--- Log opened Tue Dec 06 00:00:33 2016
20161206 00:30:54-!- louis94 [~~louis94@91.178.240.133] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
20161206 00:58:03-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 01:03:23-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 01:07:16-!- Appleman1234_ [~Appleman1@KD106161205160.au-net.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 01:07:34-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 01:07:55-!- Appleman1234 [~Appleman1@KD106161200237.au-net.ne.jp] has quit [Disconnected by services]
20161206 01:08:01-!- Appleman1234_ is now known as Appleman1234
20161206 01:09:29-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 01:25:12-!- Samual [~Samual@xonotic/core-team/Samual] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20161206 01:31:36-!- Samual [~Samual@xonotic/core-team/Samual] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 01:34:30-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20161206 01:40:59-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 01:48:25-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 01:49:45-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 01:55:09-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 01:56:10-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 02:06:23-!- aeth [~Michael@wesnoth/umc-dev/developer/aethaeryn] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 03:30:44-!- ArneBab [~quassel@55d44669.access.ecotel.net] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 03:30:45-!- ArneBab [~quassel@55d44669.access.ecotel.net] has quit [Changing host]
20161206 03:30:45-!- ArneBab [~quassel@freenet/developer/arnebab] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 03:35:13-!- ArneBab_ [~quassel@55d4418a.access.ecotel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20161206 03:58:34-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20161206 04:05:48-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds]
20161206 04:06:34-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 04:06:34-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@124.109.10.167] has quit [Changing host]
20161206 04:06:34-!- vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 04:23:42-!- vincent_c [~bip@vcheng.org] has quit [Quit: Coyote finally caught me]
20161206 04:24:18-!- vincent_c [~bip@vcheng.org] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 05:05:49-!- edaq [~edaq3@h184-60-58-252.cytnin.broadband.dynamic.tds.net] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20161206 05:20:16-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126237116023.9.openmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 05:24:57-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126237116023.9.openmobile.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 05:28:55-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126237116023.9.openmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 05:29:52-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@133.15.175.65] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 07:13:49-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@133.15.175.65] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 07:16:25-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161124042.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 07:36:10-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161124042.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 07:40:20-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161124042.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 07:59:02-!- Kwandulin [~Miranda@p200300760F6EBFC315C18785A4008AA0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 08:03:24-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161124042.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 08:42:31-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20161206 08:42:39-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 09:00:26-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161124042.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 09:08:38-!- ToBeCloud [uid51591@wikimedia/ToBeFree] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 09:28:46-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161124042.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 09:50:11-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 10:08:18< Soliton> good point. looks like whoever added modifications did not extend the log message for them.
20161206 10:45:28-!- Kwandulin [~Miranda@p200300760F6EBFC315C18785A4008AA0.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 10:50:43-!- louis94 [~~louis94@91.178.241.93] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 11:11:40-!- ToBeCloud [uid51591@wikimedia/ToBeFree] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity]
20161206 11:32:10-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161112077.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 12:28:04-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 12:42:29-!- Kwandulin [~Miranda@p200300760F6EBFC3F4DAFD2EC2928FE1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 12:47:26-!- Kwandulin [~Miranda@p200300760F6EBFC3F4DAFD2EC2928FE1.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 12:56:29-!- Thoma [9b04cd1c@gateway/web/freenode/ip.155.4.205.28] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 12:57:19< Thoma> Hello!
20161206 13:00:11< Soliton> greetings.
20161206 13:00:33< Thoma> Wooh, here I was getting worried people could not see my messages.
20161206 13:05:01< Thoma> So I'm going to briefly be one of those guys and come in with a question.
20161206 13:05:17< Thoma> When did they change the main menu music?
20161206 13:05:31-!- wario [~wario_@unaffiliated/wario] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 13:07:47< zookeeper> in 1.13.0
20161206 13:08:28< Soliton> http://changelog.wesnoth.org
20161206 13:11:00< Thoma> Cheers, played this game on and off for about 10+ years now. I got really startled when it opened all soothing.
20161206 13:12:46< zookeeper> people got a bit tired of the loud bombastic opening, so...
20161206 13:13:59< Thoma> I like the new tune. At the same time, it's weirdly depressing and making me aware of the passage of time.
20161206 13:26:03-!- wario [~wario_@unaffiliated/wario] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
20161206 13:26:09-!- wario_ [~wario_@unaffiliated/wario] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 13:40:44< DeFender1031> Wait... what track is the menu music now?
20161206 13:42:39< celticminstrel> It's not a new track.
20161206 13:42:57< celticminstrel> Don't remember which though.
20161206 13:43:47-!- Kwandulin [~Miranda@p200300760F6EBFC3F0AF9EBB55C0A020.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 13:44:03< zookeeper> journey's end
20161206 13:51:47< DeFender1031> celticminstrel, I assumed it wasn't new. I assumed it was either a different mainline track or something from the UMC pack upgraded to mainline.
20161206 13:53:12< DeFender1031> zookeeper, nice. Though it starts a little slow for a menu theme.
20161206 13:53:35< DeFender1031> (not the tempo, but the actualy pick up of any form of melody... i don't know the proper musical terms.)
20161206 13:53:42-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds]
20161206 13:54:57< DeFender1031> I also like journey's end because it's kind of a medley of a bunch of the other tracks.
20161206 13:55:47< DeFender1031> In general though, all the music is really really good
20161206 13:57:06< zookeeper> yeah, it is. the music's quite a precious little treasure.
20161206 13:59:09< DeFender1031> I actually hate "frantic", but other than that, they're excellent
20161206 14:01:53< zookeeper> ah yes, 1.12 only has the old frantic.
20161206 14:01:56< zookeeper> the new frantic is great.
20161206 14:02:25< celticminstrel> There's a new frantic? :O
20161206 14:02:26< zookeeper> https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/blob/master/data/core/music/frantic.ogg
20161206 14:08:46< DeFender1031> zookeeper, yeah, that's formerly frantic sketch of UMC music pack 4, which is also excellent.
20161206 14:08:54< DeFender1031> i was referring to the old frantic.
20161206 14:09:05< DeFender1031> the one that sounds like angry clowns.
20161206 14:09:27< zookeeper> and clearly i was referring to you referring to the old frantic, no? :p
20161206 14:09:36< DeFender1031> yes.
20161206 14:09:42< DeFender1031> i was confirming
20161206 14:09:51< zookeeper> righty
20161206 14:10:32< DeFender1031> anyway, i have most of the wenoth music, both mainline and UMC, on my work playlist.
20161206 14:11:47< zookeeper> there's a lot of good stuff that's ended up in the UMC music collections, but i've never listened to them much so they're kind of unfamiliar to me.
20161206 14:13:23< DeFender1031> zookeeper, I highly recommend them. I often wonder why a lot of the top quality stuff in UMC (both music and things like graphics, custom terrains, etc.) hasn't been dumped into mainline for authors to use, even if nothing in mainline itself will use it.
20161206 14:15:22< zookeeper> i'm glad it hasn't, i'm not a fan of that approach
20161206 14:22:25-!- lamefun [~lamefun@94.181.153.143] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 14:23:18-!- lamefun [~lamefun@94.181.153.143] has quit [Client Quit]
20161206 14:23:31-!- lamefun [~lamefun@94.181.153.143] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 14:36:51-!- lamefun [~lamefun@94.181.153.143] has quit [Quit: lamefun]
20161206 14:49:22< DeFender1031> zookeeper, why not?
20161206 14:51:48< zookeeper> because there's an endless amount of things that could be dumped into mainline purely because maybe someone somewhere will one day find it useful, combined with how almost everything dumped into mainline has a non-zero maintenance cost
20161206 14:52:16< DeFender1031> fair.
20161206 14:53:30< DeFender1031> though I'd say that's probably true of terrains, but anything else... music tracks, sounds, simple graphics such as items and scenery, don't really come with much maintenence.
20161206 14:53:41< DeFender1031> even so, you're probably right
20161206 14:56:15< zookeeper> music is probably >30% of the download size currently, so there is certainly a very tangible cost to adding more even if it's not maintenance per se
20161206 14:58:16< zookeeper> the line must be drawn somewhere regarding what the criteria for mainline inclusion is, and while it's not exactly "it must be used by mainline content" it can't be "maybe someone will find it useful" either
20161206 14:59:10-!- wario [~wario_@unaffiliated/wario] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 14:59:16< DeFender1031> Right. My criterion is "it's really really good and fits the overall style of the rest of mainline"
20161206 14:59:30< DeFender1031> but as you said, there could be an infinite amount of such
20161206 15:00:37< zookeeper> well, i'm certainly not saying there's not things out there that could be in mainline. if they're really really good and fit in, then they would likely find a use in mainline, anyway.
20161206 15:01:01< DeFender1031> well... actually... there can't exactly, as there IS a finite number of possible configurations of, for example, a 72x72 pixel image, though that number is so large that it may as well be infinite for our purposes
20161206 15:01:24< zookeeper> we could write a generator and include _all_ possible 72x72 images!
20161206 15:01:44< zookeeper> although we would need to come up with some other naming convention
20161206 15:02:09-!- wario_ [~wario_@unaffiliated/wario] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20161206 15:02:20< Thoma> Create a auto-name generator using integer numbers?
20161206 15:03:03< Thoma> Assign one image to one generated name for maximum effect
20161206 15:03:10< zookeeper> something like that
20161206 15:03:54< DeFender1031> If my math is right, there's 1.84 times 10 to the 49937 possibilities.
20161206 15:04:06-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 15:04:29< DeFender1031> and yeah, no, I don
20161206 15:04:56< DeFender1031> 't think that's a good idea.
20161206 15:05:01< DeFender1031> :P
20161206 15:05:17< Thoma> Now, what would be the new mainline filesize be with all said images?
20161206 15:05:49< DeFender1031> Thoma, that's much harder to calculate as different images would be capable of different levels of png paletteing and compression
20161206 15:06:28< Thoma> You're a smart guy and I'm not picky. Give me an estimation!
20161206 15:06:40< DeFender1031> for example, an all black image could be as little as a few dozen bytes, whereas an image where every pixel is unique would be much much larger.
20161206 15:06:45< DeFender1031> hahahah
20161206 15:08:39< zookeeper> well we just need a naming system in which the image contents can be decoded from its name, so actually whenever you refer to an image file you refer to it by its contents, so we wouldn't need _any_ (72x72) images at all, meaning the filesize would drop drastically!
20161206 15:08:48< zookeeper> good idea
20161206 15:09:33< DeFender1031> Thoma, I can tell you it wouldn't exceed 3.81 times 10 to the 49941 bytes.
20161206 15:09:55< zookeeper> i mean... the size taken by the now-nonexistent image files themselves... the WML size could bloat quite a bit :>
20161206 15:10:01< DeFender1031> Now the question is, how many amazon nowmobiles would that be?
20161206 15:10:44< DeFender1031> zookeeper, you're basically suggesting the base-64 encoded image idea that was discussed in here a while ago.
20161206 15:11:00< DeFender1031> snowmobiles*
20161206 15:12:04< DeFender1031> anyway, thanks for the ridiculous conversation, guys, but my RAM upgrade just got here, so i'm going to shut down for a bit and (hopefully) be back soon.
20161206 15:12:15< DeFender1031> ttyl.
20161206 15:12:18-!- DeFender1031 [~DeFender1@93-172-151-164.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Quit: I'm not back now.]
20161206 15:13:20< Thoma> He can use that to calculate the upper limit in gigabytes for me
20161206 15:16:02< celticminstrel> So uh, assuming 32 bits per pixel, meaning 4,294,967,296 possible pixel values; 72x72 = 5184 pixels. This is selection with replacement, so it's the power formula, so... 5184 to the power of 4,294,967,296 possible 72x72 images, if I remember my math correctly.
20161206 15:16:31< celticminstrel> That's pretty insanely large though, so I wonder if I messed up somewhere.
20161206 15:16:48< celticminstrel> On the other hand, it's not that weird for the number of possible images to be insanely large.
20161206 15:17:48< Thoma> Appearantley, if I asked google correctly. The maximum size would be below 3.8 GB
20161206 15:18:01< celticminstrel> Hm?
20161206 15:18:33< Thoma> So you know, the fact that we could have every possible combination of 72x72 pixel image only being the size of 72x72 gigabyte is pretty outstanding
20161206 15:18:47< Thoma> Size of 3.8 gigabyte*
20161206 15:18:58< celticminstrel> How do you get that?
20161206 15:20:15< Thoma> "1.84 times 10 to the 49937 possibilities." according to DeFenders math. And when I asked the estimation of the size he noted  "it wouldn't exceed 3.81 times 10 to the 49941 bytes."
20161206 15:20:51< Thoma> So I took that last number and converted it from byte to gigabyte and if I did it right it should just be 3.8
20161206 15:20:52< celticminstrel> I want to know where those numbers come from too...
20161206 15:21:02< Thoma> Dunno, you'd have to ask him
20161206 15:21:04< celticminstrel> Oh uh.
20161206 15:21:08< Thoma> I just google-fu
20161206 15:21:29< zookeeper> i'm quite unable to do the math but i'm pretty sure there's no way it could be as little as 3.8gb
20161206 15:21:46< Thoma> Yeah, that's why I'm saying, I might be reading it wrong
20161206 15:21:56< celticminstrel> Which number is 3.8GB?
20161206 15:22:41< Thoma> Wait, let me see if I can do thsir gith
20161206 15:22:59< Thoma> do this right*
20161206 15:23:01< celticminstrel> Wait, I think maybe I did swap it around...
20161206 15:23:41< celticminstrel> For every pixel, there's 2^32 possibilities, so it should be (2^32)^(72*72), not (72*72)^(2^32).
20161206 15:24:30< celticminstrel> Which according to Python is a 49937-digit number.
20161206 15:24:58< celticminstrel> So I guess that's where he got that number from somehow.
20161206 15:26:02< Thoma> Oke
20161206 15:26:20< Thoma> So yeah, we can take from that that I've likely fucked up reading the Google thing
20161206 15:26:37< Thoma> I will go on record I never said I was -good- at google-fu or math
20161206 15:26:44< celticminstrel> Oh wait.
20161206 15:27:25< celticminstrel> Aha, yes, 1.84 times ten to the 49937 is (2^32)^(72*72) rounded to three significant figures and expressed in scientific notation.
20161206 15:27:39< celticminstrel> The first four digits of that number are 1836.
20161206 15:29:44< Thoma> So that would be written out as 1.836*10^49947 if you were to put it purely in math form?
20161206 15:30:01< celticminstrel> Yes, pretty much.
20161206 15:30:38< celticminstrel> Yeah, next digit after 6 is 2, so it round to that.
20161206 15:31:05< celticminstrel> Or 1.836E49937 if you want the programming form.
20161206 15:31:25< celticminstrel> I wonder if that'd even fit in a 128-bit float.
20161206 15:31:54< Thoma> I mean, on Google when converted to Gigabytes it comes back as "1.836e-9" I just don't get what the e-9 stands for
20161206 15:31:58< celticminstrel> Oh hey, when did IEEE add a 256-bit float?
20161206 15:32:33< celticminstrel> Substitute e with *10^
20161206 15:32:40< celticminstrel> Though that result sounds wrong...
20161206 15:33:19< Thoma> so I suppose e stands for exponentional?
20161206 15:33:32< Thoma> For reference, I'm glad to learn I'm the dumbest person here.
20161206 15:33:37< celticminstrel> Something like that.
20161206 15:33:45< celticminstrel> Why is that something good to learn? :|
20161206 15:34:03< Thoma> Because it means I get to learn
20161206 15:34:18< celticminstrel> As I thought, this number would not fit in a 128-bit float.
20161206 15:34:33< celticminstrel> But it would fit in a 256-bit float.
20161206 15:35:42< Thoma> Alright, enlighten me. How does this matter exactly?
20161206 15:35:56< celticminstrel> The size of the float it fits in?
20161206 15:37:12< celticminstrel> It basically means it's too large for a computer to store it as a number.
20161206 15:37:46< celticminstrel> Specifically a number that's natively supported by the computer.
20161206 15:38:06< celticminstrel> Of course you can store it in some other format (a string, for example) and operate on it like that.
20161206 15:40:50< celticminstrel> Also, it's (almost certainly) many, many times more than the total amount of data stored on computers across the world. Even in yottabytes it's still 49913 digits (assuming I converted correctly, which I probably did since that looks about right).
20161206 15:41:40< Thoma> Aka what you're saying is
20161206 15:42:06< Thoma> We need to get NASA on creating a super computer to create and store every 72x72 pixel image known to men
20161206 15:42:36< celticminstrel> No, what I'm saying is that it would be a total waste of space to create and store every 72x72 pixel image known to man.
20161206 15:43:27< celticminstrel> Keep in mind that the vast majority of these possible images are either 1) invisible, or almost so (due to low alpha values) or 2) virtually indistinguishable from a large number of the other possible images.
20161206 15:44:01< celticminstrel> Where by "virtually indistinguishable" I mean that if you look at them, you won't notice the difference.
20161206 15:44:28< Thoma> Of course it isn't. It would challenge them to up and elevate current Computer electronics and storage. Advancing computer science by decades
20161206 15:45:34< Thoma> Just the sorting of useable pictures alone would make for AI progression the likes humanity has yet to see.
20161206 15:47:09< Thoma> In a sense, Wesnoth would've triggered the next scientific evolution and advanced humanity as a whole.
20161206 15:47:22< celticminstrel> Yeah no. XD
20161206 15:47:52< Thoma> For now though, it seems to be crashing when I alt-tab.
20161206 15:51:06< celticminstrel> I doubt there's even enough hard drives in the world to store that much data.
20161206 15:51:57< Thoma> I know, that's why they would have to invent one big enough to store it
20161206 15:52:20< celticminstrel> Holographic storage might be able to, though I think you'd still need a large number of them.
20161206 15:53:19-!- louis94 [~~louis94@91.178.241.93] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20161206 15:53:28-!- louis94 [~~louis94@91.178.241.93] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 15:53:48< Thoma> This is why we need quantum computing
20161206 15:54:08< celticminstrel> Uh. Does that even have anything to do with data storage? I thought that was just about computation.
20161206 15:54:19< Thoma> You know, I wouldn't know
20161206 15:54:35< Thoma> It would speed up creating the images though
20161206 15:57:00-!- DeFender1031 [~DeFender1@93-172-151-164.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 15:57:15< DeFender1031> Thoma, no, those wouldn't be gigabytes.
20161206 15:57:26< Thoma> Yeah no, we concluded that
20161206 15:57:40< DeFender1031> we're talking about a number with close to 50000 zeroes after it
20161206 15:57:57< celticminstrel> Except they're not actually zeroes.
20161206 15:57:59< DeFender1031> ah, i'm commenting as i'm catching up... should probably read up completely first
20161206 15:58:03< Thoma> As I'm said, I'm glad I got to be the dumbest person -in- the conversation
20161206 15:58:12< Thoma> As I said*
20161206 15:58:17< Thoma> This is just getting embarrasing
20161206 15:58:20< DeFender1031> and the number came from me plugging the permutation into wolfram
20161206 15:58:36< celticminstrel> Wolfram, huh.
20161206 15:58:41< DeFender1031> 0x100000000 to the power of 72*72
20161206 15:58:55< celticminstrel> Python was quite fast too, and more exact.
20161206 15:59:02< celticminstrel> Though really, the exactness doesn't matter.
20161206 15:59:40< DeFender1031> wolfram also had a lot of precision.
20161206 15:59:50< DeFender1031> i shortened it to be able to say it concisely here
20161206 16:00:37< celticminstrel> I assume it didn't show all 49937 digits though as Python did when I tried it. >_>
20161206 16:01:06< celticminstrel> I wonder if Wolfram uses arbitrary-precision floats.
20161206 16:01:08< Thoma> I'm glad I subjected your PC to that
20161206 16:01:12< celticminstrel> :P
20161206 16:01:14< DeFender1031> Thoma, I very much doubt you're the dumbest person here.
20161206 16:01:26< Thoma> Again
20161206 16:01:29< Thoma> In the conversation
20161206 16:01:54< DeFender1031> celticminstrel, pretty sure wolfram uses large-number and large-fraction libraries, as its main purpose is as a massive, high-precision computing engive
20161206 16:02:03< zookeeper> <Thoma> In a sense, Wesnoth would've triggered the next scientific evolution and advanced humanity as a whole. 
20161206 16:02:04< zookeeper> <Thoma> For now though, it seems to be crashing when I alt-tab.
20161206 16:02:10< zookeeper> ah, the potential vs reality of game development...
20161206 16:02:12< celticminstrel> It'd make sense, yeah.
20161206 16:02:23< Thoma> I'm a dreamer
20161206 16:05:06< DeFender1031> anyway, my RAM upgrade appears to be successful, as I have pretty much every VM i habe in virtualbox open, as well as a crapload of chrome tabs, IRC, a bunch of IDE sessions, several instances of wesnoth, and everything is running smoothly at 27GB of usage. :D
20161206 16:05:15< DeFender1031> have*
20161206 16:05:38< Thoma> Noice, how much ram did you download? :D
20161206 16:05:58< celticminstrel> Apparently holographic discs actually exist already but can only hold around 300GB.
20161206 16:06:10< celticminstrel> As of 2012.
20161206 16:06:28< DeFender1031> celticminstrel, and they lost the race against blu-ray, despite being the superior technology
20161206 16:06:44< celticminstrel> Is that less than a blu-ray disc?
20161206 16:07:12< Thoma> Blame porn
20161206 16:07:15< DeFender1031> Thoma, downloading RAM... nice. :P
20161206 16:07:26< Thoma> hehe, figured you'd like that
20161206 16:07:27< DeFender1031> Thoma, and the answer is that I now have 32GB.
20161206 16:07:33< Thoma> Oh neat
20161206 16:07:54< DeFender1031> and I struggled to get the usage high enough to test it, which is weird
20161206 16:08:31< Thoma> Sounds about right
20161206 16:08:33< DeFender1031> i opened tons of tabs in chrome which before i swapped out the RAM had been using 10-12 GB, and for some reason afterward was only using around 4
20161206 16:09:01< DeFender1031> the type of RAM in use shouldn't affect how much of it chrome uses, should it?
20161206 16:09:33< DeFender1031> but whatever, so now I know that I really don't need to worry about maxing out on RAM.
20161206 16:10:07< Thoma> Now to challenge yourself and go max it for the heck of it
20161206 16:13:32< DeFender1031> there are a number of ways i could easily do so, but I don't want to because the HD here was set up back in the day when things such as a swap partition were necessary, and it starts going into swap automatically when i hit arount 27, slowing everything down.
20161206 16:14:42< DeFender1031> besides, if i were to hit the max, it'd trigger the OOM manager, and that might lead to the unexpected termination of programs that really ought not to be unexpectedly terminated.
20161206 16:15:35< Thoma> Ah, but it aint fun if you don't run the risk of breaking something
20161206 16:15:41< DeFender1031> hahahaha
20161206 16:16:04< Thoma> Unrelated, way back in the day. There used to be an addon that was great for local co-op involving two elf leaders they each could only recruit certain units. Basically it took turns between leader 1 and 2 before moving to the enemy turn. Sound familiar to anyone?
20161206 16:16:14< DeFender1031> if i boot and run memtest, it'll max it out.
20161206 16:16:52-!- Kranix [~magnus@185.118.249.37] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 16:18:46< zookeeper> Thoma, elf war maybe?
20161206 16:19:49< Thoma> Could be, let's see if I can find anything on the forums about it
20161206 16:25:09< janebot> wesnoth: Came back to wesnoth after some years, and i would like to know why they changed the artstyle i thought it was fine before (by /u/marincel) https://redd.it/5gtrg2
20161206 16:25:39< celticminstrel> What a stupid question.
20161206 16:26:35< Thoma> I think that is it Zookeeper, cheers
20161206 16:26:43< celticminstrel> Though I wonder what the old artstyle he's referring to is, is it that really old one from sometime before 1.10 that I've never actually seen except in screenshots...
20161206 16:29:01< zookeeper> well, yeah, sort of needs some context there.
20161206 16:29:25< zookeeper> when? what art?
20161206 16:30:02< Thoma> Also, wow, I don't think that campaign has been maintained since early 1.0 days. I'm impressed you figured out the addon and remembered the name that quickly
20161206 16:31:05< zookeeper> there has been something done with it lately (as in past ~5 years), i think.
20161206 16:31:11< zookeeper> not that i know the details
20161206 16:33:48-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20161206 16:45:11< DeFender1031> been looking thought the old screenshots since the vage reddit post above got me curious and noticed three things.
20161206 16:45:58< DeFender1031> 1. The person who posted the reddit comment is dead wrong, the old graphics looked childish and very very basic compared to the modern style.
20161206 16:46:24< DeFender1031> 2. I think I liked the old illuminates aura better and I'm wondering why it was changed: https://www.wesnoth.org/images/sshots/wesnoth-1.3.4-c.jpg
20161206 16:46:39< DeFender1031> 3. aeth has been around for a freaking long time: https://www.wesnoth.org/images/sshots/wesnoth-1.4-3.jpg
20161206 16:50:15-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 16:50:38< Polsaker> the old artstyle was too anime-ish
20161206 16:51:23< Polsaker> at least what I remember of konrad
20161206 17:05:41-!- louis94 [~~louis94@91.178.241.93] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
20161206 17:19:10-!- Nikitaw99 [~Nikitaw99@ppp85-140-2-240.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 17:21:10-!- Nikitaw99 [~Nikitaw99@ppp85-140-2-240.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 17:21:40-!- Nikitaw99 [~Nikitaw99@ppp85-140-2-240.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 17:23:20< Nikitaw99> rip
20161206 17:24:01< celticminstrel> ?
20161206 17:25:59< Nikitaw99> people barely chat in this channel
20161206 17:26:01< Nikitaw99> sadly
20161206 17:26:01< zookeeper> DeFender1031, it was changed because i thought the new one looked cooler, pretty much :p
20161206 17:26:27< zookeeper> speaking of that screenshot, i had forgotten that apparently we experimented with that kind of map edge back then
20161206 17:26:52< celticminstrel> I think the new one looks cooler.
20161206 17:27:00< celticminstrel> That map edge actually looks cool though.
20161206 17:27:15< celticminstrel> Though it's taking up a lot of space.
20161206 17:27:28< DeFender1031> Nikitaw99, i don't know what you're talking about, but the channel's been pretty active practically all day
20161206 17:27:37< celticminstrel> I mean, it looks about as large as a whole row of hexes.
20161206 17:27:53< DeFender1031> zookeeper, cooler perhaps, but it's less clear IMO what it's actually doing.
20161206 17:28:34< celticminstrel> Was there any particular reason for including an even larger version of the illuminates aura?
20161206 17:28:52< celticminstrel> Does some mainline campaign use it?
20161206 17:29:00< celticminstrel> (I use it though, so I'm not complaining.)
20161206 17:29:31< Nikitaw99> i was wondering if there is some sort of downloadable version of the wml reference
20161206 17:29:39< zookeeper> celticminstrel, at least the UtBS campfires use it
20161206 17:29:43< celticminstrel> Unfortunately not.
20161206 17:29:44-!- ChipmunkV [~vova@static-89-94-113-91.axione.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 17:29:52< DeFender1031> Nikitaw99, ctrl-s
20161206 17:30:04< celticminstrel> Well yes, but that's not very helpful.
20161206 17:30:34< celticminstrel> I guess you could use https://wiki.wesnoth.org/Special:Export
20161206 17:30:45< celticminstrel> If you can decide exactly which pages you need.
20161206 17:31:32< celticminstrel> Not sure how you'd read that though once it's saved. IIRC it's an XML format.
20161206 17:31:40< Nikitaw99> celticminstrel, thanks
20161206 17:31:57< Nikitaw99> .-.
20161206 17:32:40< Nikitaw99> and i know nothing about xls or whaterver its called
20161206 17:32:50< celticminstrel> Maybe there exists software to view MediaWiki archives offline; otherwise the best way to view it would involve actually setting up your own localhost webserver and installing MediaWiki on it, which I'm guessing is a bit beyond you.
20161206 17:33:32< zookeeper> or just use some software or browser add-on or whatever which can download the current page and all pages linked to by it.
20161206 17:34:56< Nikitaw99> do you know one for firefox?
20161206 17:35:23-!- Kwandulin [~Miranda@p200300760F6EBFC3F0AF9EBB55C0A020.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 17:35:55< DeFender1031> downthemall
20161206 17:36:18-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20161206 17:42:22< zookeeper> yeah, i've used that one myself
20161206 17:42:51< zookeeper> although i don't know if it can actually fix the links for you
20161206 17:43:00< zookeeper> so that you can actually browse what you downloaded
20161206 17:48:11< Nikitaw99> brb trying to start up firefox
20161206 17:48:18< Nikitaw99> [pain]
20161206 17:49:53< Ravana_> I have used HTTrack
20161206 17:53:04-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 17:53:40-!- ChipmunkV [~vova@static-89-94-113-91.axione.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20161206 17:55:22-!- ChipmunkV [~vova@static-89-94-113-91.axione.abo.bbox.fr] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 18:20:03-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20161206 18:32:10-!- wario_ [~wario_@unaffiliated/wario] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 18:34:13-!- wario [~wario_@unaffiliated/wario] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20161206 18:48:24-!- bumbadadabum [~bumbadada@wesnoth/developer/bumbadadabum] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 19:00:49-!- claymore [~claymore@unaffiliated/claymore] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 19:07:20-!- Nikitaw99 [~Nikitaw99@ppp85-140-2-240.pppoe.mtu-net.ru] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20161206 19:35:01-!- APic [apic@apic.name] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
20161206 19:35:01-!- lobby [~wesnoth@wesnoth/bot/lobby] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds]
20161206 19:35:19-!- lobby [~wesnoth@wesnoth/bot/lobby] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 19:35:19-!- Topic for #wesnoth: Wesnoth User Channel | http://wesnoth.org | Latest stable version: 1.12.6 | Latest development version: 1.13.6 | Check the upness of Wesnoth servers: http://status.wesnoth.org | >>> Want to help? Go here: http://r.wesnoth.org/t42911 (and thanks!) <<< | Public IRC logs: http://irclogs.wesnoth.org | Don't paste on IRC! Use a pastebin: https://bpaste.net
20161206 19:35:19-!- Topic set by vultraz [~chatzilla@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] [Fri Nov 11 00:13:20 2016]
20161206 19:35:19[Users #wesnoth]
20161206 19:35:19[ _iwc          ] [ demok       ] [ iwaim      ] [ mic_e     ] [ Rhonda  ] [ vincent_c    ] 
20161206 19:35:19[ aeth          ] [ dobson      ] [ janebot    ] [ minbonbon ] [ salluc69] [ Vorpal       ] 
20161206 19:35:19[ Appleman1234  ] [ elias       ] [ JesseH2    ] [ Murgatroyd] [ Samual  ] [ vultraz      ] 
20161206 19:35:19[ ArneBab       ] [ EliDupree   ] [ Jetrel     ] [ namad8    ] [ Sauce   ] [ wario_       ] 
20161206 19:35:19[ bumbadadabum  ] [ Falcon`     ] [ Jetrel_bot ] [ NeaN      ] [ Smedles ] [ Xjs|moonshine] 
20161206 19:35:19[ celticminstrel] [ FinalBossDad] [ jurkan     ] [ nore      ] [ Soliton ] [ Yaiyan       ] 
20161206 19:35:19[ ChipmunkV     ] [ frainz      ] [ knotwork   ] [ oldlaptop ] [ soloojos] [ zookeeper    ] 
20161206 19:35:19[ clavi         ] [ Gambit      ] [ Kranix     ] [ PjotrOrial] [ TC01    ] 
20161206 19:35:19[ claymore      ] [ HeyCitizen  ] [ Lirion     ] [ Polsaker  ] [ TC02    ] 
20161206 19:35:19[ cyphase       ] [ Ipsi        ] [ lobby      ] [ prkc      ] [ TheJJ   ] 
20161206 19:35:19[ DDR           ] [ Ipsilon     ] [ loonycyborg] [ RatArmy_  ] [ Thoma   ] 
20161206 19:35:19[ DeFender1031  ] [ Ivanovic    ] [ MadMerlin  ] [ Ravana_   ] [ tokage  ] 
20161206 19:35:19-!- Irssi: #wesnoth: Total of 67 nicks [0 ops, 0 halfops, 0 voices, 67 normal]
20161206 19:35:19-!- Home page for #wesnoth: http://www.wesnoth.org
20161206 19:35:22-!- Channel #wesnoth created Sun Nov 26 06:42:43 2006
20161206 19:36:08-!- Irssi: Join to #wesnoth was synced in 57 secs
20161206 19:36:22-!- Shiki [~Shiki@141.39.226.226] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 19:36:26-!- APic [apic@apic.name] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 19:53:39-!- claymore [~claymore@unaffiliated/claymore] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20161206 20:27:34-!- ChipmunkV [~vova@static-89-94-113-91.axione.abo.bbox.fr] has quit [Quit: ChipmunkV]
20161206 20:39:35-!- claymore [~claymore@unaffiliated/claymore] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 21:14:38-!- salluc69 [~salluc69@host126-195-dynamic.4-87-r.retail.telecomitalia.it] has quit [Ping timeout: 245 seconds]
20161206 21:15:21-!- ArneBab_ [~quassel@55d44ae9.access.ecotel.net] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 21:17:45-!- Kranix [~magnus@185.118.249.37] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!]
20161206 21:18:28-!- ArneBab [~quassel@freenet/developer/arnebab] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20161206 21:19:08-!- irco [~irco@HSI-KBW-091-089-039-076.hsi2.kabelbw.de] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 21:22:11-!- salluc69 [~salluc69@79.51.72.60] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 21:29:23-!- salluc69 [~salluc69@79.51.72.60] has quit [Quit: Sto andando via]
20161206 22:05:05-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161112077.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 22:05:35-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161112077.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 22:07:33-!- irco [~irco@HSI-KBW-091-089-039-076.hsi2.kabelbw.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection]
20161206 22:20:53-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161112077.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 22:23:48-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161112077.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 22:30:10-!- claymore [~claymore@unaffiliated/claymore] has quit [Quit: Leaving]
20161206 22:47:46-!- louis94 [~~louis94@91.178.241.93] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 22:53:40-!- wario_ [~wario_@unaffiliated/wario] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 23:14:37-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161112077.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 23:18:37-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161112077.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 23:19:59-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@om126161112077.8.openmobile.ne.jp] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 23:26:16-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@133.15.175.65] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 23:32:16-!- edaq [~edaq3@h184-60-58-252.cytnin.broadband.dynamic.tds.net] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 23:40:43-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds]
20161206 23:42:43-!- louis94 [~~louis94@91.178.241.93] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds]
20161206 23:48:05-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@133.15.175.65] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer]
20161206 23:48:50-!- ArneBab [~quassel@55d44631.access.ecotel.net] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 23:48:50-!- ArneBab [~quassel@55d44631.access.ecotel.net] has quit [Changing host]
20161206 23:48:50-!- ArneBab [~quassel@freenet/developer/arnebab] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 23:49:33-!- RatArmy_ [~ratarmy@133.15.175.65] has joined #wesnoth
20161206 23:51:29-!- ArneBab_ [~quassel@55d44ae9.access.ecotel.net] has quit [Ping timeout: 244 seconds]
--- Log closed Wed Dec 07 00:00:18 2016