--- Log opened Sat Aug 06 00:00:05 2016
--- Day changed Sat Aug 06 2016
20160806 00:00:05< celmin> True enough.
20160806 00:00:42< irker708> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 2e92e9ecc166 / src/attack_prediction_display.cpp: Use proper weapons damage separator in attack prediction display https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/2e92e9ecc166b28ab356f2b7a997ff7c7a05a03c
20160806 00:01:14< vultraz> I want us to try to aim for 1.13.6 fairly soon
20160806 00:01:30< vultraz> say, by next month.
20160806 00:01:34< vultraz> not 5 months fromnow
20160806 00:02:05< vultraz> issues like the ; in the command line and the unit preview pane layout stuff are fairly annoying.
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20160806 00:02:27< vultraz> therefor we should try to push a release with these fixes relatively soon.
20160806 00:02:50< vultraz> for reference, 1.13.4 was in March
20160806 00:02:53< vultraz> 1.13.5 in July.
20160806 00:04:25< vultraz> We've already fixed a number of visible issues
20160806 00:04:39< vultraz> LEt's try to get the rest fixed and 1.13.6 by September.
20160806 00:04:42< vultraz> out by*
20160806 00:04:44< jamit> So September, if you want to be boring and predictable? :)
20160806 00:05:21< vultraz> yup
20160806 00:07:03< fabi> vultraz: I have some connection problems, did you get my question regarding "FOREACH"?
20160806 00:07:10< vultraz> yes
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20160806 00:08:59< irker708> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 491fa9190635 / data/core/macros/ (deprecated-utils.cfg utils.cfg): Deprecated FOREACH and NEXT https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/491fa9190635ae928d336b86d914539975983483
20160806 00:09:14< vultraz> (we still need to add actual messages for all of these)
20160806 00:09:19< celmin> Unfortunately the change to {NEXT} breaks some addons, BTW.
20160806 00:09:26< celmin> (Not this change, the original change.)
20160806 00:09:47< celmin> Remind me to try adding #deprecated to the preprocessor.
20160806 00:10:22< celmin> I wonder if there's a function to distinguish a local addon from a downloaded addon.
20160806 00:10:23< fabi> vultraz, celmin: I think this one could be handled by just expanding those 2 macros during the wmllint run.
20160806 00:10:45< celmin> It's not that simple, actually.
20160806 00:10:57< celmin> Since some people used {NEXT} without {FOREACH}.
20160806 00:10:58< vultraz> wmllint is not that intelligent
20160806 00:11:03< vultraz> and that
20160806 00:11:05< celmin> Also that.
20160806 00:11:05< vultraz> very ugly
20160806 00:11:16< celmin> (With a different header instead of {FOREACH} of course.)
20160806 00:11:27< zookeeper> we don't need to add messages nor actually remove any macros that we have no technical reason to remove
20160806 00:11:28< fabi> oh
20160806 00:11:50< celmin> Still, I think wmllint could warn about use of these macros, or something.
20160806 00:12:21< zookeeper> if a macro intrinsically relies on engine functionality we no longer can have, then yes it makes sense to deprecate and remove, but there's no reason to remove or complain about macros that can just happily live forever in deprecated-utils.cfg.
20160806 00:12:51< vultraz> deprecated-utils is supposed to be cleaned out periodically 
20160806 00:12:59< vultraz> in this case, in 1.15
20160806 00:13:02< zookeeper> and we have this exact same discussion regularly
20160806 00:13:04< celmin> I wonder if we should maybe revert the FOREACH/NEXT macros to their old form though.
20160806 00:13:14< celmin> (Leaving them in deprecated-utils, of course.)
20160806 00:13:20< vultraz> perhaps, celmin 
20160806 00:13:22< zookeeper> don't bother people with stuff you don't need to bother them with.
20160806 00:13:40< vultraz> zookeeper: I very much disagree.
20160806 00:13:47< vultraz> We should make people use cleaner WML.
20160806 00:13:47< celmin> Zookeeper has a point about there being no need to bother cleaning out deprecated-utils.
20160806 00:13:58< zookeeper> vultraz, good thing that you're wrong then :J
20160806 00:14:05< vultraz> I say you're wrong
20160806 00:14:08< zookeeper> no you are
20160806 00:14:10< celmin> ...
20160806 00:14:12< celmin> Wow.
20160806 00:14:12< vultraz> you are
20160806 00:14:17< celmin> This is incredible.
20160806 00:14:18< zookeeper> you're twice as wrong as me!
20160806 00:14:26< celmin> Inconceivable.
20160806 00:14:28< vultraz> you're three times as wrong as you think I am
20160806 00:14:31< celmin> ...
20160806 00:14:48< zookeeper> you're a hundred million zillion times more wrong
20160806 00:14:48< celmin> I'd say impossible, but my eyes disprove that.
20160806 00:14:54 * zookeeper wins!
20160806 00:15:01 * fabi thinks that the traditional way of dealing with wml incompatibilities between major versions is that it is good when wmllint can handle it.
20160806 00:15:15< celmin> BTW vultraz, what about {REPEAT}?
20160806 00:15:16< fabi> We do that since ages.
20160806 00:15:40< vultraz> celmin: oh, right, you implemented [repeat]
20160806 00:15:41< fabi> And we should not freeze an api that is that ugly.
20160806 00:16:03< vultraz> yeah should do that
20160806 00:16:18< vultraz> well, even if we don't clean out the file we should have a warning SOMEWHERE
20160806 00:16:38< vultraz> celmin: I think REPEAT can just be reimplemented
20160806 00:16:52< vultraz> FOREACH and NEXT relied on bad design by default
20160806 00:16:52< celmin> Huh? DId I remove it?
20160806 00:17:01< vultraz> no, I mean redesigned
20160806 00:17:05< vultraz> to use [repeat]
20160806 00:17:10< celmin> Oh. I thought I did that already.
20160806 00:18:14< vultraz> oh you did
20160806 00:18:15< vultraz> ok
20160806 00:18:20< vultraz> oh, btw
20160806 00:18:36< vultraz> bumbadadabum: you're still supposed to do something about FORCE_CHANCE_TO_HIT
20160806 00:18:41< vultraz> you said you would ages ago
20160806 00:18:59< bumbadadabum> oh
20160806 00:19:01< bumbadadabum> I might've
20160806 00:19:07< bumbadadabum> when I get my laptop repaired
20160806 00:19:17< zookeeper> do what? about the macro or its uses?
20160806 00:19:23< fabi> Just imagine a world in which add-ons would need zero porting effort between major releases. And they would just got uploaded with every new major version. 
20160806 00:19:29< vultraz> re-implement it better 
20160806 00:19:34< vultraz> so it's not such a bloat 
20160806 00:19:56< fabi> And we had 5000 addons on the server.
20160806 00:20:01< celmin> fabi: For zero porting effort you need to freeze the API no matter how ugly.
20160806 00:20:15< celmin> And/or automatically port on the fly.
20160806 00:20:18< vultraz> fabi: and UMC authors would need to use consistent style and clean code
20160806 00:20:24< fabi> Wait
20160806 00:20:26< celmin> No they wouldn't.
20160806 00:20:28< vultraz> many UMC authors do not even use wmlindent and wmllint
20160806 00:20:39< fabi> I am trying to do a point against a stable api.
20160806 00:20:47< celmin> There is no reason for UMC authors to use wmlindent.
20160806 00:20:48< celmin> Ever.
20160806 00:20:53< fabi> Let me say it the other way around:
20160806 00:20:54< vultraz> why not?
20160806 00:20:56< zookeeper> why would you spend time and effort re-implementing a macro that's rarely used, everyone typically hates anyway, and isn't even very bloated to begin with (some 150 lines or so), and works?
20160806 00:20:56< vultraz> :P
20160806 00:20:58< vultraz> I always use it
20160806 00:21:08< celmin> wmlindent is for mainline.
20160806 00:21:16< vultraz> it's for all WML
20160806 00:21:19< vultraz> not just mainline
20160806 00:21:21< fabi> I think changing the api and forcing active porting effort is what keeps the addon server clean.
20160806 00:21:22< celmin> zookeeper: I seem to recall having problems with it.
20160806 00:21:27< vultraz> what are you smoking, celmin :P
20160806 00:21:36< fabi> You do not do porting efforts for a crappy thing.
20160806 00:21:39< vultraz> it's a wml indenter
20160806 00:21:45< zookeeper> celmin, did you tell me? :p
20160806 00:21:48< vultraz> not a mainline indenter
20160806 00:21:51< celmin> Though I ended up fixing those problems without changing the macro, I think. Unless I copied the macro into my campaign and fixed it. And yes I told you.
20160806 00:21:59< celmin> Maybe you fixed it. I don't remember.
20160806 00:22:13< celmin> The unit it was applying to lost the magical weapon special.
20160806 00:22:23< vultraz> and wmllint isn't just a "magical conversion script"
20160806 00:22:26< vultraz> it's also a sanity checker
20160806 00:22:32< fabi> So you should need at least have to run a tool like wmllint and reupload it again.
20160806 00:22:35< vultraz> UMC authors should always run both
20160806 00:22:38< zookeeper> celmin, oh yeah i recall that complaint, i... think i fixed it?
20160806 00:22:45< celmin> vultraz: I don't actually know if wmlindent is flexible.
20160806 00:22:57< celmin> But if it forces me to use spaces, I'll never use it.
20160806 00:23:02< vultraz> celmin: if you write you code to comply with it it is
20160806 00:23:17< vultraz> celmin: it makes code space, but you don't have to write in spaces
20160806 00:23:21< vultraz> that's the beauty
20160806 00:23:24< celmin> No.
20160806 00:23:27< celmin> I don't want spaces.
20160806 00:23:27< zookeeper> bumbadadabum, anyway, it's not something i'd suggest trifling with lightly. if you must re-implement it, then make sure there's no regressions and stuff.
20160806 00:23:27< vultraz> write in tabs, distribute in spaces
20160806 00:23:29< celmin> I want tabs.
20160806 00:23:33< celmin> Tabs all the way.
20160806 00:23:36< celmin> Always tabs.
20160806 00:23:37< celmin> Tabs.
20160806 00:23:39< vultraz> then work with C++
20160806 00:23:41< celmin> Never spaces.
20160806 00:23:42< vultraz> :P
20160806 00:23:43< celmin> Tabs.
20160806 00:23:47< celmin> Tabs tabs tabs tabs. ><
20160806 00:23:48< vultraz> jeez, man
20160806 00:23:50< celmin> :P
20160806 00:23:55< vultraz> are you annoymissusus in disguise
20160806 00:23:59< celmin> What XD
20160806 00:24:05< vultraz> this guy
20160806 00:24:10< vultraz> used to be a dev
20160806 00:24:12< vultraz> loved tabs
20160806 00:24:18< vultraz> even made a 'tabify' script
20160806 00:24:25< vultraz> to make his WML use tabs
20160806 00:24:50< celmin> Every so often I notice my WML uses spaces, and fix it to use tabs.
20160806 00:24:50< vultraz> I can never spell his name
20160806 00:24:53< bumbadadabum> zookeeper: yeah I know
20160806 00:25:02< bumbadadabum> I was mostly going to rewrite it to a wml tag
20160806 00:25:04< celmin> (My text editor makes it very easy to convert between tabs and spaces.)
20160806 00:25:06< bumbadadabum> but keep the macro there for now
20160806 00:25:18< celmin> bumbadadabum: So how would it work as a WML tag?
20160806 00:25:28< celmin> bumbadadabum: ActionWML I assume, so in prestart?
20160806 00:25:39< celmin> Or maybe in [abilities]?
20160806 00:25:43< zookeeper> i completely fail to see the point of having something as obscure as that macro as an actual tag
20160806 00:25:52< celmin> Though I feel like that doesn't make sense.
20160806 00:26:00< bumbadadabum> zookeeper: idk it was a long time ago
20160806 00:26:06< vultraz> there should be some simple way to enforce CTH
20160806 00:26:16< bumbadadabum> mind you, I never got to it because I could not find an elegant way to do it
20160806 00:26:22< celmin> vultraz: There's abilities, and accuracy and parry.
20160806 00:26:26< bumbadadabum> and kinda forgot about it now
20160806 00:26:33< zookeeper> vultraz, like [chance_to_hit]?
20160806 00:26:33< vultraz> we still have that?
20160806 00:26:34< bumbadadabum> until vultraz brought it up again
20160806 00:26:55< celmin> Yes, because I complained when gfgtdf removed it because I'd worked on it a little.
20160806 00:27:03< celmin> And documented it as well.
20160806 00:27:05< vultraz> then again, accuracy doesn't work against specific targets
20160806 00:27:12< celmin> True.
20160806 00:27:20< zookeeper> the simple way to enforce CTH is [chance_to_hit], which just happens to be what the current macro utilizes. :p
20160806 00:27:33< vultraz> well
20160806 00:27:37< vultraz> then maybe it's not worthchanging
20160806 00:28:01< zookeeper> things that aren't a problem for anyone rarely are
20160806 00:28:36 * zookeeper goes to fall asleep
20160806 00:29:00< celmin> Someone should consider rewriting {SCATTER_UNITS} to use the WML tag.
20160806 00:29:09< celmin> Oh wait, I spoke too soon.
20160806 00:29:14< celmin> It's been done, heh.
20160806 00:29:16< bumbadadabum> but yeah, I think at the time I just didn't like macros like that
20160806 00:29:38< bumbadadabum> also why I rewrote some other macros to WML
20160806 00:29:45< bumbadadabum> well, wml tags
20160806 00:30:18< celmin> I feel like {FORCE_CHANCE_TO_HIT} could be redone with an [object] and [remove_object]...
20160806 00:30:40< celmin> Also, zookeeper is right, it doesn't make sense for it to be ActionWML since it's events.
20160806 00:30:56< bumbadadabum> yeah, idk
20160806 00:31:02< bumbadadabum> the macro just seemed inelegant at the time
20160806 00:31:07< vultraz> all large sources of WML should be made into Lua
20160806 00:31:07< bumbadadabum> but as I said, I never found a good way to do it
20160806 00:31:09< vultraz> or not-WML
20160806 00:31:10< bumbadadabum> so I didn't
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20160806 00:51:12< irker708> wesnoth: Celtic Minstrel wesnoth:wml_tag_porting bc77bc308a93 / / (9 files in 4 dirs): Properly port [modify_side] to Lua https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/bc77bc308a937c41fbb98fb1cdd8388c9518a7cd
20160806 00:51:13< celmin> ^ Again, haven't tested it yet.
20160806 00:51:14< irker708> wesnoth: Celtic Minstrel wesnoth:wml_tag_porting bc4efcc974b3 / data/lua/wml-tags.lua src/ai/manager.cpp src/scripting/game_lua_kernel.cpp: Properly port [modify_ai] to Lua https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/bc4efcc974b308e16ce42627a31432643305a824
20160806 00:51:17< celmin> ^ Or that
20160806 00:51:43< celmin> I only verified that it builds, which is obviously insufficient.
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20160806 01:10:57< ancestral> Okay, seeing the X in the damage/attack formula makes me happy
20160806 01:12:54< ancestral> Is someone working on the Li’sar attack animation?
20160806 01:18:32< celmin> Not as far as I know?
20160806 01:18:36< celmin> What attack animation?
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20160806 01:25:15< vultraz> uh..dont think so
20160806 01:29:32< ancestral> celticminstrel, vultraz: In the tutorial
20160806 01:29:48< ancestral> You know, maybe the first thing people will play ;-)
20160806 01:29:50< celticminstrel> ...huh?
20160806 01:30:04< ancestral> When you choose Li’sar to play with in the Tutorial
20160806 01:30:10< ancestral> When she attacks the Quintain
20160806 01:30:40< ancestral> She just feels very static
20160806 01:31:16< celticminstrel> I think that sprite is supposed to be replaced anyway, though.
20160806 01:32:24< ancestral> Unless it has and the animation just hasn’t been finished?
20160806 01:32:30< ancestral> She does appear different to me
20160806 01:32:40< celticminstrel> She looks the same to me.
20160806 01:33:02< celticminstrel> Same as in 1.10, even.
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20160806 01:37:11< ancestral> celticminstrel: 3 months ago: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/data/campaigns/tutorial/images/units/human-princess.png
20160806 01:37:27< ancestral> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/tree/master/data/campaigns/tutorial/images/units no li'sar attack anims
20160806 01:38:04< ancestral> Yeah the ones in HttT are old
20160806 01:38:10< ancestral> Well, complete though
20160806 01:38:14< ancestral> Wait
20160806 01:38:53< ancestral> Okay looks like they aren’t done. Okay! :)
20160806 01:39:05< ancestral> (Jetrel would probably know)
20160806 01:39:13< celticminstrel> Oh.
20160806 01:39:28< ancestral> I do like the new base frame however
20160806 01:39:32< celticminstrel> Yeah.
20160806 01:43:11< celticminstrel> So, why wasn't it updated in HTTT?
20160806 01:43:23< ancestral> Because it’s not complete?
20160806 01:43:32< ancestral> The base frame is actually in the httt scenario too, just not used
20160806 01:43:45< celticminstrel> Then why was it put in the tutorial?
20160806 01:43:53< ancestral> Great question, for testing?
20160806 01:43:57< ancestral> Maybe an oversight?
20160806 01:44:18< ancestral> “Welcome to the development branch?”
20160806 01:49:39< celticminstrel> I think the Lua API functions like get_units, get_sides, get_locations should return a userdata instead of an array-like table.
20160806 01:49:50< celticminstrel> Might make them more efficient for iterating over.
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20160806 01:51:59< mattsc> celticminstrel: just to follow up on yesterday, if you want to make the MESSAGE macro behavior consistent with previous versions until it is deprecated/removed, you don’t have to change wesnoth.message.  You can do that easily with the macro itself.
20160806 01:52:07< mattsc> That’s probably obvious, but I thought I mention it anyway.
20160806 01:52:25< celticminstrel> You can? I don't know how.
20160806 01:52:41< celticminstrel> Feel free to do it if you know how, I guess.
20160806 01:52:57< mattsc> https://github.com/mattsc/Galuldur-git/blob/master/Galuldur/utils/Galuldur_utils.cfg#L3
20160806 01:53:26< mattsc> That doesn’t help people who have their own variations of the macro in their UMC, of course, (like I do), but oh well.
20160806 01:53:40< celticminstrel> I see.
20160806 02:10:42< celticminstrel> Ugh, wesnoth.animate_unit is dumb too.
20160806 02:10:56< celticminstrel> But I think fixing it is impossible.
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20160806 02:17:42< celticminstrel> Anyone have any idea what the comment at src/units/udisplay.cpp:811 is talking about?
20160806 02:19:25< irker708> wesnoth: Celtic Minstrel wesnoth:wml_tag_porting b24e56b121bf / / (4 files in 4 dirs): Properly port [heal_unit] to Lua https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/b24e56b121bfc22201b71c815237a22b3d9d9686
20160806 02:25:01< irker708> wesnoth: ancestral wesnoth:ancestral_tutorial_changes aee64eeff637 / data/campaigns/tutorial/scenarios/ (01_Tutorial_part_1.cfg 02_Tutorial_part_2.cfg): * Changed the attack and damage text to include the new separator, '×'. https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/aee64eeff637546aa7e544d95ebc66f104bf2b67
20160806 02:25:51< celticminstrel> You should probably put a general description on the first line...
20160806 02:26:04< ancestral> Okay
20160806 02:30:26< irker708> wesnoth: ancestral wesnoth:ancestral_tutorial_changes 1cf4f067ea8a / data/campaigns/tutorial/scenarios/ (01_Tutorial_part_1.cfg 02_Tutorial_part_2.cfg): Changed text in tutorial to make it easier to understand how the tutorial works  https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/1cf4f067ea8ad03fe485c8288d6044769aa00f4d
20160806 02:42:40< vultraz> I approve of these changes
20160806 02:44:27< vultraz> celticminstrel, ancestral: I don't think the tutorial ever had the animations she did in HttT
20160806 02:44:35< vultraz> of course, there are no animations for the new sprite
20160806 02:49:12< SigurdFD> I think the whole choice about when to move to the tutorial's 2nd scenario should be removed.
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20160806 02:56:25< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#10163 (wml_tag_porting - bc4efcc : Celtic Minstrel): The build has errored.
20160806 02:56:25< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/150200897
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20160806 02:59:07< celticminstrel> SigurdFD: Uh, why?
20160806 02:59:49< vultraz> Well, it isn't really standard wesnoth gameplay
20160806 03:00:17< ancestral> The tutorial could be compeltely overhauled… and various people attempted, and never finished
20160806 03:00:23< ancestral> I’m just making cosmetic changes
20160806 03:00:41< ancestral> Until someone does overhaul it
20160806 03:02:06< celticminstrel> I don't think it really matters that much if it's not standard Wesnoth gameplay. Most of the first scenario isn't standard Wesnoth gameplay anyway.
20160806 03:02:21< celticminstrel> Maybe all of it, even.
20160806 03:02:27< SigurdFD> celticminstrel: It seems an unnecessary decision for someone learning the game, and they miss stuff if they do choose to skip ahead.
20160806 03:03:37< ancestral> The goal is to teach the gameplay
20160806 03:04:20< ancestral> The first scenario is movement, attacking and recruiting, I would say very important topics
20160806 03:05:07< celticminstrel> They don't miss stuff.
20160806 03:05:14< celticminstrel> That bit of the scenario is just more attacking.
20160806 03:05:23< celticminstrel> Which they've already done.
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20160806 03:09:58< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#10165 (ancestral_tutorial_changes - aee64ee : ancestral): The build has errored.
20160806 03:09:59< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/150212277
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20160806 03:11:58< SigurdFD> there's a message that appears on turn 10. choosing to move on would likely miss it.
20160806 03:12:15< celticminstrel> What's the message about?
20160806 03:12:27< SigurdFD> defense.
20160806 03:12:36< SigurdFD> there are messages each of the previous turns as well
20160806 03:12:41< celticminstrel> Hmm, okay.
20160806 03:16:56< vultraz> ancestral: I made significant improvements to it last year
20160806 03:17:08< ancestral> That’s great
20160806 03:17:38< ancestral> I noticed it’s in better shape than it used to be
20160806 03:17:40< celticminstrel> I did some stuff too. Can't remember what it was besides all the female_texts though...
20160806 03:17:54< ancestral> Lots of {GENDER} tagging
20160806 03:18:09< vultraz> I significantly cleaned up the code too
20160806 03:18:25< vultraz> I think I also improved the content too
20160806 03:18:32< vultraz> ALso did the dialog
20160806 03:19:00< ancestral> Okay, errors in master
20160806 03:19:15< celticminstrel> Right, I did lots of gender stuff, but I think there was something else too.
20160806 03:19:46< ancestral> https://paste.ee/p/Lj47B
20160806 03:20:24 * vultraz has no idea
20160806 03:20:34< celticminstrel> That most likely means a file is missing from the XCode project, which implies you're not on the tip of master.
20160806 03:20:42< ancestral> https://paste.ee/p/xz1S0
20160806 03:20:44< celticminstrel> Though I dunno, it could be something else.
20160806 03:20:45< ancestral> Okay
20160806 03:21:46< ancestral> Missing vtable?
20160806 03:22:18< celticminstrel> Missing vtable usually occurs when you have a class with virtual functions, none of which have been defined.
20160806 03:22:39< celticminstrel> For example, if you included the header somewhere, but forgot to compile in the source file.
20160806 03:22:54< ancestral> menu_events
20160806 03:23:04< ancestral>       events::menu_handler::recall(int, map_location const&) in menu_events.o
20160806 03:23:19< celticminstrel> That's not relevant, the issue is tunit_recall.
20160806 03:23:49< ancestral> This file is red for me: reference_counted_object.hpp
20160806 03:24:01< celticminstrel> I thought I removed that.
20160806 03:24:18< celticminstrel> Yeah, I removed it.
20160806 03:24:27< ancestral> Okay
20160806 03:24:42< ancestral> I still need to commit a new version of the project file
20160806 03:25:37< ancestral> Actually, that’s probably my issue
20160806 03:25:55< ancestral> unit_recall.cpp needs to be added
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20160806 03:26:19< celticminstrel> Yes.
20160806 03:26:33< celticminstrel> But better to just update to master and get the fix that way.
20160806 03:26:51< ancestral> Then I’ll have to fix all the refs
20160806 03:26:52< ancestral> Alright
20160806 03:27:08< celticminstrel> Well, you can stash if you want.
20160806 03:27:14< ancestral> Nah it’s fine
20160806 03:27:20< celticminstrel> Then you won't have to re-fix all the refs.
20160806 03:27:46< celticminstrel> Oh right, I forgot to test if the build works without the pango modules included.
20160806 03:27:58< celticminstrel> I mean, if it runs without them.
20160806 03:29:00< celticminstrel> I'll test it here, but could you try it as well?
20160806 03:29:23< ancestral> So all the libboosts have new paths
20160806 03:29:28< celticminstrel> Yeah.
20160806 03:29:34< ancestral> So it’s the same name as if you build them in MacPorts or Homebrew
20160806 03:29:40< ancestral> And then I have libreadline.6.dylib
20160806 03:29:47< ancestral> I mean, 6.3
20160806 03:31:03-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@173.240.241.83] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
20160806 03:31:06< ancestral> Also, the targets, can’t build with macOS 10.7 SDK; should really be Latest OS X
20160806 03:31:35< celticminstrel> Latest or current should both be fine.
20160806 03:31:36< ancestral> And then maybe I’ll add pcre to the project
20160806 03:31:49< celticminstrel> Latest means I'll build with 10.8, hopefully that works out...
20160806 03:32:02< ancestral> celticminstrel: Right, the project currently specifically requests “macOS 10.7 SDK”
20160806 03:32:09< ancestral> Easy fix
20160806 03:32:21< ancestral> So I’ll submit the fixes soon
20160806 03:33:45< celticminstrel> The sRGB stripping made the images quite a bit smaller, like 5MB each.
20160806 03:34:19< celticminstrel> Sometimes less...
20160806 03:34:20< vultraz> indeed
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20160806 03:40:26< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#10164 (wml_tag_porting - b24e56b : Celtic Minstrel): The build has errored.
20160806 03:40:26< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/150211693
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20160806 03:43:07 * vultraz wonders why tuples don't have .first, .second, and .third accessors
20160806 03:43:19< celticminstrel> Because it's impossible.
20160806 03:43:49< vultraz> why?
20160806 03:43:58< vultraz> pairs have .first and .second
20160806 03:44:08< celticminstrel> Pairs are only one length.
20160806 03:44:25< vultraz> I thought pairs were 2 members and tuples 3
20160806 03:44:27< vultraz> well, up to 3
20160806 03:44:29< celticminstrel> The only way to have tuples with first, second, etc would be to have a separate tuple class for each possible length.
20160806 03:44:31< celticminstrel> ...
20160806 03:44:40< celticminstrel> Tuples can be any length you want.
20160806 03:44:48< vultraz> wait, really?
20160806 03:44:51< celticminstrel> Yes.
20160806 03:44:53< vultraz> even above 3?
20160806 03:44:56< celticminstrel> Of course.
20160806 03:45:02< celticminstrel> They can have 100 elements if you want.
20160806 03:45:07< vultraz> this seems like... a weird container
20160806 03:45:23< celticminstrel> It's sort of a cross between an array and a struct.
20160806 03:45:38< celticminstrel> Like a struct with anonymous fields.
20160806 03:45:45< celticminstrel> Unnamed fields. Whatever.
20160806 03:47:32< celticminstrel> If you're using long tuples it's probably better to change them to structs, really.
20160806 03:47:47< celticminstrel> Unless you need std::tie.
20160806 03:48:07< celticminstrel> ...though I suppose you could somehow make that work for a struct...
20160806 03:48:33< celticminstrel> After all, it works for pairs, I think.
20160806 03:49:11< celticminstrel> ...hmm, I suppose it's operator=, so you can't add a new overload. Never mind.
20160806 03:49:27< celticminstrel> (std::tie returns a tuple object similar to std::make_tuple.)
20160806 03:51:06-!- hk238 [~kvirc@t224.ip7.netikka.fi] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160806 03:51:21< vultraz> maybe I mixed tuples up with tribools
20160806 03:51:33< celticminstrel> That sounds impossible.
20160806 03:51:49< celticminstrel> Tribools aren't even a container.
20160806 03:52:54< SigurdFD> celticminstrel: is there a formula console that can be opened in wesnoth? (as opposed to Gamestate Inspector & Lua Console)
20160806 03:53:05< vultraz> yes
20160806 03:53:08< celticminstrel> SigurdFD: Press f
20160806 03:53:21< celticminstrel> It evaluates formulas in the context of the current side's AI.
20160806 03:53:38< celticminstrel> (So any formula variables available to the AI can be used.)
20160806 03:54:29< vultraz> celticminstrel: any more thoughts on merging/connecting the formula and config classes?
20160806 03:54:38< vultraz> and allowing formulas for any key?
20160806 03:54:42< celticminstrel> I don't think it's plausible.
20160806 03:54:46< vultraz> how so
20160806 03:55:02< celticminstrel> Because the variables that a formula should have access to are dependent on where the formula is used.
20160806 03:55:19< celticminstrel> I'm pretty sure this is the same thing I've said every time you bring it up... >_>
20160806 03:55:20< SigurdFD> any idea what it's hotkey prefs name is? (I think I reassigned f)
20160806 03:55:30< vultraz> you have not said that
20160806 03:55:32< celticminstrel> Maybe "evaluate formula"?
20160806 03:55:39< celticminstrel> Or "debug formula"?
20160806 03:55:40< vultraz> and I only brought this up once before
20160806 03:55:54< celticminstrel> I seem to remember at least twice.3
20160806 03:55:59< vultraz> and again, I don't think that's an issue
20160806 03:56:10< vultraz> leave it up to the coder to use certain variables within scope
20160806 03:56:18< vultraz> of they're out-of-scope, they do nothing
20160806 03:56:19< celticminstrel> How is it not an issue?
20160806 03:56:32< vultraz> or they throw an error
20160806 03:56:38< vultraz> in fact, any invalid variable should 
20160806 03:56:43< celticminstrel> Undefined variables evaluate to null in WFL.
20160806 03:56:44< vultraz> for example
20160806 03:57:02< vultraz> hm
20160806 03:57:09< vultraz> well, then, no problem
20160806 03:57:27< celticminstrel> How is there no problem?
20160806 03:57:39< vultraz> or are you saying the problem is to determine the context from the call location?
20160806 03:58:03< celticminstrel> The context depends on the call location, doesn't it?
20160806 03:58:18< vultraz> if it does, HOW IS THIS A PROBLEM
20160806 03:58:20< vultraz> :|
20160806 03:58:36< vultraz> "Because the variables that a formula should have access to are dependent on where the formula is used."
20160806 03:58:44< SigurdFD> it's 'Run formula'
20160806 03:58:48< vultraz> If a variable is used somewhere it isn't accessible, it's null
20160806 03:58:55< vultraz> If it is used somewhere correctly, it's not
20160806 03:58:59< celticminstrel> WFL knows nothing about WML.
20160806 03:59:00< vultraz> Why is this such a problem
20160806 03:59:17< vultraz> Ok
20160806 03:59:19< celticminstrel> A formula requires a formula object to be run on.
20160806 03:59:32< vultraz> that's what I meant by this: [14:57:39]	vultraz	or are you saying the problem is to determine the context from the call location?
20160806 03:59:45< vultraz> I have a solution
20160806 03:59:49< celticminstrel> Do you.
20160806 03:59:53< vultraz> well, a proposal
20160806 04:00:00< celticminstrel> Okay, let's hear it.
20160806 04:00:05< vultraz> what formula object is used when you do this: $() 
20160806 04:00:13< celticminstrel> null
20160806 04:00:24< vultraz> ugh
20160806 04:00:34< vultraz> $($some_WML_variable + 1)
20160806 04:00:38< vultraz> what handles that + 1
20160806 04:00:48< celticminstrel> $some_WML_variable is substituted before the formula is parsed.
20160806 04:00:51< vultraz> Yes
20160806 04:00:55< vultraz> variable substitution
20160806 04:01:00< vultraz> but the + 1 is a formula
20160806 04:01:05< vultraz> what formula object is used here
20160806 04:01:08< celticminstrel> So the formula has no idea that there was a variable there. All it sees is the literal value of that variable.
20160806 04:01:20< celticminstrel> The object used is still null.
20160806 04:01:28< celticminstrel> Variable substitution is processed right-to-left.
20160806 04:01:44< vultraz> so this is all variable substitution\ and not WFL?
20160806 04:01:47< celticminstrel> Variable substitutions within a formula are replaced by their value before the formula is even parsed.
20160806 04:01:49< celticminstrel> Yes,
20160806 04:01:54< vultraz> BLAGH
20160806 04:01:56< celticminstrel> Incidentally, if the variable were a string, it wouldn't work.
20160806 04:02:02< vultraz> shitty systems 
20160806 04:02:05< celticminstrel> You'd have to surround it in single quotes.
20160806 04:02:08< vultraz> What I had in mind was this
20160806 04:02:37< celticminstrel> ancestral: My Wesnoth build runs if I remove the pango folder from Contents/Resources.
20160806 04:02:44< ancestral> Yeah
20160806 04:02:47< celticminstrel> Yours too?
20160806 04:02:50< ancestral> Yes
20160806 04:03:00< ancestral> That and the pango.modules and the rc
20160806 04:03:00< celticminstrel> You ready to push your XCode update?
20160806 04:03:03< celticminstrel> Yeah.
20160806 04:03:05< ancestral> I can
20160806 04:03:17< ancestral> vultraz, celticminstrel: When is it okay to push to master?
20160806 04:03:26< ancestral> When you guys sign off on it first?
20160806 04:03:34< celticminstrel> Huh?
20160806 04:03:39< ancestral> Pushing changes
20160806 04:03:42< vultraz> ancestral: you can always push to master
20160806 04:03:44< vultraz> you're a dev
20160806 04:03:45< celticminstrel> You can push whenever you want, right?
20160806 04:03:50< ancestral> Okay
20160806 04:03:52< celticminstrel> Especially if it's an XCode update.
20160806 04:03:58< ancestral> That’s fair
20160806 04:04:14< ancestral> Okay
20160806 04:04:24< celticminstrel> No approval is needed for project file updates, unless they're somehow weird or something.
20160806 04:04:35< celticminstrel> So, I need to rename my boost libs to all end in -mt, right?
20160806 04:04:53< ancestral> Going to rebuild just in case
20160806 04:05:01< ancestral> celticminstrel: Yes, -mt instead of w
20160806 04:05:19< celticminstrel> You going to upload a new libs package soon?
20160806 04:05:28< celticminstrel> mattsc: Take note. :)
20160806 04:05:28< ancestral> And then, rename libreadline.6.dylib to libreadline.6.3.dylib
20160806 04:05:29< ancestral> Yes
20160806 04:05:36< ancestral> I most definitely will
20160806 04:05:43< ancestral> And adding pcre
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20160806 04:05:44< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#10166 (ancestral_tutorial_changes - 1cf4f06 : ancestral): The build passed.
20160806 04:05:44< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/150212724
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20160806 04:06:02< vultraz> celticminstrel: WFL contexts. A global context that could evaluate stuff like this: $($var + 1) with WFL as opposed to variable substitution. As such, it would become ($var + 1). $var would still be handled by substitution, but + 1 would be handled by WFL. Any other context would be a sub-context of global. Such context would be, say, AI and GUI2. One could specify a context with 'using...
20160806 04:06:03< vultraz> ...context some_context', and that formula object would be used to parse the formula. However, I do think there should be a formula_base class or something that implements the basic operations, and any objects that handle context-specific variables would derive for it.
20160806 04:07:15< celticminstrel> I don't see how this is different from the current situation.
20160806 04:07:35< celticminstrel> BTW, using tformula it's fairly easy to implement GUI2-style formulas.
20160806 04:07:39< celticminstrel> (With the parentheses.)
20160806 04:08:03< vultraz> Could you please explain the problem here, then?
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20160806 04:08:27< vultraz> You have yet to clearly explain what the issue here is
20160806 04:08:33< celticminstrel> Somehow it's hard to explain...
20160806 04:11:43< vultraz> I'm gonna go get a late lunch.
20160806 04:11:58< vultraz> Please try to explain the issue
20160806 04:12:01< vultraz> As I see it, there isn't one
20160806 04:12:07< vultraz> But you say there is
20160806 04:13:48 * celticminstrel waiting on ancestral 
20160806 04:13:57< ancestral> Alright
20160806 04:15:35< SigurdFD> celticminstrel: is there a lua function that will invoke the formula console?
20160806 04:15:46< celticminstrel> SigurdFD: Yes, it's undocumented.
20160806 04:15:53< celticminstrel> I think it's wesnoth.show_lua_console.
20160806 04:16:06< SigurdFD> :P that invokes the lua console
20160806 04:16:15< celticminstrel> ...oh. Duh.
20160806 04:16:33< irker708> wesnoth: ancestral wesnoth:master deb56e0fe668 / projectfiles/Xcode/ (7 files in 3 dirs): Updated Xcode project and removed unused pango files https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/deb56e0fe668f0a89ad4d0c6859759e79d9d3323
20160806 04:17:14< celticminstrel> There's no Lua function to invoke the formula console. The only Lua-formula functions at the moment are eval_formula and compile_formula.
20160806 04:18:46< celticminstrel> What's SDKROOT? :|
20160806 04:20:04< SigurdFD> ok, thanks. was thinking of making it accesable via right-click, but I can't think of a point.
20160806 04:20:27< SigurdFD> (could probably do with with eval_formula some way if I really wanted to)
20160806 04:20:43< celticminstrel> You could, but it wouldn't be the same as the formula console.
20160806 04:20:52< celticminstrel> eval_formula doesn't support the AI object at the moment.
20160806 04:20:57< SigurdFD> ok
20160806 04:21:11< celticminstrel> It only works on tables (WML or otherwise) and unit objects.
20160806 04:21:27< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master aa8b5417579c / data/campaigns/Dead_Water/ (4 files in 2 dirs): DW: Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/aa8b5417579c0bff09d4c8c9bc8d586f2572969e
20160806 04:21:29< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master fab576f23419 / data/campaigns/Delfadors_Memoirs/utils/ (generators.cfg sides.cfg): DM: Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/fab576f2341970b57a6808070d3c8186f7ff1ec5
20160806 04:21:31< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 5e7aa7ce307d / data/campaigns/Descent_Into_Darkness/ (6 files in 2 dirs): DiD: Replaced FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/5e7aa7ce307d420735387c19923007186e31d902
20160806 04:21:32< celticminstrel> (I intend to do something about that though.)
20160806 04:21:33< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 25e46473d2bd / data/campaigns/Heir_To_The_Throne/ (6 files in 2 dirs): HttT: Replaced FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/25e46473d2bdb0a2bb7577373c216efa5b631847
20160806 04:21:35< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master a4e366d2da15 / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/ (5 files in 4 dirs): LoW: Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/a4e366d2da15d2ccc5e35dba60347323d06189e2
20160806 04:21:37< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 418c9656a5a9 / data/campaigns/Sceptre_of_Fire/scenarios/ (4 files): SoF: Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/418c9656a5a99798a612e626ada432cda9652607
20160806 04:21:39< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 4213c04dfbfd / data/campaigns/Son_Of_The_Black_Eye/ (5 files in 2 dirs): SotbE: Replaced FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/4213c04dfbfd1ee5a40187a0438c2b8b3b59361d
20160806 04:21:41< SigurdFD> ok
20160806 04:21:41< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 7012b998baf5 / data/campaigns/Liberty/scenarios/ (02_Civil_Disobedience.cfg 04_Unlawful_Orders.cfg 05_Hide_and_Seek.cfg): L: Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/7012b998baf5568613492903fdad6d40c5381cb3
20160806 04:21:43< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 03126ad1e4cf / data/campaigns/The_Hammer_of_Thursagan/scenarios/05_Invaders.cfg: tHoT: Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/03126ad1e4cf278cf7d62435c44b82105282b4ea
20160806 04:21:45< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master e4014088198a / data/campaigns/The_Rise_Of_Wesnoth/scenarios/19_The_Vanguard.cfg: tRoW: Replaced FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/e4014088198a9a11605696971139196fb6c7b474
20160806 04:21:47< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 6aaa7cd17db2 / data/campaigns/The_South_Guard/scenarios/ (6 files): tSG: Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/6aaa7cd17db2b67674d9c2d26daa2facf295581e
20160806 04:21:49< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master df777bd9048c / data/campaigns/Eastern_Invasion/ (4 files in 2 dirs): EI: Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/df777bd9048cd47633bbe9d02aca20ccdeee0b1a
20160806 04:21:51< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 7918425cd23c / data/campaigns/Under_the_Burning_Suns/ (6 files in 2 dirs): UtBS: Replaced FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/7918425cd23c38367a89a842617ce8b9bbb2b1a5
20160806 04:21:53< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 8eea8122f9ec / data/ai/micro_ais/scenarios/ (goto.cfg guardians.cfg lurkers.cfg): Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/8eea8122f9ec9169235cc27c8963871deca10e77
20160806 04:21:55< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 84bab7ad19f0 / data/multiplayer/scenarios/ (4p_A_New_Land.cfg ANL_utils/ANL_auto_working.cfg): Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/84bab7ad19f093fdbb7c32e994a4ee3b6146530c
20160806 04:21:57< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master ed296f30a031 / data/core/units.cfg: [+units] -> [units] https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/ed296f30a031d7ca5bf05ee10675d9ab7f9751df
20160806 04:21:59< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 8544320b586f / data/core/macros/ (ai_controller.cfg side-utils.cfg utils.cfg): Replace FOREACH https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/8544320b586f0b8decf56c3194ff186bf48ac010
20160806 04:22:01< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master b9d2ec4409cf / changelog data/lua/wml-flow.lua: Renamed [foreach] variable= to array= and item_var= to variable= https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/b9d2ec4409cf43e275b9709f15ac2451a188ac63
20160806 04:22:03< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master bf27180ec9a0 / data/campaigns/Under_the_Burning_Suns/utils/dehydration-utils.cfg: Fix a missing "/" in a tag closing. https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/bf27180ec9a0e5e1fb8fb1f4b9c1e0380e932c25
20160806 04:22:04< celticminstrel> I'm kinda surprised XCode isn't making me do a full rebuild.
20160806 04:23:19< celticminstrel> Though I should probably do a clean build...
20160806 04:23:45< celticminstrel> I guess that can wait unitl XCode reindexes everything. (Since I deleted the index files.)
20160806 04:24:06< SigurdFD> How does one define a side in the map editor?
20160806 04:24:27< celticminstrel> You need to create a new scenario, rather than a new map.
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20160806 04:26:06< SigurdFD> ok, thanks. that keeps being non-intutitive for me.
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20160806 04:50:12< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 71ec45480d32 / data/scenario-test.cfg: Some last [+units] -> [units] https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/71ec45480d32f50589fe4efda214af92cd6a5f74
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20160806 05:14:17< irker708> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master a221339d5740 / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/ (_main.cfg units/Great_Ogre.cfg): Moved the Great Ogre in a subdirectory. https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/a221339d57401620a4a546688ac8ce2ee1601e6a
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20160806 05:23:31< tad_> is there anyone on who can explain the new [foreach] thing. specifically will {CLEAR_VARIABLE this_item} remove the referenced item from the control list and does it allow for that in the iterator?
20160806 05:24:28< fabi> tad_:  ask celticministrel when he is here again.
20160806 05:25:42< tad_> ok. I guess I will jsut have to beat on it. looks like my best option is to copy the FOREACH and NEXT macros from deprecated into the scenario so it can't be made to go away.
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20160806 06:15:52< irker708> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master aab702fb1eb8 / data/gui/window/unit_recall.cfg: Unit Recall: no longer force scrollbar for list https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/aab702fb1eb87202b3505808e5890bf6bcdd0e83
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20160806 06:34:14< travis-ci> wesnoth/wesnoth#10172 (master - a221339 : fendrin): The build has errored.
20160806 06:34:14< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/wesnoth/wesnoth/builds/150225493
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20160806 07:18:34< irker708> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 4e718ad1d29b / src/gui/dialogs/unit_recall.cpp: tunit_recall: made use of unit::image_mods() https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/4e718ad1d29b7a4462f952e9aafe37a0cfdf3e30
20160806 07:21:32< vultraz> something I'd like to look into sometime:
20160806 07:21:49< vultraz> an animated image widget
20160806 07:22:09< vultraz> so like, in the details pane i could have the unit doing its standing animation
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20160806 07:34:43< hay207_> Hi,  shall macro's names be unique, across all add-ons installed ?
20160806 07:35:42< vultraz> No
20160806 07:35:51< vultraz> Only within the same addon
20160806 07:37:22< hay207_> So, if i fork an addon , and changed it's scenario id, no need to rename macro's then?
20160806 07:38:28< vultraz> Strictly, no.
20160806 07:38:36< hay207_> I 'm saying this cause my edited macros only work , if i uninstalled the original addon
20160806 07:38:51< vultraz> You probably haven't updated the campaign's define 
20160806 07:39:03< vultraz> Is this a singleplayer addon?
20160806 07:39:15< hay207_> a mp map pack
20160806 07:39:18< vultraz> hm
20160806 07:39:46< vultraz> in this case, you probably want unique macro names
20160806 07:40:05< vultraz> it's a little complicated to explain why
20160806 07:40:50< hay207_> i want explanation
20160806 07:41:51< hay207_> It's odd , if i changed scenario id, to change all macro's names too
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20160806 07:42:09< vultraz> Ok, so in wesnoth, things are guarded behind defines
20160806 07:42:28< vultraz> If you have a campaign, you can set something like.. define = MY_CAMPAIGN
20160806 07:43:06< vultraz> a define is what you do when you create a macro
20160806 07:43:16< hay207_> Ok
20160806 07:43:23< vultraz> if you have a piece of code that says
20160806 07:43:32< vultraz> #ifdef MY_CAMPAIGN
20160806 07:43:35< vultraz> *stuff*
20160806 07:43:38< vultraz> #enddef
20160806 07:43:50< vultraz> "*stuff*" will only happen if MY_CAMPAIGN is defined
20160806 07:44:20< vultraz> for SP stuff, the line "define=MY_CAMPAIGN" is a little shortcut that means that is defined when you select that campaign
20160806 07:44:27< hay207_> Which is in _main.cfg
20160806 07:44:31< vultraz> in multiplayer, there's a universal define called MULTIPLAYER
20160806 07:44:42< vultraz> it's defined when you enter mp mode
20160806 07:44:59< vultraz> individual MP scenarios may *also* set their own define
20160806 07:45:10< vultraz> define=MY_MP_SCENARIO
20160806 07:45:29< vultraz> and you can guard bits of code behind #ifdef MY_MP_SCENARIO
20160806 07:45:50< vultraz> Now, since you forked your map pack
20160806 07:46:18< vultraz> And assuming the original map pack's macros are not behind an #ifdef
20160806 07:46:28< vultraz> both your macros and the other macros are found by the game at the same time
20160806 07:46:35< vultraz> since you're in multiplayer
20160806 07:46:49< vultraz> so the game looks at the first copy it finds
20160806 07:46:59< vultraz> in this case, it sounds like it found the original addon's macros
20160806 07:47:01< vultraz> before yours
20160806 07:47:21< vultraz> This is why I say you should make your macros have unique names
20160806 07:47:42< hay207_> So scenario id does nothing if it's different
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20160806 07:48:26< vultraz> Even if you guard your *own* macros behind #ifdef MY_MP_SCENARIO, the other addon's data is still found, since both your addon and his are behind #ifdef MULTIPLAYER
20160806 07:49:14< hay207_> Ok,so what to do, other than renaming macros?
20160806 07:49:19< vultraz> Scenario id enables your scenario to be its own scenario
20160806 07:49:38< vultraz> but macros are parsed by the preprocessor
20160806 07:49:47< vultraz> The preprocessor doesn't care about scenarios or anything
20160806 07:49:59< vultraz> All it sees is a giant readout of ALL the WML in the game
20160806 07:50:30< vultraz> hay207_: renaming your macros is the simplest solution and actually really the only solution you have.
20160806 07:52:09< hay207_> Ok
20160806 07:52:27< hay207_> mDo i rename only the macros i edited?
20160806 07:52:49< hay207_> or all that's included in velensk 
20160806 07:52:58< vultraz> You should rename all of your macros
20160806 07:53:25< hay207_> Zrr, now i got angry
20160806 07:53:27< hay207_> :)
20160806 07:53:29< vultraz> Technically you only have to rename the ones your changed, yes, but relying on the implementation of a macro in someone else's addon is bad.
20160806 07:53:47< hay207_> Ok
20160806 07:54:05< hay207_> Thanks a lot for the explanation
20160806 07:54:13< vultraz> you're welcome
20160806 07:54:18< vultraz> good luck with your addon
20160806 07:54:29< vultraz> if you have any further questions, ask zookeeper 
20160806 07:55:00< hay207_> Ok
20160806 07:58:31< zookeeper> SigurdFD, i don't even recall how exactly the choice to move to the next scenario works, but in a tutorial the player should absolutely be given as much freedom as possible to decide when they want to move on to the next lesson/scenario/etc.
20160806 08:01:58< zookeeper> a good tutorial doesn't just teleport you to the next part when you fulfill the conditions of the current part, it tells you that you're done and you can get to the next part by walking through that door there, or similar.
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20160806 08:06:26< zookeeper> ancestral, celticminstrel, li'sar is identical in HttT and tutorial.
20160806 08:06:57< zookeeper> (as far as appearance goes)
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20160806 08:11:59< zookeeper> how does https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/b9d2ec4409cf43e275b9709f15ac2451a188ac63 not break existing uses?
20160806 08:15:24< zookeeper> fabi, looks like you missed something here: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/df777bd9048cd47633bbe9d02aca20ccdeee0b1a#diff-b789643f8dbc74a37bc6eece355817ebR220
20160806 08:19:30< zookeeper> and https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/7012b998baf5568613492903fdad6d40c5381cb3#diff-548b31bcc938181d00f32386c95f7b8bR384 <- you can nest [for] tags without [do]?
20160806 08:25:11< zookeeper> and another missed bit: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/25e46473d2bdb0a2bb7577373c216efa5b631847#diff-90d41d31fabbb8dfdc5bcd710b56f412R525
20160806 08:29:41< zookeeper> and unless github shows stuff wrong, this deletes instead of moving: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/a221339d57401620a4a546688ac8ce2ee1601e6a
20160806 08:35:30< zookeeper> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/a4e366d2da15d2ccc5e35dba60347323d06189e2#diff-2fb5c8f7d1395e0237b53cf621d01f93R289
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20160806 08:44:35< wedge009> Oh, whoops. Yeah, that just deletes - the corresponding add is missing.
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20160806 08:52:40< zookeeper> regarding the conversion mistakes, i hope someone other than me was intending on double-checking the diffs and would have caught those. introducing bugs when doing substantial changes is fine, but when it's a case of just shuffling some code around, one needs to be more careful about breaking stuff.
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20160806 08:57:53< zookeeper> if one rewrites a scenario to actually work much better then a bug or two might be a small price to pay for the improvements, but when nothing changes except some bugs appear then... well, you know.
20160806 08:58:44< zookeeper> contrary to common belief, i'm not against those kinds of operations for no reason.
20160806 09:03:20< wedge009> zookeeper: Oh you know what? There is a Great_Ogre.cfg in ogres/ already. It's just not clear from the commit record.
20160806 09:04:24< zookeeper> oh, okay. i haven't pulled in some days so i didn't see one.
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20160806 09:06:27< wedge009> Looks like there were two copies. So the commit message is a bit misleading.
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20160806 12:06:47< gfgtdf> vultraz: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/src/mt_rng.cpp#L69 still needs to be fixed
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20160806 12:09:46< gfgtdf> vultraz: https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/491fa9190635ae928d336b86d914539975983483 saisy it deprecated REPEAT for unblanced wmlm but repeat has no unbalanced wml
20160806 12:10:15< gfgtdf> vultraz: hmm my bad i dont know what i thought it said repeat.
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20160806 13:02:29< irker752> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master e6b31636c19d / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/chapter4/14_Human_Alliance.cfg: fix wrong side number in LoW scenario 14. https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/e6b31636c19dd633560a473ab1b229a37d2ec353
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20160806 13:49:41< tad_> checking to see if there is any on who knows the new [foreach]
20160806 13:50:11< celticminstrel> Um, the conversion you referred to in the commit comment may have already been done.
20160806 13:50:23< celticminstrel> That aside, I created it, so I basically know it.
20160806 13:50:54< tad_> ok. I saw the commit and am trying to fix the breakage in HttT.
20160806 13:51:06< celticminstrel> Breakage?
20160806 13:51:18< tad_> Question: can one delete from the list being iterated over?
20160806 13:51:22< celticminstrel> No.
20160806 13:51:30< celticminstrel> If you need to do that, use [for] instead.
20160806 13:51:45< tad_> yeah. dropping use of the control variable 'i' created an infinite loop.
20160806 13:51:54< celticminstrel> (The {FOREACH} macro is currently implemented with [for], though we might change it back the the [while] implementation.)
20160806 13:51:56< celticminstrel> Huh?
20160806 13:52:13< tad_> ok. then you need to go through the mass-change commit and record foreach to for anywhere that's done. 
20160806 13:52:44< tad_> the delete item done I mean
20160806 13:52:56< celticminstrel> Did he use [foreach] in places where elements are being deleted?
20160806 13:53:11< celticminstrel> I did say I'd review his commits though, so I guess I might as well do that now.
20160806 13:53:11< tad_> The 'i' issue is a loop in a loop and nevermind it was lame code and I fixed ikt
20160806 13:54:34< tad_> Yes in HttT one place it was {CLEARVARIABLE $this_item} but there are all sorts of creative ways to hide it from teh code-reader
20160806 13:55:30< tad_> And you have to watch out for changing the loop index. some code sets it to 0 to start over and 999 as a [break]
20160806 13:55:58< celticminstrel> Ah, yeah, in that case it should be changed to use [break].
20160806 13:56:08< celticminstrel> Changing the loop index will have no effect.
20160806 13:56:14< tad_> The 999 / break was the infinite loop case .. 'delete this, break, start over' this was never deleted so over and over and ..
20160806 13:56:18< celticminstrel> It'll just be reset to the next proper value on the next interation.
20160806 13:58:02< tad_> for i = 0 to 5 do if testcasewhen(i==3) then delete(i==3) i=0 end done 
20160806 13:58:18< celticminstrel> Not end end?
20160806 13:58:34< tad_> don't ask me why and I get a headache when I ask the code why
20160806 13:59:02< tad_> I'm trying to give pseudo code of the lame-ass code I need to fix
20160806 13:59:37< celticminstrel> With a for-loop deleting elements it's probably safer to iterate backwards.
20160806 13:59:45< celticminstrel> Which means reverse=yes
20160806 13:59:50< celticminstrel> Or was it reversed=yes
20160806 13:59:57< celticminstrel> It's documented on the wiki, anyway.
20160806 14:00:10< celticminstrel> Not sure if fabi updated it for his changes.
20160806 14:00:26< celticminstrel> But that only affects variable and item_var in [foreach].
20160806 14:00:27< tad_> yeah well I get the impression (1) HttT existed long before and (2) it was not a pro programmer
20160806 14:00:45< celticminstrel> Heh.
20160806 14:02:09< tad_> prolly a lot of fingers in the pie makes it worse than it started out to be. gotta love "[if][then]" and "[if][else][then]"
20160806 14:02:24< tad_> Note there are no conditionals.
20160806 14:02:51< celticminstrel> Heh, else before then... I guess that's still technically valid...
20160806 14:03:05< celticminstrel> If there's no conditionals though, the else will never run, I think.
20160806 14:04:42< zookeeper> celticminstrel, i did post a bunch of oversights in the commit already, in case you didn't read the log
20160806 14:05:00< celticminstrel> I didn't. That's good to know.
20160806 14:05:07< celticminstrel> You posted them in here?
20160806 14:05:10< zookeeper> yes
20160806 14:05:27< zookeeper> although i didn't look for the item deletion thing
20160806 14:05:29< tad_> Yep. And it's a long block of code so even noticing the [then] was hard unless you were looking
20160806 14:06:34< tad_> Probably someone once-upon-a-time said the test was backward and rather than [not] it they swapped [then] and [else] .. then someone else came along and decided the conditional was always [true] so removed it.
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20160806 14:08:55< tad_> OK. well I need to get off, reverse that change then hand-compile the {FOREACH} macro into a [for] loop. Then think on what it's really because it does look fishy
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20160806 14:09:21< celticminstrel> zookeeper: [foreach] actually does set the $i variable, though I suppose maybe it shouldn't unless explicitly requested...
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20160806 14:10:42< celticminstrel> Okay yeah, he forgot the [do] in that one place.
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20160806 14:20:16< zookeeper> celticminstrel, right, so is $i the default if not specified?
20160806 14:21:24< celticminstrel> Yeah.
20160806 14:23:41< Spixi> Does anyone know how to create a widget for GUI2? I tried to implement a chart widget (the current implementation is native SDL2), but I don't know how to marry this with the GUI2 framework). I created a forum thread here: https://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=10&p=599514
20160806 14:24:17< celticminstrel> I don't know the details of how to do it, but I think you need a GUI2 canvas.
20160806 14:25:13< celticminstrel> For how to create a widget in general, try looking at some of the existing ones?
20160806 14:25:28< celticminstrel> You need three classes per widget.
20160806 14:25:33< Spixi> I had a look at the drawing widget and used it as a template
20160806 14:25:36< celticminstrel> (I know, it's a bit ridiculous.)
20160806 14:25:44< celticminstrel> Okay.
20160806 14:25:51< celticminstrel> That sounds like a good start.
20160806 14:27:11< Spixi> I know that we need a builder, a definition and a widget class
20160806 14:27:15< celticminstrel> Hmm, I just realized that there doesn't seem to be a way to force variable substitution from WML...
20160806 14:28:09< celticminstrel> eg, if you use something like [set_variable]literal="Hello, $var!", there's no way I can see to later tell the engine to substitute that $var.
20160806 14:28:30< celticminstrel> Unless I'm missing something?
20160806 14:31:28< zookeeper> celticminstrel, so the defaults are $i for the current index, and $this_item for the current item? ok, in that case a lot of those problems presumably aren't problems at all.
20160806 14:31:43< celticminstrel> The missing [do] is still a problem though.
20160806 14:32:26< celticminstrel> BTW zookeeper, any comments on [remove_object]? https://wiki.wesnoth.org/DirectActionsWML#.5Bremove_object.5D
20160806 14:33:11< zookeeper> celticminstrel, well i don't see how it's supposed to remove the actual effects the objects has had on the unit
20160806 14:33:40< celticminstrel> It uses the same mechanism as expiring temporary objects, such as duration=turn.
20160806 14:34:06< zookeeper> i don't see how those are supposed to do it either
20160806 14:34:22< zookeeper> have i missed someone actually implementing that? i don't know
20160806 14:36:16< gfgtdf> Spixi: i know that you can draw in widgets using the cnavas and tshape objects, that maybe wokr even in lua
20160806 14:36:29< zookeeper> celticminstrel, in case you don't know what i mean:
20160806 14:37:42< zookeeper> celticminstrel, a unit has 35 max hp. give it an object that increases its max hp by 10. now it has 45. then the object expires (one way or another). how many max hp does the unit now have?
20160806 14:37:50< celticminstrel> It rebuilds the unit. (This probably means most manual modifications, eg with [modify_unit], are lost.)
20160806 14:37:52< gfgtdf> Spixi: other than tha you can overwrite the draw mehogs qwith take a surface (SDL_Surface*) objects to draw in
20160806 14:38:01< zookeeper> ohh, okay. yeah, in that case it'll work right.
20160806 14:38:23< celticminstrel> unit::expire_modification actually calls advance_to.
20160806 14:38:32< Spixi> I saw, that there is already a drawing widget, which are already accessible via Lua, but I don't know how performant this is. 
20160806 14:38:49< celticminstrel> Mehogs? :P
20160806 14:38:55< gfgtdf> methods*
20160806 14:39:48< zookeeper> celticminstrel, i guess direct variable manipulation just isn't very safe to do these days, since units can get rebuilt due to all sorts of actions.
20160806 14:40:25< celticminstrel> Well, it's safe (and expected) for transient things though - xp, moves, hp, for example.
20160806 14:40:44< celticminstrel> Not sure if transient is the right word, but things that change during normal play.
20160806 14:40:51< celticminstrel> Without advancement.
20160806 14:40:54< gfgtdf> i just noticed that the game engine seems to more or less ignore the side= attribute in [side] unless you load a start of scenario save.
20160806 14:41:16< celticminstrel> Really? That seems a little bad.
20160806 14:42:04< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: well the side has always to match the position that side is in the scearnio
20160806 14:43:17< celticminstrel> Why?
20160806 14:43:29< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: so in 1.12.5 the first [side] of a scenario always had to have side=1 (gave an error and refuses to start), while in 1.13.5 it just ignored the side0 attribute
20160806 14:43:52< celticminstrel> So make it honour the side attribute.
20160806 14:44:13< celticminstrel> The existence of the side attribute sends the message that you can put your sides out-of-order and it will still work.
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20160806 14:47:54< irker752> wesnoth: gfgtdf wesnoth:master 6a32d984fdb5 / src/gui/dialogs/ (loadscreen.cpp loadscreen.hpp): rethrow exceptions form loadingscreen worker thread https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/6a32d984fdb52b42509aaad6cb6f07b6422327c5
20160806 14:51:24< celticminstrel> Whee, clean build time.
20160806 14:51:51< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: i think the wiki explictly notes that you cannotdo that, also the if we remove this resiction we migth have to deal with things like a scenario defning a side 1 and 3 but not side 2.
20160806 14:52:11< celticminstrel> Is that actually a problem?
20160806 14:52:44< celticminstrel> The alternative in my opinion is marking the side attribute deprecated.
20160806 14:53:03< celticminstrel> (Which means the saved game loader should also ignore it, and the saved game writer should not output it.)
20160806 14:53:44< celticminstrel> So, looking through fabi's commits, I've already found two places that could be changed to use [remove_object].
20160806 14:54:14< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: hmm not sure but it seems to be quite likeley that there are codes assuming no mising sides, specially since the sides are just stored in a simple std::vector that is indexed by the side number.
20160806 14:54:35< celticminstrel> Okay, then let's deprecate it like I just mentioned.
20160806 14:55:25< celticminstrel> Hmm, I wonder if people rely on it being there in [store_side].
20160806 14:55:33< celticminstrel> (Assuming that exists?)
20160806 14:55:50< celticminstrel> ...well, assuming it does and they do, that's easy to work around in [store_side].
20160806 14:56:43< celticminstrel> I wonder why L2 uses [unit] instead of [unstore_unit] for the peasants.
20160806 14:57:36< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: wel im suite sure they, so if you for examepl want to give a unit to the side that is allies with side 1  you usually use [store_side] [allied_with] side=1, [unit] side.side, same with lua side objects
20160806 14:58:17< gfgtdf> L2 ?
20160806 14:58:27< celticminstrel> Makes sense.
20160806 14:58:34< celticminstrel> L2 = Liberty scenario 2
20160806 15:02:07< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: well with [unstore_unit] you'd need to remove all tags that you dont want ([attacks], aligment, ...) while with [unit] you have to specify all tags that you want to kepp (id=, [modifications]) i guess that there are just more tags that you want to remove so using [unit] is easier.
20160806 15:02:37< celticminstrel> The question is why they don't want those other tags.
20160806 15:03:05< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: becasue tha change th units tpye and want them to be recalculated from the units type definition.
20160806 15:03:34< celticminstrel> They changed the units' type? Okay then. I guess that kinda makes sense.
20160806 15:05:05< celticminstrel> Whoa. L5 is manyally running random trait generation.
20160806 15:05:15< celticminstrel> Clearly I need to add the traits= key to [unit] as well.
20160806 15:05:17< celticminstrel> ^manually
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20160806 15:20:58< celticminstrel> Okay fabi_, I've reviewed your commits and made comments on them where there seem to be mistakes.
20160806 15:21:16< celticminstrel> You might want to make a second pass for other similar issues.
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20160806 15:24:55< irker752> wesnoth: Gregory A Lundberg wesnoth:master 575bc843b8b4 / data/campaigns/Heir_To_The_Throne/scenarios/19c_Cliffs_of_Thoria.cfg: Emergency fix for commit 25e46473d2bdb0a2bb7577373c216efa5b631847 https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/575bc843b8b41a1c51a885d8f9d564c0b0f9b5e6
20160806 15:24:57< irker752> wesnoth: Celtic Minstrel wesnoth:master 9c814cd7779d / data/campaigns/Heir_To_The_Throne/scenarios/19c_Cliffs_of_Thoria.cfg: Merge pull request #726 from GregoryLundberg/GL_emergency_fix_for_25e46473d2bdb0 https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/9c814cd7779d973453f248a848b7d4fd59b495ef
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20160806 15:29:02< celticminstrel> (In particular I somehow missed that issue in my review...)
20160806 15:33:42< zookeeper> celticminstrel, i don't think L5 is any reason to add things like that. it's a very specific rare case and the only reason it looks like manual random trait generation is because i didn't want to be lazy and use entirely predetermined traits. although, i'm not at all opposed to the idea of being able to provide a list of id's of traits the unit is allowed to get.
20160806 15:34:03< zookeeper> that would be a handy feature sometimes
20160806 15:37:01< zookeeper> (well, it _is_ manual trait generation, instead of only looking like it...)
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20160806 16:35:46< fabi_> celticminstrel: ping?
20160806 16:36:29< celticminstrel> Hmm?
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20160806 16:38:57< fabi_> celticminstrel: Have you thought about how we handle the syntax change properly?
20160806 16:39:38< celticminstrel> I think I'm missing (or forgetting?) context here.
20160806 16:40:09< fabi_> [foreach] variable got array and item_var got variable
20160806 16:40:36< fabi_> that triangle name change makes it difficult to provide any backwards compatibility  
20160806 16:40:48< celticminstrel> Ah, right.
20160806 16:40:50< fabi_> That is why I didn't even tried yet.
20160806 16:41:10< celticminstrel> It's actually super-easy.
20160806 16:41:18< celticminstrel> Because the first key is required.
20160806 16:41:55< celticminstrel> So, if there's no array key, then the variable key is the array name, and the item_var key is used.
20160806 16:42:06< fabi_> Ah, fine.
20160806 16:42:27< fabi_> Your comments on the bugs, are they made here in the chat?
20160806 16:42:37< celticminstrel> They're made as commit comments on github.
20160806 16:42:51< fabi_> cool, thanks
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20160806 16:59:02< fabi_> celticminstrel: To be honest, the wiki api change scares me most. :-)
20160806 16:59:11< celticminstrel> Huh?
20160806 16:59:48< fabi_> still the same context
20160806 17:00:35< celticminstrel> I know.
20160806 17:00:45< celticminstrel> vultraz: Seems like nobody likes the race icons.
20160806 17:01:50< irker752> wesnoth: Gregory A Lundberg wesnoth:master b8b482354dfc / data/campaigns/Heir_To_The_Throne/scenarios/19c_Cliffs_of_Thoria.cfg: Missed ending /foreach -> /for https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/b8b482354dfc51128c4efb6742866b29ebd06194
20160806 17:01:52< irker752> wesnoth: Celtic Minstrel wesnoth:master 2586e805dc03 / data/campaigns/Heir_To_The_Throne/scenarios/19c_Cliffs_of_Thoria.cfg: Merge pull request #727 from GregoryLundberg/GL_typofix https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/2586e805dc03d3677176879baa96e18c0e0a69d8
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20160806 17:35:38< fabi_> celticminstrel: Do I understand correctly, your change to REPLACE has not been 100% compatible than the version based on while?
20160806 17:35:57< fabi_> s/than/to
20160806 17:36:07< celticminstrel> Do you mean REPEAT?
20160806 17:36:13< fabi_> yes
20160806 17:36:18< fabi_> no
20160806 17:36:21< fabi_> FOREACH
20160806 17:36:23< fabi_> sorry
20160806 17:36:25< celticminstrel> Oh.
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20160806 17:36:44< celticminstrel> [foreach] is not a drop-in replacement for {FOREACH}, not. [for] can be used that way.
20160806 17:37:56< fabi_> Okay, then  the comment "Are you sure it won't skip the next element? Maybe the array should be iterated in reverse?" questions the quality of the code before the change?
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20160806 17:38:54< celticminstrel> Which commit was that on, again?
20160806 17:39:12< fabi_> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/8544320b586f0b8decf56c3194ff186bf48ac010
20160806 17:40:03< Spixi> I just implemented a prototype for a chart widget. You can find it here: https://github.com/spixi/wesnoth/tree/chart_engine
20160806 17:40:04< Spixi> It seems fine, but I have the following problem: How can I determine the left upper corner of a tcontrol in a tgrid? In tcontrol::impl_draw_background  x_offset and y_offset are both 0. Did I do something wrong?
20160806 17:40:05< fabi_> There [for] is used to replace FOREACH. So I pretty much thought their is no change in behaviour caused. So you have spotted a bug that was in before?
20160806 17:40:42< celticminstrel> I guess so, yeah. Though I'm not sure it's a bug. It depends on whether the loop is expected to delete multiple elements or just one.
20160806 17:40:50< celticminstrel> If the latter, it should be fine as-is.
20160806 17:41:46< fabi_> I guess you spotted a bug.
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20160806 17:42:59< fabi_> Is the ai controller still used in mainline?
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20160806 17:43:22< celticminstrel> No clue.
20160806 17:43:36< fabi_> Iirc it in no longer maintained, not working properly and not in use.
20160806 17:47:08< SigurdFD> zookeeper: In the tutorial S1, the player can choose to proceed on at the start of turn 5, after defeating only one Quintain.
20160806 17:48:11< SigurdFD> if they do this, they will miss out on getting more attack practice & five turns worth of additional advice.
20160806 17:49:45< SigurdFD> if anyone new to the game actually does this, they would be in poor shape for the second scenario.
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20160806 17:52:17< zookeeper> SigurdFD, right, i see. seems a bit weird indeed.
20160806 17:52:51< SigurdFD> I think it would be better to force the play to defeat all 4 quintains. it would be in better harmony with objectives & dialog as well.
20160806 17:53:08< zookeeper> fabi_, it's in use and no one's told me of any problems with it so i haven't looked. looks like the set objective orders menu is borked.
20160806 17:55:19< fabi_> Okay.
20160806 17:57:09< Spixi> Is here any Wesnoth wiki buerocrat who could create an account for me? I wanted to document commit a8f625f
20160806 17:57:23< fabi_> I need help as well.
20160806 17:57:43< fabi_> Can't remember my wiki accounts password and my old email is out of use.
20160806 17:58:10< iceiceice> idk who can make accounts
20160806 17:58:14< iceiceice> i have an account but i dont think i can make them
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20160806 18:02:12< zookeeper> Spixi, i can make it for you if you msg me your e-mail address
20160806 18:04:14< tad_> I think I've done all I can do with HttT. There is an old note about conversion to Loyal I might still add. I've read over it and it looks ready for fresh eyes to read and test.
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20160806 18:07:05< travis-ci> spixi/wesnoth#7 (chart_engine - 6c9fc3c : Spixi): The build is still failing.
20160806 18:07:05< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/spixi/wesnoth/builds/150300786
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20160806 18:08:50< zookeeper> tad_, the thing is that the PR is >70 commits and >50 comments and a lot of the discussion was branched out to half a dozen other PR's involving several new features and it's just kind of impossible to review that as one item?
20160806 18:09:32< tad_> I am open to suggestions
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20160806 18:12:07< zookeeper> well could it be split into some kind of logical units?
20160806 18:12:11< fabi_> celticminstrel: The i=999 hack is used at least twice more. 
20160806 18:12:41< celticminstrel> fabi_: As long as it's in [for] and not [foreach] it'll work, though better to replace it with [break] anyway.
20160806 18:13:09< tad_> i=999 from what I've seen usually means [break]
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20160806 18:14:11< tad_> I can break it up. Would you prefer a series of new PRs? Like: style and bug fixes, and a PR for major areas of addition?
20160806 18:14:53< fabi_> celticminstrel: The i=999 was the reason I made them for and not foreach. So that will go to foreach using break.
20160806 18:15:18< zookeeper> tad_, i'd think that things like the gryphon return and the changes to underground channels should be separate from everything else. various code cleanups can go in one PR of course.
20160806 18:17:07< tad_> ok I'll close that PR and do a new series after I break it up into functional parts.
20160806 18:17:17< zookeeper> tad_, basically a separate PR for everything that can be accepted/rejected independently from everything else would be ideal. so maybe you want to break things up in a specific order to make it more convenient.
20160806 18:17:38< zookeeper> but you don't necessarily need to close the current one first
20160806 18:17:51< celticminstrel> I supposr you could keep the current one for the cleanup type changes and split other bits into separate PRs?
20160806 18:18:10< celticminstrel> It's also possible to change a PR's title, as I recall.
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20160806 18:19:14< fabi_> tad_: 19c_Cliffs of Thoria, did you rewrite that scenario as well?
20160806 18:19:19< zookeeper> yeah. it's great to have that much fixes but as it is it's almost impossible to review them as one lump.
20160806 18:19:21< tad_> Well the comment about 50 comments is valid. And virtually all of them were about issues since fixed. So a new PR would clear away that cruft, too
20160806 18:19:43< celticminstrel> Shrug. Your choice.
20160806 18:19:49< tad_> No 19c I just cleared a few bugs IIRC
20160806 18:19:51< celticminstrel> It's not like there's any need to conserve PR numbers.
20160806 18:20:08< celticminstrel> fabi_: I think SigurdFD did something about 19c.
20160806 18:20:51< fabi_> There is another [foreach] that deletes in the own array.
20160806 18:21:02< tad_> He did, if he's the one who did away with the swamps and undead
20160806 18:21:11< fabi_> I wonder how a WML coder properly searched and deletes an item in an array.
20160806 18:21:24< fabi_> We should properly offer a macro or wml tag for that.
20160806 18:21:48< celticminstrel> Can it be macro'ed?
20160806 18:21:54< celticminstrel> Myabe...
20160806 18:21:57< celticminstrel> ^Maybe...
20160806 18:22:26< fabi_> REMOVE_ITEM_IN_ARRAY ARRAY FILTER
20160806 18:22:46< tad_> Depends on if the item is unique and if you want to delete a unique, or some of the matching, or all of the matching
20160806 18:23:06< fabi_> yeah
20160806 18:23:14< fabi_> the whole thing is not that easy
20160806 18:23:26< fabi_> that is why  I think the wml coder could need some help with it.
20160806 18:23:48< tad_> I think a better solution is a wiki page with meaningful examples
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20160806 18:24:32< zookeeper> ah, the woefully underutilized https://wiki.wesnoth.org/UsefulWMLFragments ...
20160806 18:24:55-!- abruanese [~a@45.63.97.181] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160806 18:25:24< tad_> Would help if [for], as an example, had examples right there or a link to actual use cases.
20160806 18:25:56< celticminstrel> Determining opposite coordinates doesn't need complicated variable work now.
20160806 18:27:00< celticminstrel> Heh, the macro for it use a macro said to be earlier on the page which no longer exists.
20160806 18:29:18< zookeeper> yeah there's all sorts of hilariously outdated things there. digging into the edit history ought to be a nostalgia trip.
20160806 18:29:21< tad_> @zookeeper .. I was thinking along that line .. I will try to avoid merge issues, so you can pick and choose but most likely I will assume the 'base' PR will be taken. I will try to make it easy on you.
20160806 18:29:57< zookeeper> cool, thanks
20160806 18:30:39< tad_> OK. I'm off to split and refactor and test it all again :)
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20160806 18:31:30< vultraz> celticminstrel: BTW, I looked at that message image issue that was reported
20160806 18:31:42< vultraz> celticminstrel: the behavior is the same for 1.12
20160806 18:31:52< celticminstrel> I see.
20160806 18:31:58< vultraz> celticminstrel: seems that portrait is just unusually large (500x500)
20160806 18:32:59< fabi_> vultraz: The double sized unit images in the dialogs.... They seem not to use iceiceice's scaling algos. That would be awesome.
20160806 18:33:10< vultraz> fabi_: deliberate.
20160806 18:33:47< vultraz> fabi_: it doesn't just scale sprites up, it scales all sprites to 144x144 (maintaining aspect ratio if it's not exactly square)
20160806 18:34:00< vultraz> fabi_: so some like the dragon need to be scaled down
20160806 18:34:28< vultraz> fabi_: and the point was to have a consistent size
20160806 18:34:45< vultraz> partly because of shitty gui2 restrictions
20160806 18:35:57< vultraz> celticminstrel: I'm seeing much hate for the use of icons :(
20160806 18:36:08< celticminstrel> Yup.
20160806 18:36:21< celticminstrel> I'm not too fond of them either, honestly. More the race ones than the alignment ones.
20160806 18:36:30< vultraz> ANd not just the aesthetics (ie, better icons needed)
20160806 18:36:35< celticminstrel> I wouldn't mind using race icons with accompanying text.
20160806 18:36:47< celticminstrel> Like, "[icon] Human"
20160806 18:36:50< vultraz> I personally do find the race icons a little iffy
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20160806 18:36:59< celticminstrel> Their existence or their form?
20160806 18:37:05< vultraz> design
20160806 18:37:19< vultraz> I wonder if LB would be up to redesigning them 
20160806 18:37:22< celticminstrel> So the latter.
20160806 18:37:29< vultraz> (at this point we really need to start paying him extra)
20160806 18:41:01< celticminstrel> I think it's not bad to have alignment icons (though they really need tooltips), but for races, I think it's more important to have text than icons.
20160806 18:44:29-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@x4e32b210.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160806 18:45:24< vultraz> celticminstrel: now, what is this about [side] being deprecated?
20160806 18:45:25< zookeeper> use text labels, and then put the icons in their tooltips? :>
20160806 18:45:28 * zookeeper ducks
20160806 18:45:38< gfgtdf> vultraz: i wonder whther we could give the recruit list a searchbox liek the recall list has ?
20160806 18:45:45< celticminstrel> vultraz: Not [side]. [side]side=
20160806 18:45:49< vultraz> er, yes
20160806 18:45:51< vultraz> sorry
20160806 18:45:55< vultraz> gfgtdf: I could
20160806 18:46:08< vultraz> I really should put the filter code in a helper file somewhere..
20160806 18:46:22< celticminstrel> Apparently the game ignores it anyway, and can't handle missing sides, so having the side key sends a false message to designers.
20160806 18:46:28< gfgtdf> vultraz: i think that'd be useful not only when you ahve too mayne recruit options, but also when you for some reason want to do it without mouse, 
20160806 18:46:40< vultraz> celticminstrel: but how does one filter on sides by number then?
20160806 18:46:46< gfgtdf> vultraz: i just saw this bugreport https://gna.org/bugs/?5324 that  why i though
20160806 18:47:13< celticminstrel> vultraz: The key would be removed from the WML, but still accessible to Lua and filters, and still included by [store_side].
20160806 18:47:22< celticminstrel> But omitted in saved games.
20160806 18:47:53< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: well actuall i dont think e shodul deprecate side, even if its doesnt do anything, it still makes it easier to understand a scenario file that you see the side number in [side]
20160806 18:48:22< celticminstrel> Then we should make the game not ignore it and support discontinuous sides.
20160806 18:48:23< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: specially when there are many sides.
20160806 18:48:42< zookeeper> gfgtdf, if you want to use the recruit dialog without a mouse, wouldn't you just navigate it with the arrow keys..?
20160806 18:48:44< celticminstrel> I doubt it would be difficult to support discontinuous sides.
20160806 18:48:46< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: hmm  i dont see a reason to do that.
20160806 18:49:13< fabi_> and gamepad buttons
20160806 18:49:20< celticminstrel> All you really need to do is fill the gaps with a stock side, perhaps controller=null and no_leader=yes or something.
20160806 18:49:37< gfgtdf> zookeeper: but tyoing the first letter of a name is easier than finding out te index of the unit in teh list and then clicking the down button that many times.
20160806 18:50:32< zookeeper> gfgtdf, really? that sounds pretty bizarre to me
20160806 18:51:14< celticminstrel> The list box should scroll to the first matching entry when you type a letter.
20160806 18:51:32< zookeeper> i mean, you have the arrow keys to navigate, and you see the unit in the list and that you have to press the down arrow 5 times to get to it. you'd rather type the first letters of its name to avoid pressing the down key 5 times?
20160806 18:52:22< zookeeper> if you say so, then... uh, okay. i wouldn't have thought someone would naturally gravitate towards that.
20160806 18:52:47< gfgtdf> zookeeper: no te idea was that you just have to type the full anym usually
20160806 18:53:16< celticminstrel> I don't think recruits really need a filter, though I suppose it wouldn't hurt.
20160806 18:53:28< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: i really think of the side= atribute as something like a 'checked comment' so that it doenst do anything , but the game asists you that it doesn't put wrong information there
20160806 18:53:29< celticminstrel> But if there's no filter, the list box should respond like I mentioned.
20160806 18:53:50< gfgtdf> celticminstrels suggestion of jumpin there woudl most likeley be also a good way
20160806 18:53:59< zookeeper> gfgtdf, why would you ever have to type the full name..? i'm not following
20160806 18:54:06< celticminstrel> gfgtdf: I don't think that's a good way of putting it. Furthermore, you said it no longer "assists you" and now just ignores it.
20160806 18:54:51< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: y but that was what it did in 1.12 afaik.
20160806 18:55:00< zookeeper> i guess i don't see any intrinsic harm in having a filter box in the recruit dialog, unless someone accidentally pops a letter there and narrows their recruit list down without realizing it, which seems like a minor concern.
20160806 18:55:07< celticminstrel> But that's not relevant if it no longer does it.
20160806 18:55:57< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: well the current bahviourf, that it onyl gives an error when loaded as a start-of-scenario save is obviously bad.
20160806 18:56:14< iceiceice> do filter boxes work well in all languages?
20160806 18:56:59< celticminstrel> iceiceice: Potentially yes, I think.
20160806 18:57:01< gfgtdf> celticminstrel: so we have  options: 1) make it ignore side= completeley, 2) Make it ive a warning on wrong side numbers (or a blicking erro liek 1.12.5 did), 3) support noncontinious side numbersw
20160806 18:57:19< iceiceice> good to know :)
20160806 18:57:24< celticminstrel> I prefer #3 but would be okay with #2.
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20160806 19:03:32< fabi_> celticminstrel: I tried to do #3 in Irdya. It gets ugly.
20160806 19:03:43< zookeeper> Aginor, vultraz, the "you have no units to recall" message when you try to recall for instance at the beginning of a campaign still isn't showing up in 1.13.5 (the last time i assumed it was getting auto-dismissed somehow). dunno if it's a problem with the recall dialog stuff or a redraw-related issue.
20160806 19:04:05< celticminstrel> fabi_: How so?
20160806 19:04:08< vultraz> how come everyone except me is seeing this bug :|
20160806 19:04:39< celticminstrel> vultraz: Maybe it's a redraw-related issue and your runtime is better at handling that somehow?
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20160806 19:04:49< vultraz> perhaps
20160806 19:06:06< fabi_> celticminstrel: Oh. There was just a lot of cases to handle. What if sides have the same number? How to distribute the numbers if only a subset of the sides got the attribute?
20160806 19:06:32< celticminstrel> I don't quite understand the second one.
20160806 19:06:48< celticminstrel> For the first I'd give a warning and probably ignore the duplicate.
20160806 19:07:22< fabi_> But usually the latter overwrites the earlier in wml.
20160806 19:07:25< celticminstrel> Oh, the second, are you saying if some [side] have a side attribute and others don't? I'd just make the attribute compulsory, so it's an error if they don't.
20160806 19:07:34< celticminstrel> fabi_: Well, that would be fine too.
20160806 19:08:04< celticminstrel> Could also merge them, but that'd probably never produce the desired result.
20160806 19:08:08< fabi_> Sure, you can do that. I just got bored while coding all that what if stuff.
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20160806 19:22:46< fabi_> celticminstrel: I would rather prefer [side] to be supported in actionWML to dynamically add sides during runtime.
20160806 19:23:23< fabi_> and also [story] 
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20160806 19:58:00< irker752> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master ddb528faf450 / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/chapter1/ (01_The_Uprooting.cfg 02_Hostile_Mountains.cfg 03_Kalian_under_Attack.cfg): LoW Chapter 1: Wrapped [event] actionWML in [command]. https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/ddb528faf450f234b05e41669364ae60a12ade5f
20160806 19:58:02< irker752> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 4776823128f5 / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/units/ogres/Great_Ogre.cfg: Fix portrait path by removing the "transparent" part. https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/4776823128f5f265cde04eac9088f16da42a551b
20160806 19:58:04< irker752> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 18ec4a150736 / data/campaigns/Eastern_Invasion/scenarios/04c_Mal-Ravanals_Capital.cfg: Fix a [foreach] which still used the runtime variable into [for]. https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/18ec4a150736fb49e1895b7414e4895e2aa6ab94
20160806 19:58:06< irker752> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 49f7103ad1b1 / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/ (13 files in 3 dirs): LoW: Wrapped event actionWML into [command]. https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/49f7103ad1b17d639cb5b97e67e672df0a148342
20160806 19:58:08< irker752> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master b8b72750f914 / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/ (scenarios/chapter3/09_Bounty_Hunters.cfg utils/low-macros.cfg): LoW 09: Remove a silly use of [+unit]. https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/b8b72750f9143400503bcc6bf18fe75f670d0d11
20160806 19:58:10< irker752> wesnoth: fendrin wesnoth:master 8a9feb10ac02 / data/ (8 files in 7 dirs): Fix several bugs introduced with the FOREACH replacement. https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/8a9feb10ac029c0dcb73fdea0faf81f4e84d1e0f
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20160806 20:04:12< celticminstrel> ddb528f annoys me for some reason.
20160806 20:04:38< celticminstrel> Amd 49f7103
20160806 20:04:46< celticminstrel> ^And
20160806 20:04:59< fabi_> What is wrong with it?
20160806 20:05:38< celticminstrel> Nothing specifically wrong, just annoying.
20160806 20:05:50< celticminstrel> Maybe I get annoyed by people doing pointless changes.
20160806 20:06:02< fabi_> I see.
20160806 20:06:16< Espreon> You should have been around when I replaced apostrophes and "--"s.
20160806 20:06:18< Espreon> :D
20160806 20:06:29< fabi_> :-)
20160806 20:06:49< celticminstrel> --?
20160806 20:07:00< Espreon> A makeshit em dash
20160806 20:07:06< Espreon> *makeshift
20160806 20:07:09< celticminstrel> I'm kind of hoping you don't plan to do this on all campaigns.
20160806 20:07:09< Espreon> Heh, "makeshit".
20160806 20:07:14< Espreon> They are indeed shit, that's for sure.
20160806 20:07:22< gfgtdf> i argee with celticminstrel here, there are really no reason for these changes.
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20160806 20:07:58< vultraz> yeah, there's no need for that change
20160806 20:08:04< vultraz> please revert it
20160806 20:08:12< vultraz> (ddb528faf450 )
20160806 20:08:22< celticminstrel> There's as little point reverting it as there was making it in the first place, really.
20160806 20:08:47< celticminstrel> Definitely don't do it in other campaigns though, since vultraz (and gfgtdf) disagree.
20160806 20:09:28< vultraz> I don't want that type of useless WML use encouraged in mainline
20160806 20:09:36< vultraz> UMC authors will see it and emulate it
20160806 20:09:46< fabi_> I hope so.
20160806 20:09:52< vultraz> Why?
20160806 20:10:17< fabi_> Because [event] is the last place where actionWML is mixed up at the same level with other WML.
20160806 20:10:41< vultraz> [event] IS actionwml...
20160806 20:10:47< vultraz> to a point
20160806 20:10:48< fabi_> sadly not
20160806 20:10:58< fabi_> there are attributes and filters in there
20160806 20:11:02< vultraz> yes
20160806 20:11:03< celticminstrel> I understand fabi's argument but still consider it pointless.
20160806 20:11:07< vultraz> ^
20160806 20:11:20< vultraz> having tag metadata on the same level as execution commands is FINE
20160806 20:11:39< vultraz> seriously 
20160806 20:11:48< vultraz> we don't want to pointlessly add indentation 
20160806 20:11:52< celticminstrel> There's that, too.
20160806 20:11:55< vultraz> I suppose I sound like zookeeper here
20160806 20:12:09< celticminstrel> vultraz: Don't lose track of the fact that it was split into two commits for some reason - one for S1 and one for the rest.
20160806 20:12:30< vultraz> ugh
20160806 20:12:32< vultraz> just
20160806 20:12:37< vultraz> please, revert that change.
20160806 20:12:51< fabi_> I like to discuss that out.
20160806 20:13:00< zookeeper> why the hell would you wrap stuff in [command]s...
20160806 20:13:12< celticminstrel> Here's another who disagrees.
20160806 20:14:00< vultraz> We should be working towards reducing code complexity 
20160806 20:14:05< fabi_> yes
20160806 20:14:11< fabi_> That is the idea behind it.
20160806 20:14:15< vultraz> This is the exact opposite, I'm afraid
20160806 20:14:16< fabi_> It reduces code complexity
20160806 20:14:19< fabi_> no
20160806 20:14:26< vultraz> It doesn't reduce it at all
20160806 20:14:35< celticminstrel> Note that wrapping it in [command] reduces code complexity on the C++ side since you don't need to filter out the filter tags.
20160806 20:14:42< fabi_> yes
20160806 20:14:51< fabi_> And when parsing wml
20160806 20:14:56< vultraz> if *anything*
20160806 20:15:00< fabi_> Trust me, I know what I am doing.
20160806 20:15:11< vultraz> it's the filters that should be wrapped in a sub-tag
20160806 20:15:17< vultraz> but the commands
20160806 20:15:19< celticminstrel> It does increase complexity on the WML side though.
20160806 20:15:27< vultraz> you do this stuff to the *smaller* areas.
20160806 20:15:35< fabi_> vultraz: Do you want to have a wmllint that is a real parser and validator? 
20160806 20:15:45< fabi_> One that is maintained actively again?
20160806 20:16:00< celticminstrel> I'm pretty sure wmllint is actively maintained.
20160806 20:16:06< vultraz> Elvish_Hunter has done a perfectly good job of maintaining it
20160806 20:16:13< vultraz> and wmllint will never be a proper parser
20160806 20:16:40< celticminstrel> Actually, wmllint cannot be a full parser.
20160806 20:16:48< celticminstrel> It cannot expand macros.
20160806 20:16:53< fabi_> vultraz: I bet for the current state of LoW I can write a proper parse and lexer.
20160806 20:16:57< celticminstrel> To do so would cripple it.
20160806 20:17:12< vultraz> LoW's code is messy as hell
20160806 20:17:17< celticminstrel> A lexer and parser is probably pretty easy, ignoring preprocessor.
20160806 20:17:22< vultraz> unless you magically fixed that in the past week.
20160806 20:17:49< celticminstrel> The lexer and parser only needs to capture the config structure. It doesn't need to validate it against a schema.
20160806 20:19:00< fabi_> The validator needs to deal with mixed wml types.
20160806 20:19:45< celticminstrel> Wrapping it in [command] would help the validator, sure. It still doesn't mean I'll agree with it.
20160806 20:24:14< vultraz> You guys know I'm not one to balk at changes that inconvenience UMC authors
20160806 20:24:30< vultraz> Especially if it's an improvement on something
20160806 20:24:32< vultraz> But this is not
20160806 20:25:06< celticminstrel> In particular, I would point out that if something improves things on our side but makes it worse for addon devs, then we shouldn't do it.
20160806 20:25:13< celticminstrel> This definitely fits that category.
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20160806 20:25:56< vultraz> I really must insists you revert that change.
20160806 20:26:19< celticminstrel> vultraz: You know, you keep insisting that he do something that you can easily do yourself. :P
20160806 20:26:26< vultraz> I could
20160806 20:27:01< vultraz> I'm giving him a chance to do it himself.
20160806 20:27:01 * celticminstrel notes that this situation might be partly my faulr since I was the one who mentioned it was possible at some point. >_>
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20160806 20:52:19< celmin> Aside from the [command] issue, I'm not seeing what part of 18ec4a15 made it necessary to be [for].
20160806 20:52:23< celmin> Maybe I'm missing something.
20160806 20:55:26< celmin> I see you chose to change to this_item instead of just adding variable=this_unit. Whatever.
20160806 20:55:46< fabi_> celmin: The variables in case were locations.
20160806 20:55:56< celmin> Oh, okay.
20160806 20:56:00< celmin> Makes sense then.
20160806 20:56:44< celmin> vultraz: Apparently mapgen name generation is broken.
20160806 20:56:50< fabi_> I first thought as well that I had been inspired by an old runtime variable name regarding units.
20160806 20:57:15< celmin> That variable still exists though.
20160806 20:57:20< fabi_> But it seems I just typed unit instead of item just for the fun of it.
20160806 20:57:50< celmin> Hmm, you know, I wonder if [modify_unit] could be rewritten to, where possible, avoid storing the unit...
20160806 20:58:20< celmin> Or, maybe, to avoid it altogether.
20160806 20:58:30< celmin> It's kinda a big change though...
20160806 20:58:55< celmin> And would be uglier probably.
20160806 21:00:00< vultraz> celmin: are you saying I broke it?
20160806 21:00:12< celmin> Probably, though it could've been me.
20160806 21:00:32< celmin> The location of Spixi's comment implies that he thinks it was you though.
20160806 21:01:03< fabi_> celmin:           {VARIABLE_CONDITIONAL i numerical_equals $paladin_i} makes 18ec a [for]
20160806 21:01:17< fabi_> I did that wrong before but zookeeper spotted it.
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20160806 21:01:34< celmin> Ah. So you changed the uses of i that zookeeper spotted?
20160806 21:02:06< gfgtdf> celmin: i dont liek unstore_unit, for exactly becasue it used store_unstore internally. but i guess that there quiet soem umc relaingon this behaviour.
20160806 21:02:21< gfgtdf> uses*
20160806 21:02:22< celmin> Guessing you mean [modify_unit].
20160806 21:02:32< celmin> In what way would UMC rely on this behaviour?
20160806 21:02:32< gfgtdf> celmin: yes i mean modify_unit
20160806 21:03:16< celmin> Oh, I guess it can't be done without store_unit, since the $this_unit variable does need to be populated, but I think it could be done without unstore.
20160806 21:03:39-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160806 21:04:05< celmin> It would be rather more complicated to do though while preserving current behaviours, such as altering objects, attacks, or abilities.
20160806 21:05:21-!- Spixi [~chatzilla@pD9549FB4.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds]
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20160806 21:11:37< gfgtdf> celmin: well what i don't is more that it deöletes and creates a new unit (as opposed to usning lua unit proxy fields) not that it sotes them in a wml varaible. So i one thought about having lieka map names wml_names->lua_names and then impementing it as in 'function modify_unit (cfg) ... for k,v in pairs(cfg) u[names[k]] =v'    but that want really possible for exameple becasue it wouldn't...
20160806 21:11:38< gfgtdf> ...suport changing child attributes like of attacks and sometimes the types of the wml atributes are quite different than on lua unit proxies
20160806 21:12:04< celmin> It's a good idea though.
20160806 21:12:07< gfgtdf> s/want/wasn't 
20160806 21:12:26< celmin> It won't fully emulate the current behaviour, but I think it would be a step in the right direction.
20160806 21:12:59< celmin> Which ones have different types in Lua and WML?
20160806 21:13:56< gfgtdf> celmin: extra recuit for examepl is a list in lua and a commy seperated in wml
20160806 21:14:18< celmin> Ah, that's true.
20160806 21:14:29< celmin> You could handle that one separately though.
20160806 21:18:33< gfgtdf> celmin: hmm maybe, but then i lost motivation to think about it more.
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20160806 21:34:44< celmin> So I got a message from Firefox telling me that my system is unsupported. :O
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20160806 21:59:53< Aginor> zookeeper: if it's a redraw issue it should still show the buttons and the like as you mouse over it
20160806 22:00:04-!- RatArmy [~RatArmy@om126212092091.11.openmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20160806 22:00:12< Aginor> zookeeper: I'll see if I can look into it later though, I have a day of consulting to get through first
20160806 22:00:36< zookeeper> Aginor, there's nothing to mouseover
20160806 22:00:59< Aginor> zookeeper: that makes me thing the dialog is never created
20160806 22:01:00< celmin> The dialog in question has no buttons, just text.
20160806 22:01:08< Aginor> ah
20160806 22:01:16< Aginor> transient message?
20160806 22:01:25< celmin> Think so, yeah.
20160806 22:01:33< Aginor> they should work ;)
20160806 22:01:45< Aginor> they're gui2 and gui2 has always "just worked"
20160806 22:02:12< Aginor> I'll investigate later though
20160806 22:02:28< Aginor> celmin: start of any scenario?
20160806 22:02:49< Aginor> celmin: or should I encounter it if I attempt to recall at first scenario of a campaign?
20160806 22:04:23< zookeeper> yes you should
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20160806 22:09:50< Aginor> cool, I'll give it a go later
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20160806 22:10:24< Aginor> I've also made some progress on tracking down the last cause of the flickering when closing [message /]
20160806 22:10:34< Aginor> so I'm hoping to resolve that
20160806 22:10:36< Aginor> soon
20160806 22:10:56< Aginor> which up until now was my last known GUI issue ;)
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20160806 22:37:50< Spixi> name generation in the map generator is fixed with PR#728
20160806 22:38:01< celmin> Yay, thanks.
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20160806 23:11:28< vultraz> PR looks alright
20160806 23:11:29-!- Greg-Boggs [~greg_bogg@host-200-188.pubnet.pdx.edu] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20160806 23:11:39< vultraz> celmin might want to look over it
20160806 23:12:04< celmin> Already did.
20160806 23:12:21< celmin> Didn't see anything worth commenting on, only "I would've done that a bit differently" things.
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20160806 23:12:54< travis-ci> spixi/wesnoth#8 (fix_mapgen - 1ff43c4 : Spixi): The build passed.
20160806 23:12:55< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/spixi/wesnoth/builds/150339265
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20160806 23:13:37< vultraz> merge?
20160806 23:14:26< celmin> I dunno. Probably fine?
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20160806 23:15:01< irker763> wesnoth: Spixi wesnoth:master d0d3b1fbca6f / changelog data/english.cfg src/generators/default_map_generator_job.cpp: Fixed name generation in map generator https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/d0d3b1fbca6f452f9cd70c6d08d097a6e36ff9fe
20160806 23:15:01< irker763> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 0e03992f7d69 / changelog data/english.cfg src/generators/default_map_generator_job.cpp: Merge pull request #728 from spixi/fix_mapgen https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/0e03992f7d69b02a37fb6c1c39d1bc2dce36daba
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20160806 23:17:31< gfgtdf> celmin: weren't you recently talking about making the ambush text in [hides] customisable? i just found a featruerequest about exactly that https://gna.org/bugs/?8264
20160806 23:18:00< celmin> I was, yes.
20160806 23:18:16< celmin> I discovered it to be harder than it sounds, so put it on hold; but feel free to assign that bug report to me.
20160806 23:24:19< irker763> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 31c31a674fb9 / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/chapter1/ (01_The_Uprooting.cfg 02_Hostile_Mountains.cfg 03_Kalian_under_Attack.cfg): Revert "LoW Chapter 1: Wrapped [event] actionWML in [command]." https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/31c31a674fb9a7d6ff05b65639ec7912e2dc5550
20160806 23:24:22< irker763> wesnoth: Charles Dang wesnoth:master 40bc508f7f3a / data/campaigns/Legend_of_Wesmere/scenarios/ (13 files in 3 dirs): Revert "LoW: Wrapped event actionWML into [command]." https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/40bc508f7f3adc30ca832d88000415b3cc724ff0
20160806 23:25:52< vultraz> fabi_: I have reverted the offending two commits. We can still discuss a cleaner structure for [event] if you want, but I feel that is not the right way to go.
20160806 23:26:13< vultraz> (that = wrapping things in [command])
20160806 23:26:16< gfgtdf> Aginor: maybe the recall promt issues re related to this one https://gna.org/bugs/?12162 ?
20160806 23:28:05< gfgtdf> vultraz: you think i can close https://gna.org/bugs/?10519 since it can already be done with wesnoth.show_dialog ?
20160806 23:28:48< vultraz> Yes, close it
20160806 23:28:59< celmin> Wait.
20160806 23:29:10< vultraz> Wait?
20160806 23:29:10< celmin> Yes it can be done with show_dialog.
20160806 23:29:17< celmin> But that's requesting a WML tag.
20160806 23:29:32< celmin> So I wonder if it should be moved to the WML category instead of closing it>
20160806 23:29:34< celmin> ^?
20160806 23:29:38< vultraz> It's requesting a built-in way to do it.
20160806 23:29:40< celmin> I dunno. Just a thought.
20160806 23:29:44< vultraz> I don't think such a thing is worth adding 
20160806 23:29:59< vultraz> Better left to UMC authors.
20160806 23:30:07< celmin> Since it's possible with show_dialog, implementing it into an ActionWML tag would be easy to do.
20160806 23:30:16< vultraz> Yes
20160806 23:30:24< vultraz> That's how I implement all my custom GUI2 dialogs
20160806 23:30:32 * celmin shrugs.
20160806 23:30:34< vultraz> but i mean there isn't much use in having such a tag core.
20160806 23:30:41< celmin> Well, whatever.
20160806 23:31:40< vultraz> Especially since the use is very limited
20160806 23:31:47< vultraz> Er, lemme rephrase 
20160806 23:31:53< vultraz> The request is very specific 
20160806 23:32:07< vultraz> Now, I *would* support adding a [transient_message] tag
20160806 23:32:42< vultraz> (basically directly enabling use of the dialog [object]/any in-game popop uses)
20160806 23:33:34< vultraz> I think you added wesnoth.show_transient_message()?
20160806 23:34:48< celmin> I did, yes.
20160806 23:35:46< vultraz> Might be worth adding a WML wrapper
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20160806 23:37:06< travis-ci> spixi/wesnoth#9 (fix_mapgen - d0d3b1f : Spixi): The build passed.
20160806 23:37:06< travis-ci> Build details : https://travis-ci.org/spixi/wesnoth/builds/150340098
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20160806 23:42:54< celmin> Hmm, does anyone think that the [leader] tag should be made standard?
20160806 23:43:07< celmin> Instead of mixing side and unit attributes in [side].
20160806 23:43:54< vultraz> This is a good question
20160806 23:43:57< vultraz> fabi_ would say yes
20160806 23:44:03< vultraz> I'm not sure
20160806 23:44:09< celmin> I think it's a good idea.
20160806 23:44:17< vultraz> On one hand, I think it'd make things cleaner
20160806 23:44:50< celmin> The only thing I would really need to change is that the presence of a [leader] tag prevents the game from trying to spawn a leader from the side attributes, as if no_leader=yes were present.
20160806 23:45:22< celmin> What's the other hand, then? :P
20160806 23:45:25< vultraz> On the other, can I support this while supporting no [command] in [event]
20160806 23:45:51< celmin> I think mixing attributes is worse than mixing tags, personally.
20160806 23:45:59< vultraz> this is true
20160806 23:46:13< celmin> In my campaign I already indent the leader attributes an extra level.
20160806 23:46:19< vultraz> So, what is your proposal?
20160806 23:46:31< vultraz> [leader][/leader] = no_leader=yes?
20160806 23:46:37< celmin> Pretty much.
20160806 23:46:50< vultraz> what about [leader][/leader] next to existing leader attributes
20160806 23:46:52< vultraz> same thing?
20160806 23:47:17< celmin> Probably. I don't think people would have been likely to mix them.
20160806 23:47:23< vultraz> And will there be a warning
20160806 23:47:33< vultraz> About inline leader attributes 
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20160806 23:47:44< celmin> There could be a warning if type is present.
20160806 23:48:01< celmin> A general warning about any inline leader attributes would be hard, but type is probably the only required one.
20160806 23:48:14< vultraz> sounds reasonable
20160806 23:48:20< vultraz> I guess I support this
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20160806 23:49:13 * vultraz has always wondered why the 'team' class handles
20160806 23:49:17< vultraz> [side]
20160806 23:49:19< vultraz> and not teams at all
20160806 23:50:30< celmin> It makes sense to me.
20160806 23:50:45< celmin> The word "team" makes sense when applied to a single side.
20160806 23:50:53< vultraz> true
20160806 23:50:55< celmin> It also makes sense when applied to an alliance of several sides.
--- Log closed Sun Aug 07 00:00:48 2016