--- Log opened Fri Jan 13 00:00:07 2017
20170113 00:04:32< vultraz> ok, granted
20170113 00:04:47< vultraz> then tell me what social effort would need to be invested in moving away from IRC
20170113 00:05:55< zookeeper> uh... to get all developers to go along with it instead of refusing? :P
20170113 00:06:15< vultraz> that's simple
20170113 00:07:50 * zookeeper sits down and chains himself to the channel
20170113 00:08:45< vultraz> if there's some community attachment to irc that prevents them from using discord do let me know
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20170113 00:16:19< Aginor> I like IRC, and I'm active on lots of different channels across multiple servers/network
20170113 00:16:45-!- irker294 [~irker@uruz.ai0867.net] has joined #wesnoth-dev
20170113 00:16:45< irker294> wesnoth: ln-zookeeper wesnoth:master 803d809e41fe / data/campaigns/Eastern_Invasion/ (8 files in 2 dirs): EI: Map aesthetic tweaks (castles and villages) https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/803d809e41fe4316906ef865f0b6d31d5d121e2e
20170113 00:17:07< Aginor> I dislike having to use yet another communication thing in addition to skype, hangouts, slack and hipchat
20170113 00:17:31< Aginor> :D
20170113 00:17:35 * zookeeper blinks
20170113 00:17:58< Aginor> but that's just me being grumpy :D
20170113 00:18:03< zookeeper> i'm so out of touch with modern communications
20170113 00:18:46< Aginor> I find it obnoxious :D
20170113 00:18:54< Aginor> and I tend to neglect half of them
20170113 00:20:20< zookeeper> i thought i was surrendering to trendy mainstream terribleness sometime in 2003 by using msn messenger, but at least i've managed to redeem myself by avoiding all these newfangled things
20170113 00:20:33< Aginor> at least everyone's there's no ICQ, MSN or Jabber to worry about any longer
20170113 00:20:59< Aginor> mainly because they're dead or everyone abandoned them
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20170113 00:22:23< zookeeper> jabber died? i remember some people somewhere else trying to move something from irc to jabber in ancient times, but for some reason i didn't like it at all
20170113 00:24:18< zookeeper> but i guess i haven't heard anything about jabber in 5+ years, so probably i should have assumed it's dead :p
20170113 00:25:31< Aginor> google managed to kill it
20170113 00:26:01< Aginor> they got everyone on board with google chat, then they turned google chat into hangouts and managed to migrate the user base away
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20170113 00:44:23< Appveyor> The Battle for Wesnoth (Visual Studio 2015) - Release Jyrki Vesterinen 5d7849e: New add-on manager: fix add-on version being shown as 0.0.0 after install Succeeded
20170113 00:44:23< Appveyor> Details: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth-7lnpw/build/Wesnoth-VS2015-master-130
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20170113 00:46:15< vultraz> what is jabber
20170113 00:46:44< vultraz> and for that matter, icq
20170113 00:47:04< zookeeper> you haven't heard of icq? :>
20170113 00:48:33< Aginor> vultraz: they're like MSN, but better and/or older
20170113 00:49:39< zookeeper> you can even fill in icq and jabber fields on the forums: https://forums.wesnoth.org/ucp.php?i=164
20170113 00:51:30< vultraz> good god
20170113 00:51:51< vultraz> icq.. aol... msn..
20170113 00:51:56< vultraz> how old is our phpbb
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20170113 00:52:51< Aginor> you used to be able to get these great clients though, they'd speak all of the protocols
20170113 00:53:02< Aginor> so it'd just be one entry point to it all
20170113 00:53:04< zookeeper> AFAICT, all of those are still in use and are only dead in the sense that they're not very common anymore
20170113 00:53:27< Aginor> zookeeper: msn and skype have been roleld up
20170113 00:53:38< Aginor> zookeeper: aol and icq have also been combined
20170113 00:53:51< zookeeper> right
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20170113 01:10:20< Appveyor> The Battle for Wesnoth (Visual Studio 2015) - Debug Jyrki Vesterinen 5d7849e: New add-on manager: fix add-on version being shown as 0.0.0 after install Succeeded
20170113 01:10:20< Appveyor> Details: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth-7lnpw/build/Wesnoth-VS2015-master-130
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20170113 01:32:32< celticminstrel> Silly vultraz.
20170113 01:32:54< celticminstrel> There are totally reasons to not abandon IRC.
20170113 01:33:17< celticminstrel> Mainly, certain people (myself included) are perfectly satisfied with IRC and unwilling to move.
20170113 01:40:54< Aginor> https://github.com/reactiflux/discord-irc
20170113 01:40:59< Aginor> that'd solve everything though
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20170113 01:42:47< Appveyor> The Battle for Wesnoth (Visual Studio 2013) - Release ln-zookeeper 803d809: EI: Map aesthetic tweaks (castles and villages) Succeeded
20170113 01:42:47< Appveyor> Details: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth/build/Wesnoth-VS2013-master-132
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20170113 02:08:21< Appveyor> The Battle for Wesnoth (Visual Studio 2013) - Debug ln-zookeeper 803d809: EI: Map aesthetic tweaks (castles and villages) Succeeded
20170113 02:08:21< Appveyor> Details: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth/build/Wesnoth-VS2013-master-132
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20170113 05:36:30< pydsigner> So I just realized an issue with TSG
20170113 05:36:56< pydsigner> It calls Deoran the son of Haldiel
20170113 05:37:55< pydsigner> While the wiki history says, and the timespans involved demand, that he be his grandson at least.
20170113 05:39:26< pydsigner> Haldiel is of age in 517 YW while Deoran is sub-20 in 607 YW.
20170113 05:40:03< pydsigner> Really he has to be a great grandson
20170113 05:41:13< aeth> You aren't planning on having any children when you're over 80 years old?
20170113 05:41:17< pydsigner> Haldiel's son might be born in 540 if we're generous, and then his grandson in 580 at the latest
20170113 05:41:44< pydsigner> aeth: Not especially :P
20170113 05:44:40< aeth> What if his father just happens to have the same name?
20170113 05:44:40< aeth> e.g. Haldiel -> son -> Haldiel -> Deoran
20170113 05:44:40< aeth> And so he is the great-grandson
20170113 05:44:40< pydsigner> I say Haldiel's son @ 530, grandson @ 560, Deoran 588
20170113 05:44:40< pydsigner> aeth: Story text
20170113 05:44:40< pydsigner> "Deoran was the son of Haldiel, who had fought with distinction alongside Konrad I in the wars against the orcs."
20170113 05:44:40< aeth> ah
20170113 05:45:14< pydsigner> Of course, making him the great-grandson kinda shreds any point in mentioning the ancestry
20170113 05:45:21< aeth> Then if you're right changing the line to "grandson" makes the most sense
20170113 05:45:26< aeth> afaik
20170113 05:46:22< pydsigner> So, 90 years to get from Haldiel to Deoran the same age
20170113 05:49:04< pydsigner> If you make Deoran and Haldiel 17 each than you need two people between them if you're going to have parentage at age 30
20170113 05:49:17< pydsigner> For the three fathers
20170113 05:49:43< pydsigner> So I don't think grandson works out either
20170113 05:49:56< pydsigner> Unlike I had originally supposed
20170113 05:51:03< pydsigner> And we can't really compress it because Konrad lives 62 years and is considered to have a long reign
20170113 05:53:02< pydsigner> Although I don't know if there's basis for that.
20170113 05:53:26< pydsigner> The timeline has Dacyn born in 533 YW which is ridiculous
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20170113 05:54:37< pydsigner> Delfador lives 91 years, and the timeline has Dacyn out on military assignments and running around the continent in his 90s
20170113 05:55:32< pydsigner> I just wanted to point this out, not sure of a good solution
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20170113 07:15:07< DeFender1031> Aginor, pidgin still does all those protocols.
20170113 07:15:46< DeFender1031> I'd also like to add my voice to the "hell no" category of "should we migrate away from IRC"
20170113 07:18:42< DeFender1031> pydsigner, Aragorn is in his 80's before he even marries, and he's considered anything but elderly. People in high fantasy sometimes have much longer lifespans than people in our world. I don't see an issue here. (That's aside from the fact that it could be that his father was named after his great grandfather, if you want to go that route).
20170113 07:19:24< pydsigner> DeFender1031: Aragorn is not from Wesnoth.
20170113 07:19:35< DeFender1031> Didn't say he was. It was an example.
20170113 07:19:41< pydsigner> Right
20170113 07:20:13< pydsigner> But precedent in Wesnoth is that humans don't live that long.
20170113 07:20:37< DeFender1031> Hmm...
20170113 07:20:40< pydsigner> It's also worth noting that Aragorn was by no means a normal human
20170113 07:20:50< DeFender1031> Also true.
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20170113 07:56:14< wedge009> vultraz: I must be stupid but I don't know what discord is (this communication platform, not the word itself).
20170113 07:57:12< JyrkiVesterinen> https://discordapp.com/
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20170113 07:59:02< wedge009> Oh. Yet another thing trying to be all-encompassing? :/
20170113 07:59:25< wedge009> Looks like it's targeted to people playing games.
20170113 08:01:19< JyrkiVesterinen> I have noticed, in particular, that it shows which games (if any) everyone is playing ATM.
20170113 08:01:40< JyrkiVesterinen> I don't mind myself, but I imagine some people may want more privacy.
20170113 08:01:50< wedge009> Provided the application is running on the same platform that you're playing the game.
20170113 08:01:59< wedge009> Yes, I concur.
20170113 08:03:15< wedge009> I'd try to follow whatever is mandated, of course, but for me, I run IRC (admittedly, solely for #Wesnoth) through my e-mail client, so I don't need to run anything separately. If we choose to start using this Discord thingy, that would require a separate installation.
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20170113 08:03:37< wedge009> So I'd prefer leaving things as-is.
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20170113 08:05:21< wedge009> BTW, I've played through the first two scenarios for Secrets of the Ancients. Nothing major so far. I did have a problem raising a corpse at one of the grave markers at the start of the second scenario but when I tried again in a fresh game it seemed to work fine. So must be something funny with my particular play-through.
20170113 08:05:27< wedge009> Not game-crippling.
20170113 08:06:00 * wedge009 wishes it wasn't still 42C at 7 pm ):
20170113 08:10:30< JyrkiVesterinen> It's 2C here (Helsinki, Finland, North Europe). Last week it was much colder, the temperature went below -15C for a couple of days.
20170113 08:10:57< JyrkiVesterinen> I suppose I would't survive even for a second in the Australia/NZ weather. :/
20170113 08:15:39< wedge009> JyrkiVesterinen: Admittedly, 40+ doesn't happen too often in Sydney but we already had one on Wednesday. It's mainly the heat hanging around this late that's upsetting but it's been far, far worse further inland.
20170113 08:15:53< wedge009> I know the majority of the world's population is in winter at the moment.
20170113 08:16:27< wedge009> (I was born in the UK, where a rare 30C heat-wave was the hottest I'd been in till I moved to Aus.)
20170113 08:19:57< wedge009> JyrkiVesterinen: I remember reading this recently: http://www.cntraveler.com/story/helsinki-airport-sign-applauds-badass-travelers-for-visiting-in-winter
20170113 08:23:11< JyrkiVesterinen> Helsinki is actually one of the warmest cities here. We are in the southern edge of the country, and next to the Baltic Sea, which limits temperature changes.
20170113 08:23:28< JyrkiVesterinen> Nothern Finland is the real cold place.
20170113 08:25:11< wedge009> Yeah, to be expected. Which is why I never really got that cold in UK. Visiting relatives in Canada was the coldest I'd ever been, and that was in spring time!
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20170113 08:44:20< Appveyor> The Battle for Wesnoth (Visual Studio 2015) - Release ln-zookeeper 803d809: EI: Map aesthetic tweaks (castles and villages) Succeeded
20170113 08:44:20< Appveyor> Details: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth-7lnpw/build/Wesnoth-VS2015-master-131
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20170113 08:54:02< zookeeper> pydsigner, https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/902bfd38d2866b766
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20170113 09:09:34< Appveyor> The Battle for Wesnoth (Visual Studio 2015) - Debug ln-zookeeper 803d809: EI: Map aesthetic tweaks (castles and villages) Succeeded
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20170113 09:29:27< Soliton> zookeeper: yeah, we should probably remove that.
20170113 09:34:15< zookeeper> mmkay
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20170113 09:43:40< Appveyor> The Battle for Wesnoth (Visual Studio 2013) - Release ln-zookeeper 803d809: EI: Map aesthetic tweaks (castles and villages) Succeeded
20170113 09:43:40< Appveyor> Details: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth/build/Wesnoth-VS2013-master-133
20170113 09:43:43< Aginor> JyrkiVesterinen: as a Swede living in NZ, I find it tolerable
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20170113 09:44:17< JyrkiVesterinen> Huh. It's a quite large temperature range to tolerate.
20170113 09:46:11< Aginor> nz is more temperate than aus
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20170113 09:54:35< zookeeper> Soliton, i guess i'll go with this unless anyone happens to have a better idea:
20170113 09:54:37< zookeeper> -message= _ "Congratulations for surviving the map that so many people claim is impossible. Frankly, I haven’t got a clue as to how you did it, so send me the replay by mail to: roze@roze.mine.nu. Thank You!"
20170113 09:54:38< zookeeper> +message= _ "Congratulations for surviving the map that so many people claim is impossible!"
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20170113 09:55:57< Soliton> sounds good.
20170113 09:58:28< zookeeper> i wish we still had some multiplayer people working on the mainline maps/scenarios
20170113 09:59:40< Soliton> i'm sure wingsfalcon would love to jump in!
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20170113 10:01:08< irker829> wesnoth: ln-zookeeper wesnoth:master 6638df53a465 / data/multiplayer/scenarios/6p_Team_Survival.cfg: Removed request to e-mail Team Survival replays to Roze https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/6638df53a4657deb2a0b6d580af38954966595f1
20170113 10:01:23< zookeeper> uh... yeah, i'm sure he would
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20170113 10:10:30< Appveyor> The Battle for Wesnoth (Visual Studio 2013) - Debug ln-zookeeper 803d809: EI: Map aesthetic tweaks (castles and villages) Succeeded
20170113 10:10:30< Appveyor> Details: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth/build/Wesnoth-VS2013-master-133
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20170113 10:16:33< Soliton> the technical effort of moving away from irc includes the wesnothd lobby and moderator channels, btw.
20170113 10:17:13< Aginor> I don't think anyone is proposing we move from irc
20170113 10:17:29< Aginor> I'm sorry I asked
20170113 10:17:54< Soliton> vultraz is.
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20170113 11:26:33< irker829> wesnoth: ln-zookeeper wesnoth:master 980dd4e5fb94 / data/core/images/terrain/portals/ (12 files): Added some grain to the wooden doors to give them a bit more texture https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/commit/980dd4e5fb942619b47e107e900deb6165cff470
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20170113 13:46:48< pydsigner> zookeeper: well that is what I get for checking 1.12 instead of 1.13
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20170113 14:53:13< celticminstrel> Someone just posted a list in the 1.13.6 thread... :|
20170113 14:53:32< celticminstrel> Some of these suggestions seem ridiculous for various reasons.
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20170113 15:37:28< zookeeper> celticminstrel, it's no coincidence that i've not responded to any of her posts so far.
20170113 15:37:47< celticminstrel> Heh
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