[engine] WML - options tag improvements

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Jarom
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[engine] WML - options tag improvements

Post by Jarom »

1. In scenarios and modifications you can add options with [options] tag and [slider], [checkbox], [combo] or [entry]. But there's no way (or no easy-to-find documentation for this) to disable (and make grey)/hide one option depending on state of another, like "fog","shroud" and some other depends on "use map settings". I think there should be a tag/tags with structure like this:
[hide_if]
id=id_of_option_that_this_option_depends_on
value=value_or_comma_values_list_that_causes_option_to_hide
set_to_default=does_value_of_this_option_should_be_set_to_default
[/hide_if]
[disable_if]
id=id_of_option_that_this_option_depends_on
value=value_or_comma_values_list_that_disallows_this_option
set_to_default=does_value_of_this_option_should_be_set_to_default
[/disable_if]
Key "value=" should also can be altered to greater_than, less_than and other similar.
set_to_default isn't necessary, but sometimes author would like not to set this option manually and get it imported to game with default setting, and other author would want to keep this option's state for next games and don't use it's value or set it later in code. This will affect value after creating game, not when options are selected.
2. Modifications mostly can be played at different maps, and some of them have their own special maps, and when we add eras to combinations, it gets a bit complicated, so there should be tag or key that works similar to the two presented above but depends on era/modification/map.
3. There should be possibility to add "reset options to default" button.
4. Some add-ons, like my Wesnoth Terraforming, uses so many options, that some of their combinations works completely different than others. It'll take much more codework than disabling options, but allowing to create predefined/user defined options combinations will be really fine. User defined will be fine in general options too, because rankings needs options, that I don't want to use in game with friends, and looking at all options takes some time.
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White_Drag0n
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Re: [engine] WML - options tag improvements

Post by White_Drag0n »

I'm not sure if this concern is actually about the engine itself - but I agree that UI could use some improvement.
Other than what you said, I'd like to see sliders which accept string values on min and max values. For example, a slider going from 1-90, with the max value called 'Unlimited', couldn't possibly be too hard to code. :hmm:
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Jarom
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Re: [engine] WML - options tag improvements

Post by Jarom »

[engine] This changes the way the game works at its core. This includes WML suggestions.
That's the reason - I was surprised too.

Sliders with string replacements (like disabling exists in configuration screen on income and turns sliders) will be great. I think it should be like this:
[string]
value=comma_list_of_values_to_change
string="string that will be shown instead of these values"
[/string]
Obviously, this should accept more than one of these tags.
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Ravana
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Re: [engine] WML - options tag improvements

Post by Ravana »

Shouldnt you just use combobox instead of slider then?
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Jarom
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Re: [engine] WML - options tag improvements

Post by Jarom »

I'm currently doing so for small numbers of possible choices, but I also want to make options that value vary between 0 and 40 and also -1 as special unlimited value, so combobox is impractical, just like in turns counter.
Tad_Carlucci
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Re: [engine] WML - options tag improvements

Post by Tad_Carlucci »

So you want to give a choice of 40 or more items using a slider so your user can be frustrated getting the value they want instead of a combobox where they can specifically choose the value straight away?

I guess I'm not see what's being asked for, why it's needed, or how it improves upon the user experience.
I forked real life and now I'm getting merge conflicts.
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White_Drag0n
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Re: [engine] WML - options tag improvements

Post by White_Drag0n »

The existing of combo box is why I didn't asked for allowing a comma separated list of strings in sliders. The only situation I can think of, where it's better, is when you scroll through the difficulties - novice, easy, normal, hard, insane, from the left to the right. Would propably be better aesthetically than a combobox.

In his last post, Jarom is propably asking for the same thing I did - a numerical slider between 1 and 40, and a special value on the rightest edge - not a choice between 40 string. Think of it as the 'turn limit' slider. You can't make such sliders in mod preferences.

Anotger thing which you cannot do is to gray out options, which become irrelevant if you check off one of the previous options. Think of it like with the timer settings - if you choose to play without timer, all it's corresponding options get grayed out. Something like this might be useful in UMC add-ons with many preferences.
Tad_Carlucci
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Re: [engine] WML - options tag improvements

Post by Tad_Carlucci »

The disabling of options bugs me too.

But, the design philosophy of Wesnoth seems to be to remove rather than disable.

I disagree with it, because it leads to a confusing and frustrating user experience, but it is what it is and it's too much work to change.

So, go with consistency and don't display options which don't apply at the moment.
I forked real life and now I'm getting merge conflicts.
Tad_Carlucci
Inactive Developer
Posts: 503
Joined: April 24th, 2016, 4:18 pm

Re: [engine] WML - options tag improvements

Post by Tad_Carlucci »

Personally, I dislike the abuse of sliders for a limited choice such as difficulty. They seem to imply a more continuous selection where there should be values between Easy and Medium. Radio buttons were designed for that purpose and better represent the choice between a limited number of options.

As to the request: If the desire is that a 0-100 slider simply display 'None' for 0 and 'Unlimited' for 100, but still return the numerical values ... that should be do-able since it's just a presentation issue. I would suggest, however, that the slider should, then, make it clear the precise value being selected. And it should provide some means allowing the user to enter a precise value (otherwise selecting a value from, say, 0 to 1000, is too error-prone, if not impossible).
I forked real life and now I'm getting merge conflicts.
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