--- Log opened Tue Dec 02 00:00:13 2014
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20141202 00:20:56< irker087> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master c7a0c1e4efd0 / src/ (playsingle_controller.cpp playsingle_controller.hpp): push an assertion re: end turn exception further down callstack http://git.io/WxkkDQ
20141202 00:20:57< irker087> wesnoth: Chris Beck wesnoth:master db481fb9849f / src/ (playsingle_controller.cpp playsingle_controller.hpp): playcontroller: fixup a return type to be more specific http://git.io/w0d6Zg
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20141202 02:16:59< iceiceice> gfgtdf: there?
20141202 02:18:38< gfgtdf> iceiceice: y
20141202 02:18:51< iceiceice> so i was thinking about something you said before,
20141202 02:19:02< iceiceice> so you found that scale_surface_sharp is much slower than scale_surface in 1.12?
20141202 02:19:11< iceiceice> when involved with minimap?
20141202 02:19:53< gfgtdf> iceiceice: this call https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/1.12/src/minimap.cpp#L275
20141202 02:20:00< gfgtdf> tahes quite a lot of teh time
20141202 02:20:03< gfgtdf> takes*
20141202 02:20:16< gfgtdf> iceiceice: especialy when you have fog on and move a unit
20141202 02:20:20< gfgtdf> iceiceice: on a large map
20141202 02:20:50< gfgtdf> iceiceice: then the minimap is recalculated after every step of teh move
20141202 02:20:57< iceiceice> that is very wierd to me because i think that should be the downscaling part
20141202 02:21:02< gfgtdf> iceiceice: and the call takesmost of teh time during a unit move
20141202 02:21:03< iceiceice> i think it should be very fast
20141202 02:21:13< gfgtdf> iceiceice: yes it is downscaling
20141202 02:21:17< iceiceice> also it should not be faster with scale_surface
20141202 02:21:29< iceiceice> because that one is doing more work, it is actually computing interpolation
20141202 02:21:49< gfgtdf> iceiceice: it is a bit, but even with scale_surface it takes a miticable ampunt of time
20141202 02:22:05< gfgtdf> noticable*
20141202 02:22:19< iceiceice> gfgtdf: i think that both of these functions were not really designed with downscaling in mind
20141202 02:26:44< iceiceice> right so for both of them, i guess that it is iterating over the entire source image pixel by pixel
20141202 02:26:56< iceiceice> but if you are doing nearest neighbor downscaling that is unnecessary i think
20141202 02:27:16< iceiceice> you just have to look at each pixel of the output, and give it the color of the nearest pixel in the input
20141202 02:27:49< gfgtdf> iceiceice:  that sonds like it could eally speed up things in this case
20141202 02:28:04< gfgtdf> really*
20141202 02:28:53< iceiceice> i'm trying to figure out if we already have a function that does this, if not i guess i can write one
20141202 02:29:24< gfgtdf> iceiceice: would that replace scale_surface or scale_surface_sharp ?
20141202 02:29:33< gfgtdf> iceiceice: for downscaling
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20141202 02:34:02< iceiceice> mmm ok
20141202 02:34:09< iceiceice> scale_surface_sharp is doing something different than i thouht
20141202 02:34:16< vultraz> Does the minimap scaling have something to do with the weird checkerboard patterns that appear on large monoterrain maps and the jagged edges you see on small ones?
20141202 02:34:24< vultraz> minimaps of large []*
20141202 02:35:37< iceiceice> ok, i guess that scale surface sharp is meant for downscaling, and it does a bunch of averaging when it does
20141202 02:36:12< iceiceice> vultraz: i'm not sure exactly what you mean but i think those are different
20141202 02:36:29< vultraz> Let me make some screenshots
20141202 02:38:35< vultraz> iceiceice: https://www.dropbox.com/s/8mz1i32wklbjxl2/smallminimap.PNG?dl=0
20141202 02:38:45< vultraz> https://www.dropbox.com/s/5xpmuhclw7i37y7/largeminimap.PNG?dl=0
20141202 02:39:25< iceiceice> vultraz: i think that is a "moire pattern" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moir%C3%A9_pattern
20141202 02:39:49< iceiceice> maybe not exactly
20141202 02:40:01< iceiceice> i think its just a general form of spatial aliasing; http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Aliasing
20141202 02:41:13< vultraz> Hm
20141202 02:42:06< vultraz> Well, that's not an issue. What I'm really wondering about is small minimaps
20141202 02:42:22< iceiceice> so my guess is that it is occuring because you have a very large and repetitive square pattern, and you are sampling it in a grid pattern
20141202 02:42:43< iceiceice> i don't know what the "normal" methods are to fix it, its some signal processing stuff or something
20141202 02:43:00< iceiceice> if i wanted a hack to fix it, i think i would perturb all the sample points randomly very slightly
20141202 02:43:21< iceiceice> but it would be pretty experimental
20141202 02:43:56< vultraz> It's normally not seen except in map making, so no need to bother
20141202 02:44:07< iceiceice> y i see
20141202 02:45:48< iceiceice> gfgtdf: one of the functions included in the xBRZ library is a nearest neighbor scaler
20141202 02:45:54< vultraz> But about small minimaps, how come it looks like it's being scaled up?
20141202 02:45:55< iceiceice> which i assume is super optimized like the other part
20141202 02:45:55< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i cam make a scenario where you can see how much the move is faster when minimap disabled if you want.
20141202 02:46:18< iceiceice> gfgtdf: i think it might be a good idea to go into master to that line, and use "scale_surface_nn" instead of scale surface sharp
20141202 02:46:30< iceiceice> i made that wrapper to the xbrz function a long time ago
20141202 02:46:48< iceiceice> i had been meaning to evaluate it vs the ones we have
20141202 02:47:04< iceiceice> but now i see that actually its completely different from scale surface sharp, which isn't actually doing nearest neighbor
20141202 02:52:05< iceiceice> hmm i wonder also if this line slows it down: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/1.12/src/minimap.cpp#L278
20141202 02:52:28< iceiceice> right so scale_surface returns by value
20141202 02:52:40< iceiceice> and minimap is a surface type...
20141202 02:53:11< iceiceice> idk if the compiler is smart enough to see that calls to log.cpp cannot change stuff in SDL?
20141202 02:53:27< iceiceice> it should be using return value optimization i think but i don't know if it would
20141202 02:53:33< iceiceice> unless it can see that the logging does not have a side effect
20141202 02:54:26< gfgtdf> iceiceice: is claer that the slowdown only happens on large maps, returning by value , or adding log output shodl be unrelated to the map size, becasue teh minimap size stays teh same
20141202 02:54:46< iceiceice> yeah thats true i guess
20141202 02:54:58< iceiceice> at that time the image is already small anyways
20141202 03:02:33< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i uploaded an addon movement test to rthe addin server
20141202 03:02:36< gfgtdf> the*
20141202 03:02:39< gfgtdf> addon*
20141202 03:03:08< iceiceice> ok thanks, i think i will tinker with it
20141202 03:04:00< gfgtdf> iceiceice: i acualy dont know whether teh addin server for 1.13 and 1.12 is idfferent
20141202 03:04:09< iceiceice> hmm i think that they are
20141202 03:04:09< gfgtdf> iceiceice: in case it is, i used 1.13 version
20141202 03:04:11< iceiceice> ok
20141202 03:04:26< iceiceice> gfgtdf: i made lua bots that can host and join a test game
20141202 03:04:30< iceiceice> https://github.com/cbeck88/wesnoth/commit/28656604d3e51caf5e9af5725407b10071241e90
20141202 03:04:46< iceiceice> it still doesn't work completely
20141202 03:04:55< iceiceice> in that the host cannot configure very much yet
20141202 03:05:12< iceiceice> and they cannot leave the game
20141202 03:05:15< gfgtdf> iceiceice: did you already merged the c++ part ?
20141202 03:05:19< iceiceice> no
20141202 03:06:09< iceiceice> probably i should rebase it and clean it up
20141202 03:06:28< gfgtdf> iceiceice: maybe we shoudl ad a leave gae option ot the ai ?
20141202 03:06:35< gfgtdf> add a leave game*
20141202 03:07:03< iceiceice> we could i guess
20141202 03:07:17< iceiceice> there should be a "Quit" option for the plugin scripts
20141202 03:07:24< iceiceice> but i have not been able to test it yet
20141202 03:07:33< iceiceice> idk if its good if the in-game ai is able to concede,
20141202 03:07:40< iceiceice> usually you don't want it to do that
20141202 03:08:36< gfgtdf> iceiceice: so the plugin can do things during the actual game ?
20141202 03:08:52< iceiceice> there is a "plugin_context" in controller_base right now
20141202 03:09:12< iceiceice> and the controller::play_slice function now calls the plugin_context play slice function
20141202 03:09:24< iceiceice> so if there are plugins they get the opportunity to make callbacks during the game
20141202 03:09:30< iceiceice> but there are no callbacks for them right now except quit
20141202 03:09:42< iceiceice> and they can ask the game what the level result is, and what turn count is
20141202 03:09:59< iceiceice> they don't have access to the same tables that the ai's do
20141202 03:10:06< gfgtdf> iceiceice: well its hard to decide whether you want to quit i you dont know about teh acual game i guess
20141202 03:10:08< iceiceice> i don't even think they can chat right now
20141202 03:10:18< iceiceice> gfgtdf: yeah
20141202 03:10:31< iceiceice> i'm not intending that the plugin should really talk to the ai
20141202 03:10:37< iceiceice> the plugin is like some channel bot
20141202 03:10:52< iceiceice> i guess maybe they can talk just by chats,
20141202 03:11:03< iceiceice> like if the ai chats "i surrender" the plugin could see that and leave the game
20141202 03:11:25< iceiceice> right now the plugins can chat and see chats in the lobby and in the game wait / connect dialogs
20141202 03:11:30< iceiceice> i don't think they can see in-game chats yet
20141202 03:15:11< iceiceice> bbl
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20141202 03:30:15< travis-ci> cbeck88/wesnoth#19 (plugins - fbb3850 : Chris Beck): The build was broken.
20141202 03:30:15< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/cbeck88/wesnoth/builds/42690976
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20141202 04:44:21< travis-ci> cbeck88/wesnoth#20 (plugins - 2865660 : Chris Beck): The build failed.
20141202 04:44:21< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/cbeck88/wesnoth/builds/42697021
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20141202 06:25:30< travis-ci> cbeck88/wesnoth#21 (plugins - d686d52 : Chris Beck): The build was fixed.
20141202 06:25:30< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/cbeck88/wesnoth/builds/42702568
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20141202 15:48:31< fendrin> shikadibot: seen mattsc_?
20141202 15:48:31< shikadibot> fendrin: Person, who 8d 10h ago used nick mattsc_, last spoke 3d 19h ago.  18h 14m ago as mattsc they disappeared.  No more information is available.
20141202 15:49:33< fendrin> "18h 14m ago as mattsc they disappeared." ? ? ?
20141202 15:49:45< fendrin> shikadibot scares me.
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20141202 16:22:01< happygrue> shikadibot: where are the bodies buried?
20141202 16:22:22< happygrue> shikadibot will never tell!
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20141202 16:52:39< iceiceice> open the pod bay doors, Hal!
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20141202 17:07:42< happygrue> o/
20141202 17:07:51< happygrue> and he's gone.  XD
20141202 17:08:22< happygrue> when the move to GitHub was made, was using their bug tracker discussed?
20141202 17:08:33< happygrue> I think it looks quite slick:  https://guides.github.com/features/issues/#overviews
20141202 17:08:55< happygrue> I am somewhere between saddened and enraged that we are still using GNA when such thing exist.
20141202 17:15:58< vultraz> One of the problems is it requires registration and that it doesn't support non-image uploads
20141202 17:16:09< vultraz> I find both to be minor issues, however
20141202 17:18:35< happygrue> I see
20141202 17:18:56< happygrue> I'm writing up a mail, I was just checking to see if there was some reason this was talked about and thrown out before now.
20141202 17:19:49< vultraz> The registration issue may not be an issue on GNA, but GNA's confusing interface is sure to turn away people just as much
20141202 17:20:39< vultraz> And as for non-image uploads, there are many file sharing sites
20141202 17:20:44< happygrue> well, mail sent.  I am guessing the big hurdle is just moving bugs over
20141202 17:20:52< happygrue> but IMO we should just scrap it and get to the lifeboats
20141202 17:21:05< happygrue> move a few important things and start fresh with 1.12 and moving forward
20141202 17:22:13< vultraz> Agrees
20141202 17:22:25< vultraz> Agreed*
20141202 17:23:33< happygrue> It seems like we can finally do that right now, where doing it at 1.11.13 or whatever was not a good option
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20141202 17:38:47< vultraz> Wrote a response
20141202 17:44:33< happygrue> Ah, I see.
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20141202 17:48:43< happygrue> Yes, save files are important.  I'm interested to hear what others have to say.
20141202 17:49:24< vultraz> There will certainly be opposition :P
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20141202 17:56:03< iceiceice> vultraz: you saw the post on the stream thread, right?
20141202 17:56:08< iceiceice> *steam thread
20141202 17:56:13< iceiceice> someone has already posted 1.12 on steam
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20141202 20:22:11< iceiceice> re: bugtracker stuff,
20141202 20:22:48< iceiceice> i had remembered reading some stuff (on wiki @ git migration status? @ gsoc 2012 report?? I don't remember anymore) that crab had successfully used "forgeplucker" to get our bugtracker contents off of gna
20141202 20:23:03< iceiceice> i think i can't find it anymore...
20141202 20:23:09< iceiceice> maybe we should try to replicate this first of all
20141202 20:24:04< iceiceice> *not gsoc 2012, i meant fosdem 2012 i think
20141202 20:26:37< iceiceice> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/Fosdem2014#Bugtracker_.2F_single_login
20141202 20:27:07< iceiceice> so, actually pretty recent
20141202 20:27:58< happygrue> looks like some talk about it in passing here too:  http://wiki.wesnoth.org/Fosdem2012
20141202 20:29:05< happygrue> IMO though, I don't know how much value is gained by importing old bugs into a new system.  I would expect that we have some noise in there and I wonder if there is something to be gained by starting a new system with a clean slate?
20141202 20:29:30< happygrue> obviously some things lost too - we should scan and import things that look obviously important
20141202 20:29:57< iceiceice> theres some old bugs that have very good reports though i think
20141202 20:29:58< happygrue> but I think it might be a useful way to introduce the system to tell everyone "new bug tracker, go make an account NOW and report your favorite bugs"
20141202 20:30:03< iceiceice> also they may have savefiles attached
20141202 20:30:17< iceiceice> its ultimately a lot of work to trawl through and assess what is worth saving
20141202 20:30:34< happygrue> the balance would be how much work is it to import things.  If it's little effort, perhaps because crab did a lot of it already, then there could be value to that.
20141202 20:30:56< iceiceice> yeah maybe we should email him and ask him if he still has the results or a script that produced them
20141202 20:31:22< happygrue> iceiceice: I don't thinkit has to be.  Have everyone scan what catches their eye, and anything that falls through the cracks will get reported again.
20141202 20:31:23< iceiceice> if nothing else he could upload to files.wesnoth.org or something with a timestamp and then we decide where to go from there
20141202 20:31:58< happygrue> for example, I would look through interface bugs and MP related bugs because that's what's interesting to me.  Other people could look through what's interesting to them (which ultimately is what gets worked on anyway)
20141202 20:32:07< happygrue> and that should cover most of the important things... I hope? 
20141202 20:32:12 * happygrue crosses his fingers
20141202 20:32:36< happygrue> but the savefile uploading (or lack thereof) would be a problem
20141202 20:33:13< iceiceice> one thing that's kind of annoying is that if we abandon all the old bug reports, we have a bunch of commits called "bugfix #XXXXX" and then an explanation in the bugtracker maybe
20141202 20:33:52< iceiceice> its not actually that uncommon that i'll look at some line in the code and be like "why is this here?"
20141202 20:33:55< iceiceice> then i run git blame
20141202 20:33:58< iceiceice> and it points me to some commit
20141202 20:34:03< iceiceice> that points me to some ancient bugtracker entry
20141202 20:34:34< iceiceice> maybe that's not a problem, maybe we just leave all the old reports on gna
20141202 20:34:44< iceiceice> and try to close it off to new entries somehow
20141202 20:35:20< iceiceice> if we could actually export everything cleanly onto a shiny new bugtracker on wesnoth.org that would be ideal,
20141202 20:35:27< iceiceice> but i guess we've been saying that for almost a year now
20141202 20:35:33< happygrue> that seems ideal, if we could do that.
20141202 20:35:58< happygrue> the thing is: it will not be as easy to switch as it is now until the next stable release
20141202 20:37:12< iceiceice> yeah
20141202 20:37:21< iceiceice> there's also nothing that says we can't switch again if we get a volunteer later
20141202 20:37:38< iceiceice> it might be a little confusing
20141202 20:40:01< Ravana_> happygrue: you mentioned MP interface, does the bug I reported at https://gna.org/bugs/?22987 happen to other people too?
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20141202 20:43:59< happygrue> Ravana_: I don't have experience with that one one way or the other, sorry.
20141202 20:44:56< happygrue> iceiceice: It could be that important things get reported on a new tracker and it can be "best practice" for some time to be taking any new bugs and also checking them against older GNA bugs to see if there are any hits there
20141202 20:45:14< happygrue> then we don't have to worry as much about transfering everything over
20141202 20:45:33< happygrue> and then the ship will just right itself over time...
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20141202 20:55:15< iceiceice> i think we should see what happens on the list, maybe someone will have time over winter break to try to set up a redmine installation
20141202 20:55:25< iceiceice> it really shouldn't be too much work just to install it
20141202 20:55:45< iceiceice> and we already have the webserver, with a mySQL database for passwords and such
20141202 20:56:21< happygrue> Sure.  By "now" I really mean before we start piling development releases on top of each other - not a particular rush.
20141202 20:56:36< iceiceice> if there's still no volunteer then yeah maybe we should just switch to github
20141202 20:56:53< iceiceice> unless there's some better tracker than github
20141202 20:57:10< iceiceice> but realistically we don't want to introduce yet another credential
20141202 20:58:32< zookeeper> what's wrong with gna? (didn't read everything)
20141202 20:58:56< iceiceice> mark up sucks, can't edit posts,
20141202 20:59:07< iceiceice> it requires a new credential, the users can't figure out how to bypass the security problems,
20141202 20:59:25< iceiceice> the users can't figure out how to answer the *trivia question about git* which they use as a captcha question...
20141202 20:59:58< iceiceice> interface is unintuitive, for instance i have no idea how to delete a report or split one up into different pieces
20141202 21:00:23< zookeeper> right
20141202 21:00:23< iceiceice> also the actual system itself, savane, is no longer supported by any developers
20141202 21:00:37< iceiceice> so presumably it will die a fiery death any moment now
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20141202 21:05:34< happygrue> personally, I have *not reported* bugs that I tried to report while playing a game because dealing with gna was time intensive enough that I either didn't want to mess with it, or started to report it and then aborted the atempt
20141202 21:05:54< happygrue> so that means you have to remember to come back later or have time after the game or whatever
20141202 21:06:15< anonymissimus> if we impose an ultimate feature freeze until all bugs are fixed, we don't need to migrate anything xD
20141202 21:06:24< happygrue> "muwahaha"
20141202 21:06:47< happygrue> digging a shallow grave would be easier...
20141202 21:07:45< iceiceice> what is "ultimate feature freeze"
20141202 21:07:54< iceiceice> "no commits may be made until all bugs are fixed"
20141202 21:07:57< iceiceice> ?
20141202 21:08:03< anonymissimus> well, all branches under freeze
20141202 21:08:04< happygrue> yes
20141202 21:08:07< iceiceice> XD
20141202 21:08:10< anonymissimus> no feature commits
20141202 21:08:11< happygrue> ;)
20141202 21:08:29< anonymissimus> an no commits that are just cloaked as bug fixes
20141202 21:09:39< happygrue> then we hang a big banner that says "Mission Accomplished" and declare victory over development.
20141202 21:10:38< iceiceice> we can also make an official policy out of this user post: http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=39068&p=569471&hilit=british+slang#p569471
20141202 21:10:47< iceiceice> "So, non-british people are considered Spam now ?  :shock:"
20141202 21:12:16< happygrue> yikes.
20141202 21:14:37< iceiceice> maybe we could find a list of like 10 extremely hard trivia questions that only a true brit would know
20141202 21:14:44< iceiceice> and you can only report bugs if you can answer them
20141202 21:14:55< anonymissimus> 303 bugs...I recall times when we had < 200 bugs
20141202 21:15:03< iceiceice> if there are no bug reports then i guess there are no bugs
20141202 21:15:57< Ravana_> it would require time limit then to be really effective
20141202 21:16:03< iceiceice> hehe
20141202 21:16:25< Ravana_> but that would also mean that 10 wouldn't be enough
20141202 21:16:27< anonymissimus> according to physic laws, state debt and bug count do only ever increase
20141202 21:17:13< iceiceice> anonymissimus: i think its inevitable, there are some bugs that just get forgotten, and then even they may be fixed without knowledge of the report
20141202 21:17:30< iceiceice> i discovered that i did this on one occasion for a 6 year old bug or something
20141202 21:17:41< iceiceice> i think bugs like that will just accumulate
20141202 21:17:46< iceiceice> if no one notices
20141202 21:19:48< anonymissimus> sometimes bugs get closed because they can no longer be reproduced too
20141202 21:20:14< anonymissimus> the real problem is that usually devs like to work on features instead of bugs
20141202 21:20:37< anonymissimus> that in combination with all work being voluntary
20141202 21:20:53< anonymissimus> just like politicians depend on votes :P
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20141202 22:06:30< zookeeper> shadowm, would you agree that we should put this in in its current state? http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=14&t=35773
20141202 22:06:37< zookeeper> ...i doubt he's coming back anytime soon, after all
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20141202 22:11:14< zookeeper> he hasn't visited the forums and seen the PM i sent him about it in 2013, so it'd be pointless for me to send another, and i didn't find any other contact info with his realname either
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20141202 22:31:38< iceiceice> happygrue: apparently someone has extended "forgeplucker" with a "redmine loader": https://mail.gna.org/public/forgeplucker-dev/2011-07/msg00003.html
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20141202 22:33:48< irker952> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master 20be879cbbf3 / src/server/ (game.cpp game.hpp): use boost::ptr_vector for wesnothd::game::history_ http://git.io/dIcr6Q
20141202 22:33:48< irker952> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master 0e1dd6004124 / src/server/ (game.hpp server.cpp server.hpp): use boost::ptr_vector for wesnotd::server::games_ http://git.io/4E0RPQ
20141202 22:33:48< irker952> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master 6844e4334a3d / src/server/ (game.cpp game.hpp server.cpp server.hpp): Merge pull request #340 from gfgtdf/wesnothd_sides http://git.io/GgcbEQ
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20141202 22:36:31< gfgtdf> shikadibot: seen Soliton
20141202 22:36:31< shikadibot> gfgtdf: Queried user last spoke 14d 22h ago.  Soliton is currently in this channel.
20141202 22:36:43< gfgtdf> Soliton: online ?
20141202 22:38:09< gfgtdf> Soliton: do yo know wy we send a [create_game] first and then send the level data in a seperate package ?
20141202 22:38:13< gfgtdf> why*
20141202 22:39:36< gfgtdf> iceiceice: do you have an idea why?
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20141202 22:40:05< iceiceice> not off the top of my head
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20141202 23:48:32< travis-ci> cbeck88/wesnoth#22 (plugins - 328cf80 : Chris Beck): The build has errored.
20141202 23:48:32< travis-ci> Build details : http://travis-ci.org/cbeck88/wesnoth/builds/42801096
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--- Log closed Wed Dec 03 00:00:03 2014