--- Log opened Tue Jan 08 00:00:50 2019 20190108 00:07:11-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20190108 00:08:32< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:1.14 josteph 02a4338924 Sidebar: Reformat trait tooltip AppVeyor: vs2015/Release Failed 20190108 00:08:34< irker018> Details: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth-7lnpw/builds/21446687 20190108 00:55:38-!- celmin|away is now known as celticminstrel 20190108 00:57:19< celticminstrel> IMO those stats bugs should be treated as somewhat critical. They basically render stats meaningless. If they're not gonna be fixed we might as well just remove the stats altogether. 20190108 01:08:38< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:1.14 josteph 6c04e541eb mp_staging: Build all teams, not only th AppVeyor: vs2015/Release Failed 20190108 01:08:38< irker018> Details: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth-7lnpw/builds/21447345 20190108 01:12:52-!- stikonas_ [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has quit [Read error: Connection reset by peer] 20190108 01:48:48< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:master josteph 520b2c9d59 fixup! Fix textdomain id computation whe AppVeyor: All builds passed 20190108 02:05:28<+wesdiscordbot> @Vultraz https://forums.wesnoth.org/viewtopic.php?f=5&p=637245#p637245 20190108 03:55:31< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:master jostephd 40fbb6dc43 Merge pull request #3731 from jostephd/s AppVeyor: All builds passed 20190108 04:36:55<+wesdiscordbot> @sevu @josteph about DiD S6, return to parthyn, I'm thinking about changing it like this 20190108 04:37:46<+wesdiscordbot> if you look at the map, the path that malin takes doesn't make sense, he travels south to follows the orcs, but then abruptly cuts east across the river, crosses another one to the south, and heads west toward parthyn again 20190108 04:38:06<+wesdiscordbot> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/259976436490829825/532055370320052234/unknown.png 20190108 04:38:07<+wesdiscordbot> like so 20190108 04:38:25<+wesdiscordbot> what I'm thinking of is making it head south/southwest toward parthyn, never crossing the vertical river 20190108 04:39:21<+wesdiscordbot> then malin and the orc will both end up on the north side of the river, where they confront each other; this makes it more plausible to kill drogan without killing someone from parthyn (the orcs are likely to do it for you) and it also incriminates malin more since it will actually look like he brought the orcs to attack parthyn 20190108 04:39:27<+wesdiscordbot> thoughts? 20190108 05:08:33< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:1.14 josteph 02a4338924 Sidebar: Reformat trait tooltip AppVeyor: 1/2 builds failed 20190108 05:08:34< irker018> Details vs2015/Release: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth-7lnpw/builds/21446687 20190108 06:08:38< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:1.14 josteph 6c04e541eb mp_staging: Build all teams, not only th AppVeyor: 1/4 builds failed 20190108 06:08:39< irker018> Details vs2015/Release: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth-7lnpw/builds/21447345 20190108 08:03:51-!- heirecka [~heirecka@exherbo/developer/heirecka] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20190108 08:06:45-!- heirecka [~heirecka@exherbo/developer/heirecka] has joined #wesnoth-dev 20190108 08:42:36< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:master josteph d6d0fcf570 Game Stats: Hide leader in status table AppVeyor: All builds passed 20190108 10:33:32-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has joined #wesnoth-dev 20190108 10:45:25< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:master nemaara bb3d5d4a71 DiD S2: minor dialogue tweaks AppVeyor: vs2017/Release Failed 20190108 10:45:26< irker018> Details: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth-605wt/builds/21455013 20190108 10:57:09<+wesdiscordbot> It's an improvement. 20190108 11:39:50< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:1.14 josteph 31fa9fa33f Add changelog entry for #3854. AppVeyor: All builds passed 20190108 12:02:17<+wesdiscordbot> Any idea why I'd run into a Lua error in TRoW, last scenario, turn 19 (on hard)? 20190108 12:02:58<+wesdiscordbot> https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/259976436490829825/532167325143793675/lua_e.png 20190108 12:06:27<+wesdiscordbot> Oh, found it. There is a third Cuttle Fish that was supposed to destroy the last bridge, but nothing happened. 20190108 13:24:17< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:master nemaara 1b51324fc7 DiD S5: dialogue fixes AppVeyor: All builds passed 20190108 13:43:05<+wesdiscordbot> Will there be a rewrite for UtBS to match the new Quenoth Elves? 20190108 14:03:43-!- celticminstrel is now known as celmin|away 20190108 14:10:17<+wesdiscordbot> @Yumi Yeah, makes sense that Malin should be on the north bank side S1 depicts orcs raids coming from there. If anything, orcs should be camped on the north bank and Malin should be coming from even farther north, so the order (north to south) is Malin, orcs, Great River, Partyn 20190108 14:41:31< zookeeper> you'd have to rewrite a whole lot of dialogue to accommodate that, in case it's not obvious. 20190108 14:43:49< zookeeper> half of the premise is that malin is seemingly a direct threat to parthyn by being between them and the orcs, so if he's behind the orcs then it's not like malin and drogan have any reason to fight before the orcs are gone. 20190108 14:56:44< zookeeper> so you'd end up with presumably completely different kind of gameplay (because you'd no longer be between the orcs and parthyn), and probably typically killing the orcish leader before drogan, which seems like the distinctly inferior order story-wise. the scenario didn't even originally cover that, the dialogue for it is an afterthought added in case someone does the unlikely. 20190108 15:45:26< irker018> wesnoth/wesnoth:master nemaara bb3d5d4a71 DiD S2: minor dialogue tweaks AppVeyor: 1/4 builds failed 20190108 15:45:27< irker018> Details vs2017/Release: https://ci.appveyor.com/project/wesnoth/wesnoth-605wt/builds/21455013 20190108 16:10:21-!- LovCAPONE [LovCAPONE@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/lovcapone] has joined #wesnoth-dev 20190108 16:25:45<+wesdiscordbot> yes I agree with that 20190108 16:26:24<+wesdiscordbot> but the setup also doesn't make sense :thonk: 20190108 16:27:03<+wesdiscordbot> how about if Malin stands between the orcs and the ford 20190108 16:28:40<+wesdiscordbot> still very likely you can kill the orcs first 20190108 16:30:25<+wesdiscordbot> doing that isn't the worst thing for the story, but I agree with zookeeper that it's better the other way 20190108 16:30:46<+wesdiscordbot> you kill the orcs, Malin asks to be unbanished, Drogan refuses, Malin kill Drogan, and then has to retreat to the signpost 20190108 16:30:51<+wesdiscordbot> yeah... 20190108 16:31:11<+wesdiscordbot> right, it's workable but not the beeeessst 20190108 16:31:14<+wesdiscordbot> how about 20190108 16:31:19<+wesdiscordbot> Malin starts at the ford 20190108 16:31:32<+wesdiscordbot> tells Drogan that orcs will come intwo days 20190108 16:31:37<+wesdiscordbot> and to call every man back, etc 20190108 16:31:41<+wesdiscordbot> Drogan tries to kill Malin 20190108 16:31:43<+wesdiscordbot> on T6 orcs come 20190108 16:31:45<+wesdiscordbot> but the problem is 20190108 16:31:51<+wesdiscordbot> hes chasing orcs 20190108 16:31:52< zookeeper> @Yumi so to be clear: the problem with the setup is that it doesn't make sense malin would either a) so badly mistrack the orcs or b) the orcs somehow cleverly crossed the river with unknown means (it's not clear what the canon explanation would be)? 20190108 16:31:59<+wesdiscordbot> they aren't chasing him 20190108 16:32:05<+wesdiscordbot> both are issues 20190108 16:32:06<+wesdiscordbot> he's following orcs 20190108 16:32:17<+wesdiscordbot> the second problem is that gameplay wise 20190108 16:32:17<+wesdiscordbot> when he gets close to Parthyn, he overtakes them to warn the town 20190108 16:32:28<+wesdiscordbot> he knows the terrain better, and he can get through any villages in the area rather than around them 20190108 16:32:44<+wesdiscordbot> its pretty nasty for you to have to kill drogan without being allowed to kill his units 20190108 16:32:50<+wesdiscordbot> quite 20190108 16:32:54<+wesdiscordbot> that 20190108 16:32:59<+wesdiscordbot> can work 20190108 16:33:23<+wesdiscordbot> it'll be interesting strategically 20190108 16:33:32<+wesdiscordbot> try to kill drogan when you know that you're about to be flanked 20190108 16:34:00<+wesdiscordbot> Maybe even get in two wolves on T3, scouts/vanguard, before the main orcish party comes somewhat later 20190108 16:34:02<+wesdiscordbot> I like it ๐Ÿ‘Œ 20190108 16:34:10<+wesdiscordbot> brainstorming ๐Ÿ˜ƒ 20190108 16:34:15<+wesdiscordbot> they should come at once I think 20190108 16:34:38<+wesdiscordbot> they're not weak, but still a remnant army 20190108 16:34:46< zookeeper> i have no clear recollection, so please do remind me: the villagers aren't really much of a real threat to you, right? 20190108 16:34:57<+wesdiscordbot> Ah, right, I forgot that it's a remnant 20190108 16:35:09<+wesdiscordbot> they become one 20190108 16:35:10<+wesdiscordbot> Drogan has lvl1 units, Dela has lvl2, I think 20190108 16:35:26<+wesdiscordbot> no mages, though 20190108 16:35:34<+wesdiscordbot> villagers can kill you and you also aren't allowed to kill them if drogan is alive 20190108 16:35:48<+wesdiscordbot> recruit=Spearman,Bowman recruit=Spearman,Bowman,Swordsman,Pikeman,Longbowman,Thug,Poacher,Footpad 20190108 16:40:49< zookeeper> possible solution to the mistracking/rivercrossing problem: have malin track the orcs on the east side of listra, then the orcs cross at the river fork (to the north side) and since malin realizes they are going for parthyn, he intentionally crosses to the south to reach parthyn in time and to stand between parthyn and the orcs because from the orcs' rear he couldn't really defend the town 20190108 16:40:49< zookeeper> from them, after all. 20190108 16:40:50<+wesdiscordbot> I think I'll have it be an rpg style scenario at the start 20190108 16:41:17<+wesdiscordbot> yeah 20190108 16:41:23<+wesdiscordbot> "rpg style scenario" ? 20190108 16:41:38<+wesdiscordbot> no recruits at the very start 20190108 16:42:05<+wesdiscordbot> because when the orcs arrive it may be plausible that you still decide to sit there and kill them first 20190108 16:43:24<+wesdiscordbot> I'll probably take zookeepers method for the positioning 20190108 16:43:25<+wesdiscordbot> what zookeeper suggests works equally well on either side of the listra, by the way? Malin and orcs could have started on the west bank of Listra (makes sense given location of previous battle and elves in Lintair) and then Malin forded the river farther upstream than the orcs 20190108 16:43:53<+wesdiscordbot> sure 20190108 16:43:56<+wesdiscordbot> I don't understand why you'd have no recruits lore wise 20190108 16:44:13<+wesdiscordbot> you're coming back from a great victory... 20190108 16:44:15<+wesdiscordbot> just zookeepers way makes me not have to change the bigmap too much 20190108 16:44:29<+wesdiscordbot> because skeletons cant move as fast maybe 20190108 16:44:44<+wesdiscordbot> suppose someone else did the bigmap work, what would you prefer? 20190108 16:45:04<+wesdiscordbot> it seems odd to base scenario design on bigmap; the battle itself is much more important 20190108 16:45:28< zookeeper> @josteph sure, but then both orcs and malin would at least make one river crossing each. if the orcs never cross a river, it could/would look silly for malin to make an extra crossing in order to reach parthyn at the same time. 20190108 16:46:15<+wesdiscordbot> zookeeper, your way the orcs cross two rivers, malin once. Why wouldn't the orcs ford Great River upstream of the confluence with Listra? 20190108 16:47:50<+wesdiscordbot> my preference is the orcs just run south 20190108 16:48:11<+wesdiscordbot> malin follows, then overtakes when he realizes they're going near parthyn 20190108 16:49:01<+wesdiscordbot> then let's do that.. I'm sure the bigmap can be taken care of 20190108 16:49:12<+wesdiscordbot> It would be nice to have green dots in the bigmap representing the orcs, by the way 20190108 16:49:21< zookeeper> @josteph i don't follow. in my version, both would cross once, if you ignore the orcs having to cross the ford of parthyn to actually attack the town. 20190108 16:49:22<+wesdiscordbot> so a green dot blinks and a red dot follows it 20190108 16:49:34<+wesdiscordbot> zookeeper, I don't ignore that. ๐Ÿ˜ƒ 20190108 16:50:45< zookeeper> well, okay. sure, i guess it'd be more efficient for the orcs to take the south side of the river, but maybe it's unknown country to them and they prefer their usual attack routes or whatever. 20190108 16:53:17<+wesdiscordbot> sure, makes sense 20190108 16:53:40<+wesdiscordbot> but isn't that also an argument for the orcs sticking to the west bank of the Listra? 20190108 16:53:51<+wesdiscordbot> east bank has elves, west bank is closer to the orcs' homes in the north 20190108 16:54:35< zookeeper> it is, but i think you can handwave some of it by the fact that they were routed and malin was chasing them (never stated whether the orcs are aware, though). 20190108 16:55:16< zookeeper> anyway, i doubt there's a perfect fix to be found, the current journey markers are just my best attempt of placing this stuff on the bigmap. the campaign originally didn't have a bigmap, after all. :x 20190108 16:55:18<+wesdiscordbot> Hmm, yes... The last chieftain escaped 20190108 16:55:26<+wesdiscordbot> so he'd have needed to find another tribe or something 20190108 16:55:52<+wesdiscordbot> good work ๐Ÿ˜ƒ 20190108 16:56:50<+wesdiscordbot> I wonder which way the escaping chieftain would have gone from the last battle 20190108 16:57:03<+wesdiscordbot> Maybe the journey markers should actually start by going north 20190108 16:57:15<+wesdiscordbot> since Malin is following the chieftain, who is presumably seeking reinforcements 20190108 17:07:07<+wesdiscordbot> back from stealing some free cookies ๐Ÿช 20190108 17:07:43<+wesdiscordbot> if nobody minds I"ll try changing the bigmap to what I said, orcs going south, west of the river listra 20190108 17:07:48<+wesdiscordbot> malin follows then overtakes 20190108 17:08:14<+wesdiscordbot> then just same as it is now, malin makes a camp and attacks drogan first, then the orcs (or chooses to escape) 20190108 17:08:28<+wesdiscordbot> I also came up with a reason for a turn limit so I'll implement that 20190108 17:49:01-!- TC01 [~quassel@venus.arosser.com] has quit [Ping timeout: 258 seconds] 20190108 17:51:56-!- stikonas [~gentoo@wesnoth/translator/stikonas] has joined #wesnoth-dev 20190108 18:09:45-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has joined #wesnoth-dev 20190108 18:45:52-!- irker018 [~irker@wesnoth/umc-dev/bot/shikadibot] has quit [Quit: transmission timeout] 20190108 20:24:53-!- gfgtdf [~gfgtdf@134.76.63.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev 20190108 21:18:01<+wesdiscordbot> yo, DiD talk i see? 20190108 21:26:36-!- irker255 [~irker@wesnoth/umc-dev/bot/shikadibot] has joined #wesnoth-dev 20190108 21:26:36< irker255> wesnoth/wesnoth:master Vlad Drozdov e2bceb6ccc Campaign selection filter : ัhanges for AppVeyor: All builds passed 20190108 21:50:16<+wesdiscordbot> yah ๐Ÿ˜ฎ 20190108 22:06:30-!- gfgtdf [~gfgtdf@134.76.63.8] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20190108 22:10:24-!- zookeeper [~lmsnie@wesnoth/developer/zookeeper] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20190108 22:30:19-!- gfgtdf [~gfgtdf@134.76.63.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev 20190108 22:59:22-!- gfgtdf [~gfgtdf@134.76.63.8] has quit [Ping timeout: 250 seconds] 20190108 23:01:45-!- gfgtdf [~gfgtdf@134.76.63.8] has joined #wesnoth-dev 20190108 23:27:57< irker255> wesnoth/wesnoth:master Vlad Drozdov 6777626601 Campaign selection filter : ัhanges for AppVeyor: All builds passed 20190108 23:34:44-!- boucman [~rosen@wesnoth/developer/boucman] has quit [Remote host closed the connection] 20190108 23:59:52-!- LovCAPONE [LovCAPONE@gateway/vpn/privateinternetaccess/lovcapone] has quit [Quit: Life is like a void pointer: you never know what you're going to get...] --- Log closed Wed Jan 09 00:00:52 2019