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20151111 08:35:30< Necrosporus> I have searched the wiki for "jamming" but I can't find what it actually does
20151111 08:38:50< Necrosporus> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/UnitsWML it is not described in [movetype] section for example
20151111 08:44:22< Necrosporus> By the way why not to provide wesnoth sources in tar.xz ?
20151111 08:44:34< Necrosporus> kernel.org switched to xz long time ago
20151111 08:44:43< Necrosporus> I mean instead of bzip2
20151111 08:44:58< shadowm> Because I tested that for 1.13.0 or 1.13.1 and found it wasn't worth it.
20151111 08:50:49< zookeeper> shadowm, speaking of which, any ideas yet about when 1.13.2 might happen?
20151111 08:51:02< Necrosporus> bunzip takes 1m39.867s real time on my machine
20151111 08:51:38< shadowm> zookeeper: Whenever Aginor's work gets merged in mainline + 2 to 4 weeks after that.
20151111 08:51:53< shadowm> I explained this in the email didn't I?
20151111 08:52:15< zookeeper> well, you know how i usually don't remember anything
20151111 08:52:23< shadowm> Aginor: By the way, someone asked a question in your SDL bug thread.
20151111 08:53:07< shadowm> zookeeper: https://mail.gna.org/public/wesnoth-dev/2015-09/msg00000.html
20151111 08:53:25< Necrosporus> What abot my question? What's [jamming_cost] ?
20151111 08:53:29< shadowm> Last paragraph especially.
20151111 08:53:41< Necrosporus> I have not been able to find out what it does
20151111 08:54:11< zookeeper> roger
20151111 08:55:03< shadowm> Can't help you with that, unfortunately, because the author never documented it in spite of my numerous requests to do so.
20151111 08:55:28< shadowm> IIRC it has something to do with obstructing vision but I'm probably wrong.
20151111 08:57:29< zookeeper> yes, it does
20151111 08:57:56< zookeeper> ought to work exactly as you'd expect
20151111 08:58:06< zookeeper> specifies the range of jamming
20151111 08:58:19< Necrosporus> I think that bzip2 vs xz problem is that wesnoth tarball consists of png files mostly which are poorly compressable 
20151111 08:58:40< Necrosporus> And what's jamming?
20151111 08:59:31< zookeeper> you were just told
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20151111 09:00:37< Necrosporus> zookeeper, I do not understand. vision cost defines how far shroud/fog is cleared
20151111 09:00:49< Necrosporus> movement cost defines how far unit can move
20151111 09:01:13< Necrosporus> Ah, it's meant for terrains?
20151111 09:01:35< Necrosporus> vision points defines how far unit can see independent from movement
20151111 09:01:55< Necrosporus> and jamming cost defines how many vision points a terrain removes?
20151111 09:06:27< zookeeper> jamming obstructs enemy vision. jamming= specifies the range of jamming, [jamming_costs] specifies terrain costs as you'd expect.
20151111 09:08:13< Necrosporus> Interesting... so if [jamming_cost] was like 1 for all terrains and jamming=100 such unit could make enemy blind, seeing only positions of their own units and possibly units they are fighting with?
20151111 09:09:52< Aginor> shadowm: you mean in the SDL issue tracker? - I need to take a bit of time to make the response, which is why I haven't responded yet
20151111 09:10:23< shadowm> Aginor: Yeah, just making sure you had seen it.
20151111 09:10:34< Aginor> shadowm: thanks :)
20151111 09:10:50< Aginor> I do read all of my email, I might just be slow in responding
20151111 09:11:20< Aginor> we should talk sdl2 as well
20151111 09:11:30< Aginor> but maybe not right now, I need to go to bed shortly
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20151111 09:27:18< Necrosporus> shadowm, tar.bz2 is 370 MiB, while tar.xz is 339 MiB, so there's 9% difference
20151111 09:28:11< Necrosporus> Or 51.4% vs 56.1% in compression ration
20151111 09:28:44< Necrosporus> I'm using 0.12.5 release tarball
20151111 09:28:48< Necrosporus> * 1
20151111 09:36:44< Necrosporus> Decompression speed of unxz is 0m45.786s while it is 1m39.867s for tar.bz2
20151111 09:36:59< Necrosporus> So xz not just compressed better, but also let me decompress faster
20151111 09:41:25< Necrosporus> Though xz compression takes 12m13.881s while gzip compression takes only 1m5.108s but results only in 61% compression ration which makes the tarball 32.6 MiB bigger than bzip2 and 63.5 MiB bigger than xz
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20151111 09:43:09< Necrosporus> And gzip decompression is fastest, taking only 0m13.692s
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20151111 09:49:42< Necrosporus> Also bzip2 compression takes 3m21.358s which is 3 times more than gzip and 3 times less than xz, resulting file size is same as in original tarball 387726941 and tar.bz2 made by you and me are byte-identical
20151111 09:51:06< Necrosporus> shadowm, so, I do not know how did you take your test, but mine test show that xz is overall better, since you have to compress release tarball only one time, but every user has to decompress it for themselves
20151111 09:52:06< Necrosporus> I have used the best compression options available
20151111 09:52:18< Necrosporus> -9e for xz, -9 for bzip2 and gzip
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20151111 09:57:01< Necrosporus> untar time is 0m3.320s for me, so it's not significant comparing to decompression time
20151111 10:08:45< Necrosporus> So I'd recommend to switch either to gzip if you find 30 MiB size difference insignificant or to xz if you find it warranting extra compression time
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20151111 18:52:57< celticminstrel> ...desert elves don't have an archer line?
20151111 18:53:32< zookeeper> not a dedicated one, no. the only "archer" is a levelup to the scout
20151111 18:53:52< neverEnough> in desert they dont find wood for bows
20151111 18:53:58< celticminstrel> Huh.
20151111 18:54:08< neverEnough> they are even lucky to find a rock to lauch
20151111 18:54:12< celticminstrel> neverEnough: You don't need wood for bows.
20151111 18:54:12< neverEnough> launch*
20151111 18:54:23< neverEnough> celticminstrel, how do u do bows then?
20151111 18:54:29< celticminstrel> Bone or something.
20151111 18:54:45< celticminstrel> I don't know the exact details, but it can be done.
20151111 18:54:50< neverEnough> ah, then they are going to look like corrupted elves or so
20151111 18:54:57< celticminstrel> Not really.
20151111 18:55:24< neverEnough> well if about real life, in my childhood i was used to make bows. The flexibility is pretty important
20151111 18:55:32< celticminstrel> Yes.
20151111 18:55:48< neverEnough> i don't see a way a bone can REALLY make a bow
20151111 18:55:51< celticminstrel> It's not like they just take a piece of bone and use that, there's a process to it.
20151111 18:55:59< neverEnough> oh
20151111 18:56:06< celticminstrel> I think it's part bone and part other materials, as well.
20151111 18:56:15< celticminstrel> It's probably harder than making a wooden one.
20151111 18:57:00< neverEnough> hm iirc from laboratory some acids make bones doughy
20151111 18:57:28< neverEnough> not anything like "make a flexible item from that", but ok, chemistry always has a solution
20151111 18:57:51< neverEnough> chemical brothers in elvish version
20151111 18:58:00< celticminstrel> I think this is what you call a "laminated" bow, if you want to try looking it up.
20151111 18:58:33< neverEnough> was about doin smthing, but damn u made me curious :)
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20151111 19:01:53< neverEnough> hm sounds interesting
20151111 19:02:13< neverEnough> celticminstrel, you are evil, really
20151111 19:02:36< celticminstrel> Huh? What'd I do?
20151111 19:03:35< neverEnough> i just started this programming period, now i'm about "what if i spend my free time for tryin and learning amateur laminated bowerage?"
20151111 19:04:03< neverEnough> freetime.push_back("laminated bow")
20151111 19:05:32< neverEnough> gotta first fix the bugs i added, and complete the new task still in research mode :P
20151111 19:06:02< iceiceice> from wikipedia:
20151111 19:06:05< iceiceice> "Laminated bows were rare in most of the world before modern waterproof glues became widely available, almost unknown before about 1900CE,"
20151111 19:06:37< neverEnough> this means they do not apply in wesnoth?
20151111 19:06:41< celticminstrel> If the issue is waterproofing, I'd think a desert is one of the most likely places to find one though.
20151111 19:07:07< iceiceice> i mean we can just say they have magic glue :p
20151111 19:07:12< celticminstrel> True.
20151111 19:07:15< neverEnough> those elves must have a waterproof spit!
20151111 19:07:25< celticminstrel> That wouldn't work. :P
20151111 19:07:35< neverEnough> ^^
20151111 19:08:41< neverEnough> i think dwarves race apply for an ingenious variant with 3d printers and cnc machines 
20151111 19:09:16< neverEnough> even if they had to commerce arduino boards from mutated red mages
20151111 19:10:16< celticminstrel> Uh. what. XD
20151111 19:10:20< iceiceice> ahah
20151111 19:11:05< neverEnough> The Ben Heck show was brought u by dwarvish element14, the short-legs electronic community and online store
20151111 19:11:27 * neverEnough is trollin a bit ^^
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20151111 21:09:32< Andrettin> hello
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20151111 23:34:06< neverEnough> it looks like fewer people play wesnoth last week, often i see just a dozen of not-ingame players
20151111 23:35:08< neverEnough> would be cool if status.wesnoth.org listed some stats
20151111 23:36:02< numberdance> hi again devs
20151111 23:36:43< numberdance> where can I be of help with the core?
20151111 23:37:33< neverEnough> hi
20151111 23:37:36< neverEnough> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/Easycoding
20151111 23:37:47< neverEnough> http://wiki.wesnoth.org/NotSoEasyCoding
20151111 23:39:30< numberdance> thx
20151111 23:40:17< neverEnough> np
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--- Log closed Thu Nov 12 00:00:06 2015