--- Log opened Sun Feb 11 00:00:03 2018 20180211 00:31:09-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20180211 00:31:15-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 01:03:28-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.156.44] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 01:22:13-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20180211 01:22:19-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 01:41:07-!- TheRuralJuror [~quassel@178.115.237.87] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20180211 01:47:32<+wesnoth-discord-> So, a human, a orc, and a elf are all sitting around a campfire. The human suggest, as is ancient human tradition, to tell a scary campfire story. 20180211 01:47:56<+wesnoth-discord-> The human tell a story about a insidious killer stalking the streets of a city at night 20180211 01:48:44<+wesnoth-discord-> The elf tells a story about a group of orcs big enough to eat trees whole rampaging through a elven city 20180211 01:49:20<+wesnoth-discord-> And the orc sits in silence for a minute or two, racking his brain 20180211 01:49:45<+wesnoth-discord-> Finally he gives them the most horrid, unlikely story he can think of 20180211 01:50:22<+wesnoth-discord-> When all his fellow orcs are away on a raid, the goblins rise up 20180211 01:50:33<+wesnoth-discord-> And eat all the good food 20180211 01:50:46<+wesnoth-discord-> Dun dun dun 20180211 01:51:38<+wesnoth-discord-> @Kiiviing_Zindaal orcs have brains? 20180211 01:51:55<+wesnoth-discord-> XD 20180211 01:52:46<+wesnoth-discord-> Well, they have more than Goblins, which I think are just canonically weaker and dumber orcs used as meat shields. 20180211 02:19:02<+wesnoth-discord-> Smaller and weaker, yes. 20180211 02:19:55<+wesnoth-discord-> I question the 'dumber' part when a Goblin Trapper has a greater life expectancy than an Orcish Warrior. 20180211 02:20:16<+wesnoth-discord-> Guys are too much muscle, no strategy at all. 20180211 02:21:22<+wesnoth-discord-> Aren't orcs canonically born in 'packs', where about 1/2 of the 'pack' is goblins, and 1/2 of the rest are weaker orcs like Assassins and Archers, making only about 1/4 true orcs? 20180211 02:22:06<+wesnoth-discord-> Idk where you read those numbers but I think that's more or less how it works. They're called litters, though. 20180211 02:22:22<+wesnoth-discord-> Oh okay. 20180211 02:22:49<+wesnoth-discord-> I think I just sorta guessed. Haven't looked at the description in a long time. 20180211 02:23:05<+wesnoth-discord-> (With the fractions) 20180211 02:24:10< celticminstrel> Goblins being the "runts" of an orc litter is estabished by one of the race descriptions IIRC, but I don't think there was anything about assassins vs grunts being different other than in life choices. 20180211 02:24:12<+wesnoth-discord-> in any litter 20180211 02:24:16<+wesnoth-discord-> only "one or two" will be true orcs 20180211 02:24:27<+wesnoth-discord-> a few will be half-orcs, weaker than their big brothers 20180211 02:24:39< celticminstrel> That's not what "half-orc" means. 20180211 02:24:40<+wesnoth-discord-> and the rest, often a full half of more of any litter 20180211 02:24:41<+wesnoth-discord-> will be goblins 20180211 02:24:47<+wesnoth-discord-> that's what the description says 20180211 02:24:59<+wesnoth-discord-> Okay. Thanks. 20180211 02:25:11<+wesnoth-discord-> I don't really know what is meant by half-orc 20180211 02:25:16<+wesnoth-discord-> šŸ¤· 20180211 02:25:16< celticminstrel> I guess the description should be changed then, because that has undesirable connotations. 20180211 02:25:37<+wesnoth-discord-> yes, it could be misleading 20180211 02:26:20<+wesnoth-discord-> The only canonical hybrids are Tallin's children at the end of NR, for the record. And those are half-elves. 20180211 02:26:36<+wesnoth-discord-> He has children? 20180211 02:26:48<+wesnoth-discord-> Under specific circumstances yes. 20180211 02:26:56<+wesnoth-discord-> I don't remember that, though NR is one of my favorites. 20180211 02:27:12<+wesnoth-discord-> There's more than one possible ending I that regard. 20180211 02:27:20< celticminstrel> Given the litters thing, I wouldn't expect humans and orcs to be genetically compatible anyway. 20180211 02:27:29<+wesnoth-discord-> And I pretty much always save the two elven shamans. 20180211 02:27:34<+wesnoth-discord-> although it is not canon 20180211 02:27:38<+wesnoth-discord-> So I get that ending. 20180211 02:27:38<+wesnoth-discord-> in "A New Order" 20180211 02:27:43<+wesnoth-discord-> But that particular ending is the golden ending as far as I remember. 20180211 02:27:48<+wesnoth-discord-> I believe it is stated somewhere 20180211 02:27:51<+wesnoth-discord-> that orcs and humans are not compatible 20180211 02:28:18< celticminstrel> Wasn't A New Order abandoned and renounced by its creator... 20180211 02:28:27<+wesnoth-discord-> Aren't orcs "half-beast half-man"? 20180211 02:28:30<+wesnoth-discord-> possibly, I don't know :shroug: 20180211 02:28:30<+wesnoth-discord-> Huh was it? 20180211 02:28:32<+wesnoth-discord-> šŸ¤· 20180211 02:28:50< celticminstrel> Who was the creator again? I could be thinking of a different campaign. 20180211 02:28:58<+wesnoth-discord-> szopen I think 20180211 02:28:59<+wesnoth-discord-> I think I remember reading in a description they are half-beast. 20180211 02:29:04< celticminstrel> Hmm. 20180211 02:29:11<+wesnoth-discord-> szopen yes. 20180211 02:30:56< celticminstrel> I looked up the description. 20180211 02:31:05< celticminstrel> I think you misinterpreted it. 20180211 02:31:33< celticminstrel> It's a reference to their appearance only. 20180211 02:31:45<+wesnoth-discord-> That's what I thought. 20180211 02:32:07< celticminstrel> I don't like it. 20180211 02:32:25<+wesnoth-discord-> Random thought, but that made me think, we never see Orc females really in any fantasy works, even Wesnoth, (Tolkien universe does have one canon Dwarf female, but no orc females to my knowledge), what are they like? Are they any different? 20180211 02:33:04< celticminstrel> Since when did any Middle-Earth stories have a female dwarf character... 20180211 02:33:39<+wesnoth-discord-> Let me look up the canonical female Dwarf. Just a sec. 20180211 02:34:11<+wesnoth-discord-> the elder scrolls series has female orcs šŸ˜ 20180211 02:34:20< celticminstrel> ...you know, it would be quite a change, but perhaps it would make sense (in Wesnoth) to say that the "weaker half-orcs" are actually the females. Then assassins and archers would become either female or possibly-female. 20180211 02:34:45< celticminstrel> Also... I'm sure you can find lots of female orcs and dwarves if you look around in works of fantasy. 20180211 02:34:48<+wesnoth-discord-> it would make sense 20180211 02:34:51<+wesnoth-discord-> in some regard 20180211 02:35:13<+wesnoth-discord-> I haven't really seen any ever. 20180211 02:36:28<+wesnoth-discord-> Found her. I think she's Fili and Kili's mother. 20180211 02:36:29<+wesnoth-discord-> lotr.wikia.com/wiki/dĆ­s 20180211 02:36:44< celticminstrel> You probably just haven't looked at that much fantasy. 20180211 02:36:55< celticminstrel> It might be more common in games than in written works. 20180211 02:37:02< celticminstrel> (Either tabletop games or video games.) 20180211 02:37:15<+wesnoth-discord-> I'm a huge fan of it, mostly the Tolkienesque stuff. 20180211 02:38:17<+wesnoth-discord-> I remember one of my friends I had when I was in my early teens said he spent a full 2 years researching Dwarves, because he actually thought he was one. XD 20180211 02:39:21<+wesnoth-discord-> I had weird friends. 20180211 02:39:54 * celticminstrel shrugs. 20180211 02:41:10-!- hrubymar10 [~textual@ip-86-49-9-122.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20180211 04:25:01<+wesnoth-discord-> celticminstrel: in a series I'm actually reading currently, a key character is a female orc shaman 20180211 04:25:21< celticminstrel> Is this about Wesnoth or just fantasy generally 20180211 04:26:07<+wesnoth-discord-> Well, my comment on Orcish Women was directed at more universal fantasy, including Wesnoth. 20180211 04:27:12<+wesnoth-discord-> Threadbare, Andrew Seiple 20180211 04:27:33<+wesnoth-discord-> Okay. Seems interesting. 20180211 04:29:03<+wesnoth-discord-> Do they have a "role" in orcish society (like the hunter-gatherer system), or are they pretty much the same as male orcs? 20180211 05:18:52<+wesnoth-discord-> @Not Hamel - In the add-on I wrote called "Bad Moon Rising" (which has been around for a while, though it certainly isn't canon) the female orcs were not that different from female humans in a patriarchy where birth control didn't exist, neither did any real medicine, and life expectancy was short for everyone: Women died in childbirth (whether they wanted to be mothers or not) and men died in stupid battles (whether they 20180211 05:18:52<+wesnoth-discord-> wanted to fight them or not). 20180211 05:19:28<+wesnoth-discord-> Okay. Interesting. 20180211 05:19:34<+wesnoth-discord-> Thanks. 20180211 05:48:57-!- SFault [2588443a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.37.136.68.58] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 05:49:15< SFault> Hi peeps! 20180211 06:58:44-!- SFault [2588443a@gateway/web/freenode/ip.37.136.68.58] has quit [Quit: Page closed] 20180211 07:47:40-!- celticminstrel is now known as celmin|sleep 20180211 08:22:27-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 09:14:49-!- hrubymar10 [~textual@ip-86-49-9-122.net.upcbroadband.cz] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 09:44:26<+wesnoth-discord-> Hi SFault! 20180211 10:40:29<+wesnoth-discord-> I remember, Gimli's father showed off a picture of wife and kid in the Hobbit movie. 20180211 10:52:58<+wesnoth-discord-> just came on here to ask - where the heck is the steam version - u said early 2017? 20180211 10:56:11-!- hrubymar10 [~textual@ip-86-49-9-122.net.upcbroadband.cz] has quit [Quit: hrubymar10] 20180211 10:57:35<+wesnoth-discord-> Release dates were being vaguely stated and stuff seems to have arised. Now the team is stating the latest dates announced are tentative so hopefully that'll be more predictable. 20180211 10:58:22<+wesnoth-discord-> Indeed, Vultraz was way too optimistic in hir original "early 2017" estimate. 20180211 10:58:47<+wesnoth-discord-> (Even the tentative release date of April 13, 2018 is starting to look like too optimistic.) 20180211 10:59:00<+wesnoth-discord-> but we're trying to make it 20180211 10:59:39<+wesnoth-discord-> Well, this flurry of changes and regressions right at the time we were supposed to have another beta release is a very bad sign. 20180211 10:59:55<+wesnoth-discord-> Right before a gbeta release, the rate of changes should slow down, not 'speed up*. 20180211 11:00:23<+wesnoth-discord-> well, you have to remember these are mostly bug fixes 20180211 11:00:42<+wesnoth-discord-> Even bug fixes have risk of regressions, unfortunately. 20180211 11:33:51-!- claymore [~claymore@unaffiliated/claymore] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 11:49:18-!- DeFender1031 [~DeFender1@93-172-141-41.bb.netvision.net.il] has quit [Ping timeout: 265 seconds] 20180211 12:17:32-!- Haudegen [~quassel@178.115.237.87] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 14:36:45<+wesnoth-discord-> Is it just me or there is no OoA campaign on the addons server? 20180211 14:38:18<+wesnoth-discord-> Yeah, there was a bug which made it unplayable on the latest version. Didnt get to fix it yet 20180211 15:00:26<+wesnoth-discord-> isn't it simple. orc archers and goblin riders are small orcs, below them you have goblins, grunts are true orcs 20180211 15:00:32<+wesnoth-discord-> same as assasins are small orcs 20180211 15:00:52<+wesnoth-discord-> so i guess these small orcs are half orcs merged with goblins 20180211 15:41:33-!- DeFender1031 [~DeFender1@46-116-68-9.bb.netvision.net.il] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 16:00:55<+wesnoth-discord-> welp ive done that second mission on Under The Burning Suns finally lol 20180211 16:00:59<+wesnoth-discord-> (the one with the thirst mechanic) 20180211 16:07:04<+wesnoth-discord-> ah 20180211 16:07:25<+wesnoth-discord-> if you're still having trouble with UtBS, you could look through my replays I put on the forum 20180211 16:07:42<+wesnoth-discord-> but congrats on beating that scenario 20180211 16:13:23<+wesnoth-discord-> Nice playthrough 20180211 16:16:26<+wesnoth-discord-> Mountain Witch campaign is impossible to beat 20180211 16:16:57-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.156.44] has quit [Ping timeout: 240 seconds] 20180211 16:16:59<+wesnoth-discord-> Only takes a few seconds of playing 20180211 16:21:33<+wesnoth-discord-> Anyone else play that campaign? 20180211 16:26:57<+wesnoth-discord-> haven't played it thus far 20180211 16:27:12<+wesnoth-discord-> sorry to interrupt, but does anyone know how [game_config] finds images? 20180211 16:28:38< Ravana_> from data/core/images and maybe from images too 20180211 16:30:36<+wesnoth-discord-> using CoreWML, I changed the binary path and loaded from my own game_config file but it seems to still be loading from data/core/images and images 20180211 16:31:04<+wesnoth-discord-> you need to right click and create circle 20180211 16:31:11<+wesnoth-discord-> in the middle i think 20180211 16:31:17<+wesnoth-discord-> then you win first scenario 20180211 16:48:27-!- celmin|sleep is now known as celticminstrel 20180211 16:49:34-!- Ivanovic_ [~ivanovic@p579FBA67.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 16:49:34-!- Ivanovic_ [~ivanovic@p579FBA67.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Changing host] 20180211 16:49:34-!- Ivanovic_ [~ivanovic@wesnoth/developer/ivanovic] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 16:51:21-!- Ivanovic [~ivanovic@wesnoth/developer/ivanovic] has quit [Ping timeout: 263 seconds] 20180211 16:51:32-!- Ivanovic_ is now known as Ivanovic 20180211 16:54:50<+wesnoth-discord-> Now it says ā€œError: Failed to load the scenarioā€ 20180211 16:55:46<+wesnoth-discord-> For the Mountain Witch scenario 20180211 17:00:47-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20180211 17:01:02-!- janebot [~Gambot@unaffiliated/gambit/bot/gambot] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 17:20:58-!- vultraz [uid24821@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has quit [Quit: Connection closed for inactivity] 20180211 17:44:11-!- octalot [~steve@91.141.0.93.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 18:04:27<+wesnoth-discord-> how unfortunate 20180211 18:04:28<+wesnoth-discord-> Iā€™m on iOS so maybe Iā€™ll discuss it in the forum sometime soon 20180211 18:04:53<+wesnoth-discord-> Yeah if canā€™t load anymore 20180211 18:09:28<+wesnoth-discord-> @sinda is the iOS porter. He may be able to help. 20180211 18:12:44<+wesnoth-discord-> Should I just post it in the forum? Or just ping me if you need to talk with me. 20180211 18:36:45<+wesnoth-discord-> Redownloaded the campaign and it works again. Trying to figure out how to play it on iOS without losing on the first scenario 20180211 19:14:12-!- synthpopisback [~synthpopi@cpe-2606-A000-7947-5000-A816-8F9B-43B8-454B.dyn6.twc.com] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20180211 19:20:41<+wesnoth-discord-> Right clicking on the middle where the person is worked. Thanks 20180211 19:23:06<+wesnoth-discord-> Still losing the first scenario but got a little further. 20180211 19:24:01<+wesnoth-discord-> Iā€™ll be back later. 20180211 19:26:30-!- Haudegen [~quassel@178.115.237.87] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20180211 19:51:06-!- Haudegen [~quassel@178.115.237.87] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 19:51:27-!- vultraz [uid24821@wesnoth/developer/vultraz] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 19:54:29<+wesnoth-discord-> @SageSeer Can you try it on a desktop 1.13 please? You can also come to iOS subforum, or maybe it's a question for the campaign author - if it's 1.13 compatible. We can figure it out by trying on a desktop version. 20180211 19:58:57<+wesnoth-discord-> I think it is a question for the author but the Failed to load error got fixed by removing it and the redownloading. Sad thing is I donā€™t have a desktop right now. I have another project or problem Iā€™m working on about the addons that I will post later in the iOS sub forum 20180211 20:02:17<+wesnoth-discord-> I donā€™t have a desktop at the moment unless I can find a good deal just to play wesnoth on but most likely I will have to save up. Iā€™m on a iPad mini 2 for the wesnoth playing 20180211 20:19:37<+wesnoth-discord-> @sinda Iā€™ll post something in the iOS subforum soon. 20180211 21:06:14-!- claymore [~claymore@unaffiliated/claymore] has quit [Quit: Leaving] 20180211 21:14:31<+wesnoth-discord-> No worries, I'm not demanding such an effort. Thanks for reporting! 20180211 21:15:15<+wesnoth-discord-> I just want to point out, that if it's an add-on incompatibilty with 1.13, then all I can do is to report it to the author. 20180211 21:17:41<+wesnoth-discord-> @sinda I can play my iPad like a desktop with my physical keyboard. Is there an option for me to play that way? 20180211 21:22:56<+wesnoth-discord-> Instead of being on desktop itself or do you need it differently than what Iā€™m thinking 20180211 21:24:17<+wesnoth-discord-> I cannot really tell, I don't have an iPad keyboard. If it sends keystrokes the way the on-screen keyboard does, then it should be very possible. 20180211 21:24:32<+wesnoth-discord-> What happens when you try to play with keyboard attached? 20180211 21:29:24<+wesnoth-discord-> It is just like a regular desktop keyboard 20180211 21:29:38<+wesnoth-discord-> A regular Mac desktop keyboard 20180211 21:31:11<+wesnoth-discord-> I think it works better than the onscreen keyboard 20180211 21:34:13<+wesnoth-discord-> It takes a few seconds from punching the keys for it to show up and then it is just like a Mac keyboard 20180211 21:34:28<+wesnoth-discord-> It needs to be Bluetooth keyboard to connect to iPad, AFAIK. 20180211 21:34:44<+wesnoth-discord-> Yeah it is Bluetooth 20180211 21:36:26<+wesnoth-discord-> Hm, that's a bad delay. Needs some work to investigate. Some day I'll buy a keyboard and check it out, but no promises that it will happen any time soon. 20180211 21:37:17<+wesnoth-discord-> It is only for the initial typing but after that there is no delay 20180211 21:39:51<+wesnoth-discord-> What kind of desktop do I need? For future reference. Wonā€™t be soon but hopefully sometime this year. 20180211 21:40:51<+wesnoth-discord-> You can see the system requirements right at https://www.wesnoth.org/ 20180211 21:41:07<+wesnoth-discord-> Pretty much anything that itns' completely ancient can run Wesnoth. 20180211 21:41:14<+wesnoth-discord-> *isn't 20180211 21:42:36<+wesnoth-discord-> Ok thanks 20180211 21:44:14<+wesnoth-discord-> Unless thereā€™s something more specific in mind? 20180211 21:46:00<+wesnoth-discord-> Well, there is one thing I'd recommend. We have barely any macOS developers, and therefore the game is more stable on Windows. Thus, for Wesnoth, buying a Windows desktop is a better idea than buying a Mac. 20180211 21:46:58<+wesnoth-discord-> @SageSeer Once again, the problem with external keyboard is that on-screen keyboard still pops up? 20180211 21:49:07<+wesnoth-discord-> No onscreen keyboard doesnā€™t show up when physical desktop is being used. 20180211 21:50:59<+wesnoth-discord-> Good. Sorry, what is a problem then? 20180211 21:52:34<+wesnoth-discord-> You wanted me to use the desktop version and so I was thinking would it be possible on the iOS device to use my physical desktop keyboard just like the desktop version? 20180211 21:54:05<+wesnoth-discord-> Ah, no. Please forget it. the point was to find the difference in the software. But the software is still the same, keyboard or not, so no point doing that. 20180211 21:54:45<+wesnoth-discord-> Anyway, it's probably a small problem in an add-on, that will eventually go away as the author tests it for compatibility with the upcoming 1.14. 20180211 21:55:26<+wesnoth-discord-> Ok good to know. 20180211 21:57:33<+wesnoth-discord-> Jyrkive: Thanks. Iā€™ll save up for Windows machine instead of a Mac. Thanks for the input 20180211 21:59:22<+wesnoth-discord-> Iā€™m going to test some things out. Iā€™ll be back later. 20180211 22:03:24<+wesnoth-discord-> If you tell me more details about your problem, I can post them to the author's forum. Or you can do it: https://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=8&t=45017&start=105 20180211 22:09:23-!- octalot [~steve@91.141.0.93.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 276 seconds] 20180211 22:10:42<+wesnoth-discord-> I think I will read and possibly reply in that thread. Thanks. Next time I will search the forums if I have any problems first. The only problem was fixed by removing and reinstalling. The other issue can be resolved in that forum topic. So forget about this for now. 20180211 22:11:57-!- octalot [~steve@178.165.130.195.wireless.dyn.drei.com] has joined #wesnoth 20180211 22:12:26< Soliton> i think there is still that subtle cache issue in the ios version. might be that. 20180211 22:13:03< Soliton> i'd start with uninstalling all other addons to narrow it down. 20180211 22:18:40<+wesnoth-discord-> That's a known problem in iOS version. Still in progress, sorry. 20180211 22:18:51<+wesnoth-discord-> Yes, that's it. 20180211 22:19:49<+wesnoth-discord-> It manifests in multiple add-ons, and there are some hints in Wesnoth's bug tracker. I'm going to try fixing it soon. 20180211 22:30:20<+wesnoth-discord-> To get rid of all the addons I just uninstalled Wesnoth and reinstalled and all the addons were removed. No iCloud support yet. 20180211 22:36:07<+wesnoth-discord-> Just now saw the ā€œRemove add-onsā€. Makes things easier. 20180211 22:46:23-!- vn971 [~vasya@94.158.103.15] has left #wesnoth ["PING 1518389183"] 20180211 23:24:24-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 260 seconds] 20180211 23:41:49-!- Bonobo [~Bonobo@61.68.156.44] has joined #wesnoth --- Log closed Mon Feb 12 00:00:04 2018