--- Log opened Fri Jun 10 00:00:24 2016
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20160610 01:45:30< irker127> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master 73a8cf4a8b22 / utils/compare_images.py: wesnoth-optipng: Run companion script with Python 3 https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/73a8cf4a8b22da32813dce10dbec242e40fc9645
20160610 01:45:33< irker127> wesnoth: Ignacio R. Morelle wesnoth:master d5fdc951c1a7 / utils/compare_images.py: wesnoth-optipng: Fix compatibility issues with newer versions of PIL https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/d5fdc951c1a78c01f8b5bdf90ff4e258146db2cb
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20160610 06:54:50< ancestral> wedge009: Have you been able to successfully build the OS X version lately?
20160610 06:58:39< wedge009> ancestral: I'm only on Windows and Linux, sorry.
20160610 06:58:50< ancestral> My mistake, sorry
20160610 06:59:02< ancestral> Must have gotten you confused with someone else
20160610 06:59:50< shadowm> celticminstrel perhaps?
20160610 07:04:13< ancestral> Yeah
20160610 07:06:44< iceiceice> ancestral, i can try compiling, i have a mac nowadays
20160610 07:07:07< ancestral> You do, eh?
20160610 07:07:13< iceiceice> idk if i have all the reqs
20160610 07:07:18< iceiceice> i bought an old macbook on ebay like 6 months ago
20160610 07:07:20< ancestral> I’m struggling with getting Boost to work
20160610 07:07:24< ancestral> iceiceice: Cool
20160610 07:07:56< ancestral> Anyway, it’s not critical right now
20160610 07:08:06< iceiceice> ok
20160610 07:08:15< iceiceice> apparnetly my boost is working but not my SDL things
20160610 07:08:25< ancestral> Do you have SDL2?
20160610 07:08:33< iceiceice> i have SDL2 but not the extensions
20160610 07:09:02< ancestral> Yeah, you’ll need all the SDL2 binaries, which you can download from libsdl.org or build from homebrew, MacPorts, etc.
20160610 07:09:24< iceiceice> i think i'm using homebrew deps exclusively on this machine
20160610 07:10:26< ancestral> Then there were two additions, libhistory and libreadline
20160610 07:14:32< iceiceice> how do i make sure SDl2 mixer has ogg support?
20160610 07:14:34< iceiceice> i forget
20160610 07:14:45< iceiceice> i remembre how to do it in the ruby file but not from command line
20160610 07:16:11< iceiceice> do i just install libvorbis first and then it just picks it up?
20160610 07:16:39< ancestral> Hmm
20160610 07:16:52< ancestral> Let me check my project directory
20160610 07:17:58< iceiceice> ok
20160610 07:18:00< iceiceice> i think it worked
20160610 07:18:29< ancestral> I feel like SDL_mixer 2 just supports it
20160610 07:20:06< iceiceice> ancestral, i'm pretty sure it supports a number of formats but requires optional external support for each
20160610 07:20:14< iceiceice> but whatever i did in homebrew it seems to have enabled it now
20160610 07:20:19< iceiceice> i'm building now,
20160610 07:20:25< iceiceice> i get a lot of "missing override keyword" warnings
20160610 07:20:35< ancestral> Hmm
20160610 07:20:53< ancestral> I find I often have to clean before I build if I added or removed any files from the project
20160610 07:21:14< iceiceice> ok
20160610 07:21:21< iceiceice> i got some error about boost_static_assert failed
20160610 07:21:21< ancestral> Oh, maybe you’re just talking about SDL
20160610 07:21:24< iceiceice> in one of the AI files
20160610 07:21:34< ancestral> Yeah, so I think boost is out of date
20160610 07:21:41< ancestral> Which is what I was running into
20160610 07:21:48< iceiceice> i mean
20160610 07:21:52< iceiceice> i'm using whatever boost is on my machine
20160610 07:21:59< iceiceice> i'm not using a project file here, just scons
20160610 07:22:05< ancestral> Ah okay!
20160610 07:23:06< iceiceice> ive got boost 1.60
20160610 07:25:06< ancestral> Is there an easy way to tell what I have?
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20160610 07:25:46< iceiceice> if you know what folder your boost is installed in
20160610 07:25:50< iceiceice> then you can look at hte name of hte folder
20160610 07:25:59< iceiceice> if you are using brew, you can use "brew info boost"
20160610 07:26:06< ancestral> So you brewed it?
20160610 07:26:14< ancestral> Last time I tried I got an error, there was an issue opened for it
20160610 07:26:20< ancestral> Maybe they fixed it
20160610 07:26:50< iceiceice> i think i brewed it like some months ago
20160610 07:27:03< iceiceice> idk what the current status is
20160610 07:27:29< ancestral> Well, looks like I’m still not tired, so what the heck, let’s see how long it takes
20160610 07:27:45< ancestral> iceiceice: Basically, what would happen for me is homebrew would never finish building boost
20160610 07:27:51< ancestral> It would just get hung up somewhere
20160610 07:29:40< iceiceice> hmm thats wierd
20160610 07:29:45< iceiceice> you could try running it with --verbose i guess?
20160610 07:30:18< ancestral> Yeah I might try that, good call
20160610 07:30:49< iceiceice> ancestral, i think this issue is like,
20160610 07:30:59< iceiceice> there is an issue in the code maybe?
20160610 07:31:17< iceiceice> i dont completely understand but it seems to say that, `std::bind` is being used with some boost placeholder symbols
20160610 07:31:44< iceiceice> (i realize that probably doesn't mean much)
20160610 07:31:47< ancestral> Do you have readline and libhistory installed? I know those two are new
20160610 07:31:53< iceiceice> i think i have readline
20160610 07:31:55< iceiceice> i dont have history
20160610 07:31:59< ancestral> readline is probably installed by OS X
20160610 07:32:00< iceiceice> but thats optional anyways
20160610 07:32:39< ancestral> You may be right? I know celminstrel made some changes in the last couple months that might result in it being a requirement?
20160610 07:32:52< ancestral> But probably not your error?
20160610 07:33:06< iceiceice> let me see if i get this in linux also
20160610 07:33:40< ancestral> Yeah I was building just fine until some newer Boost dependencies creeped into the project (which is fine, just gotta figure it out)
20160610 07:33:55< shadowm> Did they?
20160610 07:34:48< shadowm> AFAICT both master and 1.12 are supposed to require Boost ≥ 1.48.
20160610 07:35:06< shadowm> Any deviation from that would be a bug and the person responsible for it should get a squeaky mallet to the face.
20160610 07:35:37< iceiceice> how many versions of boost do you actually test with thoguh
20160610 07:35:41< ancestral> Between 1.12 and 1.13.latest is there a newer minimum requirement?
20160610 07:35:54< shadowm> I just said there isn't.
20160610 07:36:10< ancestral> 1.12 Mac binary probably has some ancient version
20160610 07:36:26< ancestral> Let’s find out
20160610 07:36:47< shadowm> If you don't build 1.12 with Boost.Locale then 1.12's minimum version requirement goes down to 1.44.
20160610 07:36:48< ancestral> (When I started building 1.13 I just kept all the 1.12 libs)
20160610 07:37:10< shadowm> Oh wait, 1.36, not 1.44.
20160610 07:38:50< shadowm> But why would you not build 1.12 with Boost.Locale + Boost.Filesystem... I don't remember if that was acceptable for OS X or not.
20160610 07:39:09< ancestral> Never said I didn't
20160610 07:39:35< shadowm> It's the only possible justification for using a Boost version older than 1.48 (master's req) on 1.12.
20160610 07:39:52< ancestral> If Wesnoth 1.12.5 will launch I’ll find out what’s in it
20160610 07:40:22< ancestral> Browsing the package, maybe I don’t need to launch it
20160610 07:40:22< shadowm> Unless you are mixing different versions of the Boost libraries, in which case I'd be terrified.
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20160610 07:41:04< iceiceice> i think the issue is that
20160610 07:41:06< iceiceice> in this line:
20160610 07:41:07< iceiceice> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/src/ai/composite/ai.cpp#L82
20160610 07:41:27< iceiceice> for some reason it is resolving the `_1, _2, _3` to be `boost::placeholder::_1` rather than `std::placeholder::_1` or whatever
20160610 07:41:48< iceiceice> idk if there is some "using boost::placeholders" directive earlier
20160610 07:41:52< iceiceice> or why it doesn't do that on linux
20160610 07:41:59< iceiceice> maybe its a clang bug or something
20160610 07:42:01< iceiceice> ADL is complicated
20160610 07:42:48< iceiceice> i guess i could try building gcc with homebrew
20160610 07:42:50< iceiceice> and then use that
20160610 07:43:32< ancestral> Yuck
20160610 07:43:46< ancestral> I wouldn’t go that far
20160610 07:44:10< ancestral> Unless it’s certain that’s necessary
20160610 07:44:58< iceiceice> i guess i will try building with clang on linux
20160610 07:45:16< iceiceice> then we'l know if its an "old apple clang" bug or all clang
20160610 07:45:24< iceiceice> i mean presumably it will work here since builds are passing on travis?
20160610 07:45:53< iceiceice> maybe my clang is a bit old
20160610 07:46:06< iceiceice> it says apple clang 7.0.2
20160610 07:47:24< iceiceice> hmm
20160610 07:47:27< iceiceice> i cant build master with clang on linux,
20160610 07:47:29< shadowm> I can't use clang on Linux thanks to the GCC 5 ABI breakage.
20160610 07:47:33< iceiceice> for some reason the configuration tests for boost fail
20160610 07:47:42< iceiceice> it can't detect iostreams
20160610 07:48:04< shadowm> Last time I checked it still couldn't deal with GCC 5-built C++ libraries.
20160610 07:48:53< iceiceice> i can't remember how to figure out if i am using libc++ or libstdc++
20160610 07:49:01< iceiceice> i think clang can use either in theory?
20160610 07:49:15< iceiceice> but yeah i think they dont handle the abi thing as gcc does
20160610 07:49:44< iceiceice> shadowm, potentially there's a hack you could try i guess
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20160610 07:50:37< iceiceice> you could try adding "-D_GLIBCXX_USE_CXX11_ABI=0" to your CXXflags
20160610 07:50:50< iceiceice> it's described here: -D_GLIBCXX_USE_CXX11_ABI=0
20160610 07:50:51< iceiceice> sry
20160610 07:50:58< iceiceice> http://stackoverflow.com/questions/34124994/is-this-simple-c-program-using-locale-correct
20160610 07:51:16< shadowm> I don't remember that helping at all.
20160610 07:51:24< iceiceice> i probably mentioend this the last time we talked about it
20160610 07:51:31< iceiceice> dont remember now T_T
20160610 07:51:51< ancestral> Hmm, Wesnoth not wanting to open. Maybe has something to do with brewing Boost
20160610 07:51:57< shadowm> OTOH, it seems they are closer to merging a patch to fix the issue in clang: https://llvm.org/bugs/show_bug.cgi?id=23529  http://reviews.llvm.org/D18035#450258
20160610 07:52:03< ancestral> Lotta stuff going on on my computer
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20160610 07:55:36< shadowm> I mean, it sure would help to use that symbol if I compiled Boost myself, probably, but I'm not desperate enough to do that.
20160610 07:55:58< shadowm> *myself with clang
20160610 07:56:20< shadowm> I even removed clang over half a year ago to save up on dist-upgrades from testing. :p
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20160610 07:58:07< iceiceice> wow
20160610 07:58:11< iceiceice> i got another one of these heisenbugs
20160610 07:58:12< iceiceice> just now
20160610 07:58:14< iceiceice> in wesnoth 1.12
20160610 07:58:20< iceiceice> the one where the unit image is corrupted
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20160610 07:58:31< iceiceice> all the skeleton archers in this game i am watching are now invsiible
20160610 07:59:01< ancestral> It’s a feature
20160610 08:00:04< shadowm> iceiceice: Is it a game on the server right now?
20160610 08:00:09< iceiceice> yes
20160610 08:00:23< shadowm> Well I don't see you.
20160610 08:00:33< iceiceice> ladder between Caritas and Ricemuncher
20160610 08:00:39< iceiceice> i am logged in as "portishead"
20160610 08:01:16< shadowm> Welp, everyone's visible for me.
20160610 08:01:27< shadowm> Hesisenbug indeed.
20160610 08:01:34< shadowm> s/s//
20160610 08:01:38< ancestral> Well hey, Boost finished
20160610 08:01:56< ancestral> iceiceice: All in game graphics, or just some?
20160610 08:02:18< iceiceice> here's what i see
20160610 08:02:37< iceiceice> http://imgur.com/a/rvOsc
20160610 08:02:55< iceiceice> skeleton archer is even gone in the sidebar
20160610 08:03:13< iceiceice> its like, whatever image cache is in "images.cpp" i think
20160610 08:03:16< iceiceice> is just losing track of a sprite
20160610 08:03:21< iceiceice> idk
20160610 08:03:22< shadowm> What are your animation settings?
20160610 08:04:07< iceiceice> igot 16x speed
20160610 08:04:20< shadowm> Show combat on?
20160610 08:04:36< iceiceice> yes
20160610 08:04:53< shadowm> Standing animations on, animate map on?
20160610 08:04:57< iceiceice> yes
20160610 08:05:16< shadowm> Yeah it's not happening for me.
20160610 08:05:37< ancestral> In game help, do you see skeleton archer icon?
20160610 08:06:01< shadowm> I imagine not, since it uses the same cache on account of everything in the game using image::get_image().
20160610 08:06:18< iceiceice> no
20160610 08:06:22< iceiceice> that looks pretty weird actually
20160610 08:06:26< iceiceice> it just skips the skeleton archer unit image
20160610 08:06:53< iceiceice> i uploaded a screenshot of it
20160610 08:10:00< shadowm> Um. Yeah. I guess... it must be somewhere you usually upload screenshots to.
20160610 08:10:44< shadowm> Anyway I'm not interested in seeing it since I know what an invisible unit looks like. I just want to reproduce it since it's not the first time I hear of it and it's a pretty alarming issue.
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20160610 08:11:45< shadowm> You wouldn't happen to see any relevant "could not open image" errors on stderr, right?
20160610 08:11:48< iceiceice> yeah... i've seen it before
20160610 08:12:03< iceiceice> oh
20160610 08:12:04< iceiceice> 20160610 04:05:58 error display: could not find image for report: 'units/undead-skeletal/archer.png~RC(magenta>1)'
20160610 08:12:33< iceiceice> 20160610 03:59:33 error display: could not open image 'units/undead-skeletal/archer-idle-2.png'
20160610 08:12:34< iceiceice> 20160610 03:59:34 error display: could not open image 'units/undead-skeletal/archer-idle-4.png'
20160610 08:12:34< iceiceice> 20160610 04:00:45 error display: could not find image for report: 'units/undead-skeletal/archer.png~RC(magenta>1)'
20160610 08:12:34< iceiceice> 20160610 04:01:16 error display: could not find image for report: 'units/undead-skeletal/archer.png~RC(magenta>1)'
20160610 08:12:34< iceiceice> 20160610 04:01:26 error display: could not find image for report: 'units/undead-skeletal/archer.png~RC(magenta>1)'
20160610 08:12:37< iceiceice> i wonder why i get that
20160610 08:12:56< shadowm> Well, at least that confirms the game is correctly catching the null surface from the cache.
20160610 08:13:31< shadowm> Er, not the cache.
20160610 08:13:42< shadowm> The game emits this error when first trying to load the image from disk.
20160610 08:14:36< iceiceice> hmm 
20160610 08:14:40< iceiceice> i guess the path is actually wrong
20160610 08:14:54< iceiceice> the files are in "wesnoth/data/core/images/units/undead-skeletal/archer"
20160610 08:14:54< shadowm> So either this returned an empty string: filesystem::get_binary_file_location("images", val_.filename_);
20160610 08:15:14< shadowm> Eh. No.
20160610 08:15:25< shadowm> The path is correct unless you are looking at master.
20160610 08:15:37< iceiceice> hmmm let me check
20160610 08:15:48< shadowm> In 1.12 it's all in undead-skeletal/, no subfolders involved.
20160610 08:15:53< iceiceice> oh
20160610 08:15:56< iceiceice> you know what this is
20160610 08:16:04< iceiceice> i guess i changed my clone to master
20160610 08:16:06< iceiceice> while i still had the game running
20160610 08:16:15< iceiceice> and now the 1.12 binary is running against a master core dir
20160610 08:16:25< iceiceice> sry, false alarm XD
20160610 08:16:53< shadowm> And that's why I recommend git-new-workdir to people if they can spare some disk space.
20160610 08:16:59< iceiceice> i wonder if thats what happened the other time i saw this also
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20160610 08:29:45< zookeeper> whoops :>
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20160610 08:56:54< Aginor> hey
20160610 09:03:42< Aginor> has anyone played with building and keeping the wesnoth sources in RAM?
20160610 09:04:07< Aginor> I'd be interested to know if there's much difference in the build process
20160610 09:04:22< Aginor> but I suspect the answer is "no" :D
20160610 09:06:50< loonycyborg> you mean building from a RAM disk?
20160610 09:07:28< loonycyborg> source size is downright miniscule compared to all intermediate stuff compiler generates..
20160610 09:08:11< Aginor> yes
20160610 09:08:41< Aginor> andreas@goddess:~/projects$du -hs wesnoth-master/
20160610 09:08:42< Aginor> 6.1G	wesnoth-master/
20160610 09:09:08< Aginor> if there's too many temporary files that gets deleted it might be awkward
20160610 09:09:34< Aginor> but I think that's containing full source, cmake + scons builds + intermediates
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20160610 09:18:08< loonycyborg> Aginor: but what would be the point? sources will get moved to cache and in practice will be read from there
20160610 09:18:18< loonycyborg> even if not on ram disk
20160610 09:21:45< Aginor> loonycyborg: mostly just for the hell of it :)
20160610 09:22:12< Aginor> it's not a cpu-bound operation so there's not that much gain in it
20160610 09:23:22< loonycyborg> actually moving only src/ dir will cover the most of files that'll get read by compiler
20160610 09:23:29< shadowm> I rather doubt individual source files are large enough for disk reads to take noticeable longer than compilation.
20160610 09:24:05< shadowm> Instead of wasting RAM you could use a SSD.
20160610 09:25:06< shadowm> (Incidentally, my /tmp is a tmpfs mount, which means it's probably on RAM most of the time.)
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20160610 09:27:13< Aginor> shadowm: I have one but not the other ;)
20160610 09:27:28< Aginor> although I'm tempted to acquire an ssd
20160610 09:27:48< Aginor> mind you, I'm also tempted to acquire a brand spanking new i7 with lots of everything
20160610 09:27:53< Aginor> but that's not going to happen
20160610 09:28:57< shadowm> I'm currently deliberating whether to acquire an SSD myself.
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20160610 09:31:48< Aginor> they're still a wee bit above my prefered price point
20160610 09:32:04< Aginor> looking at a 500Gb one
20160610 09:32:11< Aginor> it'd work for /home
20160610 09:32:19< Aginor> or / in general
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20160610 10:05:10< irker422> wesnoth: Elvish_Hunter wesnoth:master 2b3d54d5f4ea / data/tools/wmllint: wmllint: handle HelpWML markup correctly while spellchecking https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/2b3d54d5f4ea420f2a45993d18370936e6c4807c
20160610 10:05:10< irker422> wesnoth: Elvish_Hunter wesnoth:master e83d1de05e00 / src/scripting/lua_common.cpp: Lua: make wesnoth.set_variable() return nil if a variable doesn't exist https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/e83d1de05e00fcc3aab8dcc82e860381c4998ae7
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20160610 10:18:03< travis-ci> aquileia/wesnoth#53 (sprites - e043b72 : aquileia): The build was fixed.
20160610 10:18:03< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/aquileia/wesnoth/builds/136652378
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20160610 11:16:48 * Aginor is mildly frustrated
20160610 11:17:05< Aginor> I've broken floating labels on my branch and I can't figure out why
20160610 11:17:49< Aginor> what really annoys me is that I probably had a very good clue but I forgot while I was waiting for people to stop breaking stuff
20160610 11:18:28< vultraz> Apologies
20160610 11:18:55< Aginor> I want to get it sorted and merge the branch so that I can start implementing spatial searches between GUI components so I can *finally* start optimising things
20160610 11:19:02< Aginor> </rant>
20160610 11:19:06< Aginor> or vent
20160610 11:19:08< Aginor> or whatever
20160610 11:19:46< vultraz> It's mostly my fault since I went and did the whole loading screen thing
20160610 11:19:58< Aginor> there were multiple things
20160610 11:21:41< vultraz> Yes, I know. And again, apologies. We didn't mean to make you feel like we were stomping on your work.
20160610 11:23:30< vultraz> We should have waiting until you were finished before we started the major refactors
20160610 11:23:48< Aginor> it's alright
20160610 11:23:55< Aginor> it's not like I was very quick about it
20160610 11:24:13< vultraz> About the floating labels, I seem to recall you saying they had something to do with the final CVideo::flip() call in display::flip()
20160610 11:27:47< Aginor> hmmm
20160610 11:28:03< Aginor> I've killed that already
20160610 11:28:15< Aginor> putting it back makes them flicker, which is rather unseeming
20160610 11:28:46< Aginor> the problem is that they're all treated like volatile draw-events, so they are drawn, flipped, undrawn
20160610 11:28:56< Aginor> wasting precious, precious cycles
20160610 11:29:17< Aginor> the undraw isn't quite working for some reason any longer
20160610 11:29:30< Aginor> I've been meaning to break it, thoroghly, but not yet
20160610 11:30:46< vultraz> Slightly related, but did you see my message the other day about my suggestion for a global layer drawing system? 
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20160610 11:31:24< Aginor> no, I didn't
20160610 11:31:47< Aginor> where/when?
20160610 11:32:28< vultraz> hm... I can't remember the day
20160610 11:32:33< vultraz> let me try to find it
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20160610 11:36:03< vultraz> ah, found it
20160610 11:36:33< vultraz> Aginor: http://pastebin.com/f1dEN9bv
20160610 11:37:38< Aginor> vultraz: that's what I'm working towards
20160610 11:38:06< vultraz> ahh
20160610 11:38:08< Aginor> vultraz: although no explicit control over layers, I see no use case for it
20160610 11:38:28< vultraz> what do you mean by explicit control?
20160610 11:40:39< Aginor> z-distance
20160610 11:41:04< vultraz> ah
20160610 11:41:50< vultraz> well that was an example from aa, but what I meant was just "keep this effect drawn in a layer under the window but above other elements
20160610 11:42:09< vultraz> so, for example, window 1 is 100, window 2 is 200, and then we draw a blur/darkening effect at 190
20160610 11:42:28< vultraz> (again taking example from AA where objects have numerical zorder values)
20160610 11:43:03< vultraz> then if a window 3 is opening as 300 the effect is moved up the stack to 290
20160610 11:43:45< vultraz> thereby keeping the effect under the current window without any boundary tracking
20160610 11:43:51< vultraz> make sense?
20160610 11:44:08< Aginor> I understand where you're coming from :)
20160610 11:44:26< Aginor> Here's why you can't have it anytime soon: GUI1+GUI2, or just GUI2
20160610 11:44:51< Aginor> but as long as we have both, there's not going to be a path forward for something like that
20160610 11:45:07< Aginor> which is why it's layers based on windows no
20160610 11:45:14< Aginor> now, even
20160610 11:46:40< vultraz> bah, GUI1 once again complicates things
20160610 11:46:48< Aginor> ideally that'd be a feature of GUI3
20160610 11:47:01< Aginor> GUI2 won't make something like that any easier either
20160610 11:47:46< Aginor> I keep playing with the idea of recreating the minimap+gameboard in QT and building the rest out of QT primitives
20160610 11:48:02< Aginor> that *should* allow the game logic to be ported across
20160610 11:48:08< vultraz> Well, I wasn't envisioning something like this as just part of GUI2, but drawing in general. So for example, you'd just give floating labels a higher zorder than units or tiles but lower than windows.
20160610 11:48:58< Aginor> vultraz: that'd require everything to use the same frameworks and be aware of each other. Getting to that is so far down the track that it's laughable
20160610 11:49:35< Aginor> there's still serious amounts of technical debt to pay off in the near term before we can start to do shiny stuff
20160610 11:50:29< vultraz> Well, is it at least where we're hoping to end up
20160610 11:50:48< vultraz> (Or somewhere in the vicinity :P )
20160610 11:51:03< vultraz> (why do I keep saying 'Well')
20160610 11:51:17< Aginor> I'm not convinced it's an approach that makes sense for us
20160610 11:53:46< vultraz> I'll bring it up when we get to the wesnoth 2 discussion, see what other people thing, since I guess you're right that it's moot for now
20160610 11:54:27< vultraz> What are our short-term goals, then?
20160610 11:55:01< Aginor> get it working
20160610 11:55:09< Aginor> kill all undrawing
20160610 11:55:21< Aginor> enable OGL acceleration
20160610 11:55:45< vultraz> good, good
20160610 11:56:15< vultraz> Let's try to do that for 1.14
20160610 11:56:18< Aginor> there might need to be a step of peformance optimisation inbetween
20160610 11:56:21< Aginor> heh
20160610 11:56:22< Aginor> no
20160610 11:56:38< Aginor> not if you want 1.14 in the next 2 years
20160610 11:56:53< vultraz> Hm
20160610 11:56:54< Aginor> nor do I want to become the argument for why we can't release
20160610 11:56:59< vultraz> We probably do.
20160610 11:57:08< vultraz> What can we realistically get done for 1.14, then
20160610 11:57:27< Aginor> I suggested we dust off a roadmap a few months ago
20160610 11:57:32< Aginor> and do some proper planning
20160610 11:57:51< Aginor> and get people enthused and work to make it all a reality
20160610 11:58:03< vultraz> I agree
20160610 11:58:05< Aginor> that would answer that question
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20160610 12:01:06< vultraz> We should probably set a general target date
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20160610 12:01:40< vultraz> I'm thinking "early 2017"
20160610 12:02:39< Aginor> figure out what should go into it first
20160610 12:02:54< Aginor> what's "must haves" and what's "nice to haves"
20160610 12:03:03< Aginor> https://www.projecttimes.com/articles/10-steps-to-creating-a-project-plan.html
20160610 12:03:21< Aginor> with that, I'm going to bed ;)
20160610 12:03:31< vultraz> I guess I should write an ML post
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20160610 12:31:05< vultraz> Sent
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20160610 12:49:28< AI0867> Aginor: you can request access, then any admin (shadowm is one now) can add you
20160610 12:54:48< AI0867> shadowm: submitting a coverity build is a bit of an involved process. There is a script that can do it (I use a modified version of coverity-submit), but if it's misconfigured, you spend several hours doing a clean wesnoth build and then uploading the result only to get a 'nope' as a result
20160610 12:55:31< AI0867> shadowm: one of my modifications to the script was not deleting the build results after the upload finishes (possibly unsuccessfully)
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20160610 13:42:35< AI0867> shadowm: https://wiki.wesnoth.org/Coverity
20160610 13:44:23< AI0867> also, I'm currently busy submitting a build to see if I haven't missed something
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20160610 14:14:00< zookeeper> "There has been a general consensus that Wesnoth 2.0 is needed" <- what discussion did i miss?
20160610 14:18:25< loonycyborg> It was between vultaz, vultraz and vultraz
20160610 14:30:17< pydsigner> <shrug.txt>
20160610 14:32:25< zookeeper> anyway, i doubt anyone can know what anyone else would even mean by "wesnoth 2.0".
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20160610 15:19:30< vultraz> zookeeper: because we have to discuss that, but not now
20160610 15:21:22< vultraz> right now we should be deciding what's important for 1.14 and what can be done in whatever comes next
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20160610 15:27:33< vultraz> So, please. If you have a project you want to complete for 1.14, mention it in the mailing list.
20160610 15:28:22< zookeeper> i will
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20160610 15:29:33< mattsc> Fix LoW.  [I am not going to do that though so I am not going to post about it.]
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20160610 16:12:24< celticminstrel> Blah, mailing list...
20160610 16:14:47< vultraz> I don't like it either
20160610 16:15:14< vultraz> who does?
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20160610 17:24:32< celticminstrel> Presumably some people do.
20160610 17:25:20< loonycyborg> they have one advantage, that you get mail when something happens on them..
20160610 17:25:58< vultraz> I've always thought mailing lists felt antiquated 
20160610 17:26:48< loonycyborg> maybe, but need adequate replacement
20160610 17:27:25< loonycyborg> in fact if there's no adequate replacement then they fall short of being antiquated
20160610 17:29:53-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20160610 17:30:03< vultraz> Aren't there dozens of team collab apps
20160610 17:33:10< loonycyborg> mailing lists are simpler
20160610 17:33:47< celticminstrel> If mailing lists are antiquated, so is IRC.
20160610 17:33:50< loonycyborg> just send a mail
20160610 17:34:07< loonycyborg> instead of fucking around with some stupid "collaboration" interface
20160610 17:34:24< vultraz> IRC *is* antiquated
20160610 17:34:28< celticminstrel> Also, mailing lists are still used all over the place for announcements (admittedly that's a little different since subscribers aren't expected to respond).
20160610 17:34:28< vultraz> We're all hipsters for using it
20160610 17:34:45< loonycyborg> same situation with irc
20160610 17:34:51< loonycyborg> needs adequate replacement
20160610 17:34:57< vultraz> There are
20160610 17:35:11< vultraz> It's called Skype
20160610 17:35:27< loonycyborg> only one that could satisfy us foss guys is TOX
20160610 17:35:27< celticminstrel> I was about to suggest that, but then decided it's not true.
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20160610 17:35:38< celticminstrel> Skype can't really replace IRC.
20160610 17:35:38< loonycyborg> but it's still work in progress
20160610 17:35:48< vultraz> Why not, celticminstrel?
20160610 17:36:04< vultraz> loonycyborg: why foss?
20160610 17:36:13< celticminstrel> And AIM, MSN, Y!M might not be able to either, though I've never actually used them.
20160610 17:36:22< celticminstrel> Skype doesn't have any concept of rooms.
20160610 17:36:31< celticminstrel> So it's a completely different paradigm than IRC.
20160610 17:36:32< loonycyborg> because foss people want full control over infrastructure
20160610 17:36:43< loonycyborg> federated models
20160610 17:36:45< vultraz> celticminstrel: do groups not count?
20160610 17:36:54< loonycyborg> so could exist separate implementations
20160610 17:37:03< loonycyborg> like freenode etc
20160610 17:37:12< loonycyborg> also
20160610 17:37:19< loonycyborg> everyone else will drop skype too
20160610 17:37:21< celticminstrel> I thought Skype groups dissolved when the last person leaves - more like a meeting than a room.
20160610 17:37:29< loonycyborg> because it's becoming bloated pile of crap
20160610 17:37:49< vultraz> is it?
20160610 17:37:51< vultraz> I don't think so
20160610 17:37:56< vultraz> celticminstrel: true
20160610 17:38:00< vultraz> celticminstrel: what about Slack
20160610 17:38:08< celticminstrel> I've never heard about it.
20160610 17:38:22< celticminstrel> And abotu Skype, I haven't paid much attention to it lately, so I dunno if it's getting worse.
20160610 17:38:27< celticminstrel> ^about
20160610 17:38:52< ChipmunkV> never was any good on Linux
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20160610 17:39:58< loonycyborg> linux skype client is unmaintained. 
20160610 17:40:24< loonycyborg> Asking linux people to support skype is like asking armenians to support turkish nationalism
20160610 17:40:44< celticminstrel> I'm slightly surprised there is one.
20160610 17:41:06< loonycyborg> they made it before skype was acquired by microsoft
20160610 17:41:13< vultraz> loonycyborg: that's going a bit far, don't you think
20160610 17:42:10< vultraz> you make it sound like skype is Evil
20160610 17:42:41< ChipmunkV> it is
20160610 17:42:52< vultraz> how so?
20160610 17:43:00< vultraz> it's a perfectly useful app
20160610 17:43:00< ChipmunkV> any closed-source communication standard is evil
20160610 17:43:05< vultraz> I've used it for years.
20160610 17:43:06< celticminstrel> Ugh.
20160610 17:43:08< ChipmunkV> it divides people
20160610 17:43:21< vultraz> .... ok you just lost any validity your argument might have
20160610 17:43:25< celticminstrel> ^
20160610 17:43:40< Ravana_> only reason to use skype is voice support
20160610 17:43:50< loonycyborg> I think it's apt. For turks it was important to discourage armenians from existing, and for ms it was important to discourage linux from existing
20160610 17:43:57< loonycyborg> and they both were wrong
20160610 17:44:00< celticminstrel> Plus "evil" is far too strong a word to be using here.
20160610 17:45:41< vultraz> The only way it "divides" people is when someone goes around saying how "evil" it is
20160610 17:45:51< loonycyborg> https://tox.chat/ , that's the only thing that could be something like skype for foss people
20160610 17:46:27-!- ToBeCloud [uid51591@wikimedia/ToBeFree] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160610 17:48:46-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
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20160610 17:50:57< vultraz> Let us not get into an argument about foss vs proprietary 
20160610 17:52:01< ChipmunkV> voip is kinda hard. all libraries are rather old, protocols are complex and not firewall-friendly
20160610 17:54:45< loonycyborg> there's no argument because being oss/federated/peer-to-peer is a REQUIREMENT for us
20160610 17:55:00< vultraz> ...says who?
20160610 17:55:05< loonycyborg> me :P
20160610 17:55:21< vultraz> you don't speak for all of us :P
20160610 17:56:00< loonycyborg> nonetheless I know what people want, cause I'm one of them and share their wants
20160610 17:56:13< vultraz> ...what
20160610 17:56:16< zookeeper> irc and mailing lists are more persistent and future-proof as anything else.
20160610 17:56:24< zookeeper> s/as/than
20160610 17:56:25< vultraz> what is this demographic you're speaking for
20160610 17:57:36< loonycyborg> foss developers
20160610 17:58:06< celticminstrel> I'm not sure you can really call that a demographic...
20160610 17:58:40< loonycyborg> anyway until there's an adequate replacement, irc is useable
20160610 17:59:22< vultraz> since there's a GSOC channel it must not be entirely dead
20160610 18:00:54< Yaiyan> There are channels with 2000 people in them, still
20160610 18:02:12-!- horrowind [~Icedove@2a02:810a:83c0:1c18:21b:fcff:fee3:c3ff] has quit [Quit: horrowind]
20160610 18:04:14< celticminstrel> Minecraft.
20160610 18:04:24< celticminstrel> (I assume that channel is still active, at least.)
20160610 18:04:44< vultraz> says 303
20160610 18:04:50< vultraz> I wonder if I'm stilled banned from there
20160610 18:05:07< vultraz> huh, no
20160610 18:05:32< zookeeper> it'd certainly be folly to try to move from irc to something proprietary like skype or whatever which you have no control over. irc is like the best communications medium ever, it only lacks a few little things :p
20160610 18:06:28< vultraz> I'm curious, what control are you referring to
20160610 18:06:31< TC01> (the largest channel on freenode, at least, has ~2300 users and it's ##linux; the next largest are #python and #archlinux at 1900 and 1700 respectively. IRC is still pretty predominant among open source projects)
20160610 18:07:14< celticminstrel> The minecraft channel isn't on freenode.
20160610 18:07:32< vultraz> oh, well there is one on freenode
20160610 18:07:38< celticminstrel> Really?
20160610 18:07:55< celticminstrel> The one I was thinking of is on espernet.
20160610 18:08:10< celticminstrel> ...which is a less secure network then freenode, actually.
20160610 18:13:59-!- hk238 [~kvirc@t224.ip7.netikka.fi] has quit [Quit: http://www.kvirc.net/ 4.9.1 Aria]
20160610 18:16:41< loonycyborg> vultraz: isn't that obvious? Control over implementation and infrastruture.
20160610 18:17:07-!- irker387 [~irker@uruz.ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160610 18:17:07< irker387> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth:master 54c03ea6cb13 / src/server/server.cpp: Don't store pointers to internal state of temporaries https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/54c03ea6cb1364e41adf360a34b446bbf019468a
20160610 18:17:07< irker387> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth:master 433a3ad7a47d / src/actions/undo.cpp: Properly handle an error condition https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/433a3ad7a47d1945413b2a83539d13e417d34922
20160610 18:17:22< AI0867> Aginor: the former is relevant for you ^
20160610 18:17:39< celticminstrel> Some of what IRC lacks is also made up for by services.
20160610 18:20:57< vultraz> loonycyborg: we don't control the IRC implementation or infrastructure....?
20160610 18:21:06< loonycyborg> we do in fact
20160610 18:21:15< vultraz> loonycyborg: unless you mean choosing what client to connect with
20160610 18:21:26< loonycyborg> cause we can make and host own server
20160610 18:21:26< vultraz> loonycyborg: or are you referring to channel modes or something?
20160610 18:21:41< vultraz> and that is important because....
20160610 18:21:59< zookeeper> because if freenode disappears one day, all everyone needs to do is point their client to another server
20160610 18:22:02< loonycyborg> because we can fix it if thing go wrong
20160610 18:22:09< zookeeper> whereas if skype disappears one day, ..?
20160610 18:22:09< AI0867> yeah, we can just resurrect it ourselves
20160610 18:22:15< vultraz> but we're not running our own server...
20160610 18:22:22< AI0867> no, but we could run one on wesnoth.org
20160610 18:22:24< zookeeper> because we don't need to
20160610 18:22:29< zookeeper> but we could, if we needed to
20160610 18:22:33< AI0867> I could run one on ai0867.net if I wanted to
20160610 18:22:40< vultraz> ok, good point
20160610 18:22:42< AI0867> a long time ago, I ran one on my home computer
20160610 18:22:55< loonycyborg> we're reusing what freenode people have made
20160610 18:22:56< vultraz> but I wouldn't see this is a point against using skype
20160610 18:23:04< vultraz> I'd say the lack of rooms would be a bigger point
20160610 18:23:12< vultraz> Slack'd be better
20160610 18:23:54< vultraz> (I'm not proposing we abandon IRC, I hope you people realize)
20160610 18:24:01< loonycyborg> what would be better is steam :P
20160610 18:24:07< loonycyborg> it got both text chat and rooms
20160610 18:24:22< vultraz> eh?
20160610 18:24:43< loonycyborg> valve steam, it got im functionality too
20160610 18:25:07< vultraz> oh right
20160610 18:25:10< vultraz> I forgot about groups
20160610 18:25:46< vultraz> honestly any platform where we were all using the same client would be nice
20160610 18:25:52< vultraz> instead of everyone using a different one
20160610 18:26:31< vultraz> I think there's a fundamental difference of product vs protocol here
20160610 18:26:37< vultraz> I prefer products
20160610 18:26:42< vultraz> You people seem to want protocols
20160610 18:27:32< loonycyborg> we have requirements both for protocols and products
20160610 18:27:46< loonycyborg> and prefer flexible solutions
20160610 18:28:10< loonycyborg> not like skype that doesn't even have normal linux support
20160610 18:29:15< vultraz> I did say skype would probably not be the best solution
20160610 18:29:34< vultraz> though I would not be against a skype group for voice discussion
20160610 18:29:39< loonycyborg> but the thing is
20160610 18:29:43< vultraz> seems everyone was against such a thing
20160610 18:29:46< loonycyborg> irc isn't so bad
20160610 18:29:57< loonycyborg> that's the reason people use it
20160610 18:30:28< vultraz> I think IRC is only as good as the clients
20160610 18:30:42< vultraz> Whereas something like skype you can judge by itself
20160610 18:31:31< loonycyborg> I don't understand what you mean
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20160610 18:31:47< vultraz> There are a million apps you can connect to irc with
20160610 18:31:51< loonycyborg> that skype doesn't allow third party clients can't be in any way considered an advantage
20160610 18:32:08< AI0867> vultraz: yes, do you see that as an advantage?
20160610 18:32:12< AI0867> if so, why?
20160610 18:32:41< vultraz> AI0867: I see it as easier to control quality
20160610 18:32:44< AI0867> in fact, I can connect to IRC using telnet, and I have
20160610 18:33:00< vultraz> AI0867: with IRC, there's no "official" client
20160610 18:33:15< zookeeper> easier to control quality because you only have two choices, use or don't use? :p
20160610 18:33:23< ChipmunkV> to make sure that quality is sh*t on Linux
20160610 18:33:54< vultraz> AI0867: but again, it's two totally different paradigms
20160610 18:33:57< vultraz> both have their advantages
20160610 18:34:24< loonycyborg> actually you can both have official client and allow third party clients
20160610 18:34:34< vultraz> you *can*
20160610 18:34:38< vultraz> but IRC never had such a thing
20160610 18:34:47< AI0867> I rather suspect that it had one
20160610 18:35:02-!- prkc [~prkc@192.40.89.71] has quit [Ping timeout: 272 seconds]
20160610 18:36:08< vultraz> as far as I know IRC was kinda organically adopted as a communications protocol. There wasn't a company or product in front of it.
20160610 18:36:20< celticminstrel> irssi or something?
20160610 18:36:29< celticminstrel> Not sure if that counts as official though.
20160610 18:37:30< vultraz> terminal-based
20160610 18:38:17< AI0867> IRC was created by Jarkko Oikarinen in August 1988 to replace a program called MUT (MultiUser Talk) on a BBS called OuluBox at the University of Oulu in Finland, where he was working at the Department of Information Processing Science. Jarkko intended to extend the BBS software he administered, to allow news in the Usenet style, real time discussions and similar BBS features. The first part he implemented was the chat part, which he did with borro
20160610 18:38:25< AI0867> straight from wikipedia
20160610 18:39:41< celticminstrel> Also cut off.
20160610 18:40:06< celticminstrel> But I guess anyone who wants to see the rest can just go to Wikipedia.
20160610 18:40:26< vultraz> In my opinion, software with a million different version from everyone such as Linux, Android, IRC, etc, is harder for the average user to get into than software with a specific official version, like Windows, iOS, or Skype
20160610 18:41:27< vultraz> Because they're left wondering "well what is the best version"?
20160610 18:42:20< loonycyborg> I think there should be universal identities for all messaging software
20160610 18:42:41< Elvish_Hunter> celticminstrel: irssi isn't the official IRC client (there isn't one), but certainly it's one of the most used.
20160610 18:42:42< loonycyborg> so I could message everyone no matter what app they use
20160610 18:42:54< vultraz> loonycyborg: it's called texting :P
20160610 18:43:02< Elvish_Hunter> Although I moved to WeeChat because it's more powerful.
20160610 18:43:04< loonycyborg> it's not universal
20160610 18:43:14< celticminstrel> vultraz: No, that won't let you message anyone.
20160610 18:43:16< loonycyborg> SMS is just one of protocols
20160610 18:43:21< celticminstrel> Some people probably don't have SMS.
20160610 18:43:29< TC01> loonycyborg: are you familiar with bitlbee? it's an IRC server that hooks into a bunch of other types of online chat (including Skype, I think)
20160610 18:43:33< celticminstrel> Even on their phones.
20160610 18:43:36< TC01> I've never used it myself, but it seems like a nifty idea
20160610 18:43:49< loonycyborg> never heard
20160610 18:44:02< vultraz> celticminstrel: what...kind of phone can't text
20160610 18:44:08< loonycyborg> but I know that xmpp can have bridges
20160610 18:44:12< loonycyborg> to other protocols
20160610 18:44:15< TC01> loonycyborg: https://www.bitlbee.org/main.php/news.r.html
20160610 18:44:35< loonycyborg> I think that all messaging protocols should allow bridges
20160610 18:44:45< vultraz> that's a tall order
20160610 18:44:47< celticminstrel> vultraz: I don't know if it's still the case now, but the fact that people in Japan tend(ed) to use email rather than SMS suggests that SMS was not widespread there.
20160610 18:44:48< loonycyborg> instead of hoping they'll take over the world
20160610 18:44:56< loonycyborg> and all competitors stop existing
20160610 18:45:08< celticminstrel> (Just an example)
20160610 18:45:22< vultraz> huh
20160610 18:45:37< AI0867> celticminstrel: I think that was because they had functional cellular data way before everyone else, and phones came with an email address
20160610 18:45:46< celticminstrel> Maybe, I dunno.
20160610 18:45:48-!- noy [~Noy@wesnoth/developer/noy] has quit [Quit: noy]
20160610 18:45:59< AI0867> so to them, it was essentially SMS without the limitations
20160610 18:46:00< vultraz> phones came with an email address???
20160610 18:46:08< vultraz> what is this sorcery
20160610 18:46:13< AI0867> i-mode
20160610 18:46:19< celticminstrel> Did they? I thought they used stuff like hotmail addresses.
20160610 18:46:30< AI0867> people tried to roll it out in the netherlands, but far too late, and it failed
20160610 18:46:58< vultraz> (It occurred to me that email is kinda like IRC. Protocol with lot of clients)
20160610 18:47:28< celticminstrel> It's nothing like IRC, but you're right that it's just a protocol as IRC is.
20160610 18:47:39-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20160610 18:47:40< celticminstrel> Well, rather, two protocols.
20160610 18:47:47< celticminstrel> Or three, even.
20160610 18:47:52< celticminstrel> But you only need two of them.
20160610 18:48:35< vultraz> email is weird
20160610 18:49:01-!- ideuler [~textual@bl15-29-121.dsl.telepac.pt] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160610 18:49:04< vultraz> nowadays it's mostly a platform for.... 90% ads, promotional stuff, and updates, and maybe 10% actual communication
20160610 18:49:37< vultraz> well, maybe 80/20
20160610 18:49:41< loonycyborg> advantage of email is message storage
20160610 18:49:54< Elvish_Hunter> AI0867: you know, in Italy one of our GSM operators tried to run i-mode. The service closed a few years later.
20160610 18:49:54< vultraz> I guess I do get more "useful" emails than I thnk
20160610 18:49:56< celticminstrel> If you're comparing to IRC, yeah.
20160610 18:50:23< loonycyborg> most of mail I'm getting is from boost-dev ml
20160610 18:50:56< Elvish_Hunter> loonycyborg: of course, you can store IRC logs too ;) Especially if you're running your client on a server.
20160610 18:50:59< vultraz> funny thing about email is I'm pretty sure it was conceived as "let's send letters.. over the internet!"
20160610 18:51:17-!- lipkab [~the_new_l@host-91-147-210-58.biatv.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160610 18:51:27< loonycyborg> also, email clients tend to store all messages after getting them
20160610 18:51:37< vultraz> I can draw a direct comparison between that ideal and the early iOS app designs that tried to mimic real world objects in order to be more familiar to users
20160610 18:51:46< loonycyborg> so it's good for sort of communications that you want to review later
20160610 18:52:24< vultraz> Ie, taking something (or its appearance) and translating it to a new platform as opposed to inventing a new paradigm
20160610 18:52:48< vultraz> that would come later, when texting/social media/messaging apps came along
20160610 18:52:52< vultraz> or chat rooms
20160610 18:52:54< vultraz> I guess
20160610 18:53:07< celticminstrel> No vultraz, that comparison is ridiculous.
20160610 18:53:23< vultraz> Please, do counter
20160610 18:53:25< vultraz> I enjoy debating
20160610 18:53:33< celticminstrel> The thing with those iOS apps was all about the presentation, not the functionality.
20160610 18:53:45< celticminstrel> (Some of those apps were like that on Mac too, by the way.)
20160610 18:54:08< vultraz> You have a point
20160610 18:54:11< celticminstrel> The idea "let's send letters over the internet" is about the functionality, rather than the presentation, right?
20160610 18:54:27< vultraz> hmmmm
20160610 18:54:33< vultraz> Yes, that does make sense
20160610 18:54:40< vultraz> You're right
20160610 18:55:06-!- edgrey [~edgrey@178.204.211.2] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160610 18:55:35< irker387> wesnoth: loonycyborg wesnoth:master 5a7b555d3a69 / scons/boost.py: scons: don't add redundant include path for /usr/include https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/5a7b555d3a696b3fb3d867fb2d116fb4b43936d8
20160610 18:55:35< vultraz> well with that I'm really out
20160610 18:55:37< vultraz> it's late
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20160610 19:02:14-!- prkc [~prkc@5400DB22.dsl.pool.telekom.hu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160610 19:02:52< irker387> wesnoth: Elvish_Hunter wesnoth:master d625798ea5aa / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/ (10 files in 3 dirs): LoW: fixed 'side number is out of sequence' wmllint warnings https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/d625798ea5aab154cd70aace863df4f251fb8c10
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20160610 19:44:33< irker387> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth:master 2ecbb19a5930 / src/gui/dialogs/multiplayer/synced_choice_wait.cpp: Initialize all members https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/2ecbb19a59302fcf82e038de4efefe7f13de4923
20160610 19:44:35< irker387> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth:master 75e2608ed080 / src/gui/dialogs/loadscreen.cpp: Initialize all members https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/75e2608ed08036530589d4a0fb222296256ee98b
20160610 19:44:37< irker387> wesnoth: Alexander van Gessel wesnoth:master 50e8fcda0895 / / (11 files in 4 dirs): Merge branch 'master' of github.com:wesnoth/wesnoth https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/50e8fcda0895465f987a10a5b7e96fa95c6f4b47
20160610 19:47:18< loonycyborg> AI0867: I wonder if coverity could find those two UBs I had to fix after merging asio_wesnothd
20160610 19:48:25< loonycyborg> like it found that use of pointer to temporary std::string
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20160610 20:02:11-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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20160610 20:11:12< iceiceice_osx> hey, dont know if this was reported earlier,
20160610 20:11:25< iceiceice_osx> i can no longer access forums.wesnoth.org, or irclogs.wesnoth.org
20160610 20:11:38< iceiceice_osx> my firefox gives security errors
20160610 20:11:42-!- ChipmunkV [~vova@d0017-2-88-172-31-68.fbx.proxad.net] has quit [Quit: ChipmunkV]
20160610 20:11:43< iceiceice_osx> and says i cannot add an exception
20160610 20:12:02< iceiceice_osx> "This site uses HTTP Strict Transport Security (HSTS) to specify that Firefox only connect to it securely. As a result, it is not possible to add an exception for this certificate."
20160610 20:12:03< celticminstrel> Security errors for irclogs.wesnoth.org have been there ever since SSL was implemented...
20160610 20:12:16< iceiceice_osx> yeah but in the past I could add a security exception
20160610 20:12:25< iceiceice_osx> now i cannot access the site at all i guess
20160610 20:12:40< celticminstrel> But for forums.wesnoth.org that shouldn't be a problem, because the certificate is valid for it...
20160610 20:12:51< iceiceice_osx> i can access http://wesnoth.org
20160610 20:12:55< iceiceice_osx> but that's it afaict
20160610 20:13:19< celticminstrel> What about https://forums.wesnoth.org
20160610 20:13:39-!- prkc [~prkc@192.40.89.14] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160610 20:13:39< iceiceice_osx> This site uses HTTP Strict Transport Security (HSTS) to specify that Firefox only connect to it securely. As a result, it is not possible to add an exception for this certificate.
20160610 20:14:28< iceiceice_osx> maybe i need to update my firefox or something
20160610 20:14:32< mattsc> iceiceice_osx: I’m using firefox and OS X, and I have no problem getting to either site
20160610 20:15:23< Elvish_Hunter> iceiceice_osx: I get a slightly different error, in the sense that my message doesn't talk about HSTS and I can add an exception.
20160610 20:15:38< Elvish_Hunter> However, you can use https://wesnoth.org/irclogs/
20160610 20:16:01< celticminstrel> Yeah, I still see the error and can add an exception (for irclogs.wesnoth.org).
20160610 20:17:04< mattsc> Hmm, I should add that I might have added an exception at some point, I don’t remember
20160610 20:17:06< iceiceice_osx> i wonder if i can update the root certificates somehow
20160610 20:17:07< iceiceice_osx> http://pastebin.com/qeSNuCpc
20160610 20:18:28< iceiceice_osx> or maybe i can disable HSTS
20160610 20:19:20-!- stikonas [~stikonas@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160610 20:20:01< Elvish_Hunter> Maybe you can install Let's Encrypt root certificate. You can find it here: https://letsencrypt.org/certificates/
20160610 20:21:13-!- wedge010 [~Thunderbi@60-241-236-92.static.tpgi.com.au] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160610 20:21:57< iceiceice_osx> ok im going to try that
20160610 20:22:21-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
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20160610 20:23:09< iceiceice_osx> ok, i think it installed, but it didnt fix wesnoth.org
20160610 20:23:33< iceiceice_osx> i'm out of ideas for now and i have to go, if i find a work around will post back
20160610 20:23:36< Elvish_Hunter> Same error message?
20160610 20:23:39< iceiceice_osx> yeah same thing
20160610 20:23:49< iceiceice_osx> SEC_ERROR_UNKNOWN_ISSUER
20160610 20:24:14< iceiceice_osx> bye
20160610 20:24:19-!- iceiceice_osx [~chris@ext-74.ias.edu] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
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20160610 20:26:30< Elvish_Hunter> You know, iceiceice isn't the only one having the same problem. Yomar has it too: https://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=17&t=44233
20160610 20:26:54< celticminstrel> Should we poke Rhonda about this?
20160610 20:28:17< celticminstrel> I wonder if it's possible to have the redirection subdomains (such as irclogs.wesnoth.org) require non-secure connections which then redirect to the proper path on a secure connection.
20160610 20:28:28< Elvish_Hunter> Probably yes. However, it's worth noting that Yomar told me that he uses Firefox 43.
20160610 20:28:39< celticminstrel> I think I'm on 47 or so.
20160610 20:28:42< celticminstrel> Or 46.
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20160610 20:28:57< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#9609 (master - 50e8fcd : Alexander van Gessel): The build has errored.
20160610 20:28:57< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/136793412
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20160610 20:28:59< celticminstrel> I can't check right now because Firefox is being a pain as usual.
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20160610 20:30:03< Elvish_Hunter> Or maybe, the certificate could be made valid for irclogs.wesnoth.org as well.
20160610 20:30:16< celticminstrel> I think Rhonda said that wasn't possible for some reason.
20160610 20:30:43< celticminstrel> bugs.wesnoth.org is also affected by this.
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20160610 20:36:53< Elvish_Hunter> 20160315 11:43:42< Rhonda> celticminstrel: That domain doesn't do anything but redirect.  And it's even just a .htaccess file instead of its own vhost …
20160610 20:37:26< Elvish_Hunter> 20160315 11:44:29< Rhonda> I would know how to do the exceptions in the vhost, didn't dare to touch the .htaccess to make the acme directory still accessible under the different name, too.
20160610 20:41:14< celticminstrel> Why does Firefox use so much memory...
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20160610 20:57:53< Aginor> AI0867: yes, youäre absolutely right. I don't know what I was thinking, or even "if" when I did it
20160610 20:58:37< Aginor> AI0867: thanks
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20160610 21:05:36< Aginor> we use skype at work for team communication, have evaluated hipchat and slack. They all have shortcomings in various ways and brokenage. I might also add that we're mostly a Linux shop at work
20160610 21:06:30< Aginor> and I so feel like I slept through the party :D
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20160610 21:20:08< Aginor> shadowm: I'm stealing your roadmap from https://wiki.wesnoth.org/User:Shadowmaster/DevelopmentRoadmap
20160610 21:20:46< Aginor> shadowm: do you want to keep a number of things like  SDL_ttf dependency dropped and  Automatic WML cache cleanup assigned to you_
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20160610 21:31:32< Aginor> there, I've done my bit for progressing the 1.14 discussion
20160610 21:32:06< Aginor> for the record, I too don't think it makes sense to move to 2.0 after 1.14 for the same reasons iceiceice stated
20160610 21:33:41< Aginor> shadowm: apologies if I spelled your name wrong, I was meaning to double-check before sending but I forgot
20160610 21:55:31< Aginor> loonycyborg: I managed to get you and iceiceice confused, my apologies.
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20160610 22:06:54< lipkab> 1.12 should have been 2.0.
20160610 22:07:14< lipkab> ...but we let that chance slip.
20160610 22:07:30< shadowm> Why should it have been 2.0?
20160610 22:07:53< lipkab> Because it was a really big leap.
20160610 22:08:08< shadowm> Yes, how?
20160610 22:08:23< lipkab> Lots of new art, features, UI changes... lots of stuff.
20160610 22:08:48< shadowm> You should point to more specific stuff, otherwise we could make the same case for 1.6 and others.
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20160610 22:09:24< shadowm> Also, I'm sure that if you ask past users they'll disagree that 1.12 is different enough from 1.10 in gameplay and content to justify the bump.
20160610 22:09:36< Aginor> I don't think a 2.0 makes much sense as a version unless we talk about a rewrite, and I think that's a good way to kill the game
20160610 22:10:09< shadowm> (It doesn't even have new campaigns or units. Khalifate barely counts given its chronic neglect from its devs and it did previously land in a development series before being pulled out at the last minute.)
20160610 22:10:56< shadowm> (This, by the way, is the stuff users -- players -- see, not the shiny toys we devs and content creators play around with.)
20160610 22:11:51< shadowm> Aginor: Um, no, I'm still unlikely to do much development stuff for the remainder of this cycle.
20160610 22:11:55< lipkab> shadowm: AI improvements, new multiplayer interface, new map art, HttT & lots of other portraits.
20160610 22:12:05< Aginor> shadowm: that's what I suspected ;)
20160610 22:12:13< shadowm> We need to drop SDL_ttf because As You Know there's a major bug involving it.
20160610 22:12:18< Aginor> lipkab: as a user, that's small fixes
20160610 22:12:32< lipkab> New UI theme.
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20160610 22:12:50< gfgtdf> are there changes that at soem point most unit will have movement animations?
20160610 22:12:57< lipkab> It was waaaay bigger than what we had in 1.10.
20160610 22:13:00< Aginor> lipkab: as a user, I don't appreciate the effort for that either, it's just drawing pictures right? easy?
20160610 22:13:29< Aginor> shadowm: what Major Bug do you refer to?
20160610 22:13:35< shadowm> Spoken like a true user. :p
20160610 22:13:38< Aginor> I'm not sure I know
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20160610 22:14:07< shadowm> Aginor: You can go to the bug tracker and set the filter to only display open Private bugs.
20160610 22:14:35< shadowm> You have to be logged in for that, of course.
20160610 22:15:00< lipkab> Aginor: Yeah, probably, but game isn't going to be redesigned and being stuck in 1.x forever is kind of lame.
20160610 22:15:16< Aginor> shadowm: thanks
20160610 22:15:18< shadowm> Okay, I guess there's no wy to filter by visibility, so filter by highest severity instead.
20160610 22:16:02< zookeeper> gfgtdf, at this pace, maybe in 2030?
20160610 22:16:10< zookeeper> why do you ask?
20160610 22:16:24< lipkab> Okay, maybe all that new stuff wasn't a good reason to bump to 2.0, but at least it would have been a good *excuse*.
20160610 22:16:40< shadowm> Aginor: You people use Skype on Linux at work? I thought that was dead.
20160610 22:17:22< Aginor> shadowm: it is
20160610 22:17:28< Aginor> shadowm: I don't like it
20160610 22:17:53< Aginor> shadowm: there's unfortunately a lot of momentum by the time you have everyone in the company using it
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20160610 22:19:48< gfgtdf> zookeeper: just wondering, i just don't like that currently most unit levitate around the map like chess pieces, 
20160610 22:20:16< shadowm> I like that aesthetic, actually. :p
20160610 22:21:11< shadowm> In order for movement animations to shine, they must be played at 1.0x speed, which artificially increases the amount of time a player's turn.
20160610 22:21:30< Aginor> animated movement wouldn't be too hard, but I think we should make each unit an instance for that, then they can individually worry about animations and the like instead of having global handlers :)
20160610 22:21:32< shadowm> So I tend to play at 1.75x instead.
20160610 22:21:36< zookeeper> yeah something like walking animations are just utterly pointless in my view, since i can't see them.
20160610 22:21:39< Aginor> yes, that
20160610 22:23:21< zookeeper> i can see a flying unit flapping its wings or the (rubber?) horses bouncing about, but something like the dwarves and saurians running just looks terrible because of the directional running anims.
20160610 22:23:42 * zookeeper shrugs
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20160610 22:24:37< zookeeper> but i'm long since resigned to the fact that our animation goals don't match my sense of aesthetics nor achievability
20160610 22:25:21< zookeeper> which is why i should finally get this one animation-related add-on published after sitting on it for months...
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20160610 22:31:26< ancestral> Perhaps I’m in the minority, but some of the horse movement appears… strange
20160610 22:31:51< loonycyborg> shadowm: is SDL_ttf even used in GUI2 with pangocairo?
20160610 22:32:05< ancestral> But maybe that’s like what shadowm said earlier, only works well at 1.0x
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20160610 22:32:37< ancestral> loonycyborg: I think celticminstrel was saying it may be possible to switch away from SDL_ttf?
20160610 22:33:42< shadowm> loonycyborg: No.
20160610 22:34:13< ancestral> Some things in the game still use SDL_ttf but could be converted?
20160610 22:34:25< loonycyborg> so it's basically finishing gui2 transition
20160610 22:34:35< vultraz> zookeeper: isn't that what we were discussing the other day, about addon timings?
20160610 22:34:40< shadowm> That's too much work. My idea was to replace SDL_ttf calls with ttext.
20160610 22:34:59< shadowm> Since the bug in question really shouldn't be taking this long to fix.
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20160610 22:35:30< vultraz> Can we do that easily?
20160610 22:35:31< ancestral> vultraz: I’ll reply to your email soon. As far as the version designation — what does it mean to be 2.0? — it probably matters little.
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20160610 22:35:44< shadowm> vultraz: No.
20160610 22:37:45< vultraz> ancestral: I did at the time want 1.12 to be 2.0, but now I see that rewrite-level changes are needed. Like I said to zookeeper the other day, it's really just sad how difficult it is to do certain things we can do, not to mention the things we are restricted from doing that would make the player's experience better.
20160610 22:37:54< vultraz> BUT this is my opinion
20160610 22:38:28< ancestral> The Steam release will need polish, so in a way, once it’s released, one could kind of think of that as 2.0, as, heck, it will be a significant milestone.
20160610 22:38:57< ancestral> On the other hand, you could also think of it as the final updated version, that Steam will hopefully bring an influx of users and maybe some devs, who may have fresh perspectives and ideas, and 2.0 could be the byproduct of new blood.
20160610 22:39:12< vultraz> That is one thing I'm hoping for
20160610 22:39:13< ancestral> Of course, lots of ifs. Wesnoth could get released and go unnoticed for all we know.
20160610 22:41:01< vultraz> Dave and Jet seem to think a complete rewrite in Anura (a small prototype exists) is the way to go. I don't know if that's the best decision, but we'll see when the time comes.
20160610 22:41:12< vultraz> The worst thing we can do is not make any decision
20160610 22:41:42< ancestral> The worst thing is no one cares and everyone leaves the project.
20160610 22:42:02< zookeeper> vultraz, what addon timings? O.o
20160610 22:42:12< Yaiyan> Complete rewrites are rarely a good idea
20160610 22:42:14< vultraz> zookeeper: bah. animation timings.
20160610 22:42:53< ancestral> Yaiyan: On this scale, it’s pretty difficult.
20160610 22:43:22< vultraz> It's possible, just very difficult
20160610 22:43:26< zookeeper> vultraz, you'll have to refresh my memory on whatever it was about specifically :P
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20160610 22:44:03< vultraz> zookeeper: I was saying it'd be nice if we had a way to make animations not suck at accelerated speed by doing something other than speeding them up
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20160610 22:44:16< zookeeper> vultraz, oh, right, that
20160610 22:44:19< ancestral> vultraz: I have some time tonight, and Sunday. I’ll do what I can to fix the trailer by Sunday.
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20160610 22:44:26< ancestral> Sorry it’s been taking so long.
20160610 22:44:41< vultraz> zookeeper: I consider that a 2.0 target
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20160610 22:45:05< zookeeper> vultraz, but no, that wouldn't help me since the problem is the unit movement is too fast for me to see the animation, no matter how fast the animation plays. and i don't want the movement to be any slower.
20160610 22:45:49< Yaiyan> Wouldn't help with multiplayer, but could lots of units be made to move simultaneously?
20160610 22:46:04< vultraz> again, it's supposed to be about something other than speed of animation
20160610 22:46:06< Yaiyan> Would make NR more bearable, if you didn't mind missing some strategic points
20160610 22:46:34< vultraz> Yaiyan: it's something to consider
20160610 22:46:40< ancestral> Yaiyan: It’s a long requested but far from easy feature to implement that I’m afraid no devs atm feel confident in tackling any time soon
20160610 22:47:05< ancestral> Actually, I might be talking about something else
20160610 22:47:14< ancestral> Simultaneous turns
20160610 22:47:36< vultraz> ancestral: I think he means moving a new unit before one has finished visually moving to a new location
20160610 22:47:40< ancestral> Yeah
20160610 22:47:45< ancestral> I just realized that
20160610 22:47:46< zookeeper> Yaiyan, what would already help a lot would be if unit movement didn't block the UI. so you could do a move, and while the unit is moving you could already select another and move it, etc.
20160610 22:47:55< Yaiyan> I mean buffering all of an AIs moves and showing them at once
20160610 22:48:12< zookeeper> same with a lot of other animations. but of course we can't easily do any of that.
20160610 22:48:20< ancestral> Probably you would have to pre-calculate the turn before movement? That is, what’s to say if one unit moved that it might affect how the AI treats a different unit?
20160610 22:48:25< vultraz> All this stuff is stuff we should look at as 2.0 targets
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20160610 22:49:03< Yaiyan> Either way, I have far too small an ability in C++ to be able to help out at all
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20160610 22:53:27< Aginor> Yaiyan: don't sell yourself short :)
20160610 22:54:34< Yaiyan> Aginor, it's one of the only languages I just can't my head around :.)
20160610 22:54:49< zookeeper> yeah, you can spend a few years practising and you'll still probably get to be the one to do it :>
20160610 22:54:52< Yaiyan> C is fine, but C++ just has so much extra complexity on it
20160610 22:55:04< Aginor> heh
20160610 22:55:06< zookeeper> hard to argue with that
20160610 22:55:27< Yaiyan> Plus the standard library is fairly huge
20160610 22:55:35< Aginor> c gets rather hard too once you do 3-star programming or higher ;)
20160610 22:56:09< Yaiyan> hehe
20160610 22:56:40< Yaiyan> Only ever used C in uni to be honest, so most of my practice is just in java or python
20160610 22:58:24< Aginor> Yaiyan: c++ and java share the same complexity, they just come with different patterns/practises and libraries
20160610 23:00:16< zookeeper> Aginor, well surely java is much simpler as far as the language itself goes?
20160610 23:00:50< Aginor> I'm thinking about dropping SDL_GPU defines in the code, they're pretty rotten as it stands
20160610 23:01:29< Aginor> lipkab: would you object to this?
20160610 23:01:43< loonycyborg> Yaiyan: read "design and evolution of C++" book by stroustrup
20160610 23:02:00< loonycyborg> it'll seem a lot less wonky if you get rationale behind all those design choices
20160610 23:02:46< vultraz> Aginor: I thought you were keeping them for reference
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20160610 23:03:33< Yaiyan> I already have the C++ programming language by him, which I've been meaning to get all the way through at some point
20160610 23:03:59< Aginor> vultraz: I have started to rethink that
20160610 23:05:37< vultraz> ah, nice, nice
20160610 23:06:05 * Aginor swears
20160610 23:06:11< Aginor> I think I also found my problem
20160610 23:06:20< Aginor> more code making copies instead of passing references
20160610 23:07:50< vultraz> That seems to come up a lot
20160610 23:08:27< Aginor> given the time I've spent fixing that particular quirk, I agree
20160610 23:08:50< Aginor> it's causing values get out of sync and it's wasting cpu-time/resources
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20160610 23:12:39< zookeeper> uh... https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/data/campaigns/Eastern_Invasion/scenarios/05_Northern_Outpost.cfg#L153-L154
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20160610 23:14:05< zookeeper> looks like we now have that 70% in a few other scenarios too
20160610 23:14:38< vultraz> What is that
20160610 23:14:40< vultraz> Why is it 70
20160610 23:15:31< zookeeper> because someone with a wose name
20160610 23:15:49< Yaiyan> oh
20160610 23:15:54< Yaiyan> Forgot to tell make to use all my cores
20160610 23:15:58< Yaiyan> Thought building was taking a while...
20160610 23:16:17< vultraz> heh
20160610 23:16:24< vultraz> zookeeper: will you fix it?
20160610 23:16:37< zookeeper> yeah. not right now, but maybe tomorrow.
20160610 23:17:59< Aginor> Yaiyan: "make -j`grep "core id" /proc/cpuinfo | wc -l`"
20160610 23:19:03< Yaiyan> Aginor, yeah, cheers
20160610 23:19:21< Yaiyan> Already built now :)
20160610 23:19:43< Aginor> Yaiyan: install and use ccache too if you don't have it already
20160610 23:20:16< Yaiyan> Aginor, that means it doesn't have to recompile everything each time?
20160610 23:20:32< Yaiyan> Will do, thanks
20160610 23:20:49< Aginor> Yaiyan: make will do that for you too, but it can make things a lot faster for you, especially if you "make clean" a lot
20160610 23:20:59< Yaiyan> Huhm, interesting
20160610 23:21:21< Aginor> (it caches unlinked symbols)
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20160610 23:22:28< Yaiyan> Fonts look a lot nicer now that before
20160610 23:22:31< Yaiyan> At least in the preferences
20160610 23:22:55< vultraz> are you looking at master?
20160610 23:22:58< Yaiyan> Yeah
20160610 23:23:19< iceiceice> maybe its the improved italics thing
20160610 23:23:23< iceiceice> that i committed like 1 year + ago
20160610 23:27:48< vultraz> or maybe it's the new font?
20160610 23:28:29< iceiceice> is there a new font?
20160610 23:28:37< vultraz> yes
20160610 23:28:39< iceiceice> oh
20160610 23:28:43< iceiceice> when did that happen?
20160610 23:28:43< vultraz> did you not know?
20160610 23:28:50< vultraz> few months ago
20160610 23:28:54< vultraz> 3 maybe
20160610 23:29:05< iceiceice> i didnt compile master in that time, i had some problems like some months before that
20160610 23:29:31< vultraz> ah
20160610 23:29:37< iceiceice> whats the new font?
20160610 23:30:00< vultraz> Lato
20160610 23:30:21< iceiceice> cool
20160610 23:30:40< vultraz> Some have expressed dislike of the new font and want to return to DVS
20160610 23:31:02< iceiceice> you could make it a preference i guess
20160610 23:31:11< iceiceice> but its kind of a pain to make sure allt he guis look good in two fonts
20160610 23:31:27< vultraz> nooo no no
20160610 23:31:30< vultraz> no such preference
20160610 23:31:44< iceiceice> i'm sure you guys agonized over this choice :p
20160610 23:31:47< iceiceice> so probably it looks good
20160610 23:32:19< iceiceice> like when we had the super-professional announcement page for wesnoth 1.12
20160610 23:34:25< loonycyborg> iceiceice: you had problems compiling master?
20160610 23:34:36< iceiceice> some months ago it didn't work for me
20160610 23:34:43< iceiceice> on linux
20160610 23:34:49< iceiceice> but i wasn't trying that hard
20160610 23:34:54< iceiceice> it is working currently
20160610 23:34:58< iceiceice> although not on apple clang
20160610 23:35:24< vultraz> iceiceice: https://drive.google.com/file/d/0B-mR9s8FduLLUkJXWkQzUGROLU0/view?usp=sharing
20160610 23:35:26< loonycyborg> compile errors?
20160610 23:35:28< iceiceice> yes
20160610 23:35:34< iceiceice> loonycyborg, see logs from some days ago i guess
20160610 23:35:39< shadowm> One of the guys who made said super-professional announcement page disapproves of the font choice, so take that as you will.
20160610 23:35:53< shadowm> *in-game font choice
20160610 23:36:21-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds]
20160610 23:36:53< iceiceice> loonycyborg, id ont have my mac with me rihgt now
20160610 23:36:55< iceiceice> but
20160610 23:36:58< iceiceice> iirc i get errors at this line
20160610 23:36:59< iceiceice> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/src/ai/composite/ai.cpp#L82
20160610 23:37:12< iceiceice> where it seems to think that `_1, _2, _3` correspond to boost placeholders and not standard placeholders
20160610 23:37:37< iceiceice> didn't look into it much more than that
20160610 23:37:55< vultraz> I think that was fixed
20160610 23:40:09< gfgtdf> iceiceice: afaik it is intenational that boost_placeholders are used instead of std::placeholders, the reason is that boost unliek std injects its placeholders automatically into global namespace. so since we currently use both boost::bind and std::bind we have to use boost placeholders.
20160610 23:40:31< vultraz> iceiceice: see utils/functional.hpp
20160610 23:40:33< gfgtdf> boost injects their placeholders into global namespace i mwant.
20160610 23:40:39< iceiceice> gfgtfd: can you use boost placeholders with std::bind though?
20160610 23:40:46< iceiceice> i think that's not ok
20160610 23:41:08< iceiceice> i think you have to use the placeholder corresponding to the bind you are using in each case
20160610 23:41:38< gfgtdf> iceiceice: hmm see the comment in the fole vultraz linked, iirc celticminstrel wrote that code so he migth know teh details
20160610 23:41:43< gfgtdf> file*
20160610 23:44:32< iceiceice> hmm ok
20160610 23:44:35< iceiceice> maybe its some clang bug then
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20160610 23:51:26< gfgtdf> iceiceice: what is your exact error message ?
20160610 23:51:37< iceiceice> i dont remember, i dont have the machine
20160610 23:52:44< gfgtdf> iceiceice: ok
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20160610 23:53:32< gfgtdf> iceiceice: you get it from all our usecases of std::bind or jut in that file ?
20160610 23:53:44< iceiceice> the compilation stopped at that file
20160610 23:53:49< iceiceice> i can check again when i get home
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20160610 23:58:21< celticminstrel> iceiceice: The C++ library provides a mechanism to define arbitrary types as placeholders.
20160610 23:58:40< celticminstrel> So, with a couple of extra lines of code, you can enable it to use Boost placeholders.
20160610 23:58:47< iceiceice> yeah i looked into it wiht your thing, i didnt know about that
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20160610 23:58:54< iceiceice> its pretty cool
20160610 23:58:58< celticminstrel> Nor did I, until this issue came up.
20160610 23:59:27< celticminstrel> I guess I can start looking into the locale stuff now...
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--- Log closed Sat Jun 11 00:00:14 2016