--- Log opened Sun Sep 03 00:00:38 2017 20170903 00:15:50-!- celticminstrel [~celmin@unaffiliated/celticminstrel] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 00:19:06-!- MadMerlin2 is now known as MadMerlin 20170903 00:26:55< gfgtdf> from what i saw in a brief look at google it's impossible to prevent importing this with the standard python interpreter. 20170903 00:29:44-!- ToBeCloud [uid51591@wikimedia/ToBeFree] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 20170903 00:35:49< aeth> Python's about 15x to 30x less performant than I expect. 20170903 00:36:04< aeth> You can have high level with performance. 20170903 00:36:29< aeth> Even PyPy, if it had library support. Unfortunately, if you use PyPy you'd give up on the faster Numpy so the program might not even be faster as a whole. 20170903 00:36:30-!- Narrat [~Narrat@p5DCC65C3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: They say a little knowledge is a dangerous thing, but it's not one half so bad as a lot of ignorance.] 20170903 00:39:19-!- Haudegen [~quassel@178.115.237.87] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20170903 01:10:24-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@183.131.67.247] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 01:10:35-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@183.131.67.247] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 01:21:32-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@183.131.67.203] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 01:23:16-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@183.131.67.203] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 01:25:10-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@183.131.67.243] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 01:25:20-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@183.131.67.243] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 01:34:06-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@203.220.138.162] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 01:38:19-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 01:38:40-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 01:44:09-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 01:44:21-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 01:53:04-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 01:53:10-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 01:54:59-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 01:55:58-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 01:57:32-!- gfgtdf_ [~chatzilla@x4e32b7a8.dyn.telefonica.de] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 02:00:29-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@x4e32b4f9.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20170903 02:00:41-!- gfgtdf_ is now known as gfgtdf 20170903 02:00:53-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 02:03:37-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 02:11:10-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 02:14:09-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 02:15:39-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 02:16:30-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 02:20:04-!- vultraz_iOS [uid24821@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 02:24:39-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 02:25:32-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 02:26:06< wesnoth-discord-> gfgdf: yes that's why it'd be harder 20170903 02:26:16< wesnoth-discord-> You'd have to manage a fork 20170903 02:26:48< wesnoth-discord-> aeth: are we comparing to Lua or to C? 20170903 02:32:05-!- gfgtdf [~chatzilla@x4e32b7a8.dyn.telefonica.de] has quit [Quit: ChatZilla 0.9.93 [Firefox 55.0.3/20170824053622]] 20170903 02:41:14-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 02:41:49-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 02:42:05-!- ArneBab_ [~quassel@freenet/developer/arnebab] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 02:46:37-!- ArneBab [~quassel@freenet/developer/arnebab] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20170903 02:54:20-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 02:54:26-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 02:57:27-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 02:58:25-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 02:59:55-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 03:00:31-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 03:10:05-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 03:10:36-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 03:14:54-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 03:15:08-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 03:23:50-!- edaq [~edaq3@h69-21-227-85.cytnin.dsl.dynamic.tds.net] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20170903 03:25:41< aeth> pydesigner, Python frequently benchmarks as among the slowest languages. 20170903 03:25:52< aeth> Although the fast Lua is luajit, which I don't think Wesnoth uses. 20170903 03:26:29< aeth> The other really slow one is Ruby iirc. Perl 6 is actually slower than Perl iirc. 20170903 03:27:01< wesnoth-discord-> If speed is the measurement, comparing python to C seems... odd. 20170903 03:27:37< aeth> Well the 30x is to C, which is about as fast as you can get, so it just shows that there's a lot of room for improvement. 20170903 03:27:48< aeth> For other languages, it's probably more like 10x, maybe 15x. 20170903 03:30:38< aeth> You won't actually ever get to full C-like speeds in a very dynamic language, but there's no reason why you can't have both, e.g. optional types. (At the moment, type annotations in Python are just essentially comments for IDEs afaik, so no performance advantage there, yet) 20170903 03:31:15< aeth> Go and Java are probably more fair comparisons because they're GCed, but most of the fast languages are probably about a 3x slowdown from C 20170903 03:37:48< wesnoth-discord-> it would definitely be nice if there was a way to strictly define a variable as a particular type in lua 20170903 03:38:27< wesnoth-discord-> though to me it's less about performance, and more that errors will pop up a lot sooner if something unexpected happens 20170903 03:39:10< aeth> Well, I think all languages are moving toward meeting in the middle with types, in the long run. 20170903 03:40:10< aeth> Sometimes it's annoying to have to say what the type is for every variable, sometimes it should really just be stated. 20170903 03:43:28-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@183.131.67.203] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 03:45:16-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@183.131.67.203] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 03:47:22< wesnoth-discord-> IIRC, rust tries to have a bit of a middle ground with that. it's strictly typed, but it'll try to figure out a type from what you're assigning, if you don't provide one. 20170903 03:53:25-!- celticminstrel [~celmin@unaffiliated/celticminstrel] has quit [Quit: And lo! The computer falls into a deep sleep, to awake again some other day!] 20170903 04:03:36-!- Kwandulin [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BF785ABA56242B2DB53.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 04:06:57-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 04:08:33-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 04:29:56-!- APic [apic@apic.name] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20170903 04:39:03-!- APic [~apic@apic.name] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 06:29:33-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 06:31:13-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 06:44:43-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 06:45:46-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20170903 06:49:52-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 06:51:20-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20170903 06:52:11-!- ToBeCloud [uid51591@wikimedia/ToBeFree] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 06:56:14-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 06:57:17-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 07:01:50-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 07:02:42-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 07:05:05-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 07:06:36-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 07:10:10-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 07:17:26-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 07:21:22-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 07:23:40-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 07:26:54-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 07:28:10-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 07:31:43-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@203.220.138.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20170903 07:32:23-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.158.162] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 07:54:24-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 08:02:51-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 08:03:00-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 08:13:26-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 08:14:05-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 08:15:05-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 08:15:06-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 08:16:35-!- Appleman1234 [~quassel@124x38x163x22.ap124.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20170903 08:38:21-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.158.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20170903 08:39:07-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.158.162] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 08:45:50-!- claymore [~claymore@unaffiliated/claymore] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 09:01:18-!- ToBeCloud [uid51591@wikimedia/ToBeFree] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 20170903 09:13:51-!- claymore [~claymore@unaffiliated/claymore] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20170903 09:19:41-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.158.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20170903 09:19:51-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.158.162] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 09:34:55< wesnoth-discord-> Question 20170903 09:35:14< wesnoth-discord-> Do you think there were any rebellions after Konrad got his throne 20170903 09:42:24< zookeeper> probably, but whether they were successful is another matter. 20170903 09:49:18< zookeeper> https://wiki.wesnoth.org/Timeline_of_Wesnoth#628-673_YW:_The_Silver_Age_of_Wesnoth 20170903 09:50:55< zookeeper> it's doubtful that there were any successful rebellions before 673YW, and what happens after that is unknown. 20170903 09:59:55< wesnoth-discord-> thanks 20170903 10:02:25-!- Kwandulin [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BF785ABA56242B2DB53.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20170903 10:36:20-!- Kwandulin [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BF785ABA56242B2DB53.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 10:36:28-!- Kwandulin [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BF785ABA56242B2DB53.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Client Quit] 20170903 10:36:45-!- Kwandulin [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BF785ABA56242B2DB53.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 10:48:58-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 10:49:56-!- ancientcc [~ancientcc@103.221.141.157] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 10:50:49-!- claymore [~claymore@unaffiliated/claymore] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 10:53:38-!- Appleman1234 [~quassel@124x38x163x22.ap124.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 11:25:54-!- Haudegen [~quassel@178.115.237.87] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 11:34:36-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 11:34:42-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 12:21:40-!- Kranix [~magnus@188-182-184-38-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 12:53:30-!- synthpopisback [~synthpopi@2606:a000:7947:5000:fcc6:ae97:e07f:6e94] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20170903 12:54:46-!- Kwandulin [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BF785ABA56242B2DB53.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20170903 14:11:05-!- Kwandulin [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BF785ABA56242B2DB53.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 14:13:36-!- celticminstrel [~celmin@unaffiliated/celticminstrel] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 14:20:05-!- celticminstrel [~celmin@unaffiliated/celticminstrel] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 14:20:57-!- celticminstrel [~celmin@unaffiliated/celticminstrel] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 14:54:35-!- pelargos [~basket@adsl-203.37.6.3.tellas.gr] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 14:54:41-!- pelargos [~basket@adsl-203.37.6.3.tellas.gr] has left #wesnoth [] 20170903 15:01:22-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.158.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20170903 15:11:27-!- sevu [~Shiki@p54856C0A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 16:39:38-!- Kwandulin [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BF785ABA56242B2DB53.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20170903 16:43:54-!- Haudegen [~quassel@178.115.237.87] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 17:10:47-!- Narrat [~Narrat@p5DCC65C3.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 17:12:50-!- Kwandulin [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BF7BC3B4476E50D3AE9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 17:58:33-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.158.162] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 17:59:57-!- Kranix [~magnus@188-182-184-38-static.dk.customer.tdc.net] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 20170903 18:32:41-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.158.162] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20170903 18:39:33-!- Kwandulin2 [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BB7BC3B4476E50D3AE9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 18:41:05-!- Kwandulin [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BF7BC3B4476E50D3AE9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Ping timeout: 255 seconds] 20170903 18:53:50-!- Kwandulin2 [~Kwandulin@p200300E453CC3BB7BC3B4476E50D3AE9.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20170903 19:17:37-!- Kranix [~magnus@192.38.142.243] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 19:29:44-!- sevu [~Shiki@p54856C0A.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Quit: Verlassend] 20170903 19:43:53< wesnoth-discord-> mfw my 6 mages completly surround and enemy and they all mis their magic attacks 20170903 19:50:54< zookeeper> congratulations, not something you get to see every day :J 20170903 20:05:19-!- Kranix [~magnus@192.38.142.243] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20170903 20:19:24-!- Kranix [~magnus@xd520f683.cust.hiper.dk] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 20:19:32< wesnoth-discord-> @gohomoth that's why I hate RNG games. 20170903 20:20:11< wesnoth-discord-> Not Wesnoth of course :] 20170903 20:35:42< wesnoth-discord-> @gohomoth#0479 my spider-sense tells me you are lying 20170903 20:38:33< wesnoth-discord-> 0.3^(6*3)=0.000000000387420489 20170903 20:42:29-!- The_Unforgiven [~quassel@unaffiliated/the-unforgiven/x-8713611] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 20:42:30-!- The_Unforgiven_ [~quassel@2601:40a:c380:462:7c73:b82f:a889:9196] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 20:43:42< wesnoth-discord-> not a chance 20170903 20:43:56< wesnoth-discord-> bad pseudo random 20170903 20:44:02< wesnoth-discord-> thrash that host 20170903 20:45:10< wesnoth-discord-> 1 in 100 happens all the time; 1 in 1000000000 does not not 20170903 20:45:59< wesnoth-discord-> does not* 20170903 20:47:24< wesnoth-discord-> I doubt 1000000000 games of wesnoth have ever been played 20170903 20:48:05< wesnoth-discord-> or more relevantly, that there have been 1000000000 combats happening in the history of the wesnoth project 20170903 20:51:51< wesnoth-discord-> combats as in, unit on unit 20170903 20:52:25< Polsaker> well, if there's a chance then it can happen :p 20170903 20:52:36< wesnoth-discord-> all your life might be a dream 20170903 20:52:42< wesnoth-discord-> why care about anything 20170903 20:53:14-!- Kranix [~magnus@xd520f683.cust.hiper.dk] has quit [Quit: Konversation terminated!] 20170903 20:53:24< wesnoth-discord-> th echance of that is just very small 20170903 20:54:23< wesnoth-discord-> i say this as the One Person Who Has Succesfully Proven That Wesnoth Randomness Is Broken 20170903 20:54:26< wesnoth-discord-> (afaik) 20170903 20:54:42< wesnoth-discord-> But it was fixed in like a day after I reported it 😄 20170903 20:55:55-!- The_Unforgiven_ [~quassel@2601:40a:c380:462:7c73:b82f:a889:9196] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20170903 20:55:55-!- The_Unforgiven [~quassel@unaffiliated/the-unforgiven/x-8713611] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20170903 20:58:29< celticminstrel> Oh? This sounds intriguing. 20170903 20:58:42< wesnoth-discord-> It was terrain variation randomness! 20170903 20:58:46< wesnoth-discord-> Well, randomness is a deep topic 20170903 20:58:51< wesnoth-discord-> But it is probably possible 20170903 20:58:51< wesnoth-discord-> I reported it on #wesnoth-dev 20170903 20:59:19< wesnoth-discord-> It used to be that terrain variation randomness produced huge vertical columns at the left edge of maps 20170903 20:59:23< celticminstrel> Ah. 20170903 21:02:04-!- saran [~saran@91.228.34.14] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 21:07:03-!- claymore [~claymore@unaffiliated/claymore] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20170903 21:10:26< wesnoth-discord-> @Saran it is possible that you will be eaten by wolves 5 minutes from now 20170903 21:10:41< wesnoth-discord-> "possible" is such a useless word 20170903 21:11:26< wesnoth-discord-> even in online chess it is possible that you will win in 1 move from the beginning 20170903 21:11:36< wesnoth-discord-> because of an enormously unlikely write error 20170903 21:12:38-!- saran [~saran@91.228.34.14] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20170903 21:13:12< mattsc> blarumyrran: that does not mean that extremely unlikely events do not happen. It just means that any specific extremely unlikely event is … well, extremely unlikely. 20170903 21:13:50< wesnoth-discord-> i'd say "do not happen" just also means a very small probability 20170903 21:15:18< wesnoth-discord-> there is nothing that cannot happen by some very chance, by incredibly low-level errors and particle movements... when we say something is impossible, we just mean it is unlikely below a certain threshold 20170903 21:21:18< mattsc> Right. That does not mean that _some_ events like that are not going to happen. In fact, they definitely will happen. 20170903 21:22:59-!- saran [~saran@91.228.34.14] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 21:26:04< wesnoth-discord-> You said "that does not mean that extremely unlikely events do not happen.". but if you understand "do not happen" to mean "happens with a probability below a very low threshold", then "unlikely events do not happen." and "any specific extremely unlikely event is … well, extremely unlikely." mean the same thing 20170903 22:23:28-!- Appleman1234 [~quassel@124x38x163x22.ap124.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20170903 22:24:33-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 248 seconds] 20170903 22:26:01-!- Appleman1234 [~quassel@124x38x163x22.ap124.ftth.ucom.ne.jp] has joined #wesnoth 20170903 23:45:53-!- saran [~saran@91.228.34.14] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] --- Log closed Mon Sep 04 00:00:39 2017