--- Log opened Mon Jan 25 00:00:41 2016
20160125 00:08:23-!- Appleman1234 [~Appleman1@KD119104009230.au-net.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 00:13:23-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20160125 00:13:29-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 00:16:58-!- legoktm[NE] is now known as legoktm
20160125 00:50:04-!- Greg-Boggs [~oem@2601:1c2:901:5227:178:5f3e:1dc:4aaa] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 00:56:28-!- Greg-Boggs [~oem@2601:1c2:901:5227:178:5f3e:1dc:4aaa] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
20160125 01:15:20-!- Greg-Boggs [~oem@2601:1c2:901:5227:178:5f3e:1dc:4aaa] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 01:42:17< vultraz> shadowm: also working on a minimal scrollbar design: https://www.dropbox.com/s/ezipqsc0maisxg6/minimal_scrollbar.PNG?dl=0 thoughts? 
20160125 01:43:17< vultraz> Same as the old one except without the buttons and 8 px thinner
20160125 01:43:48< vultraz> Also the positioner fits more snugly into the groove 
20160125 01:43:54< shadowm> We don't want that until GUI2 actually has sensible touchscreen support.
20160125 01:44:14< shadowm> (If it doesn't already. Given GUI2's age and the state of technology back then... I highly doubt it.)
20160125 01:44:39< shadowm> Oh and don't forget that not everyone has a scrollwheel.
20160125 01:45:12< vultraz> Click and drag works perfectly fine. Are the buttons the main way to scroll on touchscreens?
20160125 01:45:15< shadowm> In fact I had to help someone do crap on a touchscreen laptop a few weeks ago and could never figure out how to scroll without touch.
20160125 01:45:28< shadowm> Click and drag?
20160125 01:45:40< shadowm> I meant on the listbox, not the scrollbar.
20160125 01:45:40< vultraz> On the positioner 
20160125 01:45:43< vultraz> Oh
20160125 01:45:47< shadowm> If you shrink the scrollbar then you are making it worse.
20160125 01:46:07< shadowm> Okay, that got too wordy.
20160125 01:46:09< shadowm> tl;dr No.
20160125 01:46:34< vultraz> Can I commit it as an alternate definition?
20160125 01:46:49< shadowm> Yes, but don't use it in mainline.
20160125 01:47:02< iceiceice> shadowm, what does gui2 have to do with touchscreen support?
20160125 01:47:11< iceiceice> i mean,
20160125 01:47:12< shadowm> SDL 2 has touchscreen support AFAIK.
20160125 01:47:26< shadowm> But.
20160125 01:47:45-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 01:47:47< iceiceice> do touch screens need to be supported differently than via the mouse?
20160125 01:47:55< iceiceice> i mean for wesnoth anyways
20160125 01:48:06< shadowm> I have no idea and it's not really the point in this case.
20160125 01:48:14< iceiceice> also isnt the iphone port basically unmaintained anyways?
20160125 01:48:32< vultraz> We have no way to know since none of us have a working iOS build
20160125 01:48:47< shadowm> Whether touchscreens have to be regarded as a separate thing or not, the goal at the end is the same: "make it touchscreen friendly".
20160125 01:49:03< iceiceice> how is a scrollbar supposed to work on a touch screen?
20160125 01:49:07< vultraz> IMO, the best way to do that would be to make the listbox touch scroll aware 
20160125 01:49:29< shadowm> I have a crappy Android phone I don't use, it seems what people are supposed to do is to touch the screen and then drag it in the opposite direction of scrolling.
20160125 01:49:56< vultraz> Well, yes
20160125 01:50:01< shadowm> Or something like that. You see, I've been avoding touchscreens like the plague.
20160125 01:50:09< iceiceice> O_o
20160125 01:50:12< iceiceice> i did not realize this
20160125 01:50:14< vultraz> Why would it be anything else?
20160125 01:50:17< shadowm> I can't offer useful first-hand information about how you are supposed to use them.
20160125 01:50:19< iceiceice> why not drag it towards the direction of scrolling
20160125 01:50:59< vultraz> Uh
20160125 01:51:02< shadowm> I think it's because it's like a piece of paper.
20160125 01:51:12< shadowm> You want to get the top closer to you, you drag the bottom towards you.
20160125 01:51:50< iceiceice> this sounds like some evil apple nonsense :p
20160125 01:51:58< vultraz> A scrollbar on a touchscreen app is supposed to be very very minimal 
20160125 01:51:59< iceiceice> i mean thats sort of antithetical to what a scrollbar is
20160125 01:52:19< shadowm> vultraz: Yeah, because unlike with a mouse (without a scrollwheel), it only serves as visual feedback.
20160125 01:52:23< iceiceice> if you want ot have like a grippable, draggable scroll pane i mean i can imagine that
20160125 01:52:32< vultraz> what shadowm said
20160125 01:52:38< shadowm> Back in my days we had to actually use scrollbars to navigate.
20160125 01:52:53< vultraz> Therefore I'll keep this around for when/if we get a proper mobile port
20160125 01:53:07< iceiceice> i mean surely no one expects to use those tiny arrow buttons
20160125 01:53:16< vultraz> Since then the scrollbars won't be necessary 
20160125 01:55:17< vultraz> iceiceice: tbh, dragging downwards to make a page scroll... down makes no sense at all :P
20160125 01:55:36< shadowm> Also, back in my days, you didn't need to keep your eye on the screen to know that it registered a button press.
20160125 01:55:43< vultraz> I can't even visualize that
20160125 01:55:47< shadowm> The _button itself_ told you it was pressed.
20160125 01:55:47< iceiceice> vultraz, i mean its exactly like a minimap
20160125 01:56:00< iceiceice> you drag the minimap rectangle towards what you want to see
20160125 01:56:11< vultraz> Hmm
20160125 01:56:17< vultraz> Ok that's a more apt description 
20160125 01:56:21< iceiceice> in most systems the size of the scrollbar gripper thing is even like
20160125 01:56:24< vultraz> But bad UI design 
20160125 01:56:28< iceiceice> adjusted based on what fractino of the content you can see
20160125 01:57:20< shadowm> Ah yes, the scrollbar blocky thing  would often turn about 2 px tall when browsing large documents.
20160125 01:57:23< shadowm> Good times.
20160125 01:58:21< shadowm> But then it wasn't too bad either because you could click on the groove to advance faster in a given direction too.
20160125 01:58:29< vultraz> BTW... who doesn't have a scrollwheel mouse in 2016? Or are you referring to touchpads 
20160125 01:58:48< shadowm> Duh who doesn't live in America in 2016.
20160125 01:58:54< shadowm> vultraz please.
20160125 01:59:06< shadowm> Not all computers or mice are born equal.
20160125 01:59:11< vultraz> I didn't even know mice were made without a scrollwheen 
20160125 01:59:13< vultraz> wheel 
20160125 01:59:15< shadowm> Some make more sense than others.
20160125 01:59:32< shadowm> And it's a worrying trend that pretty much all computers nowadays come with a touchscreen.
20160125 01:59:44< vultraz> Not worrying 
20160125 01:59:47< shadowm> Don't you know how disgusting those things can get in the wrong hands?
20160125 01:59:50< shadowm> No pun intended.
20160125 01:59:59< vultraz> Just means we have to update our tech 
20160125 02:00:11< shadowm> You've never had to use someone else's computer, have you.
20160125 02:00:30< vultraz> Why would I use someone else's computer?
20160125 02:00:32< vultraz> I mean, I have
20160125 02:00:34< shadowm> Even in a effing university where you'd think the IT people would know better, all keyboards are greasy all the time.
20160125 02:00:36< vultraz> but very very rarely 
20160125 02:00:43< shadowm> Picture that on a screen.
20160125 02:00:50< shadowm> *keyboards and mice
20160125 02:01:18< shadowm> Yep, that's you all right.
20160125 02:01:37< vultraz> What does that mean :|
20160125 02:01:44< shadowm> :)
20160125 02:03:15< vultraz> ... moving on. What I gather you're saying is we can't use the minimal scrollbars until we ascertain we have proper touchscreens support 
20160125 02:03:27< shadowm> Yes.
20160125 02:04:43< shadowm> In fact I'd probably do like KDE and keep them on and full-width by default anyway.
20160125 02:05:16< shadowm> We really have bigger fish to fry here than that.
20160125 02:05:49< vultraz> Well, then, I need a touchscreen laptop 
20160125 02:05:54< vultraz> :(
20160125 02:06:03< shadowm> 23:00:01 <vultraz> Just means we have to update our tech
20160125 02:06:05< shadowm> Just update your tech!
20160125 02:06:16< shadowm> It takes like what, $300?
20160125 02:06:24< vultraz> What
20160125 02:06:26< shadowm> Shouldn't be a problem.
20160125 02:06:36< vultraz> In what universe do laptops cost only $300
20160125 02:06:42< shadowm> Here.
20160125 02:06:51< shadowm> If you don't mind low-end specs.
20160125 02:06:56< vultraz> Or should I say, *good* laptops
20160125 02:07:08< shadowm> Don't get picky now, you said you only have to update your tech.
20160125 02:07:20< vultraz> You aren't gonna find Skylake in a $300 rig 
20160125 02:07:23< shadowm> You didn't specify it had to be expensive and Apple-branded.
20160125 02:07:52< shadowm> Well then why are you worrying about touchscreens?
20160125 02:08:07< shadowm> You should be looking forward to brain interfaces instead.
20160125 02:08:27< vultraz> Because I don't have a Mac to work on an iOS port to test out the touchscreens on my new iPad Mini
20160125 02:08:40< vultraz> touchscreen support in Wesnoth*
20160125 02:09:14< vultraz> So someone needs a Windows touchscreen laptop that can run the desktop version of Wesnoth
20160125 02:09:22< shadowm> Update your tech!
20160125 02:09:34< shadowm> It's so easy isn't it.
20160125 02:09:50< vultraz> If I were willing to spend the money, yes
20160125 02:10:27< shadowm> Well yes, that's you.
20160125 02:10:42< shadowm> Did you know there are people who aren't willing to spend the money because they don't have it?
20160125 02:11:26< vultraz> You do realize by "upgrade our tech" I meant ensure proper touchscreen support?
20160125 02:11:44< shadowm> I suspected that.
20160125 02:11:59< shadowm> But, you do realize that to do that you need touchscreens to test with?
20160125 02:12:29< vultraz> Does our company have the resources to provide for that?
20160125 02:12:36< shadowm> It's never the same if you don't experience it first-hand (biggest problem with UIs in OSS).
20160125 02:12:47< shadowm> I am not allowed to talk about that in public.
20160125 02:15:10< iceiceice> definitely need to start the GUI2 brain interface compatibility initiative
20160125 02:15:34< iceiceice> optimized so that coma survivors can play wesnoth comfortably while in recovery
20160125 02:16:17< vultraz> :P
20160125 02:16:19< iceiceice> but only the gui2 dialogs, they are SOL as regards GUI1
20160125 02:17:17< iceiceice> actally i have a touch screen laptop, its kind of awesome
20160125 02:17:23< iceiceice> but i deleted windows from it like 4 years ago
20160125 02:17:38< iceiceice> so i have no idea how the touch ui is "supposed" to work or whatever
20160125 02:17:42< vultraz> shadowm: there's one more thing I've been meaning to ask - should we remove the Tiny GUI definitions? They're unmaintained.
20160125 02:22:50< vultraz> fuck
20160125 02:22:58< shadowm> Yeah, remove them. Tiny GUI itself was removed long ago.
20160125 02:23:03< vultraz> I can't make this a definition 
20160125 02:23:19< vultraz> The buttons aren't dependent 
20160125 02:26:14< vultraz> Oh well, I'll just commit the images
20160125 02:26:26< vultraz> And the magic numbers in a commented out definition 
20160125 02:48:15-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20160125 02:52:57-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 02:58:55< celticminstrel> vultraz, iceiceice: As someone who uses touch screens, I can assure you that dragging down to scroll up makes perfect sense.
20160125 02:59:10< vultraz> celticminstrel: yes, I agree
20160125 02:59:21< celticminstrel> What doesn't make sense is when Apple transposed that back to the desktop OS.
20160125 02:59:37< celticminstrel> I dunno, maybe it makes sense if you use a trackpad, but...
20160125 02:59:52< celticminstrel> ...probably not.
20160125 02:59:57< shadowm> Oh good, another reason to avoid Apple products for my list.
20160125 03:00:18< celticminstrel> Well, it's an option in System Prefs, so I disabled it.
20160125 03:00:27< celticminstrel> But, sure. It could be a reason to avoid them. :P
20160125 03:01:00< celticminstrel> Dragging down to scroll down makes perfect sense if what you're dragging is the scrollbar thumb, but it's nonsensical if you're dragging the content.
20160125 03:01:01< vultraz> There is no reason to avoid Apple
20160125 03:01:04< iceiceice> i mean it makes sense in general but i dont like it for scrollbars
20160125 03:01:22< iceiceice> alot of people if they look at the scrollbar and its at the top, they expect to be at the top...
20160125 03:01:22< celticminstrel> iOS doesn't actually have scrollbars.
20160125 03:01:24< iceiceice> not at the bototm
20160125 03:01:43< celticminstrel> It has something that looks similar, which shows up when scrolling and indicates your position, but you can't interact with it.
20160125 03:02:03< iceiceice> yeah i see
20160125 03:02:16< celticminstrel> It does have the thumb at the top when you're at the top.
20160125 03:02:31< celticminstrel> But you don't drag the thumb down to scroll down; instead you drag the content up.
20160125 03:02:32< vultraz> yeah, I like the iOS scrollbars 
20160125 03:02:35< vultraz> not intrusive 
20160125 03:02:38< iceiceice> yeah thats a good way to do it
20160125 03:02:48< celticminstrel> OSX uses the same scrollbars since I think 10.7.
20160125 03:02:56< iceiceice> hmm wait
20160125 03:03:01< iceiceice> so does gui2 not support scroll wheel?
20160125 03:03:02< celticminstrel> Except they're interactable if you set them always visible.
20160125 03:03:08< vultraz> It does
20160125 03:03:11< iceiceice> b/c i think sdl2 should support scroll wheel ?
20160125 03:03:42< iceiceice> (on all platforms?)
20160125 03:03:58< shadowm> Yes.
20160125 03:04:17< iceiceice> so what is needed for ios-like support of vultraz's thing
20160125 03:04:18< shadowm> GUI2 does support scroll wheel, always had, otherwise I'd have quit ages ago.
20160125 03:04:30< iceiceice> just that, on ios, you shouldn't be able to click on the scroll gripper i guess?
20160125 03:04:43< celticminstrel> Yeah.
20160125 03:04:53< vultraz> iceiceice: confirmation that touch scrolling works in without having to grab the scrollbar
20160125 03:04:58 * celticminstrel has no idea how Android handles scrolling but assumes it's similar.
20160125 03:05:11< vultraz> it is
20160125 03:05:20 * celticminstrel also thinks Android's probably a better place to test touch screens for Wesnoth.
20160125 03:05:50< vultraz> Why?
20160125 03:05:54< vultraz> iOS is superior 
20160125 03:05:59< celticminstrel> But Android is open.
20160125 03:06:00< shadowm> Superior.
20160125 03:06:08< shadowm> I agree, the prices are far superior.
20160125 03:06:18< celticminstrel> So it's probably easier for developers to test it on an actual device.
20160125 03:06:22< vultraz> Android's UI design is far inferior to iOS's
20160125 03:06:27< shadowm> By which I mean they have many more figures.
20160125 03:06:33< shadowm> As in they are larger.
20160125 03:06:40< celticminstrel> I get it, shadowm. :P
20160125 03:06:44< iceiceice> i also love paying money :)
20160125 03:07:10< shadowm> I don't know, I spent less money on a high-end desktop than I would've on a mid-end Mac.
20160125 03:07:24< shadowm> I don't think it's much difference in mobile-land.
20160125 03:07:41< iceiceice> i also prefer to have all the internals of my electronics sealed together with glue
20160125 03:07:49< shadowm> *high-end Mac (mid-end compared to "PC")
20160125 03:07:54< iceiceice> to prevent any possibility of recycling, or a pesky user like me changing things
20160125 03:08:45< celticminstrel> Mighty Mouse
20160125 03:09:48< vultraz> I'm lucky enough to have both android and ios devices and ios is so much more clean and intuitive 
20160125 03:10:01< vultraz> apple really focuses on design 
20160125 03:11:16< shadowm> Expensive design.
20160125 03:11:32< vultraz> Design is expensive 
20160125 03:11:52< shadowm> Sometimes it's impractical too.
20160125 03:12:07< shadowm> (Long phone is long, etc.)
20160125 03:12:22< vultraz> Have you actually held and iPhone 6s?
20160125 03:12:36< shadowm> I'm from a poor country.
20160125 03:12:51< shadowm> I've never touched Apple stuff.
20160125 03:13:10< vultraz> Sad
20160125 03:13:12< shadowm> Furthermore, I refuse to use a smartphone.
20160125 03:13:17< iceiceice> that is noble :)
20160125 03:13:22< shadowm> Even though I have the money to buy like six of them.
20160125 03:14:25< iceiceice> i have a smart phone now, i didn't used to though
20160125 03:14:27< iceiceice> i rarely use it though
20160125 03:14:36< iceiceice> for a while it was really handy to have google maps though,
20160125 03:14:41< vultraz> That is not noble 
20160125 03:14:43< vultraz> That is foolish 
20160125 03:14:45< iceiceice> because it figured out the bus routes based on your gps
20160125 03:15:06< iceiceice> but the app got seriously broken at some point, they made it work much worse
20160125 03:15:09< iceiceice> and it wasn't possible to downgrade
20160125 03:15:17< iceiceice> other than that i dont think i used to smart phone
20160125 03:15:39< iceiceice> i went back to the old clamshell design after the plan expired
20160125 03:15:45< iceiceice> b/c it was way cheaper
20160125 03:15:46< celticminstrel> I don't think it's noble or foolish.
20160125 03:15:56< vultraz> CLAMSHELL!
20160125 03:16:03< shadowm> ^
20160125 03:16:05< celticminstrel> ...
20160125 03:16:11< iceiceice> i wish i could get a candybar phone like i had when i was backpacking :)
20160125 03:16:17< iceiceice> thats even less moving parts than the clamshell
20160125 03:16:17 * celticminstrel buries vultraz in pearls.
20160125 03:16:20< shadowm> I had a clamshell phone once, got rid of it as soon as I could.
20160125 03:16:36< iceiceice> but they dont even sell the candybar afaik in the us right now
20160125 03:16:40< vultraz> you people are all nuts 
20160125 03:16:54< celticminstrel> :P
20160125 03:16:56 * vultraz hides away with his samsung smartphone and apple tablet
20160125 03:16:57-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20160125 03:17:09< iceiceice> vultraz, there is a special place in my heart for luddites :)
20160125 03:17:31< iceiceice> my phd advisor did not even have a credit card until 2013, if he is to be believed
20160125 03:17:53< vultraz> what
20160125 03:18:05< vultraz> even *I* have a credit card
20160125 03:18:16< shadowm> iceiceice: What made him give in?
20160125 03:18:25< celticminstrel> I didn't have one until... 2006? 2008? Something like that. Of course, that was around when I started university - it's not surprising for a high school student not to have one.
20160125 03:18:47< vultraz> I have one for traveling 
20160125 03:19:05< vultraz> Not a good idea to travel without a card 
20160125 03:19:14< shadowm> Well duh.
20160125 03:19:18< celticminstrel> Why not?
20160125 03:19:32< iceiceice> it was something really banal, i dont remember exactly now
20160125 03:19:45< vultraz> celticminstrel: uh... why why not 
20160125 03:19:48< iceiceice> it was like, he wanted to buy a planeticket from some airline, and they didnt have good paypal support or something
20160125 03:19:49< shadowm> "-90% off! only paying with xyz credit card"
20160125 03:20:06< celticminstrel> Why would it be a bad idea to travel without a credit card? That doesn't make sense to me.
20160125 03:20:21< vultraz> celticminstrel: what if you run out of cash?
20160125 03:20:28< vultraz> celticminstrel: what if you need to pay for something?
20160125 03:20:30< iceiceice> write a check?
20160125 03:20:34< vultraz> and don't want to spend all your cash?
20160125 03:20:43< celticminstrel> Cheque, sure, or find a bank machine?
20160125 03:20:56< iceiceice> vultraz, when i was a kid they told everone to use travellers checks
20160125 03:21:00< iceiceice> when they travel
20160125 03:21:04< celticminstrel> Though these days, a lot of places don't acceopt cheques anymore.
20160125 03:21:06< iceiceice> i think thats kind of obsolete now though maybe
20160125 03:21:07< vultraz> This is 2016 
20160125 03:21:15< vultraz> Who uses travelers checks
20160125 03:21:16< celticminstrel> ^accept
20160125 03:21:31< iceiceice> your credit card could get stolen though
20160125 03:21:38< vultraz> So could your checks 
20160125 03:21:51< iceiceice> travelers checks are in theory more secure somehow
20160125 03:22:00< iceiceice> i mean more seriously, you could use a debit card
20160125 03:22:04< celticminstrel> ^
20160125 03:22:06< vultraz> iceiceice: plus if you're flying United on a domestic flight they only accept credit cards for meals
20160125 03:22:14< iceiceice> those meals suck anyways
20160125 03:22:25< celticminstrel> Though I never use debit myself, but I could if I was really in a pinch.
20160125 03:22:32< vultraz> iceiceice: not really 
20160125 03:22:36< celticminstrel> (Except that I have a credt card, so I'd use that instead.)
20160125 03:22:44< iceiceice> for most of the time i had some "check card"
20160125 03:22:49< vultraz> iceiceice: they're pretty good actually 
20160125 03:22:54< iceiceice> which was basically a debit card but often usable as a credit card
20160125 03:22:55-!- Greg-Boggs [~oem@2601:1c2:901:5227:178:5f3e:1dc:4aaa] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20160125 03:23:08< iceiceice> debit card feels safer than a credit card... since you cant go into debt against it
20160125 03:23:22< celticminstrel> I suppose there's that.
20160125 03:23:33< vultraz> I don't have a checking account 
20160125 03:23:42< celticminstrel> I think there's some reason to prefer credit though... maybe lower fees or something?
20160125 03:23:44< vultraz> TBH. It's actually a card on my parent's account :P
20160125 03:23:49< vultraz> So
20160125 03:23:51< vultraz> xD
20160125 03:23:57< iceiceice> celticminstrel, i think the main reason is to build your credit score
20160125 03:24:07< iceiceice> so you can eventually get a morgage for a house if you want
20160125 03:24:07< celticminstrel> Sure, I suppose that's another reason.
20160125 03:24:17< vultraz> I will have to actually get my own eventually
20160125 03:24:20< iceiceice> thats the main reason i have a credit card now
20160125 03:24:49< vultraz> But I should get a job first
20160125 03:24:59< vultraz> and jobs for foreigners here aren't really available 
20160125 03:25:08< vultraz> Unless you work on government 
20160125 03:25:10< vultraz> in*
20160125 03:26:06< iceiceice> idk i mean credit cards are kind of horrible though
20160125 03:26:10< vultraz> iceiceice: bottom line is I feel safer carrying a card 
20160125 03:26:13< iceiceice> they really screw over small businesses
20160125 03:26:17< iceiceice> like small mom and pop stores
20160125 03:26:31 * vultraz shrugs
20160125 03:27:03< celticminstrel> Those are also the types of stores that are more likely to accept cheques, at least if you're a regular.
20160125 03:27:12< vultraz> Or cash!
20160125 03:27:18< celticminstrel> Well... in my experience, anyway.
20160125 03:27:23< iceiceice> imo the credit card companies should be regulated as utilities
20160125 03:27:27< celticminstrel> Yeah, sure. I usually use cash whenever possible too.
20160125 03:27:36< celticminstrel> Especially for food.
20160125 03:27:36< iceiceice> like, the whole credit card payment infrastructure
20160125 03:27:49< iceiceice> that should just be like, nationalized and regulated at the federal level, like the highways
20160125 03:28:06< iceiceice> i have no issue with the credit card companies like, acting as banks and making loans,
20160125 03:28:24< iceiceice> but the current system is like, you just have these corporate titans that gouge everyone
20160125 03:28:28< iceiceice> and provide no actual innovation or value
20160125 03:46:23-!- irker902 [~irker@uruz.ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 03:46:23< irker902> wesnoth: Jyrki Vesterinen wesnoth:master 97952b0d4820 / src/ (serialization/string_utils.hpp wesnoth.cpp): Fixed crash on startup on Windows in paths with spaces https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/97952b0d4820bdbf360d3b1447c63f7dd8070ac6
20160125 03:46:25< irker902> wesnoth: Jyrki Vesterinen wesnoth:master 702be57481b3 / src/filesystem_boost.cpp: Fixed: filesystem::get_exe_dir() returned a wrong directory on Windows https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/702be57481b3b3620ed1194accdeef2be8f0f7a8
20160125 03:46:27< irker902> wesnoth: Jyrki Vesterinen wesnoth:master 6d82f98f658e / src/wesnoth.cpp: Try to find game data from the working directory too https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/6d82f98f658e8a46db6c3b7aa4f7f09ac9c32783
20160125 03:46:29< irker902> wesnoth: Jyrki Vesterinen wesnoth:master 8d2ae80b32a2 / src/wesnoth.cpp: Rewrote the code that restarts the process https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/8d2ae80b32a2c1b467f5b35c4cec0c7d1e27e234
20160125 03:46:31< irker902> wesnoth: Jyrki Vesterinen wesnoth:master 60f1d98c8da9 / src/wesnoth.cpp: Stop giving ourselves Above Normal priority on Windows https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/60f1d98c8da992c332de617b43a6f56873b8e3c9
20160125 03:46:33< irker902> wesnoth: Jyrki Vesterinen wesnoth:master 2cc919fa1c20 / src/wesnoth.cpp: Fixed build with MinGW toolchain https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/2cc919fa1c20765559be075a08a361eb12ace736
20160125 03:46:35< irker902> wesnoth: Jyrki Vesterinen wesnoth:master 4c81e2818048 / src/wesnoth.cpp: Fixed a compiler warning with MinGW toolchain https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/4c81e281804885e312348fcd98dfc1fcfc96116b
20160125 03:46:37< irker902> wesnoth: Jyrki Vesterinen wesnoth:master 12947486b8ec / data/core/about.cfg: Added myself to credits https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/12947486b8ec30cbb2468be63f819388d8cc964c
20160125 03:46:39< irker902> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master a34d03627962 / / (4 files in 3 dirs): Merge pull request #571 from jyrkive/fix-crash-on-openmp-relaunch https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/a34d03627962a417d9afa74ac86c197ad8555b27
20160125 04:11:37< Aginor> mmm, credit cards :)
20160125 04:13:25< Aginor> in NZ there's EftPos, also card-based payment technology. The difference is that it's tied to the banks, any (unusual nowadays) fees are paid by the custerms and are only used as debit cards. Shops love them, it doesn't detract from their bottom line and they accept payments of any size with them
20160125 04:13:50-!- solvents [~quassel@69-196-152-213.dsl.teksavvy.com] has quit [Quit: http://quassel-irc.org - Chat comfortably. Anywhere.]
20160125 04:13:50< vultraz> Huh
20160125 04:17:28< vultraz> Sounds useful 
20160125 04:17:48< Aginor> it is
20160125 04:17:54< Aginor> less evil than the big CC companies
20160125 04:50:01< vultraz> Aginor: but what do you do if you travel
20160125 04:52:15-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20160125 04:59:40-!- Greg-Boggs [~oem@2601:1c2:901:5227:178:5f3e:1dc:4aaa] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 05:00:51< Aginor> vultraz: use real CCs :D
20160125 05:02:03< Aginor> having a universal payment method that isn't tied to a specific currency and is usually available (varies by country though) is incredibly useful
20160125 05:02:27< vultraz> That is true
20160125 05:03:00< Aginor> although there's some pretty big exceptions
20160125 05:03:10< Aginor> don't expect to pay by CCs in Germany for example
20160125 05:03:28< Aginor> you have to use cash or the local system, but cash is by far king there
20160125 05:04:15< vultraz> Oh?
20160125 05:04:18< vultraz> Well good to know
20160125 05:04:45-!- Appleman1234 [~Appleman1@KD119104009230.au-net.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
20160125 05:08:34< Aginor> last time I was there I discovered that not even their largest electronics chain accepts them
20160125 05:24:30< vultraz> weird O_O
20160125 05:24:46< Aginor> just different
20160125 05:30:48< iceiceice> its probably a lot healthier for the german economy
20160125 05:31:33< iceiceice> iirc the stats from pre-2008 were like, the typical household across the world saves  like 1% of their annual income or something, and in the US it was like -4%
20160125 05:35:41< vultraz> That was before the crash 
20160125 05:42:17< Aginor> cash vs CCs aren't the same thing as sound financial planning though
20160125 05:44:42< shadowm> I'm finding the weirdest crap among orphaned forum attachments.
20160125 05:49:27< iceiceice> vultraz, yeah i dont know what happened after the crash
20160125 05:49:56< iceiceice> Aginor, it affects it though, i mean, most people in the us end up with credit card debt, even when it doesn't really make sense
20160125 05:50:26< iceiceice> at least i know that was true before the crash
20160125 05:50:33< iceiceice> i dont really know what the "typical" statistics are like now
20160125 06:02:29-!- celticminstrel [~celmin@unaffiliated/celticminstrel] has quit [Quit: And lo! The computer falls into a deep sleep, to awake again some other day!]
20160125 06:07:38-!- Appleman1234 [~Appleman1@KD119104009230.au-net.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 06:19:10-!- Greg-Boggs [~oem@2601:1c2:901:5227:178:5f3e:1dc:4aaa] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20160125 06:19:11-!- Appleman1234 [~Appleman1@KD119104009230.au-net.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
20160125 06:35:32< irker902> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master a7ee92fb00fe / / (13 files in 2 dirs): Added (unused) definition and images for a minimal-style vertical scrollbar https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/a7ee92fb00fe83e869aed3e3554287a07fb2f373
20160125 06:35:35< irker902> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 81655b3e6f1c / data/gui/default/ (33 files in 2 dirs): GUI2: remove remnants of TinyGUI https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/81655b3e6f1c576fed57694d1495d00a5b450ff5
20160125 06:36:17< vultraz> Will probably speed up loading by half a second
20160125 06:37:38< iceiceice> half a second? :p
20160125 06:37:48< iceiceice> that woudl be pretty incredible
20160125 06:38:19< vultraz> ok, less than that 
20160125 06:38:30< vultraz> some small unnoticeable amount 
20160125 06:38:54< vultraz> but removing those definitions basically cut the gui2 wml tree by about half 
20160125 06:40:24-!- travis-ci [~travis-ci@ec2-54-166-22-126.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 06:40:25< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#8302 (master - 81655b3 : Charles Dang): The build has errored.
20160125 06:40:25< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/104562536
20160125 06:40:25-!- travis-ci [~travis-ci@ec2-54-166-22-126.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20160125 06:40:41< vultraz> I love you too, travis >_>
20160125 07:06:14-!- Kwandulin [~Miranda@p200300760F6924AB483F9F4B60044383.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 07:50:01-!- boucman_work [~jrosen@193.56.60.161] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 07:50:01-!- boucman_work [~jrosen@193.56.60.161] has quit [Changing host]
20160125 07:50:01-!- boucman_work [~jrosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 07:55:32< vultraz> Seems tree node children don't respect linked_groups :|
20160125 07:55:41< vultraz> Just how bug8ged is this widget
20160125 08:00:24-!- shadowm [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20160125 08:00:31-!- shadowm [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 08:50:23-!- irco [~irco@HSI-KBW-078-042-015-165.hsi3.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 08:51:48-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 09:04:40< zookeeper> shadowm, oh, such as what?
20160125 09:14:07< shadowm> What's that a follow-up to?
20160125 09:14:55< zookeeper> the last thing you said on this channel
20160125 09:20:45< shadowm> Eh just an edit of the animesque Li'sar in place of the Add-ons button on the title screen.
20160125 09:21:32< shadowm> As well as other assorted crap that's been accumulating since the last time I purged orphaned attachments in 2014.
20160125 09:21:41< shadowm> It's all gone now, of course.
20160125 09:22:29< zookeeper> i see
20160125 09:22:54< zookeeper> that sounds like a weird image though
20160125 09:26:10< shadowm> Well the thing is I had forgotten an important detail about this.
20160125 09:26:16< shadowm> We allow attachments in private messages.
20160125 09:26:50< shadowm> So yeah I really shouldn't have been looking at the files.
20160125 09:34:36< zookeeper> whoops.
20160125 09:35:21< zookeeper> well, it sounds like at least you didn't notice any particularly improper use of the PM system then.
20160125 09:35:52-!- irker902 [~irker@uruz.ai0867.net] has quit [Quit: transmission timeout]
20160125 09:36:26< shadowm> It's perfectly possible someone intended to post that to _that_ thread and abandoned at the last second, though.
20160125 09:37:21< shadowm> Generally speaking, orphaned attachments are files that people uploaded but never actually posted anywhere (e.g. because they closed their browser/tab, or let the form expire for 2 hours or so).
20160125 09:37:29< zookeeper> you get orphaned attachments if you just don... yeah
20160125 09:37:36< zookeeper> i must have generated a few myself, then
20160125 09:53:00-!- wedge010 [~Thunderbi@60-241-236-92.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 09:56:20-!- wedge009 [~Thunderbi@60-241-236-92.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20160125 09:56:21-!- wedge010 is now known as wedge009
20160125 10:04:56-!- Kwandulin [~Miranda@p200300760F6924AB483F9F4B60044383.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20160125 10:08:27-!- Appleman1234 [~Appleman1@KD119104009230.au-net.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 10:26:08< zookeeper> this mountain layering stuff is such a mess...
20160125 10:29:07< zookeeper> to get them right it might be necessary to cut them all into single-hex pieces
20160125 10:29:16< zookeeper> which would be madness
20160125 10:29:52< zookeeper> or, alternatively, to add another base-affecting parameter, which would arguably be less mad.
20160125 10:33:39< zookeeper> except that even that would require some cutting. urgh.
20160125 10:55:17-!- zombah [~zombah@2a02:28:3:1:214:4fff:fe47:5920] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 11:00:06-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 11:23:35-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20160125 11:33:52-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 11:40:50-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds]
20160125 11:41:21< zookeeper> window_builder.obj : error LNK2001: unresolved external symbol "public: __thiscall gui2::implementation::tbuilder_combobox::tbuilder_combobox(class config const &)" (??0tbuilder_combobox@implementation@gui2@@QAE@ABVconfig@@@Z)
20160125 11:42:48< vultraz> Hm?
20160125 11:43:21< shadowm> The linker is saying that gui2::implementation::tbuilder_combobox::tbuilder_combobox(class config const &) isn't implemented anywhere and is required somewhere else.
20160125 11:44:05< shadowm> __thiscall is the calling convention. Member functions (methods, constructors, destructors) always have this calling convention.
20160125 11:48:27< shadowm> Oh yeah, the solution? In cases like these I'd suspect that zookeeper's project file is just out of date.
20160125 11:49:19< zookeeper> probably
20160125 11:49:20< shadowm> (Because if that's in mainline then I'm fairly sure Wesnoth compiled on both Linux and Linux->Mingw-w64 a few hours ago.)
20160125 11:50:36< shadowm> For example, commit 473941350209afd86c22141fc7cb84e5163694d7 adds files that seem relevant to consider for an outdated project.
20160125 11:51:44< zookeeper> yeah. should i again complain about the stupidity of needing to explicitly add every source file to the project file? just in case someone hasn't heard it before.
20160125 11:53:44< shadowm> Maybe if you insist enough, Microsoft will hear somehow and come up with a solution just for you!
20160125 11:53:51< zookeeper> ohh. you think?
20160125 11:54:14< zookeeper> because that would be great.
20160125 11:57:18< zookeeper> warning MSB8027: Two or more files with the name of combobox.cpp will produce outputs to the same location. This can lead to an incorrect build result.  The files involved are ..\..\src\gui\auxiliary\window_builder\combobox.cpp, ..\..\src\gui\widgets\combobox.cpp.
20160125 11:57:23< zookeeper> dunno if harmless or not.
20160125 11:58:53< shadowm> Expect more errors.
20160125 12:05:28< zookeeper> i guess i could just roll back to before any of this stuff and hope i don't make anything explode...
20160125 12:06:05< shadowm> Isn't there an option somewhere to force files to be built to subdirectories or something?
20160125 12:06:31< shadowm> If there wasn't any such thing, it'd be impossible to build about 80% of src/gui with MSVC++.
20160125 12:06:59 * zookeeper doesn't know anything
20160125 12:07:05< shadowm> Right click menus etc.
20160125 12:07:31< shadowm> Solution panel. Project settings. I don't know, I've not seriously used MSVC++ since 2007.
20160125 12:09:09< zookeeper> me doonno. me press bootton, but it dun work!
20160125 12:09:37 * vultraz perpetuates the gui2 paradigm and adds a template to his code
20160125 12:09:50< zookeeper> translation: yeah i've looked around but can't find anything that would look like it'd help.
20160125 12:11:35< zookeeper> i'll just roll back far enough that i can build and try to live with that
20160125 12:17:55< vultraz> shadowm: can you initialize a template with the type of an object? like template_foo<get_type_of_object_bar_somehow>
20160125 12:18:09< shadowm> That's the most common use.
20160125 12:18:17< shadowm> What you just typed there isn't C++, though.
20160125 12:19:37< vultraz> Yes, but i mean dynamically getting the type of the object. Ie, at initialization object_bar could be different types and I want to initialize to that type.
20160125 12:20:37< shadowm> Objects can only be one type and its base types at a time.
20160125 12:20:58< shadowm> There's no such a thing as an object that can be "different types".
20160125 12:21:05< vultraz> ugh ok I'm explaining this badly
20160125 12:21:53< vultraz> Say I have a object foo of type bar. And then later I may cast foo to type baz. Then I want to initialize a template with the type of foo but I don't know if it's ok type bar or baz.
20160125 12:22:02< vultraz> s/ok/of
20160125 12:22:14< shadowm> You do, actually.
20160125 12:22:29< shadowm> You do because it's whatever you are using to address the object with.
20160125 12:24:09< vultraz> uh...
20160125 12:25:09< vultraz> I'm confused 
20160125 12:26:36< shadowm> You don't roll a dice and see what type you get, _you_ decide which type you are using to refer to the object.
20160125 12:26:57< shadowm> Therefore _you_ know which type is appropriate for whichever template parameter needs to know the type.
20160125 12:27:20< shadowm> The compiler knows as well, and may be able to just use template parameter deduction on its own.
20160125 12:28:23< vultraz> But what if either type is appropriate and the cast may or may not have happened. 
20160125 12:28:27< vultraz> Are we on the same page here
20160125 12:28:43< shadowm> Why would you not know whether the cast happened?
20160125 12:29:28-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 12:29:54< vultraz> Ok, to put it better, say there's a switch block and each case performs a cast to a different type
20160125 12:30:19-!- horrowind [~Icedove@2a02:810a:8b00:1a54:21b:fcff:fee3:c3ff] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 12:30:28< vultraz> And I don't know the type because it's determined by runtime conditions 
20160125 12:30:49< shadowm> ¬_¬
20160125 12:31:05< vultraz> And I want to say, "ok, initialize this template with whatever type foo ended up being"
20160125 12:31:06< shadowm> Sorry, I won't get anywhere without looking at the code and I'm busy right now.
20160125 12:31:32< shadowm> You still have to know which type foo is.
20160125 12:31:45< shadowm> C++ is a strong-typed language. You can't just not know the type.
20160125 12:32:02< vultraz> I want to *GET* the type :|
20160125 12:32:04< shadowm> (Unless you are using `auto` in C++11/14, in which case the answer is that you are using `auto` wrong.)
20160125 12:32:17< shadowm> Yeah, but you already decided the type!
20160125 12:32:25< shadowm> I mean, surely it's not void*.
20160125 12:32:42< shadowm> (Because in that case the answer would be that you are using `void*` wrong.)
20160125 12:33:17< shadowm> Forget about the object, you are primarily interested on the variable, reference, or pointer you are using to address it.
20160125 12:33:23< shadowm> What's its declaration?
20160125 12:37:23< vultraz> I'm still working on this, but it'd probably be "twidget* setter_widget" 
20160125 12:38:20< shadowm> I'd suggest a thing, but I'm more inclined to think that you might not be planning the solution adequately.
20160125 12:38:32< shadowm> What do you intend to do with a template and what is it?
20160125 12:38:42< shadowm> (Template type, template function, etc.)
20160125 12:39:10< vultraz> http://pastebin.com/Mcf5ZPQL
20160125 12:39:22< shadowm> Yeah, you know me well.
20160125 12:40:06< shadowm> I might be hanging above a precipice desperately clinging to a rope in an attempt to save my life and if someone needs help with their code I'll go and waste those few precious seconds doing that instead.
20160125 12:40:31< shadowm> Uh.
20160125 12:40:57< shadowm> Okay? Do you actually need to know the derived type?
20160125 12:41:58< vultraz> Well I need to initialize the template, because.. http://pastebin.com/GVLqESkc
20160125 12:43:55< vultraz> You can't bind a templated function without initializing it
20160125 12:44:08< shadowm> Instantiating, not initializing.
20160125 12:47:36< shadowm> I've never had to take the address of a template anything, but I think the compiler should be fine with what you have, otherwise instantiate it explicitly in its scope.
20160125 12:48:44-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 12:49:10< vultraz> I might just have to
20160125 12:49:13< shadowm> template<ttoggle_button> void tpreferences::generic_setter_call(const std::string&, const ttoggle_button&); // no definition
20160125 12:49:43< shadowm> I've never had to work with template members (as opposed to template types) either.
20160125 12:50:35< shadowm> So yeah, that rules out the original answer I had prepared since this is a build-time (as opposed to run-time) issue.
20160125 12:51:11< shadowm> All template instantiations the program needs to know about must be known by the compiler at build-time, there is no other way.
20160125 12:51:51< shadowm> Now, a more sane approach IMHO would be to know a type that generic_setter_call()'s second argument can always be.
20160125 12:52:19< shadowm> Which is to say, a type that's always a base type of whatever object you toss in there.
20160125 12:52:36< shadowm> And which provides the interface you want.
20160125 12:53:07< shadowm> But I'm not about to research for you which GUI2 types declare a ??? get_value() const member.
20160125 12:53:55< shadowm> (`???` for "whatever type the nondescript set() function or method called there takes for its second parameter").
20160125 12:54:44< vultraz> set is preferences::set, a function with four overloads. 
20160125 12:54:53< shadowm> Let alone check whether they apply to your use case.
20160125 12:55:05-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20160125 12:55:06< shadowm> :\
20160125 12:55:29< shadowm> Are you `using namespace`?
20160125 12:55:40< vultraz> I have "using namespace preferences" to avoid typing out preferences:: before every function in that namespace 
20160125 12:55:53< vultraz> Is that bad>
20160125 12:55:55< vultraz> ?
20160125 12:56:02< shadowm> First rule of the `using namespace` club is don't use `using namespace`.
20160125 12:57:39< shadowm> Unless you really know what you are doing (which is to say, importing all symbols from the given namespace into yours), a much better approach is namespace aliasing.
20160125 12:57:52< shadowm> Or just don't use either, which is the Wesnoth way most of the time.
20160125 12:57:56< vultraz> Namespace aliasing? 
20160125 12:58:24< shadowm> Or hand-pick symbols with `using` instead.
20160125 12:59:21< shadowm> http://en.cppreference.com/w/cpp/language/namespace  7 and 6.
20160125 12:59:50< vultraz> Can't use 6 since I use a million functions from preferences::
20160125 13:00:19< shadowm> Then you can settle for aliasing or nothing.
20160125 13:00:56< vultraz> Why is 5 so bad?
20160125 13:00:59< shadowm> But you probably don't want to allow other people to break your code in the future by dropping a name that you weren't expecting.
20160125 13:08:06-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 13:10:49< vultraz> I'll deal with that at the end
20160125 13:10:55< vultraz> thanks for the help 
20160125 13:14:40-!- mode/#wesnoth-dev [+o shadowm] by ChanServ
20160125 13:14:52-!- mode/#wesnoth-dev [+mzq irker*!*@*] by shadowm
20160125 13:14:55-!- mode/#wesnoth-dev [-m] by shadowm
20160125 13:16:21-!- mode/#wesnoth-dev [-zqo irker*!*@* shadowm] by shadowm
20160125 13:39:43-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@x50abdd2a.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 13:57:13-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@f049107050.adsl.alicedsl.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 14:13:18-!- EdB [~edb@89-158-11-138.rev.numericable.fr] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 14:13:23-!- boucman_work [~jrosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Ping timeout: 264 seconds]
20160125 14:27:47-!- boucman_work [~jrosen@193.56.60.161] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 14:27:47-!- boucman_work [~jrosen@193.56.60.161] has quit [Changing host]
20160125 14:27:47-!- boucman_work [~jrosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 14:31:03-!- irker188 [~irker@uruz.ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 14:31:03< irker188> wesnoth: loonycyborg wesnoth:asio_wesnothd 00819df166e1 / src/server/server.cpp: Properly call error handler in case of wml exception https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/00819df166e17265bef77c587311bc3a97f0051a
20160125 14:51:32-!- ancestral [~ancestral@97-116-184-84.mpls.qwest.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 14:53:23-!- irco [~irco@HSI-KBW-078-042-015-165.hsi3.kabel-badenwuerttemberg.de] has quit [Quit: Lost terminal]
20160125 15:02:28-!- horrowind [~Icedove@2a02:810a:8b00:1a54:21b:fcff:fee3:c3ff] has quit [Quit: horrowind]
20160125 15:05:46-!- pydsigner [~pydsigner@unaffiliated/pydsigner] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20160125 15:06:59-!- pydsigner [~pydsigner@unaffiliated/pydsigner] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 15:19:10-!- celticminstrel [~celmin@unaffiliated/celticminstrel] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 15:21:19-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@host-91-147-210-58.biatv.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 15:21:30-!- travis-ci [~travis-ci@ec2-54-211-134-157.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 15:21:31< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#8304 (asio_wesnothd - 00819df : loonycyborg): The build has errored.
20160125 15:21:31< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/104647167
20160125 15:21:31-!- travis-ci [~travis-ci@ec2-54-211-134-157.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20160125 15:24:08< lipkab> http://pastebin.com/mUma1EQE
20160125 15:24:37< lipkab> zookeeper: ^ Is it nice there at port 9983?
20160125 15:25:14-!- ancestral [~ancestral@97-116-184-84.mpls.qwest.net] has quit [Quit: i go nstuf kthxbai]
20160125 15:25:20< lipkab> Not really nice to hack my machine, by the way!
20160125 15:25:26< shadowm> Ahahah.
20160125 15:29:14< zookeeper> :|
20160125 15:34:35 * zookeeper doesn't understand how base is supposed to work with multihex images
20160125 15:35:19< zookeeper> like, sure, that's where the image base is. but then the engine cuts the image up into hex-sized pieces and assigns each of them a modified base... somehow. but it can't know how.
20160125 15:40:47< zookeeper> or maybe that's not what it does.
20160125 15:43:14-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
20160125 15:50:15< zookeeper> in any case, it doesn't make sense.
20160125 16:18:29-!- zombah [~zombah@2a02:28:3:1:214:4fff:fe47:5920] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20160125 16:23:44< irker188> wesnoth: loonycyborg wesnoth:asio_wesnothd d0f206d185cd / src/server/server.cpp: Improved log message for incorrect wml received https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/d0f206d185cda6f9a8080debd040d9e8810f9637
20160125 16:31:36-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 16:34:24-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@host-91-147-210-58.biatv.hu] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20160125 16:38:03-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 16:38:09-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20160125 16:38:34-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 16:38:43-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20160125 16:38:49-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 16:44:00-!- wedge010 [~Thunderbi@60-241-236-92.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 16:44:37-!- wedge009 [~Thunderbi@60-241-236-92.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20160125 16:44:38-!- wedge010 is now known as wedge009
20160125 16:59:05-!- boucman_work [~jrosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20160125 17:19:26-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
20160125 17:41:40-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20160125 17:44:22< zookeeper> ah, finally i'm starting to get the hang of it...
20160125 18:14:43-!- clavii [~clavi@163.172.10.77] has quit [Quit: ZNC - 1.6.2 - http://znc.in]
20160125 18:15:20-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20160125 18:15:46-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 18:20:20-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20160125 18:21:37-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 18:27:25-!- clavi [~clavi@163.172.10.77] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 18:31:45-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@f049107050.adsl.alicedsl.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20160125 18:37:33-!- travis-ci [~travis-ci@ec2-23-20-20-92.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 18:37:34< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#8305 (asio_wesnothd - d0f206d : loonycyborg): The build has errored.
20160125 18:37:34< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/104674774
20160125 18:37:34-!- travis-ci [~travis-ci@ec2-23-20-20-92.compute-1.amazonaws.com] has left #wesnoth-dev []
20160125 18:56:05-!- ancestral [~ancestral@63.92.240.233] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 19:04:22-!- EdB [~edb@89-158-11-138.rev.numericable.fr] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20160125 19:08:28-!- ancestral [~ancestral@63.92.240.233] has quit [Quit: i go nstuf kthxbai]
20160125 19:24:18-!- irker188 [~irker@uruz.ai0867.net] has quit [Quit: transmission timeout]
20160125 19:32:08-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@wh.Uni-Dortmund.DE] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 19:37:30-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 19:52:39-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 20:10:29-!- Kwandulin [~Miranda@p200300760F69246E755C0A8588C525EF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 20:13:04< vultraz> error: default template arguments may not be used in function templates without -std=c++11 or -std=gnu++11|
20160125 20:13:06< vultraz> :(
20160125 20:13:08< vultraz> sadness
20160125 20:13:26-!- wedge009 [~Thunderbi@60-241-236-92.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20160125 20:14:11< vultraz> No hack around this, I don't think 
20160125 20:14:24-!- wedge009 [~Thunderbi@60-241-236-92.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 20:14:50< celticminstrel> There probably is. What's the situation?
20160125 20:18:03< vultraz> I have a bunch of functions I wrote to set up callbacks and value setters for widgets. Decided to try to use them for the Advanced preferences (since it might save me the problems I had last night), but right now they're using twindow arguments whereas there they would need tgrid or something else. Was going to make them templated functions with twindow as a default argument since twindow is...
20160125 20:18:04< vultraz> ...used 99% of the time
20160125 20:18:11< vultraz> Wow that was long
20160125 20:19:14< celticminstrel> Okay, so would these functions actually still work if you substituted tgrid for twindow? All the functions called, do they exist in both classes?
20160125 20:19:27< celticminstrel> Is there a common subclass to twindow and tgrid?
20160125 20:19:46< vultraz> window is only needed for find_widget
20160125 20:20:53< celticminstrel> So find_widget can take a tgrid in place of a twindow?3
20160125 20:21:01< vultraz> yes
20160125 20:21:24< vultraz> for example, such as in:
20160125 20:21:44< vultraz> 		tgrid* main_grid = dynamic_cast<tgrid*>(pref_node.find("pref_main_grid", true));
20160125 20:21:46< vultraz> 		ttoggle_button& toggle_box = find_widget<ttoggle_button>(main_grid, "value_toggle", false);
20160125 20:22:46< celticminstrel> Oh, hang on. I think it'd work just fine if you didn't bother defaulting the argument. Just add the template argument without a default.
20160125 20:23:29< celticminstrel> Function template arguments are in many cases implicitly determined from the type of the arguments passed to the function, so it shouldn't cause any problems to existing uses of the now-templated functions.
20160125 20:25:01< vultraz> Oh, I see
20160125 20:25:10< vultraz> Then what are default arguments needed for
20160125 20:25:31< celticminstrel> They might be needed for cases where the arguments can't be deduced.
20160125 20:25:38< celticminstrel> Like the first argument to lexical_cast.
20160125 20:25:45< celticminstrel> First template argument, that is.
20160125 20:26:11< celticminstrel> Though lexical_cast is not an example of where you'd consider using default arguments.
20160125 20:32:06< vultraz> Hm. Damn. Looks like my code might not be as reusable as I thought
20160125 20:32:22< vultraz> It does build without the default argument just like you said, though
20160125 20:33:08-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20160125 20:34:46< vultraz> maybe I can use boost::function
20160125 20:37:43-!- Necrosporus [~Necrospor@unaffiliated/necrosporus] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20160125 20:38:21< vultraz> uhh... ok, that doesn't work...
20160125 20:38:41< gfgtdf> vultraz: what do you want to do ?
20160125 20:41:53-!- sfan786 [~sfan786@c-24-131-93-63.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 20:42:44< vultraz> http://pastebin.com/5Mv3uEs5
20160125 20:44:24< vultraz> is that not the right use of boost::function
20160125 20:46:01< gfgtdf> vultraz: why did you make F a template agument instead of just always bool ?
20160125 20:46:23< gfgtdf> vultraz: and why do you have a template augment T instead of always twindow?
20160125 20:46:37< vultraz> gfgtdf: see above 
20160125 20:47:15< vultraz> gfgtdf: I'm experimenting with making these functions usable with functions that don't take a bool argument and widgets not directly in twindow
20160125 20:47:34< gfgtdf> shoudl you make teh second rument also make tyoe F instead of bool ?
20160125 20:47:39< gfgtdf> shouldn't
20160125 20:47:44< gfgtdf> argument*
20160125 20:48:00< gfgtdf> vultraz: also i think you can replace T with just twidget
20160125 20:49:51< vultraz> no need for F for the second argument 
20160125 20:50:46< vultraz> but that doesn't explain why it thinks I'm passing a c-style function pointer 
20160125 20:55:36-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20160125 20:57:52-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 21:02:05< vultraz> you guys said it didn't need "*"
20160125 21:11:04-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20160125 21:12:21-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 21:46:17-!- horrowind [~Icedove@2a02:810a:8b00:1a54:21b:fcff:fee3:c3ff] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 21:52:57-!- wedge010 [~Thunderbi@60-241-236-92.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 21:57:22-!- wedge009 [~Thunderbi@60-241-236-92.static.tpgi.com.au] has quit [Ping timeout: 256 seconds]
20160125 21:57:22-!- wedge010 is now known as wedge009
20160125 22:01:00-!- sfan786 [~sfan786@c-24-131-93-63.hsd1.pa.comcast.net] has quit [Quit: My Mac has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…]
20160125 22:02:48-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20160125 22:16:58-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
20160125 22:19:59-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 22:19:59-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20160125 22:34:23-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 22:39:23-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds]
20160125 22:53:09-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 22:53:14-!- atarocch [~atarocch@151.64.72.94] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 22:57:57-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 23:02:18-!- Kwandulin [~Miranda@p200300760F69246E755C0A8588C525EF.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20160125 23:12:04-!- Appleman1234 [~Appleman1@KD119104009230.au-net.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
20160125 23:15:11-!- irker026 [~irker@uruz.ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160125 23:15:11< irker026> wesnoth: loonycyborg wesnoth:asio_wesnothd dcf4355e769e / src/server/server.cpp: Autoremove disconnected players from games https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/dcf4355e769e73c438594a9e70a81b86c642f0af
20160125 23:15:13< irker026> wesnoth: loonycyborg wesnoth:asio_wesnothd 610c844a7cc0 / src/server/ (server.cpp server.hpp): Ensure that games are always deleted when all players log off https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/610c844a7cc0c04380ad23ff363670eac9710d02
20160125 23:38:50-!- atarocch [~atarocch@151.64.72.94] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20160125 23:42:05-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20160125 23:42:33-!- mjs-de [~mjs-de@wh.Uni-Dortmund.DE] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
--- Log closed Tue Jan 26 00:00:42 2016