advanced preferences now work, but they're pretty weird. a lot of entries don't have tooltips, yet even their actual checkbox/slider/whatever does (it just shows the name of the preference)
20141012 13:39:03< shadowm> vultraz: Where did you obtain the shield logo from?
20141012 13:39:17< shadowm> I need a transparent version.
20141012 13:40:27< vultraz> I er....can't recall....huh...
20141012 13:40:31< vultraz> Wasn't the forums
20141012 13:42:36< vultraz> here, though: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ezsy17vm9az7rlj/shield.png?dl=0
20141012 13:43:14< vultraz> Oh, that's right
20141012 13:43:29< vultraz> I originally got it from the template in resources/
20141012 13:43:44< vultraz> https://github.com/wesnoth/resources/tree/master/image-localization/templates/bfw-logo
20141012 13:46:45< irker027> wesnoth: Charles Dang website:Vultraz_template_revisions ee4d22db75de / start/1.12/template.html: Converted remaining break tags to be XHTML compatible http://git.io/56Xuow
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20141012 13:57:54< mattsc> shadowm: how do we usually deal with bugs like this:  https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?22751 ?
20141012 13:58:57< mattsc> Should I close those?  I found a handful that I marked as “works for me” or “won’t fix” a week or so ago.
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20141012 13:59:58< shadowm> We should triage all WFM and RFT bugs soon.
20141012 14:00:48< shadowm> Won't Fix bugs are normally closed as part of every release as applicable.
20141012 14:01:07< shadowm> (See http://wiki.wesnoth.org/ReportingBugs#Bug_protocol on exactly when a bug is closed.)
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20141012 14:03:20< mattsc> shadowm: I know that procedure; it’s ambiguous concerning “wont’ fix” bugs (and probably some other categories)
20141012 14:03:39< mattsc> sorry “works for me"
20141012 14:04:24< shadowm> I've not closed WFM bugs in ages. We've been building up a massive queue which, again, we should triage soon.
20141012 14:04:44< mattsc> I absolutely agree with that
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20141012 14:05:10< shadowm> Much like RFT and NI bugs, it's hard to decide exactly when to get rid of them since users are usually not fast enough to respond.
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20141012 14:06:27< shadowm> OK, nobody panic, it seems I broke campaignd.
20141012 14:07:28 * mattsc panics !
20141012 14:07:52< mattsc> 8+9+20 = 37 bugs marked in those categories
20141012 14:09:16< shadowm> !tag 1.11.16
20141012 14:09:17< shikadibot> shadowm: Tag 1.11.16, revision 34a56515f9a3 (Nils Kneuper) on Sat Jul 12 18:21:08 2014:
20141012 14:09:21< shikadibot> shadowm: bump version to 1.11.16
20141012 14:09:23< shikadibot> shadowm: Web interface URL: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/34a56515f9a3
20141012 14:10:25 * shadowm scratches head.
20141012 14:10:56< mattsc> is this about the post by tekelili?
20141012 14:11:03< shadowm> Yes.
20141012 14:12:27< shadowm> Uh hoh.
20141012 14:14:51< shadowm> Well, this is embarassing.
20141012 14:21:13< irker027> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master 97690a241d18 / src/campaign_server/campaign_server.cpp: campaignd: Clear [feedback] from campaign list response *after* using it http://git.io/UupB0w
20141012 14:21:17< irker027> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:1.12 3f55be954f1e / changelog src/campaign_server/campaign_server.cpp: campaignd: Clear [feedback] from campaign list response *after* using it http://git.io/dpjfVg
20141012 14:22:50< shadowm> UB in server application.
20141012 14:22:58< shadowm> gg guy.
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20141012 14:39:03< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/builds/37747173
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20141012 14:43:05< travis-ci> gfgtdf/wesnoth-old#270 (AI-boost_filesystem_2 - 5e56f2a : gfgtdf): The build has errored.
20141012 14:43:05< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/builds/37747497
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20141012 15:17:45< travis-ci> gfgtdf/wesnoth-old#271 (AI-boost_filesystem_2 - 514b93b : gfgtdf): The build passed.
20141012 15:17:45< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/builds/37747838
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20141012 15:39:45< travis-ci> gfgtdf/wesnoth-old#272 (AI-boost_filesystem_2 - fcc95f6 : gfgtdf): The build failed.
20141012 15:39:45< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/builds/37749056
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20141012 15:42:03< irker027> wesnoth: Andrius Silinskas wesnoth:1.12 2464cfab486a / src/ (mp_game_utils.cpp multiplayer_connect_engine.cpp savegame.cpp): Partially fixed MP start-of-scenario saves. http://git.io/7Lgufg
20141012 15:42:14< thunderstruck> mattsc, gfgtdf, Ayne: ^
20141012 15:43:00< thunderstruck> I worked on MP sos saves and I managed to make them work, but only partially. It looks like there are some problems with networked MP, because something bad happens with side controllers.
20141012 15:43:24-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20141012 15:43:27< thunderstruck> I tried to look into that, but I think that has changed since I worked on them and I'm not really sure what's the problem.
20141012 15:44:08< thunderstruck> I don't have much time now to dive deep enough into that area, so I would appreciate if something else could take a look. If not, I might try to find some time to look at it again.
20141012 15:44:57< gfgtdf> thunderstruck: what exatly is wrong with the controllers ?
20141012 15:45:18< thunderstruck> gfgtdf: Server complains that it can't find right controllers and then it assigns them to host.
20141012 15:45:37< thunderstruck> Then if you load the game, clients will complain about OOS.
20141012 15:46:05< thunderstruck> And also controllers do not look right in the game lobby when you load save game files.
20141012 15:47:35< gfgtdf> thunderstruck: do it stil doesnt work at all ? Maybe we shoudl just drop the 'reserved' player feature for sos saves ?
20141012 15:48:22< thunderstruck> It seems to work fine in non-networked games.
20141012 15:49:28< thunderstruck> Just to clarify: you can now load MP sos saves, but there might be problems in networked MP.
20141012 15:49:57< thunderstruck> Yeah, maybe we should drop 'reserved' if that would fix the problems.
20141012 15:50:25< thunderstruck> But it might be something else.
20141012 15:51:05< gfgtdf> y
20141012 15:51:05< thunderstruck> Maybe 'level' is still missing some data or some of it is set incorrectly.
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20141012 16:13:35< fabi_> The side limit in MP games, is it 9 or 10?
20141012 16:13:46< gfgtdf> fabi_: it 9
20141012 16:13:48< gfgtdf> its
20141012 16:13:52< fabi_> oh
20141012 16:13:54< fabi_> hmmm
20141012 16:14:24< gfgtdf> fabi_: i acrtualy wonder whats the reason for this limit, is it only the colors ?
20141012 16:14:38< fabi_> I don't know.
20141012 16:14:59< fabi_> Maybe it is something with the setup screen.
20141012 16:15:31< gfgtdf> fabi_: sp supports > 9 players. I think sides > 9 have all black as default color
20141012 16:15:43< fabi_> There might be no room for more than 9 sides and the dialog.
20141012 16:16:11< gfgtdf> fabi_: you mean the mp connect dialog ?
20141012 16:16:22< fabi_> yes
20141012 16:17:20< gfgtdf> fabi_: i dont think that is teh reason, even in 9p-merkwürdigeleibe there is not eough space if played in small windows and teh game automaticly adds a scrollbar then
20141012 16:18:14< fabi_> Well, 9 is a little few for LoW MP.
20141012 16:19:24< gfgtdf> the lmit is hardcoded here, but since those are vextors it shoudl be possible to make it dynamicly sized . https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/src/server/game.cpp#L57
20141012 16:19:27< gfgtdf> limit*
20141012 16:24:53< Ravana_> when talking about large number of sides, what is the reason that no side has default color of yellow?
20141012 16:25:47< gfgtdf> Ravana_: i dont know
20141012 16:27:21< irker027> wesnoth: Charles Dang website:Vultraz_template_revisions cd847a9b857e / start/1.12/ (styles/intl.css template.html): Apply same font to both intro text and button text http://git.io/mwFp7Q
20141012 16:29:06< vultraz> shadowm: alright, that's everything ^
20141012 16:30:29< gfgtdf> is teh 1.17 windows binary alredy avainable`?
20141012 16:31:28< Ravana_> I guess it is, yesterday I took 1.16 link and changed 6 to 7 and it seems to work
20141012 16:42:52< gfgtdf> Ravana_: ok ty
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20141012 17:56:42< vultraz> shadowm: also, I don't think there will be an issue with translations of the imagetext title
20141012 17:56:53< vultraz> I allowed enough empty space on the sides
20141012 17:57:12< vultraz> There aren't really many ways you can translate a proper noun like Wesnoth and make it longer
20141012 18:04:03< Ravana_> whats going on with 1.10 mp server?
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20141012 18:37:19< iceiceice> gfgtdf: i looked through https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/pull/296
20141012 18:37:32< iceiceice> i didnt see anything in the diffs that looks bad
20141012 18:37:35< iceiceice> but also,
20141012 18:37:45< iceiceice> i dont really understand why many commits appear twice, and the second time in different orders...
20141012 18:40:06< iceiceice> if it works it works though i guess
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20141012 18:41:25< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i just rebased rebased 296 to add e815c94f7043ad0eb2d1d342fdecc26afd2cf85.
20141012 18:42:03< gfgtdf> they appears wrice becasue there was a merger from ais orignal branch and my branch to its cotnains my charrypicked commit and his origonal commits
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20141012 18:42:51< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i wonder whether i should rebase e815c94f7043ad0eb2d1 into teh commit before to make it compilable with cmake
20141012 18:48:40< iceiceice> maybe
20141012 18:48:42< iceiceice> its up to you
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20141012 18:51:07< iceiceice> i dont think its a big deal, as far as i can tell ivanovic is the only person who really uses cmake
20141012 18:54:28< Ivanovic> if i am not able to build with cmake, then releasing fails
20141012 18:54:29< Ivanovic> ;)
20141012 18:55:50< gfgtdf> Ivanovic: it was just about whether failing at one specific old commit was bad.
20141012 18:56:08< Ivanovic> that can happen
20141012 19:00:31< irker027> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master e34ea01d71a6 / src/wesnoth.cpp: extend NO_CATCH_AT_GAME_END http://git.io/P4Hpkw
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20141012 19:18:16< gfgtdf> iceiceice: if we want to use boost random for teh mersennetwister, do we even need the random.dll ?
20141012 19:18:54< iceiceice> why wouldn't we?
20141012 19:19:04< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i beleive it's very posible that  teh mersennetwisert part is header only and the dll is only needed for teh random device part
20141012 19:19:37< iceiceice> hmm
20141012 19:20:12< iceiceice> i dont know
20141012 19:21:12< iceiceice> im looking at my notes again,
20141012 19:21:21< iceiceice> i think actually on windows, the boost random device is replaced by a windows api call
20141012 19:21:35< gfgtdf> iceiceice: yes and teht is done in the random.dll
20141012 19:21:52< gfgtdf> iceiceice: in teh boost header it says: typedef mersenne_twister_engine<uint32_t,32,624,397,31,0x9908b0df,
20141012 19:21:54< gfgtdf>    11,0xffffffff,7,0x9d2c5680,15,0xefc60000,18,1812433253> mt19937;
20141012 19:22:09< gfgtdf> so since it is a template it somehow must be header only i think
20141012 19:22:21< gfgtdf> in this case i mean
20141012 19:24:10< iceiceice> maybe
20141012 19:24:25< iceiceice> what benefit is it if it's header only?
20141012 19:24:57< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i thought that could it easier to compile on pandora but that was just a thought
20141012 19:25:03< iceiceice> oh i see
20141012 19:25:26< iceiceice> yeah so i realized at some point recently,
20141012 19:26:31< iceiceice> actually when pyrophorus was developing yamg,
20141012 19:26:43< iceiceice> he added the mersenne twister right into the yamg code
20141012 19:26:53< iceiceice> just like, copy pasted it from whatever source
20141012 19:27:01< iceiceice> i guess because he wasnt happy with our internal random generator
20141012 19:27:12< iceiceice> it got removed by lipk here: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/0c973bcf400e7df329497efb798fa6ef04c42729
20141012 19:27:18< gfgtdf> iceiceice: he deeloped yamg independetly form wesnoth source
20141012 19:27:24< gfgtdf> developed*
20141012 19:27:43< gfgtdf> iceiceice: and it was integrated lather, i beleive that's the main reaso why there are 2 random generators
20141012 19:28:04< iceiceice> hmm
20141012 19:29:20< iceiceice> yeah so i dont think its a good thing to just copy the source in, even though its sort of what happened with our current rng...
20141012 19:29:38< iceiceice> but header-only lib and copying the source in like this really isn't that different
20141012 19:30:49< iceiceice> the thing also is,
20141012 19:30:58< iceiceice> if we change the rng algorithm now,
20141012 19:31:05< iceiceice> i guess that it breaks mp compatability right?
20141012 19:31:36< iceiceice> and you can't load any games and replays because all the random results will be different for the given seeds...
20141012 19:31:48< iceiceice> so its not really an option for 1.12 now
20141012 19:32:39< gfgtdf> iceiceice: well adding a compability path shouldn't be that hard, but yes i didn't intend for 1.12
20141012 19:33:29< iceiceice> Ivanovic: i remember a couple emails about, 1.12 will be the last version you release for pandora,
20141012 19:33:53< iceiceice> does that mean it's okay to add boost random and boost filesystem on master?
20141012 19:45:21< fabi_> mattsc: There is something wrong with the AI. It is not clearing the fields before recruiting and thus it only recruits a few units during the second turn.
20141012 20:00:45-!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: Samual, zookeeper, Anakonda, esr
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20141012 20:05:09< bumbadadabum> Ivanovic: Are you going to be at FOSDEM again next year?
20141012 20:05:39< bumbadadabum> bit early to ask, but the subject of FOSDEM was dropped in another channel
20141012 20:06:01-!- zookeeper_ is now known as zookeeper
20141012 20:22:00< vultraz> Does anyone have any more suggestions for my announcement template?
20141012 20:22:12< vultraz> anyone else*
20141012 20:22:50< vultraz> If not, what's the consensus on actively using it
20141012 20:23:24< iceiceice> vultraz: is it the current "master" branch on website repo?
20141012 20:23:28< iceiceice> or is it in the vultraz branch
20141012 20:23:35< vultraz> my branch
20141012 20:25:41< iceiceice> i think it looks good
20141012 20:30:34< vultraz> If there aren't any objections, I'll look to merging it to master in the next day or two
20141012 20:33:04< vultraz> Ivanovic: ^
20141012 20:35:45< vultraz> shadowm: would you prefer I write a new downloads section or just revert the deletion of the old one
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20141012 21:36:44< mattsc> fabi_: what do you mean?  in all scenarios?  or under what circumstances?
20141012 21:37:09< fabi_> hi mattsc
20141012 21:37:20< mattsc> hi fabi_ 
20141012 21:37:30< fabi_> LoW 14
20141012 21:38:00< mattsc> the default AI *never* clears castle hexes.  It moves units toward goals.  If it does not have goals to move toward, it does not move its units (incl. off castle tiles)
20141012 21:38:00< Ivanovic> iceiceice: changing those deps is fine, as long as noone raises a different valid reason on wesnoth-dev (the ML)
20141012 21:38:18< Ivanovic> bumbadadabum: not sure at all, at least there will not be a games devroom in 2015
20141012 21:38:37< bumbadadabum> oh
20141012 21:38:55< Ivanovic> bumbadadabum: i mentioned to folks that i will not have the time to organize it
20141012 21:39:03< Ivanovic> noone stepped up, so no dedicated dev room
20141012 21:39:13< mattsc> fabi_: so are you sure that the AI has goals to move toward?
20141012 21:39:34< Ivanovic> vultraz: maybe try to restore the old downloads section since this was already translated in the past and will only require little changes by translators
20141012 21:39:45< shadowm> 15:04:01 <Ravana_> whats going on with 1.10 mp server?
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20141012 21:39:55< shadowm> Ravana_: I don't know, perhaps you do? :)
20141012 21:40:35< bumbadadabum> Ivanovic: oh that's a shame
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20141012 21:41:08< bumbadadabum> I found out I would actually get credits for my study by going to FOSDEM
20141012 21:41:15< bumbadadabum> so it'd be cool for me to go
20141012 21:41:22< bumbadadabum> but welp
20141012 21:41:35< Ivanovic> i might go to fosdem anyway, but as of right now i don't know
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20141012 21:43:37< Ivanovic> what i did not know is that i would certainly not have the time to organize a devroom
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20141012 21:45:51< bumbadadabum> I might still be there as well
20141012 21:46:00< bumbadadabum> quite a lot of other students are going
20141012 21:49:21< Ivanovic> time for me to get some sleep
20141012 21:49:22< Ivanovic> n8+
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20141012 22:15:21< shadowm> vultraz, Ivanovic: vultraz's branch isn't in a mergeable state and I'd personally veto some of his design decisions.
20141012 22:15:56< shadowm> I'd rather have us go with the current design from master as soon as the contents are finished.
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20141012 23:47:56< gfgtdf> thunderstruck: ok did some research and found out that on master (1.13) the sos saves are still quiet broken, esecialy "team_name" gets reset so when reloading all players will be enemies, i'll think about it.
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--- Log closed Mon Oct 13 00:00:20 2014