--- Log opened Thu Nov 03 00:00:08 2016
20161103 00:00:22< celticminstrel> Probably?
20161103 00:00:37< celticminstrel> Well, I'm not really sure what you're doing it for though.
20161103 00:00:42< lamefun> I have to do that because when there's a game that you don't have an add-on for, it's just gray and you can't enter it.
20161103 00:00:49< celticminstrel> Huh?
20161103 00:00:53< lamefun> It doesn't offer you to install the add-on.
20161103 00:01:04< celticminstrel> Well, that's not entirely true.
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20161103 00:03:29< lamefun> So the would-be player has to exit the lobby and search for the add-on... it's impossible to test like that because you'll never get players quickly...
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20161103 00:05:07< lamefun> Is this fixed in 1.13?
20161103 00:06:35< DeFender1031> 20161031 00:53:21< lamefun> the loss of performance doesn't matter, since I'm already using things like building images by blitting pixels from blank_attack
20161103 00:08:04< DeFender1031> my point was basically that you've previously stated that you don't care about performance even on major things, yet tonight you seem to be concerned about performance on something relatively minor.
20161103 00:08:52< celticminstrel> lamefun: Yes, I believe it is.
20161103 00:09:11< celticminstrel> But in 1.12 it's possible to not require download. aeth has achieved this, among others.
20161103 00:13:13< lamefun> DeFender1031, my point was that while you have to copy and lose performance with immutable variables, you also have to copy and lose performance with mutable variables to say sane.
20161103 00:14:29< DeFender1031> lamefun, you have to copy far less frequently with mutable ones though, and with languages that are structured to better deal with such things (like what I said about C/C++), you don't even need to do it manually.
20161103 00:15:19< DeFender1031> celticminstrel, true, but aeth severly restricts himself. No custom images, for example.
20161103 00:15:29< celticminstrel> True.
20161103 00:15:52< celticminstrel> 1.13 does implement automatic add-on downloading.
20161103 00:16:09< celticminstrel> I can't speak for how well it works, but I assume it's been tested by someone.
20161103 00:16:35< DeFender1031> but like i've said many times, there's no reason why a manual download should ever be required (or why OOS should ever happen). The machine hosting the game should be able to send all relevant information across when the other machines need it.
20161103 00:17:45< celticminstrel> Yeah.
20161103 00:18:19< lamefun> "like what I said about C/C++" - it deals with it by allowing immutable data structures
20161103 00:18:44 * celticminstrel has no idea what you're talking about now.
20161103 00:20:55< lamefun> eg. std::map copies the map keys and only allows const access to them.
20161103 00:21:00< DeFender1031> lamefun, "allowing", not "requiring"
20161103 00:21:21< DeFender1031> i was referring to how it does pass-by-copy unless you specifically specify a reference
20161103 00:23:10< DeFender1031> bottom line though, if you're using objects as map keys in such a way that the key's relationship to the value is based on the object's data rather than the object instance itself, then you're using lua in a way it was not intended and asking for issues.
20161103 00:23:56< DeFender1031> (frankly, i think using objects as map keys is a pretty terrible idea in general except for a few specific, select cases)
20161103 00:24:35< DeFender1031> for example, if you want to map x and y locations to some data, instead of using a table as a key, use a string in the form of "x,y"
20161103 00:25:13< lamefun> well, this just means that I have to parse the keys when I get them back...
20161103 00:25:14< DeFender1031> alternately, use a multi-level map, with the outer one having the x values as keys, and another map as values which itself uses the y values as keys
20161103 00:26:01< DeFender1031> finding the comma in a 3-5 character string (okay, MAAAAAAAAAYBE 7 in cases like aeth's) should not be a big deal.
20161103 00:29:12< celticminstrel> If you want to map x and y locations to some data in Wesnoth, use the location_set "class".
20161103 00:29:45< celticminstrel> (Despite the name, it's really a map, not a set.)
20161103 00:32:33< lamefun> I want to identify attacks like this: attack { name = ..., range = ..., type = ... }
20161103 00:33:36< lamefun> and have a map: disabled_attacks : attack_id -> bool
20161103 00:37:09< DeFender1031> lamefun, is this leading to a question, or are you just letting us know how you structured your code?
20161103 00:42:38< lamefun> Is there some library that implements typed classes/records with possibly immutable fields?
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20161103 01:26:48< lamefun> Well, I'll just dump tables to generate complex keys...
20161103 01:42:25 * celticminstrel doubts it's a good idea to use very long strings as keys.
20161103 01:45:44< lamefun> I'll use this for small tables like: http://paste.ofcode.org/qnNg8Q8Rs6McjnpCUX2q8w
20161103 01:46:12< celticminstrel> I see.
20161103 01:47:07< celticminstrel> That should work, as long as iteration order is independent of insertion order. (I think it is but not sure.)
20161103 01:48:33< lamefun> It sorts the keys anyway.
20161103 01:48:55< celticminstrel> Uh, I'm pretty sure it's a hash map, not a tree map.
20161103 01:49:15< celticminstrel> With some special consideration for an "array-like" portion consisting of contiguous keys from 1 to whatever.
20161103 01:49:36< lamefun> cc.dump sorts the keys
20161103 01:49:42< celticminstrel> Oh, okay. Gotcha.
20161103 02:12:36< lamefun> Before I waste time and have to scrap the code: can I have lists within multi_pages? I.e. wesnoth.set_dialog_value('faerie fire', 'multipage', i, 'attacks', j, 'name')?
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20161103 02:17:41< DeFender1031> lamefun, yes
20161103 02:28:22< lamefun> Can I add something to list_definition's toggle panel to prevent it from being selectable?
20161103 02:44:15< celticminstrel> Nope.
20161103 02:45:55< lamefun> Can I make it look like it's not selectable?
20161103 02:46:06< vultraz> has_minimum = false
20161103 02:46:32< celticminstrel> That doesn't do what he asks.
20161103 02:47:09< celticminstrel> I suspect there's no easy way to make it look like it's selectable.
20161103 02:47:57< celticminstrel> You might be able to do something complicated with has_minimum=false and fixing the selection when they click a non-selectable element. (If no elements are selectable, that's probably not too difficult.) I'm not entirely sure how well has_minimum=false works in 1.12 though.
20161103 02:48:19< celticminstrel> Basically I'm saying a selection callback that deselects the element.
20161103 02:48:38< vultraz> tl'dr: switch to 1.13 :P
20161103 02:48:42< celticminstrel> has_minimum=false means there does not need to be a selected element (ie, it's possible that no element is selected)
20161103 02:48:51< celticminstrel> vultraz: That's probably not an option. :P
20161103 02:49:05< celticminstrel> Well, if it is though, I'd recommend it.
20161103 02:49:28< celticminstrel> (For example, if what you're working on is unlikely to be finished within a few months, it might be worth it.)
20161103 02:49:44< celticminstrel> (Or at least finished to the point where people can try it out.)
20161103 03:12:47< lamefun> set_dialog_callback is not immediate?
20161103 03:14:04< lamefun> nvm
20161103 03:14:20< lamefun> forgot that dialogs block messages
20161103 03:14:29< lamefun> do they still do that in 1.13?
20161103 03:18:35< lamefun> can I only add items to preshow?
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20161103 03:42:20< lamefun> what number should I provide to set_dialog_value to deselect everything?
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20161103 04:08:04< celticminstrel> You should be able to add items from a callback...
20161103 04:08:19< celticminstrel> And to deselect everything I think you'd provide -1, or possibly 0.
20161103 04:08:37< celticminstrel> (I think actually any invalid index would work.)
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20161103 04:27:43< lamefun> does it work on 1.12? I tried, it doesn't seem to work.
20161103 04:29:56< celticminstrel> No idea.
20161103 04:31:30< can-ned_food> has anyone ever wanted a mod that allows you to use teammate's villages while not taking the village from them?
20161103 04:32:16< can-ned_food> and i hope i didn't spend my time on something that was already done.
20161103 04:37:14< can-ned_food> so, celticminstrel, should i bother posting a diff of the small spellchecking i've done while playing Besieged Druids?
20161103 04:37:35< can-ned_food> well, that and some other things i think.
20161103 04:40:06< celticminstrel> can-ned_food: Feel free. I probably have unreleased changes, though, so I'm not sure how cleanly a patch would apply.
20161103 04:41:11< lamefun> are there some widgets (e.g. a panel) that can be styled? maybe I could hide the toggle panel beneath one...
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20161103 04:41:56< lamefun> what I want to do: http://uploadpie.com/RxIIU - hide the selection in the shop row
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20161103 04:50:03< celticminstrel> All widgets can be styled, but there's no addon access to this mechanism that I know of.
20161103 04:50:46< celticminstrel> So you can only really use preset styles. (The definition key in a widget specifies the style to use. Available styles depend on the widget.)
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20161103 05:12:50< lamefun> celticminstrel, I DID IT!
20161103 05:13:11< lamefun> set_dialog_canvas on the toggle_panel...
20161103 05:14:04< celticminstrel> Oh.
20161103 05:14:05< lamefun> cleared canvases 4 and 6
20161103 05:14:15< celticminstrel> I didn't know this existed.
20161103 05:14:19< lamefun> there's still sound on click, but it doesn't look like a list anymore
20161103 05:30:26< vultraz> iintteresting
20161103 05:30:36< vultraz> that is probably one of the hackiest hacks I've ever seen
20161103 05:30:38< vultraz> but i'm impressed
20161103 05:43:20< lamefun> I can force blur on dialog too!
20161103 05:43:52< lamefun> http://uploadpie.com/L2Xh8 - Apple iPhone!
20161103 05:45:59< lamefun> although it doesn't look like I can actually use it, you see the shadows around the items, they only grow stronger with time (bug) :(
20161103 05:56:01< lamefun> I actually tried set_dialog_canvas multiple times, but alas, I'm an idiot.
20161103 05:56:13< lamefun> I always used it before the list item was created...
20161103 05:56:21< lamefun> Sorry for wasting your time.
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20161103 06:04:59< lamefun> There's another thing I forgot about when deciding to port to Lua... can't use eg. "{WEAPON_SPECIAL_DRAIN}"....
20161103 06:25:06< can-ned_food> porting to Lua, eh?  i've not studied the Lua support in Wesnoth.  how much is there, lamefun?
20161103 06:26:03< can-ned_food> i mean, in brief of course, if you don't mind.
20161103 06:26:48< lamefun> The support is 100%.
20161103 06:27:02< lamefun> Since you can run WML commands from within Lua just as easily as from WML.
20161103 06:27:24< lamefun> But you can't use macros...
20161103 06:29:44< lamefun> You can also extend WML from Lua, but I got sick of WML, so I decided to only use it for configuration.
20161103 06:37:46< can-ned_food> well, macros are only there to make up for the awkwardness of WML
20161103 06:37:53-!- celticminstrel is now known as celmin|sleep
20161103 06:38:19< lamefun> the problem is really the existing macros...
20161103 06:38:23< lamefun> can't use them in Lua.
20161103 06:38:33< celmin|sleep> There's a way around that.
20161103 06:38:44< celmin|sleep> Generally your Lua script is execute by a [lua] tag, right?
20161103 06:38:53< celmin|sleep> The [lua] tag supports an [args] subtag.
20161103 06:39:03< celmin|sleep> (I think it was args.)
20161103 06:39:15< celmin|sleep> You can put any arbitrary WML in there.
20161103 06:39:19< celmin|sleep> Which of course includes macros.
20161103 06:39:33< celmin|sleep> And then that [args] tag is accessible from the script via ...
20161103 06:39:52< celmin|sleep> So if you did something like [args][drain]{WEAPON_SPECIAL_DRAIN}
20161103 06:40:39< celmin|sleep> Then you can get the macro's expansion via helper.get_child(..., "drain").
20161103 06:41:08< celmin|sleep> Obviously this won't work for any arbitrary macros, but the ones for traits, specials, abilities etc will work fine.
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20161103 10:58:06< Nikitaw99> hm, is it possible to specify that role=null when creating a unit? it will be useful for my macro
20161103 10:58:37< zookeeper> yes, you can specify the role when you create a unit.
20161103 11:05:42< Nikitaw99> and role=null makes the role unspecified?
20161103 11:07:43< zookeeper> no, it makes the role be "null"
20161103 11:09:03< Nikitaw99> :|
20161103 11:09:06< Nikitaw99> oh well
20161103 11:09:10< Nikitaw99> anyway
20161103 11:09:22< Nikitaw99> how do I changed a specific unit's color without changing it's side
20161103 11:09:23< zookeeper> what you want doesn't make sense
20161103 11:09:57< Nikitaw99> eh, i don't really need it anyway
20161103 11:10:11< Nikitaw99> so, how do I change a specific unit's color without changing it's side?
20161103 11:10:55< zookeeper> you can't change the ellipse color, but at least darken volk in DiD has some kind of image mod which gives him a special TC coloring
20161103 11:11:14< zookeeper> some other units somewhere else too
20161103 11:11:25< zookeeper> grüü i think
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20161103 11:14:35< Nikitaw99> i have a peasant named "Bob" in my campaign's first scenario...
20161103 11:14:49< Nikitaw99> xd
20161103 11:15:19< Nikitaw99> i sorta like that there is a "APPLE" define
20161103 11:15:31< Nikitaw99> i could make an easter egg using it ;)
20161103 11:15:37< Nikitaw99> (just for the mac users)
20161103 11:15:46< Nikitaw99> like "Bob: I like apples!"
20161103 11:36:44< Nikitaw99> mmmm
20161103 11:36:55< Nikitaw99> how do I implement a custom teleport-like ability?
20161103 11:39:41< zookeeper> the same teleport is implemented
20161103 11:39:44< zookeeper> the same way
20161103 11:40:15< Nikitaw99> ???
20161103 11:41:59< zookeeper> look at the teleport ability macro. then copy it and make whatever changes you want.
20161103 11:43:43< Nikitaw99> oh, ok, thanks
20161103 11:44:20< Nikitaw99> I am confused with some special tiles like "Village Overlay", "Castle Overlay" and "Keep Overlay"...
20161103 11:44:38< Nikitaw99> what are they and how do I use them?
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20161103 11:52:40< Nikitaw99> :|
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20161103 12:17:26< Nikitaw99> I am confused with some special tiles like "Village Overlay", "Castle Overlay" and "Keep Overlay"...
20161103 13:03:23< DeFender1031> Nikitaw99, zookeeper, I actually seem to recall there being a mainline campaign where the leader's recolor is different from the rest of the side... let me see if i can find it
20161103 13:04:14< DeFender1031> oh... the "doesn't make sense" was the the previous inquiry. never mind then.
20161103 13:05:33< DeFender1031> Nikitaw99, they do just what they sound like. They are special overlays that will make any base tile act like that type of tile instead.
20161103 13:05:54< DeFender1031> Nikitaw99, do you understand the difference between base tiles and overlays?
20161103 13:06:06< Nikitaw99> DeFender1031: I guess...
20161103 13:06:42< Nikitaw99> Base are tiles such as grass, hills, mountains... While overlays are the tiles that might be on them such as forests and castles...
20161103 13:06:52< Nikitaw99> and villages
20161103 13:06:58< DeFender1031> castles are generally base tiles as well actually
20161103 13:07:09< Nikitaw99> wait yeah
20161103 13:07:12< Nikitaw99> >_>
20161103 13:07:13< DeFender1031> but yeah, fine
20161103 13:07:17< Nikitaw99> wait
20161103 13:07:18< DeFender1031> you get the difference.
20161103 13:07:25< Nikitaw99> if castles are base tiles...
20161103 13:07:46< Nikitaw99> we can make castles that also heal units standing on them and also provide income?
20161103 13:07:54< DeFender1031> so those special overlays can be used to, for examle, make a grass tile behave like a village.
20161103 13:08:02< Nikitaw99> using Castle (Base) + Village Overlay
20161103 13:08:10< DeFender1031> that'd work, yes.
20161103 13:08:18< Nikitaw99> interesting...
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20161103 13:08:33< DeFender1031> (At least, it should work in theory... Haven't tried it myself.)
20161103 13:08:47< Nikitaw99> well
20161103 13:08:54< Nikitaw99> it works with Castle + Impassable
20161103 13:09:15< Nikitaw99> i mean speciaal tile combinations
20161103 13:09:29< Nikitaw99> Castle + Impassable is in a mainline map
20161103 13:09:40< Nikitaw99> to be specificm: a multiplayer map
20161103 13:09:58< DeFender1031> There is actually one mainline campaign that has a scenario in which there are villages (real, visible ones, not overlay) inside a castle. I discovered an interesting bug whereby if you recall a unit onto them, it will capture them, but if you then undo, they remain belonging to you.
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20161103 13:45:17< zookeeper> DeFender1031, do you know if there's a bug report for that?
20161103 13:45:28< zookeeper> (if it's a still-existing issue)
20161103 13:46:01< DeFender1031> zookeeper, i don't think I actually made one.
20161103 13:46:44< DeFender1031> I seem to recall mentioning it here and you or celmin or someone saying something like "yup, that sounds like the sort of thing that could happen."
20161103 13:48:15< DeFender1031> [Thursday 31 December 2015] [12:45:30 PM] <DeFender1031>	hmm... looks like I found a bug. If there's a village inside a castle (which there are in Northern Rebirth: The Eastern Flank), and you recall a unit onto it and then undo, the village remains yours.
20161103 13:48:17< DeFender1031> [Thursday 31 December 2015] [12:50:20 PM] <zookeeper>	huh.
20161103 13:48:18< DeFender1031> [Thursday 31 December 2015] [12:53:13 PM] <zookeeper>	yeah, sounds plausible
20161103 13:48:42< DeFender1031> that was the extent of the conversation I think.
20161103 13:48:44< zookeeper> that long time ago, huh?
20161103 13:48:54< zookeeper> you wouldn't mind filing a report for that, would you? :P
20161103 13:49:51< DeFender1031> i hate gna, but i'll see what i can do. Also, as usual, i don't know if something else fixed it, so i'd like to make sure it's still an issue in 1.13 before i report it.
20161103 13:50:10< DeFender1031> (one of these days i'll be able to test master myself)
20161103 13:50:40< zookeeper> well, i can verify it myself right now, just a minute...
20161103 13:50:41< DeFender1031> i'm also currently in the middle of working on that lua list that celmin wanted.
20161103 13:54:23< zookeeper> seems to have been fixed
20161103 13:54:47< zookeeper> well, i only tried recruiting, not recalling
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20161103 13:56:55< zookeeper> yeah, doesn't happen at least in master
20161103 13:57:01< DeFender1031> hmmm
20161103 13:57:15< DeFender1031> okay then.
20161103 13:57:25< DeFender1031> wait... i thought recruit wasn't undoable
20161103 13:57:31< zookeeper> traitless recruits are
20161103 13:57:35< DeFender1031> ah
20161103 13:57:36< Nikitaw99> i remember a wiki page that teaches how to make an icon using path image function (thingys), though i dont remember what it's called...
20161103 13:57:49< Nikitaw99> I am not sure how to launch the image_loading_tester
20161103 13:57:56< DeFender1031> Nikitaw99, https://wiki.wesnoth.org/ImagePathFunctionWML
20161103 13:58:18< Nikitaw99> DeFender1031: not exactly what i wanted...
20161103 13:58:19< DeFender1031> Nikitaw99, load the image test scenario and then type ":image_test"
20161103 13:58:30< Nikitaw99> where can i find that scenario???
20161103 13:58:45< DeFender1031> Nikitaw99, read the add-on's description for how to load it
20161103 13:58:55< zookeeper> https://wiki.wesnoth.org/FancyAddonIcons
20161103 13:58:59< DeFender1031> oh, actually, i think you can run it from any scenario
20161103 14:03:01< Nikitaw99> yup
20161103 14:03:13< Nikitaw99> zookeeper: Thank you! Exactly what I needed :)
20161103 14:20:17< Nikitaw99> CHOCOBO
20161103 14:20:18< Nikitaw99> -NE
20161103 14:22:47< DeFender1031> huh?
20161103 14:37:22< zookeeper> someone needs to write a campaign detailing where chocobones originate from
20161103 14:37:50< DeFender1031> i'm very confused... what?
20161103 14:38:15< zookeeper> you're unaware of the etymological gag? :P
20161103 14:38:49< DeFender1031> i'm unaware of several things that would seem to be necessary to understand the present conversational context.
20161103 14:39:03< DeFender1031> 1. why are we suddenly talking about chocobones?
20161103 14:39:19< zookeeper> he brought them up in caps in a confusing manner, i don't know more than that :p
20161103 14:39:25< DeFender1031> 2. what's special about where chocobones originate?
20161103 14:39:39< DeFender1031> 3. what are you referring to with this etymological gag?
20161103 14:39:49< zookeeper> https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chocobo
20161103 14:40:46< DeFender1031> ah. That explains it. Otherwise, I was always picturing a cocolate bar in the shape of a bone.
20161103 14:41:05< zookeeper> oh wow, there is a mention: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Chocobo#Other_games
20161103 14:47:12< Nikitaw99> http://i.imgur.com/KanLoti.png
20161103 14:47:33< Nikitaw99> playing the rsie of wesnoth
20161103 14:47:40< Nikitaw99> The Rise Of Wesnoth**
20161103 14:47:45< Nikitaw99> or whatever it's called
20161103 14:48:21< Nikitaw99> i've got a good knight ;p
20161103 14:48:21< Nikitaw99> http://i.imgur.com/aAbNlJP.png
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20161103 15:09:07< DeFender1031> I gotta feeling that this knight's gonna be a good knight, that this knight's gonna be a good knight, that this knight's gonna be a good, good knight.
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20161103 16:27:13< celmin|sleep> Nikitaw99: If you want the unit to have no role, just don't specify it. If you want to remove its role with [modify_unit], "role=" should work. (Also, don't use the APPLE define.)
20161103 16:27:47< Nikitaw99> celmin|sleep: ok
20161103 16:29:54< DeFender1031> why IS there even an APPLE define? isn't specializing anything per OS going to cause major OOS problems?
20161103 16:30:39< celmin|sleep> DeFender1031: Well, it's used in the default hotkey config file, at least.
20161103 16:30:50< celmin|sleep> That may be the only place.
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20161103 16:30:59< DeFender1031> ah
20161103 16:31:11< DeFender1031> that DOES make sense as the ONE place to use it
20161103 16:31:33< celticminstrel> Might be something in advanced preferences defaults too, not sure.
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20161103 21:48:09< lamefun> Can I make the gold counter update while a dialog is open?
20161103 21:49:17< DeFender1031> if you change the side's gold, does it not update?
20161103 21:50:40< lamefun> it does not
20161103 21:50:52< lamefun> when I exit the shop, the gold is gone, but not while the dialog is open
20161103 21:53:49< DeFender1031> then no.
20161103 21:54:53< DeFender1031> though, if i convince celticminstrel to add a lua hook for that function that regenerates the display, that MIGHT also do what you ask (wouldn't be in 1.12 though.)
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20161103 22:03:07< lamefun> [redraw][/redraw] only regenerates the battlefield and messes up the dialog.
20161103 22:03:32< celticminstrel> In 1.12 it's impossible to update anything underneath a dialog.
20161103 22:03:43< celticminstrel> So what I'd recommend is to add a gold counter in the dialog.
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20161103 22:04:36< celticminstrel> In 1.13 it is possible to update things underneath a dialog, but... I have no idea whether it would be possible in this specific case.
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20161103 22:09:03< lamefun> but the sidebar isn't updated as well... so when you buy a weapon you won't see it unlike the message-bases shop...
20161103 22:10:52< celticminstrel> When a dialog is onscreen, nothing underneath receives events, so even if you told it to update it wouldn't receive that event until the dialog is closed anyway.
20161103 22:11:13< celticminstrel> One workaround would be to actually close the dialog each time something changes, then re-open it.
20161103 22:12:08< celticminstrel> If you have listboxes you'd ideally want to preserve the scroll position (not sure if that's possible in Lua though).
20161103 22:13:54< lamefun> here's what I have: http://uploadpie.com/pXrsg
20161103 22:14:19< lamefun> hm
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20161103 22:14:28< lamefun> I think I can close the dialog actually.
20161103 22:17:53< lamefun> I think I can't restore scrollbars, but there won't be any unless the resolution is tiny, and the message-based shop probably had the same problem...
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20161103 22:33:32< celticminstrel> I kinda wish the Lua GUI2 API were a bit more object-oriented...
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20161103 22:34:06< celticminstrel> Like, instead of all these wesnoth.set_gui_parameter functions, you'd have get_widget function that returns something with a metatable.
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--- Log closed Fri Nov 04 00:00:06 2016