--- Log opened Thu Jul 30 00:00:06 2015
--- Day changed Thu Jul 30 2015
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20150730 00:01:42< aquileia> shadowm: Download statistic for the wesnoth windows installer in 2015: http://pastebin.com/x9pCMdCs
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20150730 00:02:34< aquileia> I've gathered the unofficial GPL translations for the corresponding languages (most of the work was reformatting from html pages)
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20150730 00:02:45< UnwiseOwl> Dammit, Australia. Do better.
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20150730 00:03:49< aquileia> UnwiseOwl: Australia would have come in 13th
20150730 00:04:01< aquileia> http://sourceforge.net/projects/wesnoth/files/stats/map?dates=2015-01-01+to+2015-07-29
20150730 00:04:14< UnwiseOwl> So close.
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20150730 00:06:00< UnwiseOwl> Imprssed by that one person in Lesotho...
20150730 00:09:47< Tracerneo> I wonder how the stats for Linux would look with files provided by distro repos.
20150730 00:10:17< aquileia> shadowm, loonycyborg: We  should decide whether we want to provide the translated licence terms in the windows installer.
20150730 00:12:53< loonycyborg> aquileia: I can 
20150730 00:13:03< loonycyborg> do this technically
20150730 00:13:16< loonycyborg> not sure how easy it will be with NSIS
20150730 00:14:46< aquileia> LicenseLangString myLicenseData ${LANG_ENGLISH} "gpl.en.txt"
20150730 00:15:42< aquileia> The worst that could happen is that we can't set a default and have to manually define English for all untranslated languages
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20150730 00:17:11< aquileia> The question is more: What about the legal concerns?
20150730 00:18:17< aquileia> The English licence text still is the official licence, and I included the link to it in each of the translations (some linked to it, some didn't)
20150730 00:18:24< aquileia> So we should be fine, right?
20150730 00:18:52< aquileia> esr: ^
20150730 00:20:19< aquileia> Oh, and for two of the languages I only found GPL 3, but as we are GPL2+ that should be no issue
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20150730 00:25:12< Tracerneo> I would keep it English-only.
20150730 00:25:48< Tracerneo> And not use GPL 3, when the project is not licensed on GPL 3.
20150730 00:25:49< UnwiseOwl> Hrmmm.. My stderr tells me I have two units with the same id, but I can only find one...
20150730 00:26:56< aquileia> Tracerneo: AFAIK GPL 2+ means the packager has the right to provide it under GPL 3
20150730 00:28:31< Tracerneo> But it changes the license to GPL3. I'm not sure if one has right to provide thing back on GPL2+.
20150730 00:31:36< aquileia> Is it really a problem if Czech and French users can't redistribute the windows installer under GPL 2 unless they look at the English licence?
20150730 00:32:08< Tracerneo> Actually… I take that back, it's just license text provided.
20150730 00:32:21< Tracerneo> And I believe it shouldn't hold any legal meaning…
20150730 00:33:00< Tracerneo> As long as original GPL 2+ license in English is provided, it's the one that describes the law rules.
20150730 00:33:31< Tracerneo> So translation is only for convenience.
20150730 00:34:12< shadowm> aquileia: Don't hold your breath waiting for an answer from the big initialism guy.
20150730 00:34:25< Tracerneo> I guess the safest would be to provide translations only for languages that have one (GPL2+), without providing GPL3.
20150730 00:34:35< shadowm> It's also rather pointless to ask him seeing as how he's neither a lawyer nor involved with the FSF.
20150730 00:35:00< aquileia> Wasn't he married to a lawyer?
20150730 00:35:33< shadowm> To my recollection he's never made use of that.
20150730 00:35:38< aquileia> Besides, it can't hurt to ping him
20150730 00:35:43< shadowm> Not for us at least.
20150730 00:36:24< shadowm> So I personally believe that the translations thing is a bit of a waste of time.
20150730 00:37:08< aquileia> Well, the work is basically done
20150730 00:37:17< shadowm> Hardly anyone is interested in reading the full license, no matter whether it's an OSS license or not. The few people who do will either be able to read the English version in its entirety, or can go look for the translated versions themselves.
20150730 00:38:42< shadowm> So if you already did the work, I guess I don't have anything against adding them to the installer.
20150730 00:39:01< shadowm> I assume the translations themselves include wording that highlights the fact that they are unofficial.
20150730 00:39:17< aquileia> They do
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20150730 00:49:35< shadowm> vultraz: Explain to me why 176bda844c7d6fea72cec97a7f3c33ca16d4907b happened.
20150730 00:55:13< aquileia> Would a traditional Chinese reader prefer simplified Chinese or English? I guess I'll leave them with the default...
20150730 00:55:47< shadowm> aquileia: Xara speaks Chinese I believe, you might want to ask him.
20150730 00:56:04< aquileia> Xara: ^
20150730 00:58:05< Xara> I guess English is better. There are some politics involved, so a default Simplified Chinese might irritate some people
20150730 00:58:40< aquileia> ok, thanks
20150730 01:00:20< shadowm> Should we list SDK maintainers like aquileia under the Packagers section of the credits?
20150730 01:00:39< shadowm> vultraz: ^
20150730 01:01:24< shadowm> (Also, don't touch the section unless you want me to take my stashed diff, print it out, fold the print-out into a dagger shape, and stab you repeatedly with it.)
20150730 01:06:39< UnwiseOwl> Tempting...just to see you do that.
20150730 01:11:06< Xara> what's the trouble with traditional Chinese translation?
20150730 01:12:00< shadowm> aquileia: ^
20150730 01:12:44< aquileia> There's a translation here http://www.linux.org.tw/CLDP/OLD/doc/GPL.html  but formatting that (we only use .txt files) is a lot of work
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20150730 01:13:32< shadowm> Why? I can copy it from the browser and paste it into a text editor and get the correct breaks between paragraphs.
20150730 01:14:48< aquileia> The layout could be screwed up and I wouldn't even notice
20150730 01:15:53< shadowm> Well, I guess there is one important thing that's missing compared to the text versions: line wrapping.
20150730 01:16:23< shadowm> No idea if that even matters for using it with NSIS.
20150730 01:17:22< aquileia> I'm pretty sure it doesn't, but I didn't get my test file to run yet
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20150730 01:17:59< irker018> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master cdd03d50cbee / data/core/about.cfg: Restore alphabetical order to the Campaign Design credits section http://git.io/vYxQ6
20150730 01:18:00< irker018> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master fcaa2ab0068b / data/campaigns/ (4 files in 3 dirs): wmlindent pass http://git.io/vYxQi
20150730 01:18:47< aquileia> They discourage using MS Word as an editor due to the file size, so I guess they could in principle even cope with .doc
20150730 01:20:59< aquileia> Xara: I copied that text 1:1 and will add the file to the PR, would be nice if you could tell me whether I broke the formatting
20150730 01:21:22< Xara> aquileia: I think I can do it
20150730 01:21:35< aquileia> that would be great
20150730 01:29:59< shadowm> !file data/campaigns/Northern_Rebirth/scenarios/10a_Stolen_GOLD.CFG
20150730 01:29:59< shikadibot> shadowm: Web interface URL to file data/campaigns/Northern_Rebirth/scenarios/10a_Stolen_GOLD.CFG: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/data/campaigns/Northern_Rebirth/scenarios/10a_Stolen_GOLD.CFG
20150730 01:30:03< shadowm> !file data/campaigns/Northern_Rebirth/scenarios/10a_Stolen_Gold.cfg
20150730 01:30:03< shikadibot> shadowm: Web interface URL to file data/campaigns/Northern_Rebirth/scenarios/10a_Stolen_Gold.cfg: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/data/campaigns/Northern_Rebirth/scenarios/10a_Stolen_Gold.cfg
20150730 01:32:13< shadowm> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/data/campaigns/Northern_Rebirth/scenarios/10a_Stolen_Gold.cfg#L82 <- Ew.
20150730 01:32:31< shadowm> Don't ever do that again, aquileia.
20150730 01:33:02< aquileia> understood
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20150730 01:33:33< shadowm> wmlindent probably didn't ever complain about it because the author didn't know about one-liner tags either.
20150730 01:33:48< shadowm> Or understood tag extenders.
20150730 01:34:11< aquileia> Or saw it as a feature ;)
20150730 01:34:25< shadowm> Knowing him, he'd have slapped you with a trout if he saw this.
20150730 01:35:14< shadowm> Feel free to change it to elseif but I'd rather you didn't because it's a good test case for this PR I'm handling.
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20150730 01:37:12< UnwiseOwl> Whoa...mainline code is so CLEAN.
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20150730 01:44:33< shadowm> vultraz: Don't forget to merge #426.
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20150730 01:59:05< vultraz> shadowm: since we don't need the standalone editor icons there.
20150730 01:59:09< vultraz> shadowm: and yes
20150730 02:01:27< shadowm> vultraz: Yes to the credits question or yes you will merge #426?
20150730 02:01:32< vultraz> Both
20150730 02:01:39< shadowm> vultraz: Do you realize the CMake recipe installs the .desktop file you removed?
20150730 02:01:59< shadowm> If you really want to remove it, update the CMake recipe and add a changelog entry.
20150730 02:02:30< irker018> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 8bd31f52705d / src/addon/ (client.cpp client.hpp manager_ui.cpp): Load addon pbl before beginning upload process http://git.io/vYxhB
20150730 02:02:33< irker018> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master c0e6a4dc7755 / src/addon/manager_ui.cpp: Display an error if trying to upload an addon with an invalid icon http://git.io/vYxhR
20150730 02:02:36< irker018> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 60400f29a23e / src/addon/ (client.cpp client.hpp manager_ui.cpp): Merge pull request #426 from Vultraz/master http://git.io/vYxh0
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20150730 02:09:51< UnwiseOwl> Ok...nearly finished (THIS scenario). Is there a guide somewhere about when and how to use persistent variables? I have one I want to carry and increment throughout a campaign.
20150730 02:10:06< irker018> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 7923a4166352 / CMakeLists.txt: cmake: drop reference to standalone editor icon and .desktop files http://git.io/vYpeV
20150730 02:10:26< autodidact> is the battle for wesnoth title logo supposed to be slowly wiping into view or did i break something
20150730 02:10:30< autodidact> or did i never notice
20150730 02:10:44< vultraz> autodidact: you appear to have fixed a bug 
20150730 02:10:57< UnwiseOwl> It used to do that on mine...
20150730 02:10:59< vultraz> (or the bug never happened for you)
20150730 02:11:05< autodidact> the latter i think
20150730 02:11:11< vultraz> that's been broken for a long time for me at least
20150730 02:11:16< autodidact> alright, just making sure lol
20150730 02:11:17< shadowm> autodidact: It is, if you enable the title screen animation option in Advanced Preferences.
20150730 02:11:45< autodidact> ah indeed
20150730 02:11:55< shadowm> It's in an intermediate state between being disabled and enabled by default, which is a bug no-one has bothered to fix because the animation doesn't add anything to the game's value as a product anyway.
20150730 02:12:30< shadowm> Some people feel strongly about the animation too, which is why it hasn't been entirely removed either.
20150730 02:12:34< vultraz> I set the preference value to No as default not too long ago.
20150730 02:12:46< shadowm> You heartless monster.
20150730 02:13:02< vultraz> #noragrats
20150730 02:13:48< vultraz> regrets* since I actually do not understand that meme
20150730 02:14:42< vultraz> UnwiseOwl: do you want to have a variable exist the entire campaign?
20150730 02:14:57< vultraz> UnwiseOwl: or do you want it to exist outside the campaign
20150730 02:15:13< UnwiseOwl> Only during the campaign.
20150730 02:16:11< UnwiseOwl> I think I do enough damage without effecting things outside the campaign, though that gives me an idea...
20150730 02:16:35< vultraz> Then simple create a variable in S1 and don't clear it once it ends
20150730 02:16:52< UnwiseOwl> Ok, that's what I hoped.
20150730 02:16:55< vultraz> variables that aren't cleared with [clear_variable] hang around
20150730 02:17:09< vultraz> It's good practice to clear the unneeded ones, though
20150730 02:17:35< UnwiseOwl> And it will not effect other campaigns if they don't finish the campaign and reach the clear, for example?
20150730 02:18:04< vultraz> No, since the variables are stored in the savefile.
20150730 02:18:35< UnwiseOwl> Right. Whereas when you set global variables they go...elsewhere.
20150730 02:19:14< vultraz> They get stored in a file in your userdata dir
20150730 02:19:35< UnwiseOwl> Thanks for clearing that up.
20150730 02:21:38< UnwiseOwl> Theoretically someone smarter than me could use that to mark when users have completed the current version of the campaign using some kind of custom campaign image, yes?
20150730 02:22:49< vultraz> Well
20150730 02:23:35< vultraz> When you complete campaign a laurel shows up on the campaign image in the campaign menu  
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20150730 02:25:15< UnwiseOwl> Yah. I just realised the obvious flaw in what I was thinking, anyway.
20150730 02:26:41< UnwiseOwl> Wanted to use it as a kind of user-end version control, 
20150730 02:27:18< UnwiseOwl> But the campaign doesn't know if it's the latest version on nkt without reference to the addons server
20150730 02:27:54< UnwiseOwl> * or not
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20150730 02:40:38< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/73304815
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20150730 03:31:40< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#6902 (master - 60400f2 : Charles Dang): The build has errored.
20150730 03:31:40< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/73304815
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20150730 03:46:56< aquileia> Xara: https://github.com/aquileia/wesnoth/blob/packaging/packaging/windows/gpl-2.zh-cn.txt and https://github.com/aquileia/wesnoth/blob/packaging/packaging/windows/gpl-2.zh-tw.txt
20150730 03:47:54< aquileia> loonycyborg: Could you test my PR again?
20150730 03:50:14< aquileia> all: Is it worth translating the shortcuts ('Manual' 'Wesnoth (with console)' 'Map editor')
20150730 03:50:38< pydsigner> shadowm: I'm still slightly confused as to why you hated that tag doubling
20150730 03:51:10< pydsigner> That'd be a pretty standard construct in languages like C without real elseifs....
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20150730 03:52:13< aquileia> NSIS could actually handle .po files, but I'd just include the translated strings directly (might split them off in a translations.nsf though)
20150730 03:52:36< mattsc> ancestral: hi
20150730 03:52:43< ancestral> Hi there
20150730 03:53:03< mattsc> I’m still around, but I’m on the road again atm, so can’t be here a lot.
20150730 03:53:35< mattsc> I do have my new computer now, so currently I have access to a 10.10, 10.9, 10.6 and 10.5 system.  \o/
20150730 03:53:44< mattsc> Now if only I had time to do something with them ...
20150730 03:54:43< mattsc> In other words, if somebody were to do the work, I’d be happy to do cross-version testing  :P
20150730 03:54:45< aquileia> loonycyborg: Does the uninstaller load the language from the registry key that's created during installation?
20150730 03:54:56< ancestral> mattsc: Excellent!
20150730 03:55:31< aquileia> If we want localized shortcuts, we'd have to delete them with the same language configuration
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20150730 04:01:17< autodidact>  //TODO: complain and remove
20150730 04:01:29< autodidact> im unfamiliar with the process, why not just remove?
20150730 04:01:47< autodidact> https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?23463#postcomment
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20150730 04:19:56< Lokiteitor> Hello
20150730 04:20:01< vultraz> hello
20150730 04:21:59< Lokiteitor> I´m not very good at english, im sorry 
20150730 04:23:18< Lokiteitor> I just read that need help with the project
20150730 04:23:30< Lokiteitor> I can help?
20150730 04:23:49< Lokiteitor> Im programmer in Python
20150730 04:24:11< vultraz> Sure 
20150730 04:24:49< vultraz> Elvish Hunter and tetha are people to talk to about the python
20150730 04:25:06< vultraz> they are not around right now however
20150730 04:25:20< autodidact> got any input on that up there vultraz ^
20150730 04:26:01< vultraz> autodidact: I just left that issue for shadowm to deal with since he said he had plans
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20150730 04:31:14< Lokiteitor> Ok,  at what time i will find?
20150730 04:31:32< Lokiteitor> email?
20150730 04:31:50< vultraz> You can send a message Elvish Hunter on the forums
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20150730 04:32:48< Lokiteitor> Ok, Thanks
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20150730 05:49:01< vincent_c> shadowm: that would be nice, thanks :) I don't have a pseudonym though; I suppose my IRC nick is the next closest thing, so "Vincent Cheng (vincent_c)"?
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20150730 05:49:26< shadowm> vincent_c: Sure.
20150730 05:49:35< shadowm> ancestral: Your packager credits entry, please.
20150730 05:50:16< shadowm> IIRC you want to be listed as just "ancestral", but I wanted to make sure you didn't change your mind since then.
20150730 05:50:32< ancestral> Correct, I still want to be listed as just “ancestral”
20150730 05:50:45< ancestral> Thanks
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20150730 05:58:50< irker178> wesnoth: Jason Francis wesnoth:master 0ce084e8b0ff / src/serialization/preprocessor.cpp: adding location of macro definition to preprocessor argument error message http://git.io/vYpSD
20150730 05:58:50< irker178> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master d7686f4895e0 / src/serialization/preprocessor.cpp: Merge branch 'macro-argument-location' of https://github.com/halfspiral/wesnoth  http://git.io/vYpSy
20150730 05:58:52< irker178> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master b650686888d0 / src/serialization/preprocessor.cpp: preproc: Minor coding style nitpick http://git.io/vYpSS
20150730 05:58:53< irker178> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master a16cc24d8c39 / src/serialization/preprocessor.cpp: Merge branch 'staging/pr-434' (PR #434) http://git.io/vYpS9
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20150730 06:11:28< irker178> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master c4e7b15ebc65 / data/core/about.cfg: Update and reorganize Packagers section in the credits http://git.io/vYpQV
20150730 06:11:31< irker178> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:1.12 cff164ef788d / data/core/about.cfg: Update and reorganize Packagers section in the credits http://git.io/vYpQw
20150730 06:11:34< irker178> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:1.12 20ec8f989380 / data/core/about.cfg: Add myself to administration http://git.io/vYpQr
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20150730 06:17:27< shadowm> Ivanovic: Since you appear to be around, perhaps you could tell me what you think about the Russian translation drama?
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20150730 06:18:11< shadowm> (Unless there's someone else active with admin access to the devs ML.)
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20150730 06:27:47< Ivanovic> clear case of: i won't get involved there!
20150730 06:27:59< Ivanovic> our policy has always been that those who do the work get to decide
20150730 06:28:31< Ivanovic> i see no reason why it should change now
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20150730 06:29:15< shadowm> Ivanovic: Okay, I assume you replied to Xudo with a message to this effect?
20150730 06:29:21< Ivanovic> nope
20150730 06:29:53< shadowm> Well, I won't do it because I'm not the i18n manager and in fact would rather not get involved with anything involving translations! ;)
20150730 06:30:02< Ivanovic> hehehe
20150730 06:30:11< Ivanovic> maybe i'll reply this evening, not sure though
20150730 06:30:35< Ivanovic> my policy is that forum PM is not my preferred method of contact, especially not for dragging me into a flamewar
20150730 06:31:35< vultraz> What's the situation anyway?
20150730 06:32:02< Ivanovic> someone from the russian community complained to shadowm and me that the latest changes by a specific translator suck
20150730 06:32:15< Ivanovic> and that we are supposed to roll them back because of that
20150730 06:32:28< Ivanovic> him, as i understand, neither being the maintainer or even a translator
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20150730 06:36:07< Ivanovic> anyway, i got to head off to work
20150730 06:36:08< Ivanovic> CU
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20150730 06:53:35< irker178> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master e7345dd69a54 / projectfiles/CodeBlocks/ (wesnoth.cbp wesnothd.cbp): Updated codeblocks projectfile to use boost 1.58 libs http://git.io/vYpp7
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20150730 07:13:53< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#6909 (master - c4e7b15 : Ignacio R. Morelle): The build was broken.
20150730 07:13:53< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/73322297
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20150730 08:07:27< shadowm> gfgtdf: Do you know if there's any particular reason Wesnoth 1.12 (no idea about master) doesn't warn about inserting units with duplicate ids into the map? Would it be an expensive check?
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20150730 08:51:55< Elvish_Hunter> Hi all
20150730 08:52:31< irker178> wesnoth: Elvish_Hunter wesnoth:master 2dee033335a2 / data/tools/wmlscope: wmlscope: fixed sorted() and type() being used as variable names http://git.io/vYhg2
20150730 08:52:34< irker178> wesnoth: Elvish_Hunter wesnoth:master d8e69a4c40d8 / data/tools/wmlscope: wmlscope: used print function http://git.io/vYhga
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20150730 09:05:00< shadowm> Elvish_Hunter: Hi.
20150730 09:06:09< shadowm> Elvish_Hunter: Did you see this thread? http://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=10&t=42945
20150730 09:07:27< shadowm> Also, in case you have anything to add to https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/pull/433 , you are more than welcome to post there.
20150730 09:07:42 * shadowm out.
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20150730 09:12:22< Elvish_Hunter> shadowm: hi
20150730 09:12:32< Elvish_Hunter> I'm currently answering to that thread
20150730 09:13:26< Elvish_Hunter> About PR #433, I don't have anything to say ATM
20150730 09:15:08< Elvish_Hunter> And about PR #428, I'd like to test it a bit, but I guess that I'll merge it tomorrow
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20150730 09:43:55< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#6912 (master - d8e69a4 : Elvish_Hunter): The build has errored.
20150730 09:43:55< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/73338844
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20150730 12:14:56< aquileia> Xara: https://github.com/aquileia/wesnoth/blob/packaging/packaging/windows/gpl-2.zh-cn.txt and https://github.com/aquileia/wesnoth/blob/packaging/packaging/windows/gpl-2.zh-tw.txt
20150730 12:17:15< aquileia> You don't need to read them, just check whether I ruined the formatting
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20150730 12:22:25< irker726> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 111e9383194b / data/campaigns/The_South_Guard/maps/ (11 files): TSG: saved maps in new format http://git.io/vYj61
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20150730 12:31:17< gfgtdf> 20150730 08:07:27< shadowm> gfgtdf: Do you know if there's any particular reason Wesnoth 1.12 (no idea about master) doesn't warn about inserting units with duplicate ids into the map? Would it be an expensive check?
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20150730 12:31:52< gfgtdf> shadowm: im quite sure that i didnt change related code specially no tin 1.12
20150730 12:32:32< gfgtdf> shadowm: i thin  that to do thet check you'd have to checkfor every unit  on the map whether the id matches
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20150730 12:33:10< gfgtdf> shadowm: it its not possible to change the idof a unit on the map then maybe we could ache a list of unit is on the map
20150730 12:34:21< gfgtdf> shadowm: i actually think the the current codewithunderlying ods and 'normal' ids is rather compliated and i dont know why we actually have underlying idbut iirc i had somediscussion about it and there was t least one reason.
20150730 12:34:30< gfgtdf> s/ods/ids
20150730 12:37:45< Xara> aquilela: is it ok if I give you the feedback tomorrow? I'm occupied now.
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20150730 12:41:27< aquileia> Xara: Sure
20150730 12:43:03< aquileia> That code isn't going to be committed for a few days, so you have all the time you need
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20150730 12:48:57< aquileia> loonycyborg: Seems we can localize the name displayed by the shortcuts with a desktop.ini file without changing the actual names - that simplifies things (the deinstaller doesn't have to know in which language we installed)
20150730 12:50:06< loonycyborg> cool
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20150730 12:52:20< aquileia> And we already have (or had, until recently) wesnoth.desktop and wesnoth_editor.desktop which contain lists of localized names
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20150730 12:54:32< vultraz> aquileia: we still have wesnoth.desktop
20150730 12:54:50< aquileia> I know
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20150730 12:55:39< aquileia> We (loonycyborg and me) only need them as a reference, not in the repo
20150730 12:56:57< vultraz> ah
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20150730 15:13:14< loonycyborg> aquileia: I tried your PR. encoding of russian license is broken and there were some warnings
20150730 15:15:02< aquileia> What were the warnings?
20150730 15:16:37< loonycyborg> aquileia: http://imgur.com/aqJNqLo
20150730 15:16:40< loonycyborg> sec
20150730 15:18:06< loonycyborg> aquileia: https://gist.github.com/loonycyborg/53cff78f2a85d119ef02
20150730 15:18:07< aquileia> Could you try converting it from UTF8 without BOM to standard UTF8?
20150730 15:18:13< loonycyborg> they;re closer to the end
20150730 15:19:08< loonycyborg> don't know how to do anything with BOM
20150730 15:19:21< loonycyborg> beside using a hex editor :P
20150730 15:20:31< aquileia> I usually convert them in Notepad++
20150730 15:20:45< aquileia> should I edit it and push?
20150730 15:20:56< loonycyborg> hmm yes
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20150730 15:24:54< aquileia> loonycyborg: PR updated
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20150730 15:33:20< aquileia> As to the warnings, I have no idea... I thought I had fixed them, and my test script worked as intended, but now I checked again and it broke for me as well...
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20150730 15:57:17< loonycyborg> aquileia: BOM seems to fix it, at least for russian
20150730 15:57:28< aquileia> ok
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20150730 16:19:24< vultraz> zookeeper: Seeing the comparison, I have to agree with LordBob and say the color tweak definitely makes it look better.
20150730 16:19:56< vultraz> comparison on the water*
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20150730 17:09:58< mattsc> ancestral: Hi.  I’ve tested several of our builds on my new system (Yosemite).
20150730 17:10:54< mattsc> I’ve confirmed the expected behavior.  Your build (1.10) works, mine (1.9) does not with the original pango modules, but does when I copy in those from your builds.
20150730 17:11:28< mattsc> I have also built the pango modules manually (using Macoprts) on this system and it works wih those.
20150730 17:11:50< mattsc> I won’t be able to tell whether those work on my 1.9 computer until I get home one the weekend.  I have no idea what to expect from that ...
20150730 17:13:39< mattsc> ancestral: one thing I have noticed though is that the 1.13 Xcode file has not been updated on github in a while and the build, in fact, fails because the file list is not up to date.
20150730 17:14:06< mattsc> ancestral: I was under the impression that you would do this (keeping the project file up to date).  Let me know if you want me to do it.
20150730 17:14:10< ancestral> I’ve been afraid to update the build file because the pango library issue
20150730 17:14:20< ancestral> If I update it, then it will break for everyone not on Yosemite
20150730 17:14:42< mattsc> ancestral: you could just update the file changes, couldn’t you?
20150730 17:15:02< ancestral> Yes, I guess that would be fine
20150730 17:15:35< mattsc> ancestral: I’m in the process of building and updating it on my side, so let me know if you want me to do it.
20150730 17:16:06< ancestral> If you are building, I have no problem letting you do this, unless it’s more work for you
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20150730 17:16:47< mattsc> Should be easy enough, I’ll know within the hour  (sitting in a meeting, doing this on the side as it is mostly just waiting for the computer to do its thing)
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20150730 17:18:44< mattsc> I also had to turn strict compiling off because there’s a virtual vs. non-virtual warning in synced_context::server_choice  (but I don’t have time to pay attention to that right now)
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20150730 17:21:59< zookeeper> mattsc, err, was the "AI doesn't attack units 1xp from levelup without chance to kill" problem solved at some point semi-recently?
20150730 17:23:13< mattsc> zookeeper: nothing was done about that in mainline.  I wrote a custom AI to deal with the problem and put it out there for people to test, but never got any feedback.
20150730 17:24:01< zookeeper> mattsc, right. i tried to reproduce it in the poster child scenario for that problem (pebbles in the flood, TSG), but couldn't.
20150730 17:24:37< zookeeper> so i was kinda confused, especially when i saw that related custom AI but how it wasn't actually used
20150730 17:24:50< mattsc> meaning: you could not get it to attack, or you could not get it not to attack?
20150730 17:25:37< mattsc> zookeeper: the AI will still attack if it has a non-zero chance of killing the enemy after it levels.
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20150730 17:26:00< mattsc> that’s always been that way, I believe  (at least since I have paid attention to these things)
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20150730 17:26:58< zookeeper> i could not get it to not attack. i made my unit 1xp from levelup, and made sure the enemy didn't have a chance to kill. it attacked anyway.
20150730 17:27:35< mattsc> hmm, could you send me a save of the situation?
20150730 17:28:41< zookeeper> does it need to be master, or is 1.12.2 fine?
20150730 17:29:23< mattsc> wherever you observed it, doesn’t matter to me
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20150730 17:30:42< Ravana_> is it possible to use such ai without requiring download for other players
20150730 17:30:48< zookeeper> hrhm, now it did happen (they refused to attack)
20150730 17:30:59< zookeeper> wait, the AI makes an exception for poison, right?
20150730 17:31:18< zookeeper> maybe it was a ghoul or something that attacked me the previous time
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20150730 17:31:57< mattsc> zookeeper: that’s possible, I don’t remember
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20150730 17:32:14< zookeeper> and now, as soon as some ghouls arrived at the scene, they attacked
20150730 17:32:31< mattsc> Ravana_: in MP?  You only need to have the AI running on the host, AFAIK  (I rarely every play MP games)
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20150730 17:33:11< zookeeper> eh. now i got attacked my an enemy peasant all right, with definitely no chance to kill. so confusing.
20150730 17:33:16< Ravana_> yes, mp. But I have noticed that anything in .lua file requires download for everyone
20150730 17:33:20< zookeeper> i'll still get you that save if you want? :P
20150730 17:34:02< mattsc> zookeeper: was the peasant the only unit to attack, or was the ghoul there to follow up?
20150730 17:34:20< zookeeper> no ghouls in range at that time
20150730 17:34:31< zookeeper> the AI just followed up with a bowman (still no chance to kill) and then something else (no poison)
20150730 17:34:39< mattsc> the AI considers attack combinations of all units that can attack simultaneously (I assume you know that)
20150730 17:35:02< mattsc> zookeeper: yes, unless you know what’s going on, send me the save please
20150730 17:35:09< zookeeper> https://dl.dropboxusercontent.com/u/63964618/wesnoth/TSG-Pebbles_in_the_Flood_Turn_1.gz
20150730 17:35:29< zookeeper> if you stay where you are, the draugs or the upcoming undead recruits won't attack you
20150730 17:35:35< mattsc> Ravana_: hmm, don’t know then
20150730 17:35:49< zookeeper> but if you move a bit north, the loyalists (which i switched to side 2 via debug mode) will attack you
20150730 17:36:21< zookeeper> so if i had to assume what causes that...
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20150730 17:36:29< mattsc> zookeeper: got it, I can’t test it right now though; maybe later today, maybe tomorrow
20150730 17:37:03< zookeeper> i'd say that the AI considers the attack combo with the loyalists, determines that there's a chance to kill (because it ignores the mid-combo levelup), and attacks
20150730 17:37:27< zookeeper> but... why don't the undead attack? they'd have a combined CtK as well
20150730 17:37:56< zookeeper> if you go in range of the loyalists so only 1-2 of them can hit you, they won't attack either
20150730 17:38:34< zookeeper> ...but now they don't attack even if i'm in range of all of them... except the peasant threw his pitchfork :P
20150730 17:38:53< mattsc> zookeeper: the peasant makes sense
20150730 17:39:04< mattsc> because that cannot cause a level-up
20150730 17:39:06< zookeeper> sure
20150730 17:39:35< zookeeper> (except that now it actually melee'd me, causing a CtK for itself, which would have leveled me up)
20150730 17:40:06< mattsc> Hmm.  I’ll check it out later and let you know if I can figure out what’s going on.
20150730 17:40:18< zookeeper> cool
20150730 17:40:45< zookeeper> oh. the first loyalist combo attack i mentioned may have begun with the peasant suiciding himself, and thus freeing the others to attack
20150730 17:41:06< zookeeper> anyway, barring poison, the basic problem seems to remain
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20150730 17:41:59< irker920> wesnoth: mattsc wesnoth:master f168f1d3e254 / projectfiles/Xcode/Wesnoth.xcodeproj/project.pbxproj: Update Xcode project file http://git.io/vOfUZ
20150730 17:42:22< mattsc> ancestral: ^
20150730 17:42:35< zookeeper> so, yeah, i don't think it's actually complicated at all.
20150730 17:42:45< ancestral> mattsc: Great
20150730 17:42:48< ancestral> Thanks!
20150730 17:43:31< mattsc> ancestral: I’ll check my current build on my 10.9 and 10.6 computers on the weekend and, depending on the outcome, might send you something to test as well.
20150730 17:43:53< mattsc> zookeeper: okay - so no need for me to test?
20150730 17:44:20< zookeeper> mattsc, i... guess so
20150730 17:45:30< zookeeper> mattsc, but the micro AI for that is ready to be used/tested, right? i could wire it in and see what happens...
20150730 17:46:18< mattsc> zookeeper: yes, it is; let me look up where it is
20150730 17:46:32< zookeeper> no need
20150730 17:46:47< mattsc> okay  :)
20150730 17:56:52< zookeeper> and i'll do that SometimeSoon(tm)
20150730 17:57:28< vultraz> mattsc: would you know anything about this? https://gna.org/bugs/index.php?23720
20150730 17:58:29< mattsc> vultraz: I saw when you posted that and have made a note to check it out, but have not had time to do so yet  (I’m traveling again this week, and most of next)
20150730 18:00:23< vultraz> ah, ok
20150730 18:01:53< mattsc> vultraz: could it just be that the unit has no CTK; in which case the AI (mosmt of the time) does not attack?
20150730 18:02:20< vultraz> well my test case was the quintain in the tutorial
20150730 18:02:34< vultraz> it always attacks if he has at least 1 max move
20150730 18:02:41< mattsc> okay
20150730 18:02:51< vultraz> in fact, it will move to do so, for some reason
20150730 18:02:57< vultraz> even if it's already adjacent
20150730 18:03:23< vultraz> so if it spawns NE of konrad, it will move N before attacking
20150730 18:03:31< vultraz> but will not attack at all if it has 0/0 moves
20150730 18:03:51< vultraz> so the bug *might* be due to something in the move CA
20150730 18:03:58< vultraz> ie, it wants to move before attacking
20150730 18:04:04< vultraz> and if it can't move, it does nothing
20150730 18:04:17< mattsc> that might just be because of the order in which it considers adjacent hexes
20150730 18:04:17< zookeeper> well, aren't attacks pretty much tied to moves anyway? i could see the whole chain just being skipped if the unit is incapable of moving
20150730 18:04:48< vultraz> yeah, but if the enemy is adjacent they should consider attacking
20150730 18:05:14< mattsc> zookeeper: not necessarily; if a unit loses MP due to an ambush, it will still attack that unit afterward (I think)
20150730 18:05:23< vultraz> so like.. maybe there should be some is_adjacent check before checking for a path to the enemy
20150730 18:05:36< mattsc> but it could be that if max_moves=0, that is treated differently
20150730 18:05:54< vultraz> so that would avoid the quintain moving when it has 1/1 moves but already adjacent as well
20150730 18:06:22< mattsc> vultraz: it’s not that easy
20150730 18:06:41< mattsc> because if another adjacent hex has better terrain, you’d want to attack from there
20150730 18:07:02< mattsc> vultraz: could you do a test?
20150730 18:07:26< mattsc> if the quintain is adjacent and NW of the enemy, will it move also?
20150730 18:09:55< vultraz> mattsc: yes, it will move N
20150730 18:10:11< mattsc> and if it’s N, it will move either NW or NE?
20150730 18:11:20< vultraz> No
20150730 18:11:24< vultraz> it attacks from position
20150730 18:12:20< mattsc> vultraz: one more test, if you don’t mind: could you try the last one (when it’s N) a few times (5 or so) and see if that always happens?
20150730 18:12:33< vultraz> side note: all these tests are on grass, so there's no def difference
20150730 18:12:49< mattsc> vultraz: right, and that’s the “problem”
20150730 18:13:17< mattsc> all of them are considered equal, so the AI chooses one (semi)randomly.  
20150730 18:13:31< mattsc> Probably what that means is that it keeps the one that it considers first
20150730 18:14:02< mattsc> And sometimes that is random, sometimes it is deterministic (in which case it most often is in order NW, SW, N, S, NE, SE)
20150730 18:14:20< mattsc> see, e.g.: https://gna.org/bugs/?func=detailitem&item_id=12978
20150730 18:15:52< mattsc> One can work around that bias by adding a very small random number; or if you’d prefer it not to move everything else being equal, one can add a very small number multiplied by the number of MP to get there.
20150730 18:16:04< mattsc> I do that (both of that) in some of my custom AIs; if I care
20150730 18:16:08< vultraz> several tests of standing immediately S of the quintain and it always attacks from position
20150730 18:16:20< mattsc> okay
20150730 18:16:26< vultraz> if I move to the SW on next turn (so it's NE) it will again move N for its next attack
20150730 18:17:30< mattsc> vultraz: okay, so it is deterministic in some way
20150730 18:18:37< mattsc> vultraz: anyways, I’ll check out the max_moves=0 case sometime later.
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20150730 18:26:02< vultraz> mattsc: one last question before you head off - do you know if icons/wesnoth-icon-Mac.png is used by any of the xcode resources?
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20150730 18:36:08< mattsc> vultraz: don’t know off the top of my head, let me do a grep in the project file directory
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20150730 18:44:57< mattsc> vultraz: I cannot find it being used anywhere
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20150730 18:45:39< mattsc> I thought that maybe it was the icon display in the Finder (file manager) window, but that one is a different icon and it’s in the Xcode project Resources directory
20150730 18:45:50< mattsc> s/display/displayed
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20150730 19:09:32< vultraz> mattsc: ok thanks, I'll remove it then
20150730 19:11:32< irker920> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 8d06d3f70d03 / icons/wesnoth-icon-Mac.png: Removed extra unused icon http://git.io/vOf9J
20150730 19:15:09< irker920> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 300b62e30412 / images/game-icon.png src/game_config.cpp src/game_launcher.cpp: Use icons/icon-game for all hardcoded logo needs http://git.io/vOfHr
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20150730 20:15:50< Nobun> Hi. About wesnoth cooperation I'm asking some things.
20150730 20:16:19< Nobun> I have to say: I am here only to explore IF I can, in a future, help in development somehow
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20150730 20:17:21< Nobun> If I will do, it will happen after november
20150730 20:17:32< Nobun> however here some questions
20150730 20:17:56< Nobun> c++ programming: how develper work?
20150730 20:18:18< Nobun> I am an intermediate c++ programmer (probably with less knowledge than intermediate)
20150730 20:21:19< Nobun> so perhaps if I will try to contribute, perhaps I could do only little things in little part of codes
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20150730 20:25:46< Nobun> so... have you so
20150730 20:25:53< Tracerneo> You can check what things have to be done.
20150730 20:25:59< Nobun> have you got a list of "planning features"
20150730 20:26:04< Nobun> ?
20150730 20:26:05< Tracerneo> There are lists with easy and not-so-easy things.
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20150730 20:26:13< Tracerneo> You can also check bugtracker and fix some bugs.
20150730 20:26:44< Nobun> ok I saw the not-so-easy things and they are probably out of my knowledge
20150730 20:26:58< Tracerneo> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/EasyCoding
20150730 20:27:02< Nobun> thank
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20150730 20:28:44< Nobun> the idea of bugtracker sounds nice
20150730 20:29:02< Nobun> since my knowledge is a bit low for wesnoth 
20150730 20:32:07< Nobun> another question, Tracerneo: if I want to commit my code for evaluation (since I am not a developer), how should I send the code?
20150730 20:32:29< Nobun> (I figure I have to send a .diff file... but where?)
20150730 20:33:16< Tracerneo> Code's on GitHub. You can fork it and send PR>
20150730 20:34:13< Tracerneo> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth
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20150730 20:35:59< Tracerneo> This might be helpful: http://wiki.wesnoth.org/PatchSubmissionGuidelines
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20150730 20:42:46< Nobun> thank a lot, Tracerneo
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20150730 22:13:58< Aginor> Nobun: I've been eyeing up "supporting screenshots in jpeg" as a potentially easy one, assuming it's doable with cairo already
20150730 22:15:26< Nobun> yep, but I don't know cairo (I should study it), so for the moment I will keep an eye on bug tracker
20150730 22:15:55< Nobun> actually my c++ knowledge is not so high... I learned all I know about c++ by myself
20150730 22:16:25< Aginor> I think that's how a lot of people learn
20150730 22:17:41< Aginor> but cairo doesn't look very promising
20150730 22:18:07< Aginor> so you'd probably have to add a dependency to libjpeg or soemthign like that, and the powers that be might not like more dependencies
20150730 22:18:37< Tracerneo> Heh, I don't even know C++ (objective part). Only C.
20150730 22:19:56< Nobun> Tracerneo: C is somewhat harder than c++, imho
20150730 22:20:35< Nobun> becouse you should do the thing "the hard way" (more use of pointers, and other similar things)
20150730 22:22:05< Nobun> however If I will start something I will do it after november, becouse I have some very important things to do... so I fear I will have not time to study what I could be able to code
20150730 22:22:06< Aginor> Nobun: what's the difference between a pointer and a reference? :)
20150730 22:22:24< Nobun> I am not a theoric, I have practical approach
20150730 22:22:55< Nobun> so if you ask definitions, I cannot answer (my work is not related to programming, and all I know about c++ I learned it by myself)
20150730 22:23:04< Nobun> I can answer in a pratical way
20150730 22:23:17< Nobun> pointer example
20150730 22:23:33< Nobun> CLASS * oject = new CLASS 
20150730 22:23:43< Nobun> (assignment pointer)
20150730 22:23:50< Nobun> but it can be NULL
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20150730 22:24:16< Nobun> (however in some compilers NULL could be not recognized and you could be address NULL pointer as pointer = 0)
20150730 22:24:37< Nobun> reference are instead a "copy of a variable that share the same memory point"
20150730 22:24:58< Nobun> I use reference to pass values to a function, for example
20150730 22:25:20< Nobun> (references cannot be NULL and are alright de-referenced)
20150730 22:25:34< Nobun> example
20150730 22:25:55< Nobun> void function (const CLASS  &value)
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20150730 22:26:35< Nobun> I can pass a CLASS value.... in the example if function changes "value" it will change the value also in the source object I passed
20150730 22:26:42< Nobun> this is my answer
20150730 22:27:29< Nobun> usually I use pointer only in some situations, like I did in my program WESPO (an alternate way to create .po file for a wesnoth addon)
20150730 22:27:46< Tracerneo> Eww… How I dislike 'a * b', it looks like multiplication, but indeed you mean pointer.
20150730 22:27:55< Nobun> in that case I coded a "very basic" tree stucture to "parse" WML
20150730 22:28:30< Nobun> well "a * b" could be ambigous
20150730 22:28:55< Tracerneo> I like 'a *b' style more.
20150730 22:29:02< Nobun> but if you write a decent code you should see immediatly if you mean a pointer or a multiplication
20150730 22:29:33< Nobun> you are right, it was a bad habit I have
20150730 22:29:58< Nobun> the strange thing is that I use that stile with reference (value &reference)
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20150730 22:33:34< Nobun> however the feature "supporting screenshots in jpeg" will probably require jpeg, however
20150730 22:33:42< Nobun> libjpeg
20150730 22:34:13< Aginor> as long as you stick with coding style of the project you should be fine
20150730 22:34:18< Nobun> since a lot of library that writes jpeg depends on libjpeg (qt, for example, use internally libjpeg)
20150730 22:34:58< Nobun> at the moment, however, I am not planning to work to that specific feature request
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20150730 22:35:39< Nobun> in this moment I will only take a look to all feature request "easy to code" and bug tracker, and see if I can do something
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20150730 22:38:57< Aginor> fair enough
20150730 22:39:36< Aginor> I started in the same way, then I got bitten by the feature creature and now I'm trying to get the game to compile and run with libsdl 2 again :D
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20150730 22:48:20 * Yaiyan thinks it would be more ideal if wmllint (or its replacement) could just be run in a webbrowser
20150730 22:48:41< Yaiyan> Of course, then there's the slight issue of copying user files onto your server, of course
20150730 22:49:44< Aginor> Yaiyan: web service where the user uploads the file
20150730 22:50:02< Yaiyan> Aginor, I was more thinking, allowing arbitrary files to exist on the server
20150730 22:50:16< Yaiyan> I know very little about the security issues with that
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20150730 22:51:27< Aginor> Yaiyan: I haven't looked at webml at all, but you should be able to provide a lint service online. The linter would have to be secure though, otherwise you'll have a bad time.
20150730 22:51:30< Yaiyan> Otherwise I'd have made such a webservice already
20150730 22:51:50< Yaiyan> Hmm, I haven't even heard of webml which isn't a good sign
20150730 22:52:17< Yaiyan> I was thinking a cgi-bin approach would be more than good enough >_>
20150730 22:52:30< Aginor> sorry, not webml, wml
20150730 22:52:39< Ravana_> for that it would be easier to just have everything happen with js client side
20150730 22:52:40< Yaiyan> Ah
20150730 22:52:42< Aginor> mixing up my terminology
20150730 22:52:52< Nobun> good night all, see you next time
20150730 22:53:01< Yaiyan> Rewrite wmllint in Javascript? Eww
20150730 22:53:18< Aginor> Yaiyan: I'd be worried about cgi-bin :D
20150730 22:53:27< Aginor> it's a python tool, aye?
20150730 22:53:35< Yaiyan> Yup
20150730 22:53:50< Yaiyan> python-cgi module is ridiculously easy to use, heh
20150730 22:54:28< Yaiyan> But beyond directory traversals, I'm not really sure of the implications to something like that
20150730 22:54:32< Aginor> does it touch disk in any other way than opening the file?
20150730 22:54:53< Aginor> how does it do path checking?
20150730 22:55:54< Yaiyan> Eh, python-cgi just runs a python script
20150730 22:56:02< Aginor> yeah
20150730 22:56:10< Aginor> I mean within the lint-tool
20150730 22:56:13< Yaiyan> Ah
20150730 22:56:20< Yaiyan> Yeah, I dunno
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20150730 22:56:31< Aginor> (I haven't looked at it at all, I'm pretty new)
20150730 22:57:05< Yaiyan> From memory it opens all wml files in the project, so if someone loaded a file with the path ../../../some/path, then I'm not sure how nice that'd be
20150730 22:57:11< Yaiyan> Besides, tetha's rewriting it
20150730 22:57:25< Yaiyan> Which reminds me, I need to get around to buying a copy of the dragon book
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20150730 23:05:27< shadowm> Nobun, Aginor: We already depend on libjpeg indirectly.
20150730 23:07:32< Aginor> shadowm: dependencies of your dependencies?
20150730 23:08:09< shadowm> SDL_image needs libjpeg in order to read JPEG images, and we use JPEG images in several places such as story screens.
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20150730 23:09:14< shadowm> Likewise, it uses libpng to read PNG images -- so there's really no good reason we have an optional direct dependency on libpng for PNG screenshots support when libpng has to be factored into the build process one way or another.
20150730 23:12:16< Nobun> shadowm: you are right. However in this moment I am not planning any work in particular, as I said
20150730 23:14:00< shadowm> That was a FYI since you said that "the powers that be" might not like more dependencies.
20150730 23:14:00< Nobun> but you did right pointing that libpng and libjpeg are actually "current de-facto" dependencies... I forgot the fact thay are required and used by SDL_Image
20150730 23:14:13< Aginor> shadowm: why make it an optional dependency if it already has to be present on the system? (and it was me who said that)
20150730 23:14:28< shadowm> That's an excellent question and I'm trying to find the answer.
20150730 23:14:42< Aginor> ok :)
20150730 23:14:58< Nobun> I can answer
20150730 23:15:10< shadowm> I mean why we decided to do this.
20150730 23:15:14< Aginor> I'll detach this IRC window for a while and try to focus on work-work a bit, I'll catch up on this later
20150730 23:15:19< Nobun> I think it is so to reduce the impact of the dependencies on building wesnoth
20150730 23:15:34< Aginor> (sorry, but this is too distracting)
20150730 23:15:38< shadowm> Except it doesn't make sense because we already require libpng and libjpeg as I said before.
20150730 23:16:04< Nobun> if you force a sub-dependencies to be checked by the system you could make wesnoth harder to build and errorr-prone
20150730 23:16:24< Nobun> becouse the new dependency could be have issue to be checked
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20150730 23:16:54< Nobun> (for example... on Cmake you could need to use another .cmake pkg-find)
20150730 23:16:57< shadowm> I'm not following your logic here. Why would this cause issues?
20150730 23:17:14< shadowm> Also, you do realize that we already have to check for libpng at build time in order to enable the optional feature that depends on it?
20150730 23:17:41< Nobun> I try to make an example... but this is only a my idea... I don't know if I am right
20150730 23:18:04< Nobun> assume I do a program that depends on SDL_Image
20150730 23:18:29< Nobun> and I create a CMakeLists.txt with a FIND_PACKAGE(SDL_Image)
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20150730 23:18:57< Nobun> if I try to create the make file with cmake, the system will see if it can find SDL_image
20150730 23:19:13< shadowm> Yes, that's what we do.
20150730 23:19:39< Nobun> but this doesn't mean that it will compile successfully if you actually have SDL_Image
20150730 23:20:13< Nobun> becouse library checking could depend by system
20150730 23:20:34< Nobun> on SDL_Image the problem is solved becouse you can rely on pkg-config
20150730 23:20:40< shadowm> CMake compiles a small test program for every library it checks, and so does SCons.
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20150730 23:21:09< Nobun> yes but the problem is that sometimes the process FAILS before the test
20150730 23:21:18< Nobun> even if you have the dependencies
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20150730 23:21:43< Nobun> this can happen when you try to check some libraries
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20150730 23:21:55< irker882> wesnoth: ElectroRat wesnoth:master bca54561f755 / data/campaigns/The_South_Guard/ (3 files in 2 dirs): South Guard text change http://git.io/vOU4j
20150730 23:21:55< irker882> wesnoth: Lari Nieminen wesnoth:master 5495339a5527 / data/campaigns/The_South_Guard/ (3 files in 2 dirs): Merge pull request #435 from chisquare130/master http://git.io/vOUBe
20150730 23:22:08< Nobun> for example
20150730 23:22:35< Nobun> In my ubuntu I can compile successfully wesnoth using scons, but if I try to compile with cmake I have errors
20150730 23:23:47< Nobun> what I am trying to say... that if a library is a sub-dependency, you are sure it is satisfied if you satisfied the higher-level library that depends of sub-dependency
20150730 23:23:55< Aginor> Nobun: the scons script and cmakelist are not in sync, cmake needs some care
20150730 23:24:35< Nobun> yeah.... I am learning Cmake recently (while I am not able at all to write a Sconscript)
20150730 23:24:43< Nobun> but the point is
20150730 23:25:00< Nobun> if you add more requirements while it is not actually needed
20150730 23:25:36< Nobun> it could be a good idea, but could be make more difficult the build to the end user
20150730 23:25:42< Nobun> the example is
20150730 23:25:46< Aginor> shadowm: may I propose that libjpeg is made a hard dependency and those optional features become non-optional? - If there's already a second-level dependency it might as well become a hard dependency and it'll simplify some build steps and remove some #ifs
20150730 23:26:09< Nobun> if I check that SDL_Image is present, I am almost sure I have libjpeg
20150730 23:26:54< shadowm> Aginor: Any particular issues you see with CMake at the moment?
20150730 23:27:10< shadowm> Aginor: Yes, that's what I want to do with libpng too.
20150730 23:27:10< Nobun> if I add libjepeg checking, I expose the build enviroment to check the library (I am sure I have if I have SDL_Image) with the risk I could create a build FAILURE if, for some reasons, libjpeg is not seen even if installed on system
20150730 23:28:21< shadowm> Nobun: Let me make this simpler. The libpng situation boils down to whether you have the header and dev library files installed or not.
20150730 23:29:04< shadowm> If you don't, you don't get PNG screenshots, but you can still use PNG files (which is essential for Wesnoth's proper functioning) if SDL_image was built to use libpng.
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20150730 23:29:50< shadowm> If you built SDL_image yourself, you will have the libpng dev files want it or not.
20150730 23:30:13< Nobun> hmm understood
20150730 23:30:14< shadowm> If you didn't build SDL_image yourself, well, you now get to install the libpng dev files using whatever method your OS provides for that.
20150730 23:30:54< aquileia> shadowm: Fun fact: That's the reason the MSVC builds depend on libpng14, libpng15 and libpng15 - 14 and 15 via the dependencies and 16 for the screenshots, where I couldn't use the others due to lack of dev files
20150730 23:31:10< shadowm> aquileia: Why did you lack dev files?
20150730 23:31:29< aquileia> I only built libpng16 myself
20150730 23:32:08< Aginor> shadowm: are there any bugs raised for it?
20150730 23:32:11< Nobun> good night all :)
20150730 23:32:18< Aginor> do we raise bugs for these things?
20150730 23:32:45< shadowm> aquileia: :\
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20150730 23:34:37< aquileia> I'd love to update all the dependencies (which would also eradicate the need for libpng14 & 15) but I had some issues and don't have the time - and I think the windows update feature is more important
20150730 23:36:42< aquileia> Besides, it'd probably be better if someone with mingw rebuilt the gtk/gnome group of dependencies with statically linked libc - that way we could update loonycyborgs releases as well
20150730 23:37:21< shadowm> aquileia: I'm not following that. Aren't they already statically linked?
20150730 23:37:32< aquileia> Yes
20150730 23:37:52< shadowm> I used loony's kit and libpango-1.0-0.dll only depends on msvcrt.dll, for instance.
20150730 23:38:03< aquileia> I'm just saying that if I compiled them, they might not be usable by him
20150730 23:38:29< shadowm> Aginor: For what, the libpng thing? No, and it's kind of beyond the scope of a bug report. I was going to yell at the mailing list and see if anyone complains about what I'm about to do.
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20150730 23:40:23< shadowm> But only after checking whether this bizarre decision didn't actually come from me at the time.
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20150730 23:41:27< aquileia> Currently the MSVC dependency package has 2 libjpeg, 2 freetype and 3 libpng versions - far from ideal, but at least it works
20150730 23:42:49< aquileia> Well, have to go again, bye
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20150730 23:49:52< Aginor> shadowm: :D
20150730 23:49:58< Aginor> I should join the list
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--- Log closed Fri Jul 31 00:00:10 2015