--- Log opened Wed Feb 17 00:00:16 2016
--- Day changed Wed Feb 17 2016
20160217 00:00:16-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160217 00:02:10< celticminstrel> Alright, looks like the walker does indeed work.
20160217 00:02:37< celticminstrel> The layout looks fine (orb problems still remains though), so I guess I can move on with the implementation.
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20160217 02:35:55< celticminstrel> Other than creating a custom toggle button definition, is there any way to use a different icon when the button is selected?
20160217 02:45:33< celticminstrel> ...maybe it's better just to use a custom definition.
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20160217 03:19:48< celticminstrel> Does anyone know if I can do string concatenation in formulas?
20160217 03:21:10< ancestral> vultraz: How easy would it be to load a different font into the game while loading a scenario or campaign?
20160217 03:21:42< ancestral> For example, let’s say load a different font depending on if the language is supported
20160217 03:25:16< ancestral> pseudocode:  if (campaign.languages contains ‘Klingon’) then { load “Droid Sans Klingon” }
20160217 03:27:58-!- mattsc [~mattsc@wesnoth/developer/mattsc] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160217 03:32:06< celticminstrel> Is it possible to load and display a GUI2 window by its window ID?
20160217 03:34:00< celticminstrel> (A registered one, not a Lua-built one.)
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20160217 03:51:07< mattsc> celticminstrel: IIRC, not really having string manipulation functionality was one of the big downsides of formulas for me and one of the main reasons why I switched from Formula AI to Lua AI.
20160217 03:52:03< mattsc> I don’t remember a way to do that (concetenate strings).  But then, it’s been a long time.
20160217 03:52:11< celticminstrel> According to the source, it seems to have one string manipulation functionality - variable substitution, like Python's string.format.
20160217 03:52:32< celticminstrel> Concatenation could probably be added as a function, if nothing else.
20160217 03:52:49< celticminstrel> (So you'd write concat("a", "b", "c") or whatever.)
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20160217 03:53:09 * celticminstrel is currently testing if that substitution actually works.
20160217 03:54:11< celticminstrel> I have three buttons in the bottom row. I want one to be off to the left and the other two to be on the right, with a larger space between the first and second. Any idea how to do this?
20160217 03:55:16< celticminstrel> I think the substitution does work.
20160217 03:55:20< mattsc> I’m wondering how often one can listen to the same Deep Purple song over and over again …
20160217 03:55:25< celticminstrel> At least, I didn't get any error messages.
20160217 03:55:27< mattsc> Oops …
20160217 03:55:46< celticminstrel> That depends on the song. If it's Smoke on the Water, there might not be a limit.
20160217 03:55:52< mattsc> Sounds good (on the substitution; not talking about DP)
20160217 03:56:27< mattsc> true; that one’s only my number 3 choice at the moment though  ;)
20160217 03:56:28< celticminstrel> Maybe I can figure out why recolouring doesn't work in my build.
20160217 03:59:20< celticminstrel> I recall ancestral not having the issue, so it must be something about my system.
20160217 03:59:47< celticminstrel> Build environment, whatever.
20160217 03:59:52< ancestral> What issue?
20160217 04:00:04< celticminstrel> Look up three lines.
20160217 04:00:15< ancestral> Recolouring?
20160217 04:00:19< ancestral> For what?
20160217 04:00:26< celticminstrel> Anything.
20160217 04:00:31< celticminstrel> ~RC(), ~TC()
20160217 04:00:35< ancestral> You mean, like team colors
20160217 04:00:39< celticminstrel> Yeah.
20160217 04:00:52< ancestral> What can I do to test it out?
20160217 04:01:01< ancestral> I want to be sure
20160217 04:01:19< celticminstrel> I thought you already did, but... just launch a game and make sure your units have red instead of magenta highlights.
20160217 04:01:26< ancestral> Okay
20160217 04:01:37< celticminstrel> (Or change the colour to blue or something, and make sure the ellipses are not red.)
20160217 04:01:40< ancestral> Right
20160217 04:01:50< ancestral> And with a recent build, you’re referring to?
20160217 04:02:13< celticminstrel> I'm only one or two commits behind, but this has been happening for awhile.
20160217 04:02:20< ancestral> Okay
20160217 04:02:37< ancestral> celticminstrel: Just curious, have you tried SDL2?
20160217 04:03:31< celticminstrel> This is with SDL2.
20160217 04:03:53< ancestral> Yeah, looks good over here
20160217 04:04:04< celticminstrel> I can't remember if it started before SDL2 or after though.
20160217 04:04:24< ancestral> You are running Wesnoth from /Applications?
20160217 04:06:14< celticminstrel> No, from XCode's derived products dir.
20160217 04:08:18< celticminstrel> I never actually tried the released 1.13.2(?) build.
20160217 04:08:19< ancestral> That shouldn’t matter
20160217 04:08:25< ancestral> Hmm
20160217 04:08:37< ancestral> Well, you could try it
20160217 04:08:52< celticminstrel> I'm stepping through a recolor in the debugger right now, and it does look like something is being done.
20160217 04:08:54< ancestral> In case there’s something funny about your project and the release
20160217 04:09:25< celticminstrel> I probably should try it.
20160217 04:09:38< ancestral> Otherwise, if you have time and space, consider cloning a new Wesnoth repo into another directory
20160217 04:10:06< ancestral> celticminstrel: 1.13.2 does not support SDL2
20160217 04:10:16< ancestral> And so it won’t really work in El Cap if you have it
20160217 04:10:31< celticminstrel> Whatever the latest release dev was.
20160217 04:10:34< celticminstrel> ^dev release
20160217 04:10:37< celticminstrel> I'm on Lion.
20160217 04:11:20< ancestral> Okay
20160217 04:14:30< aeth> When's the Vulkan port of Wesnoth coming? Vulkan's out now.
20160217 04:14:32< aeth> :-p
20160217 04:22:20< vultraz> 30 years
20160217 04:22:22< vultraz> LO
20160217 04:22:26< vultraz> :P *
20160217 04:22:30< vultraz> ancestral: I have no idea, sorry
20160217 04:22:40< vultraz> ancestral: but I'd say it could probably be done with some tweaking
20160217 04:24:13< vultraz> ancestral: ttext seems to set a bunch of font related stuff every time it fires recalculate()
20160217 04:24:15< vultraz> ancestral: which is a lot
20160217 04:24:44< celticminstrel> So, I need to add new files to, uh... scons, CMake, CodeBlocks, and MSVC.
20160217 04:24:55< celticminstrel> Oh, and something in unit tests.
20160217 04:25:48< celticminstrel> vultraz: Do you know where I need to add the dialog for unit tests?
20160217 04:26:21< vultraz> the what now?
20160217 04:26:39< celticminstrel> GUI2 dialogs need to be covered by the unit tests.
20160217 04:26:44< vultraz> oh yeah
20160217 04:27:03< vultraz> src/tests/gui/test_gui2.cpp
20160217 04:27:32< vultraz> you may also choose to exclude a dialog from the unit tests
20160217 04:27:37< vultraz> as I did with the preferences dialog
20160217 04:27:55< vultraz> (mostly because it kept failing)
20160217 04:29:28< ancestral> aeth: Let’s make a port. What sounds better, “Vulnoth” or “Weskan”?
20160217 04:29:49< ancestral> s/port/fork
20160217 04:30:16< vultraz> ancestral: why even do a port. just skip OGL support for main wesnoth and go straight to vulkan :P
20160217 04:30:47< ancestral> Let’s just make a Trekkie total conversion while we’re at it
20160217 04:32:32< vultraz> heh
20160217 04:33:06< celticminstrel> Okay, pushing. Needs testing, because all the colours are magenta for me.
20160217 04:33:27< celticminstrel> Oh right, there was that one other thing though... eh, I'll fix it later.
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20160217 04:34:20< celticminstrel> I'll make a PR so people can easily see and try it out, but don't merge it quite yet - there's at least one bug I need to fix first.
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20160217 04:36:30< vultraz> shadowm: which method do you approve of more: A ) pushing each addon's name to a separate vector, then using the selected row index to access the name and get the correct addon_list map entry.  B ) using the index of the selected row and the iterator over the config of addons to get the name of the right one to get the addon_list map entry C ) adding a function reverse engineer the results...
20160217 04:36:32< vultraz> ...of make_addon_title using the row's 'name' widget value
20160217 04:36:54< vultraz> (on ways to get the appropriate addon_info entry from the map on selecting a new row)
20160217 04:37:02< celticminstrel> C) sounds atrocious.
20160217 04:37:35< vultraz> yes, I know
20160217 04:38:30< iceiceice> ancestral, i think we should just skip Vulkan and invent our own pixel-oriented graphics card technology
20160217 04:38:46< ancestral> That’s genius!
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20160217 04:38:59< ancestral> aeth: pixel-oriented graphics
20160217 04:39:03< iceiceice> "With this patent-pending graphics card, you can see pixel art the way Jetrel sees it (TM)"
20160217 04:39:25< ancestral> All the cool indies have pixel graphics
20160217 04:40:42< Aginor> we do too, that makes us cool, right? :D
20160217 04:41:15< vultraz> pixel oriented HARDWARE? 
20160217 04:41:20< vultraz> now that's new
20160217 04:41:33< iceiceice> gotta get on that guys
20160217 04:41:53< celticminstrel> How is that new?
20160217 04:41:54< iceiceice> "beats by dre" was one of the dumbest ideas ever, but now dre is *literally a billionaire"
20160217 04:42:05< ancestral> Beat Valve to it
20160217 04:42:19< vultraz> we can become rich
20160217 04:42:22< ancestral> celticminstrel: Shhhhhh, the secret is all in the marketing
20160217 04:42:45< celticminstrel> Well, I was going to make a PR and post it here, but Firefox is not cooperating.
20160217 04:43:40< vultraz> shadowm: I'm leaning towards A since I think it's the most efficient 
20160217 04:44:21< celticminstrel> I dunno. Given a random-access iterator, B might be more efficient.
20160217 04:44:36< celticminstrel> Though I'm not entirely sure I understand what's going on in either A or B.
20160217 04:45:02< celticminstrel> (Random-access generally means "an array or a vector".)
20160217 04:45:30< vultraz> I have a map of addon name - addon info, but currently the name is discarded after the initial setup
20160217 04:45:34< vultraz> I need a method to keep it around
20160217 04:45:42< celticminstrel> I think maps use bidirectional iterators.
20160217 04:46:09< celticminstrel> I thought you said you had a vector of addons. Was I mistaken?
20160217 04:46:36< vultraz> i did?
20160217 04:46:38< vultraz> it's a map
20160217 04:46:39< celticminstrel> I don't fully understand the situation here...
20160217 04:47:06< celticminstrel> Is A robust against sorting the listbox?
20160217 04:47:21< celticminstrel> Sounds like it wouldn't be.
20160217 04:47:39< celticminstrel> Maybe.
20160217 04:47:45< vultraz> ....ahhh
20160217 04:47:47< vultraz> yes
20160217 04:47:49< vultraz> good point
20160217 04:48:12< celticminstrel> Then B... I don't really understand what you're proposing iterating over.
20160217 04:49:07< vultraz> for some weird reason... 
20160217 04:49:16< celticminstrel> Your screenshot says "Scenerio with robots / Not installed" - is that a single label, or two labels in a grid? Is "Scenario with robots" the key you'd use to look up the addon in the map?
20160217 04:49:17< vultraz> each addon is in a config child named [campaign]
20160217 04:49:22< vultraz> shadowm: explain this
20160217 04:49:40< vultraz> celticminstrel: no no, I need "Scenario_with_robots"
20160217 04:49:55< vultraz> make_addon_title strips underscores
20160217 04:50:00< vultraz> and yes, it's two labels
20160217 04:50:10< celticminstrel> Is that all that make_addon_title does?
20160217 04:50:26< celticminstrel> Addon names aren't allowed to contain spaces, right?
20160217 04:50:57< vultraz> 	std::string ret(id);
20160217 04:50:58< vultraz> 	std::replace(ret.begin(), ret.end(), '_', ' ');
20160217 04:51:00< vultraz> 	return ret;
20160217 04:51:02< vultraz> is its implementation
20160217 04:51:04< celticminstrel> Okay.
20160217 04:51:25< vultraz> I don't understand the first line, though
20160217 04:51:33< vultraz> why ret(id) not ret = id
20160217 04:51:43< celticminstrel> It's the same thing.
20160217 04:51:54< celticminstrel> Constructor syntax instead of assignment syntax.
20160217 04:52:13< celticminstrel> So, can't you get the selected row, find the title label within that row, convert spaces back to underscores, and look up in the map? (Hang on, is that what C was?)
20160217 04:52:22< vultraz> yes that's what C was
20160217 04:52:27< celticminstrel> Hmmm.
20160217 04:52:28< vultraz> I don't really like that
20160217 04:52:40< vultraz> but again, I want shadowm to say 
20160217 04:52:41< celticminstrel> It sounded atrocious because you called it "reverse engineering".
20160217 04:52:45< celticminstrel> However, here's another option.
20160217 04:53:01< celticminstrel> Slight variant of C.
20160217 04:53:28< celticminstrel> If you use the output of make_addon_title as the key to store the addon in the map, then no reverse-engineering will be needed - just grab the name from the list row and look up in the map.
20160217 04:53:45< celticminstrel> Assuming addon names can't contain spaces.
20160217 04:54:18< vultraz> it's not that simple
20160217 04:54:31< vultraz> the map is populated in the constructor
20160217 04:54:34< vultraz> of taddon_list
20160217 04:54:57< celticminstrel> Okay, and?
20160217 04:55:15< vultraz> so it's already filled with the underscored addons
20160217 04:55:19< vultraz> addon names*
20160217 04:55:21< vultraz> which is good
20160217 04:55:48< vultraz> really, let's just wait for shadowm 
20160217 04:55:52< vultraz> since he's worked with this code before
20160217 05:00:17< celticminstrel> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/pull/603
20160217 05:00:46< vultraz> easy editing, you say?
20160217 05:00:51< celticminstrel> ?
20160217 05:00:56< celticminstrel> Oh that.
20160217 05:01:12< celticminstrel> Well, easier than retyping the whole thing.
20160217 05:01:23< vultraz> did you test that it affects the selected entry?
20160217 05:01:29< celticminstrel> ?
20160217 05:01:44< aeth> ancestral: well, in the 90s apparently some graphics cards were 3D only and you had to buy a separate 2D acceleration card
20160217 05:01:57< aeth> ancestral: So we could always just bring that back, and literally make a Wesnoth 2D coprocessor
20160217 05:02:27< aeth> We can prototype it by implementing enough of a graphics engine to run Wesnoth in an FPGA
20160217 05:02:33< celticminstrel> vultraz: What do you mean?
20160217 05:02:40< vultraz> celticminstrel: did you test that it works :P
20160217 05:02:56< celticminstrel> Yes.
20160217 05:02:57< vultraz> celticminstrel: also, shame on you for using register_integer and not setup_single_slider
20160217 05:03:10< celticminstrel> Yes, that's the bug mentioned at the end.
20160217 05:03:22< ancestral> I wonder how pixel graphics look in VR
20160217 05:03:23< vultraz> what bug?
20160217 05:03:42< celticminstrel> What I didn't realize about register_integer and register_bool is that you can't use them from the pre_show.
20160217 05:03:58< vultraz> well that sucks
20160217 05:04:04< celticminstrel> If you do, the widget's initial value won't be set properly.
20160217 05:04:14< celticminstrel> And possibly other problems.
20160217 05:04:19< vultraz> yes...
20160217 05:04:20< celticminstrel> They're supposed to be used in the constructor.
20160217 05:04:26< vultraz> so use my function
20160217 05:04:38< vultraz> setup_single_slider handles setting up the callbacks and the initial value
20160217 05:04:43< celticminstrel> Yes, like I said. I already know the cause and how to fix it.
20160217 05:04:48< celticminstrel> I just hadn't gotten around to it yet.
20160217 05:06:39< vultraz> my widget groups would probably simplify the orb stfuff
20160217 05:06:46< celticminstrel> Probably.
20160217 05:07:15< celticminstrel> Incidentally, it should be possible to add a new orb colour by just editing the WML.
20160217 05:07:20< celticminstrel> If someone wanted to, for some reason.
20160217 05:07:53< celticminstrel> I want a space between Defaults and Cancel.
20160217 05:08:10< vultraz> can i see a screenshot
20160217 05:08:16< vultraz> im working in a branch now and dont want to clone
20160217 05:08:18< vultraz> er
20160217 05:08:20< vultraz> checkout
20160217 05:08:22< vultraz> the pr
20160217 05:08:26< celticminstrel> I guess, but it'll have all-magenta orbs.
20160217 05:08:38< celticminstrel> Still want?
20160217 05:08:40< vultraz> yes
20160217 05:08:44< vultraz> i just want to see the layout
20160217 05:10:21< celticminstrel> The orb buttons themselves also could probably use a little style tweaking.
20160217 05:16:24 * vultraz waits
20160217 05:16:42< celticminstrel> Yeah, sorry, slow computer and stuff.
20160217 05:20:29< celticminstrel> http://celmin.pwcsite.com/wesnoth/SelectOrbColours.png
20160217 05:21:29< vultraz> need... tweaking, yes
20160217 05:21:40< celticminstrel> You mean the orb buttons?
20160217 05:21:46< vultraz> OK and Cancel should be right-aligned
20160217 05:21:48< vultraz> Default, left
20160217 05:21:52< celticminstrel> Yeah, like I said.
20160217 05:21:56< celticminstrel> Not sure how to do that.
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20160217 05:22:21< vultraz> give Default horizontal_alignment = "left" and grow_factor = 1
20160217 05:22:32< vultraz> other two, alignment = "right" and grow_factor = 0
20160217 05:23:34< vultraz> celticminstrel: also, "Colors" not "Colours"
20160217 05:23:59< celticminstrel> I avoided that nearly everywhere, guess I missed one.
20160217 05:24:08< vultraz> in the title :P
20160217 05:25:11< vultraz> also, yes, the buttons need tweaking
20160217 05:25:15< vultraz> this will do for now...
20160217 05:25:24< vultraz> but I'll redesign them later
20160217 05:32:34< celticminstrel> After applying your suggestions, the dialog looks... exactly the same.
20160217 05:37:29< ancestral> vultraz: Droid Sans looks pretty decent in Wesnoth, dare I say, perhaps better than Deja Vu
20160217 05:38:29< ancestral> So, the Japanese translator said, no, he doesn’t use Deja Vu
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20160217 05:45:54< shadowm> 01:36:32 <vultraz> shadowm: which method do you approve of more: A B or C?
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20160217 05:46:26< shadowm> vultraz: C sounds absurd and I'm pretty sure the reason I can't parse B is that you are misusing the term 'iterator' again.
20160217 05:46:35< shadowm> Try again perhaps.
20160217 05:46:57< shadowm> vultraz: And what do I need to explain?
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20160217 05:49:45< vultraz> shadowm: why it's still "campaign"
20160217 05:49:56< vultraz> not [addon]
20160217 05:52:31< shadowm> Because otherwise people would die.
20160217 05:54:04< vultraz> option B was...
20160217 05:54:09< vultraz> im not sure what i mant, now
20160217 05:54:11< vultraz> meant
20160217 05:55:19< vultraz> shadowm: so let's scrap the options and instead... how do you recommend I get the appropriate info for the selected addon 
20160217 05:55:39< vultraz> I have the map, but the name isn't stored anywhere
20160217 05:56:02< shadowm> And you didn't looka t the GUI1 version?
20160217 05:57:57< vultraz> I am looking
20160217 05:58:46< shadowm> The GUI1 version pushes the add-on ids into a sequence container in the same order the GUI list is constructed.
20160217 05:59:11< shadowm> This allows it to keep a 1:1 mapping of list indexes to add-on ids without any additional effort.
20160217 06:00:01< vultraz> and then is that vector sorted when you sort the list?
20160217 06:00:50< shadowm> No, because GUI1 menus always preserve their contents' order internally, even if filtering or sorting options are applied.
20160217 06:01:09< vultraz> i see
20160217 06:01:15< vultraz> gui2 doesn't do that
20160217 06:01:18< shadowm> GUI2 listboxes ought to do the same, otherwise I doubt you'd have been able to implement the Create Unit dialog at the time.
20160217 06:01:21< shadowm> Whaaaaaat.
20160217 06:01:36< vultraz> or does it?
20160217 06:01:46< vultraz> I thought there was some problem I had with this
20160217 06:01:54< vultraz> when I was writing my inventory
20160217 06:02:22< shadowm> You wrote the current version of Create Unit dialog. If _you_ don't know then there's something horribly wrong with the universe.
20160217 06:02:59< vultraz> I copied the sort functions from Game Load
20160217 06:03:53< vultraz> OK
20160217 06:03:59< vultraz> I think they do 
20160217 06:04:58< vultraz> since selection relies on a simple index lookup using get_selected_row
20160217 06:14:36< ancestral> vultraz, shadowm: http://mproud.com/wesnoth/fallback.png
20160217 06:17:22< ancestral> Basically, without a font order list, we’d lose a few things.
20160217 06:17:40< ancestral> If a Latin user played with an add-on that had CJK script, the right circle never loads, and it goes to the system (if the system supports it)
20160217 06:18:16< ancestral> If a CJK user played with an add-on that had Latin script, the left circle never loads, and it displays it in Droid Sans
20160217 06:18:58< ancestral> If a CJK user played with an add-on that had Cyrillic, it would go to the system
20160217 06:20:15< ancestral> So where this hurts is things would look a little different, because Droid Sans doesn’t look exactly the same as Deja Vu Sans, or the system default (Helvetica, Arial, Bitstream Vera Sans or whatever)
20160217 06:21:45< ancestral> And theoretically, a Latin player would not play with a CJK add-on. If they did, they don’t get it in Droid Sans, they get it in their System Default
20160217 06:24:12< ancestral> That’s the only Bad News.
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20160217 06:52:52< ancestral> I really want to re-open a bug
20160217 06:53:11< ancestral> (A wish, rather)
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20160217 08:33:06< zookeeper> memory use increases slightly every time wesnoth receives focus back after having lost it.
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20160217 08:56:27< Soliton> its ego is growing everytime you look at it.
20160217 08:57:27< zookeeper> oh, i didn't consider that. it's possible.
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20160217 09:14:05< vultraz> shadowm: ok, so it seems because of more crappy gui2 design-isms, if I don't use a multipage for the addon details section, it will constantly get resized as a result of scroll labels :|
20160217 09:14:07< vultraz> this is sad
20160217 09:15:03< iceiceice> yeah the scroll labels are crap
20160217 09:15:08< iceiceice> they ruined the lua interpreter also :(
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20160217 09:15:49< vultraz> but scroll labels are the only way to force a widget resize :|
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20160217 09:16:58< vultraz> I'm going to open a high-priority bug for this
20160217 09:17:04< vultraz> the label thing, that is
20160217 09:17:11< vultraz> it's gone unfixed too long
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20160217 09:31:29< fabi> vultraz: Whom do you assign the bug to?
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20160217 09:55:44< Aginor> maybe it would be good to have a few sessions where we go through the issue tracker and see what in it is still relevant too
20160217 10:00:48< Aginor> although how to do that in a practical fashion isn't entirely obvious
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20160217 10:45:11< vultraz> Aginor: true, true
20160217 10:45:29< vultraz> Aginor: that would have to be done in any case if we eventually move to GH's tracker
20160217 10:46:14< vultraz> fabi: gfgtdf
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20160217 10:55:36-!- Topic for #wesnoth-dev: Wesnoth Developers Channel | >>> Want to help? Go here: http://r.wesnoth.org/t42911 (and thanks!) <<< | Logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Bug tracker: http://bugs.wesnoth.org
20160217 10:55:36-!- Topic set by shadowm [~ignacio@wesnoth/developer/shadowm] [Sun Jan 17 05:24:23 2016]
20160217 10:55:36[Users #wesnoth-dev]
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20160217 16:43:19< celticminstrel> vultraz: Why did you call the class tpreferences but the file preferences_dialog... :|
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20160217 16:53:40< vultraz> celticminstrel: shadowm named the file that because we already have a preferences.cpp in src/ and didn't want naming conflicts
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20160217 17:15:16< celticminstrel> Clicking "defaults" followed by "cancel" currently saves the defaults rather than reverting to what was set before.
20160217 17:16:07< celticminstrel> Oh, wait, I can get the defaults from game_config...
20160217 17:17:09< celticminstrel> That should fix it.
20160217 17:18:52< vultraz> hm
20160217 17:19:01< vultraz> wesnoth crashes if you try to place a unit in the editor
20160217 17:19:04< vultraz> t'is bad
20160217 17:19:27< vultraz> "Unhandled exception at 0x00CD4AD6 in wesnoth.exe: 0xC0000005: Access violation reading location 0x00000020."
20160217 17:19:32< vultraz> according to MSVC
20160217 17:19:35< vultraz> dunno what that means
20160217 17:19:46< celticminstrel> I'll try that out in a second.
20160217 17:20:44< celticminstrel> Oh, wait, access violation, so it's not a C++ exception.
20160217 17:21:12< celticminstrel> I'll try it out anyway, but it might not trigger on OSX.
20160217 17:21:27< vultraz> what is an access violation?
20160217 17:21:30< celticminstrel> (Might not even trigger on MSVC with a non-debug build.)
20160217 17:21:39< celticminstrel> It's when you try to read memory that is uninitialized.
20160217 17:21:45< celticminstrel> No, that's not quite right.
20160217 17:21:51< celticminstrel> Memory that hasn't been assigned to your program.
20160217 17:22:29< celticminstrel> If you try to read past the end of an array, that's an access violation (if you're lucky).
20160217 17:25:08< celticminstrel> assert(next_id_ < unit_id::highest_bit) -- unit_id.cpp, line 32
20160217 17:26:04< celticminstrel> The only pointer access there is next_id_ (which is implicitly this->next_id_, where "this" is a pointer)...
20160217 17:26:50< celticminstrel> So for some reason, the ID manager is invalid or something?
20160217 17:27:07< celticminstrel> Called from unit.cpp, line 2338.
20160217 17:27:27< celticminstrel> Which is called from unit.cpp, line 696.
20160217 17:27:35< celticminstrel> set_underlying_id(resources::gameboard->unit_id_manager());
20160217 17:27:47< vultraz> how do you debug so fast o_O
20160217 17:27:58< celticminstrel> So, could it be that resources::gameboard is not initialized?
20160217 17:28:07< celticminstrel> Uhh, I use XCode's debugger?
20160217 17:28:18< celticminstrel> MSVC has one too, it should be about this easy to use.
20160217 17:28:28< vultraz> right.
20160217 17:28:36< vultraz> I usually just do this stuff manually :P
20160217 17:28:50< vultraz> or the CB debugger
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20160217 17:29:20< celticminstrel> MSVC's debugger is pretty good, but XCode still has a minor advantage - I can switch between GUI and command-line access to the debugger.
20160217 17:29:57< celticminstrel> Indeed, resources::gameboard is null.
20160217 17:30:04< celticminstrel> So that's the cause.
20160217 17:30:29< vultraz> hm
20160217 17:30:38< vultraz> ok, so the gameboard should be initialized somewhere
20160217 17:31:41< vultraz> but where
20160217 17:32:05< vultraz> probably when initializing the editor
20160217 17:32:35< celticminstrel> Alright, PR updated. Once I figure out the issue with the Default/Cancel/OK buttons and also have someone verify that orb selection works right, it can be merged.
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20160217 17:34:31< vultraz> celticminstrel: oh, yeah, add horizontal_grow = "true" right after line 89
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20160217 17:35:17< celticminstrel> I should probably also rebase a little.
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20160217 17:39:48< celticminstrel> All the commits I just pushed should probably be squahed into one of the other commits.
20160217 17:39:52< celticminstrel> ^squashed
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20160217 18:01:41< celticminstrel> vultraz: That worked!
20160217 18:02:01< vultraz> :D
20160217 18:03:04< vultraz> see, the logic here is this:
20160217 18:03:13< vultraz> the outer column grows to fit the space
20160217 18:03:26< vultraz> then the three child columns do *not* grow
20160217 18:03:37< vultraz> they're aligned on different sides
20160217 18:04:27< vultraz> the grow_factor = 1 key in the Defaults column ensures that that column, though, will expand enough to allow the other columns to move to the right
20160217 18:04:50< vultraz> if they all had 1-value grow factors, they would all be equally placed 
20160217 18:04:53< vultraz> (I think)
20160217 18:07:15< celticminstrel> Now I just need to wait until someone tests the orbs.
20160217 18:07:26< celticminstrel> I can't tell if it all works, since everything is magenta here.
20160217 18:09:26< vultraz> i'll test
20160217 18:09:50< celticminstrel> I wouldn't mind shadowm reviewing it too, if he has the time.
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20160217 18:11:24< celticminstrel> ...uh... so, I'm on the github notifications page and it says "No new notifications"... but the little bell at the top has a blue dot indicating there are notifications... :S
20160217 18:13:41< celticminstrel> And now it's gone. Weird.
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20160217 18:21:12< vultraz> celticminstrel: for me... they're all BLACK | O_O | 
20160217 18:22:06< celticminstrel> ?
20160217 18:23:17< vultraz> the orbs
20160217 18:23:21< vultraz> in the dialog
20160217 18:23:25< vultraz> they're all black!
20160217 18:23:27< celticminstrel> :(
20160217 18:24:43< vultraz> also, you should out a padding row before the font scaling slider
20160217 18:24:46< vultraz> or maybe move it to advanced
20160217 18:24:58< celticminstrel> shadowm said it should be in display.
20160217 18:25:36< vultraz> ok
20160217 18:25:40< vultraz> well uh
20160217 18:25:44< vultraz> something about it looks weird
20160217 18:26:08< celticminstrel> Maybe it kind of looks like it belongs with the above slider? (Which isn't the case.)
20160217 18:26:14< vultraz> yeah
20160217 18:26:32< vultraz> also, serious bug
20160217 18:26:42< celticminstrel> Uh-oh.
20160217 18:26:47< vultraz> if you drag the slider to the right, the text in the dialog will increase size
20160217 18:27:02< vultraz> if to drag it to the right, only the label showing the size will
20160217 18:27:20< celticminstrel> Really? That didn't happen for me, but then I didn't test it out when I switched it to setup_single_slider.
20160217 18:27:30< vultraz> yes
20160217 18:27:45< celticminstrel> With register_integer the size didn't update until the dialog was closed, which is probably better.
20160217 18:28:07< celticminstrel> Actually, come to think of it, I wonder if that'd be good for changing the resolution, too...
20160217 18:28:15< vultraz> no no no
20160217 18:28:26< celticminstrel> ...actually... what we really need for that is a return value that says "close the dialog and then reopen it".
20160217 18:28:39< celticminstrel> Probably.
20160217 18:29:19< celticminstrel> Anyway, text size probably shouldn't update while you're dragging the slider. 
20160217 18:29:33< celticminstrel> I guess there's more work to be done on this still. :/
20160217 18:29:35< vultraz> thing is, it only updates within the dialog
20160217 18:29:49< celticminstrel> BTW, do the orbs look right if you start a game, or are the all black there too?
20160217 18:30:03< celticminstrel> Of course, because only the dialog is redrawn.
20160217 18:30:12< celticminstrel> ^they
20160217 18:30:20< vultraz> orbs are fine in-game and always have
20160217 18:30:28< celticminstrel> You did check, right?
20160217 18:30:49< celticminstrel> I just want to make sure I didn't break that somehow.
20160217 18:31:01< vultraz> yes
20160217 18:39:14< vultraz> celticminstrel: btw, the orb dialog doesn't have any selected when you open it
20160217 18:39:17< vultraz> except for one, I think
20160217 18:39:21< vultraz> under ally
20160217 18:39:31< vultraz> er
20160217 18:39:33< vultraz> hm
20160217 18:39:41< vultraz> ok, apparently there's nothing selected until you select one
20160217 18:39:44< celticminstrel> That's probably because I changed the colour names.
20160217 18:39:58< celticminstrel> And you already have chosen colours set in your preferences, which reference colours that no longer exist.
20160217 18:40:33< vultraz> yes, but the getter functions should return the default colors nonetheless
20160217 18:40:51< vultraz> I added a getter function with a string default recently
20160217 18:40:57< vultraz> pref getter function*
20160217 18:41:00< celticminstrel> I thought about making the getter function strip of the orb_\d? prefix if present.
20160217 18:41:04< celticminstrel> ^strip off
20160217 18:41:49< celticminstrel> Do you think I should do that? I thought if orb selection isn't already in a stable release, it just might not matter. (It's not in 1.12, is it? I don't recall seeing it, but I might not have looked.)
20160217 18:42:47< vultraz> no it's not
20160217 18:42:52< vultraz> but that's not my point
20160217 18:43:07< vultraz> there should be the "standard" orb settings a palette 
20160217 18:43:26< celticminstrel> Yes, there are.
20160217 18:43:30< zookeeper> weird. i figured that a low-hanging fruit might be to make mask_surface() return the original surface if the masking operation didn't actually change anything. it does produce a notable decrease in memory use, but CPU use jumps up massively.
20160217 18:43:34< vultraz> but the dialog does not reflect that
20160217 18:43:37< vultraz> new key or not
20160217 18:43:40< vultraz> if it looks for the key
20160217 18:43:44< vultraz> does not find the key
20160217 18:43:48< celticminstrel> It reflects that when you click Defaults.
20160217 18:43:48< vultraz> it should return the default
20160217 18:43:58< vultraz> .....
20160217 18:44:00< vultraz> Yes
20160217 18:44:01< celticminstrel> I think what's happening for you is that it finds the key, but it has an invalid value.
20160217 18:44:01< vultraz> BUT
20160217 18:44:23< vultraz> *it should reflect that at dialog creation if it cannot find the key in preferences*
20160217 18:44:26< vultraz> do you see what I'm saying
20160217 18:44:27< celticminstrel> I changed the color names, not the pref names.
20160217 18:44:38< celticminstrel> Yes, it will reflect that at dialog creation if the key is not in prefs.
20160217 18:44:49< vultraz> when you launch a clean install of wesnoth 
20160217 18:44:52< vultraz> it should show the defaults
20160217 18:44:55< vultraz> off the bat
20160217 18:45:01< celticminstrel> But if the key is present with an invalid value, it won't know what to do.
20160217 18:45:26< celticminstrel> I know what you're saying, and it will do that.
20160217 18:45:32< vultraz> (btw, I suppose its worth noting the dialog DOES set the orb colors and the changes do appear in game0
20160217 18:45:41< vultraz> just that the dialog shows them all black
20160217 18:45:42< celticminstrel> That is very much worth saying.
20160217 18:45:47< celticminstrel> Noting, whatever.
20160217 18:46:20< vultraz> also
20160217 18:46:32< celticminstrel> So the problem is likely in the button definition.
20160217 18:46:38< vultraz> you should not be able to select any orbs when their checkbox is unchecked
20160217 18:46:49< celticminstrel> Look up to the title.
20160217 18:47:10< vultraz> ah, minimap colors
20160217 18:47:39< celticminstrel> If I'm not mistaken, these colours are used on the minimap (in a certain mode) regardless of whether the orb is shown, so because of that I figured I should probably not disable them when the checkbox is unchecked.
20160217 18:47:52< celticminstrel> It should be simple to change, if others disagree.
20160217 18:48:30< celticminstrel> (Or if I'm mistaken.)
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20160217 19:03:56< gfgtdf> vultraz: when the read_file lua api is merge i might want to remove  map_file in [replacemap] and [terrainmask]. The point is that afaik map_file was made to make savefiles smaller, but it migzht OOS in mp. If i make them OOS save then this means that the map data will be stored in replays which are also part of saves so it will make the mapfiles larger again (after the turn where the...
20160217 19:03:58< gfgtdf> ...replacemanp happened). I really think the best way to have it is to only support a simple map_data attribute, and if wml authors think they need some optimisations, they can stil use read_file together with map_data, and then they can choose on their own whether they want to sync it with wesnoth.sync_choice or not.
20160217 19:05:01< vultraz> hmm
20160217 19:05:37< vultraz> i guess it's worth averting OOS at the cost of having to use lua
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20160217 21:24:02< mattsc> celticminstrel: just FYI, as a follow-up from yesterday:  https://wiki.wesnoth.org/Lua_AI_Howto#Using_the_Lua_Stage
20160217 21:24:35< celticminstrel> Something you just wrote, or...?
20160217 21:24:38< mattsc> That’s a section I wrote at some point, and I am very sure that I did not write that without testing that it works.
20160217 21:24:46< celticminstrel> Ah.
20160217 21:25:14< celticminstrel> That implies you can choose whatever name/ID you want...
20160217 21:25:26< mattsc> However, there’s nothing you can do with that stage that you cannot do (and more convenient, IMO) with the main_loop stage.
20160217 21:25:28< mattsc> yes
20160217 21:25:57< mattsc> The id only matters if you want to remove the stage during a scenario
20160217 21:26:08< celticminstrel> Well, I think it makes sense to leave the option open, in case someone wants to try something completely different, but yeah, normally you're going to be writing Lua candidate actions and stuff instead.
20160217 21:26:09< mattsc> and the name probably doesn’t matter at all for this
20160217 21:26:32< mattsc> How would this be completely different from using a single Lua CA?
20160217 21:27:25< celticminstrel> I didn't think of that... I suppose that if you remove all default CAs and replace them with a single Lua CA, you could do something completely different...
20160217 21:27:38< celticminstrel> I dunno how much work the main_loop actually does.
20160217 21:27:50< mattsc> I guess I could think up some border cases in which it could be slightly different, but I am not sure if it’s worth keeping lots of code around just for that
20160217 21:27:59< celticminstrel> If all it does is evaluate candidate actions, then maybe you're right.
20160217 21:28:48< mattsc> yes, that is what the main_loop stage does; and all it does
20160217 21:29:26< mattsc> and you could do what you describe even without removing the default CAs
20160217 21:29:39< mattsc> you just add CAs that have higher eval scores
20160217 21:29:44< celticminstrel> Well, if you didn't remove the default CAs, it wouldn't be "something completely different".
20160217 21:30:08< mattsc> it could be as far as AI behavior is concerned
20160217 21:30:22< celticminstrel> It only evaluates one CA each time?
20160217 21:30:35< celticminstrel> Or, executes one I guess is the way to say this.
20160217 21:30:47< celticminstrel> Since CAs have separate evaluate and execute.
20160217 21:31:05< mattsc> No, it evaluates all of them (actually, technically that’s not true either, but for this explanation you can assume so)
20160217 21:31:13< mattsc> yes — what you write next is what happens
20160217 21:31:29< mattsc> It evaluates all of them, and executes that with the highest score.
20160217 21:31:41< celticminstrel> The highest score that evaluated successfully, right?
20160217 21:32:08< mattsc> Well, kind of, yes; not usccessfully evaluated results in score = 0
20160217 21:33:08< mattsc> So I could set up 2 CAs; one that does something completely different, and one that removes moves and attacks from all units
20160217 21:33:11< mattsc> I givethe first score 300,001, and the second 300,000
20160217 21:33:27< celticminstrel> Oh, so evaluation produces the score.
20160217 21:34:07< celticminstrel> Then the score could also dynamically vary based on game state, right?
20160217 21:35:00< mattsc> The highest score of the default AI is 200,000
20160217 21:35:00< mattsc> Thus, I’ll get completely different behavior without having to remove the default AI.
20160217 21:35:01< mattsc> yes
20160217 21:35:01< mattsc> The evaluation _which_ move to do can happen either in the eval or the exec function, that doesn’t matter
20160217 21:35:01< mattsc> absolutely
20160217 21:35:01< mattsc> the default AI CAs don’t do that, but a lot of my own AIs do
20160217 21:39:46< mattsc> I’m in the process of overhauling the entire AI documentation.
20160217 21:39:52< mattsc> I don’t know if everything will be clear to others reading it then, but it should at least be clear*er*.
20160217 21:40:14< mattsc> It’s still going to take me a little, but I am making progress.
20160217 21:43:02< celticminstrel> It looks like a [stage] tag interprets its contents differently based on what type of stage it is.
20160217 21:43:33< celticminstrel> For example, the main_loop stage contains ]candidate_action]s, while the recruitment stage contains [limit]s.
20160217 21:44:24< celticminstrel> When I was looking at the AI using the inspector, I saw a few things whose purpose I didn't understand.
20160217 21:45:47< mattsc> celticminstrel: the first two statements are correct
20160217 21:45:59< mattsc> as for the third, anything you want me to explain?
20160217 21:46:36< celticminstrel> I think most of them looked like internal-use type stuff - there was [engine][data], [stage]enabled=, [stage]type=, and [stage][state].
20160217 21:46:52< celticminstrel> Ah, sorry, those are [candidate_action], not [stage].
20160217 21:47:15< celticminstrel> This list I put together has [candidate_action] listed under the [stage] heading, so I got confused for a moment there.
20160217 21:47:26< mattsc> celticminstrel: if you give me a couple days, this page will explain all that:  https://wiki.wesnoth.org/Wesnoth_AI_Framework
20160217 21:47:37< celticminstrel> Okay.
20160217 21:47:38< mattsc> At the moment, I am not there yet
20160217 21:48:18< celticminstrel> Are they something that scenario-designers might want to use sometimes, then?
20160217 21:49:01< mattsc> Probably not, unles they want to write their own AIs
20160217 21:49:19< celticminstrel> Well, I suppose there might be the occasional one who does... >_>
20160217 21:49:56< mattsc> So I am currently trying to split up the content in some sort of logical way into parts that are useful to scenario designers who “just” want to tweak AI behavior a little, and people who actually want to create their own AIs
20160217 21:50:36< celticminstrel> BTW, if you feel like looking at the list in question, I just put it up at http://celmin.pwcsite.com/wesnoth/ai-overview.txt
20160217 21:50:52< celticminstrel> I made that while working on that syntax thing I already showed you.
20160217 21:50:53< mattsc> You can look at the recent changes on the wiki if you want to get a feeling for what I am trying to do, but to be honest, unless it is urgent I’d tell you to wait until I am done
20160217 21:51:11< celticminstrel> I guess I'll wait, then.
20160217 21:52:47< mattsc> celticminstrel: that’s cool!  Pretty much all of that is on the wiki somewhere already, but until a few days ago it was jarbled all over the place.
20160217 21:53:02< mattsc> As of today, it is half organized and half jarbled.
20160217 21:53:12< celticminstrel> Yeah, I scraped some of it together from the wiki and the rest from looking at AI definitions in the inspector window.
20160217 21:53:30< mattsc> I bookmarked that list and will make sure that all of it is covered when I am done.
20160217 21:54:33< mattsc> That’s pretty much how I did it when I got started with playing with the AI; plus going through the C++ code (which you’ve also done, I think)
20160217 21:54:44< mattsc> But unlike me, you actually know C++  :)
20160217 21:55:12< celticminstrel> I went through some of the C++ code... mainly just the stuff related to loading data from the config.
20160217 21:57:14< mattsc> celticminstrel: just as a final comment before I go back to work, the reason why I am suggesting getting rid of a lot of the garbage in the AI code is not really because I care personally; I’ve figured out how to do things by now
20160217 21:57:45< mattsc> But it’s really a huge learning curve to overcome, and as shadowm said yesterday, there’s nobody who can maintain the code at the moment.
20160217 21:58:17< mattsc> If we get rid of a lot of the legacy code, it should get much easier for somebody new to get up to speed.
20160217 21:58:39< mattsc> And I really don’t see why we need to keep 5 methods of doing the same thing around.
20160217 21:58:59< celticminstrel> There's all that stuff in data/ai/formula which maybe should be ported to Lua if FormulaAI is dropped. I don't really know if that stuff is used anywhere though.
20160217 21:59:06< celticminstrel> Maybe it's just examples?
20160217 21:59:36< celticminstrel> Maybe you've already done that, even.
20160217 22:00:20< mattsc> I’d throw that out without looking back.  It’s examples that, for the most part, are barely functional.
20160217 22:00:58< mattsc> And if somebody says they really need any of it, I’d be happy to port them into a Micro AI.
20160217 22:01:32< celticminstrel> There's formula/patrol.fai and then there's lua/patrol.lua, so at least one is already accounted for.
20160217 22:01:44< mattsc> As I said, I am generally on board with zookeeper about keeping backward compatibility, but within reason
20160217 22:02:06< mattsc> And then there’s a patrol Micro AI which is vastly superior to both of those ...
20160217 22:02:12< mattsc> (last time I looked, at least)
20160217 22:02:25< celticminstrel> So patrol.lua is obsolete?
20160217 22:03:06-!- wedge010 [~Thunderbi@60-241-236-92.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160217 22:03:34< mattsc> yes: https://wiki.wesnoth.org/Micro_AIs#Patrol_Micro_AI_.28ai_type.3Dpatrol.29
20160217 22:04:21< celticminstrel> The formula engine does have one feature that's quite nice - the where clauses. But, I guess in Lua you'd do that by assigning it to a variable, then using the variable, so it's not an argument for retaining FormulaAI.
20160217 22:05:02< mattsc> celticminstrel: right, a variable or a function
20160217 22:05:14< celticminstrel> What is the stuff in data/ai/lua, anyway?
20160217 22:05:33< mattsc> celticminstrel: the one reason I can see for retaining Formula AI is that it is the Wesnoth team’s own creation
20160217 22:06:04< mattsc> I know some people are sentimental about that, and I understand that, but ...
20160217 22:06:16< celticminstrel> Well, the formula engine isn't going anywhere.
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20160217 22:06:35< celticminstrel> It's also used by GUI2, and I used it for the movetype patching as well.
20160217 22:06:56< mattsc> ai_helper and battle_calcs are utility libraries
20160217 22:07:01< celticminstrel> You'd have to drop GUI2 before you could drop the formula engine, and at the moment it's highly unlikely that GUI2 is going anywhere either.
20160217 22:07:15< vultraz> wait, the (1+1) stuff you mean?
20160217 22:07:20< celticminstrel> Yeah.
20160217 22:07:29< celticminstrel> That's the same formula engine as FormulaAI.
20160217 22:07:50< mattsc> generic_*_engine.lua are actually AIs, or parts of AIs, that are in mainline.  E.g. the Experimental AI.
20160217 22:07:58 * vultraz groans
20160217 22:08:02< celticminstrel> ...what?
20160217 22:08:08< celticminstrel> Why are you groaning?
20160217 22:08:11< mattsc> Other stuff is either examples or testing code
20160217 22:08:12< vultraz> our UI code using AI code :|
20160217 22:08:19< celticminstrel> It's not AI code.
20160217 22:08:41-!- louis94 [~~louis94@91.178.241.43] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160217 22:08:54< celticminstrel> It's just a formula engine.
20160217 22:08:58< mattsc> celticminstrel: yes, I am not suggesting to drop the Formula engine itself, only its use in the AI.
20160217 22:09:09< celticminstrel> Right.
20160217 22:09:24< celticminstrel> stdlib.lua doesn't sound like an example.
20160217 22:10:13< mattsc> ah, yes, that provides all the tags to the ‘ai’ table
20160217 22:10:24< vultraz> oh, ok
20160217 22:10:29< vultraz> that's a lot better
20160217 22:10:43< mattsc> you don’t need to include that manually any more, but I don’t remember whether whether that file is still needed or not
20160217 22:11:21< mattsc> the problem with some of the AI code is that it’s a collection of patchwork from different people working on it for a few weeks or months at a time and then disappearing
20160217 22:11:32< mattsc> Somebody should really clean all that up.  :P
20160217 22:11:41< celticminstrel> Well, it's not included by either ai_helper or battle_calcs.
20160217 22:12:02< mattsc> No, that I could have told you without looking (because I wrote the latter two)
20160217 22:12:11< celticminstrel> vultraz: When calling into the formula engine you can provide a symbol table containing functions; the AI engine does that with a large number of extra functions.
20160217 22:12:25 * celticminstrel isn't sure if the core functions are automatically available, but would expect so.
20160217 22:12:35< vultraz> what does it do that for?
20160217 22:12:35< celticminstrel> mattsc: Heh.
20160217 22:13:59< celticminstrel> Because FormulaAI provides a lot of AI-related functions?
20160217 22:14:30< mattsc> vultraz: https://wiki.wesnoth.org/FormulaAI_Functions
20160217 22:16:24< mattsc> celticminstrel: stdlib.lua is included by dummy_engine_lua.lua and that engine is needed by the external Lua CAs.
20160217 22:17:09< celticminstrel> Ah.
20160217 22:17:35< vultraz> mattsc: so I haven't been following- are you cleaning up the ai syntax or the wiki?
20160217 22:18:17< mattsc> That’s how … whatshisname Dmitry set it up a couple years ago.
20160217 22:18:36< mattsc> So yes, there is actually useful and needed stuff in ai/lua
20160217 22:18:47< mattsc> I’m not sure if that is true about ai/formula
20160217 22:19:01< mattsc> vultraz: I am currently cleaning up the wiki
20160217 22:19:24< mattsc> but just for fun on the side, we’ve also been talking about what could be done about the AI code
20160217 22:21:14< mattsc> nephro — that’s his nick …
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20160217 22:30:54< mattsc> Huh, funny.  LoW actually uses patrol.fai.
20160217 22:31:14< mattsc> It does have its own copy inside the campaign directory.
20160217 22:31:29< celticminstrel> It could be changed to use the microAI though.
20160217 22:31:38< mattsc> An it would be easy to replace by something written in Lua;
20160217 22:31:49< mattsc> Yes, that shouldn’t be a problem.
20160217 22:31:49< celticminstrel> Is that sort of thing supposed to be left to individual campaign managers?
20160217 22:32:19< mattsc> The only thing I’d have to check is exactly how the one in LoW works, and whether that needs any additions to the MAI.
20160217 22:32:32< vultraz> zookeeper: could you look over 604 when you have the chance?
20160217 22:33:01< mattsc> Well, I think if you and I decided to get rid of the FAI AI frontend, it would be our responsibility to change the campaign code.
20160217 22:33:17< mattsc> or backend, actually
20160217 22:34:50< mattsc> celticminstrel, vultraz: one thing I could do still during 1.13 is to clean up all the crap in data/ai that’s broken, not needed or otherwise useless
20160217 22:34:59< vultraz> :D
20160217 22:35:01< vultraz> please do
20160217 22:35:21< mattsc> Getting rid of some (or all) of the debug AIs would be on that list
20160217 22:35:31< mattsc> and renaming the so-called Strong AI ...
20160217 22:35:56< celticminstrel> vultraz: What did I still need to do in PR603, again?
20160217 22:36:13< celticminstrel> Orbs were black, I remember, but I think you said something else too.
20160217 22:38:33< vultraz> celticminstrel: it should show the default configuration if nothing has changed
20160217 22:39:24< celticminstrel> It already does that.
20160217 22:39:50< celticminstrel> But I know what you're referring to.
20160217 22:41:37< vultraz> when I opened the dialog initially, nothing was selected
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20160217 22:48:01< SigurdFD> mattsc: if you do clean up debug ai's, please put default RCA at top of list when debug is active.
20160217 22:49:17< mattsc> SigurdFD: okay, I’ll look into that; I actually do not know off hand how that order is determined
20160217 22:49:35< mattsc> I think mostly we can just get rid of those debug AIs
20160217 22:50:48< celticminstrel> I don't know for sure, either; but it wouldn't surprise me if it's based on the order in which they're loaded, which probably means debug ones come before RCA because D comes before R.
20160217 22:51:05< celticminstrel> Or it could be based on alphabetical order of the name. I dunno.
20160217 22:52:21< mattsc> celticminstrel: well, the debug AIs are loaded from data/core/_main.cfg, and the default ones from data/_main.cfg, so if loading order matters, that probably determines that
20160217 22:52:39< SigurdFD> not sure what causes the order, though the c++ Akihara is at the top with debug, and it does nothing.
20160217 22:53:05< SigurdFD> oh, that sounds like something I could make a pull request for
20160217 22:53:20< celticminstrel> The akihara one was something to do with recruiting, wasn't it?
20160217 22:53:51< mattsc> SigurdFD: I’ve added it to my AIs, so I’ll look into it.  Oh, unless you want to make a PR, that’s even better.  ;)
20160217 22:54:02< mattsc> AI = action item in this case  :P
20160217 22:54:06< celticminstrel> Heh.
20160217 22:54:09< celticminstrel> I was wondering.
20160217 22:54:10< mattsc> celticminstrel: yes
20160217 22:55:11< mattsc> Lots of people start with recruiting, as that is arguably the easiest thing to get a feel for how to do AI stuff (because it can be done separated from everything else)
20160217 22:55:46< mattsc> But there’s only two bits of AI work that actually were an improvement, IIRC:
20160217 22:56:13< mattsc> flixx’s new recruitment stage and aspect, and Alarantalara’s generic recruit engine
20160217 22:56:28< mattsc> If you ask me, I’d throw out all the other ones
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20160217 22:57:07< mattsc> s/AI work/recruitment AI work
20160217 22:59:48< shadowm> vultraz: FOR THE LAST TIME WE WON'T MOVE TO GITHUB'S TRACKER BECAUSE IT DOESN'T SUPPORT ATTACHMENTS OF ARBITRARY TYPES.
20160217 23:00:19< shadowm> This is definitely at least the 4th time I tell you this over the past few years.
20160217 23:00:32< celticminstrel> So the akihara one is in fact worthless?
20160217 23:00:33< vultraz> shadowm: yes I KNOW THAT, BUT THE POSSIBILITY MUST BE KEPT OPEN IN CASE THEY DO ADD SUCH A THING!
20160217 23:00:35< SigurdFD> the ais seem to be listed in alphabetical order by id, if I change the id for Akihara, it'll not be at the top anymore.
20160217 23:00:46< shadowm> vultraz: No, it "must not" be kept open.
20160217 23:00:55< shadowm> And that's not for you to decide.
20160217 23:01:22< SigurdFD> many times I've tested under debug, to find I've accidently left akihara on, and watch it recruit nothing.
20160217 23:01:23< celticminstrel> Was that intentional or accidental caps lock... no, don't tell me, I don't really need to know.
20160217 23:01:24< shadowm> I want a tracker hosted on wesnoth.org so we can look into using forum accounts for it instead of forcing people to register accounts on GitHUB.
20160217 23:01:32< shadowm> *GitHub
20160217 23:01:36< celticminstrel> Oh, that would be nice.
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20160217 23:01:43< mattsc> celticminstrel: I don’t remember the details, whether akihara pulled out before the end of the project, or whether it never got done for other reasons, but I am quite sure that it is unfinished; and it is defintiely not better than other things we have
20160217 23:01:47< celticminstrel> You'd probably also accept .patch files and stuff, right?
20160217 23:01:52< vultraz> good luck making that happen
20160217 23:02:22< shadowm> vultraz: Good luck making Steam happen too.
20160217 23:02:28< shadowm> Mr. Optimistic.
20160217 23:03:03< shadowm> Also, you probably haven't realized that GitHub's issue tracker is not a 1:1 match for Gna.org's.
20160217 23:03:30< vultraz> but for the love of god, I am *acutely* aware of the reason we can't use GH's tracker now.
20160217 23:03:47< shadowm> It only has tags. There are no priorities or categories or severities.
20160217 23:04:09< shadowm> "But tags could be used the same way". Well, I'd love to hear that from one of you people who never seem to use tags!
20160217 23:04:41< celticminstrel> Firefox, why are you not filling in my password.
20160217 23:04:42< shadowm> vultraz: If you are so aware then stop mentioning it as a sure possibility.
20160217 23:05:20< shadowm> I don't go around promising people that we'll have support for 4D holographic desktop environments by the end of the year either.
20160217 23:05:31< vultraz> I NEVER SAID THAT FFS
20160217 23:05:57< vultraz> Stop putting words in my mouth
20160217 23:06:09< celticminstrel> What. XD
20160217 23:07:13< shadowm> 20160216 15:57:24< vultraz> well, when we add ogl support we won't have to use blitting
20160217 23:07:19< shadowm> 20160216 16:09:24< vultraz> Yes. We will have some initial work done by the end of the year.
20160217 23:07:32< shadowm> ^ Implying it as a certain thing that will be done no matter what.
20160217 23:07:55< SigurdFD> mattsc: any issues with a pr changing id=ai_akihara to ai_dev_akihara, so it'll be off the top of the debug list?
20160217 23:07:56< vultraz> It's not certain but it's probable that we'll have SOMETHING
20160217 23:08:17< shadowm> Your wording did not specify a probability less than 100%.
20160217 23:08:42< shadowm> "will have" vs "may have"/"hopefully will have"/"potentially will have"/etc.
20160217 23:08:48< celticminstrel> I'd be surprise if there were absolutely zero progress on OpenGL support by next December 31.
20160217 23:08:57< celticminstrel> ^+d
20160217 23:09:03< vultraz> I'm aiming for a probability of no less than 100% for SOMETHING
20160217 23:09:07< celticminstrel> But I could be surprised.
20160217 23:09:16< vultraz> Even if I have to learn OGL handling myself
20160217 23:09:23< celticminstrel> I really don't recommend that.
20160217 23:09:34< shadowm> Once we go OpenGL it has to be all or nothing, I'm afraid
20160217 23:09:59< shadowm> It's simply not compatible with the gradual transition approach, which is where most of the difficulty lies.
20160217 23:10:14< mattsc> SigurdFD: no issues, I don’t mind one way or the other; but as I said, there’s a good chance that I’ll just remove it altogether at some point anyway, so up to you whether you want to wait for that or not
20160217 23:10:21< SigurdFD> ok
20160217 23:10:27< shadowm> Especially since our foundations are designed around a completely different platform.
20160217 23:10:36< celticminstrel> Huh?
20160217 23:10:40< celticminstrel> What do you mean?
20160217 23:10:49< shadowm> Software rendering vs. GPU rendering.
20160217 23:10:54< celticminstrel> Oh, okay.
20160217 23:11:24< celticminstrel> "Some progress" could mean "there is a branch which is working on it".
20160217 23:12:49< vultraz> If you think we can host our own bug tracker with a modern and user-friendly interface on our own servers with forum registration support, there's no reason we can't get OGL support working
20160217 23:13:35< celticminstrel> Hosting a bug-tracker is probably easier than getting OGL working.
20160217 23:14:00< shadowm> vultraz: Sorry but I don't care about "modern" or "user-friendly" in this case.
20160217 23:14:03< celticminstrel> You just need to find good bug-tracking software, install it on the server, transfer the old bugs, and keep maintaining it. Or something like that.
20160217 23:14:20< shadowm> I do have my standards but I'm not one to follow fads either.
20160217 23:14:37< vultraz> shadowm: you care about not making people register on github but not about then making the interface simple to use?
20160217 23:14:41< celticminstrel> That probably does make it sound simpler than it is, but still.
20160217 23:15:00-!- ancestral [~ancestral@63.92.240.233] has quit [Quit: i go nstuf kthxbai]
20160217 23:15:49< shadowm> I'm shutting down wesnoth.org, don't panic.
20160217 23:16:25 * celticminstrel panics. :P
20160217 23:16:48< mattsc> celticminstrel forgot his towel
20160217 23:16:53< celticminstrel> XD
20160217 23:17:54< shadowm> And back.
20160217 23:25:20< shadowm> Re tpreferences in preferences_dialog.hpp, we use a lot of confusing and overlapping -I flags.
20160217 23:25:38< shadowm> I'd rather know what file I'm including without asking the compiler first.
20160217 23:27:57< SigurdFD> mattsc: I decided not to wait. :D
20160217 23:30:58< mattsc> SigurdFD: I saw (I get email notifications).  :)  I’ll check it out tonight after work.  (It should take more than a couple minutes but I really need to get something else done first.)
20160217 23:31:09< mattsc> s/should/shoudn’t
20160217 23:35:59< SigurdFD> ok
20160217 23:39:38< shadowm> The add-ons server is going down now too.
20160217 23:40:04< shadowm> Wait, hang on, I forgot to rebuild one instance.
20160217 23:41:52< shadowm> Okay, it should be back now.
20160217 23:45:10< shadowm> The 1.13.x and trunk/testing add-ons servers are now running with SDL 2, by the way.
20160217 23:45:51< shadowm> But I don't think the SDL 2 version of SDL_net actually has meaningful differences compared to the 1.2 version so it probably doesn't matter.
20160217 23:46:40< shadowm> (Last time I checked the only thing it uses from SDL anyway is a few typedefs in lieu of C99's integer types, and some miscellaneous utility macros and functions.)
20160217 23:47:32< shadowm> wesnothd will follow early in the morning UTC.
20160217 23:48:46< shadowm> vultraz: Also, didn't I tell you to do anything other than the GUI2 Add-ons Manager port?
20160217 23:49:25< shadowm> Because, for the reasons you just mentioned, as well as plenty of other reasons we've been extensively discussing as of late, it can only make things worse right now.
20160217 23:50:17< shadowm> You yourself find dealing with GUI2 frustrating, so I'm not sure what's the point of beating the deceased equine it represents.
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--- Log closed Thu Feb 18 00:00:09 2016