--- Log opened Tue Apr 05 00:00:59 2016
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20160405 22:14:17< DeFender1031> you guys are going to wonder what the heck i'm trying to do, but is there a way to randomize an attack itself? I'm talking random damage type, random amount of hits (within a range), random damage per hit (within a range), possibly random effect as well...? either that or a way to define a series of attacks, but set it up that you can't actually CHOOSE those attacks, but rather some master dummy attack that picks one of those 
20160405 22:14:18< DeFender1031> randomly. (I suppose I could set something up with an event handle, but that could get messy.)
20160405 22:16:52< zookeeper> well, i guess you could use a dummy attack, and then change the actual stats of the attack in an attack event
20160405 22:17:14< zookeeper> other than that, no
20160405 22:18:45< celticminstrel> Well, it's definitely possible...
20160405 22:20:43< DeFender1031> so i'll make a dummy attack whose stats are 0-0 i guess and has a special with a description indicating what it actually does... my only question though is, is there some action to say "have this unit attack this unit using this attack and run the attack as normal" or would I have to code the animation calls and the damage, experience, status changes, etc. into the event manually?
20160405 22:21:40< celticminstrel> Is the goal to have an attack that has a random effect when used?
20160405 22:23:21< DeFender1031> the goal is that either the entire attack is random, or that it selects randomly from one of several pre-defined attacks with their own stats (probably the latter)
20160405 22:23:22< zookeeper> https://wiki.wesnoth.org/DirectActionsWML#.5Bdo_command.5D should be able to execute an attack
20160405 22:23:45< zookeeper> dunno why you ask, it's not related to the original question
20160405 22:23:51< zookeeper> you don't need to use that
20160405 22:23:52< DeFender1031> zookeeper, anything compatible with 12?
20160405 22:24:10< DeFender1031> is it not?
20160405 22:24:41< celticminstrel> I don't think there's any way to randomly select one attack for a player-controlled unit, at least.
20160405 22:24:46< DeFender1031> how else can i have the game natively handle the attack sequence?
20160405 22:24:50< zookeeper> i believe that if you change the attack's stats in an attack event, those stats will get used in the attack
20160405 22:24:56< DeFender1031> oh
20160405 22:24:58< celticminstrel> For an AI-controlled unit it could probably be done... somehow... but not easy...
20160405 22:25:00< DeFender1031> interesting
20160405 22:25:07< celticminstrel> Yeah, I would expect that too.
20160405 22:25:10< DeFender1031> i didn't think of that
20160405 22:25:25< DeFender1031> celticminstrel, not an AI unit. no issue there.
20160405 22:25:30< celticminstrel> I think there's an event for when the attack begins and for when the attacks end.
20160405 22:25:37< celticminstrel> ^attack ends
20160405 22:25:41< zookeeper> that's what "attack event" means :p
20160405 22:25:41< DeFender1031> right.
20160405 22:26:21< DeFender1031> so basically, when the attack starts, assign whatever stats to the attack that i randomly pick that time around, let it run, and then when the attack ends, reset it to normal.
20160405 22:26:27< DeFender1031> if that works, great
20160405 22:26:49< zookeeper> yes
20160405 22:28:24< DeFender1031> thanks
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20160405 22:41:00< DeFender1031> in case you're wondering what the heck i'm doing, it's a story set in a future (a century or two after Eastern Invasion) where more branches of magic than just fire and holy have been developed, about a young mage who's found to be capable of mastering more than one and having a hard time controlling his magic. (Later on, he'll learn to control it better.)
20160405 22:41:19< celticminstrel> Sounds interesting.
20160405 22:41:41< celticminstrel> With some similarities in premise to my own campaign, actually...
20160405 22:41:52< DeFender1031> really?
20160405 22:42:15< DeFender1031> do tell.
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20160405 22:42:41< celticminstrel> Well, I have elvish shamans who've been dabbling in magical arts more commonly used by humans - ice, fire, holy, etc.
20160405 22:43:09< celticminstrel> And every unit you recruit has a chance of getting a random extra ability or trait or something.
20160405 22:43:44< DeFender1031> ah, fascinating
20160405 22:44:12< DeFender1031> is yours A: complete B: on the add-on server and C: compatible with version 12?
20160405 22:44:33< celticminstrel> All of the above.
20160405 22:44:42< DeFender1031> i'll go check it out then
20160405 22:44:47< celticminstrel> I've only been developing it on 12.
20160405 22:45:12< DeFender1031> Besieged Druids?
20160405 22:45:13< celticminstrel> I tried it on 13 once and it actually didn't work (though I did finally figure out why).
20160405 22:45:15< celticminstrel> Yes.
20160405 22:45:36< DeFender1031> what wouldn't work on 13 that works on 12?
20160405 22:45:40< celticminstrel> I intend to work on it more, maybe make a version 2 with rehauled writing.
20160405 22:45:49< DeFender1031> doesn't seem like 13 has any backwards-compat issues.
20160405 22:46:07< celticminstrel> Well, when I opened in 13, the AI started playing your side.
20160405 22:46:17< DeFender1031> nice. if you want any help with that, count me in
20160405 22:46:20< celticminstrel> Apparently related to the "current_player" key in [side].
20160405 22:46:36< celticminstrel> Eh? Help with what?
20160405 22:47:22< DeFender1031> making a version 2?
20160405 22:47:30< celticminstrel> Ah.
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20160405 22:47:40< celticminstrel> What kind of help?
20160405 22:47:42< DeFender1031> sorry, we're having two different conversations at once
20160405 22:47:58< DeFender1031> you tell me. i was just offering
20160405 22:48:00< celticminstrel> Heh.
20160405 22:48:22< DeFender1031> anyway, it's not even clear to me what the current_player thing does, let alone actually using it
20160405 22:48:26< celticminstrel> Well, I don't think I have anything specific I need help with right now, except maybe graphics or testing.
20160405 22:48:45< DeFender1031> testing is mostly what i was thinking of
20160405 22:49:53< DeFender1031> (when i offerred)
20160405 22:50:08< ancestral> DeFender1031: Just curious, what system are you on?
20160405 22:50:40< celticminstrel> My sister is still doing a few more graphics edits for me as well.
20160405 22:51:41< DeFender1031> ancestral, depending on the context, the answer could be "Linux", "Debian", "Wesnoth 1.12.4", or something else entirely that i'm not getting... why do you ask?
20160405 22:52:00< ancestral> I should have been more specific. I meant OS.
20160405 22:52:03< ancestral> Debian Linux, then.
20160405 22:52:18< DeFender1031> then I already answered your- yeah. that.
20160405 22:52:22< DeFender1031> why do you ask?
20160405 22:52:25< ancestral> I was curious as I might need some people to test an OS X build
20160405 22:52:36< DeFender1031> my wife is on OS X
20160405 22:52:59< DeFender1031> (but she's far less technical than I)
20160405 22:53:28< ancestral> It’s really just a matter of, does it run and not crash
20160405 22:53:40< ancestral> And really, by run I mean, does it startup
20160405 22:53:48< celticminstrel> Yeah, basically, if you can get to the title screen, that's enough.
20160405 22:53:51< ancestral> I’ll likely have a binary later in the day
20160405 22:54:06< ancestral> Anyway, it’s not extremely time critical
20160405 22:54:15< celticminstrel> Well, I suppose it'd be good to try starting a game too, but... main thing is that it doesn't crash during startup.
20160405 22:54:55< DeFender1031> ancestral, ping me tomorrow then if you still need it tested by then, it's 2AM here, so i'll be unlikely to be awake "later in the day"
20160405 22:55:08< ancestral> Heh, fair enough :)
20160405 22:55:08< DeFender1031> well... depending where you are anyway...
20160405 22:55:17< ancestral> Minnesota, so yeah
20160405 22:55:26< DeFender1031> if it's like 8 AM for you then i ought to be back on by "this evening"
20160405 22:55:33< DeFender1031> (dontcha just LOVE timezones?)
20160405 22:56:01< DeFender1031> so it's like 5 for you? 6?
20160405 22:56:06< DeFender1031> (PM?)
20160405 22:56:20< ancestral> Just about 6 PM
20160405 22:57:56< DeFender1031> Yeah, so unless you keep a schedule like mine, i'll be unlikely to be around until your "tomorrow".
20160405 22:58:30< ancestral> No worries
20160405 23:02:19< DeFender1031> celticminstrel, looking through the add-on data for yours, it seems as though some of the images could have been done with IPF. (Such as the green versions of the ice missile)
20160405 23:02:56< DeFender1031> though this also makes me think... what's the policy on borrowing graphics from other peoples' add-ons?
20160405 23:04:20< ancestral> DeFender1031: Perfectly fine. Add-ons are all GPL2
20160405 23:04:43< DeFender1031> ancestral, i meant more from the social perspective. I already assumed that legally, all add-ons put on the main server were open-source and therefore subject to whatever usage legally.
20160405 23:05:05< DeFender1031> like... will people be pissed if i borrow their hard-earned graphics for my own thing
20160405 23:05:14< DeFender1031> that sort of thing
20160405 23:05:20< ancestral> Sure, good point
20160405 23:05:24< celticminstrel> Yeah, some people do indeed feel that way.
20160405 23:05:37< celticminstrel> I personally feel that forcing addons to be GPL is a mistake.
20160405 23:05:39< ancestral> Attribution is great, but it’s my understanding *most* people are fine with copying/integrating content
20160405 23:06:01< ancestral> You can always send a message to the author if you’re taking something in its entirety
20160405 23:06:06< zookeeper> no one will be pissed unless you hijack their stuff or make it look bad or something.
20160405 23:06:15< ancestral> celticminstrel: Just curious, what would you prefer?
20160405 23:06:17< celticminstrel> I also don't have any problems with people taking the graphics from my addon, though; most of them I got from other addons or from packs, anyway.
20160405 23:06:24< DeFender1031> zookeeper, define "hijack"?
20160405 23:06:40< zookeeper> DeFender1031, take someone's custom portrait and give it to a completely different character in your add-on, for instance.
20160405 23:06:40< celticminstrel> I don't know if the green missile could be done with IPF.
20160405 23:06:58< DeFender1031> celticminstrel, ~CS() function?
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20160405 23:07:11< celticminstrel> Maybe.
20160405 23:07:16< celticminstrel> I don't remember how I made that.
20160405 23:08:10< DeFender1031> zookeeper, ah, that makes sense. Though, there might also be a line between "portrait for generic custom unit of which i'm creating something similar" and "portrait of their hero which is now my hero, or worse, just a generic unit in mine"
20160405 23:08:19< zookeeper> DeFender1031, yes, certainly
20160405 23:08:39< DeFender1031> either way, it's probably decent courtesy to message an author to ask if they mind anyway
20160405 23:09:53< zookeeper> i have trouble thinking of much other art examples than portraits or hero unit sprites
20160405 23:10:16< zookeeper> if the author intended those to be unique, then they're kind of diluted by being associated with random stuff all over the place
20160405 23:10:24< DeFender1031> one issue i have though is that i'm not very good at being active on forums without some form of live notifications. I want to be more active in the community, but i haven't actually had much reason to post yet, and awesome as you three are, you seem to usually be the only people who are regularly active here in IRC.
20160405 23:10:27< zookeeper> generic unit sprites or portraits or terrains won't be
20160405 23:10:57< DeFender1031> zookeeper, yeah, that makes sense
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20160405 23:22:30< DeFender1031> well, i'm off to bed. ancestral, feel free to ping me later/tomorrow if you still want that tested.
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20160405 23:28:23< Sasquash> hm wanting to make a colosseum map
20160405 23:28:36< Sasquash> what size is each section?
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--- Log closed Wed Apr 06 00:00:03 2016