--- Log opened Sat Dec 12 00:00:37 2015
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20151212 00:11:05< gfgtdf> zookeeper: its quiet some time ago snce i played UtbS uti think makin kaleh a normal level 3 units woudl be really bad
20151212 00:11:30< gfgtdf> zookeeper: but i think that the wml code with all those variations is quite ugly
20151212 00:12:08< gfgtdf> zookeeper: you could try to replace that variation code and use teh new expluce_amly key instead (iirc celticministrel added it)
20151212 00:16:19< celticminstrel> That's exclude_amla
20151212 00:16:32< celticminstrel> Not sure if it'd be useful for Kaleh's tree, but maybe.
20151212 00:17:04< celticminstrel> I don't see a problem with using variations though.
20151212 00:19:44< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: i think it makes the code quite hard to read
20151212 00:20:11< celticminstrel> I'm not sure if we're actually talking about the same thing here.
20151212 00:20:49< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: i'm talking abouit this file: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/data/campaigns/Under_the_Burning_Suns/units/elves/Kaleh.cfg
20151212 00:21:01< celticminstrel> I know which file you're talking about.
20151212 00:21:19< celticminstrel> But when we say "variations", I wonder if we're really thinking about the same thing.
20151212 00:21:39< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: it makes heavy use ofr[variation]
20151212 00:21:40< vultraz> I simplified that file  recently
20151212 00:21:55< gfgtdf> vultraz: hmm maybe i then onyl know th old version
20151212 00:22:06< vultraz> by using inherit
20151212 00:22:13< Aginor> shadowm: I shall hold off until after the announcement then
20151212 00:22:15< celticminstrel> Using variations enables the advancements to be almost independent unit types, in that they can customize anything that a unit type can customize. They're not limited to what you can do with [effect].
20151212 00:22:25< celticminstrel> Thus, I think using variations is not at all a bad thing.
20151212 00:23:14< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: well are sure really sure you need that?
20151212 00:23:56< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: also a [effect] based implementation maybe need much less  macros
20151212 00:24:10< celticminstrel> I also think that, if you're changing lots of things, a variation would make it easier to read than using [effect]s.
20151212 00:24:26< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: no it doesnt
20151212 00:24:42< celticminstrel> Because everything is concisely in one place.
20151212 00:24:54< gfgtdf> the effects are also in one place
20151212 00:25:02< gfgtdf> also this code mixes effects and variations
20151212 00:25:04< celticminstrel> But they're less concise.
20151212 00:25:13< celticminstrel> Some things have to be implemented with [effect] though.
20151212 00:25:31< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: conciseness doesnt nesesatly make it easier to understand.
20151212 00:25:33< celticminstrel> Mixing effects and variations is probably a good thing here.
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20151212 00:25:59< irker114> wesnoth: Wedge009 wesnoth:master 00703abf7077 / doc/man/wesnoth.6: 'as well' is two words http://git.io/v0YMG
20151212 00:25:59< irker114> wesnoth: Wedge009 wesnoth:master 4579e8bc8f42 / data/campaigns/Northern_Rebirth/scenarios/04_Clearing_the_Mines.cfg: 'shrug of' -> 'shrug off' http://git.io/v0YMZ
20151212 00:25:59< irker114> wesnoth: Wedge009 wesnoth:master 44e18462d23c / data/campaigns/tutorial/scenarios/02_Tutorial_part_2.cfg: 'subtracted for' -> 'subtracted from' http://git.io/v0YMn
20151212 00:26:00< irker114> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 5ba643c80299 / / (3 files in 3 dirs): Merge pull request #560 from Wedge009/Spelling_corrections http://git.io/v0YMc
20151212 00:27:11< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: no main problem is that this code need a lot of macros, and to understand the code oyu have to understand all of tem
20151212 00:27:28< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: no the*
20151212 00:27:55< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: while asimple implemntatiow chi used onyl [effect]s coudl be very trivial to understand.
20151212 00:28:00< gfgtdf> which*
20151212 00:28:17< celticminstrel> The macros are pretty self-explanatory in my opinion - they define all the possible AMLAs for a given variation.
20151212 00:28:28< vultraz> I even reduced the number of macros
20151212 00:28:30< celticminstrel> And using effects, you'd still need a ton of macros.
20151212 00:28:40< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: no why shoud i ?
20151212 00:28:55< celticminstrel> Because there's a lot of duplicate code. That's why macros are used at all here.
20151212 00:29:12< celticminstrel> Switching it to pure [effect] won't change that there's a lot of duplication.
20151212 00:29:29< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: the dubicatio happend becase it needed for each [variation]
20151212 00:29:31< celticminstrel> I don't think there's an [effect]apply_to=level though, is there?
20151212 00:30:46< celticminstrel> The duplication isn't just because of the variations, I'm pretty sure.
20151212 00:31:16< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: well even f there is non you coudl add one
20151212 00:32:37< celticminstrel> It would be nice to see a diagram of Kaleh's advancements.
20151212 00:34:23< celticminstrel> I guess the KALEH_HERO, KALEH_CAPTAIN, KALEH_FIGHTER macros obfuscate things a bit.
20151212 00:36:07< celticminstrel> How does the game determine a unit's initial variation?
20151212 00:36:18< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: well when i look ath the code now its doesnt seem that complicated as i rememberd it but when i firt look at that code it was sure much more harder to understand than all the LotI codes.
20151212 00:36:27< celticminstrel> Logically, what I would expect is for the base to be "no variation".
20151212 00:36:38< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: yes usualyl it is
20151212 00:36:46< celticminstrel> ...I guess with Kaleh though, it could've been explicitly set when he was first placed...
20151212 00:36:56< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: but of course cou can manually specify the variation in the [unit] tag
20151212 00:37:01< celticminstrel> Right.
20151212 00:37:25< celticminstrel> vultraz said he simplified it, I guess his simplifications were good then?
20151212 00:39:15< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: maybe but it coudl also be that things are just always easier when oyou read them a second time.
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20151212 00:50:45< gfgtdf> shadowm: hmm seems liek i still get an error on unicodepaths
20151212 00:51:23< shadowm> An error? What error?
20151212 00:52:45< gfgtdf> if i start with --config-dir ./userdata
20151212 00:52:49< gfgtdf> i get this error:
20151212 00:53:11< gfgtdf> shadowm: http://pastebin.com/hhx2YmsG
20151212 00:53:21< gfgtdf> shadowm: maybe im just doing something wrong idk
20151212 00:54:11< gfgtdf> shadowm: just renamed by wesnotrh dir from 'wesnoth-old' to '(_͡°_͜ʖ_͡°)_Ä_¥_∀⣟ - Kopiewesnoth-old'
20151212 00:54:26< shadowm> Oh dear GODS it's that face.
20151212 00:55:02< shadowm> Something went horribly wrong judging by the message contents. I'll have to try to reproduce myself.
20151212 00:55:53< shadowm> In particular, there's an ellipsis at the start of the path that shouldn't be there, and it looks like two messages got smashed together.
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20151212 00:58:24< shadowm> gfgtdf: Oh, also, does the orphhaned log say anything? It'll be in %TEMP%.
20151212 00:58:26< shadowm> orphaned
20151212 00:58:41< shadowm> Er, you might want to use --log-debug=logsetup to get more info on it.
20151212 01:01:22< shadowm> Oh I see why the messages are mashe together.
20151212 01:01:49< shadowm> Silly me.
20151212 01:08:06< shadowm> Building takes so much longer when going down from -j8 to -j2, hm.
20151212 01:13:33< shadowm> 20151211 22:12:46 debug logsetup: 2 C:\Users\FOO~1\AppData\Local\Temp\/wesnoth-20151211-221246-3196.log -> NUL [side A]
20151212 01:13:36< shadowm> Hmmmmm....
20151212 01:15:34< shadowm> It's using GetTempPathW, but it still receives a legacy path for some reason.
20151212 01:16:37< shadowm> Target path exists, but...
20151212 01:17:22< gfgtdf> shadowm: why do you mean yb legacy path ?
20151212 01:17:35< shadowm> That's a DOS filename.
20151212 01:17:55< gfgtdf> hmm i think im mising something
20151212 01:17:57< shadowm> The long filename is Áêü█Foo.
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20151212 01:19:20< gfgtdf> you mean 'FOO~1' ?
20151212 01:19:38< shadowm> That's the DOS filename.
20151212 01:20:04 * shadowm wonders if MSVC++ can be used to debug non-MSVC++-built binaries.
20151212 01:20:20< gfgtdf> shadowm: well i didnt hace teh unicode characters in te username, tso they are not part of the temp filename
20151212 01:20:30< gfgtdf> have*
20151212 01:20:41< gfgtdf> shadowm: i'd be surised if it can
20151212 01:21:01< shadowm> Yeah, I'm not saying that's a problem or anything. Kudos to Windows for giving me the DOS filename no matter what.
20151212 01:21:27< shadowm> I'm testing the defaults now, which means that the rename() call still fails because the Documents path contains non-ASCII chars too.
20151212 01:22:17< shadowm> Okay, I don't see any options in MSVC++ to debug a binary without a project file, so that's great.
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20151212 01:22:41< shadowm> I'll keep trying out stuff with a blindfold on and see what happens.
20151212 01:23:06< shadowm> Or maybe  don't see any options because I'm a Limited account?
20151212 01:24:07< gfgtdf> shadowm: well you can mostlikley debug assemler levfel if thats what you want.
20151212 01:24:45< shadowm> Oh yes, I switched to my admin account and now I can see the attach to process option. Still no option to start a debugee directly from the IDE, though.
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20151212 01:25:17< gfgtdf> shadowm: im suprised you see the attach to process only as a admin
20151212 01:25:50< shadowm> Well, not the Administrator account, just an account that happens to have admin rights.
20151212 01:26:04< shadowm> I'd be surprised if anything required the Administrator account nowadays.
20151212 01:26:11< gfgtdf> shadowm: still, i never had problems with that with my normal account
20151212 01:26:34< gfgtdf> shadowm: only thing that needed adminstors privileges is the profiler (idk why)
20151212 01:26:40< shadowm> Okay, now I'm running MSVC++ as Administrator because there was no way to debug another user's process otherwise, yay!
20151212 01:27:34< shadowm> And I'm not getting any useful information here because I just remembered it's -O3 with no debug symbols.
20151212 01:27:36< gfgtdf> shadowm: did you said 'another user' before?
20151212 01:27:53< gfgtdf> shadowm: hmm you cna also do o3 with debug smybols
20151212 01:28:07< gfgtdf> shadowm: thats why i  usually do when debuggin wesnoth
20151212 01:28:14< gfgtdf> what
20151212 01:28:22< shadowm> Yes, I have a separate user named Áêü█Foo.
20151212 01:29:11< gfgtdf> shadowm: but i think its clear that a normal user cannot debug processes of another user.
20151212 01:29:47< shadowm> Eh yes but my main account supposedly has admin rights.
20151212 01:30:08< shadowm> I'll never understand what admin rights actually means in Windows, because it certainly doesn't mean what it obviously should mean.
20151212 01:30:47< shadowm> Okay, confirmed it's the rename() call through a more primitive method.
20151212 01:31:02< shadowm> Now I need to guess what its problem is.
20151212 01:32:36< shadowm> Wow MessageBoxA really can't handle UTF-8.
20151212 01:32:48< shadowm> I guess I should've expected that.
20151212 01:33:11< shadowm> Still, it looks fine. What's the catch...
20151212 01:33:26< shadowm> Maybe rename() calls ANSI functions.
20151212 01:33:27< gfgtdf> shadowm: all A cannot handle utf8
20151212 01:33:36< gfgtdf> shadowm: thats the main reason why we use rthe W functions
20151212 01:33:39< celticminstrel> Yeah, A means it's ASCII-only after all.
20151212 01:33:48< celticminstrel> And W is UTF-16.
20151212 01:34:12< celticminstrel> I think.
20151212 01:34:28< shadowm> It's a decent simplification, the actual answer is a little more complicated.
20151212 01:34:50< shadowm> The ANSI functions don't work in ASCII, they work in the system's ANSI codepage.
20151212 01:35:22< shadowm> It's not UTF-8, it's not multibyte of any other sort, but it's not 7 bits ASCII either.
20151212 01:35:35< celticminstrel> Well, okay, yeah.
20151212 01:35:40< shadowm> It's 7 bits ASCII plus 7 bits of something else. Or not even that in some cases IIRC.
20151212 01:35:53< celticminstrel> It's only 1 bit of something else. :P
20151212 01:36:06< shadowm> Well, the union is 8 bits.
20151212 01:36:18< shadowm> But if you split the codepages you get two 7 bits halves.
20151212 01:36:47< shadowm> For example CP 850's first half is ASCII, the second half is the Western Europe-specific stuff.
20151212 01:37:40< shadowm> Okay, so I need to trace function calls and I can't use MSVC++.
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20151212 01:38:10< shadowm> gfgtdf: Or if you know how to do it, use the MSVC++ debugger to figure out where the rename() call leads to.
20151212 01:38:43< gfgtdf> step into?
20151212 01:38:53< gfgtdf> shadowm: with without code running?
20151212 01:39:25< shadowm> I don't know?
20151212 01:39:37< irker114> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master 856bbc35b972 / RELEASE_NOTES: Update Known Bugs section in the release notes to match the actual posts http://git.io/v0Ypq
20151212 01:39:41< irker114> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master 044a6a999dcf / src/log_windows.cpp: log/windows: Fix message formatting in log_init_panic() http://git.io/v0Ypm
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20151212 01:41:13< gfgtdf> shadowm: can you just set a breakpoint at the rename() call and then step into the function?
20151212 01:41:45< gfgtdf> shadowm: i actualyl wonder whcih rename function you are talking about
20151212 01:41:50< celticminstrel> The only way I know to set a breakpoint in MSVC is clicking in the gutter in the code editor...
20151212 01:41:51< gfgtdf> shadowm: is it part o wesnoth src
20151212 01:42:05< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: i never missed nother option
20151212 01:42:13< celticminstrel> rename() sounds like a system call to me, although... is it part of the C library?
20151212 01:42:23< celticminstrel> It almost sounds like a POSIX call.
20151212 01:42:52< gfgtdf> shadowm: ait you are using a c(++) api for io?
20151212 01:42:56< celticminstrel> So maybe it is a Wesnoth function after all...
20151212 01:42:58< gfgtdf> a standart aip that is
20151212 01:43:01< gfgtdf> api
20151212 01:43:45< gfgtdf> you shall never use standart (C)++ oi apis on windows.
20151212 01:43:50< gfgtdf> io*
20151212 01:44:00< gfgtdf> they all accepot only ansi
20151212 01:44:06< gfgtdf> just liek the A functions
20151212 01:44:09< celticminstrel> That's not true.
20151212 01:44:11< celticminstrel> wcout
20151212 01:44:19< celticminstrel> etc
20151212 01:44:27< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: yes i means all functiosn that accept a char or char*
20151212 01:44:38< celticminstrel> That's not what you said. :P
20151212 01:45:24< gfgtdf> but what i rather means is where the filename is a char* or std::string
20151212 01:47:23< gfgtdf> shadowm: for most standart api windows offers a unicode version with has a w suffix or prefix here '_wrename' could be a good try
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20151212 01:47:36< gfgtdf> shadowm: whcih then accepots utf16
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20151212 01:51:16< shadowm> God dammit Internet connection.
20151212 01:52:32< shadowm> 22:41:51 <celticminstrel> The only way I know to set a breakpoint in MSVC is clicking in the gutter in the code editor...
20151212 01:52:38< shadowm> INT 3.
20151212 01:52:49< celticminstrel> ?
20151212 01:53:01< shadowm> Interrupt 3  = trap into debugger.
20151212 01:53:45< shadowm> I'm looking at msvcrt.dll!_rename() right now, yes, it only calls ANSI functions.
20151212 01:54:01< shadowm> kernel32.dll!MoveFileA in particular.
20151212 01:54:19< shadowm> Okay, so you are telling me that every fopen call in here is bugged too? :p
20151212 01:54:29< gfgtdf> shadowm: yes
20151212 01:54:39< shadowm> And what should I use instead?
20151212 01:54:50< shadowm> *fopen/freopen
20151212 01:55:15< gfgtdf> shadowm: hmm maybe our boost filesystem functions if they have whta you want
20151212 01:56:05< gfgtdf> shadowm: _wfreopen coudl maybe be used
20151212 01:56:18< shadowm> I see a rename() in the Boost.Filesystem reference, I don't see a freopen(), which is the most critical piece of machinery.
20151212 01:57:03< celticminstrel> I don't think there's actually a C++ equivalent of freopen.
20151212 01:58:12< shadowm> Okay, looks like Mingw-w64 has _wfreopn().
20151212 01:58:45< shadowm> No idea about Mingw, I guess it doesn't matter since Mingw won't build SDL 2 anyway.
20151212 02:02:34< shadowm> Okay, let's see if this works...
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20151212 02:04:55< shadowm> Okay now Windows insists on loading the old binary out of nothing.
20151212 02:06:26< shadowm> I guess I just learned exactly how Windows deals with changes in executable images hosted on network shares.
20151212 02:06:31< shadowm> Rebooooot...
20151212 02:07:17< shadowm> Looks like I fixed it!
20151212 02:07:58< shadowm> Okay, do I call any other C runtime functions here...
20151212 02:09:23< shadowm> Nope, it's all good to go.
20151212 02:09:26< iceiceice> shadowm: the play by play is riveting
20151212 02:09:48< iceiceice> you really should make it a practice to narrate every step every time you work on a bug, so all of us can follow along in the future
20151212 02:10:10< shadowm> http://pastebin.com/i2WxbuB4
20151212 02:15:42< irker114> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master c9c975e25609 / changelog players_changelog src/log_windows.cpp: log/windows: Use _wfreopen and _wrename where needed (bug #22897) http://git.io/v0OJ6
20151212 02:16:25< shadowm> gfgtdf: ^
20151212 02:18:23< shadowm> Should I ask loonycyborg to integrate this patch into a new 1.13.2 build? I suspect some people will have issues otherwise.
20151212 02:18:57< shadowm> (Although they could use --wconsole as a workaround, kind of tacky though.)
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20151212 06:12:40< shadowm> gfgtdf: Can you test if the fix works for you too just in case? Also, 23:18:25 <shadowm> Should I ask loonycyborg to integrate this patch into a new 1.13.2 build? I suspect some people will have issues otherwise.
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20151212 15:46:03< gfgtdf> 23:18:25 <shadowm> Should I ask loonycyborg to integrate this patch into a new 1.13.2 build? I suspect some people will have issues otherwise.
20151212 15:46:33< gfgtdf> shadowm: y i think that makes sensesense, i also wouldnt expeect fromnormla user to passcompadline arguments to a  programm
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20151212 15:52:37< loonycyborg> What issues exactly? I'd rather avoid doing "a" releases considering it's totally unclear to me how they'll interact with coming patcher..
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20151212 15:54:49< gfgtdf> loonycyborg: the 1.13.2 release font have teh updater
20151212 15:54:59< gfgtdf> loonycyborg: also i really think the updater shoudl be able to hande such releases
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20151212 18:09:55< gfgtdf> shadowm: starting with an uncodepath seems to work now.
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20151212 21:47:35< shadowm> loonycyborg: 1.13.2a needs commits 044a6a999dcf3cff6cbf0b2ea50c68f06dd2cbbb and c9c975e25609e9421a439e6f45c080b51afb3f99.
20151212 21:48:02< shadowm> Don't worry about the patcher, that's for the patcher to figure out. And yes, this is important because otherwise Wesnoth will simply not start at all for some people.
20151212 21:48:31< loonycyborg> ok
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20151212 23:45:37< irker545> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:1.12 af45cab2d1dc / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/chapter2/06_Acquaintance_in_Need.cfg: Fixed to LoW scenario6 http://git.io/v0Zcx
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--- Log closed Sun Dec 13 00:00:44 2015