--- Log opened Sat Nov 29 00:00:11 2014
--- Day changed Sat Nov 29 2014
20141129 00:00:11< irker117> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master 84f5677155d3 / src/scripting/ (lua_gui2.cpp lua_gui2.hpp lua_kernel_base.cpp lua_kernel_base.hpp): add wesnoth.show_lua_console, as a debugging aide http://git.io/yTnx3g
20141129 00:00:13< irker117> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master 87d5f3b440c8 / src/scripting/ (lua_gui2.cpp lua_gui2.hpp lua_kernel_base.cpp lua_kernel_base.hpp): Merge branch 'add_lua_interpreter_launch_command' http://git.io/3cj1xQ
20141129 00:06:50-!- ancestral [~ancestral@125.sub-70-197-198.myvzw.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 00:08:59-!- Duthlet [~Duthlet@wesnoth/mp-mod/Duthlet] has quit [Quit: leaving]
20141129 00:21:44-!- iceiceice [~chris@50.245.222.235] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 00:21:44-!- iceiceice [~chris@50.245.222.235] has quit [Changing host]
20141129 00:21:44-!- iceiceice [~chris@wesnoth/developer/iceiceice] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 00:21:58< iceiceice> does anyone know if we can use boost lambda in master currently?
20141129 00:22:01< iceiceice> or is that a compiled lib
20141129 00:23:08< iceiceice> hmm i guess its header only: http://www.boost.org/doc/libs/1_57_0/doc/html/lambda/getting_started.html
20141129 00:23:11< iceiceice> never mind...
20141129 00:24:46-!- Anakonda [Anakonda@dsl-tkubrasgw1-54f9ba-178.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 00:31:10-!- Eisenhover [~Obliterat@45.64.105.56] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 00:44:39< anonymissimus> iceiceice: the start-of-scenario saves are only deactivated for mp, right ? I though "no...how can he..."
20141129 00:44:58< iceiceice> its only deactivated in mp and only in 1.12
20141129 00:45:06< anonymissimus> almost no bug is worth loosing them, actually
20141129 00:45:24< iceiceice> i mean if they don't work they don't work
20141129 00:45:28< iceiceice> its bad to lose them in mp also
20141129 00:45:37< anonymissimus> these saves are vital for transferring campaign saves between wesnoth versions for instance
20141129 00:46:32< anonymissimus> such as when you want to go from 1.10 to 1.12
20141129 00:46:51< iceiceice> it's a shame that we weren't able to fix them
20141129 00:55:49-!- anonymissimus [~chatzilla@HSI-KBW-078-042-069-130.hsi3.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.90.1 [Firefox 11.0/20120312181643]]
20141129 01:00:54-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20141129 01:05:34-!- travis-ci [~travis-ci@ec2-54-160-202-158.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 01:05:34< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#4947 (master - 87d5f3b : Chris Beck): The build passed.
20141129 01:05:34< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/42440511
20141129 01:05:34-!- travis-ci [~travis-ci@ec2-54-160-202-158.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20141129 01:07:19< gfgtdf> shikadibot: seen thunderstruck
20141129 01:07:19< shikadibot> gfgtdf: The person with the nick thunderstruck last spoke 13d 8h ago.  2d 3h ago they left with the message: Quit: Leaving
20141129 01:07:24-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 01:09:29-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20141129 01:14:44-!- fendrin [~quassel@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 01:25:38-!- fabi [~quassel@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 01:41:59-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 01:42:07-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 01:45:03-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 01:45:35< shadowm> fabi: Do you like to ask me questions as a matter of habit, or would you like to ask me a particular set of questions right now?
20141129 01:46:00< shadowm> Sorry if I sound pedantic, but I believe you were writing a campaign too some time ago.
20141129 01:46:34< fabi> shadowm: hmmmm
20141129 01:46:49< loonycyborg> anonymissimus: yes, toolset=gcc
20141129 01:47:09< loonycyborg> but if you used bat file
20141129 01:47:17< loonycyborg> it should have took care of this
20141129 01:47:19< fabi> shadowm: You ask me if I ask you questions because I am bored?
20141129 01:48:20< shadowm> I'm pointing out the difference between saying "I like to ask you a question" and "I would like to ask you a question".
20141129 01:49:00< fabi> Let's talk about non modal gui2 dialogs.
20141129 01:49:09< shadowm> So anyway, I didn't understand your question because I don't know about the implementation details of GUI2 tooltips.
20141129 01:49:13< fabi> Currently it looks like mordante is gone for good.
20141129 01:49:26< fabi> I don't know if he ever made a Wesbreak that long before.
20141129 01:49:31< shadowm> I'm also not quite interested i what why are you saying that? I saw him around a couple of days ago.
20141129 01:49:40< fabi> Ah cool.
20141129 01:50:08< shadowm> Plus his is the second reply to the C++11 thread.
20141129 01:50:40< fabi> Iirc you know about the current state of non modal dialogs in gui2.
20141129 01:50:57< shadowm> Not really. I only know they aren't supported.
20141129 01:51:50< shadowm> The GUI2 popup thing... To my recollection, mordante was working on a new GUI2 implementation of tooltips that's only conditionally activated either by --new-widgets or a C++ preprocessor symbol at compile-time.
20141129 01:52:37< shadowm> I'm generallly not interested in WIP GUI2 things because their interface and implementation tends to be rather volatile by design, and I consider myself a GUI2 user.
20141129 01:55:44< fabi> I have added image support to the gui1 tooltips.
20141129 01:55:50< shadowm> Also, GUI2's event handling doesn't play nice with GUI1/non-GUI things and there are a few subtle bugs, so I can only imagine things would be more or less unusable if non-modal dialogs came into play. I could be wrong, but I'm not going to be that guinea pig.
20141129 01:56:02< iceiceice> shadowm: fabi and i discussed earlier that we might endeavor to figure out how to make gui2 modal dialogs,
20141129 01:56:15< shadowm> *non-modal
20141129 01:56:20< iceiceice> *thank you
20141129 01:56:35< shadowm> Well, glhf I guess?
20141129 01:56:50< shadowm> Try to email mordante or something before modifying GUI2 library code, though.
20141129 01:57:19< iceiceice> yeah i guess sending him an email is pretty reasonable
20141129 01:58:13< fabi> Let's first just discover why the popup class just freezes the UI.
20141129 01:58:29< fabi> This class claims to be non modal.
20141129 01:58:45< fabi> Maybe it is just a matter of fixing a single small bug.
20141129 01:58:55< shadowm> The attacks popup idea needs some refining to be truly usable. I don't want to see probability graphs, for example.
20141129 02:00:11< iceiceice> fabi: i think it's probably that gui2 and gui1 have separate event queues or something
20141129 02:00:27< shadowm> Yes.
20141129 02:00:28< iceiceice> i mean the tooltips don't freeze the ui when you have a gui2 dialog
20141129 02:01:03< iceiceice> and its probably fundamental that they are separate, by reason of mordante making an improved class to represent an event or something
20141129 02:01:10< iceiceice> that's what i would anticipate anyways
20141129 02:01:46< shadowm> iceiceice: I read the full block, I still don't agree we should change standard Lua functions for the sake of it.
20141129 02:02:13< fabi> shadowm: I think popups on the game screen is a very delicate issue in general. I guess there is a big part of people who just don't want any popups at all there.
20141129 02:02:37< shadowm> I also don't think we should encourage hacks like "print = std_print".
20141129 02:02:38< iceiceice> shadowm: ok, that's pretty reasonable
20141129 02:02:50< iceiceice> i don't think that's much of a hack,
20141129 02:02:54< fabi> They are so noisy and nervous that everything around them needs to be very configurable.
20141129 02:03:27< iceiceice> more or less what the game does right now when it starts up is "std_print = print; (push onto stack a new print function); settable(..., "print"); "
20141129 02:04:17< shadowm> Okay, so R_N is encouraging the use of a hack to cancel another hack?
20141129 02:04:32< iceiceice> i think this is standard practice when configuring the lua environment.
20141129 02:04:51< iceiceice> take a look at this page: http://lua-users.org/wiki/ScopeTutorial
20141129 02:05:01< iceiceice> especially, the lua section at the end entitled "strict.lua"
20141129 02:05:27< iceiceice> a new syntax is imposed on the language by defining a new table, and defining it to be the metatable of _G
20141129 02:05:38< iceiceice> and that's pretty much canonical lua
20141129 02:05:45< iceiceice> so i think hack is a relative term here
20141129 02:06:53< shadowm> fabi: Rather than graphs I'd like to see how the target unit's abilities, location defense stats, and the attacker's weapon specials play together to define the attack's CTH.
20141129 02:07:27< shadowm> I consider a plain-text 80% more meaningful than a nondescript partially-filled bar.
20141129 02:07:56< shadowm> (I also don't think this information is readily available outside the attack dialog, or I've been playing this game wrong for 9 years.)
20141129 02:08:35< fabi> I see.
20141129 02:08:42< iceiceice> fabi: regarding "non-modal dialogs",
20141129 02:09:03< iceiceice> i think after emailing mordante or perhaps before, it might be quite helpful if we make a wiki page which describes exactly what we are trying to do / what our needs are
20141129 02:09:13< iceiceice> to use as a scratch pad
20141129 02:09:31< iceiceice> i think this is not something that will go quickly and it will take some thought so as not to butcher gui2
20141129 02:09:34< fabi> iceiceice: Maybe we can use some github tools for team working.
20141129 02:09:43< iceiceice> sure
20141129 02:09:51< iceiceice> i'd like it to be open to anyone who has interest or can give advice
20141129 02:10:00< shadowm> iceiceice: I didn't read the page in its entirety, but I'm not exactly unfamiliar with overriding existing tables in Lua.
20141129 02:10:57< iceiceice> okay, all i'm saying is, it is absolutely necessary to replace the default "print" function if you want to have a lua interpreter,
20141129 02:10:58< shadowm> Overriding ubiquitous functions like that... sure, I guess we could also use C preprocessor macros everywhere.
20141129 02:11:15< iceiceice> if you think that "print = new_print" is a hack and is beneath us, i'm all ears to learn an alternate solution
20141129 02:11:18< shadowm> Okay, but why handicap it?
20141129 02:11:51< iceiceice> it's possible, even likely that i made a poor design decision,
20141129 02:12:14< iceiceice> i think the main points for me were (1) usually printing directly to std::cerr in wesnoth is frowned upon as we have log channels for this
20141129 02:13:00< iceiceice> (2) if for some reason you want the print output to go to console, but you have other things you are looking for in the cerr,
20141129 02:13:11< iceiceice> which seems quite common when you are debugging an error or warning, 
20141129 02:13:19< iceiceice> hmm let me start over with (2)
20141129 02:13:31< iceiceice> part of the reason that i made the lua interpreter is that there is no "lua gamestate inspector"
20141129 02:13:45< iceiceice> the lua interpreter lets you effectively have one, but even more powerful
20141129 02:13:52< iceiceice> you can use it just to type the names of variables and see their values
20141129 02:13:57< iceiceice> you can also use it to call functions
20141129 02:14:06< shadowm> Yes, it's the best feature ever, otherwise I wouldn't have asked how much work it'd take to backport it.
20141129 02:14:30< iceiceice> yeah so basically, if i'm using it for inspecting variables, but every time i do that the output ends up in console
20141129 02:14:38< iceiceice> it gets all mixed up wtih the actual error messages, it just seems messier
20141129 02:14:58< iceiceice> If you really want it to go to both places, you can combine the print and old print as i showed, and that won't break anything
20141129 02:15:14< iceiceice> it might be that no one actually cares out (2) and no one cares to configure it
20141129 02:15:18< iceiceice> and then this is really an "options are bad" thing
20141129 02:15:25< iceiceice> its hard for me to know
20141129 02:15:43< iceiceice> actually i hope that many of the "options" that i added may eventually get eliminated
20141129 02:15:55< iceiceice> for instance in the advanced graphics options, most of that is just debugging / diagnostics
20141129 02:16:33< iceiceice> fwiw there is now a log channel "lua/interpreter"
20141129 02:16:49< iceiceice> so that could be a place where the print output could go also, although currently it doesn't go there
20141129 02:16:50< shadowm> I've been meaning to ask, what do the two columns in the advanced graphics options dialog stand for?
20141129 02:17:08< iceiceice> its some distinction made in the code in "image.cpp"
20141129 02:17:16< shadowm> I guess the first is for zoom-scaling? (Which hopefully defaults to NN like in 1.12?) But the second is...?
20141129 02:17:20< fabi> iceiceice: Do you know how one can wrap an editor around interpreters?
20141129 02:17:22< iceiceice> images can get "scaled to hex" or "scaled to zoom"
20141129 02:17:38< iceiceice> i only know what it is from inspecting the code / twiddling things in the dialog
20141129 02:17:47< iceiceice> scaled to hex things are things that are chopped off to a hex
20141129 02:17:54< iceiceice> all terrain things are drawn "scaled to hex"
20141129 02:18:00< iceiceice> units are not, they are "Scaled to zoom"
20141129 02:18:15-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 02:18:18< iceiceice> there's some ambiguity though, all the hexes that are "offmap" are scaled to zoom instead of hex.
20141129 02:18:22< iceiceice> that's probably a minor bug
20141129 02:18:45< shadowm> So what method is used for scaling terrain graphics when zooming?
20141129 02:18:57< iceiceice> you can select it using the dialog
20141129 02:19:06< iceiceice> in 1.12 it is nearest neighbor
20141129 02:19:09< shadowm> No, I mean which of the two categories.
20141129 02:19:13< iceiceice> oh
20141129 02:19:19< iceiceice> i think terrain graphics is generally scaled to hex
20141129 02:19:34< iceiceice> keep in mind also that i have only a poor understanding of terrain graphics
20141129 02:19:52< shadowm> Okay, then if I wanted to have 1.12's behavior I'd have to select NN for both columns?
20141129 02:20:16< iceiceice> i think, in current master, you would select "NN" for hex, and "legacy linear" for zoom
20141129 02:20:53< iceiceice> fabi: what do you mean about the editor
20141129 02:21:09< fabi> editor?
20141129 02:21:12< shadowm> No, it has to be NN for zoom.
20141129 02:21:22< iceiceice> oh you are right
20141129 02:21:28< iceiceice> my patch at the end made both NN i guess
20141129 02:21:33< shadowm> So terrain uses linear.
20141129 02:21:51< shadowm> ... or NN.
20141129 02:22:17< shadowm> Hm, yeah, I don't see any use for this other than confusing people and debugging.
20141129 02:22:26< iceiceice> here's the code reference: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/1.12/src/image.cpp#L748
20141129 02:22:37< iceiceice> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/1.12/src/image.cpp#L731
20141129 02:22:44< shadowm> Only selecting between NN and xBRZ for units  would make more sense for users.
20141129 02:22:55< iceiceice> yes
20141129 02:23:13< iceiceice> without a dialog like this it's actually hard even to make screen shots comparing the options,
20141129 02:23:33< iceiceice> i guess it could be done with :commands but this is easier anyways
20141129 02:24:05< AI0867> gfgtdf: SDL_mixer up to 1.12.11 didn't allow the RWops user to decide whether or not it should free the structure (unlike every other RWops-enabled function)
20141129 02:24:12< iceiceice> the dialog basically only affects implementation details in src/image.cpp, on both branches
20141129 02:24:34-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
20141129 02:24:56< iceiceice> fabi: " iceiceice: Do you know how one can wrap an editor around interpreters?"
20141129 02:25:01< AI0867> gfgtdf: 1.12.12 then inverted the meaning of that function and added a new one that did have the bool flag.
20141129 02:25:02< iceiceice> i don't know what that means exactly
20141129 02:25:10< iceiceice> you want to be able to script the editor functions
20141129 02:25:11< iceiceice> ?
20141129 02:25:33< fabi> iceiceice: I have used the emacs editor around simple command line interpreters before.
20141129 02:25:51< iceiceice> i have actually never used emacs
20141129 02:25:57< iceiceice> i am only vaguely familiar
20141129 02:26:02< fabi> Well, emacs is not the point.
20141129 02:26:11< fabi> Just an example.
20141129 02:26:14-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 02:26:47< AI0867> gfgtdf: so making it both 1.12.11 and 1.12.12 compatible would require runtime analysis of the linked SDL version, and then different behaviour of the code I wrote
20141129 02:26:50< fabi> It is not uncommon in the unix world to write very simple interpreters (regarding the text editing features) and connect their stdin and stdout with a real editor.
20141129 02:27:05< iceiceice> fabi: i see
20141129 02:27:09< iceiceice> i never considered this
20141129 02:27:16< fabi> it would be cool
20141129 02:27:24< iceiceice> yeah it could probably be done,
20141129 02:27:37< iceiceice> it would require a little reworking of the system i set up,
20141129 02:27:53< iceiceice> i tried to use model view controller discipline with the lua interpreter dialog,
20141129 02:28:05< iceiceice> however, some of the info is stored with the lua kernel itself instead
20141129 02:28:14< gfgtdf> AI0867: yes, ty then i remembered correectly.
20141129 02:28:15< iceiceice> for instance there is a persistent command log stored with each lua kernel object
20141129 02:28:28< iceiceice> also, the lua kernel signals syntax errors and such by throwing wesnoth exceptions
20141129 02:29:20< iceiceice> fabi: i think maybe if you are willing to replace the "print" function with a shim, and if there are lua bindings to std::in or something,
20141129 02:29:34< iceiceice> then you could try to use the plugins thing i am writing to use an external interface
20141129 02:30:08< fabi> Sounds quite complicated.
20141129 02:30:20< fabi> I thought something like this would be more straight forward.
20141129 02:30:23< iceiceice> yeah i think it would be nontrivial
20141129 02:30:31< iceiceice> you could write it in C++
20141129 02:30:44< shadowm> Wow, the zoom slider is so very glitchy.
20141129 02:33:23< shadowm> What's the difference between "linear (legacy)" and plain "linear"?
20141129 02:34:06< iceiceice> linear is the one i wrote to replace the old one
20141129 02:34:33< iceiceice> you can judge for yourself the difference,
20141129 02:35:22< iceiceice> so i don't know if you followed this, do you remember that like several months ago there was this "alpha thresholding" line in the linear interpolation thing, with like a 3 paragraph explanation from boucman that it was a hack which made things uglier but worked around a bug in the hex cursor?
20141129 02:35:39< iceiceice> i ended up reverting that change,
20141129 02:35:46< iceiceice> because it turns out it broke something in the editor
20141129 02:35:54< iceiceice> i looked deeper into it,
20141129 02:36:03< iceiceice> basically the problem was that the old linear interpolation does not properly compute alpha values.
20141129 02:36:10-!- tomreyn [~tomreyn@megaglest/team/tomreyn] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 02:36:18< iceiceice> when you do linear interpolation, and you average pixels together, you are supposed to weight them by alpha basically
20141129 02:36:26< iceiceice> if you don't it just looks like crap
20141129 02:36:38< iceiceice> there were a series of hacks in place to try to make it look better
20141129 02:36:49< iceiceice> the alpha thresholding was one of them
20141129 02:36:59< iceiceice> i think my version is more correct and less hacky
20141129 02:37:06< iceiceice> and looks better in the end
20141129 02:37:20< iceiceice> you can be the judge yourself
20141129 02:38:33-!- mattsc [~mattsc@wesnoth/developer/mattsc] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 02:41:47< irker117> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master 98111b028e0b / images/buttons/misc/orb-active.png: Add an active orb icon for the Display -> Colors options page http://git.io/yYsBIw
20141129 02:48:40-!- prkc [~prkc@catv-89-134-173-244.catv.broadband.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20141129 02:49:18< fabi> shadowm: ^ Thank you :-)
20141129 02:59:22-!- iceiceice [~chris@wesnoth/developer/iceiceice] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20141129 03:07:27-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20141129 03:09:17-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 03:09:46-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 03:14:49-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 03:17:03-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20141129 03:18:54-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 03:35:46-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20141129 03:36:02-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@f054141164.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91 [Firefox 33.1/20141106120505]]
20141129 03:46:22-!- Ivanovic_ [~ivanovic@frnk-4d017c25.pool.mediaWays.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 03:47:05-!- Coffee_irc [~david@ppp121-45-26-75.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20141129 03:49:27-!- Ivanovic_ [~ivanovic@frnk-4d017c25.pool.mediaWays.net] has quit [Changing host]
20141129 03:49:27-!- Ivanovic_ [~ivanovic@wesnoth/developer/ivanovic] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 03:49:36-!- Ivanovic [~ivanovic@wesnoth/developer/ivanovic] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20141129 03:50:33-!- Ivanovic_ is now known as Ivanovic
20141129 03:50:48-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 03:59:51< irker117> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth:1.12 99b6c428d879 / changelog: Reorder items in changelog http://git.io/meBiww
20141129 04:35:43-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20141129 04:50:40-!- happygrue [~Laptop@wesnoth/developer/wintermute] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 04:52:21< irker117> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master ee48430f58cf / src/ (image.cpp sdl/utils.cpp sdl/utils.hpp): use fast function pointers for scaling algorithm selection http://git.io/eVsCGA
20141129 04:52:23< irker117> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master 2266042b67aa / images/buttons/misc/orb-active.png: Merge branch 'master' of https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth http://git.io/H7KCRQ
20141129 05:06:17-!- oldlaptop [~quassel@50-108-67-218.adr01.mskg.mi.frontiernet.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20141129 05:11:38-!- oldlaptop [~quassel@50-108-67-218.adr01.mskg.mi.frontiernet.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 05:13:00-!- Coffee_irc [~david@ppp121-45-26-75.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 05:15:13-!- noy [~Noy@S01067cb21b205894.vs.shawcable.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 05:15:28-!- noy [~Noy@S01067cb21b205894.vs.shawcable.net] has quit [Changing host]
20141129 05:15:28-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 05:43:11-!- ancestral [~ancestral@71-34-14-121.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 05:46:27-!- ancestral [~ancestral@71-34-14-121.mpls.qwest.net] has quit [Client Quit]
20141129 06:04:26-!- mattsc [~mattsc@wesnoth/developer/mattsc] has quit [Quit: Computer's napping]
20141129 06:05:28-!- ancestral [~ancestral@71-34-14-121.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:19:35-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:27:22-!- Jetrel_ [~Jetrel@c-73-164-34-22.hsd1.mn.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:27:24-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20141129 06:27:43-!- Samual_ [diotecktec@xonotic/core-team/Samual] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:27:53-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:29:46-!- OnkV [~quassel@85.124.51.57] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:31:38-!- EliDupree_ [~quassel@66-189-34-122.dhcp.oxfr.ma.charter.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:37:21-!- Netsplit *.net <-> *.split quits: Samual, EliDupree, Jetrel, Haudegen
20141129 06:38:11-!- ancestral [~ancestral@71-34-14-121.mpls.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Smell ya later!]
20141129 06:39:41-!- ancestral [~ancestral@71-34-14-121.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:43:02-!- Sulfur [~Miranda@p5B009D9B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:44:46-!- ancestral [~ancestral@71-34-14-121.mpls.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: Smell ya later!]
20141129 06:47:13-!- ancestral [~ancestral@71-34-14-121.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:47:22-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20141129 06:47:46-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 06:57:08-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20141129 06:58:54-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 07:11:46-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 07:17:32-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
20141129 07:17:58-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 07:26:54-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20141129 07:29:08-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 07:45:48-!- ancestral [~ancestral@71-34-14-121.mpls.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: i go nstuf kthxbai]
20141129 07:52:16-!- SZ_Bot [SZ_Bot@27-83-235-80.dyn.estpak.ee] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 07:52:20-!- Ravana_ [SZ_Bot@27-83-235-80.dyn.estpak.ee] has quit [Disconnected by services]
20141129 07:52:23-!- SZ_Bot is now known as Ravana_
20141129 07:52:25-!- irker117 [~irker@fehu.ai0867.net] has quit [Quit: transmission timeout]
20141129 08:00:11< zookeeper> i hope there's not another spamwave beginning, another same type spam thread popped up just now
20141129 08:02:54< vultraz> Isn't there something we can do to stop it
20141129 08:12:22< Ravana_> zookeeper: another user doing that, http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=11&t=41357
20141129 08:12:58< zookeeper> indeed
20141129 08:18:18< Ravana_> he is still doing this
20141129 08:19:09< zookeeper> i know
20141129 08:20:12< vultraz> Where's le banhammah
20141129 08:20:39-!- [Relic] [~relic@99-58-54-211.lightspeed.milwwi.sbcglobal.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20141129 08:45:02-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@host-91-147-211-128.biatv.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 08:59:42-!- Sulfur [~Miranda@p5B009D9B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 09:06:16-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 09:06:40-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 09:11:39-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20141129 09:13:05< zookeeper> shadowm, can't we have new users' first posts require moderator approval? i feel like i must have asked before though so maybe there's a reason.
20141129 09:13:41< zookeeper> i'd think we have enough moderators around that legitimate posts would usually get approved very quickly
20141129 09:33:13-!- yarker [~bismilah@li629-190.members.linode.com] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 09:35:40< vultraz> zookeeper: I feel that would be detrimental to real users
20141129 09:36:55-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20141129 09:37:42-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@host-91-147-211-128.biatv.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
20141129 09:40:57-!- yarker [~bismilah@li629-190.members.linode.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 10:24:24-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@host-91-147-211-128.biatv.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 10:27:36-!- Sulfur [~Miranda@p5B009D9B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 10:39:58-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 10:40:05-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 11:39:43-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@g228161077.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 11:41:07-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20141129 11:41:33-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 11:45:02-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 11:46:03-!- DCW [~Thunderbi@cpc66866-finc15-2-0-cust47.4-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 12:14:11-!- Duthlet [~Duthlet@wesnoth/mp-mod/Duthlet] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 12:22:31-!- DCW [~Thunderbi@cpc66866-finc15-2-0-cust47.4-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20141129 12:23:30-!- DCW [~Thunderbi@cpc66866-finc15-2-0-cust47.4-2.cable.virginm.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 12:24:46-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 12:28:20-!- Coffee_irc [~david@ppp121-45-26-75.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20141129 12:44:17-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20141129 12:45:50-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 12:55:55-!- tomreyn [~tomreyn@megaglest/team/tomreyn] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 13:06:31-!- Anakonda [Anakonda@dsl-tkubrasgw1-54f9ba-178.dhcp.inet.fi] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 13:09:08-!- DCW [~Thunderbi@cpc66866-finc15-2-0-cust47.4-2.cable.virginm.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 13:10:03-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20141129 13:11:48-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 13:43:23-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@host-91-147-211-128.biatv.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20141129 13:44:45-!- Coffee_irc [~david@ppp121-45-26-75.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 13:46:26-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 13:50:54-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 13:52:29-!- EdB [~edb@89-158-11-138.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 13:56:44-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
20141129 13:58:34-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 14:02:08-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 14:07:12-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 14:11:59-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 14:12:53-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 14:17:45-!- thunderstruck [~thunderst@cpc8-sgyl29-2-0-cust37.sgyl.cable.virginm.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 14:23:07-!- mattsc [~mattsc@wesnoth/developer/mattsc] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 14:35:40-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@f054141164.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 14:37:13< gfgtdf> thunderstruck: do you know about the [update_game] and [store_next_scenario]? You wanted to tell me.
20141129 14:38:08-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@host-91-147-211-128.biatv.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 14:38:10< thunderstruck> gfgtdf, sorry no. I was too busy and then forgot about it.
20141129 14:40:06< thunderstruck> gfgtdf, I think we could check if MP campaign's updates are shown correctly in the lobby. If not then we would know why as code doesn't look right.
20141129 14:41:53-!- prkc [~prkc@catv-89-134-173-244.catv.broadband.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 15:02:31-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
20141129 15:04:01< gfgtdf> thunderstruck: [sore_next_scenario] also calles update_game_in_lobby https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/src/server/server.cpp#L2553
20141129 15:04:12-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 15:24:09-!- shadowm_laptop [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 15:24:53-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
20141129 15:29:07-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 15:37:55-!- shadowm_laptop [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
20141129 15:59:22-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 15:59:28-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 16:07:37-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
20141129 16:09:48-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 16:14:51-!- shadowm_laptop [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 16:15:04-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 16:19:18-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 16:21:47-!- shadowm_laptop2 [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 16:24:50-!- shadowm_laptop [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20141129 16:24:59-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
20141129 16:26:56-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 16:33:18-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 16:34:18-!- Coffee_irc [~david@ppp121-45-26-75.lns20.adl2.internode.on.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20141129 16:40:20-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20141129 16:44:44-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 16:46:41-!- shadowm_laptop2 [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20141129 16:47:02-!- shadowm_laptop [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 16:49:46-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20141129 16:51:35-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 17:00:28-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
20141129 17:00:38-!- shikadibot [~shikadi@wesnoth/umc-dev/bot/shikadibot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 17:00:38-!- AI0867 [~ai@wesnoth/developer/ai0867] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 17:00:38-!- shadowm [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 17:01:12-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 17:06:57-!- shadowm_laptop [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20141129 17:09:55-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20141129 17:10:32-!- shadowm [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 17:12:02-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 17:12:39-!- mattsc [~mattsc@wesnoth/developer/mattsc] has quit [Quit: Bye for now]
20141129 17:20:09-!- anonymissimus [~chatzilla@HSI-KBW-078-042-069-130.hsi3.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 17:21:34-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@host-91-147-211-128.biatv.hu] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20141129 17:28:49-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20141129 17:31:38-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 17:40:57-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20141129 17:43:12-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 17:51:23-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20141129 17:52:14< anonymissimus> if i include both boost/range/algorithm.hpp and boost/range/adaptors.hpp in a cpp file  I get compile error already: Fehler	1	error C2039: 'type': Ist kein Element von 'boost::mpl::eval_if_c<C,F1,F2>'	f:\wesnoth-code\sdk\vc9\include\boost\range\iterator.hpp	69
20141129 17:52:46< anonymissimus> I don't suppose there's anything but to take other boost version...
20141129 17:53:55< anonymissimus> all other code is commented...
20141129 17:55:34-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 17:56:43-!- fendrin [~quassel@p20030051AA000558FD43829364E0D85B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 17:56:43-!- fendrin [~quassel@p20030051AA000558FD43829364E0D85B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Changing host]
20141129 17:56:43-!- fendrin [~quassel@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 17:56:54-!- fabi [~quassel@wesnoth/developer/fendrin] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
20141129 17:58:34< anonymissimus> i wish there were something like stable boost versions (and boost dev versions)
20141129 17:58:44-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 18:02:56-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 18:08:36< anonymissimus> I'll be glad on any hint regarding the above, google says nothing and I sure can't fix it, other than trying different boost version; the error message translates to 'type': is not an element of 'boost::: ...
20141129 18:09:20< anonymissimus> perhaps a boost version that's recommendable
20141129 18:09:34-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
20141129 18:10:25-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@host-91-147-211-128.biatv.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 18:11:08-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 18:14:49-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 18:15:23-!- iceiceice [~chris@192.16.204.74] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 18:15:27-!- iceiceice [~chris@192.16.204.74] has quit [Changing host]
20141129 18:15:27-!- iceiceice [~chris@wesnoth/developer/iceiceice] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 18:15:51< iceiceice> anonymissimus: in the past i sometimes had to apply patches from the boost issue tracker to get some old version to work,
20141129 18:16:24< iceiceice> sometimes there will be some obscure problem with some combinations
20141129 18:16:37< iceiceice> especially if you use a more recent compiler than the boost version
20141129 18:17:55-!- Gallaecio [~quassel@84.120.218.119.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 18:19:19< iceiceice> i think your best bet is probably to just use the most recent version of boost if you are having problems. but i have successfully build with mingw using 1.48, 1.54, and 1.57
20141129 18:19:25-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 18:19:41< iceiceice> and 1.48 is the earliest version that has locale, so you shouldn't use an earlier version
20141129 18:20:15< anonymissimus> iceiceice: well yes, being able to compile with mingw doesnt mean much...you see...
20141129 18:20:20< iceiceice> sorry, i used 1.52 not 1.54
20141129 18:20:49< anonymissimus> if you read my commit message in 1.12 for the cb update
20141129 18:21:44< anonymissimus> the problematic file is saved_game.cpp
20141129 18:21:52< anonymissimus> but theres ate least another one
20141129 18:23:12-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 18:23:19< iceiceice> anonymissimus: everyone was able to compile with gcc, clang, mingw, and gfgtdf was developing essentially all of this filesystem code with msvc
20141129 18:23:21< anonymissimus> normally google finds some bug report or something that helps, but this time...
20141129 18:24:15< anonymissimus> i wonder why i had warnings and errors in that code then
20141129 18:24:34< iceiceice> yes i wonder also?
20141129 18:24:42< iceiceice> what compiler version are you using
20141129 18:24:47< anonymissimus> well he probably used a recent version
20141129 18:24:50< anonymissimus> 2008
20141129 18:25:08< iceiceice> anonymissimus: if i remember there was some problem with 2008 anyways
20141129 18:25:44< iceiceice> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/src/unit.hpp#L28
20141129 18:26:14< iceiceice> there is some extremely unfortunate bug which gfgtdf discovered and put code in to cope with,
20141129 18:26:38< iceiceice> if there is a "small struct" like less than 64 bits or something like this,
20141129 18:26:45< iceiceice> and it is forward declared, and returned by value from a function,
20141129 18:26:55< iceiceice> msvc generates invalid code which segfaults, without any warning
20141129 18:27:02< iceiceice> msvc < 2010
20141129 18:27:16< gfgtdf> i used vs2010 and boost 1.51 
20141129 18:27:20< iceiceice> gfgtdf debugged many such instances of this,
20141129 18:27:28< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i think that comment means actually vs <= 2010
20141129 18:27:34< iceiceice> hmm ok
20141129 18:27:35< gfgtdf> iceiceice: since otherwise i wouldnt have dcovered it
20141129 18:27:44< iceiceice> how sure are you that you found all such instances though?
20141129 18:27:59< iceiceice> since you would only find it at runtime
20141129 18:28:04< gfgtdf> iceiceice: im not sure, i just found rthose that amke tehe programm crash for me
20141129 18:28:10< iceiceice> y
20141129 18:28:12< gfgtdf> make the*
20141129 18:28:18< iceiceice> for this reason i think i would normally suggest people to use a more recent msvc
20141129 18:28:57< iceiceice> even if no more bugs like it are specifically reported
20141129 18:29:19< anonymissimus> gfgtdf: so could you compile through wesnoth with boost 1.51 ?
20141129 18:29:38< gfgtdf> anonymissimus: yes with boost 1.51 and msvc 2010
20141129 18:30:01< anonymissimus> ok thanks, I try that (boost) version
20141129 18:30:39< anonymissimus> 2010 is slow and unstable btw, you are better off with a later version then
20141129 18:30:50< anonymissimus> I use 2008 as its fast
20141129 18:33:36< gfgtdf> anonymissimus: yes i want to update it at some time. I have to update my account on the informatic department of the university to do so though.
20141129 18:33:40< anonymissimus> and this thing is a nightmare to install, lasts hours or something...if it succeeds...must be much worse with never versions
20141129 18:33:59< gfgtdf> anonymissimus: which thing ?
20141129 18:34:03< anonymissimus> MSVC
20141129 18:34:21< vultraz> Why would newer versions be worse?
20141129 18:35:41< gfgtdf> anonymissimus: i actually don't care how long installing a compiler takes.
20141129 18:38:29< gfgtdf> anonymissimus: actualy if i remember correctly, the most problematic part was downloading the 2.5GB sized file and not installing it.
20141129 18:39:59-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20141129 18:40:32-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 18:42:59-!- iceiceice [~chris@wesnoth/developer/iceiceice] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20141129 18:46:22-!- Appleman1234 [~Appleman1@s77.BMT-e1.vectant.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20141129 18:48:48-!- Appleman1234 [~Appleman1@s77.BMT-e1.vectant.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 18:50:24< loonycyborg> anonymissimus: I generally use whatever boost that is latest
20141129 19:07:14-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@f054141164.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.91 [Firefox 33.1/20141106120505]]
20141129 19:14:32-!- [Relic] [~relic@99-58-54-211.lightspeed.milwwi.sbcglobal.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 19:19:31-!- iceiceice [~chris@50.245.222.235] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 19:19:31-!- iceiceice [~chris@50.245.222.235] has quit [Changing host]
20141129 19:19:31-!- iceiceice [~chris@wesnoth/developer/iceiceice] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 19:24:30-!- Sulfur [~Miranda@p5B009D9B.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 19:31:06< anonymissimus> vultraz: a newer version of some piece of software does not need to be better
20141129 19:31:10-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@f054141164.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 19:31:24< gfgtdf> Soliton: an opinion on https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/pull/340 ?
20141129 19:31:27-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@f054141164.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Client Quit]
20141129 19:31:45< anonymissimus> applications grow large, people like to add new things instead of rectoring and profiling to make existing code better
20141129 19:32:34< anonymissimus> an example is MSVC 2010 with its slow UI in comparison to 2008, and the compiler also seemed slower to me when I used it
20141129 19:32:35< iceiceice> most microsoft products get "worse" in some holistic sense with each release :)
20141129 19:33:05< iceiceice> for what it's worth it appears that C++11 is slower than C++98
20141129 19:33:15< anonymissimus> lol
20141129 19:33:20< iceiceice> to compile
20141129 19:33:32< anonymissimus> might be...more things to consider...
20141129 19:33:35< iceiceice> i mean its not surprising there are many new featues
20141129 19:33:57< iceiceice> probably it saves us time overall though, and if you have ccache or similar its not an issue
20141129 19:34:02< iceiceice> its only a problem for travis really
20141129 19:34:05< anonymissimus> its not only MS software that gets worse
20141129 19:34:25< iceiceice> thats true, its unfair to single out MS
20141129 19:34:46< anonymissimus> i hate the unity destop for instance, and how huge firefox' memory and kde's got
20141129 19:35:03< iceiceice> i think the classic example though is probably MS word
20141129 19:35:20< iceiceice> how for typical use each successive version looked exactly the same but just consumed much more memory and processor
20141129 19:36:17< iceiceice> maybe wesnoth also got worse
20141129 19:36:43< iceiceice> i'm not sure, i didn't profile it, but my impression is it's a bit slower now, and some others reported this
20141129 19:38:06< Sirp> iceiceice: it really depends what features you use.
20141129 19:38:30< Sirp> sure, more features, slower.
20141129 19:38:32< anonymissimus> wesnoth gets slower slowly yes
20141129 19:39:11< anonymissimus> in the opinion of mp people it always gets only worse it seems
20141129 19:40:32< iceiceice> Sirp: i think specifically its about whether loading the game config is slower
20141129 19:40:51< iceiceice> i don't know if or why the parser would have gotten slower, and i don't think its much larger than it was before
20141129 19:41:06< Sirp> iceiceice: I thought you were talking about compile time?
20141129 19:41:09< iceiceice> so its a mystery to me
20141129 19:41:21< iceiceice> yeah i guess i changed topics
20141129 19:41:31< anonymissimus> about execution, actually
20141129 19:41:36< iceiceice> the compile times are maybe about the same
20141129 19:41:53< anonymissimus> compiling got slower too...sure, more code
20141129 19:42:01< Sirp> 11:33 < iceiceice> for what it's worth it appears that C++11 is slower than  C++98
20141129 19:42:04< Sirp> 11:33 < iceiceice> to compile
20141129 19:42:04< iceiceice> there was a point where we could not run the gcc builds on travis in < 50 minutes, but that was a while ago and after cleaning up headers its better i think
20141129 19:42:06< Sirp> 11:34 < iceiceice> probably it saves us time overall though, and if you have  ccache or similar its not an issue
20141129 19:42:17< iceiceice> Sirp: yeah i changed topics when i started to talk about MS word though
20141129 19:42:18< Sirp> I think I could be forgiven for thinking this was a discussion of compile times. :p
20141129 19:42:21< Sirp> ahhh okay
20141129 19:42:39< iceiceice> i guess it changed here: "<anonymissimus> i hate the unity destop for instance, and how huge firefox' memory and kde's got"
20141129 19:43:53< iceiceice> also a lot of my impression of build times is based on the travis timings, and travis is pretty noisy
20141129 19:44:00-!- Gallaecio [~quassel@84.120.218.119.dyn.user.ono.com] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 19:46:44-!- Gallaecio [~quassel@84.120.218.119.dyn.user.ono.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 19:47:32< Sirp> anyway Wesnoth's config system is unfortunatlely not designed to scale to the size it's at today. It would be nice if we could re-design it as a more scalable system.
20141129 19:53:47< iceiceice> Sirp: it's interesting that you say this, i had an idea a while ago that i think i mentioned to shadowm and vultraz at some points, that maybe we should try to replace the existing WML parser with something made by a parser generator
20141129 19:54:10< iceiceice> the reason is that, the current parser doesn't really catch very many syntax errors
20141129 19:54:21< iceiceice> which i have found frustrating sometimes, and probably some users also
20141129 19:54:44< iceiceice> for instance it's pretty common that users will get confused about how the top level tags should be arranged, or put [event] in the wrong place,
20141129 19:55:16< iceiceice> i often have made the mistake to omit [then][/then] when using the {IF_VAR} macro, since C++ does not require this...
20141129 19:55:33< iceiceice> and when you do things like this, usually the game silently ignores the tag rather than raising a syntax error
20141129 19:56:08< Sirp> iceiceice: yeah. It's very frustrating. For the projects I work on now I have developed a new markup language which is MUCH more comprehensive about detecting syntax errors and I find it much nicer to use.
20141129 19:57:23< iceiceice> do you use ANTLR or one of these tools, or is it another hand-generated parser?
20141129 19:58:03< iceiceice> another possible benefit of a parser generator is that some of them can output in multiple languages, so it would be easier to keep tools like wmllint, wmlindent in sync,
20141129 19:58:05< Sirp> hand-generated. I've dealt with antlr and ... meh it's very 'heavy'. Plus Java-baed.
20141129 19:58:12< iceiceice> i think that right now they all parse WML differnetly
20141129 19:58:32< iceiceice> i see, i never actually used ANTLR, i only learned about it in a class some years ago
20141129 19:58:48< Sirp> well the way I do things is just build all these tools into the core engine.
20141129 19:59:19< iceiceice> yeah that is one way
20141129 19:59:42< Sirp> if I want to make some utility in my engine I just put e.g. COMMAND_LINE_UTILITY(fml_lint) { std::string fname = args().front(); ... }
20141129 19:59:54< Sirp> then just run using ./anura --utility=fml_lint file_tp_check.cfg
20141129 20:00:18< Sirp> so everything is nicely built into the engine and it's super easy to add a new utility because you get full access to all the engine's functions etc.
20141129 20:00:27< iceiceice> if someone wants to write a utility in python though they are sort of out of luck
20141129 20:00:50< iceiceice> i guess its still hard the other way, because then they still have to talk to whatever the parser generator spits out
20141129 20:02:52< iceiceice> one of the other serious obstacles to using a parser-generator is that we ultimately need to get a config, so we'd have to translate out of whatever abstract syntax tree object it gives us
20141129 20:03:11< iceiceice> but if we don't actually want to use "config" to hold the game_config anymore then that's fine i suppose
20141129 20:03:47< Sirp> yeah but cross-language dev is rarely worth it in my experience. Having to import some complicated architecture such as antlr just to support multi language dev .... ugh. 
20141129 20:04:06< iceiceice> yeah i kind of agree with you on that
20141129 20:04:09< Sirp> I'd consider having everything in C++ a feature. 
20141129 20:05:34< Sirp> C++ is a kind of annoying language because you have to source all your libs for things like parsing etc and that's annoying.
20141129 20:05:56< Sirp> but if you have an engine with all the things your utility is going to have to do and all the calls available it's not bad at all.
20141129 20:06:28< Sirp> so if your entire purpose for writing a utility is to parse some config file etc ... and what your engine does is parse these config files anyway so it has all the functionality available ... that makes it very convenient.
20141129 20:10:53< iceiceice> yeah i wonder why all those utilities were written in python anyways 
20141129 20:11:15< iceiceice> it makes it a lot harder to maintain them
20141129 20:11:28< Sirp> is all based on the preferences of the programmers who write them.
20141129 20:11:39< Sirp> a project like Wesnoth attracts lots of people who want to help but abhor C++ for one reason or another
20141129 20:11:44< Sirp> to be fair C++ is a little intimidating.
20141129 20:12:30< iceiceice> yeah it's not without its drawbacks
20141129 20:16:07< iceiceice> it would be nice IMO if we could base the parser and/or preprocessor on some external lib or boost or something, if only to reduce the maintenance work we have to do
20141129 20:16:28< iceiceice> there was a bug recently where it was found that in obscure cases, the preprocessor was mangling textdomains of some strings,
20141129 20:16:58< iceiceice> and there's not very many people who are active and worked on that stuff,
20141129 20:17:14< iceiceice> shadowm ended up figuring it out himself but it sounds like it was pretty difficult
20141129 20:19:04< iceiceice> but maybe its not really worth redoing it
20141129 20:21:39< iceiceice> Sirp: does anura use lua? or only your new markup language
20141129 20:21:41-!- travis-ci [~travis-ci@ec2-54-227-28-219.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 20:21:41< travis-ci> gfgtdf/wesnoth-old#394 (wesnothd_sides - 0e1dd60 : gfgtdf): The build has errored.
20141129 20:21:41< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/gfgtdf/wesnoth-old/builds/42495518
20141129 20:21:41-!- travis-ci [~travis-ci@ec2-54-227-28-219.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20141129 20:31:29-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@f054138110.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 20:41:13-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds]
20141129 20:44:55-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 20:46:32< fendrin> Sirp: Have you already tried 1.12?
20141129 20:53:48< anonymissimus> ...its bugs, ugly graphics, resource hungryness, failed UI design...
20141129 20:54:28< anonymissimus> fendrin: I heven't played much with 1.11, but your UI redo always felt somewhat confusing
20141129 20:54:39< anonymissimus> everything on the right and such
20141129 20:54:59< anonymissimus> the respons you get now (very late ofc) seems to be similar
20141129 20:56:18< anonymissimus> wesnoth graphics are not ugly ofc, they're very good, and the soundtrack is about the best of all games I know
20141129 20:56:48< fendrin> ofc?
20141129 20:58:45-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20141129 20:59:06< anonymissimus> well, the real testing and feedback always happens once a new major version is out
20141129 20:59:26< anonymissimus> ofc=of course, was that the question ?
20141129 20:59:35< fendrin> yes
20141129 21:00:10< anonymissimus> "the 1.10 version was better, becouse more ordered and using greater fonts."
20141129 21:00:38< fendrin> Yeah, that attracted my attention as well.
20141129 21:01:01< fendrin> The thing is: I did not change the font nor its size in any way :-)
20141129 21:01:43< fendrin> Maybe the font looked bigger because the sidebar was smaller.
20141129 21:03:33< anonymissimus> ah yes, when looking at it I recall that I frequently confuse the side number and the level of units when looking at the panel
20141129 21:06:00< gfgtdf> shadowm: diy ou already fix the mp server passowrd issue ?
20141129 21:06:02< gfgtdf> did*
20141129 21:08:19< fendrin> anonymissimus: I am right now testing the "classic" theme for backporting it into the 1.12 branch.
20141129 21:08:54< anonymissimus> fendrin: I am switching between 1.10 and 1.12 atm
20141129 21:09:20< anonymissimus> 1.10 didnt show the level in the unit panel it seems, perhaps you should just leave that away
20141129 21:09:34-!- EdB [~edb@89-158-11-138.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20141129 21:09:44< anonymissimus> the side I mean oO
20141129 21:10:41< fendrin> Is there any user visible hint to the side ownership of a unit?
20141129 21:10:49< anonymissimus> and the other things on the right (defense and level) were on the left, there is just on column in 1.10, btu 2 in 1.12 so to say
20141129 21:10:54< iceiceice> i think its the team color
20141129 21:11:00< iceiceice> but the number is also a good thing imo
20141129 21:11:13-!- SpoOkyMagician [~chatzilla@cpe-74-132-242-221.swo.res.rr.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 21:11:47< anonymissimus> that may be why I think as if I can much quicker grasp the important things when looking at the 1.10 panel as opposed to teh 1.12 panel
20141129 21:15:21< anonymissimus> well, the ellipse color is the ownership hint, normally
20141129 21:15:34-!- EdB [~edb@89-158-11-138.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 21:17:17< fendrin> I have thought about just writting: "Elvish Sharpshooter (3)" instead of "Elvish Sharpshooter" + "lvl 3".
20141129 21:17:18< anonymissimus> in 1.10 there is this additional display for coordinates and defense at the top, it moved to just below the minimap buttons in 1.12
20141129 21:18:06< anonymissimus> that is important in multiplayer allie chat "take x,y" and such, it's easier/quicker to find at the top than where it's now
20141129 21:21:35< anonymissimus> what were the reasons for changing how the UI looks like ?
20141129 21:21:58< anonymissimus> was it a side effect of other code changes, or was it "we try something new" ?
20141129 21:22:15< anonymissimus> the ladder is a bad reason ofc
20141129 21:22:19< fendrin> Yeah, I think the coordinates at top is worth a thought. I always felt they were better placed there.
20141129 21:24:44< anonymissimus> ok, so far so good for constructive criticism (I hope) :)
20141129 21:27:16< fendrin> The game UI changed to match in style to the editor one. The current state is not what LordBob and myself had planed. 
20141129 21:28:13< gfgtdf> iceiceice: do you have an opinion on https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/pull/340?
20141129 21:28:55< fendrin> Moving the coordinates and the terrain string out of the top bar was done because having that arbitary long string in a non constant sized widget is a nightmare.
20141129 21:29:23< fendrin> But it can be moved to the top of the sidebar if that works better for most people.
20141129 21:29:32< iceiceice> gfgtdf: i looked earlier but the second commit is new, let me look again...
20141129 21:30:12< fendrin> Resizing the sidebar was done because more space there is a nice thing and screens got wider than they have been in 2006.
20141129 21:30:33< iceiceice> gfgtdf: i think its good, it makes it much easier to read
20141129 21:30:57< iceiceice> the only thing i noticed is that the typedef is "t_games", i guess because its the type of the games collection?
20141129 21:31:05< iceiceice> but usually we use "tgames" with no underscore
20141129 21:31:14< fendrin> The new minimap size is determined by the ratio a square map gives us.
20141129 21:31:18< iceiceice> but i don't really care, i only noticed it
20141129 21:31:33< fendrin> Displaying a map in size x*x will fill the whole space.
20141129 21:33:39< fendrin> anonymissimus: I can go on give more of the thoughts behind the change in the UI. I guess it is also an attempt to make things look nicer.
20141129 21:36:42< anonymissimus> fendrin: yes, sorry its too late for 1.12 (or maybe not, with theming ?)
20141129 21:37:36< fendrin> anonymissimus: Well, at least the classic theme will be in 1.12.1. Every fix to the new "default" can also make it into that version. 
20141129 21:37:56< fendrin> And there is the option to offer themes over the addon server.
20141129 21:39:28< iceiceice> fendrin: i think maybe the string was better in the top though
20141129 21:39:37< iceiceice> there are some addons that want to put extra information there
20141129 21:39:44< iceiceice> and there is not much space on the sidebar
20141129 21:40:01< iceiceice> it might make space to solve the other issues that have been raised
20141129 21:40:07< iceiceice> about "Lvl" in too small a space and such
20141129 21:40:39< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i see multiple codes where we use 't_'
20141129 21:40:46< iceiceice> gfgtdf: really?
20141129 21:40:56< iceiceice> all of gui2 uses no underscore
20141129 21:41:16< gfgtdf> iceiceice: here for example: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/src/server/room_manager.hpp#L217
20141129 21:41:35< iceiceice> ok i see
20141129 21:41:40< iceiceice> i guess its different in the server code
20141129 21:41:50< gfgtdf> iceiceice: or here: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/src/unit_map.hpp#L108
20141129 21:42:47< iceiceice> maybe its just gui2 that's inconsistent
20141129 21:43:16< iceiceice> in some places its not so clear though
20141129 21:43:23< iceiceice> for instance t_string is not "string type" its "translatable string"
20141129 21:43:28< gfgtdf> you mean consistent?
20141129 21:43:44< iceiceice> no, i mean look in src/gui/dialogs
20141129 21:43:52< gfgtdf> iceiceice: yes also the t_map t_translation means terrain here
20141129 21:44:03< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i think they all use t without underscore
20141129 21:44:13< gfgtdf> in the gui code
20141129 21:44:43< iceiceice> yeah i don't see any examples of t with no underscore except in gui2
20141129 21:45:00< gfgtdf> iceiceice: looks consitent to me :), i guess we cannot expect consiteny in the whole project
20141129 21:45:18< iceiceice> y sounds good
20141129 21:45:54< anonymissimus> fendrin: the classic theme almost looks like 1.10, but the defense at the top should be in brackets ()
20141129 21:46:49< anonymissimus> and surprisingly, I don't know and can't figure out what the number behind the defense means oO
20141129 21:47:17< fendrin> movecost :-)
20141129 21:48:06< anonymissimus> ah yes
20141129 21:48:19< anonymissimus> so it should be (xx%, y)
20141129 21:48:38< fendrin> yes
20141129 21:48:57< fendrin> That is the 1.10.7 format.
20141129 21:49:30< anonymissimus> somebody might be annoyed by the missing brackets
20141129 21:50:46< fendrin> I am just looking, I guess they should fit.
20141129 21:51:08< fendrin> I need to test it on a map > 99x99
20141129 21:51:51< Sirp> iceiceice: anura does have lua support, though so far it's not as widely used as the markup language (FML) and formula language (FFL)
20141129 21:52:23< Sirp> fendrin: I have only briefly tried 1.12 so far.
20141129 21:53:46< fendrin> Sirp: Is it the version your son rated 3 out of 10?
20141129 21:55:07< Sirp> fendrin: aye.
20141129 21:55:14< fendrin> :-)
20141129 21:55:20-!- noy [~Noy@S01067cb21b205894.vs.shawcable.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 21:55:23-!- noy [~Noy@S01067cb21b205894.vs.shawcable.net] has quit [Changing host]
20141129 21:55:23-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 21:57:48< fendrin> iceiceice: Extra information? By creating custom terrains?
20141129 21:58:35< iceiceice> for instance, in the "galactic empires" add-on, maps have two areas, the "space" area and the "planetside" area
20141129 21:58:44< iceiceice> planetside tiles may be worked by workers,
20141129 21:58:58< iceiceice> a lua custom reports generator is used to add info about how productive each tile is
20141129 21:59:04< iceiceice> to that terrain info string
20141129 21:59:25< iceiceice> this is in 1.10
20141129 21:59:32< fendrin> Yeah, and the size you have for that string can be quite small.
20141129 21:59:41< iceiceice> it was more than sufficient in 1.10
20141129 21:59:42< fendrin> depending on the resolution
20141129 21:59:51< iceiceice> sure but that's not really your problem
20141129 22:00:49< iceiceice> i'm just saying, there seemed to be enough space for the string where it was in 1.10
20141129 22:00:54< iceiceice> and now in 1.12 the sidebar is quite crowded
20141129 22:01:29< iceiceice> its only "potentially unbounded" if you consider custom umc content
20141129 22:01:37< fendrin> There was not enough space on the 1024x768 default resolution for normal terrains.
20141129 22:01:38< iceiceice> i don't think you need to do that, they can make a theme to adjust things
20141129 22:01:48< iceiceice> fendrin: really?
20141129 22:02:11< fendrin> yes
20141129 22:02:13< fendrin> really
20141129 22:02:15< fendrin> just try it
20141129 22:02:22< iceiceice> that is really suprising to me, i thought there was more space there than in the sidebar
20141129 22:02:39< fendrin> I am using 1.10.7
20141129 22:03:20< fendrin> "Grassland (..."
20141129 22:03:22< iceiceice> hmmm
20141129 22:03:25< iceiceice> yeah ok
20141129 22:03:36< fendrin> Now we have a minimum size you can count on.
20141129 22:04:20< fendrin> iceiceice: Maybe that text field can be made floating?
20141129 22:04:55< iceiceice> yeah maybe
20141129 22:05:02< iceiceice> or the top bar could be made a little taller
20141129 22:05:36< iceiceice> it would be kind of a drastic change,
20141129 22:05:48< iceiceice> but if we could stack the menu and action buttons in a column, and pair off many of the other indicators,
20141129 22:06:02< iceiceice> then i guess we could also slide the terrain info pair over there as well
20141129 22:06:43< iceiceice> why is the "action" menu even necessary, isn't all of that just duplicated in the context menu?
20141129 22:08:22< fendrin> iceiceice: I think the action menu is meant for touchscreen users.
20141129 22:08:37< iceiceice> how do they access wml menu items?
20141129 22:09:01< fendrin> I don't know.
20141129 22:09:18< fendrin> We did not have them back when this UI was designed.
20141129 22:09:40< iceiceice> hmmmm
20141129 22:09:43< iceiceice> :)
20141129 22:10:13< iceiceice> maybe we can ask alep if its possible and how they do it
20141129 22:10:14< fendrin> Yes, the "Actions" button would be a good candidate to remove.
20141129 22:17:29-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 22:19:12< iceiceice> fabi: if it needs to be, i guess we could put a vertical divding line in the menu button menu, and put some of that stuff beneath it
20141129 22:21:51-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 22:21:59-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
20141129 22:22:38< fendrin> Removing the "Actions" button is worth thinking about.
20141129 22:22:58< fendrin> But not to restore a UI item with arbitrary size.
20141129 22:23:28< fendrin> The concept of a UI element that allows addons which work dependend on the screen resolution is broken by design.
20141129 22:23:49< fendrin> I won't restore a non fixed sized terrain string.
20141129 22:25:41< fendrin> Add-ons counting on a minimum screen resolution need to be redesigned.
20141129 22:26:30< fendrin> If they need a way to show extra information lets give them new tools but dissallow this hack.
20141129 22:26:37< fendrin> iceiceice: ^
20141129 22:26:47< iceiceice> fendrin: i don't think it shoudl be non-fixed size
20141129 22:26:57< iceiceice> i think it should be implicitly fixed to whatever the wesnoth core maximum is
20141129 22:27:11< iceiceice> and add-ons can fend for themselves, you don't need to solve everyone's possible ui problem in every hypothetical universe
20141129 22:27:36< iceiceice> i also don't think every add-on needs to support every screen size
20141129 22:27:43< iceiceice> its up to the maintainer
20141129 22:31:26< Sirp> FWIW for a while, KristaS and I were looking into porting Wesnoth content to work on Anura. KristaS facepalmed and refused to continue once she understood exactly how WML works though. :p
20141129 22:34:14< fendrin> iceiceice: I think I disagree on everything regarding screen size and the universe. My opinion is that every add-on should work on every resolution Wesnoth claims to support.
20141129 22:34:49-!- gfgtdf_ [~chatzilla@f054168145.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 22:34:53< fendrin> iceiceice: And giving UMC designers more tools to display some extra information is a most wanted request.
20141129 22:35:42< iceiceice> Sirp: what exactly was the sticking point? i'm curious now
20141129 22:36:05< iceiceice> fendrin: i mean in a perfect world they would all do this but the fact is they just aren't going to do that
20141129 22:36:18< Sirp> iceiceice: the macro system is just very convoluted and fundamentally difficult to make a better system backwards compatible with.
20141129 22:36:44-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@f054138110.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
20141129 22:36:45-!- gfgtdf_ is now known as gfgtdf
20141129 22:36:56-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@d155109.upc-d.chello.nl] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 22:38:21< iceiceice> yeah i see
20141129 22:40:06< iceiceice> i wonder how close you could get if you took "boost wave" and disabled all the fancy stuff
20141129 22:40:15< iceiceice> and somehow made it respect wesnoth's syntax for inclusions
20141129 22:40:38< iceiceice> it has to handle translatable strings though also...
20141129 22:41:12< iceiceice> but i think maybe you could have a "first pass" that lexes everything and replaces all strings marked _ with tstrings constructed with the correct text domain
20141129 22:59:40< gfgtdf> now not even shikadibot is available
20141129 23:01:29< Sirp> iceiceice: the fundamental problem Wesnoth has is it likes having this "one massive document" which the entire game uses. Because I didn't imagine it would grow this big when designing it.
20141129 23:01:48< anonymissimus> loonycyborg: interesting thins seems to be that I can pass mingw to boostrap.bat and still get msvc libs when passing --toolset=msvc to bjam :)
20141129 23:01:50< Sirp> the system Anura uses is e.g. each level is in a different config file. Each object type, etc. Thus it only loads what is needed.
20141129 23:02:07< loonycyborg> anonymissimus: they're unrelated
20141129 23:02:20< loonycyborg> it doesn't matter with what you've built b2
20141129 23:02:24< loonycyborg> it can use any toolset
20141129 23:02:42< iceiceice> Sirp: i see
20141129 23:02:58< loonycyborg> to bootstrap you pass the toolset to use to build b2 itself
20141129 23:03:06< iceiceice> it certainly isn't "optimal" but for what it's worth its not so slow that it kills the game,
20141129 23:03:17< iceiceice> most people are willing to wait 5-10 seconds for all that stuff to load, i've never known it to take longer
20141129 23:03:39 * anonymissimus knows nothing about b2
20141129 23:04:57< Sirp> iceiceice: yeah it is true that with modern computers it's not so bad.
20141129 23:05:51< anonymissimus> well, passing msvc to bootstrap didn't work so I'm happy it doesnt matter
20141129 23:06:20< iceiceice> it's actually funny to me that you think config is too slow to use for the entire game config, i assumed that it was somewhat designed with "large scale" in mind
20141129 23:06:29< iceiceice> and we use it for small scale also just for convenience
20141129 23:06:35< anonymissimus> bjam however seems so intelligent it detects there's msvc on my system and uses it
20141129 23:06:53< iceiceice> i mean surely it would be faster when running the game if we used structs to represent fixed types like, a particular unit filter or something
20141129 23:10:09< anonymissimus> mordante should run his script it seems, it get messages about CRLF/LF mixing
20141129 23:10:15< anonymissimus> for source files
20141129 23:15:48< anonymissimus> iceiceice: what is the de-facto min boost version now, 1.49 ? (boost.random is the issue IIRC ?)
20141129 23:16:07< iceiceice> it depends on master vs 1.12
20141129 23:16:16< iceiceice> for 1.12, 1.48 is enoguh
20141129 23:16:28< iceiceice> for master i guess it might be 1.49 now
20141129 23:16:50< iceiceice> but i think when i made the boost random patch i intended it to work with 1.44
20141129 23:16:57< iceiceice> using some preprocessor checks
20141129 23:17:06-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20141129 23:17:10< iceiceice> it just won't use the fancier "seed generation", it still will use time(NULL) for taht
20141129 23:17:17-!- Anakonda [Anakonda@dsl-tkubrasgw1-54f9ba-178.dhcp.inet.fi] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20141129 23:20:51-!- stikonas_ is now known as stikonas
20141129 23:21:15< gfgtdf> anonymissimus: i woudn't use the min required boost version, that just means you have to reinstall boost the next time we increase the required boost version. Also later boost version has obviously more featues which comes in handy when you use boost for other things than wesnoth. On the other hand i see no advantage of using an older boost version.
20141129 23:21:37< anonymissimus> I am forced to :<
20141129 23:24:28< iceiceice> you are forced because of msvc 2008?
20141129 23:24:30< gfgtdf> anonymissimus: later boost versions give you an error when compliing boost or when compling wesnoth ?
20141129 23:27:14< anonymissimus> yes
20141129 23:27:31< anonymissimus> i pasted it above today
20141129 23:28:18< anonymissimus> at about 18 GMT (if I'm correct)
20141129 23:30:12< iceiceice> i think you might be the only person still trying to use msvc 2008, i thought it was supposed to be extremely buggy
20141129 23:30:42< iceiceice> i didnt see any other complaints about msvc compilation from anyone else
20141129 23:31:13< anonymissimus> ok no way, 1.49 gives as well
20141129 23:31:55< anonymissimus> well, on average the last years, i am the only one compiling wesnoth with msvc somewhat regularly
20141129 23:32:12< anonymissimus> all others disappear at some spot
20141129 23:32:15< iceiceice> hmm i would have said its gfgtdf
20141129 23:32:57< anonymissimus> gfgtdf is still a freshman :)
20141129 23:33:08< iceiceice> y but he made more than 500 commits in the last year
20141129 23:33:22< iceiceice> i don't think he made those without compiling, his patches are pretty good :)
20141129 23:35:36< iceiceice> maybe i'm reading the github graph wrong now, i'm not sure... anyways i think what i said at least somewhat accurate
20141129 23:36:29< gfgtdf> anonymissimus: using which version you got teh erro you described above ?
20141129 23:36:47< gfgtdf> which boost version i mean
20141129 23:37:24< anonymissimus> 1.49-1.57
20141129 23:37:57< anonymissimus> ok well i could use 2010 for wesnoth but I hate it
20141129 23:38:24-!- iceiceice [~chris@wesnoth/developer/iceiceice] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20141129 23:40:52-!- cib0 [~cib@p5DC74BFE.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
20141129 23:44:01< anonymissimus> or actually, 1.49, 1.51 and 1.57
20141129 23:54:28-!- shadowm_desktop [ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20141129 23:57:28< shadowm> gfgtdf: No, and never intended to.
20141129 23:57:38< gfgtdf> shadowm: ok
--- Log closed Sun Nov 30 00:00:02 2014