--- Log opened Fri Nov 09 00:00:27 2018 20181109 00:08:37-!- sevu [~sevu@p54855B61.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 00:11:39-!- kitsunenokenja [~kitsunech@68.91.220.96] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 00:52:49-!- celmin|away is now known as celticminstrel 20181109 01:10:36-!- mattsc [~mattsc@wesnoth/developer/mattsc] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 01:29:57<+wesdiscordbot> now i know all of you have been worried sick 20181109 01:30:00<+wesdiscordbot> but they can rebuild him 20181109 01:30:02<+wesdiscordbot> http://theyhavethetechnology.ytmnd.com/ 20181109 01:30:15<+wesdiscordbot> he's gonna be around guys. dont worry 20181109 01:41:46-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 20181109 01:46:36-!- Tobbi [~Tobbi@supertux/tobbi] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 20181109 02:49:30-!- kitsunenokenja [~kitsunech@68.91.220.96] has quit [Ping timeout: 252 seconds] 20181109 02:52:31-!- sevu [~sevu@p54855B61.dip0.t-ipconnect.de] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20181109 03:24:08<+wesdiscordbot> is there any news for a hypothetical 1.15 coming out lately? 20181109 03:37:44< celticminstrel> Maybe. 20181109 03:37:56< celticminstrel> Someone on the dev team was asking about that recently, too. 20181109 03:39:19< celticminstrel> There is a distinct possibility that it could happen by the end of the month. 20181109 03:39:40< celticminstrel> But nothing is decided at this point, just speculation. 20181109 03:40:12< celticminstrel> At least, as far as I know. 20181109 04:10:10-!- celticminstrel is now known as celmin|sleep 20181109 04:15:56-!- cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has quit [Ping timeout: 268 seconds] 20181109 04:21:38-!- mattsc [~mattsc@wesnoth/developer/mattsc] has quit [Quit: So long and thanks for all the fish.] 20181109 04:22:01-!- cyphase [~cyphase@unaffiliated/cyphase] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 05:15:39<+wesdiscordbot> The aim is before the end of the year 20181109 05:15:44<+wesdiscordbot> Nothing more specific 20181109 08:24:48-!- Tobbi [~Tobbi@supertux/tobbi] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 08:44:40-!- Tobbi [~Tobbi@supertux/tobbi] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 20181109 09:06:12-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 09:47:17-!- Haudegen [~quassel@178.115.237.87.static.drei.at] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 12:53:38<+wesdiscordbot> hi guys I got a question about statistics 20181109 12:53:51<+wesdiscordbot> I want to generate a chart about how many units got recruited and how many of them died 20181109 12:54:05<+wesdiscordbot> which is shown in statistics chart by the end of the game 20181109 12:54:23<+wesdiscordbot> is there any fast ways to do that by extracting the data from replay file? 20181109 12:54:45<+wesdiscordbot> it would cost too much time to watch every replay till the end and check the stats box tho 20181109 13:19:36< zookeeper> well... check if that data is in the replay file as-is? 20181109 13:37:36< Soliton> for client side replays/saves it should be there but not for server generated replays. 20181109 13:38:42<+wesdiscordbot> Event of dying or recruiting unit is in data i think (in my saves it is). Not in one place tho. 20181109 13:39:48< Soliton> https://wiki.wesnoth.org/StatisticalScenarioWML#The_.5Bstatistics.5D_tag 20181109 13:44:22<+wesdiscordbot> Thanks. 20181109 13:49:02< celmin|sleep> That page is a little outdated. 20181109 13:49:28< celmin|sleep> The format of [recruits] has changed to 3=Elvish Archer,Elvish Fighter 20181109 13:49:39< celmin|sleep> (If you had 3 of each.) 20181109 13:50:01< celmin|sleep> (The example given would be 3=Elvish Archer 2=Elvish Fighter) 20181109 13:50:19< celmin|sleep> I think that applies to [advances] [deaths] [killed] too. 20181109 13:50:26-!- celmin|sleep is now known as celmin|away 20181109 13:50:48< celmin|away> You can confirm by looking at an actual save file. 20181109 13:54:16<+wesdiscordbot> Yes it is as you say. [deaths] 1="Bone Shooter,Ghost,Ghoul,Vampire Bat,Walking Corpse" 2="Dark Adept" 3="Skeleton" 4="Skeleton Archer"[/deaths] 20181109 15:10:49<+wesdiscordbot> Updated it on the wiki. If you come across such things, feel free to update it as you see it, this is how the wiki works. 20181109 15:55:55<+wesdiscordbot> When it comes to double style tiles like hill + fungus units should have better defense and worse movement cost? 20181109 16:12:13< Soliton> usually, yes. 20181109 16:12:30< Soliton> bridges work differently. 20181109 16:24:21<+wesdiscordbot> I ask becouse dunefolks get 40% on fungus-hill terrain. 20181109 16:51:43< Soliton> what terrain is that exactly? 20181109 17:02:10<+wesdiscordbot> Mushroom Grove 20181109 17:04:51<+wesdiscordbot> Map Freelands 20181109 17:05:07<+wesdiscordbot> 6,11 for example 20181109 17:11:10< Ravana_> would you expect them get different value? 20181109 17:15:37<+wesdiscordbot> Yes. Becouse this looks like fungus hill terrain 20181109 17:16:09<+wesdiscordbot> So they should have 60% not 40%. Not to mention positioning with them is hard as it is. 20181109 17:16:56<+wesdiscordbot> I remember noticing that a while ago, and it seemed odd, but I assumed it was intentional. 20181109 17:22:48< Soliton> mushroom grove does not care for the base terrain. 20181109 17:23:25< Soliton> so it acts just like fungus alone. 20181109 17:24:11<+wesdiscordbot> Kinda misleading. 20181109 17:26:01< Soliton> depends how you see it. if you think that the mushrooms are the defining features so it does not really matter what's below it then it makes sense. 20181109 17:27:11< Soliton> i think the balancing reason is so that dwarves are not as good on it. 20181109 17:31:34<+wesdiscordbot> Yes but dwarves are also good on mountines, and have 10% more on fungus. Dunefolks have only 40% and 60% very rarely something else. I would much rather see something like 50% forest / 50% hills. And what is up with dune herbalist? Are there any herbs there? Not to mention they look like a mongols to me. 20181109 17:34:55< Soliton> well, it's straight up fungus so the values can simply be adjusted for the dunefolk movetypes if we think that's better. no need to change how mushroom grove works. 20181109 17:35:31<+wesdiscordbot> It would be good for the dunefolk to have better dodge on mushrooms in general, I think. A lot maps use them as defensive terrain, and it makes defending a lot harder. 20181109 17:35:58<+wesdiscordbot> especially since the dunefolk aren't as durable as dwarves 20181109 17:36:55<+wesdiscordbot> though I'm a mediocre player at best, so take it with a grain of salt 😛 20181109 17:41:49<+wesdiscordbot> Dunefolks are generaly underpowered. Except Rider but he is ilminal. As well as they do not have any unit that is realy good in defending. 20181109 17:47:50<+wesdiscordbot> well, so … the problem is that nobody in the team is doing balancing … there are probably a number of balance tweaks worthy it, but nobody does the right changes … 20181109 17:48:55<+wesdiscordbot> can't make changes if nobody knows what to change 20181109 17:50:06<+wesdiscordbot> there was a balancing thread at one point, but it ended up dying. 20181109 17:51:10<+wesdiscordbot> https://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=15&t=47831 20181109 17:51:55<+wesdiscordbot> also https://github.com/wesnoth/wesnoth/pull/2664 20181109 17:54:06<+wesdiscordbot> If someone had a set of changes, I think they would be considered. Mostly the problem would be who would be the one to decide about balancing. 20181109 17:56:25<+wesdiscordbot> Well that's a problem. Doing sets like that shouldn't be that hard. But still it would be nice if someone on your side could see and tell if they at least seems good. 20181109 17:57:10<+wesdiscordbot> at some point though it ends up probably being better to just do something and see what happens, then sitting around saying nobody knows. I don't think anyone is saying that they're balanced correctly right now, at the least. 20181109 17:58:38<+wesdiscordbot> we want to have a release next month … It would be a good point to get some Dunefolk changes in there, an look how reactions are 20181109 17:59:14<+wesdiscordbot> (not sure if it's 1.14.6, 1.15.0 or both being considered for next month) 20181109 18:00:06<+wesdiscordbot> 1.14.6 is unknown at this point, though would be nice. 1.15.0 is definitely sooner, or at least better defined - #development 's header says by the end of the year. 20181109 18:00:43<+wesdiscordbot> Ok. I could talk with players about that. It's always better to have more opinions. 20181109 18:01:21<+wesdiscordbot> cool 👍 20181109 18:06:05<+wesdiscordbot> As well as i could create version of my era to test this changes before sending them. It should help with stating what is good before it makes it to official version. 20181109 18:10:45<+wesdiscordbot> Would maybe help for finding a consens with other players. However, the changes don't have to be perfect, it's the first release of the 1.15 series, can be adjusted later again. 20181109 18:11:46<+wesdiscordbot> In fact, as most things commited to master hav been backported and only the things which really can't go in 1.14 are new there, balancing changes would be the interesting parts for 1.15 20181109 18:22:03<+wesdiscordbot> Ok then let's try to do this right. Who could I talk to if I were to have any questions? 20181109 18:26:41<+wesdiscordbot> I can at least point you at the right person if I can't answer any of them myself. 20181109 18:27:17<+wesdiscordbot> though of course, depending on the question, it might need to be discussed by the development team first. 20181109 18:32:48<+wesdiscordbot> Thanks. I understand that. But it seems I will need to convince players to help because unlike me not everyone sees a point in doing this. 😅 Well my point is that I just want to make this game better. 20181109 18:32:51-!- Tobbi [~Tobbi@supertux/tobbi] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 18:33:31<+wesdiscordbot> dunefolk are indeed a little UP 20181109 18:33:48<+wesdiscordbot> a bit of balancing around them would be nice depending on your suggestions 20181109 18:40:28<+wesdiscordbot> I don't think it would be something extreme. I'm aware that you probably aren't interested in including heavy changes. 20181109 18:41:43<+wesdiscordbot> for me personally I also don't feel like they need heavy, heavy changes 20181109 18:41:48<+wesdiscordbot> but could use a little help 20181109 18:50:35<+wesdiscordbot> I think it depends on skill level too. The better you are the more you can exploit weaknesses. I don't know how good you are and I do not want to offend you but right now I believe there is only one matchup that they are ok or have any chances. If think right now thier power level is around 4/5 of power level of deafult faction. But there are some matchups that the can easy be broken that is my biggest concern. 20181109 18:51:17<+wesdiscordbot> I play SP only mostly so I don't know too many MP nuances 20181109 18:51:29<+wesdiscordbot> regardless, they even feel weak in SP 20181109 18:51:57<+wesdiscordbot> I totally could believe that they only have one good matchup, or even none (besides dunefolk v dunefolk) 20181109 18:54:08-!- Haudegen [~quassel@178.115.237.87.static.drei.at] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20181109 18:57:58<+wesdiscordbot> That sums up thier position quite well. 🙂 20181109 18:59:02<+wesdiscordbot> anyway, putting your changes in a PR is probably the best bet to get attention, or if you like, I can do that for you 20181109 18:59:20<+wesdiscordbot> once you are reasonably sure about the changes you want to make, anyway 20181109 19:04:56<+wesdiscordbot> Stating the changes will take a while. I would want to talk about them with as many players I can just to get thier opinions. This alone will take some time. Not to mention choosing things to present to you that most people are happy with. 20181109 19:06:48<+wesdiscordbot> then if you can make a forum thread that would also be helpful to keep as a record for later 20181109 19:09:31<+wesdiscordbot> It shouldn't be a problem. I will do this when I will have a computer available. 20181109 19:23:49-!- Tobbi [~Tobbi@supertux/tobbi] has quit [Quit: My MacBook has gone to sleep. ZZZzzz…] 20181109 20:13:40-!- hk238 [~kvirc@unaffiliated/hk238] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 20:47:24-!- hk238 [~kvirc@unaffiliated/hk238] has quit [Quit: KVIrc 5.0.0 Aria http://www.kvirc.net/] 20181109 21:58:09-!- Tobbi [~Tobbi@supertux/tobbi] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 22:17:29-!- kitsunenokenja [~kitsunech@68.91.220.96] has joined #wesnoth 20181109 22:25:16-!- kitsunenokenja [~kitsunech@68.91.220.96] has quit [Ping timeout: 246 seconds] 20181109 23:58:36-!- mattsc [~mattsc@wesnoth/developer/mattsc] has joined #wesnoth --- Log closed Sat Nov 10 00:00:29 2018